# Let's talk about flooring...



## Ware

I once read that everyone's idea of the "perfect" floor is whatever they don't have now - i.e. they all have their drawbacks.

We have a mix of engineered hardwood, tile and carpet in our house now. We're leaning toward engineered hardwood in the main areas of our new home, but haven't ruled out wood look tile for the overall durability.

I see a lot of vinyl plank in new homes around here, and some of it looks really good. It has a lot of desirable characteristics, but I think it's hard to get past the stigma of it being a vinyl product - despite some of it costing just as much as other options.

I know there are a lot of variables and regional trends, but what flooring type(s) do you prefer and why?


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## bernstem

Flooring is highly personal preference. Personally, I lean heavily toward natural materials. For wood flooring, I would choose natural hardwood over engineered. There is infinite variability in natural products. Engineered flooring is now very close to the look of natural hardwood, but just not quite there yet. The engineered flooring has cost and durability going for it. Though not that case in Arkansas, in some locations like Miami, natural hardwood would generally not be a great choice.

Natural hardwood will also age and weather with time, but engineered does not. Some poeple like that. Depending on budget and overal aesthetic, repurposed hardwood flooring can be very interesting if you like the look. You will also find older hardward is often 100% quarter sawn rather than mixed quarter/rift sawn. That is a rabbit hole of research if you want to go down it. Lastly, you can customize your flooring a lot more with natural hardwood. Between choosing wood (white vs red oak, cherry, hardwoods, etc), staining, and finishing you you can have a floor that is unique.

One other thing to consider. Natural Hardwood has some maintenance required. It should get new polyurethane every ~10 years or so depending on traffic. The engineered requires almost no maintenance other than washing.

Here is the 100 year old white oak floor in my current house. It is almost entirely quarter sawn. It was restained and finished 10 years ago:



And an area that was laid 6 years ago when we remodeled. It is a mix of plain and quarter sawn. You can see the difference in the grain:


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## testwerke

Love the relative warmth and look/feel of hardwood. We went with glued down engineered and have no regrets.

Vinyl doesn't feel or sound the same. Tile is too cold. Floating laminate sounds and looks terrible.


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## Thejarrod

I love oak hardwood flooring. It just looks and feels like a quality floor....we also use lots of area rugs...to protect it from children.


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## g-man

On concrete slab, a quality vinyl plank is really my choice. It is stronger and more durable to scratches. It is easier to install/replace a damaged one and it is waterproof.

Above grade, then real hardwood is a solid option. But I still prefer vinyl when we had our 90lb lab and his powerful nails.


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## bernstem

g-man makes a good point about flooring on a slab. Natural hardwood won't do well there. For basements, I like stained concrete with Polyurethane. Cermaic or natural stone tile are also good choices for a slab.

Harwood isn't perfect. My brother in law has big dogs. He had a new looking cherry floor for about a week. After 6 months they looked fine, but with character. Definitely pick a harder wood if you have big dogs and want them to stay new looking longer. I have a 60 lb goldendoodle and the white oak doesn't have any blemishes from them. I have some areas where chairs have marred the surface. I'll get some pictures later. If you have office chairs on the floor, you will want hardwood safe casters. It bothered me at first, but now I just figure it is added character (though I did upgrade to rubber casters on my chair to stop any marring).


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## Ware

Agree. I would say that's why seeing solid hardwood is so rare around here - almost all new homes are on a slab. I think you can do it, but there is a lot of added work/expense. I think one method is installing a 3/4" treated plywood underlayment on top of a plastic barrier. With today's lumber prices, that is a lot of unnecessary expense - not to mention some of the issues you would run into having an inch and half of flooring on top of the slab (e.g. trimming doors).


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## Shindoman

Don't rule out Engineered Hardwood on concrete. All of the homes we build utilize engineered hardwood glued directly to the concrete. With the advances in the glues and the stability of quality engineered hardwood it works great. Just make sure to have the floor leveled with a slurry mix to eliminate any waviness in the concrete. About the only disadvantage is there is no cushion to the floor that you would get with plywood underlayment. I'm amazed with the durability of the Walnut engineered floor we installed 6 years ago on our main floor. Even with our 75 lb Basset Hound ripping thru the house playing scratches are non existent and Walnut is a relatively soft hardwood. It's made by Kentwwod. 
Although we rarely see them, vinyl plank is extremely durable, lasts a long time. I'm not a fan of Tile on concrete unless their is radiant heat underneath. It's cold.


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## rotolow

Porcelain wood-look large format tiles.

They're tough as nails, work well for slab on grade homes, look great, etc.

We have kids and dogs- I don't think I could ever have a good looking hardwood or LVP floor with the amount of damage this family can produce...


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## bernstem

I have used the ceramic wood look tiles in some rentals. They are incredibly durable. Appearance and hardness (eveything breaks if dropped on ceramic and stone) are really the only places they fall short of natural hardwood. I have not used the engineered hardwood flooring. If you are on a slab, natural hardwood may not be the best option.

