# Anyone able to take advantage of lower mortgage interest rates?



## Ware

I think things are a little bumpy at the moment, but was anyone able to take advantage of lower mortgage interest rates before things went crazy?

We paid off our house about a year ago, but I just had a co-worker text me a big thank you for suggesting he refi his 30-year down to a 15 while the interest rates were so low. I don't have all the details, but he said he was able to get 2.75%. He said their payment will be about $200 more a month, but they will save about $68k in interest if they were to just make normal payments for the whole term. :thumbup:


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## mowww

We're about to lock in our rate with the chance of a float down in the following 60 days for our new home. Silver linings I guess.


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## Tinsmith292

Closing Friday at 3.125.. Was at @4.25 Happy Happy


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## Pete1313

Recently did. Converted our 30yr to a 15yr. Closed on the loan on 3/6. Similar numbers to what @Ware's co-worker has. Also nice having no mortgage payment for March and April during these times as it has slowed down some at work.


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## corneliani

Interesting to see the 15-yr rate higher than the 30 the past few days/weeks. We took advantage of the early march drop and locked in a 30-yr @ 3.25% which I never thought I'd see again but happy to take it.


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## Gilley11

2.75% here!


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## Ware

corneliani said:


> Interesting to see the 15-yr rate higher than the 30 the past few days/weeks...


There is some crazy turbulence in the market right now. We were about to refinance some bonds for our school district, but the rates for municipals have illogically jumped up quite a bit. Normally with this much cash being pulled out of the equity market, much of it would go into bonds, pushing up the bond price. When bond prices rise, the rates go down. So what is happening makes no sense at all - but it will all settle back down eventually.


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## pennstater2005

Went from 4.5 to 3.5 but that was a few months before all this started.


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## quadmasta

Closing on the 13th at 2.65, was at 3.65


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## dfw_pilot

@Ware, my guess is people are pulling money out of equities and going to cash (sadly) instead of bonds, hence the abnormal pricing.

I want to get into a 15 year loan soon but can't find the right property yet. Hopefully there'll be some good deals in the near future.


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## testwerke

Thanks for making the thread. Sent an email to my lender to see if we can get a better rate.


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## Buddy

In feb I went from a 30 yr fixed to a 12 yr fixed; 4.375 down to 2.90. Was a local credit union so I chopped a few years off simply with the new loan and the monthly payment didn't go up too much since I've paid down extra each month. Best part was no closing costs, so nothing out of pocket.


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## EricInGA

Just spoke to my agent and started the refi today! I'm not bad now at 4.25 30 year conventional (Only 1 year in currently)but coming down near 3% and not having payments for these couple months ahead is appealing.


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## rhanna

I refinanced for 3% 20 years a couple of weeks ago


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## OnlyMayo

Just signed my closing today. 3.875 to 3.25 VA.


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## CenlaLowell

Getting ready to purchase the lot next door to me. 4.25% on a 10 year loan this is a much better rate than I got when I brought the lot behind me.


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## Wolverine

Went from a 30 year @ 4.375 to a 15 year @ 2.75. Payment went up 200 per month. A no brainer.


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## smurg

Lender dropped me from 3.99% to 3.625% (30yr fixed), covered all closing costs, re-assessed the house at a higher dollar amount (waived inspection; it is worth more than I purchased it for) to drop PMI, and kept the same terms. I was looking at re-financing elsewhere, but with all the demand, the rates were similar for how little I have down.


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## cglarsen

Would help if people shared their Lender information too. I'm at 4.25% looking for <3.25 on this refi opportunity.


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## Jacob_S

looking to take advantage, need to/ want to refi to get ex off the mortgage, as of now I am trying to hold tight till life goes back to normalish rather than this.


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## Socks

Yep! Was at 4.5% on a 30 year conventional. Shopped around and my current lender waived basically all fees, dropped me down to a 3.375% on the same 30-year with same terms, increased my home value by almost 40k without an inspection... saving around $250 a month in principal and interest alone and only paying for title fees and all that crap (~$1700?). Should be closing here shortly (not worried though have a 90-day lock) and also have a float down option.

Since a lot of people have asked my lender is Citizens One.


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## testwerke

We're currently on a 30 yr at 4.875%
Lender says they can do 20 yr at 3.375%
So, 1.5% lower.

That would increase monthly payment $15, with closing cost of $5584 ($999 origination + $1649 3rd party fees + $2936 prepaid insurance/tax in escrow).

