# Fall seeding



## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

I am in NJ and am thinking of reseeding. Can someone help me understand what compounds I need to first add to the lawn and then what kind of lawn seeds I need to get as well as what the right time for seeing is?


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## M32075 (May 9, 2019)

No compounds are need . Just cut short ,de thatch cut again to pick up thatch, put down seed I recommend tall fescue and throw around some peat moss and keep it moist for a couple of weeks


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## BadgersFanFan (Aug 24, 2021)

When you say "reseeding," do you mean overseeding or a complete renovation?

Here are a couple of resources:

Cool Season Overseed Guide

Renovation guide


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## jha4aamu (Oct 16, 2017)

abdulazeez77 said:


> I am in NJ and am thinking of reseeding. Can someone help me understand what compounds I need to first add to the lawn and then what kind of lawn seeds I need to get as well as what the right time for seeing is?


The only way to say accurately what your lawn "needs" is getting a soil test.

Your grass seed will germinate fine with time and water. Id get your seed down asap if i were you. You may be a little late in nj to try and seed kbg though. Prg or tttf are probably better options


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

BadgersFanFan said:


> When you say "reseeding," do you mean overseeding or a complete renovation?
> 
> Here are a couple of resources:
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> ...


Overseeding.


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

jha4aamu said:


> abdulazeez77 said:
> 
> 
> > I am in NJ and am thinking of reseeding. Can someone help me understand what compounds I need to first add to the lawn and then what kind of lawn seeds I need to get as well as what the right time for seeing is?
> ...


Too late? Fall is just starting.


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## NELawn (May 7, 2019)

Its late considering a number of factors......

1.) What kind fo seed is the OP using?

Perennial Rye (PR) comes up in 7-14 days, while KBG takes 21-30 days and goes through another 20-30 days of sprout and pout before it even gets growing. PR doesn't go through sprout and pout. I'd plant PR right now, but I would never do KBG past mid August.

2.) Most people want to get some fertilizer down on their new lawn late fall, but ideally you should wait about 30 days past germination. So if your germination is finishing now, you should not really fertilize it until October 14th. Thats last a lot of time past most areas avg. first frost and you should fertilize after your avg. first frost.

3.) Your also looking at prime poa-a season. So watering multiple times a day right now is sure to bring a lot of poa-a along for the ride with your grass seed. You can put down tenacity with the seed, but the poa-a has already started germinating, its probably too late.

4.) lastly you have the tree leaf issue. Depending on where you live. leaves start to fall from october 1st and onward. Its tough to baby a new lawn while piles of leaves might be falling on them.

Spring seeding is not impossible, and sometimes preferable to fall seeding. It just has its own pitfalls and depends on what conditions and nuisance weeds your dealing with.


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## M32075 (May 9, 2019)

In NJ there's still time for a tall fescue or perennial ryegrass over seed. I recommend a tall fescue especially if you don't have a built in irrigation system. If you decide to do it definitely try to accomplish by next weekend


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

NELawn said:


> Its late considering a number of factors......
> 
> 1.) What kind fo seed is the OP using?
> 
> ...


For the last two years I have been trying to plant and what I am told is to do it in the fall. When I come here to ask I am told it's too late even though summer just ended and fall is just starting. So which way do I go? Do I need to wait until sprint?


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

M32075 said:


> In NJ there's still time for a tall fescue or perennial ryegrass over seed. I recommend a tall fescue especially if you don't have a built in irrigation system. If you decide to do it definitely try to accomplish by next weekend


I have a built in irrigation system. What are the other things I will have to put either before seeding or after and between the two varieties above is one preferable than the other? Where do I get them?


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## M32075 (May 9, 2019)

abdulazeez77 said:


> M32075 said:
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> 
> > In NJ there's still time for a tall fescue or perennial ryegrass over seed. I recommend a tall fescue especially if you don't have a built in irrigation system. If you decide to do it definitely try to accomplish by next weekend
> ...


I prefer a tall fescue blend I like from United seed you can buy on line there Super turf 1 LS a nice blend that should flourish in NJ. Do your over seed then put down some fall fertilizer after a couple of cuts you can buy at any big box store. Keep it simple


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## BigBlue (Aug 27, 2021)

abdulazeez77 said:


> NELawn said:
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> > Its late considering a number of factors......
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With the most respect, I remind you that you came here for advice and these folks are outstanding resources and they are clearly laying out not only their advice, but also the reasoning behind their advice, in great detail.