As an aside, if I ever build a house I am putting radiant floor heating wherever possible and spray foam insulating all the walls and attic.


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## corneliani

Ware said:


> Agree. I would say that's why seeing solid hardwood is so rare around here - almost all new homes are on a slab. I think you can do it, but there is a lot of added work/expense. I think one method is installing a 3/4" treated plywood underlayment on top of a plastic barrier. With today's lumber prices, that is a lot of unnecessary expense - not to mention some of the issues you would run into having an inch and half of flooring on top of the slab (e.g. trimming doors).


It's very possible to do solid hardwood on slab but it takes a little bit of planning, for sure. Set your exterior doors on 3/4" plywood strips, embedded in a generous amount of Liquid Nails. This will match your interior 3/4" subfloor height, which only requires a vapor barrier (felt or plastic) after which the subfloor can be anchored or power nailed into the slab. Once this is down throw another layer of felt paper on top and the flooring can be installed.

On my personal home I framed with double bottom-plates on the main level, which allowed me to fur up the floor 1.5". My original intent was to install a hot-water radiant floor system on sleepers, backfilled with a heat-transfer medium such as shotcrete or even sand (craziness, I know). After spending some time learning about the details of such a system and realizing we only have 2-3 months of winter here in Atlanta and the cost/expense of implementing my craziness would have a 20yr break-even timeframe i came back to reality. I ended up using 3/4" Rigid Foam boards on top of my slab to act as a thermal barrier, and anchored 3/4" subflooring on top of that (I don't want to remember how many drill bits I used that weekend!). Some 4" wide plank white oak was nailed on top without a hiccup (at least that's how I choose to remember it LOL).

Here's some relevant feedback for you though:

- modern engineered flooring has really evolved in leaps and bounds! The finish (on the good stuff) is impossible to achieve on site-finished floors. Not only is the color perfect but they bake on that acrylic so that nothing can scratch it, seemingly! I go with water-based urethane on my site finished jobs to try to mimic this result (the oil-based poly is soft and thick!) but it still doesn't compare. Oh, and if you're going for a scraped or aged look, site-finished isn't even an option. We tried doing that once using hammers and nails and chains and whatever we had at our disposal to try to create a distressed look and it was the funniest thing ever! I had to walk away, couldn't bear seeing them do that.

- the down side to engineered is that you commit to them as you can't refinish, if needed. You can get 2-3 resands out of the solid hardwoods. Again, not as relevant anymore as the finishes on the engineered stuff is that good, but worth mentioning. Even if it's a resand for colors sake, it's an option on site finished.

- i don't know anything about vinyl since it's taboo just to think about it LOL. I'm sure things have evolved in their arena as well, but nothing i deal with.

- I would only consider tile on main slab floors if I was in Florida (or similar warm areas). Or embed radiant hot-water heating in a 2" mudbed on top of your slab! Yeah. Not going to happen, i know. Just saying. Use it as an accent or in heavy traffic areas but wall-to-wall tile will require you to walk in shoes/slippers all winter long! If little kiddos are in your household then this is even more of an issue.


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## Slim 1938

I put engineered flooring in my living and dining area when we built and we hate it. It's glued on a slab but is a pain in the *** to keep clean. My BIL went vinyl and it looks good and is super easy to clean. I put ceramic wood looking tile in my bathrooms and it looks great. We'll probably replace engineered for ceramic in future.


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## Slim 1938

@Ware Here's some pics for reference. Ceramic tile and engineered hardwood..


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## corneliani

I'm loving the elegant rustic-ness (and especially the sawcut details) on this wood, and the color is becoming my new fav. It has a modern feel and works just as well in a bright/open floorplan as in smaller places.


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## bernstem

I forgot to post these pictures of the chair caster marring on my hardwood:


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## Shindoman

bernstem said:


> I forgot to post these pictures of the chair caster marring on my hardwood:


Beautiful Herringbone pattern. Those marks are called Patina. They add character.


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## Jgourley124

corneliani said:


> I'm loving the elegant rustic-ness (and especially the sawcut details) on this wood, and the color is becoming my new fav. It has a modern feel and works just as well in a bright/open floorplan as in smaller places.


Care to share the color, and or type of flooring this is?


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## Delmarva Keith

I've used solid oak finished on site and several different types of "engineered" prefinished plank flooring in different homes over the years. The engineered is obviously a lot easier and a lot less mess to deal with. A couple things to think about besides just floor type and wood species: Width of plank. Depending on the room dimensions or if in a hallway, etc., wider planks are a whole different look from narrow. Everyone has their own preference. For the engineered stuff, the machining of the edges. There is always a tiny (or not so tiny) bevel at the edges and different manufacturers have different bevels. The smaller the bevel and the tighter tolerances on dimensions of the plank, the more it will resemble a solid, site finished floor.

