# Jeff's Spring Lawn Reno 2018



## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Hi - First time caller, long time listener to the forum  We live in the SW suburbs of Chicago and I've been slowly rehabing my lawn for 4 yrs now. We moved in 2013, the home/lawn is now 25yrs old, 0.75 acre lot, ~24k sq ft (0.5 acre) of lawn - essentially a bag of NoMix. I've spent quite a bit of time on the NTEP results pages, Reno forums, and pre/post emergent care sites to get educated and caught up on the latest cultivars, practices etc. I have a Toro ZTM 5030 and Timecutter 30".

I just performed a few soil tests in Nov, since I top dressed (50/50 topsoil & compost @ 0.25") the lot over Labor Day.
1. @3-4in
2. @0-6in
3. Soil Structure (0-6in)

Looking to do a rehab or reno in 2018 with KBG (preferably Midnight/Bewitched mix or Bewitched mono) and would appreciate any feedback on the soil, as well as another comments. I'll be sure to update the thread as I progress. Many thanks every one!

*Ok to post soil results here or is a particular thread preferred?*

Regards - JGH


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Posting here is fine. In my experience, chicago soils are normally really good.

I recommend against a 22k sqft reno all at once. I most of the time recommend against a reno until you get the lawn basics nailed down. These include: spray applications (Tenacity, Herbicides, etc) and irrigation approach for the area (even coverage). Once you could get your NoMix looking awesome, then you are ready to kill it and do a reno.  We are here to help, so ask questions and advice as needed.

A great thread to look at is Pete1313. He is close to chicago and just did a large reno to kbg monostand. Pay attention to all the details he worked on prior to the actual kill. Pete1313 Reno


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## ken-n-nancy (Jul 25, 2017)

g-man said:


> Posting here is fine. In my experience, chicago soils are normally really good.
> 
> I recommend against a 22k sqft reno all at once. I most of the time recommend against a reno until you get the lawn basics nailed down. These include: spray applications (Tenacity, Herbicides, etc) and irrigation approach for the area (even coverage). Once you could get your NoMix looking awesome, then you are ready to kill it and do a reno.  We are here to help, so ask questions and advice as needed.
> 
> A great thread to look at is Pete1313. He is close to chicago and just did a large reno to kbg monostand. Pay attention to all the details he worked on prior to the actual kill. Pete1313 Reno


+1 on the above.

Yeah, every time I see an Illinois soil posting, I'm reminded of why, in the early 1800s, vast numbers of New Hampshire farmers moved to the midwest and many NH farms were simply abandoned.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

g-man said:


> Posting here is fine. In my experience, chicago soils are normally really good.
> 
> I recommend against a 22k sqft reno all at once. I most of the time recommend against a reno until you get the lawn basics nailed down. These include: spray applications (Tenacity, Herbicides, etc) and irrigation approach for the area (even coverage). Once you could get your NoMix looking awesome, then you are ready to kill it and do a reno.  We are here to help, so ask questions and advice as needed.
> 
> A great thread to look at is Pete1313. He is close to chicago and just did a large reno to kbg monostand. Pay attention to all the details he worked on prior to the actual kill. Pete1313 Reno


Thnx g-man, appreciate it. Yes, I've followed Pete1313's post. He used a Bewitched mono-stand and I want to say he's in McHenry Co. so not too far. Frankly his post has been a staple in my research. I've dabbled with glyphosate for spot and edge work. I should mention I will have help from a local landscape/hardscape firm I've worked with in the past when I do execute but not likley a full reno at once. Since posting earlier, I came across mightyquinn's soil overview, and it answered a few of my questions. I can't upload the pics since they are from my desktop. Any photo sharing sites folks are using?

Thanks!


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

Welcome to TLF fellow northern IL member! I'm actually a bit further west in Ogle County now, but grew up in the NW suburbs of Chicago as well as my last 2 homes were in the NW 'burbs. You should have great soil structure being near Chicago. My last home had a nice silt loam with 70% silt. Wish I had that soil compared to the clay loam that is in the NW part of our state.

I see you are looking to reno with KBG. Tell us more about your yard. Sunny or shady with alot of trees? What do you dislike about the northern mix? How intensely do you plan to manage the new lawn and at what height of cut? I agree with g-man, make sure you have the basics down before upgrading to an all KBG lawn. Not only will it test your patience when establishing, but since it is a slow starter you will need to be on top of herbicides like Tenacity and have a strong Pre-m plan after it starts establishing as weeds will have plenty of opportunity until it fills in. With bewitched being a very dark cultivar grassy weeds such as poa annua will now become very obvious.

Thanks for following my reno. I look forward to following yours and seeing your soil tests. Most here use postimages.org to load pics and there should be a link right at the bottom of the text box when replying.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Hi Pete1313, thnx for the feedback. Soil is 74%-21%-5% silt clay sand, but I feel my Mn and Mg is high as well as pH. Presuming we can all agree 'full sun' 6+hrs, 85% of my property would fall into that category easily, with the remaining 10% shade between two tall Maple trees (pruned this yr) and 5% as partial shade alongside of the house when the sun is on the opposite end. I don't dislike my Northern mix too much, however I would prefer uniformity, richer color, wear tolerance and of course self healing/spreading rhizomes. Having a lawn with a single or a few cultivars I'd be able to mitigate and control the outcomes better. As far as care goes I have the time and expectation to feed and treat the lawn at a high maintenance or NTEP sch A, except for the height..I'd mow 2.5 to 3".

AA: Ammonium Acetate

















Hope the photos posted this time!

JGH


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

That'sa nice soil. Other than a little phosphorous shortage and the higher pH, just about perfection unless you want to go OCD on balancing the major cations. What is the soil tilth and percolation (drainage) like?