I don't know where you were receiving your advice previously, but now that you've arrived here I can very emphatically attest this forum provides outstanding and trustworthy advice. Check out the fall overseeding resource that was linked above for step by step plans you can follow.

To recap the advice given, if you choose TTTF (Turf Type Tall Fescue) or PRG (Perennial Rye Grass) and get it down in the next week or so you should have some successful germination if you keep it moist. Cut the grass low, dethatch if you can, seed, keep moist but not too wet. That should get you some success but as was noted, frost, leaves, future fertilization, fall weed germination must all be considered and you may not have enough time to get the optimum results because yes you've started a little later than would be optimum.

Read the guides, ask any questions of these fine folks and you'll be on your way to an improved lawn. Best of luck from a fellow New Jerseyan.


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

BigBlue said:


> abdulazeez77 said:
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Deleted.


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

BigBlue said:


> abdulazeez77 said:
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Thank you. The general advise I was given is to plant in fall. The fall is just starting in NJ. If I had done the seeding earlier if would have been summer. I am trying to understand based on what has been said here that whether I should be planting in summer then given all the timing needed for the growth, considerations of frost etc.? If I miss the window now what is the best best time and when should I start?


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## CTEngineer (Aug 13, 2021)

In my opinion it is not too late to overseed your lawn in NJ but I would get it done as soon as you can. Last year I renovated my 5,000 SF backyard in CT and after underestimating the amount of time it would take me I didn't have seed down until the 3rd week of September and thanks to some fortunate weather everything turned out great. I think getting seed down in mid-late August is probably ideal for a renovation because it allows for more time to reseed some thin spots or washouts but if you are just overseeding to thicken it up or bring in some new cultivars that timeline is less important since you don't run that risk.


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## Old Hickory (Aug 19, 2019)

If you had overseeded back in August you might be overseeding again this month (due to Ida). It's not too late but get on it. Good luck.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

Seeding in Fall is misleading. People think cold weather and leaves on the ground as the best time to seed.

Instead, think of late Summer as the best time to seed. If doing a complete renovation, you would ideally want the seed down sometime in August. For an overseed, in your area, late August to first week of September (approx.)is likely a safe choice.

If you plant perennial ryegrass or Turf Type Tall Fescue, you have a chance to be successful. But I would do it ASAP.

There are so many variable involved with growing grass. I don't know what it's like in NJ but in Southern Ontario, we had very hot temps in the high 80s until 2 weeks ago and then the weather dropped to low 70s with nights and early mornings in the 50s. It went from one extreme to the other almost overnight.

Even though it may be hot in August, with irrigation you can keep the seed cool and moist; and the weather is still somewhat predictable. While waiting too long into September means you might deal with cooler temps, falling leaves that cover the seed and the chance for an early frost.

The general rule is to get your seed down a minimum of 45 days before your average first frost date. This give the grass enough time to grow and establish before Winter.

Seeding earlier also gives you time to correct any issues that absolutely will come up. It allows to you put more seed down in thin areas after a few weeks of germination and also allows the potential to get a Fall pre-emergent application down. Waiting too late doesn't leave much, if any, room for error.

Read the overseed guide along with the cool season guide linked above. This forum is without a doubt the best resource you can turn to.


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

Thank you folks. So looks like I will postpone seeding to next year so that I can work in all these timeframes. Now that that is off should I try again by spring or wait until next August? For now is there any mineral or chemical I should add?


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## Fraust (Apr 4, 2021)

Can you post a picture or two of what your lawn currently looks like?


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## jha4aamu (Oct 16, 2017)

abdulazeez77 said:


> Thank you folks. So looks like I will postpone seeding to next year so that I can work in all these timeframes. Now that that is off should I try again by spring or wait until next August? For now is there any mineral or chemical I should add?