My wife recently insisted on an engineered bamboo floor in one room of our present house. We went to every flooring store for miles around looking at many different types and ended up with Cali Bamboo "fossilized" (whatever that means) from Lowes of all places. It went down like a dream, is extremely hard and dense (and heavy) and with the right underlay (we used Pergo gold) is a blond one shy of 3/4" thick if you need to match the flooring height in other rooms (we did). Yes it's floating but it's thick and heavy enough that it pretty much has the solid feel of nailed down. It's not cheap but not crazy expensive either. Looks like traditional hardwood, at least from standing height.

We both really like the look of the tiles that look very much like wood planks but I'm hesitant to use it because I'm worried it's a fad type thing and will end up being dated down the road. Natural materials tend to be timeless. If an area is appropriate for impermeable, bite the bullet and use some type of stone tiles.


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## Deke

My 2cents. Coming from a carpet cleaning / restoration background. I would guess I have seen, touched, installed, and removed more flooring than 99.9% of people on the planet.

1. Real wood flooring. Preferably a hardwood. Tough to beat real hardwood. Only downfalls are cost and it's a pain to dry if it gets wet. If it does it usually takes specialized equipment to get it dry, most likely will have cupping for up to 6 months while floor re normalizes it's moisture content. And then will most likely need to be refinished.

2. Lvp. Fake plastic wood floor lookalike. This stuff is actually pretty amazing. I was very against this when it first came out. Feels cold and plasticy. Now they are adding texture to the flooring and coming out with more "natural" patterns. Fairly bullet proof floor, if it gets wet you can jam a crowbar under the floor to get air movement under it until subfloor is dry and then just pull out crowbar. Cost is 1/8th compared to real wood. And can be installed by homeowner relatively easy.

3. Engineered hardwood. Can look decent. Maybe my least liked flooring. Damages very easy, if it gets wet it's gone the way of old yellar. Could be a good option for older couples without kids or animals. If you are hard on your floors skip on this.

4. Carpet. Easy for me to clean and keep looking good. Harder for most people. Soft and warm, best for bedrooms and low traffic areas. Buy good carpet if you are going to put it in your house. Gen 3-4 nylon. Skip everything else. This is very much a product where you get what you pay for. Use rebond pad, no pet barrier. If it gets wet it is the easiest to dry. Takes 2-3 days and can be tucked back in, cleaned and you are back to normal in less than a half week.


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## quintafresnos

We used rectified porcelain large-format floor tile. Expensive, but our last wood floor was ruined by our dog's claws. We also used it for the bathroom walls. It is a beast to drill, one diamond bit cost $25.


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## SodFace

We're doing our basement shortly and are solidly between laminate and vinyl wood-look flooring. I think we're leaning towards vinyl for the water resistance with young kids spilling stuff everywhere.

Odd everyone here is talking about installing right on the slab. Here it's pretty typical to do a subfloor for both warmth and allow water to run underneath (worst case...definitely not normal). Either plastic roll stuff then plywood or the all-in-one 24"x24" tiles like these https://dricore.com/products/dricore-subfloor. We're leaning towards the ones that instead of plastic use rigid foam and provide a small R3 insulation. From what I've heard it makes a difference in floor temperature.


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## jayhawk

Ware said:


> I think one method is installing a 3/4" treated plywood underlayment on top of a plastic barrier. With today's lumber prices, that is a lot of unnecessary expense - not to mention some of the issues you would run into having an inch and half of flooring on top of the slab (e.g. trimming doors).


Commodity builders still put in trim before a non carpeted floor? I'm sure 'i just don't understand'


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## jayhawk

Above grade, new home....solid, site finish. Retro u have other concerns. All the engineered wood I have walked on felt cheap, like a cork feel? Maybe I've never seen 'good stuff'. 
Tile on concrete, better have a decoupling strategy.



SodFace said:


> We're doing our basement shortly and are solidly between laminate and vinyl wood-look flooring. I think we're leaning towards vinyl for the water resistance with young kids spilling stuff everywhere.
> 
> Odd everyone here is talking about installing right on the slab. Here it's pretty typical to do a subfloor for both warmth and allow water to run underneath (worst case...definitely not normal). Either plastic roll stuff then plywood or the all-in-one 24"x24" tiles like these https://dricore.com/products/dricore-subfloor. We're leaning towards the ones that instead of plastic use rigid foam and provide a small R3 insulation. From what I've heard it makes a difference in floor temperature.


Ditto. I need to price it out (dricore). While I have no interest in engineered wood but LVP I think wins due to moisture advantages. I would like some 'cushion', air and insulation.


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## Ware

jayhawk said:


> Ware said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think one method is installing a 3/4" treated plywood underlayment on top of a plastic barrier. With today's lumber prices, that is a lot of unnecessary expense - not to mention some of the issues you would run into having an inch and half of flooring on top of the slab (e.g. trimming doors).
> 
> 
> 
> Commodity builders still put in trim before a non carpeted floor? I'm sure 'i just don't understand'
Click to expand...

