# Let's talk about......Sand



## cbagz (May 12, 2020)

So there are a few things I know a good bit about (crushed stone and sand), and some things I know very little about (a beautiful lawn). I figure that since I'm learning from you guys I could possibly teach you a little about what I know.

There are probably as many types of sands as there are grasses but I'm going to focus on what I know, is most common to my area, and what you may want to ask your sand supplier when deciding what sand to use to level your lawn.

In the Columbia, SC area there are several sand mines that can be located via your favorite internet search engines. Every state probably has a list of active mines, whether it is gold, aggregate, sand, coal, or whatever there's a list somewhere. If you choose to go to the sand mine yourself and get the sand call ahead to make sure they will load sand into whatever you are taking to get loaded. A dump trailer is your best bet and those can be rented at most equipment rental places.

If you have a Site One or other place that has bunkers of sand, rock, mulch, or whatever else they usually just have a local hauler get the material and bring it to them then sell to the public.

In Columbia, there is C-33 sand, which is a washed natural sand that meets the requirements of ASTM C-33 (mainly used in concrete). There is also mason sand which is unwashed and generally meets the ASTM standard of C-144. There are a few others but these are the most prevalent.



C33 on the left mason sand on the right.

No matter where you get your sand from ask for a sieve analysis. Most producers will email that to you within the same day you request it. If you get the sand from a retailer it may take a little longer as they will have to contact the producer to get a copy of the sieve analysis.

What's a sieve analysis going to tell me cbagz?. Well, it's going to tell you the percentage of sand passing through a certain sieve. In layman's terms how big the pieces of sand are going to be in the sand I get delivered.





A nest of sieves from 3/8" all the way down to 0.075mm

A sample of sand is collected, dried, sieved and weighed to get the % passing each sieve



100% passing the 3/8" sieve



100% passing the #4 sieve 4.75mm



A little bit of material on a #8 sieve


This is a #16 sieve


A #30 sieve


A #50 sieve


A #100 sieve


The #200 sieve which is 0.075mm


The remaining material passing the #200 sieve

As you can tell as we go further down in our nest of sieves we start getting more material that isn't passing through but that's not a bad thing. For leveling a lawn you want a material that is going to be 100% passing 3/8" but prefer 100% a #4 sieve.

The sample above is of mason sand and while it offers no nutritional value to the lawn it also isn't going to wreak havoc on a reel mower either.

My point is this........ If you are thinking of leveling your lawn and you want to use sand but aren't sure what sand to get. When you start calling around to different places to get prices to ask them to email you a sieve analysis if they have one handy. If you get the sieve analysis and on the 3/8" sieve has any number other than 100 you aren't going to want that for your lawn especially with a reel mower.

If you have any questions shoot me a pm or ask away. Hopefully, this post turns out ok as I've done it from my phone and not a laptop.

Since this thread has begun I've gotten questions about where is sand available with regards to someone's location. Here is a list of state-specific DOT websites and qualified sand products to use in DOT work.

*Florida*
https://mac.fdot.gov/smoreports -->then select the fourth item down-->then select all 7 districts (unless you know which DOT district you live in) click submit and just scroll through the pdf looking for locations that have masonry or C-33 sand.

*Georgia*
http://www.dot.ga.gov/PartnerSmart/Materials/Documents/qpl01.pdf

*North Carolina*
https://apps.ncdot.gov/vendor/approvedproducts/Producer.aspx (will have to choose fine aggregate from the drop-down menu)

*South Carolina*
https://info2.scdot.org/Materials/QualProd/1%20QPL.pdf

*Texas*
http://ftp.dot.state.tx.us/pub/txdot-info/cmd/mpl/crsqc.pdf
I'm not familiar with Texas but looking through their PDF, it looks like their gravels will have sand available.


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## bigmks (May 22, 2018)

Nice write up. The only sand I can get here locally in Charleston, SC is masonry sand and it's pretty white. I recently ordered a pallet of soil 3 level mix from super-sod. I must say it spread very easy. I'm not sure of the seive size though. Great food for thought next time.


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## cbagz (May 12, 2020)

bigmks said:


> Nice write up. The only sand I can get here locally in Charleston, SC is masonry sand and it's pretty white. I recently ordered a pallet of soil 3 level mix from super-sod. I must say it spread very easy. I'm not sure of the seive size though. Great food for thought next time.