*I'm unsure how to do the break-even on this.*


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## kds

I'm also curious how many years everyone was into a 30-year loan that re-fi'd into a 15-year loan for only $200 more per month. I'm 5 years into my 30-year loan at 3.5% with a first-time homebuyer tax credit on top of that. I feel like that may go away if I re-fi?


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## Ware

testwerke said:


> We're currently on a 30 yr at 4.875%
> Lender says they can do 20 yr at 3.375%
> So, 1.5% lower.
> 
> That would increase monthly payment $15, with closing cost of $5584 ($999 origination + $1649 3rd party fees + $2936 prepaid insurance/tax in escrow).
> 
> *I'm unsure how to do the break-even on this.*


I'm not an accountant, and there is probably a handy tool out there, but I would just run the amortization schedule for your original 30yr. You are somewhere in the middle of it. Find where you are to determine how much you are/will be paying in interest each month from now through the end of the term. It goes down a little each month.

Then run an amortization schedule for the proposed 15yr refinance. You'll want to start with the closing costs, then add up the interest paid each month. I probably wouldn't include the prepaid insurance and property tax escrow amount - those are expenses you're incurring in either scenario.

Find the point where the interest paid (plus closing costs with the refi scenario) is the same. That's how long you'll need to stay put to break even. The difference in interest paid from that point forward until the end of both terms is how much you would eventually save.

It would be easiest to do this in a spreadsheet.

Extra payments, etc. can change things up, but it should give you a basic idea.


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## r7k

> I'm unsure how to do the break-even on this.





> there is probably a handy tool out there...


https://www.mortgagecalculator.org/download/excel.php

the best thing you can do, and should always do, with a mortgage is pay some [any] amount of extra principle each month.

type in your loan amount, length, interest rate, monthly payment for...
a) original mortgage
b) refinanced at whatever rate, updating interest % and length and amount financed.

compare the total interest paid and total amount paid values over the life of the loan between (a) and (b).

you could add in that upfront one-time refinance cost to (b) to be most accurate with that total amount paid over life of the loan but usually on a 100,000 or more loan it's insignificant.


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## driver_7

We're in a 3.6% 30-year fixed originating in November of last year. Going down to 3.3% doesn't seem worth it with all the fees. Lender won't waive any and honestly they were a giant pain to deal with anyway. Two missed closing dates and MIA communication throughout the whole process.


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## Ware

Fees can definitely vary from lender to lender, but there are always costs associated with doing a refi.

The "no closing cost refinances" don't get rid of those expenses - they typically either add them to the principal or exchange them for a slightly higher interest rate.

So you either pay them up front, or you pay them over the course of the loan. There's no free lunch.


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## jpos34

Just closed on mine Friday. Went from a 30 to a 20. 5.25 to 3.25. Payment is only 5$ more a month. Saving lots of money in interest


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## smurg

r7k said:


> I'm unsure how to do the break-even on this.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> there is probably a handy tool out there...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> https://www.mortgagecalculator.org/download/excel.php
> 
> the best thing you can do, and should always do, with a mortgage is pay some [any] amount of extra principle each month.
> 
> type in your loan amount, length, interest rate, monthly payment for...
> a) original mortgage
> b) refinanced at whatever rate, updating interest % and length and amount financed.
> 
> compare the total interest paid and total amount paid values over the life of the loan between (a) and (b).
> 
> you could add in that upfront one-time refinance cost to (b) to be most accurate with that total amount paid over life of the loan but usually on a 100,000 or more loan it's insignificant.
Click to expand...

Mortgage interest is pretty low in terms of interest rates and is outpaced by the market funds if you invest instead. A personal decision based on risk, but I'd rather invest the money, pay the monthly mortgage, and then decide if I'd want to pay it off in a lump sum at a later date or continue with the mortgage note. Takes some self-control not to spend the invested money either.

It was an easier decision when the standard deduction was lower since the interest ended up helping you on taxes as well.


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## Ware

No reason at all you can't do both.

When asked should you invest or pay off your mortgage early, I say the answer is a resounding "YES".

We paid off our house in 9 years (while investing in our retirement, taxable, and 529 accounts) and have ZERO regrets.

If you pay off your house early and decide you miss having a mortgage payment, they'll give you another one. :lol:


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## dfw_pilot

Remember, that if deciding on mortgage pay down vs investing the difference, compare apples to apples. Compare the mortgage rate with a comparable length bond. More on this here.

Buried deep in that article, however, is more what I subscribe to:

_If the choice is between investing in tax-advantage accounts (e.g. 401(k) or IRA) and paying down the loan, investing in the 401(k) or IRA will give you more tax-deferred investments, which will remain valuable even after you have paid off the loan, and these accounts have annual contribution limits._​
In other words, I tend to lean toward keeping the loan and investing the difference only because you can never go back and max out retirement accounts; and time in this market trumps about anything else. But these low rates y'all are getting is awesome!

