# Round-Up Lawsuit, Cancer, Etc



## Alex1389 (May 23, 2018)

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/10/health/monsanto-johnson-trial-verdict/index.html

Haven't looked too much into the details of the lawsuit here, but thought I'd bring this up as a heads up. I know the link between glyphosate and cancer is still up for debate.

What kind of PPE is everyone using when applying glypho?


----------



## LawnNerd (Sep 2, 2017)

Socks and shoes. I also strive to NOT drink it or spray it in my eyes...


----------



## Budstl (Apr 19, 2017)

LawnNerd said:


> Socks and shoes. I also strive to NOT drink it or spray it in my eyes...


 Well what fun is this? Isn't @pennstater2005 the one last year spraying in flip flops?


----------



## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

From what I read there are risks, but it is very different in a farm environment. We spray once every few years, therefore our exposure is low. Farmers with round up resistance crops using large spray equipment have a lot more risk of exposure and a lot more opportunities. Some of the hired labor don't get access to proper ppe, don't wear it because it is inconvenient or the risk are not clearly understood.


----------



## pennstater2005 (Jul 17, 2017)

Something that caught my eye from the article........

*"But Litzenburg said glyphosate isn't the big problem -- Roundup is. He said the interaction between glyphosate and other ingredients in Roundup cause a "synergistic effect" that makes the product more carcinogenic."*

And @Budstl Sandals?! No :? Wait....yes to that and fire as well......


----------



## Budstl (Apr 19, 2017)

@pennstater2005 this should be put into tlf hall of fame.


----------



## pennstater2005 (Jul 17, 2017)

Budstl said:


> @pennstater2005 this should be put into tlf hall of fame.


 :lol: It worked terribly. And my feet got really hot.


----------



## LawnNerd (Sep 2, 2017)

pennstater2005 said:


> Budstl said:
> 
> 
> > @pennstater2005 this should be put into tlf hall of fame.
> ...


I think lcn says to burn the weeds in the cracks. Not thw whole lawn...


----------



## Lawn_newbie (Jun 19, 2018)

This case is going to be the start of a class action the likes that big tobacco experienced.


----------



## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Lawn_newbie said:


> This case is going to be the start of a class action the likes that big tobacco experienced.


And it's going to possibly end with you and I no longer being able to get/use glyphosate.

I hardly ever use it, but there are times, and I would not want to have to give it up for that reason.


----------



## social port (Jun 19, 2017)

:lol: :lol:


----------



## Smokindog (Jun 20, 2018)

Yup, spot on.  These always end up with good useful products being banned and replaced with things that work 1/2 as well for twice the price 


Green said:


> Lawn_newbie said:
> 
> 
> > This case is going to be the start of a class action the likes that big tobacco experienced.
> ...


----------



## Cory (Aug 23, 2017)

Unfortunately this is the country we created. One where a jury's feelings supersed facts, evidence, and proof of any wrongdoing. This guy worked as a landscaper, so how many other chemicals has he used? Has he ever used MSMA? If it was because of the spills of roundup why was he not wearing PPE? Since he wasn't wearing PPE then part of the blame should also be put into the employer for allowing him to work without proper safety equipment.

My opinion, Monsanto has had its name drug through the mud for YEARS by so many different environmentalists groups that they never had a shot at winning this! The jurors awarded this case because of all the hate for Monsanto and because it's a pretty heart breaking situation of that family to go through. However there is ZERO evidence that his cancer was caused by roundup.

On 20/20 last night was a story about a guy that was sentenced to life for killing his wife. However there was absolutely zero ecidence to prove he did it. The situation seems like he did but there was no proof yet was convicted based on the feelings of the jurors assuming he did it.

Welcome to the guilty until proven innocent United States legal system.


----------



## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

That's all right (actually it isn't!)...I will eventually test for and get a commercial application license if I need to. That way I could have a very, very small side business someday if I wanted to.


----------



## gene_stl (Oct 29, 2017)

I know weed burning torches are totally stupid. But I love mine. Both of them. :lol:  :lol:


----------



## pennstater2005 (Jul 17, 2017)

gene_stl said:


> I know weed burning torches are totally stupid. But I love mine. Both of them. :lol:  :lol:


They are super fun! I borrowed mine from the neighbor. His kids were using it in a homemade forge melting metals into ingots. It works better for that :nod:


----------



## gene_stl (Oct 29, 2017)

There is a YouTube vid of a farm version which has a big bunch of heads fed by a big propane tank on spray type booms
I think they scorch the weeds before they plant instead of using roundup. Keep their organic rating I think.


