# Sudden Onset Weeds



## lawnnewbie (Jul 18, 2017)

Hey everyone,

I just moved from a townhouse to a house with a yard so I'm learning my way around taking care of my lawn and I'm really enjoying it...for the most part.

In the areas I get a bit of shade, backyard and front lawn, I've got the grass to be a nice dark and rich green and it's growing very well. However, on the side of my house, it is in the sun the moment the sun rises and sets. I'm in Utah and we've hit 95-100 degree weather every day without any rain and this has been constant for weeks now.

About two weeks ago I hit my lawn with a Weed & Feed for clover and broad leaf. It killed off 90% of the clover in the front and back and was doing well. On the side, it killed around 75% of it so I was still fairly happy. The grass is a yellow green and refuses to grow. I've been doing deep watering every other day and testing the soil it has good water retention and is a clay soil.

I mowed the lawn three days ago and it looked great. However, I went out around 6pm yesterday and for some reason the entire area is covered with some kind of weed. Within the last 2-3 days, I've somehow been overrun with these things. There are huge patches of weeds all over and it's thick enough to see large green patches in the light green grass. I believe the seed may have come from secondary water.

I've heard that you should use weed killers as sparing as possible in the heat because the stress can kill the lawn, even if the killer says it won't. *One, is this true. Two, if not, can I use a weed and feed again already? And three, if not, how can I go about getting rid of these things?* Even though the grass was yellow/green on on side, it still looked fairly good.

I have mainly Kentucky Blue Grass. My goal is to get rid of the other types eventually that are patchy and have _only_ KBG.

Thanks!


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## Budstl (Apr 19, 2017)

Most folks here would recommend not using weed and feed products. You want to use pre emergents in early spring and in late summer or early fall if you aren't seeding. Then whatever weeds pop up, you can use a post emergent spray when the temps are under 85 degrees or whatever the lable says. I would wait until the temps to break before spraying. Feel free to post some pics of the weeds you have on here.


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## Fronta1 (Jul 11, 2017)

You may have hurt the grass fertilizing so close to hot temps. At this point, wait until the heat wave recedes and then you can apply post emergent.


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## Colonel K0rn (Jul 4, 2017)

lawnnewbie said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> I just moved from a townhouse to a house with a yard so I'm learning my way around taking care of my lawn and I'm really enjoying it...for the most part.


Welcome to the forum, and glad to see that you made a concise first post. Bring on some pictures of said weeds, and we'll help you come up with a plan to eradicate said weeds!


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## lawnnewbie (Jul 18, 2017)

Hey everyone. Thanks for the great replies already. I grabbed some pics for you all when I got home. Seems some of these have bounced into the front lawn too.

For the weed and feed, I spot treated so I didn't hit the entire lawn but I'll switch to pre and post instead. I do want to oversees this fall. How long should o give in between pre/post immergents and seeding?

Here are the weeds.


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## Colonel K0rn (Jul 4, 2017)

lawnnewbie said:


> Hey everyone. Thanks for the great replies already. I grabbed some pics for you all when I got home. Seems some of these have bounced into the front lawn too.
> 
> For the weed and feed, I spot treated so I didn't hit the entire lawn but I'll switch to pre and post instead. I do want to oversees this fall. How long should o give in between pre/post immergents and seeding?
> 
> Here are the weeds.


Based on your first picture, it's prostrate spurge; I couldn't tell if the other pictures were the same plant, since the resolution was pretty low. They are pretty prolific seed spreaders, if you don't get them out before they can drop seeds, they'll spread pretty quickly. If you're feeling frisky, you can hand weed them, they have a long tap root, and are easy to pull when the soil is moist. You can treat spray with 2, 4-D or Dicamba, which can be found in most stuff in big box stores. Depending on the size of your yard, this could be an economical way to take care of the post-emergent stuff, but I would recommend putting down a pre-e at this time. Usually, you'll need to wait 60 days before overseeding, but I'd double-check the label before you sprayed.


