# Crab grass has taken over please help me!!!



## Millardnicole (Aug 28, 2020)

Hi everybody. Novice here. I moved to the mountain region of NC about 2 years ago. Really started working on making my yard better in the spring. I over seeded the front and back and even laid sod down in one area. Well, the sod completely died- the seed seemed to work for a while and some of it died, but the yard still looks better than it did.

My problem now-- I now realize that basically my entire front yard is crab grass. I don't want to kill it all off at once as I want it to be presentable. And even though there's so much crab grass at least it's green...?

My plan was to over seed this fall (coming very soon) and start applying pre-emergent in the spring. Then maybe I can seed again after the pre-emergent and again in the fall? Can anybody critique me? Give me recommendations? I have read so much about this I feel my head is going to explode. I am concerned that there is so much crab grass, it would be a waste to over seed this fall?

I had my soil tested and even the UNC professor said to overseed but I don't think he realized how much crab grass I have. I just want to be sure I am not wasting the seed and it will grow. I know crab grass dies every year, but I do not remember my yard being completely dead last year. Maybe it wasn't as green but I still had grass, so I'm a little perplexed at that too.

Please help me!!!!!


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## Jdotbuch (Aug 11, 2020)

I am not an expert but here is my 2 cents.

I think you would be best to kill the crab grass now and overseed this fall. I think your results will be better in the long run. I understand not wanting it to look worse for some time, but many things in life have to look worse to get better. Kinda like fresh out of a facial, sorry for the mansplain. If you attempt seeding in the spring, you will not be able to put down any pre-emergent besides Tenacity/Meso... That could work but with all the Crabgrass in your photo, I would want to do a Prodiamine app in the spring.


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## Millardnicole (Aug 28, 2020)

Thank you for your response! So you believe I have enough time to still kill the crab grass and seed this season? What product would you use for the crab grass?


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## Virginiagal (Apr 24, 2017)

If you just want green, there's nothing wrong with mowed weeds, especially in such a large area (1 acre). At our house on the river we mow whatever grows and in the summer it's mainly crabgrass, like yours. We're happy with it. After the crabgrass dies in the fall,, we have spring/winter weeds like henbit. At our house in the city I am maintaining 2000 sq ft of tttf in the front and leaving the back to mowed weeds (I downsized the grass after getting cancer, which is in remission now). For the front yard, it's a matter of pulling out a heavy hose and moving sprinklers when watering is needed, putting down fungicides every few weeks in late spring through summer to prevent brown patch (every year when I avoided fungicide, I lost lots of grass to brown patch; fungicide kept it alive this year), fertilizing in the fall, overseeding as needed in early fall (with light watering multiple times a day). With mowed weeds, all you need to do is mow. So the question is whether you are happy with what you have or if you want grass without weeds. Maybe you might want to do grass only for a smaller area.

If you want grass, figure out your irrigation plans before killing stuff. Do you have sufficient hoses and sprinklers if you don't have in ground irrigation? Quinclorac will kill crabgrass and not interfere with reseeding grass. Pre-emergent like Prodiamine next spring when the forsythia blooms will prevent next year's crabgrass. Did you read the overseeding guide?
https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=6250
One problem when overseeding over dead (or dying) crabgrass is it is so low to the ground it is hard to scalp it with the mower to get it out enough to expose the ground. Seed has to be in contact with the soil, not on top of foliage. Slit seeding or aeration might be needed if scalping and raking isn't sufficient.

Late summer/early fall, not spring, is the time to seed cool season grass. Spring seeded grass won't have sufficient roots to make it through the summer and it's also overtaken by summer weeds. Pre-emergent in the spring also prevents seeding in the spring. Right now or as soon as possible is the best time to seed.


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## Thick n Dense (May 7, 2019)

I'd argue against this... Tenacity controls crabgrass through pre-emergant means.

So spring seeding is viable with tenacity.


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## Old Hickory (Aug 19, 2019)

Research when your soil will be at/near 70degrees. That's when you need to seed. This website will tell you: 
https://www.greencastonline.com/tools/soil-temperature I didn't look for Western NC but I bet you have time for two applications of post-emergent (to kill off the crabgrass) before you can/need to seed. You'll need 45 days after germination to get the lawn ready for any snow which I bet doesn't happen before Thanksgiving.

And you'll need to get ready for late Februray early March to use pre-emergent to get ahead of the crabgrass.


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## Jdotbuch (Aug 11, 2020)

Not knowing the weather in your parts I am not certain, but being that your south of me I believe so. I think you need to spray, wait 10 days, clear the dead, prep the bed/soil and seed. I think if you spray this weekend you can plant in two weeks and have a good amount of time.

Herbicide:
Quinclorac as mentioned, and you'll want to spray this ASAP. Is there a landscape supply store near you? It would be better to get a pro product than what you'll find at a box store. Any of these should do the trick but I wouldn't want to wait for shipping. https://search.domyown.com/search?w=Quinclorac (copy & paste)

You will need some things to keep hazards to a minimum.

- Safety rubber gloves
- a mask for nose and mouth
- glasses
- a sprayer, a $10 - $15 hand sprayer from a box store will work
- protective rubber boots (you can probably get away with your yard shoes if this is just a one time thing, but you should have a pair for all your future maintenance.
- as per Virginagal, you may want to pick up a hard rake, dethacting rake or something to remove the dead crabgrass and expose the dirt. I am doing a lawn renovation and I used my string trimmer where I couldn't get my mower in.
- scale (a throw away measure cup could also work, I just prefer keeping a chemical scale, which is just and old kitchen scale I no longer use in the kitchen)

When applying the herbicide, you will need to carefully read the rate instructions and may have to spend a little time working out the calculations for the area your are going to spray.