----------



## pennstater2005 (Jul 17, 2017)

gene_stl said:


> There is a YouTube vid of a farm version which has a big bunch of heads fed by a big propane tank on spray type booms
> I think they scorch the weeds before they plant instead of using roundup. Keep their organic rating I think.


I've seen that. It's posted somewhere around here I think.


----------



## FRD135i (Oct 15, 2017)

For what it's worth, the guy said he used proper PPE but was completely covered with "ranger pro" on two separate occasions. One the hose blew off the truck and covered him and another where his backpack sprayer sprung a leak. Both times being saturated with the chemical. Don't use it for bath water.

I also agree with what some other people have stated one here. Yes, we might expose ourselves to glyphosate more than normal folks but until we can clean up all of the things that we ingest and actually put into our bodies it's a moot point, to an extent. When was the last time y'all looked into what vaccines have in them these days? We didn't get the same ones that are out today. There are bigger things to worry about is all. This is the plastic straw of the lawn community.


----------



## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)




----------



## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)

The only problem I see with weed-burning is that while it may be organic, it releases carbon into the atmosphere and so the politicians will have to enact a carbon tax, as this apparently saves the planet.

Regards

Kaptain "Waiting for the Canadian Governments Carbon Tax to kick in on fuel in my province" Zero


----------



## Suburban Jungle Life (Mar 1, 2018)

Is there a concern with applying herbicides/fungicides/chemicals to the grass and later burning it? Does it cause the chemicals to volatilize and then you breath it in while working? ex. you spray roundup to kill the lawn and then when it is brown, you burn it causing the glyphosate to become airborne.


----------



## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)

And of the topic of Roundup.....

http://www.fox32chicago.com/health/roundup-ingredient-found-in-cheerios-quaker-oats-and-other-cereals


----------



## dfw_pilot (Jan 28, 2017)

> . . . according to lab tests conducted by the left-leaning Environmental Working Group (EWG). . .


Even _if_ it's true, the parts per billion are still safe levels. Crossing the street, holding a mobile phone to our heads, or standing in the sunlight has risks, too, yet we continue to take them. That safe levels of necessary pesticides make it into our food supply seems way down the list of battles to fight.


----------



## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)

@dfw_pilot Yeah, we had a big debacle here in Canada about Monsanto's patented Roundup ready wheat quite some time ago. The wheat was engineered to withstand glyphosate, so you could kill all other plants and yet the wheat crop would not be harmed.

A farmer who's land was next to one that used the Monsanto seed, would save part of his harvest as seed for the following year. He was sued by Monsanto for having their patented seed that he did not buy and pay for. I don't remember what the end result was, but his land was invaded by pollination from the Monsanto crop and that brought up the issue. The big thing was that the engineered wheat could not be killed with glysphosate which pretty much made it an non-killable invasive species. Monsanto dropped the idea before receiving final approval from the USDA, so I guess we'll never know what would have happened.

The "Left-leaning" types, are exactly that, and these boxed cereal products loaded with sugar are far more dangerous to public health than the pesticides found in them. Then again, nobody claims that a little bit of cyanide is good for you (but I realize that almonds do contain a tiny amount). I don't know what the answer is, the ban on herbicides (for cosmetic use) for homeowners in my province leaves us with very expensive and yet ineffective choices. I sprayed the chelated iron offering I'm allowed to use and it's not even 5 weeks ago and the weeds are returning from their roots. I don't know how "environmentally friendly" spraying chelated metal solutions on my lawn is, but this is trailing off the subject of Roundup and so I should just drop that bit here.


----------



## Cory (Aug 23, 2017)

What else is in it at parts per billion? Such a stupid article! If you want to be healthy you shouldn't be eating any of that crap anyway, the amount of other garbage like refined sugars will kill you faster. Yet another scare tactic against Monsanto for those that already hate it.


----------



## randy (Jun 29, 2018)

There is a farm behind our house. I love the smell of 2,4-D and whatever chemicals they spray. Whenever he's out there spraying I take the family out to breath it all in. JK But in all seriousness, the RoundUp lawsuit is nonsense. It will get appealed, the jury decision is just a demonstration that the general public lacks understanding of the scientific process and logic.

We need a lawsuit that shows the essential oils that the pseudo science health nuts have been pushing on our our wives to rub on the kids causes cancer too.


