# Weed Identification in Bermuda



## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

Hi,
I am new here and looking forward to getting some good input from everyone. I have celebration bermuda and need help identifying these weeds that are present. I applied a pre-emergent in the fall but these weeds are getting worse every year this time of year. I believe picture number 3 is POA annua. Thanks for your help.


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## UltimateLawn (Sep 25, 2020)

I am certainly not an expert in weed identification, but seeing that you are also in TX, I've gone to the Texas A&M weed identification page and typically have been able to identify them specifically.

https://aggieturf.tamu.edu/turfgrass-weeds/


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

@saxman2u The larger question is why did your pre-emergent application not work that well. When did you apply? What did you apply? What rate did you apply? Did you water it in with at least 1 inch of rain or irrigation?

In Austin you should be applying pre-emergent NOW and again in about 90 days to prevent the same thing from happening in the Summer and Fall. If it was me, I would be applying two different pre-emergent modes of action.

With 2500sq ft you can get a bag of prodiamine or dithiopyr and combine it with Isoxaben(Gallery) for pretty cheap($30-40). If you want to go the spray route then it would be much cheaper. You can find others sharing small amounts in the Marketplace section of this forum. Your cost would be reduced to less than $5 per application. Here are some resources as well.

https://cdn-ext.agnet.tamu.edu/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/ESC-042-bermudagrass-lawn-management-calendar.pdf

https://aggieturf.tamu.edu/wp-content/uploads/Preemergence-Herbicide-Guide-4.pdf


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Broadleaf, poa, maybe Italian ryegrass for the last photo


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## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

Thanks for the responses. I try not to use chemicals with all of our dogs, we have 7, but it seems like every year this is getting worse. I put down a light Barricade (Prodiamine) application in the fall but maybe need to go heavier next time around.

My question about the pre-emergent, you stated "now" like in February and also in 3 months. The label on Barricade says to only apply two times a year. If I do the fall, February, and May, that is 3 times a year. Suggestions on this?

This is pic from a few years ago.


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## Redtwin (Feb 9, 2019)

You can do a half-rate of the label and apply every 3 months. Some refer to it as split apps. I've had mixed results doing splits but will probably try it again this season.


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## crstude (Jun 21, 2019)

2nd pic looks like wild carrot. Only reason to say that is I've pulled plenty out this year myself. That's been the one I've battled most this year with a small bit of poa annua amd some rescuegrass.


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## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

In central Texas, is it better to do a fall and spring application, two times a year? or do a fall, February, and then spring application, 3 times a year?


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

@saxman2u Beautiful backyard!!
If you wanted to limit your exposure of chemical to the dogs then remove them from the backyard and put your pre-emergent down and water very good into the soil. Once it is dry the dogs are good to go back on the grass (12-24 hours).

From the label: Prodiamine 65 WDG may be applied as a single application or in sequential applications to control weeds germinating throughout the year. *All applications should be made before target weeds germinate*.

From the labelrodiamine 65 WDG may be applied more than once a year as long as the total amount applied is not greater than the maximum application rate per calendar year for the turf species. *All applications must be made before weed seeds germinate.*

In Austin I would recommend February 15th- March 1st and Sept 1-15. With your size yard and how nice it is I would apply the prodiamine and buy a bag of Specticle G and apply at least two times a year. Go for two modes of action. The bag of Specticle G would last you 3+ years and 6+ applications. I saw bags at Siteone for just a tad over $100. If you did not want to spend that much I would buy a bag($25-30) of Isoxaben(Gallery) and put down with your prodiamine for broader weed coverage and effectiveness.


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## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

Hi,
Thank you for all the help.

I have an account at siteone so i will take a look at the bag of Specticle G.

As for the Prodiamine, should I take the max dosage for a year and divide by 2? Or, should I go with a lighter dose?.


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

@saxman2u Prodiamine annual max rate is .83oz per 1000 sq. for bermuda. You can apply .415oz in the Fall and .415 oz in the Spring.

You can do the same thing with (Indaziflam) Specticle G or Specticle Flo if you are spraying. Half rate in Fall and Spring.

In our Texas heat I would never apply less than the max annual rate. The microbial action increases with the heat of the soil and breaks down the chemical pre emergent barrier as time goes on. That is why some complain of having weeds very late in the winter(now) or late Fall because the application just did not last long enough.

Here is a pretty good guide for Texas Lawns for pre-emergent:

https://aggieturf.tamu.edu/wp-content/uploads/Preemergence-Herbicide-Guide-4.pdf

PS. I personally use prodiamine, isoxaben, and simazine all in one tank spray. 
I am starting to add indaziflam (Specticle Flo)into my rotation because I think it is the best product on the market. I have also used dithyiopyr in the past. I have had great results using a 3 mode of action approach.


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## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

Hi,
Thanks for the information. This is good information to have.

Just to confirm, there is nothing wrong with using all three of the pre-emergent herbicdes together and use them at their max usage per their labels?

if you are starting to add Specticel FLo into your rotation, are you backing off on any of the Prodiamine, isoxaben, or simazine?


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

@saxman2u You can mix Prodiamine and Isoxaben at full rates with no issues. If you use Simazine as well it has lower rate for hybrid bermuda like celebration. I mix all three with a hybrid rate for Simazine.

Prodiame and dithiopyr: Inhibition of Microtubule Assembly
Isoxaben and Specticle flo(Indaziflam): Inhibition of Cellulose Synthesis
Simazine: Inhibition of photosynthesis

When I use Specticle Flo I will not use Isoxaben. I also would not use full rates of prodiame and dithiopyr together. That would be doubling down on one mode of action. I use Simazine because it is ultra cost effective for a large lawn.

