# Poa Trivialis!!!!



## jvf1095 (Aug 8, 2019)

Hello & thanks for having me as a member. Here's my issue...
My front lawn is infested with Poa Trivialis. At this point it's dormant. 
I read that the best time to spray to kill it is in the Spring, but I didn't know I had Triv till now. Also, I don't have Velocity which I
understand will kill it if sprayed in the spring without killing my Tall Fescue. What I'm thinking is this. I want to rake all the Triv out now, & spray the area with Tenacity to weaken what might be left, avoiding Round up. Then put down Dimension to kill any unwanted Poa or other weed seed. I'm not going to seed the area in the fall, just leave it bare & seed in the Spring. This way, if the Triv starts to grow back in those areas in the Spring, I can spray it with Round Up & just kill the Triv without killing my Tall Fescue because I'll know where the Triv was & I'll know it's Triv that's growing back. Then I'll top dress with clean top soil & seed at the right time with Tall Fescue after the growing Triv is dead. Does this sound like a good approach, or can you please advise me otherwise?
Thanks!!!...Joe


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Welcome to TLF

1) there is no way to kill POA t if it is dormant. 
2) velocity is not the best tool. Many have used it and killed their fescue or did not killed the POA t.
3) tenacity will make it go dormant again
4) round up is the way. I hit mine in spring at least twice with round up 10 days apart and it survived. I will let that sit in. Twice with round up and one survived, the other died.
5) dimension will not kill poa. It prevent seeds from developing.
6) POA t is very noticeable in early spring. No need to leave bare areas.

POA t is a multi year approach. You kill most of it with less returning.

Killing it in fall is hard mainly because it is dormant. By the time it wakes up, winter is here. Hitting it in spring is best because you can see it. It just leaves ugly dead spots.


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## john5246 (Jul 21, 2019)

So you light it up with some tenacity and then paint it with round up? (depending on how much there is)


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Yes. You can do that. In the spring I could tell the POA t because it so light green and grows slightly faster, so I did not use tenacity.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

11 apr



Edit:
This POA t was in the front lawn. I hit it with round up twice and it worked. Now you can't see the damaged spot. The kbg filled in.

3ft from the cable boxes and 6inches towards the house.


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## jvf1095 (Aug 8, 2019)

Lots of good advice here. Want to make sure I understand this. Looks like Round Up is the way to go, but not now, in the Spring. I do want to rake it out now because bare it will still look better than this matted mess. I don't mind leaving it bare, because in the spring, I can see exactly where it was when it comes back. because it's not just in one area. (It's "scattered" & as such, I didn't recognize it in the spring, because I thought it was just Fescue that was a lighter shade). So if I leave it bare, I'm won't be shot-gunning my lawn & can hopefully be as specific as possible in those areas with the Round Up. I want to put down Dimension because I have Poa Annua in back. (I know the difference now). With the Tenacity, I wanted to spray the entire front lawn. (Normal dosages, not "nuke" dosage). Figuring if anything turns white here & there in a Tall Fescue lawn, I probably don't want it anyway. Any more thoughts on this guys? THANKS!!!


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## ryeguy (Sep 28, 2017)

Has anyone tried digging it up? It's pretty shallow rooted so I'm wondering if there's a chance it could work.


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## TreyDoc (Aug 16, 2018)

Raking can leave stolons, which turns into new plants. G-Man was the one who let me know to start in spring before my current reno and I'm glad I started then. I personally didn't mind the spots, neighbors thought we had gotten a couple dogs.


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## Babameca (Jul 29, 2019)

@g-man Best way to identify Triv vs anua? For most amateurs like me they kind of look the same.


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## Kissfromnick (Mar 25, 2019)

Hope my back yard poa t free. Blanket cover all lawn with Xonerate and just to make sure roundup some area. Will do seeding next week.


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## NJ-lawn (Jun 25, 2018)

I had luck with Velocity about 3 years ago. I have a tttf/ Kbg mix. If I can find my notes I'll let you know exactly what I did but basically I hit it every week in the spring with small doses. It took a couple seasons but never came back.