I cover from columbia east to charleston. Shoot me a PM next time you are looking at needing sand and I can point you to a couple different sand producers in the charleston area if you'd like.


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## Ccualumni (Jul 8, 2018)

Cbagz, do you know any sand mines in Charlotte, NC?


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## cbagz (May 12, 2020)

None in Charlotte however there are a couple locations that get sand from the Pageland and Bethune area of SC and have it trucked up to Charlotte.

If you want shoot me a pm as to what part of Charlotte and I'll tell you where the closest locations I know of that are relatively close to your location.


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## ShaneQi (Oct 9, 2019)

Does sand cause soil compaction? The people I've seen saying sand + clay = concrete are about as many as people that are saying it's a myth. I really want an answer.

Thanks in advance!


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## cbagz (May 12, 2020)

ShaneQi said:


> Does sand cause soil compaction? The people I've seen saying sand + clay = concrete are about as many as people that are saying it's a myth. I really want an answer.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


In a one-word answer....No

The red clay around in South Carolina by its make up is a dense soil in and of itself, there is no denying that fact. However as soon as that red clay soil gets wet it becomes pliable and manageable to an extent. Sand for the most part is spherical and cant compact because the particles can move against themselves and never really bond. The clay will work its way between the sand particles and become a barrier but it will take quite a while for that to take place. (At least a year depending on how the sand is being pressed into the clay)

Spoiler alert....The above is my opinion with what I have seen in the field over the past 22 years with my work. Hope this helps and remember your clay may be different than the clay I am used to but it wont turn into concrete unless your clay has cementitious properties.

My lawn for example is pretty much a thin layer (1/8-1/4") of topsoil then red clay underneath. Later this year I'm going to scalp, aerate, add nitrogen then level with the C-33 sand since it is a little grainier than the mason sand. The Bermuda will be recovering from the scalping with the help of the nitrogen and also by aerating it will give the sand a headstart in getting down into the red clay to help give the water an easier route into the soil as well as give the roots an easier path to grow deeper.


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## Philly_Gunner (Apr 23, 2019)

Great thread, thanks for the write up and information!!


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## Redtwin (Feb 9, 2019)

ShaneQi said:


> Does sand cause soil compaction? The people I've seen saying sand + clay = concrete are about as many as people that are saying it's a myth. I really want an answer.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


There are many example on this forum showing that it does not make concrete. I have yet to see an example of it creating concrete.


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## Mister Bill (Apr 12, 2019)

Redtwin said:


> ShaneQi said:
> 
> 
> > Does sand cause soil compaction? The people I've seen saying sand + clay = concrete are about as many as people that are saying it's a myth. I really want an answer.
> ...


Just the opposite, actually. In my area of the world, every cross cut section I have removed has been a loamy mixture that crumbles in your hand and is rich in compost from the turf. There is no shortage of internet myths, that's for certain. Tell a lie over and over...


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## ShaneQi (Oct 9, 2019)

@cbagz @Redtwin

Thanks for verifying the concrete thing is a myth. 
I never believed it, but I keep seeing people claiming that now and them. 
Now I can argue w/ confidence and let more people know.


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## Mister Bill (Apr 12, 2019)

ShaneQi said:


> @cbagz @Redtwin
> 
> Thanks for verifying the concrete thing is a myth.
> I never believed it, but I keep seeing people claiming that now and them.
> Now I can argue w/ confidence and let more people know.


Educate, never argue. I've learned arguing with some people is like wrestling with a pig. All you really accomplish is getting muddy and then you realize the pig likes it. :lol:


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## ShaneQi (Oct 9, 2019)

Mister Bill said:


> ShaneQi said:
> 
> 
> > @cbagz @Redtwin
> ...


Great point! I don't think I'm expert enough to educate someone, but I'll definitely avoid arguing.


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## Batsonbe (May 9, 2019)

cbagz said:


> ShaneQi said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I'm in spartanburg. Masonry sand local to me is 3/32 or less in size and $48 a ton. Are you aware of any better or more affordable places for sand?


