# Bermuda yard dominated by smooth crabgrass



## p1muserfan (Jul 7, 2019)

As my stats on the right indicate, I've got new Palisades Zoysia in my backyard (been in the house 12 years now and the ash trees are awesome but the Bermuda had no chance) and Bermuda in the front. However, it's dominated by smooth crabgrass, I honestly don't see much Bermuda anywhere. I've probably got 75% smooth, 10% large crabgrass and the rest Bermuda. I've never done pre-m but now know what to use and when (can't wait till soil temps cool, too bad it's only July, lol). I haven't watered at all this year with all the rain we've had and am cutting both yards at 2" about every 4 days. I've been bagging the clippings from both yards. I think the smooth crabgrass took over when I was lightly watering too frequently the last couple of summers, I've since learned how wrong that is too. 
Long story, should I fertilize the front yard anymore this year? I think I've done 2 rounds. Am I nourishing the crabgrass? I'm gonna start mulching the back yard but should I continue to bag the front? Do I need to try to kill the crabgrass now or can I wait to do the pre-m in the fall and spring? I hate looking at my front yard every day but I can be very patient. At this point it's personal. Will the Bermuda come back strong next season if I wait to do pre-m?


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## TN Hawkeye (May 7, 2018)

p1muserfan said:


> As my stats on the right indicate, I've got new Palisades Zoysia in my backyard (been in the house 12 years now and the ash trees are awesome but the Bermuda had no chance) and Bermuda in the front. However, it's dominated by smooth crabgrass, I honestly don't see much Bermuda anywhere. I've probably got 75% smooth, 10% large crabgrass and the rest Bermuda. I've never done pre-m but now know what to use and when (can't wait till soil temps cool, too bad it's only July, lol). I haven't watered at all this year with all the rain we've had and am cutting both yards at 2" about every 4 days. I've been bagging the clippings from both yards. I think the smooth crabgrass took over when I was lightly watering too frequently the last couple of summers, I've since learned how wrong that is too.
> Long story, should I fertilize the front yard anymore this year? I think I've done 2 rounds. Am I nourishing the crabgrass? I'm gonna start mulching the back yard but should I continue to bag the front? Do I need to try to kill the crabgrass now or can I wait to do the pre-m in the fall and spring? I hate looking at my front yard every day but I can be very patient. At this point it's personal. Will the Bermuda come back strong next season if I wait to do pre-m?


I would get the crabgrass gone real quick like. Research what is best to use in your area and torch it. It will look ugly now but will give you a head start on next year. The more room you make for the Bermuda now will allow it to spread before dormancy. Can you handle a bad looking lawn this fall to have a better looking lawn next spring?


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## p1muserfan (Jul 7, 2019)

TN Hawkeye said:


> p1muserfan said:
> 
> 
> > As my stats on the right indicate, I've got new Palisades Zoysia in my backyard (been in the house 12 years now and the ash trees are awesome but the Bermuda had no chance) and Bermuda in the front. However, it's dominated by smooth crabgrass, I honestly don't see much Bermuda anywhere. I've probably got 75% smooth, 10% large crabgrass and the rest Bermuda. I've never done pre-m but now know what to use and when (can't wait till soil temps cool, too bad it's only July, lol). I haven't watered at all this year with all the rain we've had and am cutting both yards at 2" about every 4 days. I've been bagging the clippings from both yards. I think the smooth crabgrass took over when I was lightly watering too frequently the last couple of summers, I've since learned how wrong that is too.
> ...


Yes, I can deal with ugly in the front if it gives the Bermuda a chance. Heck, I've still got about 3 months of growing season to play with. I've got some old MSMA I'll try first and if that doesn't work I'll buy some Drive XLR8


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## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

MSMA will work if it hasn't gone bad.


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## smarchandiv (Aug 22, 2018)

I use Quinchlorac 75d and it knocks the hell out of crabgrass. Use it with the seed oil surfactant. Repeat a spot treatment in 2 weeks and as needed.


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## p1muserfan (Jul 7, 2019)

I sprayed my lawn with the old MSMA early Saturday morning and also ordered a pint of QuinKill Max. I'm not sure about the kill time for MSMA but today is only Tuesday and the entire lawn save for a few patches of Bermuda is beginning to turn yellow/brown. I can always hit the lawn again when the QuinKill shows up but will give the MSMA 10 days-2 weeks, I don't want to shock the Bermuda. So far so good...


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## p1muserfan (Jul 7, 2019)

So this is my grass 1 week after spraying with the old MSMA I had laying around. I have since received QuinKill Max along with some Duo Stick. Should I hit it again? I was thinking Wednesday morning after the next irrigation cyle.


