# Sand for topdressing ponding areas?



## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Been starting to look at sand for this purpose. I noticed @GrassDaddy used play sand, and @Delmarva Keith recommeded mason sand.

Is this type of stuff ok?
https://www.lowes.com/pd/QUIKRETE-50-lb-Dry-Mason-Sand/3594850

I'm a bit scared of getting sand that turns to rock like concrete when wet! Please help me understand the difference and how to tell.


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## N LA Hacker (Aug 17, 2018)

That's just mason sand bagged up. If you don't have a lot of area to work it's fine. If you are working the entire 15k of lawn that you have, it would warrant at least a dump truck load and you'll spend way less on 10-15 yds delivered than trying to do those bags over the entire lawn.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

N LA Hacker said:


> That's just mason sand bagged up. If you don't have a lot of area to work it's fine. If you are working the entire 15k of lawn that you have, it would warrant at least a dump truck load and you'll spend way less on 10-15 yds delivered than trying to do those bags over the entire lawn.


Yeah, it's a small area, so I don't need a lot. But help me understand mason sand versus the sand used in Portland Cement.


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## N LA Hacker (Aug 17, 2018)

That sand should not have cement in it to make it concrete. All concrete is a mix of sand, aggregate and cement. If that is just the sand for mortar mix, it will not have any cement in it. Unless you add cement down the road, the sand will never turn to concrete. Clear as mud?


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

N LA Hacker said:


> Clear as mud?


Lol. So as long as there's no cement in a bag of sand, it won't cure...that's what I'm getting out of this. But I thought cement was also a type of sand...

Is mason better than play sand in people's opinions?


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## Shindoman (Apr 22, 2018)

Play sand is typically sterilized to keep things from growing in it in a sandbox. You want things to grow in your sand so 
just get masons sand.


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## Suburban Jungle Life (Mar 1, 2018)

Green said:


> N LA Hacker said:
> 
> 
> > Clear as mud?
> ...







Cement must be heated to be created. Without heating it, there is no cement.


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## Delmarva Keith (May 12, 2018)

Green said:


> N LA Hacker said:
> 
> 
> > That's just mason sand bagged up. If you don't have a lot of area to work it's fine. If you are working the entire 15k of lawn that you have, it would warrant at least a dump truck load and you'll spend way less on 10-15 yds delivered than trying to do those bags over the entire lawn.
> ...


Generally, depending on location and local custom, concrete sand has more coarse grains than mason sand. In some places they are the same. If I remember right, the ASTM specification is "C3" sand. The best sand for a not crazy price is fairway sand but it's not available just everywhere. What you want is a sharp sand with a mixture of grain sizes that drains in a reasonable period of time (but not too fast). Play sand is too fine and doesn't drain well.

Mason sand is readily available and fits the bill. I used to mix peat moss into it before spreading using a concrete mixer but I've found that just spreading some peat moss over top of it after it's down and leveled does just as well. I've seen plenty of youtube vids from guys using just sand, no peat, but their climates are different from mine. I want a little bit of OM in my sand.

Portland cement is just cement - no sand or aggregates. There is no sand in portland cement. Concrete is a mix of cement, sand and gravel. Mortar is a mix of cement and sand. Mason sand is just sand - won't harden.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Good advice, everyone.

@Delmarva Keith, if I have more questions, I'll follow up.


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## Delmarva Keith (May 12, 2018)

For some (hopefully) reassurance, the pictured area was always swampy with standing water after every rain. As of early Sept, there were several inches of standing water. On Sept 10 or thereabouts, two yards of mason sand were spread on the area right over inches of rain water. Peat was hand tossed over top of that. Subsequent rains washed in and washed away alot of the peat.

On Sept 30, area was seeded and rolled. Ten days later, germination has started. It's actually better than it looks in the photo. Some of the new seedling blades are still too fine to show up in the photo.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

@Delmarva Keith, that's the type of area I'm dealing with. I plan to use the sand on the very worst areas using bagged sand; it's too much area to do more, and I would need a yard or two for the whole area like you did. Not making a big project out of it at this time. Hoping to do it this month once it dries from the current rain and I get some sand. In the Spring, I'll plant plugs in the area.

How far did the 2 yards go?


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## Delmarva Keith (May 12, 2018)

Green said:


> Delmarva Keith, that's the type of area I'm dealing with. I plan to use the sand on the very worst areas using bagged sand; it's too much area to do more, and I would need a yard or two for the whole area like you did. Not making a big project out of it at this time. Hoping to do it this month once it dries from the current rain and I get some sand. In the Spring, I'll plant plugs in the area.
> 
> How far did the 2 yards go?


I'd estimate I covered about 500 sq ft total with the 2 yds and sprinkled 3 bales of peat over top of it. Yes, it's a lot of work doing it alone and large areas require a lot of sand. If I remember my calculations of long ago correctly, a yard will cover 1,000 sq ft with 1/3". If you need an inch or two of sand over a larger area, it's a lot of sand.


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## GrassDaddy (Mar 21, 2017)

Shindoman said:


> Play sand is typically sterilized to keep things from growing in it in a sandbox. You want things to grow in your sand so
> just get masons sand.


Well - the sand is cleaned for play sand, but it's not treated with a pre-emergent or something that would affect grass. That being said, it would be cheaper with masons sand because it hasn't gone through the triple wash process.


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