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@Ridgerunner - appreciate the feedback...at this point I think I'm best served striving to introduce more OM. I put down 15yrds of topsoil compost mix in early September (soil analysis had it at ~25% OM) which I feel will help and/or continue to to help as it gets deeper into the soil. Tillage is great from where I sit, its pliable enough to hold shape but easily breaks into sizable chunks when pressed. The previous 3 owners always had a lawn service, but the owner whom preceded me had only 'green' and organic fertilizers applied which was a big help. No standing water or drainage issue to note, even in the lower spots. That being said, I feel I've got a good lot of soil, with some opportunities for leveling and grading but overall, a solid foundation.


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

With good tillage and drainage, IMO, no reason to chase the major cations. However, you might want to read the section about magnesiumotassium ratios in my thread in the FAQs Forum, just for future use if the turf shows any potassium deficiency issues. You can also use the formulas in that thread to calculate a total phosphorous addition that you can spread/apply over the next year or two. 
Let me know if you can't decipher my gibberish and I'll do my best to clarify, There is a plethora of people here that can give great advice on a reno, including alternative techniques, "best practices", and save you some headaches.

EDIT: Sorry, I meant to give you the formula for converting Logan Labs reported phosphorous to ppm:
LL reported value of P/2/2.3 = ppm


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Excellent! Thank you Ridgerunner - I'll check it out now!

JGH


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

Jeff,
I was looking at your soil test again and noticed that LL reports the depth of the test done with ammonium acetate (AA) at 4" rather than your stated depth of 6". In order to correctly calculated ppm, you will need to multiply the reported poundage of P2O5 by a factor of 1.5 (correcting from a 4" depth to a 6" depth).
70lbs P2O5 X1.5 /2 /2.3 = 23 ppm. (which to can compare to the Melich III sufficiency range table.)
Comparing the results from both test, it appears that LL may have used the 3-4" sample for both tests.
Is that your understanding of what was done or did I misread your first post?


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Ridgerunner, excellent catch - I really do appreciate your interpretation! Full disclosure, I had (3)tests done. 1. At inch 3 to 4, then 2. 0-6in, and 3. Soil structure from 0-6in, overkill I know 

Here is the 0-6in results


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

That's a lot of testing. 
With the LL test at 6" you can use the first formula without the depth conversion factor for ppm determination for P.
The other major cations (Ca, Mg and K) can be converted to ppm simply by dividing by 2.
That way you can compare your values to recommended values in the chart for Mehlich III extraction in the aforementioned thread.
Any questions, feel free.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

So it began....

I took the leap and committed to a Spring Reno. I applied a couple of glyphosate apps in March when the days actually got above 60 and began the seed bed prep in mid April. I've been living all-things-turf since last fall trying to get educated, assemble resources and plan. Below is a snapshot of what I've done thus far, beginning in September 2017. As of today, 5/13 (Day 22) I have quite a bit of germination and am essentially ~7 days behind many of Fall Reno updates I've studied. Which makes sense considering the first 7 days since seed down (4/21) for me had less than ideal soil temps, but by Day 7 through today, I've been very fortunate to have great soil temps day and night.

Notable shout-outs to @Pete1313, @wardconnor, @Ware, @g-man @GrassDaddy, @Ridgerunner, SuperSeedStore Drew K, Penn State Extension (Peter Landschoot), countless YouTube vids, and plenty of hours on this site  I may not have had direct contact with the aforementioned but their postings and updates have been invaluable to me and by continually referencing their material and processes was the only way any of this would have even been possible for me. To that, many thanks - Cheers!

*End Game*: Bewitched monostand (50lbs), ~24K sq ft

*2017*
Equip: Toro 50" ZTM w/ cart. Toro 30" push mower. My labor

9/14	Mowed low @ 2". Dethatched Lawn. Raked turf/debris (yield 14 refuse bags). 
9/15 Aerated. Delivery 15yds of 75% Compost, 25% Topsoil mix (Analysis: 25.9% OM, 7.9pH). Began distributing compost/soil mix. Raked it in.
9/17	Completed compost/soil mix application. Full water irrigation cycle

*2018*
Equip: Toro 50" ZTM w/ cart. Toro 30" push mower. Gregson-Clark Spreader-Mate A (modified). Turf Teq Power Rake (rented). Toro Dingo (rented). Midwest Landscape Rake 36". My labor

3/18	1st Nuke App
3/26 Well & Irrigation adjustments (new well pump). Combining 2 irrigation rotor zones into 1. LL Property Soil Analysis Results (10 plugs @ 3-4" depth: 7.47% OM, 7.1 pH)
3/28 2nd Nuke App
3/30 Outsourced Landscape ground cover/bush removal, trimming. Outline new patio design
4/13	Scalp & Bag (yield 9 refuse bags)

Took a week's VAC to complete the rest
4/16 Rental: Turf Teq Power Rake (~0.5" deep)
4/17	Con't Power Raking. Dragged property in the PM
4/18	Con't Drag Mat + Hand rake turf/debris (yield 10 refuse bags). 14yds of 20yds Topsoil/Compost mix delivered. (Analysis: 5.81% OM, 7.5 pH) Covered w/trap in advance of snow.
4/19	AM Snowfall, setback. Waiting to melt/dry. Refuse pickup (19 bags). Begun applying soil mix to hell strips, hand raking/leveling
4/20 Toro Dingo rental for soil mix loading. Con't applying soil mix to property, hand raking/leveling. Final 6yds of 20yds soil mix delivered
4/21	Finish applying soil mix, complete hand raking/leveling property
Seed down (PM)
50lbs of Bewitched (SuperSeedStore - Drew K)
(2) bags Soil Moist
~90lbs of Starter Fert (16-28-12 with Armament ZnB, 30% PSCU by ATS)
3.0oz/acre tenacity
Raked in seeds
Rolled
Full watering, 12 zones (rotor zones doubled up to equal 8 total)
4/22 Watering Schedule: 3-4 times a day, rotor zones 7-10mins + spray zones 3-5min. Daily manual tweaking
4/29 Day 8: Handful of germinating seeds
5/3	Day 12: Significant germination, photo worthy. Some relief 
5/10 Day 19: More and more germination, every day
5/12-13: Heavy downpours missed! ~0.75" (Forecast called for 2.5")

