# Work in Progress - AZ PRG



## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

About a year after purchasing a once abandoned short sale the yard was finally ready to be addressed. I was left with someone else's neglect which ultimately ended up destroying my plants and irrigation system.

The water to the house was turned off for the better part of the year (lawn was closer to 3) and absolutely reeked havoc on the plumbing and valves for the irrigation. Every time I Fixed something, something else would break. Everything from the controller, cracked valve bodies, ripped diaphragms, to roots smashing the unground SCH40. Repairs took close to 3 months. Constant digging and diagnosing. There are a total of 14 1" valves on my property and still do not know where the majority of them go. This made diagnosing things very difficult. This was hands down the most frustrating part of the work. I hate digging.

The grass area itself was battered with knee high weeds and goatheads. Not to mention the 80ft long sissoo roots that were on top of the surface. This is indicative of the tree looking for water. I absolutely hate these trees and will one day Rip it down.

At the time not owning anything than a hand downed rotary motor I applied glyphospahte/Sulfran the entire yard which cleared it up to at least unsightly dirt. 
Making a makeshift harrow I dragged around a weighted pallet that I had 100 screws poking through the Bottom to break up the top soil. It kinda helped level things but not even close to being perfect. Any remnants of the 3 year old dead grass was gray and resembled a brush fire. 
Some more time passed and picked up a few more pieces of equipment. A ryan verticutter from a closing course and a Power Rake dethatcher from auction. These guys did the bulk of the Reno work and 100% prefer the verticutter over a flail blade power rake for pretty much any situation.

Last season I planted PRG as well but turned out meh. Great for the first 2 months then my efforts started to diminish. It still looked great in comparison to others when mowed with a Exmark 52" zero Turn I picked up from a fleet sale. My plans were to over seed with Yukon, but the time when my schedule opened up in May the time had passed. With temps well into the 100s it proved to be incredible difficult for germination and keep anything wet. Lesson learned. Only about 10% established. So in short. The summer was a bust and The grass was back to hideous.

After some time it was October 2018. Enter PRG. For 8,200 sqft of area I applied ~250lbs of seed with a 36" Gandy drop spreader. Absolutely game changer. No soil test and just spreading starter Fertz praying it worked out.

Fast forward to now things came in well. Really starting to thicken out, but the color is no where near where I'd like it. Blotchy green after first feeding of N. Earlier this week I applied 144lbs of milorganite which is also a first for me. Never heard of it before this thread. I always over looked it while at the big box store.

This is the driving force to acquiring a sprayer mate. It will be used primarily for foliar applications of PGR and nitrogen. Optimistic this combat The uneven color out and allow me to waste more time and money.

Come March I'll start the whole cycle over again. Kill it all, rent a bobcat equipped with a Harley rake and level the lawn prior to laying 419 or tifgrand.

Anyone with a large lawn like Connor. How do you NOT have a remote for your zones!? Just irresponsible not to ;-) Best $90 you will spend!

I'm cutting Wednesdays with my 2653, and then again saturdays with a GM1000 at ~3/4. Catching clippings on saturdays. Hope to have some boom parts next week so I can start spraying and burning up the lawn!

So far this board and its members have been open arms with addressing my questions regarding feeding applications and look forward to learning more! I'll do my best to document along the way so others can learn what not to do.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)




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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

It's been a few years since I've purchased a broadcast spreader and have been making due with a small hand spreader. Today was the first drive with the Lesco 80lbs spreader to put down some 21-2-4 w/iron Nitra King. 
Since they carry a hefty price tag I waited and shopper around. Finally a BNIB popped up on eBay for $300 and I jumped on it. Is it better than any other pneumatic tire spreader? No idea. But it sure beats the hell out of my hand spreader.


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## PokeGrande (Mar 25, 2018)

Looks great! I overseeded my bermuda with PRG this fall and love it.


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## jessehurlburt (Oct 18, 2017)

Thanks for sharing photos of your local PGA golf course, how's your yard doing?

Seriously though, great work and fun toys youve got there! Looks amazing!


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Thank you. Yard is doing well, the deep green I want is slowly coming in, but blotchy in most areas. 
This weekend will be the first time spraying AMS so planning on easing into it with caution. With a conservative rate of .5lbs AMS/K. 
It's a double edged sword, the greener you get it the faster it grows! By the time I get home in the evening it is already dark so mowing is becoming increasingly difficult. The headlights are definitely utilized.