To those who've reduced their rate: Kudos!

ETA: Ware beat me to it: Yes is the right answer.


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## Ware

I don't disupute the long-term advantages to maxing out retirement accounts, but the fact is most people don't.



> ...Only 13% of participants maxed out their 401(k) in 2017 (when the limit was $18,000), according to a 2018 Vanguard report about its investors. What's more, these investors had higher incomes, were older and had longer tenure at their employers. Comparatively, 9.1% of workers whose 401(k) plans are managed by Fidelity Investments reached the cap, up slightly from 9% at the end of 2017 and 8.1% at the end of 2013...


I would probably argue the type of people who are likely to pay off their mortgage early are the same type of people who are likely to maximize their retirement savings, and vice versa.

The argument over which is better is really moot when reality is most people are doing neither.


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## dfw_pilot

@Ware, no question most people don't max out retirement accounts.

@smurg, I'm with ya on investing the difference, especially with good buying going on now. Just make sure to compare bond rates when doing the "invest the difference" calculations (the point of my post). Once accounts are maxed out, the comparison can change if you want to increase allocations to riskier stocks. WCI has a nice write up about his side fund he made to pay down his mortgage.

Cheers!


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## cldrunner

@dfw_pilot @Ware @smurg

Two points.

1. A better analysis to me is how many investors are investing 10% or even 20% of their gross. An individual who makes 50K a year and invests 20% is better than a person making 200K and maxing out their 401K. The first investor is saving more in comparison.

2. If I had it to do all over again I would not have invested a penny into the 401K except to either meet the matching portion with the Roth option or in after tax 401A contributions. First, tax wise in the long run I think I would have been better off just putting the money in a brokerage account outside retirement accounts and investing the same way. Gains are taxed at the long term rate which is lower than the ordinary rate and index funds and Index ETF's are very tax efficient. Second, money outside the 401K has maximum flexibility and diversification. I can leverage into real estate or hard money loans (real estate debt). 
In my opinion there are to many strings attached with retirement accounts especially if you stay employed with one company for a whole career. You never get the chance to do a rollover. I know this goes against the heard mentality of investing in the 401K. I understand their may be points in time where investing before tax may lower the income to meet certain deductions and credits. In this situation I would favor the before tax 401K option.


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## Ware

cldrunner said:


> ...An individual who makes 50K a year and invests 20% is better than a person making 200K and maxing out their 401K. The first investor is saving more in comparison.


Agree. Good point.


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## proctore

2.29% on a 5 year fixed with BMO on our mortgage renewal. That's down from 2.59% 5 years ago when we first took out the mortgage.


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## supradude

Was at 4.00% and refinanced at a local bank for 2.75% on a 20-year amortization (26 years remaining on the prior note). Paying roughly $3.00 more per month, but that is because my homeowners insurance when up slightly. I should note I paid my closing costs out of pocket instead of rolling them into the note. I wasn't necessarily looking to refi, but it would have just been financially irresponsible not to. I'm also going to set myself up to pay extra principal based upon a 15-year amort, but have the goal of ten years to pay it off if I can.


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## kds

cldrunner said:


> In my opinion there are to many strings attached with retirement accounts especially if you stay employed with one company for a whole career. You never get the chance to do a rollover.


What are the benefits you mean by doing a rollover?


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## cldrunner

kds said:


> cldrunner said:
> 
> 
> 
> In my opinion there are to many strings attached with retirement accounts especially if you stay employed with one company for a whole career. You never get the chance to do a rollover.
> 
> 
> 
> What are the benefits you mean by doing a rollover?
Click to expand...

@kds

In my opinion there are two benefits of the rollover.

Diversification- The ability to invest in other assets outside of a 401K. I have a brokerage account attached to my 401K which gives me diversification beyond the regular set of funds. Many do not have this option. Outside of the 401K I can use my IRA to invest directly into real estate. My IRA owns rental homes directly. I loan money like a bank for real estate projects (hard money lending) from my IRA. Simple Example: https://www.groundfloor.us/

Flexibility- The ability to execute Roth conversions. The ability to use my IRA funds as an emergency fund. The ability to use my IRA funds for college education and not pay a penalty. Let's say you have kids in college and your pay just got got 50% from Covid reduction in hours. You can use IRA money to pay tuition without a penalty. In today's environment you may have greater flexibility in a 401K with the loan option.