May:Consider AS/SRN applications/fungicides/fertilizer(s). Break ground for patio overhaul. Rachio 3 w/ Flow meter
June: Mow @ 2-2.5". Note Progress, evaluate, consider AS/SRN & fert applications. Tenacity.

Post Kill pics








Scalp and Turf Teq










Snow Delay 




Soil Spreading/Dingo/Daddy's Helper. I'm rockin the TLF hat! 














Seed Down 4/21


Day 22 (comparable to Day 15)
















Open soil area: Ripped out all boxwoods, roses, ground cover for new plantings.


Orange Paint outlines patio expansion




Problem Area1: Constant wash out. Reseed? Wait? TBD


Problem Area2: Upper left corner, constant puddling. Swamp


Weekly progress to follow, thanks for browsing.


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## wardconnor (Mar 25, 2017)

Thanks Jeff. Happy to help you. My vote is to throw some seed down. Your project is a ton of work but looks fun to me.

Do you have a cylinder mower? I might have missed that.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Thnx Connor, I was leaning toward throwing down. I snagged a 20" Scott's push reel mower off Craigslist this week. I'll need to sharpen the blades before using. Short term plan is to only use it for the first 2-4 mowings then move up to my 30" Toro Time Master. I also have a 50" zero turn that I could use. Next year is when I'll decide whether to to invest in a cylinder mower and begin going low HOC.


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## jha4aamu (Oct 16, 2017)

g-man said:


> Posting here is fine. In my experience, chicago soils are normally really good.
> 
> I recommend against a 22k sqft reno all at once. I most of the time recommend against a reno until you get the lawn basics nailed down. These include: spray applications (Tenacity, Herbicides, etc) and irrigation approach for the area (even coverage). Once you could get your NoMix looking awesome, then you are ready to kill it and do a reno.  We are here to help, so ask questions and advice as needed.
> 
> A great thread to look at is Pete1313. He is close to chicago and just did a large reno to kbg monostand. Pay attention to all the details he worked on prior to the actual kill. Pete1313 Reno


i thought about starting another thread with similar questions but happend to come across this one. But I've noticed that alot of cool season guys are doing renos w/ Bewitched monostands and wondering what the rationale was to that vs other KBG varieties? I am strongly considering doing a fall reno this year and wanted to do either Mazama or Midnight monostand but didnt know if that was advisable.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Go ahead and start a thread. You will get more attention to your question that way. Is your question around monostand or more why Bewitched vs. mazama vs midnight?


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## jha4aamu (Oct 16, 2017)

g-man said:


> Go ahead and start a thread. You will get more attention to your question that way. Is your question around monostand or more why Bewitched vs. mazama vs midnight?


a little of both. esp since i have about 25lbs of mazama and midnight in my garage that I'd like to use. ill start that thread though and see if i can get some more insight. thanks


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Day 28 - Moving along nicely.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Day 36. Mowed for the first time on Day 34, then again today at 36. 50#'s of Healthy Grow 10-3-2 + ~5#'s left over starter fert down on Day 34 after first cut. Temps in the 90's for the last 3 days, and the forecast calls for it to continue for the next 3. Watering 3 times a day, with the 14:00 watering a bit heavier. Hopefully the heat will subside and the mid week forecast for rain stays true.

Apologies for the shadows


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

It is looking good. Just keep an eye at it getting too dry vs too moist and fungus. It is a balancing act.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@g-man Re: fungus, good point!
My plan
1.Continued weekly N apps ~0.5# per K until mid/end of June.
2. First Tenacity app (5.0oz/A) is planned for ~Day 42 (6/2)
3. Fungicide: Do you think I'm better served doing a blanket app as a preventitive measure or spot shots if/when I identify them?

As with most its been a rollercoaster of a ride. After the expected rainfall tomorrow, I'll peel back to 1 watering a day, possibly adding an abbreviated 2nd if needed (Rachio really makes this easy).

As always, thanx for the feedback!


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Weekly 0.5 of N seems like too much to me.

The tenacity is for weeds?


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## iowa jim (Jan 22, 2018)

Looking great: the bewitched looks like its doing a good job of filling in under those trees.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@g-man Yes, Tenacity is a selective herbicide for pre and post emergent care.

@iowa jim Thanks, its undoubtedly been a labor of love. The photos were taken after I mowed, between mowings the barnyard grass sticks out over the Bewitched and is driving me mad :evil: Tenacity app scheduled for this weekend...can't wait


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Day 45. Tenacity went down last Thursday afternoon @ 2.5oz (5oz/Acre rate) with surfactant and blue tracer dye...shoulda seen my legs, rookie mistake :roll: . Already starting to see some light bleaching on weeds (yard is overwhelmingly barnyard, some PA and crabgrass). Gave it a long awaited mow @ 2" HOC. 2 weeks of N @ 0.5#/M seems to moving growth and density along quite nicely. Subject to the weather, I'll continue spoon feeding N for another 3 to 4 weeks...shooting for cessation a ~week before the 4th of July. Patio work is underway.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Day 60 Update
Hard to believe its been already 2months since seed down! Very pleased so far and admittedly, equally impressed with the elite KBG Bewitched...the growth, density (in most areas) and of course the spreading has been really amazing to watch.