Seed:
Since you have posted that you have fescue you'll likely want to stick with a tall fescue.
- check the delivery dates, you have time to order online from somewhere like seedsuperstore.com many are trying out Pete's GCI turf type fall fescue but I am not sure he offers a small amount or just look for the required amount at your box store, you will need to figure out the square footage you will be seeding.
- If getting from box store read the label on the back of the see for tall fescue. If a mix it should be fine. Just don't buy the cheaper construction grade stuff. I may this mistake and got grass that looked more like weeds.

Picking the seed can get a little more sophisticated in looking for specific NTEP rated cultivars. If you have time, it doesn't get too deep. seedsuperstore generally offers high quality stuff


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## dicko1 (Oct 25, 2019)

If I were you I'd turn this into a multi year project. Start small. Go big.

Buy a bottle of Quinclorac and just kill off a small portion of the crab grass right now. Kill a small enough section that its easy to work on for the next phase. Then, once its dead, I'd experiment with reseeding. I'd look at different cultivars and see which one grows best and what practices work best to get it to grow. If you have no irrigation, I'd look at TTTF, maybe some of the new hybrid bluegrass varieties, and maybe the new Healthy Grass Technology (HGT) grasses, anything that can survive your summer heat without watering. Learn how to grow it in a small patch.

Next spring, once you've figured out what you're doing, move to the rest of the lawn. Put down a pre-emergent to keep any crabgrass seed from sprouting and fertilize to encourage the surviving grass to grow and fill in. Then in the fall use quinclorac to kill off the crabgrass that survived and put what you learned from the previous fall into practice and reseed the entire lawn.

I have a 2 acre lawn and no irrigation. It always dies out in spots when the August heat and drought hits. Last year I planted RTF water saver TTTF. Cant say I was impressed with its performance this past month. It seems to have died at the same rate as always, maybe a bit less. This year I'm trying a hybrid bluegrass. It says I'm at the north end of its growing range so I'm giving it a shot.

So experiment, turn it into your new hobby.


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## Virginiagal (Apr 24, 2017)

Thick n Dense said:


> I'd argue against this... Tenacity controls crabgrass through pre-emergant means.
> 
> So spring seeding is viable with tenacity.


The Tenacity protection only lasts about a month and you are limited in how much you can use in a year. It can give spring seeds some protection but you will have to switch to a regular pre emergent when it is safe to use after seeding (and measure it so it wears off in time for fall seeding if needed). There is still the problem that roots haven't developed much and summer is quite stressful.


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## HoosierLawnGnome (Sep 28, 2017)

Crabgrass dies in the cold. Question is, does it get cold enough to kill it where you live?

If so, You could overseed now, wait for it to grow in, get a half app of pre emergent down after 60 days, then do a half app this coming spring and start in on weeds with q4 plus or other quinclirac based herbicide.

The crabgrass is going to look bad all winter, brown, as it dies.

It will either look bad now if you treat it, or bad this winter when it dies.


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## Millardnicole (Aug 28, 2020)

****o1 said:


> If I were you I'd turn this into a multi year project. Start small. Go big.
> 
> Buy a bottle of Quinclorac and just kill off a small portion of the crab grass right now. Kill a small enough section that its easy to work on for the next phase. Then, once its dead, I'd experiment with reseeding. I'd look at different cultivars and see which one grows best and what practices work best to get it to grow. If you have no irrigation, I'd look at TTTF, maybe some of the new hybrid bluegrass varieties, and maybe the new Healthy Grass Technology (HGT) grasses, anything that can survive your summer heat without watering. Learn how to grow it in a small patch.
> 
> ...


Thanks for your response!! I think I am going to try and kill the crabgrass this weekend. Instead of doing my entire yard, I think I will experiment with the section. I would still like to oversee the entire yard to at least put some effort into the rest. Do you think I would be wasting my money if I tried to over seed into the crabgrass or do you think I would at least have some still grow?


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## Millardnicole (Aug 28, 2020)

Thank you all for the responses. I think I'm going to try and kill the crabgrass this weekend. I think I'll go ahead and experiment with A section or two with the quinclorac. I am concerned about doing my entire yard with her right now, and having just bare spots everywhere. Do you think it's possible to still over seed into the parts that I will not kill off the crabgrass and as the season goes on and the crabgrass dies, some of the fescue will still grow? Or am I totally wasting my money if I do that.


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## Virginiagal (Apr 24, 2017)

If you don't kill the crabgrass it will die after frost. Until then it will be outcompeting new grass, whatever seed that managed to make it into the ground past the foliage. If you spray crabgrass it doesn't suddenly disappear. It will gradually die and at the same time the new grass will be sprouting and growing. So you won't have bare areas, just a variety of colors. Your main challenge will be getting seed to soil contact. Spraying is fairly easy. Scalping and getting stuff up will be tiring. Another challenge is how you will keep the soil moist. I wouldn't tackle the whole yard. Do a section where you want nice grass and see how that goes. You can do a section each year. Figure out some sort of irrigation plan with hoses and sprinklers if you don't have in ground irrigation.


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