# Wifi or zigbee control valves



## shyam (3 mo ago)

Hi folks, Are there any wifi or zigbee based valves for in-ground sprinkler system?

I am looking for valves that communicate back to controller without a wire.


----------



## Factor (Oct 10, 2019)

shyam said:


> communicate back to controller without a wire.


What controller do you have that supports this?


----------



## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Factor said:


> What controller do you have that supports this?


You likely can talk to Rachio and/or OpenSprinkler using Home Assistant.

OP: I dont know if there is something out there for this. You might need to build it using a relay. Keep in mind that you will need a power source for both the solenoid and the zigbee/zwave/matter/thread device.


----------



## Wile (Sep 17, 2020)

I was just thinking about this the other day when I saw you can use a Shelly Relay to run sprinklers with HA. I'm not to satisfied with my Wyze Sprinkler controller and was thinking it would be nice to have something more open source control it with the help of a PWS.


----------



## shyam (3 mo ago)

Factor said:


> What controller do you have that supports this?


Good question factor. I am in the process of planning my first sprinkler system and thought why we still don’t have wireless valves. Did not think about controller. You are right, I don’t know if there are wireless controllers in the market as well.


----------



## shyam (3 mo ago)

g-man said:


> You likely can talk to Rachio and/or OpenSprinkler using Home Assistant.
> 
> OP: I dont know if there is something out there for this. You might need to build it using a relay. Keep in mind that you will need a power source for both the solenoid and the zigbee/zwave/matter/thread device.


 Thank you. I will look into this.


----------



## Factor (Oct 10, 2019)

g-man said:


> Rachio and/or OpenSprinkler using Home Assistant.


Rain Machine as well. Although you cant really buy a rain machine currently

I have had both Rain Machine and Rachio connected to HA.


shyam said:


> why we still don’t have wireless valves.


In general its the Distance. Zigbee or wifi wont go for miles. They would need to use Lora. Which in some large cases wont make either.
Plus copper would be cheaper and require less infrastructure.


----------



## shyam (3 mo ago)

Factor said:


> Rain Machine as well. Although you cant really buy a rain machine currently
> 
> I have had both Rain Machine and Rachio connected to HA.
> 
> ...


My use case is a DIY home sprinkler system. I may be naive in my thinking because I am new to this but I feel like wireless valve will be easier to install and maintain for a DIYer. It can potentially eliminate manifolds and makes it very easy to add new zones or change existing zones by tapping into the main sprinkler line wherever you want without needing a wire all the way from the controller. It will be easy to boost wifi to cover my whole property Lora will work very well as well.


----------



## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

shyam said:


> My use case is a DIY home sprinkler system. I may be naive in my thinking because I am new to this but I feel like wireless valve will be easier to install and maintain for a DIYer. It can potentially eliminate manifolds and makes it very easy to add new zones or change existing zones by tapping into the main sprinkler line wherever you want without needing a wire all the way from the controller. It will be easy to boost wifi to cover my whole property Lora will work very well as well.


Your main problem is likely power. When the zone is on, it is using the 24V from the wire to keep the zone open. Plus you will need power to keep the signal to the controller. I would hate to have something that I need to go find to replace the battery once a month. Maybe a solar panel in the lid of the valve box can charge a battery. But all of this starts to get expensive vs a wire.


----------



## Factor (Oct 10, 2019)

shyam said:


> DIY home sprinkler system


You have to follow the money and profits. There is barely any interest in electronic controllers. Rachio is the only one with any traction in the market. RainMachine is likely going out of business soon. The golf courses, winery's and nurseries are all massive in size.
Corporations are not interested in you doing DIY. They are interested in million dollar golf course, nursery, and winery deals.



g-man said:


> Your main problem is likely power.


Totally true.

If you plan ahead and map it all out. You will put it in the ground and hardly ever touch it. Some things work just fine with out over teching them.


----------



## dksmc (8 mo ago)

g-man said:


> Your main problem is likely power.


This was my first thought. I can tell you WiFi is going to destroy battery life especially if it is running all the time waiting for a message.


----------



## shyam (3 mo ago)

g-man said:


> Your main problem is likely power. When the zone is on, it is using the 24V from the wire to keep the zone open. Plus you will need power to keep the signal to the controller. I would hate to have something that I need to go find to replace the battery once a month. Maybe a solar panel in the lid of the valve box can charge a battery. But all of this starts to get expensive vs a wire.


Makes sense. Didn’t realize power is needed to keep the valve open.


----------



## shyam (3 mo ago)

Factor said:


> You have to follow the money and profits. There is barely any interest in electronic controllers. Rachio is the only one with any traction in the market. RainMachine is likely going out of business soon. The golf courses, winery's and nurseries are all massive in size.
> Corporations are not interested in you doing DIY. They are interested in million dollar golf course, nursery, and winery deals.
> 
> 
> ...


Lol. I understand no one is interested in my DIY . Just wish things can be easier. Thanks for all your comments.


----------



## MasterMech (Sep 24, 2017)

If you are planning this from scratch, I wouldn't start with wireless valves. Laying sprinkler wire is a piece of cake if you are already trenching for new zones. Rain Bird has some battery powered controllers that can be mounted on or near the valve. Wireless, especially WiFi, isn't all that reliable, especially at massive scale. Zigbee is great but is likely to be replaced with Thread in the next 5-10 years. WiFi isn't great for multiple battery powered devices as you'll be running around replacing batteries more than you'd like.

