# Scalping Zorro (or Zeon)?



## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

I've read a few threads discussing the benefits of scalping (usually specific to Bermuda) but have also seen a couple of warnings about Zorro/Zeon's recovery when scalped.

@Greendoc 
@bladerunnerfarms

Is there a consensus on the risks/benefits of scalping Zorro beyond the general early spring application?

I currently maintain it at .5" but would like to take it down to the dirt (for thatch removal and further leveling preparation) when advisable. Thanks in advance for any advice.


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## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

My thoughts would be to rent a power rake to dethatch and open up the canopy. This will help you to get the leveling done and reset the cut height slightly without doing a full scalp.


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## jonthepain (May 5, 2018)

I'm surprised that you would even have thatch when maintained at a half inch


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## gatormac2112 (Sep 14, 2017)

The way my Zorro is growing right now I'm not sure it couldn't recover quickly from a scalping. I'm havin trouble keeping up with it. It spreads slowly, but vertical growth? Very Bermuda-esque.


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## jayhawk (Apr 18, 2017)

If it was me, drop a little but not shock it by removing all the green blades.

No grommer on your greens mower? As spammage notes, a vertical type will open it up for the benfits mentioned and be less stress. Flail blade ok, fixed blade best (I used a bluebird with the slicer blade used for seeding prep?)


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

gatormac2112 said:


> The way my Zorro is growing right now I'm not sure it couldn't recover quickly from a scalping. I'm havin trouble keeping up with it. It spreads slowly, but vertical growth? Very Bermuda-esque.


My sod grower told me to cut off the N and feed only micronutrients as needed for green color. He also told me to restrict the water once the sod has completely established in the area. This is for Zeon, which is a Me Too of Zorro.


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

As a Zeon owner I can confirm it absolutely hates scalping.


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

SCGrassMan said:


> As a Zeon owner I can confirm it absolutely hates scalping.


What do you predict will happen if I cut 50% off in the July heat, with ample watering?


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

monkeygrass said:


> SCGrassMan said:
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> > As a Zeon owner I can confirm it absolutely hates scalping.
> ...


Let me see a pic of how it looks now


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

SCGrassMan said:


> monkeygrass said:
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> > SCGrassMan said:
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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

monkeygrass said:


> SCGrassMan said:
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> > monkeygrass said:
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Honestly it doesn't look like it "needs" scalping to me, if you want to go lower, I would just start cutting lower. Ask Greendoc though he's a lot smarter than me


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## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

@monkeygrass I think you would be okay to scalp, I just don't think it's necessary. An aggressive dethatching/verticutting in two directions (2nd pass 90° to the 1st pass) should accomplish what you are looking for with less stress to the grass. However, I would probably wait until the Phoenix like temps pass in a week or so.


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

Thank you for the opinions, @Spammage & @SCGrassMan!

I have a new mower coming that may max out at a .297" HOC. If that is the case, I might have some interesting photos to share in the near future. This past photo is a week old and I was experimenting with lower water rates, thus it looks a little on the yellow-side already.


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

I have heard of keeping upright growing Matrella types(Zeon) at tournament fairway heights in Southeast Asia. Required mowing 3 times a week. Water and fertilizer is also extremely limited. It is contradictory to water and fertilize such that the grass is super green, yet it must stay low. At least that is the case for Zeon and Zorro. Is the mower in your signature your new low cut mower? @monkeygrass


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

It should be my new mower by tomorrow, unless I jinxed myself by claiming ownership a day early... Toro specs say .297" max HOC without a kit, but the distributor is saying it is able to handle .5" max HOC without a kit. Had a new 8-balde reel put on it. @Greendoc


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

1/2" is do able with restricted water and fertilizer. Zorro and Zeon are some hard grasses for mowers to even cut. I hope the electric motor can deal with it.


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

Greendoc said:


> 1/2" is do able with restricted water and fertilizer. Zorro and Zeon are some hard grasses for mowers to even cut. I hope the electric motor can deal with it.


I'll let you know how that first cut goes!

