# Hey Lawn Forum! (Introduction and Pics)



## jessehurlburt (Oct 18, 2017)

Hey Everyone!

I am the newest noob and am so glad I found these forums. I bought a house last spring and after getting the basics done to get us set up, I realized how pathetic my lawn was and quickly became obsessed with what I need to do to get to a better place. Here are some pictures of the lawn from last summer. :blush:







So last year at this time, before learning the first thing about turf grasses, decided I needed to start by filling in the completely bare spots. Grass began growing and I was already patting myself on the back about the amazing green thumb I had. Then temperatures began dropping in the fall and I was wondering why the rest of my lawn appeared to be dying without realizing it was mostly all crabgrass!  



So this past spring, I aerating and overseeded the front. I got a lot of weeds, but it has improved and is looking better this fall. 


On Labor day I aerated the back, put down starter fert and milo and had decent results. Still a lot of weeds. 


Now I am trying to figure out what the next order of business is for the spring. We are already getting frosts here in Central CT, so my focus has shifted to getting the lawnmower maintenance done, getting the snowblower ready to go and general cleanup of the yard. I have learned about Tenacity in the last few weeks and it sounds like a miracle molecule- being able to seed and prevent crabgrass at the same time?! I'm thinking in the spring I will power rake the areas of dead crabgrass, lay some seed and then try the Scotts Weed Preventer for New Grass. I will most likely overseed in the fall as well with the same approach. Is this a good approach? I know fall is best to seed, but I keep getting hung up on using a Pre-Em in the spring, then leaving huge swaths of the lawn bare until fall. What do you guys think about using Tenacity while overseeding?

Thanks!
Jesse


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## pennstater2005 (Jul 17, 2017)

I think the big question would be, do you want to attempt an overseed or just kill it all next year and start fresh? If you have mostly crabgrass and a general mish-mash of broadleaf weeds and weed grass that might be a good option. I would let grow what grows in the spring and plan for a fall renovation. But, this is coming from a guy who had a failed over seed 

Welcome to the forum :thumbup:


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## Virginiagal (Apr 24, 2017)

You can use Tenacity for a spring overseeding but the pre-emergent protection only lasts about a month. You are limited in how much Tenacity you can use in a year; you can't keep using it month after month. One possibility is to use Tenacity at seeding and then a regular pre-emergent later when it's safe (read the directions on the pre-emergent for when it can be used on new grass). If you think you might also seed in the fall, be careful to use an amount that will be "worn off" by seeding time. If it were me, I would skip seeding in the spring. The roots will still be small when summer heat arrives.


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## jessehurlburt (Oct 18, 2017)

Thanks for your replies. 

I am fascinated by the renovation threads but I don't think that is in the cards at the moment. Between the expense and time commitment, it is too much for me. I am OK with incremental progress each year and OK with different grass types. Not that I planned on using Tenacity all season, but can you give more detail on that comment about not using it continuously? Are their laws against continued use, or does it lose effectiveness over time? Curious..

Here is another photo from the end of September giving a fuller shot of my back lawn. I know this is still a joke compared to some of the lawns on here, but my expectations are lower, (LOL) and I did come a long way from where I was a year ago.. Incremental progress is all I am after..

I appreciate your thoughts and I'm loving scouring the forum for new info!


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

A full renovation is not always needed. From the progress you made, it looks in decent shape. There is some clover spots and you still have time to treat them with CCO (weed b Gon for clove).

I'm with virginagal, I would avoid a spring seeding (hard to make it survive). I would apply a prem to get the weeds undercounted and seed in August. Get your soil tested in April to address any issues. Develop a way to get ~1in of water a week.

Regarding tenacity, the label has a annual max application. The vendor places them for environmental reason, ease label approval for home owner use or to avoid the weeds developing resistance to it. I don't know the actual reason for it, but I do stick to it. It is a great product and helps but it could hurt your lawn.


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## ericgautier (Apr 22, 2017)

Jesse, Welcome to the forum! :wave:

Here's what I would do:

1) Apply a pre-emergent now.
2) You are probably too late now to start the Fall Nitrogen Blitz (cool season grasses only), but see if you can do the "The end of the season (aka winterizing)" app.
3) Spring - apply a pre-emergent when the forsythia plant starts to bloom in your area.
4) Transition into feeding the lawn organically. You might be able to get http://www.baystatefertilizer.com/ by you. Or use Milorganite.
5) Tackle the weeds using basic weed killers. IE - http://www.homedepot.com/p/Ortho-Weed-B-Gon-1-Gal-Plus-Crabgrass-Control-Ready-to-Use-043451005/206605396 this should get rid of 80% of the weeds. The last 20% will need specialty herbicides but we can help when it gets to that point.

Here's an example that really shows what happens when you do the basics...



> "I would have posted this under the Reno topic, but it's not a reno. It's not even an overseed. After finding this site last fall, all I did over the last 6 months was: hand pull as much crabgrass as I could find; apply Oceangro; apply 2,4D; start cutting at the highest mower setting. The random Northeast mix of grasses did the rest all by itself.
> 
> I know this lawn is not up to the elite KBG standards you guys hold, and I'll eventually do a full reno, but I already have the best looking front lawn on the block with these few simple steps."
> 
> ...


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## Virginiagal (Apr 24, 2017)

From the Tenacity instructions for new seedings:
"Apply Tenacity at 5-8 fl. oz. per acre in at least 30 gallons of water per acre prior to seeding or post seeding of tolerant turfgrass species listed on this label, except fine fescue....Avoid spraying on newly germinated turfgrass plants. Wait until the newly germinated turf has been mowed two times or four weeks after emergence (whichever is longer) before making a postemergent application.
For postemergent application:
"Apply Tenacity at 4-8 fl. oz. per acre in at least 30 gallons of water per acre. Apply with a NIS type surfactant. A repeat application at two to three weeks may be required for adequate weed control."

The annual limit is 16 oz. per acre per year. Two applications at 8 oz rate hits the limit. Four applications at 4 oz rate hits the limit. So if you use up your limit in the spring, you can't use it in the fall. It's good stuff. But you have to be choosy about when best to use it.


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## jessehurlburt (Oct 18, 2017)

Thanks All.

@g-man, it's not late to kill the clover? Days have been in the upper 60s -70s and nights have been as low as 30 recently..

@ericgautier your lawn looks pretty awesome to me and I would be super pleased with those results, personally. The Fall Pre-Em app is for Poa Annua? Is that right?

@virginagal- thanks for the info on Tenacity- a little goes a long way I guess!


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## ericgautier (Apr 22, 2017)

jessehurlburt said:


> Thanks All.
> @ericgautier your lawn looks pretty awesome to me and I would be super pleased with those results, personally. The Fall Pre-Em app is for Poa Annua? Is that right?


Thanks, but that is not my lawn. Just showing an example of what can happen with just a few steps. :thumbup:

Here's my lawn journal if you want to check it out.

Yes, Fall Pre-Em can help with Poa Annua.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

I would not worry about fall PreM, you are too late for it in your weather/region.

Clove is a perennial and you want to kill it so it doesnt take over the yard. Now it is a good time to kill it.


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## jessehurlburt (Oct 18, 2017)

G-man- thanks so much. The clover is widespread. On the CCO.


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## social port (Jun 19, 2017)

One thing that I will add: If and when you do get around to using Scott's' starter fertilizer with mesotrione, be as attentive as you can to make an even application. Recently, I found that I dropped a little too much in areas where I had to stop walking to change directions. In some of these cases, the grass ended up getting damaged. Some of the sprouts recovered, while others did not.


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