I maintained a steady weekly diet of Nitrogen, bumping it up from 0.5# to 1.0# on 6/8 (Day 48) and then yesterday (6/19, Day 59) @ 0.75#. Also applied my second post-emergent application of Tenacity @ 2.5oz (5.0oz/Acre rate) in as many weeks, hoping this round will seal the deal on this barnyard grass (see photos). Cutting right now @ 2.5", I'll raise it to ~3.5" during the summer and revisit the HOC again in the Fall. Again, all things considered, and being a Spring half acre reno, very pleased...breathing a little easier (at least for a short while until the summer heat hits - fungicides are next).

In other news, during the last 2 weeks...
1. Our patio and walkway was completed (couldn't be any happier with it! The lights at night completes it)
2. Front yard/door area was planted with some nice Boxwoods, Blue Eye Spruce, Yew Densi and a Lilac Dwarf.
3. AC area was planted with Hydrangea Limelight as bookends and (3) Weigela Sonic Blooms in between.

That being said, I am quite proud of the entire yard and of course the progess. Crisp garden bed lines, BY island lighting, and some misc lawn projects still remain, but the majority of my Spring '18 lawn and landscape plans have manifested themselves into some really beautiful spaces. Appreciate all of the guidance and advice from other members and the invaluable information within this forum, and of course, I'd be remiss if I didn't thank my wife (who has been holding her breath since March!) for going along, albeit reluctantly, with yet another one of my 'crazy ideas'  
As this is my journal, I'll continue to add photos and updates around milestones. Thanks for reading, and I'd be happy to elaborate on any of my processes or experiences should anyone ever wish to inquire. Cheers

Day 60










Due to the construction traffic this area was trampled so we decided to add a couple yrds of topsoil to level and simply decide what to do with this space under the trees another time






New Patio


Trench running low voltage to the BY island


Barnyard Grass Aerial view


Same Barnyard Grass area but Street level


Great example of KBG filling in. This was a 'washout' spot for me ~Day 21, and one I was sure I'd have to reseed in the Fall. Now its filling in nicely. (Location is upper left corner of pic, beginning from the sprinkler flag to the driveway)


Sprinkler miss. This too seems to be closing the gap every week, I'd say ~25% fuller on the outskirts than it was 2 weeks ago. This however will likely become a reseeded area in the Fall.


Another couple of 'washout' areas...but lately its becoming more difficult to notice. Lovin the KBG!


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## OnyxsLawn (Mar 15, 2018)

looks great! How much N have you put down since seed down? Any fungus issues with all the heat, moisture, and weed control?


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Hi @OnyxsLawn here are my apps since seed down 4/21

5/25 N @ 0.4lbs
6/1 N @ 0.4lbs
6/2 TENACITY APP (5.0oz Acre rate)
6/8 N @ 1.0lbs
6/16 TENACITY APP (5.0oz Acre rate)
6/19 N @ 0.8lbs
6/26 N @ 0.8lbs (doing this tonite)


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

*Day 74*
Continually pleased by the progress. Diggin the color already 

We've started off July each day at or near 90+ (since the last week of June really) so the new stand will certainly be tested this summer. Another and likely final N app for a while (Healthy Grow 10-3-2) @ 0.4lb/M on 7/3....maybe some Milo in a few weeks, we'll see. Severe thunderstorms expected tonite...I'll take the rain and added N! :beer:

























Aerial view: Improvement in barnyard grass suppression/elimination


Street view


Some brown/dying grass I've been paying attention to. Could be anything from shedding blades during the KBG life cycle, to Tenacity browning. Not sure, but keeping a close eye on it.



Next update, Day 100. Happy 4th and enjoy the summer!


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

This is looking really good. The extra summer rains sure help in a spring seeding.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Day 89
Rain in the forecast for Day 90 so today will have to do.

Applied 1#/M of Milorganite 7 days ago and the color is starting to really darken. Looking forward to this 'cooler' weather (60-82) for the next couple days alongside ~1" of rain. Should make for some nice Day 100 pics! With the HOC @ 3.75" the stripes really pop in the light (Toro kit)!










Cheers


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Looking good. I would start thinking of prem soon to avoid poa a next year.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Agreed. I don't think I'll do any reseeding...I'm happy with the current coverage so no risk there. Many of the spots I considered weeks ago are legitimately closing in due to the awesome KBG spreading power :thumbup: . *BUT* if I do spot seed the one 2'X5' area I've been considering, I should be ok if I simply ensure I don't broadcast or foliar app the pre-m near it...right? As always, thanks @g-man


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## rob13psu (May 20, 2018)

:thumbup: Looking awesome!


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Stay away from the area and it will be ok.


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

I'm not sure how I missed this thread. Looks great. Spring reno's can be a challenge but yours has turned out very well.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

*Day 106*
Was out of town and missed the Day 100 photos...but definitely celebrated the milestone nevertheless! :beer:
Gave the lawn much needed TLC. Cut yesterday at 4.25" then again today at 3.75". While I was gone, had a friend put down (2) 50# bags of 22-0-4 w/ 0.29% Prodiamine on 8/2. Hope I'm not too late with this app...discovered a few POA seedheads in the lawn today. Many thanks to @g-man for calling this app out, woulda kicked myself had I missed it. That being said...I can honestly say, and couldn't imagine back in April I'd ever say it this year, but I don't need to reseed any areas. The original ~2.25#/M of Bewitched on 4/21 is what I have today and it did the trick! Now, there are plenty of areas that need filling in, and that'll be nudged forward alongside the Fall Nitrogen Bliss program - https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=753&p=13800&hilit=nitrogen+blitz#p13618. I do have the Rachio 3 and monitored the watering and weather while I was gone, but I still came home to some heat stress areas. I doubled up on this morning's watering and hopefully will see some turn around soon, we are also expecting some rain Monday and Tuesday, fingers crossed. Overall, 100+ days in, I'm very pleased with the progress, and really looking forward to this Fall's growing season to see how much can really fill in!