Any thoughts on Trinity (a.k.a. L1F) versus Zeon/Zorro?

@bladerunnerfarms


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## gatormac2112 (Sep 14, 2017)

Greendoc said:


> 1/2" is do able with restricted water and fertilizer. Zorro and Zeon are some hard grasses for mowers to even cut. I hope the electric motor can deal with it.


Yep. I wish I would have known that before getting Zorro, it grows fast and is tough to cut.


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

monkeygrass said:


> Greendoc said:
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> > 1/2" is do able with restricted water and fertilizer. Zorro and Zeon are some hard grasses for mowers to even cut. I hope the electric motor can deal with it.
> ...


Trinity is a dwarf variant of Matrella. I have seen it at my friend's sod farm. Would not imagine it being any easier to mow. What my friend told me is that it is better suited to Fairway and Tee use than Zeon and Zorro. Those just grow too fast and do not like being mowed lower than 0.5. Tournament quality warm season Fairways are below 0.5.

Electric motors are what stops me from getting something like a JD hybrid. I can just imagine the motor smoking when I put the mower on El Toro or Zeon that has gotten a little overgrown. My GM just slows down and if I am trying to take too big a bite, it will stall. That stall is what will smoke an electric motor unless there are safeties that shut everything down if current draw is exceeded.


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

Greendoc said:


> monkeygrass said:
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It appears there are several motor-related faults that will intitate an automatic shutdown on the Greensmaster eFlex.


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## Ral1121 (Mar 19, 2018)

@monkeygrass

are you going to post some pics and do a review on that eflex 21 when you get it? Maybe a video review?


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## nt5000 (Jun 13, 2018)

Greendoc said:


> Electric motors are what stops me from getting something like a JD hybrid. I can just imagine the motor smoking when I put the mower on El Toro or Zeon that has gotten a little overgrown. My GM just slows down and if I am trying to take too big a bite, it will stall. That stall is what will smoke an electric motor unless there are safeties that shut everything down if current draw is exceeded.


 :bandit: Smoked, lol.

Check out this electric mower!
"The Electra was powered by an electric motor fed from mains electricity." :shock:


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

I have used one of those. Plugs into 220 v. Cannot handle thick or overgrown grass. Also cannot be used to mow Zoysia.


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

Greendoc said:


> I have used one of those. Plugs into 220 v. Cannot handle thick or overgrown grass. Also cannot be used to mow Zoysia.


Had zero issues cutting the overgrown Zorro(and the nutsedge) at .3" with the eFlex.


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

How high did it grow before you mowed?


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

Ral1121 said:


> @monkeygrass
> 
> are you going to post some pics and do a review on that eflex 21 when you get it? Maybe a video review?


I think the Toro sales sheet says that the eFlex is every bit the performer of the gas-powered Flex. My first experience with it seems to confirm that. No issues powering through the Zorro zoysia. The relative lack of noise is what currently stands out to me the most. It is an eerie combination of weight (heavy) and sound.

I'm not sure I have a video in me but here are a few photos.


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

Greendoc said:


> How high did it grow before you mowed?


The tallest area appeared to be in the .75" to 1" range. It was being kept at .5" with the Mascot push mower until about a week ago.


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

That is not overgrown. I have had to deal with Zeon that grew to 2-3". not fun.


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## monkeygrass (Jul 30, 2017)

Greendoc said:


> That is not overgrown. I have had to deal with Zeon that grew to 2-3". not fun.


I deal with similar heights next door. It gets the Honda rotary once a week...


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## jayhawk (Apr 18, 2017)

Mows 5 days a week but daayamm

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/980200588947476487


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## scarlso2 (May 8, 2017)

Eric Bauer's a great follow! Very inspirational pics of their Zeon/L1f. Another good follow is Tim Huber. He's the superintendent at the Fazio course 10 miles from bluejack. They have Zeon fairways and they look amazing.

I live down the road from these courses and have chatted with a few maintenance guys. They made it sound like Zeon enjoys more frequent, less aggressive grooming/vertical cutting to keep the thatch in-check.


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