For some flexibility and diversification are not needed. You just put as much into your 401K as possible. *Diversify! Rebalance!* *Close your eyes and never look at your balance*. Rinse and repeat for 30 years and wake up with a big pot of money. For most non sophisticated investors or individuals who cannot stick to a budget this is probably the best way to go.


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## testwerke

supradude said:


> Was at 4.00% and refinanced at a local bank for 2.75% on a 20-year amortization (26 years remaining on the prior note). Paying roughly $3.00 more per month, but that is because my homeowners insurance when up slightly. I should note I paid my closing costs out of pocket instead of rolling them into the note. I wasn't necessarily looking to refi, but it would have just been financially irresponsible not to. I'm also going to set myself up to pay extra principal based upon a 15-year amort, but have the goal of ten years to pay it off if I can.


Good deal. What was the reason you chose to pay closing costs out of pocket instead of rolling them into the note?


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## Ware

cldrunner said:


> kds said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cldrunner said:
> 
> 
> 
> In my opinion there are to many strings attached with retirement accounts...
> 
> 
> 
> What are the benefits you mean by doing a rollover?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> In my opinion there are two benefits of the rollover...
Click to expand...

This thread is really about mortgage interest rates. Please continue further discussion about retirement accounts in this thread - or start a new one. :thumbup:


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## supradude

testwerke said:


> supradude said:
> 
> 
> 
> Was at 4.00% and refinanced at a local bank for 2.75% on a 20-year amortization (26 years remaining on the prior note). Paying roughly $3.00 more per month, but that is because my homeowners insurance when up slightly. I should note I paid my closing costs out of pocket instead of rolling them into the note. I wasn't necessarily looking to refi, but it would have just been financially irresponsible not to. I'm also going to set myself up to pay extra principal based upon a 15-year amort, but have the goal of ten years to pay it off if I can.
> 
> 
> 
> Good deal. What was the reason you chose to pay closing costs out of pocket instead of rolling them into the note?
Click to expand...

I'm not particularly fond of amortizing closing costs over the long haul. Plus my closing costs were only around $1,800, of which I'll get about $1,000 back from my escrow account on the paid off note. It comes out to roughly $800 out of my own pocket, and that wasn't going to break the bank.


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## testwerke

supradude said:


> testwerke said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> supradude said:
> 
> 
> 
> Was at 4.00% and refinanced at a local bank for 2.75% on a 20-year amortization (26 years remaining on the prior note). Paying roughly $3.00 more per month, but that is because my homeowners insurance when up slightly. I should note I paid my closing costs out of pocket instead of rolling them into the note. I wasn't necessarily looking to refi, but it would have just been financially irresponsible not to. I'm also going to set myself up to pay extra principal based upon a 15-year amort, but have the goal of ten years to pay it off if I can.
> 
> 
> 
> Good deal. What was the reason you chose to pay closing costs out of pocket instead of rolling them into the note?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I'm not particularly fond of amortizing closing costs over the long haul. Plus my closing costs were only around $1,800, of which I'll get about $1,000 back from my escrow account on the paid off note. It comes out to roughly $800 out of my own pocket, and that wasn't going to break the bank.
Click to expand...

Sweet! Thanks for the reply. Those are definitely low closing costs!


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## EricInGA

Started the refi process with Quicken back at the beginning of this month(have had 2 mortgages with them already).

I chose to NOT lock to take advantage of the credit Quicken is offering for floating.

Ended up choosing 3.25% (could have went 2.99% but the closing costs would have been much higher and not been worth it) with only $1400 closing costs.

Lowered my rate 1.25%.
Didn't add to my mortgage amount or length of time left.
Lowered our monthly payment by $220.
Get to skip May's payment.
23 days from start to close!

All in all, I'd say it was a great day &#129315;


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## elm34

I've been inquiring for the past two months as I've been watching rates fairly steady. I was quoted today 2.5% for a 15yr and 2.75% for a 20yr.


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## Ware

elm34 said:


> I've been inquiring for the past two months as I've been watching rates fairly steady. I was quoted today 2.5% for a 15yr and 2.75% for a 20yr.


That's awesome.


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## Gilley11

That's great! I got 2.75 for a 30yr. I would jump on that 20yr!


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## jayteebee

I did! Luckily my mother is a loan officer and was watching the market. Went from a 4.75 to a 3.375 - saving roughly $600 a month. :shock:


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## uts

elm34 said:


> I've been inquiring for the past two months as I've been watching rates fairly steady. I was quoted today 2.5% for a 15yr and 2.75% for a 20yr.


Wow that's nice. What lender are you working with. The big banks are riding the sky!


