# Let's see how the HBG does in the heat



## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Some of you know that last Fall, I overseeded my low-input area because a lot of the grass died in Summer 2018. For seed, I used some of everything but the Kitchen sink...basically every popular cool-season species, with the idea that something had to do well. I used Kentucky Bluegrass, Turf Type Tall Fescue, Creeping Red Fescue, Turf Type Perennial Ryegrass, and Hybrid Bluegrass seed. How's that for a mix? I also dormant seeded again in late Winter.

It looks great so far. We had good rain for germination through the Spring, and regular rain in much of June. End of June and first half July came, along with temps in the high 80s/low 90s, and there was less rain, so I started irrigating 0.5 inch at a time as needed (currently doing once per week in the absence of rain).

The real test will be this weekend, with two days near 100. I'm so glad I planted HBG based on what I've heard about it, because we've been getting hotter Summer temps in recent years. I can't tell it apart from regular KBG, but I believe it's definitely there, mixed in with everything else. Two nights ago, it rained about an inch, which was great. I won't be watering this weekend. Let's see how the grass does!


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## Powhatan (Dec 15, 2017)

These blue green color HBG standout amongst the green TF. It's mid-morning when I took the pic and the sun line is creeping up on it. Where it's located it receives the afternoon sun. It's looking healthy, has a few black fungal spots, not as much as the intermingled TF has on it's respective blades.


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## social port (Jun 19, 2017)

I'm interested to see how it does, even if the heat is short-term. To my eyes, I really notice the blue hue in many of @Powhatan's shots.

One usually reads that the hybrids have a lime-ish color compared to bluegrass. That doesn't seem to be the case for the HBG above.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

@social port, it's hard to tell in photos which is the HBG, and which is PRG or even TTTF. I told Powhatan, in some of his photos, I think I see PRG. But it's hard to tell in photos. PRG often goes blue in the heat like that, though.

As far as heat goes, today was the first day to hit the mid 90s. Default high temps the past month or so have been mostly 85 to 92. So far, the grass has done much better than what I had in the low I out area last year. But I also found out that my soil tests were lacking in some things that I didn't realize due to how I had tested in previous years. So, I did a Lime application in May. It really seems to have helped with the heat stress. So did the early season high soil moisture levels, apparently. I also put down a product with biochar a couple of weeks ago. And then a Potassium fertilizer app a few days ago. Next thing will be micro nutrients and humic acid. No doubt, it all helps, as does having good grass that holds up. I'll try to photograph the area tomorrow. It might hit 97.


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## Powhatan (Dec 15, 2017)

SPF 30, Fahreheit 90, PRG, or TTTF? I see what appears to be boat tips, so I'm thinking not PRG or TTTF. I've also read that hybrid appears lime green, but which cultivar(s)? The Southern Belle seed blend I put down in 2017 included SPF 30 and Fahreheit 90.


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## social port (Jun 19, 2017)

Powhatan said:


> I've also read that hybrid appears lime green, but which cultivar(s)? The Southern Belle seed blend I put down in 2017 included SPF 30 and Fahreheit 90.


Yes, I was wondering if color differences might be a matter of cultivar differences.
It also occurs to me that color descriptions may not be totally faithful to the mature grass if HBG is grown for a brief trial. It is possible that hybrid forms of bluegrass, like KBG, take a couple of seasons to develop full color.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

@Powhatan, I'm not sure what type of camera you use, or how close you can focus, but if you have macro capability, could you maybe at some point shoot some details of the various single, cut grass blades on a flat surface? Because I think I see some pointed, semi-keeled tips in there, which would be PRG. I don't doubt it's possible the HBG could be a similar color. I definitely see some boat shaped tips in your photo as well, but I can't tell if any of them are on the blue colored blades due to the way the camera records the tones. There simply isn't enough resolving power in the overall closeups to see details. You seem good with the camera, so you should be able to get some macro shots if your lens permits it.

Edit: I definitely see at least 2 PRG blades in there, which were in the focus plane. I'll show you...


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

@Powhatan, continuing the discussion...

Regarding the photo you posted above questioning, "SPF 30, Fahreheit 90, PRG, or TTTF? I see what appears to be boat tips, so I'm thinking not PRG or TTTF."

-Since I can't identify grass at the optimal focus plane in that particular shot, I'm going to use a different one. But before I do, I will say I definitely see what I believe is likely to be either PR or TTTF in that shot, but I'm not totally certain which of the two.

Now on to the other shot you posted before:
I cropped out a section and circled the PR blades I saw that are at the focal plane. Here is the cropped, marked up version:








Some of the blue blades do appear to be PR. That's also consistent with how my PR appears right now (blue, thin blades, pointed/keeled, with veins). The dark green, shiny blade between the two PR blades also appears to be a PR blade, but the backside; it's glossy and green, again consistent with my own PR. Notice how the PR blades look like two extremely thin TTTF blades fused together edgewise with a larger divide between them...a hallmark of Turf-type Perennial Ryegrass.

For the left-most blade I circled, I'm leaning toward PR, but could be TTTF. Hard to tell since it's not right at the focus plane. The lighter green, wider blade which I labeled KY-31 could also be TTTF, I suppose...but it's certainly a Fescue.

Does that help at all?? This stuff is fun, but not easy...I get a kick out of the fact that with respect to the scientific names for genus/species, Tall Fescue is often considered a species of Ryegrass, and Annual Ryegrass (which I had never seen until recently) is clearly classified as a Fescue (I found it looks very similar to Tall Fescue, so there has to be something to that).