In new construction around here I would say interior trim is almost always installed, caulked/puttied, primed, sanded and shot with lacquer before any flooring goes down. I personally wouldn't want that work performed over a finished floor, but YMMV.


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## Ware

Just an update - we ended up going with a wood look tile for overall durability. It hasn't been cleaned in this photo, but you can get an idea of what it looks like:


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## jayhawk

I just prefer base ontop floors and no shoe mould. Ramboard


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## jayhawk

Ware said:


> jayhawk said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Ware said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think one method is installing a 3/4" treated plywood underlayment on top of a plastic barrier. With today's lumber prices, that is a lot of unnecessary expense - not to mention some of the issues you would run into having an inch and half of flooring on top of the slab (e.g. trimming doors).
> 
> 
> 
> Commodity builders still put in trim before a non carpeted floor? I'm sure 'i just don't understand'
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> In new construction around here I would say interior trim is almost always installed, caulked/puttied, primed, sanded and shot with lacquer before any flooring goes down. I personally wouldn't want that work performed over a finished floor, but YMMV.
Click to expand...

I just prefer base ontop floors and no shoe mould. Ramboard


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## corneliani

SodFace said:


> We're doing our basement shortly and are solidly between laminate and vinyl wood-look flooring. I think we're leaning towards vinyl for the water resistance with young kids spilling stuff everywhere.
> 
> Odd everyone here is talking about installing right on the slab. Here it's pretty typical to do a subfloor for both warmth and allow water to run underneath (worst case...definitely not normal). Either plastic roll stuff then plywood or the all-in-one 24"x24" tiles like these https://dricore.com/products/dricore-subfloor. We're leaning towards the ones that instead of plastic use rigid foam and provide a small R3 insulation. From what I've heard it makes a difference in floor temperature.


You don't need water management if your slab is on/above grade, it's usually for below grade applications where you have to mitigate for the capillary action through concrete walls/slab. That's when it becomes best practice to create an air barrier, be it with sleepers or the $$$ dricore product. And for a below-grade application the floating vinyl products are really a good idea, esp if you get the nicer CVT-type ones. They're resilient and easy to disassemble if needed.... and the heavier material products don't sound/feel hollow & mushy.

@jayhawk - are we the only ones in the country that still prefer natural hardwood flooring as a premium product?? lol It is a lot more work, that's for sure, but it's a classic look for sure. At least for us it is.


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## corneliani

Ware said:


> Just an update - we ended up going with a wood look tile for overall durability. It hasn't been cleaned in this photo, but you can get an idea of what it looks like:


That looks good Ware! I particularly like the split-width on some of the tiles, it gives it a nice randomness.

Landscaping next??


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## Ware

corneliani said:


> Ware said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just an update - we ended up going with a wood look tile for overall durability. It hasn't been cleaned in this photo, but you can get an idea of what it looks like:
> 
> 
> 
> That looks good Ware! I particularly like the split-width on some of the tiles, it gives it a nice randomness.
> 
> Landscaping next??
Click to expand...

Thanks, and I agree - I like that it doesn't look as repetitive as some of the WLT's I've seen.

We're not quite to landscaping yet, but should be setting up for a driveway and sidewalks soon. We're in the queue, but spring rain every few days has the dozer guy backed up.


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## jayhawk

Like the darker grout there ....we did a dark wood tile, however our greyish grout reminds u it's tile


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## SodFace

jayhawk said:


> Ditto. I need to price it out (dricore). While I have no interest in engineered wood but LVP I think wins due to moisture advantages. I would like some 'cushion', air and insulation.


We ended up going with that insulated dricore subfloor and a middleish grade vinyl flooring. Probably won't really be able to tell how well it works until this winter.


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## corneliani

Ware said:


> We're not quite to landscaping yet, but should be setting up for a driveway and sidewalks soon. We're in the queue, but spring rain every few days has the dozer guy backed up.


But of course... setting you up to do landscaping right as the hottest time of the year rolls around! Classic.

@SodFace - I was looking for these pics of one of our church youth leaders, it's a plastic composite (SPC) but I was pleasantly surprised by how classy it turned out. Funny part is, it was lai8 over the existing glue-down engineered floor since it's only about 1/8" thick! Aint nobody got time for scraping off glue-down. 
If you don't have existing moisture issues I wonder if this isn't good enough to lay down directly on the slab (?).


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## SodFace

corneliani said:


> @SodFace - I was looking for these pics of one of our church youth leaders, it's a plastic composite (SPC) but I was pleasantly surprised by how classy it turned out. Funny part is, it was lai8 over the existing glue-down engineered floor since it's only about 1/8" thick! Aint nobody got time for scraping off glue-down.
> If you don't have existing moisture issues I wonder if this isn't good enough to lay down directly on the slab (?).