----------



## Cory (Aug 23, 2017)

This was posted on NC State's Turf Files yesterday https://ncturfbugs.wordpress.ncsu.edu/2018/08/22/how-do-you-know-the-truth/


----------



## dfw_pilot (Jan 28, 2017)

Great article.

The banning of DDT over similar fears, leading to worse problems like Zika, comes to mind, too.


----------



## jonthepain (May 5, 2018)

Cory, you beat me to it. I was just about to post that article.

By the way, Rick Brandenburg is a very smart guy with a great sense of humor. You should check out his Facebook page turf bugs & rock and roll.


----------



## ryeguy (Sep 28, 2017)

Grassfactor put out an excellent video on this topic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eY2DvqX4J9Y


----------



## jonthepain (May 5, 2018)

Excellent video.


----------



## ryeguy (Sep 28, 2017)

Looks like a second jury in a different case just ruled that it causes cancer.


----------



## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

ryeguy said:


> Looks like a second jury in a different case just ruled that it causes cancer.


For what it's worth, I *think* both cases were heard in San Francisco.


----------



## Dkrem (Mar 16, 2019)

Makes 18kgal, apply to 400 acres:


----------



## Rucraz2 (Apr 8, 2018)

https://amp.desmoinesregister.com/amp/3624978002


----------



## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

@Rucraz2, moved this to the general discussion forum. :thumbsup:


----------



## bullet (Mar 4, 2019)

Popular weed killer's alleged link to cancer stirs widespread concern

The EPA "_concludes that glyphosate is not likely to be carcinogenic to humans_".
I've worked in a laboratory for the past 7 years and I know how stupid the EPA can be. "Not likely", well that's certainly reassuring.

Even Bayer says it's safe. However, there's other studies according to several other articles, that's it's been linked to multiple cases already.


----------



## stotea (Jul 31, 2017)

I think we've discussed this a few times on this site now.

I'm summary, I think most people will agree that as long as people use proper PPE and don't drink or bathe in the stuff, you'll be fine. Obviously, the more frequently you interact with ANY herbicide, pesticide, etc., the more careful you'll want to be.


----------



## HoosierLawnGnome (Sep 28, 2017)

The misuse and overexposure to dihydrogen oxide results in thousands of deaths nationwide.


----------



## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

HoosierLawnGnome said:


> The misuse and overexposure to dihydrogen oxide results in thousands of deaths nationwide.


Scary stuff for sure. :thumbup:


----------



## TC2 (Sep 15, 2017)

HoosierLawnGnome said:


> The misuse and overexposure to dihydrogen oxide results in thousands of deaths nationwide.


Not to mention your food is full of the stuff and it accumulates in breast milk :shock:

Some people need to spend some time in California, where everything comes with a cancer health warning. This isn't even hyperbole. Walk into Starbucks or PF Chang's and you'll be warned that you're eating and drinking stuff which could cause cancer. Strangely enough, millions of people still do it but they're shocked that "glyphosate could cause cancer". GTFO.


----------



## bosox_5 (Jun 20, 2018)

$2 Billion! That kind of judgement will put the breaks on any chemical company bringing things to the market in the future.


----------



## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Chemical companies are not the real problem, it is the insurance companies not wanting to cover the manufacturers for fears of these large lawsuits.


----------



## FlowRider (Apr 7, 2019)

The decisions that come out of California juries are absolutely ridiculous. It has been that way for years. Failure to warn and failure to adequately label products has created an industry unto itself where the plaintiffs' trial lawyers lobby has written a law (Proposition 65 labels purporting to warn that certain chemicals in a product may cause cancer or reproductive harm) that allows for lawsuits to be filed against almost any company doing business in that State that end up in jury awards that are completely out of touch with reality.

Two billion dollars is 2,000 million dollars. Think about that. How is it even possible that a jury would award that much money to any person who claims they got cancer from using weed killer weekly, which in and of itself is ridiculous? California is a legal hell hole for business, and these awards will definitely be overturned on appeal shortly.

Remember, this is the same court system that said President Trump did not have the right to control immigration from countries that are known terrorist harboring countries, and even sponsor terrorism at the national governmental level....

Think about that - a court was actually taking the position that the Commander in Chief of the U.S. Armed Services cannot prevent people from coming into our country who are arriving here from known terrorist safe havens and training grounds.

Of course this was overturned once it was out of the Ninth Circuit, on appeal.... Same thing will have to happen here....


----------



## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

We keep The Lawn Forum a political free environment. These subjects spiral out of control really fast and don't help to build the community.


----------

