# Gallery (Isoxaben) or Barricade (Prodiamine) in the fall?



## craigdt (Apr 21, 2018)

Due to torrential flooding and travel this fall, I just dropped a second batch of overseed KBG and TTTF.

Which pre-emergent would you recommend this fall? I've never applied a pre-emergent previously.

Spring '19 I'll use Dimension (Dithiopyr) to handle crabgrass and Little Barley in the fall.

I've heard Barricade (Prodiamine) can be easier on young seedlings, but not sure if true. Its also very economical.

Had planned on mixing the Dimension and Gallery (Isoxaben), as together, they cover a wide range or grassy and broadleaf weeds.
Both of which I have in abundance.

Gallery controls white clover (but how well?) and pepperweed/peppergrass, both of which I have.

But I dont see many users of Gallery (Isoxaben) here on the forums.

Any input?


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## Miggity (Apr 25, 2018)

Skip the preemergent this fall, it is likely too late anyway. Overseeding and preM don't mix well.


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## craigdt (Apr 21, 2018)

Miggity said:


> Skip the preemergent this fall, it is likely too late anyway. Overseeding and preM don't mix well.


I'd do this, but am concerned about all the broadleaf weeds that will germinate over the winter.

My turf is not nearly as thick as I'd like it to be, so I can't really rely on that for much control....

But if its too late to control items like chickweed, peppergrass, henbit, etc and run the risk of damaging my new seedlings, then I'll certainly skip it.


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## Miggity (Apr 25, 2018)

I think the preM will kill more grass than the weeds will outcompete. Broadleaf weeds are easy to kill in spring. The risk to reward is to low IMHO.


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## craigdt (Apr 21, 2018)

Miggity said:


> Broadleaf weeds are easy to kill in spring.


True enough- Im just tired of being re-active instead of pro-active.

But my wife will kill me if I kill off what little grass has sprouted :lol:

Any thoughts on a particular pre-emergent being harsher than others?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Prodiamine label calls for application 60 days post germination. If you get germination today, 60 days is 01dec. At that point it isn't useful.


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## Miggity (Apr 25, 2018)

craigdt said:


> True enough- Im just tired of being re-active instead of pro-active.


You are being pro-active. You overseeded twice for a fuller lawn in the fall, the best time to do so. Now just let that grass get established before your next pro-active step.


> But my wife will kill me if I kill off what little grass has sprouted :lol:


Happy wife, happy life.


> Any thoughts on a particular pre-emergent being harsher than others?


I don't think it matters next spring. I use prodiamine because it is cheap and effective.


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## samjonester (May 13, 2018)

When did the first batch of seed go down? Tenacity would likely get you through peak germination this fall, and also knock out anything that's already come up. Typically you'd put it down with your seed, then re-up 3-4 weeks later. It's not a great pre-emergent because it's got a short half-life in the soil, but the stuff is amazing around seeding time.

+1 for skipping the other pre-emergents you've listed.


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## craigdt (Apr 21, 2018)

samjonester said:


> When did the first batch of seed go down? Tenacity would likely get you through peak germination this fall, and also knock out anything that's already come up. Typically you'd put it down with your seed, then re-up 3-4 weeks later. It's not a great pre-emergent because it's got a short half-life in the soil, but the stuff is amazing around seeding time.
> 
> +1 for skipping the other pre-emergents you've listed.


Yes, I should have applied Tenacity, as I have a nice fleet of cragbrass and yellow nutsedge now.

First overseed was August 27th. Due to the heavy rains, a lot of it got washed away and is pretty spotty.

Was concerned about broadcast spraying Tenacity, due to whitening of existing turf. But in hindsight, I see that I really should have used it.


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## samjonester (May 13, 2018)

It's not too late! You could apply Scott's starter with weed preventer as an alternative (it's got the same AI, mesotrione, as Tenacity) if you'd rather, but I have a feeling it won't work well on the older crabgrass. Broadcast spraying now _will_ knock out the crabgrass.


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## craigdt (Apr 21, 2018)

So are we pretty much in agreement that Tenacity would be okay and more beneficial than harmful/waste?

A lot of the crabgrass is on the more mature side of things.


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## samjonester (May 13, 2018)

My neighbor just had a company spray their lawn with Tenacity, though I don't know why. Their lawn was about 60% crabgrass, 20% k31, and 20% other weeds. The crabgrass is all dead now. It was pretty surreal seeing the entire lawn turn white.

If you think you'll be able to fill the empty soil with grass, then yes, I'd say it's beneficial. If you're like my neighbor and will just be exposing dirt a couple weeks before temperatures kill the crabgrass anyways, then all you're doing is signing up for another herbicide application later, and possibly creating problems with soil erosion.

I'm not sure when you get frosts in your area, but I think the decision really comes down to whether you think you have enough time to get grass to grow. A deep freeze will kill less mature plants, and a frost will kill very young seedlings.


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## friscolawner (Sep 24, 2018)

Tenacity can be used when seeding Bermuda as well ?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

@friscolawner I'm not sure. I think so. Check the label. Also, the little that I know of Bermuda, most folks prefer spring or sod Bermuda than seed. I think the seed species are not as good. Ask in the warm season side.


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