That looks pretty good.

The builder would have put the underpadding and carpet right on the slab.

I decided dricore to make the floor a lot warmer and hedge against moisture issues. We actually had all insulation ripped out, mold removed, and spray foamed prior to this basement project starting. So I guess you can say we HAD moisture issues but that's dealt with now.


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## Lawndress

I have kids. I'm a vinyl plank convert.


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## Bigdrumnc

Lvp and have a very nice dehumidifier in the crawl space. We love our lvp with kids and two dogs. If you live in a humid part of the country you really need to look into a dehumidifier if you go the wood or lvp(t) route.


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## Thick n Dense

Being in the mitten, I visited this factory before purchasing. Their unique thing is a 3" - 4" - 5"
Pattern. 
The stuffs gorgeous ans adds a unique flair that breaks the mold a bit. Great selection of different styles and wood. 
Expensive of course. 
I went with the paradise hickory as was closest of matched to my cabinets https://www.chelseaplank.com/chateau-series

My only complaint is that my contractor basically skipped out on the floor leveling part (no correalation to the wood mfg) 
This is real and impacts over all look when done. Dont skip this step.

Fortunately, no one notices but me.

Also, if you have an older house replacing or placing new subfloor for increased strentgh is a good habbit as well.

I ultimately chose real wood so that I can refinish when the kids are gone. I know that ittl get beat the F up over the years. Idk the exact number but you get a handfull of sandings with real wood. I guess enter the disposaple razor blade anology here. The cost of install these days is almost as much as the wood.

Also real wood is more resilient to water than engineered and laminate unless otherwise stated.

I thing i have a pic of it before funiture was moved in...

Also shop around when bidding, in my area, these guys are so busy that theyre booked for months and what they do is give you a quote for a ridiculous amount know that they dont need the work but if you agree theyll cancel their other job and make 2-4k more on you.


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## tdcarl

We just finished turning the previous owner's office into our nursery and floated engineered hardwood over the old wooden floor (was covered by dirty old carpet when we bought the house). We were hopeful to be able to refinish the existing flooring as the room across the hall has nice natural wood, but holes from the pipes of the old radiant heating system and a big patched spot (we're thinking they moved the cold air return at some point?) made just laying new floor the better option. Overall we're really happy with how it turned out and how easily it was to put down. Now we're just hoping that durability is as good as promised.


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## Bmossin

Deke said:


> My 2cents. Coming from a carpet cleaning / restoration background. I would guess I have seen, touched, installed, and removed more flooring than 99.9% of people on the planet.
> 
> 1. Real wood flooring. Preferably a hardwood. Tough to beat real hardwood. Only downfalls are cost and it's a pain to dry if it gets wet. If it does it usually takes specialized equipment to get it dry, most likely will have cupping for up to 6 months while floor re normalizes it's moisture content. And then will most likely need to be refinished.


@Deke Do you have any tips on getting wet hardwood dried out on a slab. About 3 weeks ago we had an overflow, and while I thought I got all the water up and fans drying things out on the carpets, did not fair as well on about a 12ft x4ft run of wooden flooring. Now I am dealing with the cupping.

Anyway I can speed up drying and cupping to go back down, or am I looking at needing to refinish?


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## Thick n Dense

Bmossin said:


> Deke said:
> 
> 
> 
> My 2cents. Coming from a carpet cleaning / restoration background. I would guess I have seen, touched, installed, and removed more flooring than 99.9% of people on the planet.
> 
> 1. Real wood flooring. Preferably a hardwood. Tough to beat real hardwood. Only downfalls are cost and it's a pain to dry if it gets wet. If it does it usually takes specialized equipment to get it dry, most likely will have cupping for up to 6 months while floor re normalizes it's moisture content. And then will most likely need to be refinished.
> 
> 
> 
> @Deke Do you have any tips on getting wet hardwood dried out on a slab. About 3 weeks ago we had an overflow, and while I thought I got all the water up and fans drying things out on the carpets, did not fair as well on about a 12ft x4ft run of wooden flooring. Now I am dealing with the cupping.
> 
> Anyway I can speed up drying and cupping to go back down, or am I looking at needing to refinish?
Click to expand...

I'm not a pro, but I don't think that cupping will reverse with drying, it's like a permanent defect.

Now that I'm thinking about it, it's kind of a sham that wood isn't completely sealed to prevent this from happening... I can't think of a reason why major mfg's don't do this except that it keeps their business going.