Also, it is very easy to over water! With Temps at 75-40, you want to water every day, but unnecessary. The problem is my canopy is thickkkkk. The PRG is really starting to clump out and the ground is retaining water well. Propiconazole will also make its way onto the grass this weekend as well. It kinda a bust cause the mower is floating and not cutting as well. Time to lower it to .75"

The baby JD pic was taken for our expecting photos. April is coming all too soon.

Lastly, picked up some 6061 flat bar stock yesterday for a DIY HOC gauge. Just need to turn down a stand off and attach the dial indicator. Will start a thread on that as well. The accu-gage is awesome, but essentially the same thing can be replicated for $30.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

The 2653 has spiral rollers. While it is great at straightening and lifting the blades the caveat is it will absolutely destroy the grass if you turn to tight of a radius when the gangs are down. 


It's not a perfect mow during the week but drastically reduces my time on the weekend when I walk it with the toro.

I have grooved rollers and catchers I've been meaning to install as well.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

The Sprayer Mate received a quick and cheap upgrade today. Leads for the float charger and a waterproof volt meter.

Now I know once it dips to < 12.4V it would be wise to throw it on the charger.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

The end game was to weld on a removable stainless boom, but my metal supplier did not have the stock I was looking for. So a temporary pvc boom was used in its place and worked just as well.

While the 3 jets is nice 5 would better fit my needs and limit the amount of overlap. Ware's writeup was a huge aid and the driving force for getting a sprayer in the first place.

Spraying AMS was a breeze. Even with the blue tips 8 gallons goes quickly. I need to learn to walk faster or dilute more. I let it sit on the lawn for 4 hours then watered it in. Hopeful I can see a quick response and a deeper green. The Milorganite is still working it's magic so it's hard to decipher what's what.

Today I'll take it down another .25" and apply my first application of PGR. Followed by propiconazole later this week. Any recommendations on application? 
Current highs are ~70F.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Double stripes are too much work.


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## TheTurfTamer (Aug 8, 2018)

AZChemist said:


> It's been a few years since I've purchased a broadcast spreader and have been making due with a small hand spreader. Today was the first drive with the Lesco 80lbs spreader to put down some 21-2-4 w/iron Nitra King.
> Since they carry a hefty price tag I waited and shopper around. Finally a BNIB popped up on eBay for $300 and I jumped on it. Is it better than any other pneumatic tire spreader? No idea. But it sure beats the hell out of my hand spreader.


AMAZING !!! GREAT WORK :bandit: :thumbup:


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Wish I didn't have to spray this stuff. PPZ legit smells like my diesel fuel additive. There goes the fresh plastic smell of the sprayer. Picked this up from a member in marketplace, thanks @craigdt


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Great work! And that's a heck of an irrigation controller. Looks like a commercial model. My friend lived in Gilbert for a few years, during most of middle and high school.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Thanks! There were multiple rain dial controllers around the yard powered by direct Burial wire. I managed to hit most of those lines when trenching to move my pool pump and plumbing. Consolidating the controllers was a no brainer and would relieve me of turning on a zone, jumping walls, and running while making repairs.

The remote is a MUST for large properties. I can not reiterate this enough. It does work on most raindial controllers as well.

After a few months of searching this MC controller popped up brand new. Want to say I paid $150 for it. Shout out to Josè. Seldom do I buy anything new for retail. This stuff is crazy expensive. Local programming is not very intuitive but with time becomes easier. There is also a function to make your watering schedule on the computer and update it wirelessly back to the controller. Maybe next year I'll explore the option.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

I'm still fighting the yellowing throughout the yard. Looks like the mower spread what ever it is big time. The color has improved greatly. The greens are greens, and the yellows less yellow. I watered once for 3 minutes mid week, then of course what never happens in AZ happened. It rained. Soaked again 🤦‍♂️.

Today I mowed then threw down another low dose of PPZ and mid strength Azoxy. The dew lingers around most of the morning so it was a pretty wet mow.

PGR is def going to be in my household for as long as I own a grass yard. It did exactly what it claims and slowed growth about 50% after just 1 application! Still about 60 gallons of clippings but I skipped my mid week cut.

Also, just out of chance I stumbled on another MC controller. This time a 24 station. So my 12 is going to get swapped out and will make it's way to the marketplace.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Looks like my lawn survived the worst of the winter. Temps are a little higher and it's been growing well. There is a ton of overcast this season which is very unusual so that has put an vise on it's full potential.