Imo, id rather seed slightly late in the fall vs in the spring. TTTF and PRG may do just fine if you get it down asap. I just dont think kbg would work well this late

If you do plan on waiting, a soil test would be the best way to tell exactly what your lawn needs or is deficient in.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

jha4aamu said:


> abdulazeez77 said:
> 
> 
> > Thank you folks. So looks like I will postpone seeding to next year so that I can work in all these timeframes. Now that that is off should I try again by spring or wait until next August? For now is there any mineral or chemical I should add?
> ...


I agree with this. Either of these grass types and you'll be cutting in 2 weeks. There are less factors involved with an overseed.

I'd cut low before seeding and avoid any nitrogen until you've cut the new grass once.


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## jedross86 (Apr 27, 2021)

+1 on Fall > Spring. There are risks with both. Most people seem to tend to take the risks in the fall since there is more they can control. As others have stated, if you put down TTTF or PRG, with some luck, you will do just fine. Where in NJ are you? If you do move forward with seeding this fall, don't let the heat this week delay you. Get the seed down ASAP and keep it moist.


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## JP900++ (Aug 24, 2018)

Don't over think it. It is just grass. Unless you want KBG you should be fine. Worst case scenario is you're out some seed expense. You'll gain experience for doing it again next year.


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## NELawn (May 7, 2019)

Just to respond to the proper time to seed. A lot of people not in the know tell you to seed in the fall, they think it's cooler and they won't have to water as much.

This is wrong in that Fall is still pretty hot even in my neck of the woods, and you still have to water it a few times a day.

The best time to seed in the Northeast is about August 10th for KBG. It's still warm, but as the days get shorter it's starting to cool down and your going to have to water a few times a day anyway. The soil is warm and the seed germinates really fast.

So If you put seed down August 14th, your KBG will be up by Sept 14th, wait for 30 days to fertilize and sprout and pout is over, gives you about October 14th. That gives you maybe 2-3 weekly apps of fast acting fertilizer, since I usually break thirty day fertilizer rule, but won't fertilize until I get two cuts in.

If you do TTTF or PR on AUG 10th, you might even get to have enough germination to get two cuts in and get some pre-m down before the poa-a really starts to germinate. If germination didn't work out, skip the pre-m, and you get to throw some more PR down the first two weeks in Sept.

Either way you look at it, mid August gives you the best options to establish a new lawn. There is a lot of rules of thumb about lawn care that people tell you that don't work out all that well.

Take a look at core aerating lawns with huge patches of bare spots if you don't believe me.


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## Jersey_diy (Sep 5, 2020)

I live in NJ and i seeded on 9/29/2020 KBG and RPR,, it was close and I got a full lawn in time....you have plenty of time with Tall fescue...temperatures are so warm right now. Also we have had major washouts and your entire seed would have been washed out a week ago...and tonight if you live anywhere near me....getting about an inch of water in 2 1/2 hours right now.


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## SoilSecrets (Apr 12, 2019)

If you postpone seeding, then wait until late summer (i.e. late August to early September 2022) to seed in NJ. In the interim, get a soil test performed by Rutgers University Soil Science Laboratory. When you get the results, post them in the soil forum and we can assist with interpretation. Then a plan can be formulated to help you begin to get your soil right and conduct amendments if needed. This way, you can hopefully be in very good shape to seed next year. The knowledge on the forum is extensive and advice will be freely given in this community. Any knowledgeable turf enthusiast, semipro, pro on this forum will tell you how critical it is to get the soil/dirt in good shape before dropping seeds.


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## simplesimon (Aug 25, 2021)

How does the success of reseeding bare spots at 21 DAG differ in principle from seeding the whole lawn at this point in time?


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

jha4aamu said:


> abdulazeez77 said:
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> 
> > Thank you folks. So looks like I will postpone seeding to next year so that I can work in all these timeframes. Now that that is off should I try again by spring or wait until next August? For now is there any mineral or chemical I should add?
> ...


Can you point me to any recommended seed brands to buy?


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## jedross86 (Apr 27, 2021)

There is a thread on this here.


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## M32075 (May 9, 2019)

Do the over seed with TTTF this weekend your still in the time frame. It's not open heart surgery. Over think it and another season passes you by.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

simplesimon said:


> How does the success of reseeding bare spots at 21 DAG differ in principle from seeding the whole lawn at this point in time?