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## Deke

Thick n Dense said:


> Bmossin said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Deke said:
> 
> 
> 
> My 2cents. Coming from a carpet cleaning / restoration background. I would guess I have seen, touched, installed, and removed more flooring than 99.9% of people on the planet.
> 
> 1. Real wood flooring. Preferably a hardwood. Tough to beat real hardwood. Only downfalls are cost and it's a pain to dry if it gets wet. If it does it usually takes specialized equipment to get it dry, most likely will have cupping for up to 6 months while floor re normalizes it's moisture content. And then will most likely need to be refinished.
> 
> 
> 
> @Deke Do you have any tips on getting wet hardwood dried out on a slab. About 3 weeks ago we had an overflow, and while I thought I got all the water up and fans drying things out on the carpets, did not fair as well on about a 12ft x4ft run of wooden flooring. Now I am dealing with the cupping.
> 
> Anyway I can speed up drying and cupping to go back down, or am I looking at needing to refinish?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I'm not a pro, but I don't think that cupping will reverse with drying, it's like a permanent defect.
> 
> Now that I'm thinking about it, it's kind of a sham that wood isn't completely sealed to prevent this from happening... I can't think of a reason why major mfg's don't do this except that it keeps their business going.
Click to expand...

Cupping or swelling will reverse with drying. If you think about your floor as a bunch of single boards with the tops being sealed and the edges natural. The water can more easily enter the edges which then swell. Causing the cupped look. To combat this most people/companies will sand and refinish the floor, and it will look good again…. Until the moisture level normalizes throughout the plank. Then you get crowning, which is just inverse cupping. The proper way to handle a hardwood floor is to have specialized mats that are made for drying out hardwood. Or you can rent / buy a good dehumidifier and tent off the area of the floor that is damaged woth the dehumidifier inside the tent. And then you need to be checking moisture levels on the floor. A pinless meter works well for this application, and can be bought at Lowe's for under $50. Check an area that was far away from damaged spot but still on same subfloor to figure out your goal for the damaged area. Once you are down to that number across the damaged area, pull the tent and check out the floor. If it looks good that's great, it still may need to be refinished, but will not crown after it is done.


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## Thick n Dense

I think I have my definition if cupping wrong so I wont further commment but I have a couple ideas on moisute management.

Lets say you had a diastrous event with water, you could drill a hole in the subfloor from the basement and break the layment and let it drain.

Another potential trick is to use moisture absorbing products. Things like rice corn meal etc. im sure there are commercial products designed for this specifically. 
After this period this things can easily be vacummed up.

This works wonders for spilt oil.

Another trick is to place dry things into the area and seal it off. 
Just like osmosis in water, the same thing happens in air. The water wants to come into equilibrium with its surrondings. 
Something as simple as placing dry towels on the wet spots and sealing it off. Its the same principle in a way as throwing dry towels in the dryer with a wet load. The towel absorbed the moisture and helps the clothes dry faster and more evenly,

Lastly, the most out there theory that would need testing is to UV light that mimicks the sun. 
In the oceans and sea's, lots of h2o gets turned into water vapor without reaching its boiliing point. The right light could help facilitate this evaportion process. This will be hard to find out which light range to use if an according one is made but wanted to point this out cause its a bit fascinating.

And i guess lastly, air flow, fans. You could seal off and use a shop vac for much flow.


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## Deke

Thick n Dense said:


> I think I have my definition if cupping wrong so I wont further commment but I have a couple ideas on moisute management.
> 
> Lets say you had a diastrous event with water, you could drill a hole in the subfloor from the basement and break the layment and let it drain.
> 
> Another potential trick is to use moisture absorbing products. Things like rice corn meal etc. im sure there are commercial products designed for this specifically.
> After this period this things can easily be vacummed up.
> 
> This works wonders for spilt oil.
> 
> Another trick is to place dry things into the area and seal it off.
> Just like osmosis in water, the same thing happens in air. The water wants to come into equilibrium with its surrondings.
> Something as simple as placing dry towels on the wet spots and sealing it off. Its the same principle in a way as throwing dry towels in the dryer with a wet load. The towel absorbed the moisture and helps the clothes dry faster and more evenly,
> 
> Lastly, the most out there theory that would need testing is to UV light that mimicks the sun.
> In the oceans and sea's, lots of h2o gets turned into water vapor without reaching its boiliing point. The right light could help facilitate this evaportion process. This will be hard to find out which light range to use if an according one is made but wanted to point this out cause its a bit fascinating.
> 
> And i guess lastly, air flow, fans. You could seal off and use a shop vac for much flow.


Don't do any of that. I have been doing water damages since I was 15 years old. I have been to dozens of schools for everything involved in the process. Fire, water, mold, structural, advanced structural….. air movement with dehumidifiers. No tricks, no short cuts.