I've been slamming it with AMS every 1-2 weeks at 0.4lbs/k and it is loving it. So much it now has turned a dark bluish green. I over did it with seed and is now so thick I can't even stick a finger down to ground without prying the blades apart. Great to be barefoot on, but not looking forward to dethatching and ripping it up for TiffGreen sod. I'm going to take some soil samples and test the pH in the lab just to make sure things are not drifting too high.


Once it hits 80s again I'll be back to mowing 3 days a week and this is where I hope the PGR will slow it down. 1/2 dose, and most certainly the full recommended dose will burn the heck of your lawn. Lesson learned. It set me back weeks and is still recouping.

I've since dropped down the HOC to 0.8". Not quite to that 0.7" I want but it's getting there. Adjustments are so much more accurate with my gauge my buddy made for me.





Tonight we are expecting but yet more rain so I jumped on the wagon and picked up 100lbs of Humic Acid. This was a granular but if all goes well I'll incorporated RGS into the mix. Just looks like a pain to clean the sprayer afterwards.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

I've read over and over this is a must have for a spreader.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

70 and hot today! 
I picked up 2009 21 Flex and gotta say, the cut is a lot better than my GM1000. The lawn isn't very level so I was getting a bounce to it leaving ripples. I have a few gripes about the flex but overall pretty happy with it. Photo 1 is with the GM and 2 is with the flex. The stripes are much more defined and grass is cut more even (level) when doing multiple wide passes.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

For the last 10 years I've been using a weedeater brand curved shaft trimmer that I bought 2nd hand on Craigslist. It's been pretty good to me over the years and just would not quit. I could lean it out and rev it like an RC car but she would never pop. I unfortunately had to part ways with her recently due to the increasingly difficult time to get it started ever week. I ended up parting ways with it for $5.

Enter the new. I have quite a few Stihl products so I wanted to keep it going. I originally bought a FS56RC and it sat in the garage unused because I was out of leaded fuel. Well a brand new FS70R popped up for $150 and I snagged it.

Overall I'm happy with it. But my biggest complaint with any straight shaft is the rotation. I've have years of muscle memory trimming one way, and now doing so throws all the material at my legs :-( I also like that it had a clutch. My old unit was direct drive.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

AZChemist said:


> throws all the material at my legs :-( I also like that it had a clutch. My old unit was direct drive.


The landscape blade will solve this problem.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Awesome System, just twice as much as the trimmer. I have a FC56 edger and does well partitioning the grass and curbing enough to where I can grab most with the reel.

Side note. I don't think I'd use granular Humic ever again. 2.5 weeks later of daily watering and most has not dissolved. When I mowed 1 week after application a good number of product ended up in my catch.

Just gunna order the RGS. Any coupons anyone!?


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## BakerGreenLawnMaker (Mar 13, 2018)

Those are some impressive stripes! Job well done!

uote=AZChemist post_id=124807 time=1548534031 user_id=3660]
70 and hot today! 
I picked up 2009 21 Flex and gotta say, the cut is a lot better than my GM1000. The lawn isn't very level so I was getting a bounce to it leaving ripples. I have a few gripes about the flex but overall pretty happy with it. Photo 1 is with the GM and 2 is with the flex. The stripes are much more defined and grass is cut more even (level) when doing multiple wide passes. 



[/quote]


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## Bradymco11 (Jul 11, 2018)

Where did you get your flex 21? I live near you and recently bought one for me and one for my friend. I bet we got them from the same source. I got mine from a golf course up in anthem unloading all their older models on OfferUp.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Warmer temps and rains made the lawn explode along with the weeds.

I didn't spray Prodiamine on the curbing surrounds the lawn and well, that's the only place I have weeds in the grass.

I'm back to cutting 2 times a week due to growth (about 1/2" every 3-4 days). With a gallon of T-Nex in the garage I want to spray another application, but last time I sprayed at the 50% of the label dose it burned the lawn badly in the beginning of the season. I'm hesitant to apply again even at 25% as it could be detrimental. With an event at our house in 2 weeks she'd kill me if I botched it up now.

Camera does not do it justice but the green color is a deep emerald green.