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

:thumbup: It looks great! :thumbup:

This looks great. I had a torrential downpour the only day I had to apply prodiamine, so I'm some what late. Hopefully tomorrow.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

g-man said:


> :thumbup: It looks great! :thumbup:
> 
> This looks great. I had a torrential downpour the only day I had to apply prodiamine, so I'm some what late. Hopefully tomorrow.


Many thanks @g-man! Labor of love no doubt. Pulling weeds by hand after irrigation/rain makes for much easier root removal, albeit laborious. But a half hour here, there, and it really starts to add up...now I just need those half dollar sized vacancies to fill in! Threw down another 1#/M of Milorganite today...about 10 days ahead of schedule, but only because Menards is having their 11% rebate this week AND the closest store to me that had at least 10+ bags was 25miles away! :shocked: ...def Milo shortage out there folks.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Day 131

Posting for no other reason than I thought the yard looked really great today. Began the Fall N Blitz a few weeks back, laid down 1#/M of 46-0-0. Fortunately a local ConservFS had some AS 21-0-0, so I snagged 300# which should last me through November. Dropped the HOC to 3.25" today and it's got me looking forward to ~2.0"! I think somewhere between 1.75" - 2.25" HOC and the yard could look very nice! Also ordered FAS hoping to get some down next week


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

Nice! Which ConservFS did you end up going to?


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Thanks @Pete1313. I bought it from ConservFS in Tinley Park. As soon as I walked in and asked for it, the salesman immediately asked me if I was 'licensed'. Said the stuff will smoke my lawn. After chatting for a few mins I suppose he became more comfortable in selling them to me. I wonder if this had anything to do with my struggle to source it too...if folks on the other end of phone just felt uncomfortable selling to a residential owner should they'd just say, sorry none in stock, dunno. My Plainfield ATS is my go-to, they know me very well since March :thumbup: . Hopefully they'll carry it next yr.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Spot seeded last week Saturday (9/1)- 3 sites on the property...1)a tree & stump removal, 2) around the new patio, 3) adjusted sprinkler head....totaling ~90 sq ft at most for all 3 locs. I had an extra 10# of Bewitched on hand from April that I dipped into (bought as insurance in case my Spring seeding went south...but never needed).

So impressed. 


That being said...several neighbors (all of which paid close attention to my April seeding...with folie de grandeur lol) eventually approached me in ~June...saw my results/yields and inquired...why, when, and how about my project to start-anew and seed. Long story short, one of them committed and drank the kool-aid...ordered seed from Drew @ SeedSuperStore, bought 25# of SS1100 (KBG: Award, Midnight, and Bewitched), nuked in early August, scalped, dethached, collected, and slit seeded (8/31). He had germination at the 11th hour on Day 5 (9/6) when we checked. He decided to only do his front yard and portions of his sides, totaling ~12K sq ft.

Prep






Seeding (first slit seeder rental failed, swapped out...went into sunset/dusk)




Nearly 6 Days later (9/7)..Lil' green babies!


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Day 150

HOC is now down to 2.75". Happy with the height and how the lawn is filling in (slowly) some areas, but I'm honestly bummed by all the Dollar Spot locations I have. I applied Eagle 20 EW twice in July but it seems I got hit again in August/Sept. I put down another app at 1.0oz/M yesterday hoping to curb the spread before the cooler weather rolls in ~Friday. Still looking good at street level and from afar, but the aerial pics show the damage. Suppose it could always be worse...hoping for a nice turnaround in 30days as I hit the 6mo mark!

Also, been participating in the Fall N Blitz plan, but doubled checked my records, and it appears, as of 9/12, I'm up to 4.75#/N for the year (3.5# from bio's such Milo and Healthy Grow. And 1.25# from Urea and AS). Any thoughts/feedback on continuing the Fall N Blitz or am I approaching an undesirable level of N for 2018?
[https://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/ay/ay-22-w.pdf, cites up to 5#'s annually. I have 4 bags of AS in the garage]


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Dollar spot pressure is super high for us this year. I feel like I have to be in constant Fungicide. Continue the nitrogen and do some FAS too.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Thanks @g-man. I did my first app of FAS (3oz F to 2.5oz AS) on 9/4, but can't say I noticed much...other than some staining  Appreciate the vote of confidence on the N and FAS, here's my Sept - Nov plan, maintaining a 2.75" HOC:

9/24: FAS (3.0ozF + 2.5ozAS/M)
9/28: PGR T-Nex (0.6oz/M)

10/5: 0.5#/M of granular AS
10/19: 0.5#/M of granular AS
10/20: FAS (3.0ozF + 2.5ozAS/M)
10/21: PGR T-Nex (0.6oz/M)

11/2: 0.5#/M of granular AS
11/16: 0.5#/M of granular AS Last N app of the year
*11/17: FAS (3.0ozF + 2.5ozAS/M) Last FAS app of the year
*11/18: PGR T-Nex (0.6oz/M) Last PGR of the year

*Undecided apps, may skip


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

I normally stop nitrogen around 25oct. I also stop pgr since the cold weather takes care of slowing the grow.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@Ridgerunner 
@g-man

Hey guys, got my soil test results back today and noticed a significant difference in OM % between standard testing and ammonium acetate. Seems off to me. Could a difference such as these values between both testing methods be legit? Also, should I worry about the sulfur (have been applying FAS lately). Other than that, I think the macros look good despite the high Magnesium. As always, thanx!


