# Ontario lawn prep for next summer



## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

Hey guys I live in Ontario and just wanted to know what I should be doing now for a nicer lawn next year...
I plan on over seeding like crazy and fertilize to help crowd out weed and stuff as this summer turned out to be a hot one where we live...crabgrass started to grow...
Just need a little advice&#128563;
I have crab-ex pre emergent to use for next year and tenacity and surfactant..so any advice or help would be great!
Does crowding out weeds and crabgrass even really work??
I do realize how and when the crabgrass germinate at around 50-60 degrees temp in the soil and in bare areas...hence the over seeding..
Any help would be great!


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## Sinclair (Jul 25, 2017)

Greensass1 said:


> Does crowding out weeds and crabgrass even really work??


It absolutely does, but a little chemical help initially makes it a lot easier to get there.

I've been 100% organic for over a year now, and I've hand pulled a handful of weeds all summer.

Welcome to TLF!


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

Pardon my ignorance but what do you mean by organic??


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## Kaba (Mar 29, 2019)

I can also attest to it, my lawn is thinner than I'd like to admit, even still keeping it tall the past 2 years, I don't think I've used more than an oz or two of 2,4-d in 3 years over 3000sqft. The weeds try so hard to get above the grass they do not establish roots and the occasional ones I see while I mow pull out like butter.


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## Sinclair (Jul 25, 2017)

Greensass1 said:


> Pardon my ignorance but what do you mean by organic??


No pre-emergent or post-emergent herbicides, no fungicides, etc.


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

What do you guys do for poa annua?
I have a ton of Home Depot grass seed....will that be enough??
I plan on dumping a bunch of seeds all over and covering with beginners seed fertilizer stamping it and let September and October rain do the rest of the work....
But can I add winter fertilizer as well or not??
Or instead of adding new seed fertilizer just add the winter feed fertilizer instead


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

@Sinclair has gotten to the point where he doesn't really need chemical intervention to help control weeds or fungus. He has worked tirelessly to improve his cultural practices to get to this point.

I am working towards that goal, in terms of weed control. I have spot sprayed just once this year and currently have maybe 5-6 small weeds in my backyard which are virtually invisible because of my low height of cut.

To help control crab grass you will want to get 1-2 pre emergent apps down in the spring.

When do you plan to over seed? It's a little late now I'm the season to give the grass a fighting chance to survive our winter climate.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

Poa Annua: pre emergent app in August.

I wouldn't seed now and I wouldn't use Home Depot seed. It likely contains weed seeds as well.

Also stay away from "winter fertilizer". As @Sinclair says, it's a marketing gimmick.

Instead get some urea and start the fall N blitz.

It might help if we can see some pictures of the state of your lawn.


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

The lush green shots are the beginning of summer...the brown crappy shots are from tday...summer was too hot..and my lack of watering...early morning work coming back home late...etc


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

These were from tday


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

What is urea and where do I get it from??


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

Where are you? Do you have a TSC store near you? If you're anywhere near Georgetown you can go to peel Landscape depot.

I would rent a power rake, fertilize and water. I don't know if there is any value in taking on anything else, given that it's September 1st.

I would read this forum and check out the cool season guide. Also search for Canadian Alternatives to Milorganite and the Great Canadian Lawn Care Rant and put together a plan to come out strong in the spring.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

http://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=753

Check out the above link.

Urea is a fertilizer that contains 46% nitrogen and is mostly used for fall fert apps.


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

Harts said:


> Where are you? Do you have a TSC store near you? If you're anywhere near Georgetown you can go to peel Landscape depot.
> 
> I would rent a power rake, fertilize and water. I don't know if there is any value in taking on anything else, given that it's September 1st.
> 
> I would read this forum and check out the cool season guide. Also search for Canadian Alternatives to Milorganite and the Great Canadian Lawn Care Rant and put together a plan to come out strong in the spring.


What is the TSC??
Heard it mentioned before?


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

Greensass1 said:


> Harts said:
> 
> 
> > Where are you? Do you have a TSC store near you? If you're anywhere near Georgetown you can go to peel Landscape depot.
> ...


Sorry forgot to mention I live in Scarborough...


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

TSC is a hardware store. Stands for tractor supply company. I'll try to do a search and see what I can find close to you.


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## Babameca (Jul 29, 2019)

@Greensass1 
https://www.tscstores.com/
https://www.tscstores.com/25KG-46-0-0-TSC-UREA-P31918.aspx


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

Thanks guys I appreciate the help...
I keep reading different times on when to be applying weed killers...
Nothing clear on tenacity...I can use this to kill weeds and still over seed?
Is urea a good thing to use when overseesing?