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## CenlaLowell (Apr 21, 2017)

Man this is beautiful. I'm a warm season guy, but I lurk over to the cool section every now and then. What type of mower you are using to get those stripes.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Thank you! I'm using a GM1000 and Flex. Both 21". Just wish the flex had a larger catcher. 
Here's a photo of the GM. 
I have an extra GM to use in between sharpenings but have yet to use it.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Weather this winter has been terrible! Last week I saw 3" of rain over 3 days. This week though has been 75 and amazing. With the warmer weather I dropped the mower down to 0.6" and absolutely love it.

Saturday I'll step it again to 0.5" and apply Prodiamine, Bifen, and PGR. Now that we've had our baby shower last weekend I could care less if I stress the grass. Realistically I'll see 90-100 degree temps in the next 30 days and the PRG will fade very fast. I bought some baskets for the 2653 and need to get them installed as well. Also need to pull the reels and adjust them lower

By the time I finished doing a rough cut it was too late to blow or take decent lighted photos. Cut quality vastly improved with the lower HOV.


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## social port (Jun 19, 2017)

How can this not be LOTM?! You got my vote, for sure. Looks great! I never would have guessed that you've had difficult weather this winter.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Thank you! Yes we normally have cooler temps, but plenty of sunshine. Lots of cloud cover this year. And lots and lots of frost. I had probably 2 dozen hard freezes too. In previous years it would be 3-5 a winter. The rye held up nice though! Early morning water would help thaw it out.

I'll pull it out this weekend but I finally got a set of wheels machined out to fit my MiniCab.


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## Suburban Jungle Life (Mar 1, 2018)

Congrats on LOTM!!


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Congrats! Looking amazing.


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## Buffalolawny (Nov 24, 2018)

AZChemist said:


> The Sprayer Mate received a quick and cheap upgrade today. Leads for the float charger and a waterproof volt meter.
> 
> Now I know once it dips to < 12.4V it would be wise to throw it on the charger.


You say you have to put on the charger when it gets to 12.4v

Should consider purchasing an adjustable voltage disconnect.

So that you don't have to be constantly looking for the volt meter and can concentrate on keeping the spray lines.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

That's a great idea! I found that I can spray 27 gallons, probably more, on a single charge with a voltage drop to 12v. The drop has little no Ill effect on pressure either.

These little sprayers are pretty impressive!


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Today's plan was to install some catches I purchased from the Cubs spring training field. They had an old 2653 that was on its way to the scrap yard and was lucky enough to pick up the reel assembles with the buckets.

John Deere did a terrible job with the bolt placement. Most of the bolts needed for any adjustment requires a box wrench, but you can't fit in the 12 point side. No chance for sockets to fit either. Well some of the bolts are stuck so I decided to just adjust the HOC instead. Also a huge Pain. 
I found 0.65" on the JD is about the same as 0.55 on my flex due to the corkscrew front rollers. There is very little surface area so they find their way keeper into the turf vs. the grooved roller. 
All in all, cuts very well. The yard looks much flatter and is much easier to hold my beer while mowing. Now I just have to deal with all the clippings.


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## OnTheOxbow (Jan 27, 2019)

Congrats on LOTM! Well done sir.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

With a 0.55" cut on the 2653 I've found the striping effect to not be as predominant as using the walk behind. I also believe it is the front rollers as they leave more or a tenderized meat finish than a pushed over blade. 
My biggest complaint. No cup holder. At least my ExMark had one ;-)

Still kicking myself for not putting down Prodiamine yet and hope to knock it out first thing in the morning. Last year I had a ton for crab crass and not looking to go down that road again. I've picked up some Quinclorac as well to have on hand. Also added a product called Cyzmic CS for the scorpions. I'll be adding this in my normal spraying program for around the house and walls. Not the grass. That will continue to get Bifen.

With a little guy due any day now, I'm
Sad to let go of my Minitruck I had imported from Japan. Have to make room for the new!

It hasn't seen much use, but I believe my Gator will better serve me for my size of property.


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## jjepeto (Jan 27, 2019)

That mini truck is awesome! Sad to see it go


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## Chris LI (Oct 26, 2018)

Here's a potential solution for your cup holder issue. A couple of self tapping screws should do the trick. Beautiful work, by the way, and congrats on LOTM! I've been following your journal and it has inspired me to step up my game.


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## mowww (Jan 16, 2018)

AZChemist said:


> Cyzmic CS for the scorpions. I'll be adding this in my normal spraying program for around the house and walls.