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## JRS 9572 (May 28, 2018)

@cbagz welcome to the forum from a fellow Lexington resident. Where do you source your sand from? Sand mines below the airport?

@bigmks I lived in Summerville for a while. When you leave Summerville on 17A heading to Cottageville there are, or there was, sand mines that brought out almost bleached white sand sold to golf courses for bunkers.


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## ThomasPI (May 18, 2019)

Great info thanks.


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## Paul (Jul 17, 2017)

Man, I never knew we had so many from the Lexington/Columbia area on this site. 
@cbagz - How's the Particle Size Distribution on the sand?


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## bwhitaker (Apr 11, 2019)

Thanks @cbagz This is good stuff, I was about to start doing some leveling with masons sand they have at the landscaping place, but I may call around to look for c-33 instead. I know we have a concrete company in town so they may have it for sale as well.

Also I assume that your red clay in South Carolina is the same as it is here in Georgia. Do you know of, or have you heard of any differences between them? At least so far what little sand I've added hasn't turned to concrete.

Thanks!


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## Mister Bill (Apr 12, 2019)

I've always used river sand for leveling. Never had an issue with it. :?


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## bigmks (May 22, 2018)

JRS 9572 said:


> @cbagz welcome to the forum from a fellow Lexington resident. Where do you source your sand from? Sand mines below the airport?
> 
> @bigmks I lived in Summerville for a while. When you leave Summerville on 17A heading to Cottageville there are, or there was, sand mines that brought out almost bleached white sand sold to golf courses for bunkers.




Like this?


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## JRS 9572 (May 28, 2018)

bingo! they say it's part of the old ocean floor from when the ocean used to come a lot further inland.


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## viva_oldtrafford (Apr 4, 2018)

Batsonbe said:


> cbagz said:
> 
> 
> > ShaneQi said:
> ...


Holy crap that's ridiculously high! We can get USGA spec sand somewhere in the $30-34 range - I do live in FL, however, and we have a lot of sand. We just renovated all of our bunkers (98 in total) I paid $32/ton for g-angle bunker sand (crushed silica - the good stuff) - we used 2,700 ton of sand for the project.

E: i think it would also be helpful to mention the 5 sizes of sand very coarse, coarse, medium, fine, very fine (aka silt) and their respective sizes. Load up on that coarse / medium mixture if you can, folks.


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## Buffalolawny (Nov 24, 2018)

Sand difference @ 2:50


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## Ken_K (Apr 16, 2020)

Any comments about whether it's good or bad to use river sand? Is there a standard particle size for this commodity?


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## Dfw_ozzy83 (May 16, 2020)

Just for reference for particular size, this is "Usga" spec sand that is used on most greens. It dries very quickly and is great for people that like the short cut grass and that have plenty of density to their grass


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## cbagz (May 12, 2020)

Ken_K said:


> Any comments about whether it's good or bad to use river sand? Is there a standard particle size for this commodity?


You can use river sand, just be sure and ask what the largest size is. You don't want river sand with 1/2" or 3/8" pebbles in it to mess up a mower blade or blades.

I went back and edited the original post to provide links to GA, FL, NC, SC, and TX DOT websites with locations where you will find sand. These are locations that are approved by each state-specific DOT for use in DOT projects.


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## DuncanMcDonuts (May 5, 2019)

From my research, it looks like manufactured and mason sands are crushed from bigger rocks into fine aggregates. They have angular structures compared to river sand which is smoother and rounder. Is there any pros/cons for angular or round sand?


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## Mister Bill (Apr 12, 2019)

Ken_K said:


> Any comments about whether it's good or bad to use river sand? Is there a standard particle size for this commodity?


For reference, I use river sand sourced from Green Brothers here in the ATL area. I don't know the screen size, but it is what they use in their top dressing mix. They sell a lot of the river sand for leveling yards and they recommend it over the mason sand. I can say from personal experience it locks in and stays in place. I've never had any issues with pebbles or stones with it. I have access to a couple degreed landscape architects and they both recommended the river sand as well.


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## crzipilot (Jul 4, 2018)

One of the big courses locally by their top dressing sand from this place

We use GA-65 and we purchase it through Golf Agronomics.


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## Krs1 (Apr 2, 2020)

Added


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