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## ThomasPI

Sure did, went to contract on a house at end of April, locked in 2.75% with Wells Fargo.


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## elm34

uts said:


> elm34 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've been inquiring for the past two months as I've been watching rates fairly steady. I was quoted today 2.5% for a 15yr and 2.75% for a 20yr.
> 
> 
> 
> Wow that's nice. What lender are you working with. The big banks are riding the sky!
Click to expand...

Big banks always have higher rates. Then lender that quoted me these rates is Watermark Home Loans out of California.

Last July I refinanced with a local Texas lender but used the rates I got from Watermark to see if they would match and they did. I'm currently at 3.5% on a 20 year but looking to go to the 15 year once I feel the rates have bottomed out.


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## greencare

elm34 said:


> uts said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> elm34 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've been inquiring for the past two months as I've been watching rates fairly steady. I was quoted today 2.5% for a 15yr and 2.75% for a 20yr.
> 
> 
> 
> Wow that's nice. What lender are you working with. The big banks are riding the sky!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Big banks always have higher rates. Then lender that quoted me these rates is Watermark Home Loans out of California.
> 
> Last July I refinanced with a local Texas lender but used the rates I got from Watermark to see if they would match and they did. I'm currently at 3.5% on a 20 year but looking to go to the 15 year once I feel the rates have bottomed out.
Click to expand...

Big banks might have higher rates, but if things were to go sour during your ownership, big banks will treat you better than smaller banks/lenders.


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## erickdaniels

Deleted


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## Movingshrub

Yes, used UWM conquest program and laughed all the way to the bank.


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## cglarsen

Movingshrub said:


> Yes, used UWM conquest program and laughed all the way to the bank.


How did you go about applying through UWM? Was it direct or through another broker?


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## Movingshrub

cglarsen said:


> Movingshrub said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, used UWM conquest program and laughed all the way to the bank.
> 
> 
> 
> How did you go about applying through UWM? Was it direct or through another broker?
Click to expand...

I used a broker. We bought our house five years ago. The lender is close to our age. I contacted her in December trying to get 3% or below. She called me the day after the conquest program came out. I thought I was going to land at 2.9375% for zero points but the rates changed and I landed at 3%. We closed in less than two weeks after I applied, no appraisal required due to our LTV. I'm not sure it could have gone any better than it did.


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## cglarsen

Movingshrub said:


> cglarsen said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Movingshrub said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, used UWM conquest program and laughed all the way to the bank.
> 
> 
> 
> How did you go about applying through UWM? Was it direct or through another broker?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I used a broker. We bought our house five years ago. The lender is close to our age. I contacted her in December trying to get 3% or below. She called me the day after the conquest program came out. I thought I was going to land at 2.9375% for zero points but the rates changed and I landed at 3%. We closed in less than two weeks after I applied, no appraisal required due to our LTV. I'm not sure it could have gone any better than it did.
Click to expand...

That's awesome. I'm looking into their local lenders now.


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## Jgourley124

Went from a 5.125% 30yr to a 3.625% 20yr saving me $180,000.

Payments went up $20.

Best decision I ever made. Only $145 for closing costs. Closed in 20 days.


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## Matthew_73

Yep went from a 4.250 to a 3.0 Saved 350 a month in payments


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## Thejarrod

Hello all, is it fair to evaluate closing costs as a percentage of loan , or as a flat amount?

I was quoted 2.5% for 15 yr or 2.8 for 30yrs.


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## Ware

Thejarrod said:


> Hello all, is it fair to evaluate closing costs as a percentage of loan , or as a flat amount?
> 
> I was quoted 2.5% for 15 yr or 2.8 for 30yrs.


The origination fee is usually a percentage of the loan size, but I would say most of the other fees (appraisal, title work, recording, credit report, etc.) are mostly fixed. So I guess the answer would probably be it depends on how heavily the origination fees are weighted to the total closing costs.


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## Jacob_S

Figured I'd update my earlier post, I am in the process of going from a 30yr at 4.25% to a 15yr at 2.625% this will take 8 years off my current length due to already be 7 into my 30yr.


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## cbagz

Locked in 30yr at 2.9 today. Coming from a 30yr at 5.5. Saving around 330 a month but we will apply it to principal each month and should knock off about 11 years.


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## cldrunner

cbagz said:


> Locked in 30yr at 2.9 today. Coming from a 30yr at 5.5. Saving around 330 a month but we will apply it to principal each month and should knock off about 11 years.


That is a great deal. Did you pay any points?


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## cbagz

Negative. Not paying points or any excess fees.