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

LL responded...the OM% difference was an error. All square now


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## ken-n-nancy (Jul 25, 2017)

Hey, a test from a company (Logan Labs) with which I am familiar enough to be of help!

Either one of those OM% are fantastic - even at the lower level, there's not new work to do there! Keep up whatever you've been doing for OM, as it's working!

I wouldn't personally be worried about that sulfur level. I seem to recall that a Logan Labs test value of about 10-200 is fine.

The macros do look pretty good. Potassium % is a little lower than optimal, but a soil with that TEC holds a lot of nutrients, so there's actually a fair bit of potassium there, even though the % is down a bit. The magnesium is high, but there's nothing that needs to be fixed there, other than avoiding new applications of magnesium (no dolomitic limestone or epsom salt applied to your lawn.)

Basically, if you can't grow grass on that soil, you can't blame the soil for the problem...


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

Good to see you got it resolved. Poor LL, they seem to be having their fair share of errors lately.    
FYI: The extract methods used to measure the cations (M3 or AA etc.) would have no effect on OM results. OM measurement is a completely separate test process/method. There are two test methods used for measuring/estimating OM. One is a hazardous chemical method to remove carbon content from a soil sample and the cost is very high, so although some labs make it an elective option, it is seldom used as a default. Most labs including LL use the second method: LOI (Loss On Ignition) which measures the amount of carbon lost from a soil sample when subjected to high temperatures. The amount of carbon lost/removed is then used to calculate the amount of OM that was present.


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

Missed your other two questions. Sulfur levels are fine. More than sufficient and there are no known maximum levels that are toxic/detrimental to turf, so you don't need to avoid sulfate, but why push it? As your sulfate/sulfur levels are sufficient, you don't need to limit yourself to sulfate containing amendments, Using cheaper and easier to find potassium chloride can be used to add potassium to your soil. All reported nutrient levels, except K, are more than sufficient for turf needs. Recommended sufficiency levels for potassium are 220 lbs/acre. you're slightly shy, but see below.
Mg is high. You could slowly try to lower this with additions of gypsum, but it's not critical to do so and it's not something I am a proponent of doing, but to each his own. Although high Mg levels can make for "tighter" soils, reducing Mg levels is very much an individual choice. Keep in mind that Mg and K are antagonistic elements, so an excess of one may create a plant deficiency of the other. On the other hand, higher Mg levels have been found to result in increased P plant availability. All in all, it's better to just make sure values are within range rather than attempting to fine tune levels.

Edited as I could not locate supporting documentation for all of the removed statements.


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

Went back and read through your post.
Lawn looks like it came in great. Congrats!
Question though: The pH values between this current test and the orifinal test does not compute for me. Especially as a major amendment was soil with a pH of 7.9. Any explanation how pH dropped from 7.4 to 6.8? Maybe on a low CEC sand, but very unlikely with a CEC in the mid teens and with your soil texture analysis (clay and silt). Anything I'm missing?


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

ken-n-nancy said:


> Hey, a test from a company (Logan Labs) with which I am familiar enough to be of help!
> 
> Either one of those OM% are fantastic - even at the lower level, there's not new work to do there! Keep up whatever you've been doing for OM, as it's working!
> 
> ...


Thanks @ken-n-nancy. My goal for next Spring is to source some SOP to help get the K on track. (Diggin the cobblestone border that you did alongside the road!)


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Ridgerunner said:


> Went back and read through your post.
> Lawn looks like it came in great. Congrats!
> Question though: The pH values between this current test and the orifinal test does not compute for me. Especially as a major amendment was soil with a pH of 7.9. Any explanation how pH dropped from 7.4 to 6.8? Maybe on a low CEC sand, but very unlikely with a CEC in the mid teens and with your soil texture analysis (clay and silt). Anything I'm missing?


@Ridgerunner Thank you for the details re: LL testing procedures, certainly glad you had the time to look at them. I'll continue with Milo and Healthy Grow 10-3-2 and pepper in an app of 0-0-50 next year if I can source some. But I agree, overall the soil is in great shape and I'm happy with it. The long term plan will continue to be establishing a steady pH range from 6.5-7.0. That being said, a great segue into your question Re: the pH. From where I sit, a drop or in this case an improvement in pH from 7.5 to 6.8 is/was a huge change, for the better of course...if it's 'accurate'. The only major actions that I can think of that could've manipulated the soil was 1) In September '17, I topdressed ~15yrds of a topsoil compost mix but that yielded a 7.9 pH (A&L Great Lakes labs). 2)Then this Spring '18, another 20yrds of mix (different local supplier) and that yielded 7.5 (LL testing). As you can see in both instances, the pH was higher than my lawn soil. So, I am too curious as to how the drop came. I should note however, in my journal here, my last soil test posting was my Fall '17 (December) results (7.4). I submitted another sample (which I did not post) via LL on 3/26/18 to see if again, if any changes occurred, especially as I was a couple weeks leading up to my April reno, and that pH value came back at 7.1. So, at this point either last winter somehow lowered my pH or LL is a bit flaky lately, I'm not quite sure :dunno: . I'll have something to compare IF I take another test in March '19. I seriously doubt the 150# of AS 21-0-0 I put down (1.2#N/K total) in July and August swung the pH either.


