# Frequency of dethatching and verticutting?



## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

What is the standard frequency for 1) dethatching with flail blades and 2) verticutting with actual sharpened blades on bermuda? I know detarching happens once in the spring, but what about verticutting?

Will verticutting also dethatch, or is it best to both dethatch in spring and verticut later?

Im trying to decide if a verticut reel is worth the investment for my used power rake (classen)

Thanks


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## DFWLawnNut (Jul 7, 2020)

I wouldnt think verticutting would be necessary unless you were overseeding, but maybe its a thing? I know "the doc" would say no lol, but he also doesnt believe in dethatching bermuda. That is until the Andersons decide to do so or he can make a buck on it.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

Hmmm I was under the impression that dethatching would obviously remove dead material, and that verticutting would cut stolons creating additional growth and a thicker lawn? I'm happy to not spend another 400 clams, so if dethatching is all I need, I'm fine with that!


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## RangersFC (Jul 29, 2019)

I've also been under the impression verticutting can be done regularly on thick bermuda. My 419 gets almost patchy in spots that get insanely thick. The entire lawn is filled in and this extra thick patches make mowing a bit of a challenge to get a uniform surface. I thought a good verticut was a way to fix this, in addition to a good scalp/reset. I've been looking for a Classen and slicer blade setup. But sounds like this is not the right approach?


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## DFWLawnNut (Jul 7, 2020)

RangersFC said:


> I've also been under the impression verticutting can be done regularly on thick bermuda. My 419 gets almost patchy in spots that get insanely thick. The entire lawn is filled in and this extra thick patches make mowing a bit of a challenge to get a uniform surface. I thought a good verticut was a way to fix this, in addition to a good scalp/reset. I've been looking for a Classen and slicer blade setup. But sounds like this is not the right approach?


Yeah I guess when its thick it makes sense to break it up like that. Dethatching seems to thin it out quite a bit too.


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## Redtwin (Feb 9, 2019)

I plan on experimenting with this next season with regular light verticutting. My 419 got really thick this year and a couple of verticut sessions helped.


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## Kicker (Apr 5, 2018)

If i had a classen with fixed slicing blades instead of the flail blades I would probably use it at least monthly.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

Ok, now Im more confused. What reel do I want for dethatching bermuda?





Again, I have the flails. But am willing and able to weld them solid and sharpen them i to blades if need be. Fun project and it would save $400.


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## LoveMyLawn (Oct 14, 2019)

I'm using a Sunjoe. It came with both sets. I've only used the Verticut set. I scalped then used the Verticut. I was shocked at the amount of thatch it pulled up. I was going from a 2"(ish) height of cut to about 3/4" this spring. I was able to maintain the HOC this year no problem so I never scalped and/or dethached to reset the HOC again this year. I am interested in the thoughts like @Kicker mentioned doing monthly or even bimonthly verti?

But I think the Sunjoe only goes down about a 1/4" and not the 1/2" or more like a Classen can.


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## Kicker (Apr 5, 2018)

LoveMyLawn said:


> I'm using a Sunjoe. It came with both sets. I've only used the Verticut set. I scalped then used the Verticut. I was shocked at the amount of thatch it pulled up. I was going from a 2"(ish) height of cut to about 3/4" this spring. I was able to maintain the HOC this year no problem so I never scalped and/or dethached to reset the HOC again this year. I am interested in the thoughts like @Kicker mentioned doing monthly or even bimonthly verti?
> 
> But I think the Sunjoe only goes down about a 1/4" and not the 1/2" or more like a Classen can.


I have the sunjoe as well and believe it is not a True verticut solution. I even went as far as to use an angle grinder+hand file to sharpen the fixed blades and the end result is not anything like i would expect a true dedicated verticutting machine either with the multi-purpose blades or vertical slice blades mentioned above.


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## LoveMyLawn (Oct 14, 2019)

Gotcha. Thanks make since Kicker. :thumbup:


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## southernbuckeye (Sep 29, 2019)

It all depends on how aggressive your verticut is. Think about grooming, light verticut, and heavy verticut on a spectrum. You don't want to be going -.500 on your verticut very often, but a light one every couple weeks, especially if you're pushing the turf with fert will help. Same goes with using a groomer every other time or so that you're cutting.
I don't think you're going to get as good of a result using a Classen dethatcher. The flail blades are very far apart compared to a verticutter. This results in a less uniform output compared to a verticut unless you're going to make a ton of passes. Even then I've found my verticut units do a better job than the Classen did on my tif tuff.