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## J_nick

Paperwork is still being drawn up but we are going from a 30 at 4.25% to a 15 at 2.75%. Payment went up right under $100 a month but knocked 9 years off the loan. Will end up saving around $129k.


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## Jacob_S

J_nick said:


> Paperwork is still being drawn up but we are going from a 30 at 4.25% to a 15 at 2.75%. Payment went up right under $100 a month but knocked 9 years off the loan. Will end up saving around $129k.


Sweet, closed on my deal with just about same numbers Tuesday, congrats on shortening debt life.


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## littlehuman

Locked in a 2.99 over 30 just yesterday.


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## J_nick

Jacob_S said:


> J_nick said:
> 
> 
> 
> Paperwork is still being drawn up but we are going from a 30 at 4.25% to a 15 at 2.75%. Payment went up right under $100 a month but knocked 9 years off the loan. Will end up saving around $129k.
> 
> 
> 
> Sweet, closed on my deal with just about same numbers Tuesday, congrats on shortening debt life.
Click to expand...

Thanks man, definitely looking forward to shortening the term. It's in underwriting right now so hopefully it will be done soon.


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## Thejarrod

Quick update on my refi. I'm looking at 2.85 for 30 years. Not sure I'm actually locked yet. Rates trended down very very slightly so I'm not too excited about locking immediately.


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## j4c11

Refinanced from 30 at 4.5% to 15 at 2.5%, closing Monday. Shaved 8 years off with about $100 increase in payment.

I spoke to my insurance company to update the policy, the CSR was really nice, got to chatting while she was updating the system, she said a lot of people calling in refinancing right now, and she's heard of rates below 2%. Not sure how you get that.


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## JayGo

How do you guys streamline the "shopping for a lender" part? Naturally, I'm going to hit the two banking institutions I have my business and personal accounts as a starting point, but beyond that, how do you guys find other lender options?


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## cldrunner

JayGo said:


> How do you guys streamline the "shopping for a lender" part? Naturally, I'm going to hit the two banking institutions I have my business and personal accounts with first, but beyond that, how do you guys find other lender options?


@JayGo I just locked in a *2.625%* 30 year at my local bank. I went from 3.875%. It did not make sense for me to go with a 15 year because it was not much lower. The bank is a 8-10 branch bank not a mega bank. The local bank is going to service the loan. No points.


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## JayGo

@cldrunner, 2.625% is pretty killer. Congrats! Hope I can score something like that, too.


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## metro424

We ended up @ 2.875 for 30 years. Paid $8500 to close including points and escrow. Maybe we should have shopped around a bit more but either way our breakeven is 38 months. We used better.com and it was fairly painless and substantially better than our last experience with Bank of America who we will never use again.


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## behemyth

I've given some thought to doing this - I'm 1 1/2 years into my 30 year. Its at 4.49%, but i plan on moving again in the next 5-6 years. I just cant bring myself to shell out a ton of money to drop my mortgage, and then spend 3-4 years just to break even again, plus my house has already appreciated substantially (there's a wait list to build in my neighborhood, even with the pandemic going on)

Congrats to everyone getting super low rates, that's definitely exciting.


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## massgrass

Amazing how low rates are. I currently have a 15 year @ 3.125%, but my balance is low enough where refinancing doesn't make sense financially.


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## Buddy

massgrass said:


> Amazing how low rates are. I currently have a 15 year @ 3.125%, but my balance is low enough where refinancing doesn't make sense financially.


Check out the Spectrum Home Loan at Pawtucket Credit Union. 2.90%, no closing costs, no points. Basically a free refinance for you, and it seems like you're in a good position years wise to drop a little and some years. I went through them, and it was an easy painless process. 
https://www.pcu.org/mortgage/refinance-specials/


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## JayGo

I'm glad I stumbled on this thread. It lit the fire under my arse to finally see if refinancing was a good move for me. I'd been hearing about it for a few months but kept putting it off.

A few days ago, we locked in at a 2.75 (down from 3.75). This will save us just over $300/month PLUS another $160 on top of that since we get to drop that ridiculous PMI bill. We had another 18-ish months left on that, so thankful to be ridding ourselves of that in the process.


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## Ware

Congrats!


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## massgrass

Buddy said:


> Check out the Spectrum Home Loan at Pawtucket Credit Union. 2.90%, no closing costs, no points. Basically a free refinance for you, and it seems like you're in a good position years wise to drop a little and some years. I went through them, and it was an easy painless process.
> https://www.pcu.org/mortgage/refinance-specials/


Wow, that is a pretty good deal.

I'm at the point where we'll be paid off in ~2 years with our current modest monthly payment, so I would probably just write a check for the balance before dealing with the hassle of another refi. I guess there are benefits to being old and living in the same house for a long time.