If you like Cyzmic for scorpions, you should try Fendona - game changer.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Cyzmic is new to me. It was recommended to me by a pest professional. 
I alternate between CY kick and Demon WP and delta dust in the block wall. During summer months I spray the house every 2 weeks and block walls monthly which I read is redundant due to absorption rate of unpainted block. 
About 1.5 gal for exterior house. And 3 gallons for perimeter. They are so hard to completely get rid of. 
I have zero insects other than ants but we can still find scorps at night. I hate it. 
Night time direct spraying is something I'll do before I go to bed in the summer a few nights a week. Most nights it's nothing. Others I'll find 3. For those of you not in the area. They literally glow under UV light. So armed with a black light you can easily spot them from afar.

I'd like to think my treatment is 100x more than what anyone else does. 
I've never heard of Fendona till now but looking at the price I can see why it is not highly reviewed.


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## mowww (Jan 16, 2018)

AZChemist said:


> Cyzmic is new to me. It was recommended to me by a pest professional.
> I alternate between CY kick and Demon WP and delta dust in the block wall. During summer months I spray the house every 2 weeks and block walls monthly which I read is redundant due to absorption rate of unpainted block.
> About 1.5 gal for exterior house. And 3 gallons for perimeter. They are so hard to completely get rid of.
> I have zero insects other than ants but we can still find scorps at night. I hate it.
> ...


Understandable, I got a deal on a case when I lived in TX for scorpions if you want to try some vs. the others. I would get 2-3x the life vs. Cyzmic for scorpions and now I get about 1.5-2x days of control for mosquitos vs Suspend Polyzone and Cyzmic (I can't decide which I dislike more, mosquitos or scorpions). PM me if you want me to send you some - the 480oz. case might last me the rest of my life.


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## rickta24 (May 10, 2018)

I also live in the valley and am curious what your plans are for transitioning from PRG to Bermuda? Excellent looking lawn and congrats on LOTM!


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Temps are kissing 90 and the lawn is moving along. I have not fed it in weeks to slow down the growth. 2 weeks ago I got down some Prodiamine and will most likely put a 2nd dose this weekend. Fearful of crabgrass ruining my life again. 
Even though this grass is at the end of its life cycle it got ~30lbs if 21-7-14 today. It was what ever was left in the bag and it at least cleared up some garage real estate.

@rickta24 As to the bermuda transformation. I plan on killing the PRG. Leveling with a Harley Rake. Drive around with my gator a few hundred times with a drag mat, trench and add another zone for the center of the yard (only 2 heads now) and lay down some TifGrand.

I plan on fixing the curbing that's been lifted from roots along with a laundry list of other items, but my time has been better spent indoors the last few months. Good news is, I replaced my 1150 trencher with a larger RTX100. Every time I fix a section of drip line it busts somewhere else. Decided replacing everything will be my best option to keep my sanity.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Was too late on the Prodiamine this year so I have goose everywhere. There was a ton of it last year when the yard was dirt but undestimated how many seeds it produced. Power raking and drag mat certainly didn't help me out containing it to a section either.

Tenacity shows up today and will get put down with a 2nd dose of pre-em.

Fine tuning the rotarys to get the water where it needs it the most this morning.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

I sprayed the perimeter and spot treated areas with 3-Way and Quinclorac. The knock down has been great In comparison to my normal glyphosate. Don't see myself ever going back.

Another hard knock learned this year is my PRG hates PGR. If applied to any area even remotely stressed the impact is detrimental. Applied at 0.25oz/K it is hit or miss with some areas. Another lesson learned is pre-em early In the year. I have some grassy weed now. My late season application of Prodiamine seemed to do nothing. Also, I'm going to apply at the higher end of the rate spectrum for longer coverage.

My procrastination cost me $60 for some tenacity and what will probably be 2-3 applications to get what ever weed it is out of the yard.

And lastly. Clippings. Wish I had put my buckets on the 2653. The clippings completely hide the stripping and make the real roller appear it's HOC is higher than the front. I have the reels positioned to throw the clippings forward on the front, and backwards on the rear. They also have an affinity for the dogs paws as well and gets tracked inside the house.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Yesterday 95. Today 75 and windy. 
It's starting to get stressed in areas despite longer waterings. 
Next week I'll begin verticutting and send her on her way to succumb to the inferno known as an AZ summer. 
My now lack of care of survival has given me the opportunity to come out with the fam during the evening and practice my short game using a solar light as a makeshift golf pin ⛳ . Just need to find a hole cutter now. 
It's been fun rye. Till next time.