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## BenC (Mar 27, 2018)

Is Logan labs local to you? Not familiar with your area, but would guess that ammonium acetate extract isn't appropriate for a slightly acidic/neutral organic soil. I haven't seen Mg concentrations limit drainage until they are up to about 1100 ppm on lower CEC soil types, percentage wise that starts happening at 40% plus saturation. Ideal Mg sat% is 20% and Ca 72%, otherwise you're really well balanced. You need calcium but not a pH change. Gypsum, calcium thiosulfate, maybe calcium chloride. But i'd Be wary of chloride formulations; either potassium or calcium chloride. You might be fine if you water it in real good, but with higher organic matter and higher CEC you might get a little salt burn from the chloride if it can't get through the profile quick enough, just something to watch.
pH changes that big could be the lab, maybe a sampling error. pH and potassium results will change from fall to spring or spring to fall, so results on those two can't be compared unless they are taken from the same season.
If you think sulfur is an issue, i'd Get a nitrate on your next results and look at the ratio, not a great big help since both of those analytes change rapidly. Off the top of my head I think most stuff likes a 16:1 N:S, but i'd Want to double check that.
Otherwise @Ridgerunner and @ken-n-nancy are right on the money in my book. Soil is really nice as is your lawn. Your soil applied pre-e rates will likely need to be at the extreme end of the rate range due to organic matter tie up in most cases.


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## Outerspace (Sep 7, 2018)

I am enjoying the pictures


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Thanks @BenC for the feedback! I had my suspicions that there would be a natural seasonal swing in pH, just not quite that much. Perhaps it was a sampling error, wouldn't rule that out, but I did approach this sample with the same methodology as the others. Trying to decide whether to take an annual soil test in the spring or fall, but overall, I agree the soil is good and at this point I don't really want to mess with it. As always, lovin the pointers!


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Day 183 (6 months!)

Really pleased to update this journal with some 6 month photos...in the same moment, hard to imagine it was only March when I nuked it, and 4/21 when I seeded! Very happy with the color, the Fall N Blitz is nearing the end and the overall density and filling in is noticeable week after week. As this year comes to a close, it'll be a nice break/winter to kick back and reflect but also prepare for Spring '19...perhaps a Toro 1600 purchase between now and then  ...very seriously considering it.

My spring reno had it challenges, ups and downs, but I just want to thank everyone for your help, comments and feedback.

Day 22


Day 28


Day 36


Day 45


Day 60


Day 74


Day 106


Day 131


Day 151


Day 183 - Present
HOC 2.75". Weather went from sunny to overcast on the day these were taken.


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## JP900++ (Aug 24, 2018)

Looks so good!


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## rob13psu (May 20, 2018)

Wow, that looks great!


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Long winter....

So happy to see the hours change next Sunday...closer step to Spring! Snow finally melted by me and it struck me how different my Bewitched looks compared to my neighbor's NoMix, even in Feb. Anyway thought I'd share, slowly getting back into the swing of things, can't wait for the growing season!!!

Lighting is bad, I'll try and capture a better shot during the day w/ a clear sky.


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

The dormant color of bewitched is just alittle darker then the neighbors no mix :lol: :thumbsup:. I wish I can see my grass. It is still under ice and snow just an hour west of you.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@Pete1313 From what I experienced this winter, you probably had 5X times the snow and bit colder polar vortex...and just one hour away...NUTS! Looks like the second wk of March will yield more opportunities above freezing. Got any major plans this yr?


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

Definitely looking forward to getting outside, but it's going to take some time for this ice and hard snow to melt. No major plans besides fine tuning cultural practices. I'm going to try and do more with foliar fertilization. How about you? Any major plans?


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@Pete1313 No major plans. Last year was the spring reno, patio expansion, and a crabapple tree removal. Sold my 50" ZTM Toro on craigslist in November, gonna push mow with the 30" Toro, I like the cut better and of course walking the yard while doing it. This spring I'll likely create a 24" flowerbed/shrub border along the perimeter of my new patio, redraw/clean up existing flower bed lines etc. Nothing major. Did you ever replace the tree in your BY island that blew down? I'll need to revisit your post soon.


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

I have not. Kind of wish the other tree would just fall as it will look awkward back there for a while, even if I plant another tree. I have a maple sapling that is just over 3 ft tall in another spot. If it looks healthy this spring, I might just transplant it there and see what happens, but not sure yet.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

NTEP has Bewitched and KBG in general as slow to "spring green up"...but that's not the case at my house. I've got the greenest lot in the neighborhood!

Can't believe my monostand will turn 1yr old in only a couple of weeks :shock:


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

^ awesome. My 5 month old kbg beat my nomix in green up. And the no mix beat the neighbors by a few weeks.


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

Looks beautiful! The clean edging on that huge bed really stands out!


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@g-man @Pete1313, thank you! Do you guys have any feedback as to what I can expect from my lawn heading into my first year reno anniversary (3rd growing season)? Of course it'll thicken but how much do you think if I keep up with N. And color, will it darken much more? Curious what your experiences were as your renos matured. Thnx!


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Day 373

1 YEAR OLD. Can't believe it.

Last yr at this time I was sweating germination, taking soil temps, on NOAA, etc...and TODAY, a year later, I'm researching commercial grade mowers because my 30" TC is struggling to cut because of how thick the lawn is. I mowed today for the 4th time in 8 days. 2.5, 3.25, 3.25, 2.5 (always mulching). Again, appreciate all the feedback and questions, its been a wonderful ride! Enjoy the pics


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Looks beautiful... Nice outcome on a spring reno...

I don't know much about the mower, but a Kawasaki engine is a great thing.. I have an 18.5hp on my X304 with a 42" deck and it has been a fantastic motor...


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## synergy0852 (Jun 30, 2018)

Wow, that's a beautiful property you have there!