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## Mightyquinn (Jan 31, 2017)

I've used both the flail blades and verticut blades and I think the flail blades do a good job of beating up the bermuda and thinning it out. I've only used it on semi-dormant bermuda as it was waking up from the Winter though.

The verticutter blades will pull up a lot more crap(thatch, stolons and rhizomes) and leave a cleaner look once all the debris is cleaned up. Verticutting isn't something you should need to do more than 3 times a year(Once in the Spring and maybe once or twice during the growing season). You can go pretty deep on Bermuda without doing any permanent damage as it will generally recover within 2-3 weeks. If your bermuda is getting too thick during the season you may want to look into cutting back on your Nitrogen input and try to control how much water it is getting. When bermuda is getting too much Nitrogen and water it will start to get "puffy" and your mower will start to float across the grass instead of riding on or in the grass. I know you aren't always able to control the water input if Mother Nature is giving you too much but don't be afraid to push it and see how far you can go before you need to water. If you have to, just hand water the drier spots before soaking the whole lawn.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

@southernbuckeye Per Clemson, verticut blades should be 1 - 2" apart.

I will try the vertical slicer blades


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## southernbuckeye (Sep 29, 2019)

DFWdude said:


> @southernbuckeye Per Clemson, verticut blades should be 1 - 2" apart.
> 
> I will try the vertical slicer blades


Not sure about that. Sometimes people conflate verticutting and dethatching. My Jacobsen verticuts are .750 and I know Toros are as well. Maybe someone with JD can chime in but I'd imagine they're similar. Groomers are .250.

1"-2" sounds right for dethatch flail blades and aligns with what I've seen on the Classen.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

Yeah, This is in reference to dethatching.

Per https://hgic.clemson.edu/factsheet/controlling-thatch-in-lawns/

Select a vertical mower with revolving, straight fixed blades with adjustable spacing and depth. Space the blades 1 to 2 inches apart for Kentucky bluegrass, red fescue, bermudagrass and zoysiagrass.


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## southernbuckeye (Sep 29, 2019)

Mightyquinn said:


> The verticutter blades will pull up a lot more crap(thatch, stolons and rhizomes) and leave a cleaner look once all the debris is cleaned up. Verticutting isn't something you should need to do more than 3 times a year(Once in the Spring and maybe once or twice during the growing season). You can go pretty deep on Bermuda without doing any permanent damage as it will generally recover within 2-3 weeks.


Amen! You want a big mess? Do a deep verticut! On the most aggressive HOC, mine throw up so much material that the reels will literally clog themselves after less than 20'. You'd think a diesel triplex would be able to go through it but Mother Nature disagrees. I'm thinking of fabbing a mount over the winter that will hold two large garbage cans in front of the forward two reels and disconnecting the rear reel for next spring. Should be great for sprigging and maintainance verticuts!


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## gooodawgs (Jul 10, 2020)

If you do this early Spring, do you have to throw down another app of pre-emergent immediately after since the soil was disrupted??


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## Mightyquinn (Jan 31, 2017)

gooodawgs said:


> If you do this early Spring, do you have to throw down another app of pre-emergent immediately after since the soil was disrupted??


I usually wait until this process is done before doing my PreM app. I don't get too tide up in the whole "got to apply it by this date or this soil temp" mentality that some people get into. If you do a good verticut/dethatch of your lawn in Spring(go in at least two directions) you will remove a lot of the weeds with it. I've also had great success in adding some Celsius into the spray solution along with the Prodiamine, gives it a good 1-2 punch :thumbup:

Another tip is to rake up all the debris before you run a mower over the lawn after the verticutting as you will be getting up the majority of the crap off the lawn and it is pretty light weight so it's easy to rake and move to a garbage bag or how ever you dispose of your lawn waste.


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## dmouw (Jul 17, 2018)

RangersFC said:


> I've also been under the impression verticutting can be done regularly on thick bermuda. My 419 gets almost patchy in spots that get insanely thick. The entire lawn is filled in and this extra thick patches make mowing a bit of a challenge to get a uniform surface. I thought a good verticut was a way to fix this, in addition to a good scalp/reset. I've been looking for a Classen and slicer blade setup. But sounds like this is not the right approach?


I have a Billy Goat PR550 with verticutting blades on it and I have been verticutting probably every 6-8 weeks this summer. It really helped keep it from getting so spongy.


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