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## Thejarrod

behemyth said:


> I've given some thought to doing this - I'm 1 1/2 years into my 30 year. Its at 4.49%, but i plan on moving again in the next 5-6 years. I just cant bring myself to shell out a ton of money to drop my mortgage, and then spend 3-4 years just to break even again, plus my house has already appreciated substantially (there's a wait list to build in my neighborhood, even with the pandemic going on)
> 
> Congrats to everyone getting super low rates, that's definitely exciting.


@behemyth i was in a similar position. My old mortgage was at 4.50%. just closed at 2.8 (both 30 year fixed). That is a big rate change, so my payback is only 7 months. :thumbup:


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## MikeConroy

Just completed a refinance yesterday. Went from 4.375% to 2.25% on 30 year lowering payment by $560 a month. 18 month payback on associated fees, but well worth the delta in the long run.


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## adgattoni

Refi'd last year from 4.8675% to 4.125%, refinancing now and just locked in at 2.875% for a 30 year fixed. No points, no closing costs.


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## uts

MikeConroy said:


> Just completed a refinance yesterday. Went from 4.375% to 2.25% on 30 year lowering payment by $560 a month. 18 month payback on associated fees, but well worth the delta in the long run.


2.25 on a 30 year is outstanding. Can I ask who you are working with?


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## corneliani

Some of these rates though ... headscratcher! Are you guys sure you're not buying them down? If these are par rates then wow.. how do you find them?? But if not, you have to take into account that you're prepaying the interest portion upfront and there's a break-even period that needs to be accounted for, whether or not you add any NPV / opportunity cost factors into the equation or not. 
All that aside, rates are just crazy no matter what. Most of us will win by taking advantage of them.


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## The_Beast

I just bought my house last July, 4.125% on a 30 year fixed. I called the loan company and got down to 3.125% with minimal closing cost (nothing out of pocket), no appraisal, no title fees...

It saved me $100 a month on the payment, about $35k over the lifetime of the loan if I pocketed the extra $100 a month. I kept my payment the same (extra $100 on principle) and over the lifetime of the loan, it should save me about $75k.


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## STI_MECE

2.25% sounds like a stretch....The lowest anyone can charge on a mortgage right now is around 2.7%. It changes constantly though and that was at the beginning of the month. Must have been a typo.


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## elm34

Any rate is possible, just depends on how many points you are willing to buy the rate down. I've been quoted 1.99% that would have required to buy the rate down by 1.375 points, my breakeven was ~72 months. I missed out on a 2.25% since rates spiked last week based on the FHFA issued an additional fee of 0.5% on all refinances that close after 9/1. Was able to lock my rate @ 2.5% on a 20 year that I only refinanced a year ago at 3.5%.


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## MikeConroy

> 2.25% sounds like a stretch....The lowest anyone can charge on a mortgage right now is around 2.7%. It changes constantly though and that was at the beginning of the month. Must have been a typo.


2.25% was not a typo.


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## cldrunner

@MikeConroy Thank you for serving our country. That is a great rate. VA loans are typically lower than conventional loans because they are backed by the U.S. Government. Seems like they are .2-.4 lower than conventional. On top of that they do not require PMI and might come with no money down. Great deal for serving our country!!

@STI_MECE I did lock on a conventional loan 3-4 weeks ago at 2.625% on a 30 year.


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## STI_MECE

@cldrunner okay, that is impressive. I wonder if it would be worth refinancing from 2.9%. I got a 30year at that rate in 2017.


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## edixon88

I'm closing in about a week on a refinance to go from 4.625% to 3.125%. Both 30 year conventional, but we were only 2 years into our original loan and rolled all closing costs into the new loan so we don't have to pay anything out of pocket. I have a friend that just closed on her first home yesterday at 2.8% too.


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## Ware

STI_MECE said:


> @cldrunner okay, that is impressive. I wonder if it would be worth refinancing from 2.9%. I got a 30year at that rate in 2017.


That's already pretty low - it would probably be tough to justify unless you were thinking about going to a 15-year.


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## cldrunner

@STI_MECE @Ware I agree with Ware. 2.9% is a great rate. I was at 3.875% that was locked in around November of 2017. You did well.


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## smurg

uts said:


> MikeConroy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just completed a refinance yesterday. Went from 4.375% to 2.25% on 30 year lowering payment by $560 a month. 18 month payback on associated fees, but well worth the delta in the long run.
> 
> 
> 
> 2.25 on a 30 year is outstanding. Can I ask who you are working with?
Click to expand...