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## Bradymco11 (Jul 11, 2018)

AZChemist said:


> Another hard knock learned this year is my PRG hates PGR. If applied to any area even remotely stressed the impact is detrimental. Applied at 0.25oz/K it is hit or miss with some areas. Another lesson learned is pre-em early In the year. I have some grassy weed now. My late season application of Prodiamine seemed to do nothing. Also, I'm going to apply at the higher end of the rate spectrum for longer coverage.


That's interesting. This was my first year doing PGR on PRG and it did awesome. I maintained 0.45" HOC all winter only mowing once a week. I quit applying PGR in early April and started transition to Bermuda in mid April though. I wonder if your PGR stress just came from the 90 degree heat rather than the PGR.

Regardless, yours is looking awesome. Looking forward to seeing how this summer goes.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

PRG is back, but this time overseeded in Tifgrand. There is still a few thousand more square feet of bermuda to lay and have tentatively set a install date for the 2nd week of November. The bermuda will be overseeded as well and the yard will probably look weird all winter long, but o well. 
Aeration will happen this weekend and 6 tons of sand will be leveled out for a sod bed. 
With a tile saw blade on the edger I'll cut the existing grass edge as straight as possible so the sod will mate Cleaner.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

The grind continues with changing out a few heads before I lay the sand bed and level. 
Before I aerate I will blanked a generous amount of Prodiamine and gly to save the spring time headache. 
The rye/Tifgrand got another light dose of 21-7-14 at 0.5/k for the last time before switching to AMS.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Busy weekend. Edges of Tifgrand were cut, Aerated, and then added 6 tons of sand.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Temps have been holding at high 80's and only dipping into the 60's at night allowing the rye to really take off. A week ago we were getting into the high 30s at night and it came to a quick halt.

Here is yesterday's cut at 0.48". The diagonals would have looked better as doubles but it was getting dark. The on/off switch to my flex is intermittently grounding out so it made it made it difficult to get going yesterday.


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

Wow that looks crazy good.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Thank you. It took a ton of work to get it where it is today. The Reno is highlighted in my warm season journal.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

It's a week late but 3400sqft of sod was just delivered as I was finishing up spraying 1oz/k of Prodiamine with a little bit of quinclorac. The Tifgrand is overseeded. Wet. And heavy. Should make for a fun morning tomorrow.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Wasn't an easy day but all the sod made it down. I am only 5 pieces short which I'll pick up Saturday. Tomorrow I'll roll and throw 21-7-14 at it. Can't wait till summer to further level it.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

The new sod received its first cut and has been about 10 days since it was laid. After the first feeding and a heavy few inches of rain it took off to 4+ plus. This made it difficult to get the wet canopy down to 1" with a time master and a failing engine. Took 2 days and 2 trash bins to get it down enough to reel mow.

Still super choppy, but the reel mower should flatten it out a bit over the next few months till I can verticut it and level with sand.

This week has more rain in the forecast so the sod to the right will get some more 21-7-14 to help drive those roots down. Without the bermuda growing it's kinda just heavy wet carpet out there until the rye barely bites in.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

The flex received a long over due backlap today. New motor for the timemaster shows up tomorrow, and 10 left over pounds of PRG was thrown down over the new sod. Doubt it will grow but was worth a try. Also, ordered some Ferrous Sulfate and am going to give FAS a try. Rain is in the forecast but if thanks giving is free it will get sprayed down then.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

I bought a Timemaster second hand sight unseen. Quickly I found out why it was so cheap. In addition to needing a handful of parts the motor smoked terribly. The 8.75hp engine seemed like a waste of time so I picked up a 10hp on eBay. Night and day difference. Wish it went a little lower. I have it dropped basically dragging the deck on the ground. 
Now, the mower is enjoyable and has tons more power. She's a little rough but one of these days I'll get it powder coated.

Also, I sprayed FAS and PGR a few days ago. It noticeably made a difference on the new so. Not so much on established turf. I'm trying to get the sod to green up without pushing more N. Spraying FAS will definitely be in my rotation.


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## jabopy (Nov 24, 2018)

Great looking lawn!! The new section is coming on well. What size are the rolls of turf (sod) you layed,they look bigger and heavier than the ones I get over here.?


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

They are 5x2' and weigh 45-60lbs depending on how wet they are.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Things are looking superb! The winter rye from the sod farm is starting to thicken after a few weeks mowing as low as the TimeMaster can go and an app of PGR. My established side is still being maintained at just below 0.5" with an flex. Still blows my mind seeing a side by side of how much better a reel cut low looks to the lowest of cut from a rotary.