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## Thick n Dense

Deke said:


> Thick n Dense said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think I have my definition if cupping wrong so I wont further commment but I have a couple ideas on moisute management.
> 
> Lets say you had a diastrous event with water, you could drill a hole in the subfloor from the basement and break the layment and let it drain.
> 
> Another potential trick is to use moisture absorbing products. Things like rice corn meal etc. im sure there are commercial products designed for this specifically.
> After this period this things can easily be vacummed up.
> 
> This works wonders for spilt oil.
> 
> Another trick is to place dry things into the area and seal it off.
> Just like osmosis in water, the same thing happens in air. The water wants to come into equilibrium with its surrondings.
> Something as simple as placing dry towels on the wet spots and sealing it off. Its the same principle in a way as throwing dry towels in the dryer with a wet load. The towel absorbed the moisture and helps the clothes dry faster and more evenly,
> 
> Lastly, the most out there theory that would need testing is to UV light that mimicks the sun.
> In the oceans and sea's, lots of h2o gets turned into water vapor without reaching its boiliing point. The right light could help facilitate this evaportion process. This will be hard to find out which light range to use if an according one is made but wanted to point this out cause its a bit fascinating.
> 
> And i guess lastly, air flow, fans. You could seal off and use a shop vac for much flow.
> 
> 
> 
> Don't do any of that. I have been doing water damages since I was 15 years old. I have been to dozens of schools for everything involved in the process. Fire, water, mold, structural, advanced structural….. air movement with dehumidifiers. No tricks, no short cuts.
Click to expand...

I wouldnt argue against the tried in true methods. I was think of more of a spot problem then a washer leaking all over the floor.

The concepts with a fan and dehumidifier are the same as I listed. 
Dehumidifiers dry the air by removing water vapor so that the water from the wood is more likely to fill that space in the air. Just like a cup of h20 will evaportate faster on a dry day. Than a wet one.

Fans work like a stirrer in a glass beaker to speed up the reaction. Picking up that water vapor and moving to a differenr area so that dryer air can come in and absorb more h2o.

This is why the rice cell phone trick works to remove water.

Im not a pro, just wanted youll to think about water transfer in a different way.


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## Deke

Thick n Dense said:


> Deke said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thick n Dense said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think I have my definition if cupping wrong so I wont further commment but I have a couple ideas on moisute management.
> 
> Lets say you had a diastrous event with water, you could drill a hole in the subfloor from the basement and break the layment and let it drain.
> 
> Another potential trick is to use moisture absorbing products. Things like rice corn meal etc. im sure there are commercial products designed for this specifically.
> After this period this things can easily be vacummed up.
> 
> This works wonders for spilt oil.
> 
> Another trick is to place dry things into the area and seal it off.
> Just like osmosis in water, the same thing happens in air. The water wants to come into equilibrium with its surrondings.
> Something as simple as placing dry towels on the wet spots and sealing it off. Its the same principle in a way as throwing dry towels in the dryer with a wet load. The towel absorbed the moisture and helps the clothes dry faster and more evenly,
> 
> Lastly, the most out there theory that would need testing is to UV light that mimicks the sun.
> In the oceans and sea's, lots of h2o gets turned into water vapor without reaching its boiliing point. The right light could help facilitate this evaportion process. This will be hard to find out which light range to use if an according one is made but wanted to point this out cause its a bit fascinating.
> 
> And i guess lastly, air flow, fans. You could seal off and use a shop vac for much flow.
> 
> 
> 
> Don't do any of that. I have been doing water damages since I was 15 years old. I have been to dozens of schools for everything involved in the process. Fire, water, mold, structural, advanced structural….. air movement with dehumidifiers. No tricks, no short cuts.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I wouldnt argue against the tried in true methods. I was think of more of a spot problem then a washer leaking all over the floor.
> 
> The concepts with a fan and dehumidifier are the same as I listed.
> Dehumidifiers dry the air by removing water vapor so that the water from the wood is more likely to fill that space in the air. Just like a cup of h20 will evaportate faster on a dry day. Than a wet one.
> 
> Fans work like a stirrer in a glass beaker to speed up the reaction. Picking up that water vapor and moving to a differenr area so that dryer air can come in and absorb more h2o.
> 
> This is why the rice cell phone trick works to remove water.
> 
> Im not a pro, just wanted youll to think about water transfer in a different way.
Click to expand...

If you don't mind me asking, what do you do for a living? You can be as generalized as you want, I'm not looking for anything too specific.


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## jayhawk

@corneliani I appreciate the 3/4 foam and 3/4 board on top the slab. You recall the foam brand/type? Did you see what Risinger did ?

Got a 9' basement in progress - LVP alone ...has to be awfully hard, cold and suboptimal for sound resonance.


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## corneliani

jayhawk said:


> @corneliani I appreciate the 3/4 foam and 3/4 board on top the slab. You recall the foam brand/type? Did you see what Risinger did ?
> 
> Got a 9' basement in progress - LVP alone ...has to be awfully hard, cold and suboptimal for sound resonance.


Awesome video! Just watched it. I've never seen so many concrete guys on one project before!!! Not to mention his construction details... Risinger is crazy. 😝

I had a similar thought when I did my house, but only because I wanted to embed pex water lines throughout the slab (for a radiant heated floor). It would've required an insulation barrier under the slab so that the heat doesn't travel down & into the soil. Leave it to Risinger to pull this off the way only he can!