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

If you absolutely need to overseed, avoid all fertilizer. It will force top growth and crowd out need seedlings.

You need to identify the type of weeds you have. Tenacity and other herbicides are not "catch all" killers.

To be honest, I don't think you have a huge weed issue. Your lawn looks stressed from the heat and is suffering from drought.

I'll reiterate that I think you should just power rake and get on the fall nitrogen blitz. Take the winter to put a plan together for next season.

Lawn care is a process.


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## Kaba (Mar 29, 2019)

I agree with @Harts.

1) Mow 2-3x a week
2) Water deeply and infrequently
3) Fertilize appropriately with a purpose

Then you, if next spring you can identify weed issues, probably spot spraying 2,4-d will nail almost everything.


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

Harts said:


> If you absolutely need to overseed, avoid all fertilizer. It will force top growth and crowd out need seedlings.
> 
> You need to identify the type of weeds you have. Tenacity and other herbicides are not "catch all" killers.
> 
> ...


Thank you my friend...the front isn't too bad actually...but if I don't oversees to crowd out the weeds this fall next summer I'm screwed...
Truthfully the plan I had in mind was to over seed the living hell outta the front and back yard...top soil..and water and that's it..
Was prob thinking doing it not this weekend but the weekend after


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

If you can, get it down this weekend. You're not leaving much time for the new grass to establish before frost sets in.

You may also want to look into pre emergents this winter - prodiamine or dithiopyr - and apply it next spring. Makes a world of difference with weed control (along with a dense lawn, of course).


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## MMoore (Aug 8, 2018)

I use prodiamine 65wdg and its amazing. my wife can attest, I sprayed her beds with it and there was probably an hour of weeding flowerbeds all year between the spring and "fall" apps.

I picked mine up from seedworld usa. I have had about an hour of weeding this year in the lawn too... just a few spots that I must have missed with the prodiamine had a patch of crabgrass.... but because im spending time dialing in things like lawn cutting, watering and fert the crabbies did come out really fast.


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## Greensass1 (Jun 1, 2019)

MMoore said:


> I use prodiamine 65wdg and its amazing. my wife can attest, I sprayed her beds with it and there was probably an hour of weeding flowerbeds all year between the spring and "fall" apps.
> 
> I picked mine up from seedworld usa. I have had about an hour of weeding this year in the lawn too... just a few spots that I must have missed with the prodiamine had a patch of crabgrass.... but because im spending time dialing in things like lawn cutting, watering and fert the crabbies did come out really fast.


Is the prodiamine not available in Ontario/ Canada? Or will the us ship it to my door no prob??


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## davegravy (Jul 25, 2019)

@Greensass1

https://www.seedworldusa.com/products/prodiamine-65wdg-herbicide-guardrail-barricade-crabgrass-control-5-lbs

Will ship to Canada but it can be expensive especially if you get dinged with duty.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

@Greensass1 pre emergents are not available in Canada - not in stores or on Amazon. Prodiamine isn't sold in big box stores in the US either.

Seed World is the place you want to go to.


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## Avid123 (Jul 31, 2019)

Harts said:


> http://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=753
> 
> Check out the above link.
> 
> Urea is a fertilizer that contains 46% nitrogen and is mostly used for fall fert apps.


Fellow Canuck here, @Harts you had given me some advice on another thread and said research has shown even small quantities of N might be ok (around 0.25/K) and I shouldnt go too aggressive this season. I managed to find Urea but it turns out that if I only have a 1200sq ft lawn I will need less than a pound of urea. The issue is that in terms of volume that seems to be a pretty small quantity to spread using a rotary spreader even on a pretty low setting. So if I added a bit more to it, I just wanted to ask how much is safe to out down at one time without risking burnt grass ?


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## Mok (May 29, 2019)

Have you tested your soil yet? I'm about to do that so I know what to add to my lawn. Gotta have it absorbing all those nutrients make also to make sure you know what to apply to your lawn


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

@Avid123 you can actually apply 0.5lb N every 2 weeks. Still means you're only using just over 1lb of urea.

2 options:

1. Use a hand held spreader like the Scott's wizz

2. Dissolve the Urea and spray with a 2 gallon pump sprayer. If you choose this method, I wouldn't go higher than 0.25lb N. Use 1 gallon per M.

I apply 0.25lb N weekly in the fall and use my hand held spreader. During weeks where I am due for my PGR app, I dissolve the Urea in my tank and do a foliar app.


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