We've been hit hard with a ton of rain lately but before then I can officially say I am a believer in FAS. The sod darkened up dramatically in a weeks time. Now for the already good looking side there was no visible difference. Could be the pgr as well.

This time last year we had a very similar weather pattern and the lawn looked sickly all winter long. I blame the copious amount of Milorganite I applied. May just be physiological but I'm staying away from it indefinitely and sticking with synthetic.

PGR this year on the PRG has been great, but on the other side which has annual rye it is evident it needs a higher dose. Now, it has seen a lot of 21-7-14 in the past weeks as well, but the pgr didn't even put a dent in it with cooler temps.

My plan this weekend is to spray FAS, PGR, and my app of Prodiamine.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

After a few apps of PGR and mowing twice a week with the lowest setting on the TimeMaster the sod farm rye is finally starting to thicken.

It's been about a year since I've fired up the 2653, but today she got some use and I trimmed down the right side. If memory serves me correctly, the HOC is set at 0.6". So much better than walking.

AfterWards i pressured washed the mower and backlapped.

Once a few hours passed I sprayed FAS, Prodiamine, and PGR. My house has seen some hard frosts in the morning, but daytime temps in the 70s. The cooler weather really puts the brakes on the top growth. I'm still shying away from any nitrogen till next month.


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## rob13psu (May 20, 2018)

AZChemist said:


> After a few apps of PGR and mowing twice a week with the lowest setting on the TimeMaster the sod farm rye is finally starting to thicken.
> 
> It's been about a year since I've fired up the 2653, but today she got some use and I trimmed down the right side. If memory serves me correctly, the HOC is set at 0.6". So much better than walking.
> 
> ...


Wow, you've done a ton of work. The rye is looking great. Do you have much more sod to put down?


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Thank you. Yes, there is about 3,000 sqft more to go.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

We had a decent amount of rain over the past week plus a cold front. The first hard freeze made its way to the lawn. Growth is almost none existent at this point.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Can't wait for some bermuda! The new sod has been getting the 2653 treatment and has really helped out with rolling it a little flatter. The established side gets the toro flex since there is still a slight difference in the HOC.

The sod Ends where it does because that is the max area of coverage from zone 2 of the irrigation. I did not want to run a partial zone to water half dirt.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Today was the first time the entire lawn was cut sub 0.5". The 2653 and PGR has done a great job at pushing everything down and out. Without it the new lawn cut this short would look scalped. 
It has been months since it has a N feeding but I plan on throwing down 0.5lbs/k Tomorrow. FAS gets the green where I want it, but it is short lived for only a few days.

The growth is still glacial at best. Daytime temps will kiss 70 this week and lows will slow things down as they are in the high 30s.

A few weeks ago I bought a used TimeMaster and it was a disaster. The motor went out followed by the transmission and rear high adjustment. Luckily one popped up at one of those places that buys all of HDs returns and open boxes and was able to purchase a brand new mower for under $500 w/electric start. Even though I seldom use a rotary mower it is nice to have to vacuum all of the edgings and thatch when the verticutter is used.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

The lesco threw down 10-11lbs of AMS which only comes out to just over 0.35lbs n / k.

My next step is to source a truly fine grain sand for leveling. All I've found is "mortar sand" and has large pebbles in it. Primarily what all aggregate yards sell. Anyone in AZ have any recommendations? I want something much finer. . What have locals used prior?

Have my eye on an old sh*t toro top dresser from 91' that will hopefully save my back. But if it does I just hope the gator will pull it loaded.


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## SC Grass Loon (Jun 7, 2019)

I am not local and cannot offer you a good lead other than I searched on the web for pga topdressing sand in my area and found a supplier that way. I would think with as many golf courses you all have out there someone will be selling it. You could also check with some greens keepers in your area to see where they are getting their sand in from.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

From what I've been told is one yard has a contract to purchase all the usga sand in the greater Phoenix area till 2022 and won't sell residentially. I'll try my luck with some greens keeper superintendents and see if I can get any traction.


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## SC Grass Loon (Jun 7, 2019)

AZChemist said:


> From what I've been told is one yard has a contract to purchase all the usga sand in the greater Phoenix area till 2022 and won't sell residentially. I'll try my luck with some greens keeper superintendents and see if I can get any traction.