I ended up building the radiant subfloor on the master bathroom only & used regular XPS sheathing panels (Owens-Corning?) throughout the main level, mainly to act as a thermal bridge between the finished floor & the slab. I took care with sealing off the perimeter but his termite detail work make me think I didn't do enough. 😬. There's no way to know if they find a way in there!! Argh.

What your plan for that space you're working in?


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## jayhawk

@corneliani I think your talking about his latest ....massive amount of concrete and the overthetop terminate strategy. Sorry, I was thinking about his personal house (5mo ago?) Where he laid foam and then 2 layers of 3/4 advantech.

I am close to done finishing drywall stage, a basement area (basically the kitchen and great room space) using theater techniques. Audiophile equipment and keep noise above, out. Floor is next, I refuse to use shoe mold.

My plan is some LVP .... conditioned via mini split 
I did one separate room with tile ...see how long that lasts before one breaks (I didn't know to have them decouple with that orange mat....schluter?)

If there was no budget ....dricore underlayment. Balancing ideal vs practical, not 'final' home ... However I need to price a foam and board material for the sq ft. How do you get airflow in the event of water is an open question/concern


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## Deke

jayhawk said:


> @corneliani I think your talking about his latest ....massive amount of concrete and the overthetop terminate strategy. Sorry, I was thinking about his personal house (5mo ago?) Where he laid foam and then 2 layers of 3/4 advantech.
> 
> I am close to done finishing drywall stage, a basement area (basically the kitchen and great room space) using theater techniques. Audiophile equipment and keep noise above, out. Floor is next, I refuse to use shoe mold.
> 
> My plan is some LVP .... conditioned via mini split
> I did one separate room with tile ...see how long that lasts before one breaks (I didn't know to have them decouple with that orange mat....schluter?)
> 
> If there was no budget ....dricore underlayment. Balancing ideal vs practical, not 'final' home ... However I need to price a foam and board material for the sq ft. How do you get airflow in the event of water is an open question/concern


You pull one side of the rooms trim, get a wedge under that side of the floor and force air in through 1/4 inch hoses. Either directly from the exhaust of a dehumidifier, or from an injecti-dry. It is actually quite easy once you have done it a time or two.


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## corneliani

How am I missing all these cool video??!! Just checked that one out & I may need to reach out & let him know I beat him to this concept &#128541;.

I didn't think about the benefit of a slight give that the foam gives but he has a good point there.

Btw yiur shoe mold comment had me rolling!! I don't understand using quarter-round in those instances.. that's almost 1" wide!


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## Ware

Just a quick follow-up… we're still really happy with our decision to go with wood look tile. It suits our young family and rural location well. The Roomba is great too. :thumbup:


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## Herrysmith

If you are looking for a quality flooring option for your home, then consider adding wood flooring to your living space. With a variety of colors and styles, spc flooring offers an attractive and timeless alternative to more common options.
A new type of flooring that is made from recycled materials and rubber from old car tires. It is available in a variety of colors and patterns that can be made to look like wood, tile, stone, or even a grass mat.


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## DarylEustoquio

A couple of years ago, my wife and I moved into a new house and were very happy about it. We began to make repairs slowly and reached the floors. We thought for a long time and argued about which coating was better to choose. But in the end, we settled on wood and a wooden floor. I decided to lay the foundation myself; I read a lot on the Internet about how to do it correctly. I was lucky and found the site 20 Cheap DIY Flooring Ideas You Need To Know About. With the help of this site, I managed to do everything right and neatly. A wooden floor looks just gorgeous in the interior.


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## berisiw

Deke said:


> Cupping or swelling will reverse with drying. If you think about your floor as a bunch of single boards with the tops being sealed and the edges natural. The water can more easily enter the edges which then swell. Causing the cupped look. To combat this most people/companies will sand and refinish the floor, and it will look good again…. Until the moisture level normalizes throughout the plank. Then you get crowning, which is just inverse cupping. The proper way to handle a hardwood floor is to have specialized mats that are made for drying out hardwood. Or you can rent / buy a good dehumidifier and tent off the area of the floor that is damaged woth the dehumidifier inside the tent. And then you need to be checking moisture levels on the floor. A pinless meter works well for this application, and can be bought at Lowe's for under $50. Check an area that was far away from damaged spot but still on same subfloor to figure out your goal for the damaged area. Once you are down to that number across the damaged area, pull the tent and check out luxury vinyl plank flooring atlanta. If it looks good that's great, it still may need to be refinished, but will not crown after it is done.


Hey, Finished my floating subfloor and added some kill mildew/mold primer on top. Great stuff around the edges epoxy flake flooring tampa. I’m curious if there’s any benefit to putting vinyl plank flooring down before adding furniture and counters in a build rather than adding to the visible floor areas afterward. Thanks!


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