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## jstephens (May 22, 2019)

I would wait 14 days to reapply


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## p1muserfan (Jul 7, 2019)

I am going to spray the lawn again Saturday morning with crabgrass killer so I don't know if it's my imagination or not but it seems the bermuda is emerging among the dead crabgrass. Can I fertilize first before I spray the crabgrass again or should I wait?


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## RYBLMC (Apr 2, 2019)

p1muserfan said:


> I am going to spray the lawn again Saturday morning with crabgrass killer so I don't know if it's my imagination or not but it seems the bermuda is emerging among the dead crabgrass. Can I fertilize first before I spray the crabgrass again or should I wait?


I am in the same predicament as yourself. You can fertilize beforehand, but you will need to water in for a good two days imo. I just sprayed my crabgrass with water soluble nitrogen to give the Bermuda a quick and heavy hit of fertilizer at the same moment I sprayed for the crabgrass. This will help keep the Bermuda green and strong while the crabgrass is suffocating.


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## p1muserfan (Jul 7, 2019)

This morning I applied round 2 of "the crabgrass kill of 2019". However, yesterday I bought a SunJoe scarifier/dethatcher. For the heck of it I tried it on the highest setting on a small area of dead brown crabgrass. Wow! I was shocked by how much crap it removed. After giving this new round of kill 2 weeks, would it be ok to go over the entire yard and remove as much of the dead stuff I can to help the Bermuda out?


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## FlowRider (Apr 7, 2019)

Crabgrass is allelopathic, meaning it secretes toxins into the soil that help crowd out competing plants from growing in their root zone area. It actually can kill other plants as it grows and becomes established.

If you scarify, rake, dethatch, or rough up the soil, you will help the microbes in the soil recover from these toxins, and removal of the dead plant leaves and stems will help the Bermuda grow into the area much faster as well.

After burning down the crabgrass with quinclorac and Roundup, I scalped my lawn and bagged all the dead brown crabgrass into my bagger system to get it all off the lawn. The Bermuda grew back over the dead spots aggressively.

Interesting article on allelopathic effect of crabgrass:

https://www.acs.org/content/acs/en/pressroom/presspacs/2013/acs-presspac-june-26-2013/crabgrass-secret-the-despised-weed-makes-herbicide-to-kill-neighboring-plants.html


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## p1muserfan (Jul 7, 2019)

I'm sold! In the meantime I'll be watching the small area I dethatched yesterday to see if the Bermuda comes back quicker


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## cglarsen (Dec 28, 2018)

FlowRider said:


> Crabgrass is allelopathic, meaning it secretes toxins into the soil that help crowd out competing plants from growing in their root zone area. It actually can kill other plants as it grows and becomes established.
> 
> If you scarify, rake, dethatch, or rough up the soil, you will help the microbes in the soil recover from these toxins, and removal of the dead plant leaves and stems will help the Bermuda grow into the area much faster as well.
> 
> ...


Had no idea it secreted toxins in the soil. Great information - what a nasty friggin plant.



p1muserfan said:


> I sprayed my lawn with the old MSMA early Saturday morning and also ordered a pint of QuinKill Max. I'm not sure about the kill time for MSMA but today is only Tuesday and the entire lawn save for a few patches of Bermuda is beginning to turn yellow/brown. I can always hit the lawn again when the QuinKill shows up but will give the MSMA 10 days-2 weeks, I don't want to shock the Bermuda. So far so good...


My experience has been Quinchlorac and MSO gives a lightning quick kill whereas MSMA is very slow and seems to affect some types of common bermuda temporarily. I prefer the former over the latter.


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## p1muserfan (Jul 7, 2019)

Update on the front yard crabgrass kill project. I sprayed with QuinKill last Friday and decided to "rake" with the SunJoe this morning. I caught a break due to some cloud clover. I fertilized with Anuvia GreenTRX 16-1-2 @ .64lb/N before applying that QuinKill last week. With all the debris I collected this morning was that application a waste? Did it make it down into the soil? Do I need to apply again?


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## jakemauldin (Mar 26, 2019)

I had some weed pressure in my newly established Bermuda lawn. I had tons of Crabgrass and Dallisgrass so I decided to use MSMA. First I mowed at 2" but didn't weedeat up against the house where there was nothing but crabgrass and Dallisgrass. I blanket sprayed the MSMA and I had a full kill on the crabgrass/dallisgrass that was cut short but the longer weeds almost remain untouched. I think you might have luck spraying again now that the grass is low and dethatched.


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## p1muserfan (Jul 7, 2019)

Coming along nicely despite the crazy heat here in DFW. Cutting low and often has been the ticket. Debating whether to blanket spray again to keep the crabgrass at bay while the bermuda comes back. Spot spraying is becoming a whip!


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