That definitely stinks. In my area they have a yard about 10 miles from me that is commercial only and I have to drive to one about 45 miles from me to get to the retail sales.

Best of luck!

BTW the lawn looks great.


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## Vtx531 (Jul 1, 2019)

If you are just concerned with leveling, I think the mortar sand will be fine. On the other hand, if you are worried about golf cart traffic or football games, then you might need to be more selective.

I have tried:
1. Fill sand
2. 2NS sand
3. Washed fine sand (like a Caribbean beach)

After it gets worked down, you can't tell a difference at all.

The fill sand really freaked me out at first because the finer particles worked down and I was left with pebbles all over. But after a while, you can't even tell the difference.

That being said, topdressing is something you cant undo.
So do whatever you are comfortable with and it won't matter either way.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Mortar sand in AZ is not like others have posted on this site from other regions.

It is far from a small-medium mesh and is heavy with pebbles. I've tried 3 different yards and it is all rubbish. Think concrete mix more so than sand. Motar in the rest of America is reserved for stacking bricks, where as here is is used for stucco. A brick home is a rare sight these days. The said sand ranges from 10-20 mesh.

Seeing as I plan on keeping the lawn sub 0.4" during the summer and groom/verticut frequently a lawn full of rocks is not a avenue id like to explore. The risk is not worth it.

I did find a direct supplier of 100 mesh sand used for sport field applications this week. The caveat is the cost of the sand is practically nothing, and the freight is almost $300.

While yes AZ is home to a billion golf courses and one would think sourcing sand for residential would be easy . . Instead it is the opposite because basically no one here has grass exceeding 100sqft.

Even the mortar sand I speak of is $25-40 a ton plus delivery in the Phoenix area.


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## Vtx531 (Jul 1, 2019)

Wow that is crazy expensive! Sounds like your mortar sand is our fill sand.

You zeroed in on the fundamental problem with sand/gravel - it is heavy and therefore costs a lot to ship. No getting around it.

I pay about $5 per ton for 2NS which is a screened and washed sand. Delivery is $80 local within 10 miles no matter if you want 1 or 14 tons.

The cost makes sense for a golf course because the topdressing will (hopefully)pay for itself with increased greens fees (not having to close after heavy rain events).

If nobody is paying you to use your turf...it's all on you. But labor costs are free so there's that.

The good thing is you have made the decision on a high quality sand so really there is nothing to figure out except pay for it or don't do it at all.

Hope you can find a good source at reasonable cost and look forward to seeing your progress!! Your lawn looks amazing already.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

76 degrees today, but soil temps still below 50. The last 2-3 weeks I've had frost every morning. The sod installed in November has little to no roots. Because of this, despite watering for a long duration, the areas that were leveled heavily with sand dry out quickly and the PRG gets stressed. I went through the same thing on the other side with the bermuda.
Previously I've added humic in the solid form, but quickly found out it is not very water soluble. 2 days later most of it ended back in my catcher as I mowed. So this year I am going to incorporate RGS with my spray apps. People seem to be happy with it here on the board. 
Overall things still look well at 0.5" and look forward to Bermuda and the high water bill.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Back in it for winter 2020. 
12 days since seed. 
Few bare areas but reseeded and dressed with the clippings.

Excited to get the 2500E on this lawn in a month.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

3 weeks old today. Was pretty wet when when I mowed and the reel kept getting jammed up. 
Will give it another go at end of day when it's nice and dry this week.

Only apps have been a light dose of 21-0-0 after my initial ital starter fert.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

@robbybobby sorry I inadvertently posted in the wrong thread. This is the current lawn thread for the PRG.

My lawn is surrounded by pea gravel that tends to make its way into the grass every time I drive my gator into it. The reel mower does a great job at finding them. My Turf model had "turf" tires that constantly had rocks stuck into the tread.
Well, sold the turf and stepped into a 4x2 which had the original knobby tires on it that are much too aggressive for the lawn. JD uses a 9" rear tire and the smooth tread design is limited so I went with a 12" rear off of a tractor to expand my tire options, powder coated them, and wrapped them with some tires which should be gentle on the lawn. Working out much better than the turf tires.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)

Some single doubles this morning. Would of loved to checker but it was too much walking. 0.4"


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## SC Grass Loon (Jun 7, 2019)

It is looking good! The new tires on the gator look nice as well.


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## AZChemist (Nov 7, 2018)




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