I think a two mode of action approach at full yearly rates is more than sufficient. Isoxaben or Specticle Flo just gives you better broadleaf control than prodiamine will not give you alone.


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## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

Thank you for all the help. I have ordered some new items and have some reading to do! Will report back in the spring and let you know how it is all going.

-S


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## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

This is good information, thank you.

Ok, going to try and get this stuff down this weekend, i may be a little late but will try. Just need some clarification for your "two mode action" and "hybrid" approach. Can we stick to measurements for 1,000 sq ft. I want to use Prodiamine, Specticle Flo, and Simzine in a tank sprayer.

What amounts are needed per 1,000 sq ft if i am going to apply two times a year, one in fall and once in spring?

1. For the simazine, i want to stay at the lower rate, which is 1qt per acre or .75 oz per 1000 sq ft if I have a hybrid bermuda like celebration bermuda. please confirm
2. For prodiamine, .55 oz per 1,000 sq ft in the fall and .55 oz per 1,000 sq feet in the spring
3. For Specticle Flo, .12 oz per 1,000 sq ft in the fall and .12 oz per 1,000 sq ft in the spring

Let me know how these calculations look, i have about 3,000 sq ft lawn, is it best to convert to teaspoons?

Thanks for all of your help.


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

@saxman2u You should buy a digital food scale for measuring. Something like this:

https://www.amazon.com/GreaterGoods-Digital-Kitchen-Multifunction-Measures/dp/B01JTDG084/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=digital+food+scale&qid=1615267612&sr=8-5

Walmart may have a similiar scale.

Spring:
Simazine- yes apply at .*75 oz* per 1000 sq ft.
Prodiamine- Apply .*415 oz* per 1000 sq ft (max is .83 oz a year)
Specticle Flo-Apply *.21 *oz per 1000 sq ft
Label: The total amount of SPECTICLE FLO applied in a 12-month period must not exceed 18.5 fl oz per acre. SPECTICLE FLO can be applied in multiple seasons in a calendar year.
18.5/43.5 =.4253 max yearly rate per 1000

Fall:
Same as above around Sept 1-15 for Austin. An additional Simazine app could be applied in November.

Better to have digital scale and not convert to teaspoons. Make sure scale is dry oz for Prodiamine and Fl oz for Simazine and Specticle Flo. I think your timing is almost perfect but try to get down this week like you said. That is a great plan.


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## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

Thanks for all the help. I will get it down this week. I am also going to try some blindside for the current weeds that exist!

For the prodiamine, I am using Barricade 4 FL, shouldn't this be FL oz instead of dry oz like you mentioned above?

https://www.domyown.com/barricade-4fl-herbicide-p-3956.html


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## Redtwin (Feb 9, 2019)

Be careful with the Blindside around trees and shrubs.


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

saxman2u said:


> Thanks for all the help. I will get it down this week. I am also going to try some blindside for the current weeds that exist!
> 
> For the prodiamine, I am using Barricade 4 FL, shouldn't this be FL oz instead of dry oz like you mentioned above?
> 
> https://www.domyown.com/barricade-4fl-herbicide-p-3956.html


Yes, you are correct. Use your original calculations of .55 fl oz. Thought you were using the dry prodiamine.

I have not used Blindside but take @Redtwin s advice. Also you may want to start with a lower rate as well.


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## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

ok, got my new scale and got everything i need for my 2,400 sq ft. The yard is a mess but I am going to hold off on the blindside, seems too toxic from reading the label and everything. :0

For the specticle flo, barricade 4 FL, and the simazine that i am going to mix together, do i water in after 24 hours if no rain in the forecast?


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## BudaTx (Jul 15, 2020)

Yes, Take the max dose and divide by 2. Those 2 applications would put you at the annual limit. If you still had problems you could look into another pre-em with a different mode of action for a 3rd application.


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## saxman2u (Feb 1, 2021)

ok, thanks. let me know if what I need to do with my irrigation system once i have everything applied. so to be clear, once i am done with my tank spraying, do i water this stuff in more after 24 hours???


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## Kdaves12 (Aug 10, 2020)

WOW



saxman2u said:


> This is pic from a few years ago.


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## Darrell_KC (Mar 20, 2019)

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but while pic 3 does look like Poa, but pic 4 to me is textbook crabgrass. The plant looks like it and the fact you can see the dew/water is beaded up on it, that's my telltale. Crabgrass is water repellant, that's why it laughs at most herbicides. Liquid beads up and runs right off.

It's all killable. If this was me, and my lawn, I would use this. https://www.homedepot.com/p/Spectra...yL8xYidiIRNCUuN-6YoaAg9vEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

You can get it at Home Depot, and it's pretty cheap and works well. The reason I'd go with this, 1) It's a post emergent to start killing off the weeds that are already popped up now. 2) It contains dithopyr as a pre-emergent, to help stop weeds from coming up in the future. 3) It will kill crabgrass.

The big thing for this product, you must use it when the grass is wet. Either throw it on early in the morning (my preference) with dew on the ground, or after a rain when you don't have a threat for an immediate following rain. It's a red power/pellet mix, and it will cling to ANYTHING wet. It will coat your shoes, clothes, etc. Don't wear nice clothes when using this on wet grass. It does clean off easy and doesn't stain, but your pants/shoes will get messy from this.


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

saxman2u said:


> ok, thanks. let me know if what I need to do with my irrigation system once i have everything applied. so to be clear, once i am done with my tank spraying, do i water this stuff in more after 24 hours???


Once you get 1/2 inch of rain or irrigation you are good. It is in the soil and will be activated to prevent weeds.


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