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Shot this today. Low res., so you can't see the details, but I wonder if the diagonal light blue-green blades in this photo are HBG. They didn't have veins when I saw them in person, so are either that or KBG. The seed I used last Fall had Thermal Blue, but I also have KBG (and PR, TTTF, and FF) in the area.


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## Powhatan (Dec 15, 2017)

@Green I'm taking pictures with an iPhone 7. I shoot a hand full of shots when taking close ups and keep the one(s) that are fairly clear. I'll try to pluck blade examples of varied grass types and take pics of those today before I cut the grass ahead of the cold front.

Here's some pics of an area in the front yard. First two pics taken this morning and the last yesterday afternoon. There's some good looking boat tips I believe - HBG? which cultivar don't know. These lighter green blades look like very similar to yours. The darker blue green clump that I've always thought were HBG is in the middle right. If that blue green clump is PRG, those are some tough ones to be going through heat and drought.



Same area zoomed out. They almost look like they have double veins on the underside. We discussed that characteristic earlier this year on another pic.



Same area yesterday afternoon.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

@Powhatan, the left blade with the arrow you added is definitely Bluegrass. Since you didn't seed any KBG, it must be HBG. And it does look like the ones I photographed yesterday that I wasn't sure about being HBG or KBG. In any case, the two look very similar, at least Thermal Blue looks similar to KBG. Can't speak for the others, but I will say the physical characteristics shouldn't vary all that much from one cultivar to the next...usually just color and blade thickness, if anything.

Unfortunately, there isn't enough resolution/correct focal plane to tell what the darker, blue, thin blades are...but I'm leaning more toward PRG. If they look like the ones I circled last night, then they're definitely PRG. You can judge that from your observations, and compare them. The giveaway for PRG is that it has the many veins like a Fescue. In fact, sometimes PR and certain Fine Fescues are tough to tell apart because both are very thin and have many veins. Other times of the year, when going to seed, the PR blades tend to widen, flatten out, and look more like TTTF. But even then, they're less stiff, and more blue, I've found.

I forgot...did you seed with any Fine Fescue yet?


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## Powhatan (Dec 15, 2017)

Green said:


> I forgot...did you seed with any Fine Fescue yet?


No, not yet. Last fall I planned on sowing Chewings FF due to be most like clumping TF, but thought about Creeping Red being self repair. Still up in the air about that. The poa trivialis is occupying most of the areas I planned to put FF so killing the poa T put a halt to FF.

Here's a blue green PRG still holding on to life growing in the sunniest driest part of the lawn. Didn't think they last in the heat. Must be one tough hombre. I used Scotts PRG, I think they sell older cultivars still. It's outlasted some TTTF in the same area.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

@Powhatan, I do see some veins on blades that look like PR in there, but can't tell if there is any TTTF (or other grasses) mixed in with the PR above. Is there any? If not, maybe some of the PR blades widened out during the seeding season. Do you know if any of the current seedheads are from PR?

I guess if it's unmowed for a while, it'll do better in the heat. Just a guess.

There is supposedly a researcher working on PR/TF hybrids for lawn use for the past ten years, and his main thrust is drought tolerance. I was surprised, too.

As far as fine fescue goes, I think most of mine is Creeping Red. Lately I've been using either Garnet or Chantilly Strong CRF. A bag lasts forever, because I use very low rates. The Strong CRF definitely spreads. It seems to be doing better in the heat now that there are other grass types like HBG and TTTF mixed into it. I lost a lot of it last Summer when the lawn in that section was mostly composed of it on its own with a little KBG. The heavy overseed with the other grass types did the trick. Much more resilient now.


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## Powhatan (Dec 15, 2017)

Green said:


> I do see some veins on blades that look like PR in there, but can't tell if there is any TTTF (or other grasses) mixed in with the PR above. Is there any? If not, maybe some of the PR blades widened out during the seeding season. Do you know if any of the current seedheads are from PR?


Didn't see any TTTF mixed with that PRG. I've seen one PRG seed head, all the rest are KY-31.


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## Captquin (Aug 22, 2019)

@Green how's the SPF-30 holding up?


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Captquin said:


> @Green how's the SPF-30 holding up?


Thermal Blue. But I would say, as part of the mixture, it seems to be doing pretty well in many of the areas where I overseeded with it. I can't be sure, though, because I'm not certain which is the Thermal Blue and which is regular KBG (there are also Fescues and Ryegrasses in the mix). But some of the grass is doing better than others; some is browning moreso. Now, I'm hoping for some rain tonight...otherwise I'm going to have to water tomorrow.


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## Captquin (Aug 22, 2019)

@Green Roger that. I used Turf Blue HGT last fall and some parts have thinned this summer. Not sure which cultivars survived but they are spreading now that I've increased irrigation.

Will overseed in the fall and trying to decide whether to go back with HGT or throw in some HBG.

Would definitely blend it together if I was stopping for scratch. A bit concerned about it looking patchy if the HBG only fills in the bare spots.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Captquin said:


> @Green Roger that. I used Turf Blue HGT last fall and some parts have thinned this summer. Not sure which cultivars survived but they are spreading now that I've increased irrigation.
> 
> Will overseed in the fall and trying to decide whether to go back with HGT or throw in some HBG.
> 
> Would definitely blend it together if I was stopping for scratch. A bit concerned about it looking patchy if the HBG only fills in the bare spots.


Didn't get any rain (maybe 0.01 inch) last night, so I've been watering today.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Captquin said:


> @Green how's the SPF-30 holding up?


It's dormant now. So we'll see...


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