# KBG seeding rate disparities



## NoslracNevok (Jun 12, 2018)

I'm prepping for seeding Bewitched KBG and Mazama KBG. I'll have 1 Bewitched Mono plot, 1 Mazama mono plot, and 1 plot mixed of the two. I want to get a fair comparison of the two, however I'm seeing large disparities in the seeding rate.

Vista Seed Partners (creators of Mazama?) recommenced Mazama is 2-4lbs/1,000.

SeedSuperStore recommended Bewitched seeding rate of 2lbs/1,000sqft.
Prefered Seed recommends Bewitched at 3lbs/1,000. 
Purdue Ext recommends 1.5-2 lbs for KBG in general.

I like going with the highest recommend rate, but as you can see it's 4 for Mazama, and 2-3 for Bewitched. I'm thinking if the seed size is close enough, I'll go with an equal rate of 4#/M? Am I over thinking this?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

With kbg, high rate is not a good approach. It crowds and gets too dense and grows fungus. 2lb/M is what I use. It spreads from there.


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## macleod52 (Feb 23, 2018)

My sod farm recommended 4lb per k. Is there a reason they would recommend such a high rate for bare soil?


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Maybe they want to sell more seed.

Also, sod farms might seed at a higher rate so it fills in faster and they can sell it.

2 lbs per thousand should be adequate. I don't think I've ever intentionally gone higher.


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## macleod52 (Feb 23, 2018)

Well crap. I seeded at their recommended rate.  Hopefully I won't have any issues.


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## NoslracNevok (Jun 12, 2018)

@g-man I'd imagine seeding rate is a average, similar to the recommend amount of water, or HOC. However, if you get into it, there's a plethora of variables which change these things.

Although I've never read it mentioned/studied, I'd imagine one factor which would at least slightly change an ideal seeding rate would be the intended HOC? If true, I'd guess a slight inverse relationship between the two?

I'm thinking I'll go with 2#, but man does this make me want to start another plot with rates of 2,3, and 4#s. 

I'd imagine it's best to start low, then let the turf naturally find it's own density cap/balance, rather than starting high and let the turf atrophy to that point.


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## JDgreen18 (Jun 14, 2018)

At Hogans Bob recommended 4 pounds as well per 1000...I went with 2.7 as it worked out to 30 pounds


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

NoslracNevok said:


> I'd imagine it's best to start low, then let the turf naturally find it's own density cap/balance, rather than starting high and let the turf atrophy to that point.


^ this. Remember that each germinated seed will compete for nutirents, water, sun.

Im going to drop Bewitched kbg between this weekend and next. I will do 2lb/M.


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## STL (Jul 14, 2018)

g-man said:


> NoslracNevok said:
> 
> 
> > I'd imagine it's best to start low, then let the turf naturally find it's own density cap/balance, rather than starting high and let the turf atrophy to that point.
> ...


+2.

I seeded at 2.5#/m on recommendations from those on ATY. It seemed to have enough room to do it's thing and it's healthy so far in its first hot St. Louis summer. That said, I'd would go lower with the rate, but not higher.

Complete guess, but maybe the rate discrepancy has to do with how many seeds actually make up a pound for each cultivar. From reading tech sheets that list that amount, it could vary by up to a few hundred thousand seeds for KBG.


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## NoslracNevok (Jun 12, 2018)

> Complete guess, but maybe the rate discrepancy has to do with how many seeds actually make up a pound for each cultivar. From reading tech sheets that list that amount, it could vary by up to a few hundred thousand seeds for KBG.


Good point, I'm may average the cultivar single seed mass and make my own 1:1 seed ratio, opposed to ```1:1 mass ratio. I'll need to bring in some seed to work, my cooking scale isn't sensitive enough. If it's wildly off, I'll just stick to 1:1 mass.


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## JDgreen18 (Jun 14, 2018)

How does germination rate play into this? If you had a 10 pound bag of seed say for instance. Each pound has 2.2 million seeds. 
90%=1980000×10=19800000
85%=1870000×10=18700000
Thata a difference of 1.1 million seeds that didn't germinate for that 10 pounds


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## JDgreen18 (Jun 14, 2018)

So to follow up with my last post for every 10 pounds you lose a half a pound of seeds. Or if you were doing 5k worth of space at 2 pound rate you need 10 pounds but at 85% germ rate you will put down 1.1 seeds that will germ over the 90% germ rate. Does this make sense?
So I'm thinking a lower germ rate needs more seeds on the ground.


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## maynardGkeynes (May 23, 2017)

macleod52 said:


> Well crap. I seeded at their recommended rate.  Hopefully I won't have any issues.


The greatest issue I see at that seeding rate is fungus, so you need to be careful with the watering once the turf begins to look lush and somewhat dense. That will be a while with KBG, even at your rate. You could treat prophylacticly with fungicide, but best to avoid such treatments, and it's not that effective anyway on young, fragile seedlings. So basically, do everything right with watering.


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## macleod52 (Feb 23, 2018)

maynardGkeynes said:


> macleod52 said:
> 
> 
> > Well crap. I seeded at their recommended rate.  Hopefully I won't have any issues.
> ...


The cultivars my sod farm uses are all pretty resistant to disease so perhaps that allows for more lb/k?

They use
Solar Eclipse - 25%
Everest - 25%
Rush - 25%
Everglade - 25%


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## NoslracNevok (Jun 12, 2018)

@JDgreen18 I've always ignored the germination rate without realizing it, that's something I will definitely account for in my 1:1 ratio.


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

macleod52 said:


> maynardGkeynes said:
> 
> 
> > macleod52 said:
> ...


Disease possibility is always higher in a first year lawn. Bewitched scored high in disease resistance to dollar spot and I was hit with it this year. I seeded at 2lbs/1000 sq ft


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