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

Beautiful stuff! Congrats on the 1 year anniversary!


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

That is some great looking bewitched. :thumbup:


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## Scagfreedom48z+ (Oct 6, 2018)

The lawn looks great! Awesome progress in so little time.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

@Hyna32 how is this looking?


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@g-man Thanks for checking in! Discovered the secret sauce recently...ZnB Armament from Advanced Turf Solutions (HQ is in your neck of the woods in Fisher IN)....this formula really brings out the color of the stand. My pH is a bit high ~7.4 and this stuff really frees up the micros and trace elements. These pics are from a couple weeks ago, 3.75" HOC. Seeing some Dollar Spot of late (curbed it with Eagle 20EW)











Added (4) David Austin roses to the landscape (caged due to the wildlife eating em up! :evil: )


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

Looks great @Hyna32! When did you first start seeing the dollar spot? We had some really ripe conditions for it the weekend of the 20th-21st. We have some good growing weather coming up this week! :thumbsup:


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## iowa jim (Jan 22, 2018)

Very nice and that edging= fantastic


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## social port (Jun 19, 2017)

iowa jim said:


> that edging= fantastic


+1
My oh my, your lawn looks great. I can't believe that I haven't yet commented. Something about Northern Illinois soil or weather must suit Bewitched.

Edit: @Hyna32, I would like to clarify: You are mowing 24k with a 30 inch Timemaster?


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@Pete1313 Re: Dollar Spot, I'd say ~2wks/10days ago. Bugged me because I knew the timing would be ripe soon but I didn't want to put down a fungicide right then only to have it lapse protection after 3 wks THEN watch it get hit. So I threw Eagle down about 10days ago...not quite preventative at that point but still early. And it seems to be working. Last year I was in total curative mode and I paid $$ a lot more. As for this weeks low 60/dare I say high 50's evenings, I chanced it this afternoon and put some fert down right after we got pounded with rain. Hopefully the stand will take it up with some soil temps. BTW, good advice on the T-Nex/Primo. I use it regularly and love it!


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

iowa jim said:


> Very nice and that edging= fantastic


 :beer: Thanks


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

@social port Yep, I use my Toro 30". But between the landscaping upgrades and patio extension I'm probably closer to 22K by now. In 5yrs I've had (2) ZTM's, a commercial Toro 36" Floating Deck and my 30" TC. Sold them all except the TC. I hated the divots the ZTM created and the Floating deck was heavy and didn't maneuver as well as I hoped. Above all, none of them gave me the quality of cut as my lil 30" walk behind did (G5 gator blades help to - Huge!). So, I get my walk in...takes an hr to cut, 2hrs for the full shave and cut, but damn it looks good. Oh, and thank goodness for T-Nex, otherwise Spring and Fall would be nuts to manage.


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Closing out 2019. Posting a couple photos for posterity...comparing against this time last year, surprised by how early the leaves fell this yr vs 2018. My front yard Maple shed all her leaves and last year at this time they were just turning color, same goes for the backyard! Anyway, year 2 of my Spring Reno is done, biggest takeaway was failing to put N down of any kind QRN or SRN between June and late Sept...I just didn't get to it, slipped my radar, and it showed. Between 9/20 and 10/24 I managed to force feed 2.5#/M SRN and 1.5#/M QRN so I'm hoping the roots received enough for storage going into winter. BTW I transplanted the 3-David Austins roses (Carding Mill and 2 Queen of Sweden) from the BY island to side of the house for better visibility and control (rabbits  ). Ordered 6 more (color progression White -> Purple) for planting in the FY. Cheers! :beer:

2019 Late October








2018 Late October


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Hope everyone is safe and getting a chance to get outside in the yard! I ripped out two areas alongside the driveway that had several Burning bushes. The polar vortex really did a number on them in 2019 and I hoped they'd come back later that spring and summer but too much of them had perished. So, with left over seed from my spring 2018 reno, I seeded the area after pulling out the bushes, graded, and put down mushroom compost and peat moss. It'll be warm for a few days, then NOAA is forecasting a cold front coming through with temps between 50-29deg. We'll see how well this goes in terms of seed vitality and potential freezing temps...nonetheless, it was great to get a mow in and get this project behind me. Here's to a new growing season! :beer:


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Started to see germination on Monday evening, Day 14. Turns out the seed from 2yrs ago was still viable and the overnight freezing temps with snow didn't delay (or prevent for that matter) germination too much.





Also on Monday we had some dying Spruce trees removed from the BY. Seeded on Tuesday


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## Hyna32 (Dec 1, 2017)

Just when you think you are doing things right...this is what two weeks of unchecked Summer Patch can do. Noticed what I thought was the onset of Brown Patch or Dollar Spot ~2weeks ago. Went on a vacation to MI then a work trip a wk later...this is what I came back to.

Summer Patch


Thinking this is SP as well








I JUST spot sprayed 6oz of EagleEW20 around the periphery of each section of 'hay', hoping that'll curb the spread and/or salvage whats left nearby. SP is a killer though once it spreads.

My watering schedule had been ~1" per week, since July. Rest of the lawn looks ok. (Some of the brown spots in the aerial views are actually sprinkler heads that don't overlap that well in coverage)












Now it'll be tear up the mailbox area and likely 3ft diameter sections around the yard and reseed after I double pass aerate the yard. This is the the largest issue/failure I've experienced since I first seeded the Bewitched monostand in April 2018. Looking ahead to next year, I'll be buying and blanket spraying Heritage beginning in May through Aug/Sept each yr here on out. We had a 90deg heat stretch recently but SP starts to infect in the spring at 4" soil temps ~65....lesson learned.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

1in/week might not be enough water too. I've been doing more than that.


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