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## Fronta1 (Jul 11, 2017)

To my knowledge pre emergent prevent any germination for anywhere from 3 to 8 mos depending on the product and amount used. Off top of my head I think most selective post emergent, like the ones colonel suggested, are 3 or 4 weeks, while non selective, like glyphosate, are just a few days.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Good Id colonel k0rn.

Welcome to the site and to owning a lawn. Weed and feed products are made as a compromise two different things in an easy to apply format. The compromise is they key bad thing about them. For example: it is best not to fertilize (promote growth) when it is too hot and the grass wants to survive. The other compromise is the herbicide is a weak quantity in granular form.

So I recommend going to homedepot, lowes, menards, etc and getting weed b gon plus crabgrass control concentrate (~$10) or a similar 4 way weed control product in liquid. Also get a small 1 gallon sprayer to mix and spray the weeds. Follow the label instructions to mix and spot treat those weeds. Mixing is very easy and will save you a ton of money. You could buy the ready mixed products too, but you end up paying for water.

One last thing, do not spray the lawn if temps are above 85F. The products limit the amount of damage the cause to the lawn but at higher temps they do cause damage.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

I forgot something. These weeds did not came with the water. They've been there since last year.

A prem in early spring provides a blanket protection to stop the seeds from growing.


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## lawnnewbie (Jul 18, 2017)

Thanks for the additional replies. Looks like I've got some work to do tonight. I'll go out and yank as many by the root as I can stand doing and then I'll toss down a post emergent because I really want to overseed this fall so I'll watch the time between. I was thinking around late Sept. early Oct. to overseed. Is that a good time? It's a lot cooler here by then as long as I don't wait till then end of October, it's getting pretty chilly by then.

For the temps to get under 85, I'll have to go out and spray around 8:30pm or so. Will the product still work as the night will start to bring about morning dew. It's there every morning but I don't know what time it start to show up. I figure it would have quite a few hours on the weeds before it hits that.

I was thinking of the 2, 4-D but all I've seen in our Lowe's and Home Depot is that as an ingredient in the weed killers, I can't seem to find just 2, 4-D alone.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

For overseed I would recommend mid august for my area (indianapolis). I think you will be a bit colder than me, so I would think a week or so before. The idea is to give the new grass enough time to develop roots before winter.

The temps for herbicide area around the high temp for the day. Once the high temps drop below 85F then it is ok to apply. You could apply it at any time of the day (am, pm, midnight) as long as the next days high temp are not above 85F. It normally takes 3-4 hrs for it to be rain proof, so dew is not a concern. Please take the time to read the entire label of the product you buy since it provides the details that are needed.

A 4 way will include 2, 4-D and it is what I use. You get to buy one thing that could control multiple weeds. No need to find/buy a only 2, 4-D. If you really want to buy it, you will need to go to a feed store (Tracktor Supply, Rural King, etc)


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## lawnnewbie (Jul 18, 2017)

Okay, this is good to know. It looks like the stores around me are recommending Weed-B-Gone.

We haven't had a day below 90 for over a month now and according to weather reports, it's not coming soon.

I'll go buy some concentrate, now with a bag, the spray the infected areas and then cross my fingers for at least an overcast day tomorrow.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Spraying wbg above 85f high temp is like spraying round up. Let the weed be until it cools down or hand pull them. If you have kids, make it a game who could collect more.


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## lawnnewbie (Jul 18, 2017)

Okay, so this Weed B Gone I got said I can spray up to temps to 90 degrees. I mowed my lawn today and bagged it all so hopefully that catches the bulk of the seeds before they are able to drop. I did a few spots to test it and see how it does in the higher temp. This one said 2.5oz per gallon of water so I'll let you know how it does.

I appreciate all the help with this.


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## Fronta1 (Jul 11, 2017)

I don't know this for sure, but I'm guessing the 90 degree thing is a guideline so people don't spray when grass is dormant, not because the product won't work at that temperature. If your grass is still growing because you've been keeping it irrigated, it should work just fine.