Less area to seed means less can go wrong and less to worry about. When seeding bare or thin spots at 21 DAG, you are fine tuning your renovation/overseed. But the majority of the hard work is completed.

Think of studying for an exam in 21 days. You'll have a better chance at doing well if you study for the first 20 days and take the final day to fine tune you knowledge. Waiting to study the entire course material the day before, typically spells disaster.


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## Dvxdarkvashxvb (Sep 7, 2021)

I'm in Midwest 6b and its too freaking hot and we are doing 90 daily temps; hell no I'm not seeding now; cool season is cool season,ideal germination is 65- 80f with how these seed vendors are listing their seed. I think for NJ you are subject towards other pressures such as early winters and rough unpredictable precipitation patterns. Just go based on what you feeling on what fall is and the exception is KBG since the germination is practically over a month

Most people shouldn't be suggesting this difficult grass type with all the demands it needs for newer lawn owners


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

Dvxdarkvashxvb said:


> I'm in Midwest 6b and its too freaking hot and we are doing 90 daily temps; hell no I'm not seeding now; cool season is cool season,ideal germination is 65- 80f with how these seed vendors are listing their seed. I think for NJ you are subject towards other pressures such as early winters and rough unpredictable precipitation patterns. Just go based on what you feeling on what fall is and the exception is KBG since the germination is practically over a month


^ This. Ideally you want a minimum of 45 days before your average date of first frost. The more days you can give yourself the better, but we can't control how hot it currently is or how cold it could quickly get. What's right for me in Ontario or someone in KS or PA is going to be different for someone in NJ.



Dvxdarkvashxvb said:


> Most people shouldn't be suggesting this difficult grass type with all the demands it needs for newer lawn owners


Who is suggesting KBG for new lawn owners?


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## Don_Julio (Aug 16, 2021)

I'm in central NJ. I put down a blend of TTTF and 10 % KBG. It's coming along great besides me over applying Tenacity in certain areas. I have some bleached grass blades which look bad but should go away.

I really don't know what I'm doing myself. I did an overseed in spring but the grass struggled badly in the summer so I killed it all and did a full renovation. &#129335;‍♂

Reading these replies are starting to worry me a bit. will my KBG make it? I noticed some areas that look a little thin so I threw down more seed yesterday. I'm very impatient and have had an eye sore of a lawn for the whole month of August due to Glyphosate.

I put a starter fertilizer down with the seed on Labor Day weekend. 18-24-6. I know the grass should fill in when I start mowing but I just wanted insurance.

I read I should fertilize again on Friday which is 15 days after seed down. Is this correct? Or should I wait until 30 days? And then what's my next step after my second application of starter fert. I'm putting down RGS too. I'm a bit hesitant to add Urea since it's such a low dosage and it's hard to get even coverage. Any advice is greatly appreciated.


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

Don_Julio said:


> I'm in central NJ. I put down a blend of TTTF and 10 % KBG. It's coming along great besides me over applying Tenacity in certain areas. I have some bleached grass blades which look bad but should go away.
> 
> I really don't know what I'm doing myself. I did an overseed in spring but the grass struggled badly in the summer so I killed it all and did a full renovation. 🤷‍♂️
> 
> ...


Where did you buy the seed?


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## LawnMavrik (Sep 22, 2020)

Don_Julio said:


> I'm in central NJ. I put down a blend of TTTF and 10 % KBG. It's coming along great besides me over applying Tenacity in certain areas. I have some bleached grass blades which look bad but should go away.
> 
> I really don't know what I'm doing myself. I did an overseed in spring but the grass struggled badly in the summer so I killed it all and did a full renovation. 🤷‍♂️
> 
> ...


Have you checked out the cool season guide renovation section?


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## Don_Julio (Aug 16, 2021)

abdulazeez77 said:


> Don_Julio said:
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> 
> > I'm in central NJ. I put down a blend of TTTF and 10 % KBG. It's coming along great besides me over applying Tenacity in certain areas. I have some bleached grass blades which look bad but should go away.
> ...


United Seed Super Turf ll


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## Don_Julio (Aug 16, 2021)

LawnMavrik said:


> Don_Julio said:
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> > I'm in central NJ. I put down a blend of TTTF and 10 % KBG. It's coming along great besides me over applying Tenacity in certain areas. I have some bleached grass blades which look bad but should go away.
> ...