Probably just paid a lot for points. May still be a quick payback versus the previous interest rate, but on the points themselves, it's 68 months.


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## cldrunner

smurg said:


> uts said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MikeConroy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just completed a refinance yesterday. Went from 4.375% to 2.25% on 30 year lowering payment by $560 a month. 18 month payback on associated fees, but well worth the delta in the long run.
> 
> 
> 
> 2.25 on a 30 year is outstanding. Can I ask who you are working with?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Probably just paid a lot for points. May still be a quick payback versus the previous interest rate, but on the points themselves, it's 68 months.
Click to expand...

@smurg If you look at the paperwork the box for VA loan is checked. VA loans are .3-.4% lower due to the federal government backing the loan.


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## Movingshrub

There is a new "Adverse Market Refinance Fee" being implemented soon for refinances. If you're on the fence, this could accelerate your timeline.
https://themortgagereports.com/69008/refinance-soon-to-avoid-fhfa-refinance-fee-and-higher-rates


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## Thejarrod

I was ready to be very angry about this. But, as I read the article and thought about it, it does make sense. 2.xx% just isn't enough return to justify holding mortgage notes.


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## Tadow781

2.60% @ 20yrs, 3k closing, but 1 k comes back when the loans paid off...


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## elm34

Just recently closed on my refi at 2.5% with no points on a 20 year. I wish I would of held of a little longer as I locked my rate when they first introduced the new refinance fee that was supposed to take effect on 9/1 that has since moved to 12/1. But I can't complain about 2.5%.


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## uts

Reviving this thread from a while back. We looked into the refiancing options a while back but then stopped since there was so much uncertanity in our job situation and where we would be. Now that there is much more clarity we are looking to refinance very soon.

Anyone with any great experience. We are currently with BoA but from what I have seen, the biggest candidate looks like a 15y with Better Mortgage. Basically looking for the best interest rate/APR out there and paying it down fast!


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## Monocot Master

I have always had good experiences with local mortgage brokers/companies. I use online reviews to aid my decisions on who I choose. Most recently I used OnQ Financial with good results. Not sure if they are licensed in your state.

Below is a great site for tracking daily rates. Man, those rates are looking sweet right now! Go for a 15 yr if you can swing it. Amortization on a 30 yr is ugly when you look at them side by side, But either way, rates are ultra low. Good luck with it!

http://www.mortgagenewsdaily.com/mortgage_rates/daily.aspx


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## corneliani

If you're a costco member they're a great option as well. I love that you can go to their website (costcofinance.com), enter your scenario and get accurate & transparent pricing on the spot. I especially like to play with what-if scenarios (LTV ratios, loan amount, etc) to see how much if any affect it has on the cost.

Here's what their results look like yesterday afternoon. This was a top tier $330k loan scenario, looking at 15 and 30yr rates. Notice the small delta between their interest rate and APR, meaning the front-end loan costs are minimal. The back-end fees are where they make their money so just try to make sure and look at lender credits to see if they're sharing any of those credits with you or not.


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## uts

@Monocot Master @corneliani

Thanks for the info, I have seen that site but havent seen their reviews which are always valuable. I also didnt know costco did mortgage which i will def check.

The 2 online ones I am looking at are better and simplist. Great reviews for both.


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## Monocot Master

Also, I like this calculator:

https://www.mortgagecalculators.info/calc-additionalpayment.php

There are some other payment calculators at the top of the webpage


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## Phids

uts said:


> Anyone with any great experience. We are currently with BoA but from what I have seen, the biggest candidate looks like a 15y with Better Mortgage. Basically looking for the best interest rate/APR out there and paying it down fast!


We refinanced with Better Mortgage in January. We paid some points and were able to get a 15 year mortgage at about 2%. It was the best rate we could find, and the process was convenient and went smoothly. We're paying $500 more per month compared to our original 30-year mortgage, but IIRC we will save somewhere in the neighborhood of $170-$180k in interest over the life of the loan.


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## wicknilly

Just seeing this thread. I've been a loan officer/broker for the last 15+ years and am happy to answer any questions.

In today's competitive and commoditized market, leverage is very important. Insist on a Loan Estimate (avoid verbal quotes, fee sheets, etc) and use that to shop other lenders and brokers. And when you find the right deal, take it.


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## Ronnyvagh

The market is crazy right now. As it has been for a decade. Our economy has been crashing for a half a century. It’s a weak and fragile system which we always need to support. I wasn’t educated financially at all before and I took a really bad percentage mortgage some years ago. There aren't a lot of good deals in Bristol, however, I think I found the worst one.


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