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## Virginiagal (Apr 24, 2017)

There is a temperature limit because the stuff volatizes at higher temperatures. If it volatizes it can drift to stuff you don't want to kill. Always follow instructions on herbicide labels. That includes wearing whatever protective gear it says to wear, when you can seed after spraying or spray after seeding, when pets and children can come back in the yard, etc.


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## lawnnewbie (Jul 18, 2017)

This is great. I've followed all directions and I'm cautious so I had my kids and dogs inside, even had the neighbors take their dogs inside, just in case. Then I didn't have to spray the backyard, the only place the kids play so that helped there too. It said to keep kids and pets off until dry but I told them not to walk on it until I water next. That way it's dried, waterproofed, and excess rinsed.

My front yard is growing just fine. It's part shade so I'm not worried about that at all. I'm worried a bit more about the sun side and that's also where the weeds are growing the most. I hit the big patch of weeds as the test and a few spot areas also. This grass is already green yellow from the heat so if it has some issues, I'd imagine it bounces back when it cools down.

The soil was still fairly moist an inch down but the topmost layer is a bit dry. I'll be doing another deep watering tomorrow morning.

As for seeding. It said to wait four weeks so it gives me just the right amount. If a few weeds pop back up during this time, I'll just weed them by hand.

How long does it usually take to see results from this stuff? I may have applied it a bit too light mainly because I watched a LawnDaddy video before I did this and he had a big dead spot in his lawn and he mentioned it was from him spraying so I may have been a bit overly cautious. If I was and it does nothing, can I spray again even though it says a month between sprays and no more than 2x per year?


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## Colonel K0rn (Jul 4, 2017)

lawnnewbie said:


> How long does it usually take to see results from this stuff? I may have applied it a bit too light mainly because I watched a LawnDaddy video before I did this and he had a big dead spot in his lawn and he mentioned it was from him spraying so I may have been a bit overly cautious. If I was and it does nothing, can I spray again even though it says a month between sprays and no more than 2x per year?


You'll notice results within a few days. I sprayed glyphosate (Roundup)on the perimeter of my fence line 10 days ago where my neighbor has a bad infestation of green kyllinga, which is a pretty hard weed to kill. I checked on it yesterday, and it's dead. It took about 4 days to notice some significant yellowing. With broadleaf weeds, like most of what you have, they seem to take the herbicide much faster, and I'd suspect you'd see results within 3 days. Since you mowed, you might not even notice them come back. Another tip is that if I see broadleaf weeds in an area that I haven't treated, I usually spray first, wait for death, then mow. That way the weeds get foliar contact with the herbicide. If you mow, it reduces that much surface, and you might not get the desired results as quickly.


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## lawnnewbie (Jul 18, 2017)

That would make sense. These weeds have leaves from the top clear down to the base and I could see the droplets on them so I'm sure I got them good, plus, the grass on that section is somewhat dormant so mowing, for the most part, just chopped off the tops of weeds which where showing the seeds. Hopefully it's going to get them just fine.

I'll keep an eye out and if this spot test starts to yellow, but the grass doesn't change, I'm going to hit a few of the other spots then I'll carefully watch the rest. If it's just a few areas, hand pulling is an option like in the front yard but on this side, I've never seen weeds move so quickly. But then, first lawn.


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## Fronta1 (Jul 11, 2017)

With the selective post emergent that your using it may take a while. And if you followed the instructions, it's difficult to spray too much because I believe out asks you to spray 1 gal per 400 sq ft or something, which means you have to walk REALLY slowly to use up the entire gallon on that much space.

I just sprayed some last week and had to do another app yesterday because I didn't get a compete kill. So IMO you don't have to wait that long to reapply but you do have to wait the 4 weeks before seeding.


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## lawnnewbie (Jul 18, 2017)

Good to know. I figured I applied pretty light, but still, there is already some browning around the leaves of a few areas. I'll give it a bit more time and see how much browning we get and if it actually stops them from spreading. I won't be seeding for awhile so as long as I get good control, I think I'll be good.


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