I did check it out but it's telling me to go with Urea or AmS. I really never used any of the two and not sure if I feel comfortable adding these. I tried searching for Urea online and everything is super expensive.


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## Don_Julio (Aug 16, 2021)

abdulazeez77 said:


> Don_Julio said:
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> > I'm in central NJ. I put down a blend of TTTF and 10 % KBG. It's coming along great besides me over applying Tenacity in certain areas. I have some bleached grass blades which look bad but should go away.
> ...


If you're asking about seed because of my failed spring overseed that was Scotts sun and shade. I also only applied one application of fert in May and nothing until mid July when that grass was already toasted.


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## jha4aamu (Oct 16, 2017)

Don_Julio said:


> LawnMavrik said:
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Urea is fairly cheap if purchased locally. Dissolving it in warm water and spraying will help give you more even coverage.

The same is true for AMS, however its easier to spread because it generally comes in smaller prills, and is a lower concentration of N


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## Don_Julio (Aug 16, 2021)

jha4aamu said:


> Don_Julio said:
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Any recommendations for AMS? I don't know where to get any.


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

Don_Julio said:


> abdulazeez77 said:
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 I meant which retailer did you buy from?


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## Don_Julio (Aug 16, 2021)

abdulazeez77 said:


> Don_Julio said:
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https://unitedseeds.com/


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## Don_Julio (Aug 16, 2021)

jha4aamu said:


> Don_Julio said:
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Will this work?

https://www.amazon.com/Ammonium-Sulfate-NH4-2SO4-5-Pounds/dp/B007ODQF5U/ref=asc_df_B007ODQF5U/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=167148598996&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=18315857247578356892&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9004053&hvtargid=pla-309570092052&psc=1


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## Don_Julio (Aug 16, 2021)

jha4aamu said:


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I only have 1k Sqft will this do the job

https://www.amazon.com/Easy-Peasy-Urea-Fertilizer-46-0-0/dp/B071WCW6P7/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=1U4BYVIGQ6413&dchild=1&keywords=urea+fertilizer&qid=1631671254&sprefix=urea+fer&sr=8-3


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## jha4aamu (Oct 16, 2017)

Don_Julio said:


> jha4aamu said:
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That should be plenty if all you have to fertilize is 1k


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

If you have a sprayer, you can go to walmart, gas station, or auto part and get a 2.5g of DEF (diesel exhaust fluid). 10oz of it = 0.1lb of N. So use 10oz for your 1000sqft.

It will cheaper than buying that online urea. DEF is urea + water.


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## Don_Julio (Aug 16, 2021)

g-man said:


> If you have a sprayer, you can go to walmart, gas station, or auto part and get a 2.5g of DEF (diesel exhaust fluid). 10oz of it = 0.1lb of N. So use 10oz for your 1000sqft.
> 
> It will cheaper than buying that online urea. DEF is urea + water.


 :shock: :shock: 
Are you serious about the Diesel exhaust fluid :lol: ? And I thought its suppose to be 0.2LB of N for 1 K sqft?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

You can go and read the ingredients for def or do a quick Google search.

10oz = 0.1lb of N, 20oz = 0.2lb of N, 30oz = 0.3lb of N,... X0oz of DEF = 0.Xlb of N.


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## abdulazeez77 (Sep 16, 2020)

Folks - Reading through all these replies makes me concerned to just go buy a seed and then overseed it this fall. Moreover I also need to research the seed needed and find a retailer. Looks like online ones work well but I will need to research which one. Doing all this research will not allow me to overseed this fall. Can I skip it and do it in Spring or read up all, be equipped with the knowledge and then do it next Fall but starting late summer in August? If I do this, are there minerals or fertilizers I could apply now? I did a soil test with Rutgers last year and based on that I did add lime and another fertilizer last year. The soil test results are attached. I have not got another soil test. Any recommendations on whether I could do any minerals application now based on last year's soil test?


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## thin_concrete (Sep 11, 2020)

Do a lot of reading here over the next year or so and then hit August/September in force. Lots of info here regarding spring seeding, and most aren't a fan unless certain conditions are present.


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