Your idea to locate the valves closer to the zones is valid though. And wiring back to a central controller doesn't have to be complicated. The cable can be direct buried, or you can lay conduit in your trenches. You can locate single valves, or small groups of valves anywhere you like, and even include a couple yard hydrants on your mainline for hand watering if that's something you'd use.

I have, and recommend, the Rachio controller. It can be setup as simple, or as complex, as you'd like, and hands down has the most bells/whistles should you want to go down the rabbit hole of ultra-efficient watering.


----------



## shyam (3 mo ago)

Wow this forum is amazing. Thank you for the engagement in the discussion.


I am perhaps overthinking.

@MasterMech I completely agree with you that if I plan out my whole lawn and zones properly I will have to just lay the wire once. I was not sure how reliable these wires are and how often they run into issues. This combined with ease of adding new zones got me thinking about wireless.

yeah direct burial should work but just out of curiosity … one advantage of putting wire in conduit is that we can pull new wire through it, correct? Do people do it? Is it easy?


----------



## MasterMech (Sep 24, 2017)

shyam said:


> Wow this forum is amazing. Thank you for the engagement in the discussion.
> 
> 
> I am perhaps overthinking.
> ...


People do all kinds of nutty things in the pursuit of awesome grass.... 

Most of the time, the wires are direct buried as the wire is designed for it and conduit is an added cost. You can lay individual pairs out to each valve, or if using small groups of say, 3-4 valves, you can buy sprinkler cable that carries color-coded conductors in a durable outer jacket. Even if you need to add a zone a year after your system is installed, you can still add wire to the system. It's not like you must follow the existing wiring back to the controller. Pick the most efficient path and just bury it deep enough it won't get damaged by an aerator. 

My experience has been that wiring issues are normally at either end of the wire rather than in the buried sections.


----------



## hokiev (4 mo ago)

shyam said:


> Hi folks, Are there any wifi or zigbee based valves for in-ground sprinkler system?
> 
> I am looking for valves that communicate back to controller without a wire.


Have you looked at:

www.irrigreen.com


----------



## JMCretella (Aug 4, 2020)

shyam said:


> Hi folks, Are there any wifi or zigbee based valves for in-ground sprinkler system?
> 
> I am looking for valves that communicate back to controller without a wire.





shyam said:


> Hi folks, Are there any wifi or zigbee based valves for in-ground sprinkler system?
> 
> I am looking for valves that communicate back to controller without a wire.


What data would you be be able to obtain with a wireless valve? The valve is binary, it’s either open or closed. There is no information that I can think of to communicate back to the controller.
The control wire coming from the controller is what provides voltage to the solenoid to open the valve. 
If you have a smart controller such as Rachio, the controller is what communicates with data from the cloud to know when you grass needs water. Or if it’s too windy, wet or cold to run the sprinkler. Then Rachio uses algorithms to determine if it should open or close the valve. 
bottom line is that even if you had a wireless communication device at the solenoid, you would still need a control wire going to the solenoid to open and close it. so there is no advantage, I can think of, to have a wireless communication device at the valve.


----------



## davegravy (Jul 25, 2019)

As already mentioned valves require a fair bit of current through the magnetic coil to keep the solenoid open and the water flowing. This would kill any battery very quickly. A natural benefit of this valve design is if the power goes out the valve automatically shuts off and doesn't waste water.

In principle it should be possible to design a latching valve which only needs a brief current pulse to switch the valve state and hence is friendly to battery operation.This would risk wasting water in the case your battery or wiring fails, but could be mitigated with low battery detection and some controller smarts. With such a valve you could have the controller inside the box (in a water-tight enclosure) with a battery and wireless radio for a fully wireless solution. As in, no wires going to/from the valve box, which is presumably the goal.

I'm not aware of anyone that makes a latching valve however, so that's the biggest obstacles to this concept IMO. Also most people are digging the lawn up to run tubing to the valve box so it's not generally much extra effort to also bury wires at the same time. I don't see a lot of market demand for this.


----------



## MasterMech (Sep 24, 2017)

davegravy said:


> As already mentioned valves require a fair bit of current through the magnetic coil to keep the solenoid open and the water flowing. This would kill any battery very quickly. A natural benefit of this valve design is if the power goes out the valve automatically shuts off and doesn't waste water.
> 
> In principle it should be possible to design a latching valve which only needs a brief current pulse to switch the valve state and hence is friendly to battery operation.This would risk wasting water in the case your battery or wiring fails, but could be mitigated with low battery detection and some controller smarts. With such a valve you could have the controller inside the box (in a water-tight enclosure) with a battery and wireless radio for a fully wireless solution. As in, no wires going to/from the valve box, which is presumably the goal.
> 
> I'm not aware of anyone that makes a latching valve however, so that's the biggest obstacles to this concept IMO. Also most people are digging the lawn up to run tubing to the valve box so it's not generally much extra effort to also bury wires at the same time. I don't see a lot of market demand for this.


I have a single impact rotor head that I run with an Eve Aqua. It's a motorized ball valve powered by AA's. I ran it all season and it's at 50% battery now. I'm pretty impressed by that actually. Thread/Bluetooth for the communication, no problem for me as I have a pretty good Thread network happening already and of course my spigots are all close to the house. 

I agree 200% though, with running traditional valves if you can and do the smarts in the controller.


----------