I tried glyphosate a couple times but it didn't work. Came back every year. Tenacity will light it up but won't wipe it out


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## jvf1095 (Aug 8, 2019)

Love to know what you did NJ-lawn. ( I can't get Velocity or Xonorate). I do know from reading these posts (g-man) that it's best to attack it in the spring. But I'm thinking to get a head start now & rake it out. I'm going to rake INTO it starting from my TTTF, INTO the Poa T, not OUT from it, so I don't spread stolons into good grass. I'm figuring I'll leave it bare (bare looks better than the matted brown crap anyway), & in the fall, if anything remaining below the surface comes up (comes out of dormancy), I'll hit it with Round Up. Then, in the spring, if it starts to come back, I'll go through a Round-Up regime big time. As far as Tenacity, planned on blanket spraying the whole front figuring if anything turns white, well it's grass I might not want anyway. Any more thoughts on this guys? THANKS!!!


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

This is a good summary from golfdom

https://www.golfdom.com/an-integrated-strategy-for-controlling-poa-trivialis/

At the bottom there is a referenced report that shows how gly is effective.

Seasonal timing of glyphosate application influences control of Poa trivialis. Appl. Turfgrass Sci. doi:10.2134/ATS-2013-0044-BR.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

There is a ton of more info on POA t in this thread..

I think a few tried different approaches this year. @Green . Also @tgreen has a video that help id it.


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## jvf1095 (Aug 8, 2019)

Going to check those out. Thanks g-man


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## Scagfreedom48z+ (Oct 6, 2018)

I'm rolling the dice this year and using round up on POA T right now in prep for overseeding. My POA T is green and thriving, not much dormancy going on.


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## Scagfreedom48z+ (Oct 6, 2018)

Kissfromnick said:


> Hope my back yard poa t free. Blanket cover all lawn with Xonerate and just to make sure roundup some area. Will do seeding next week.


Did you overseed your dead bare spots? Any after photos?


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

NJ-lawn said:


> I had luck with Velocity about 3 years ago. I have a tttf/ Kbg mix. If I can find my notes I'll let you know exactly what I did but basically I hit it every week in the spring with small doses. It took a couple seasons but never came back.
> 
> I tried glyphosate a couple times but it didn't work. Came back every year. Tenacity will light it up but won't wipe it out


Tried the former two years ago; didn't quite work for me...more eventually came back two years later. But it toasted the good grass and required a heavy overseed.

This Spring (May), I did glyphosate 3 times on as much as I could, and then reseeded. I left about 7 patches unseeded, and nothing has come back. Going to start seeding those soon.


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## Wolverine (Jan 17, 2018)

The bitch with Poa T is that it is a perennial grass and it has a 5 year seed bank. You can kill this year's germinating seeds while others lay dormant waiting for perfect germination timing, maybe 2 or 3 years later.

Some other things to try are watch your watering very closely, Don't water your desirable grass until it shows stress. Water deep and infrequent. Poa T will not survive with very little surface moisture.

Always bag your clippings.

Kiss mechanical aeration good bye. Liquid aeration from here on out.


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## Kissfromnick (Mar 25, 2019)

Scagfreedom48z+ said:


> Kissfromnick said:
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> > Hope my back yard poa t free. Blanket cover all lawn with Xonerate and just to make sure roundup some area. Will do seeding next week.
> ...


I didn't do back yard yet will do next week. I seed front yard about 6 weeks ago Get tired from all those neighbors questions about dry spots on lawn . Came out good


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## NJ-lawn (Jun 25, 2018)

Guess I got lucky...... I never aerate either. But I do mulch, so far so good


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## NJ-lawn (Jun 25, 2018)

You can try digging it out. Get a good perimeter and put down some sod unless it's all over n mixed in your entire lawn.

Make sure you get it all, like you said light it up w Tenacity.


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## Scagfreedom48z+ (Oct 6, 2018)

Kissfromnick said:


> Scagfreedom48z+ said:
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Wow! That came out great! Have you noticed any dark spots in the turf since overseeding? Were you able to overseed with the same grass seed blend?


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## Kissfromnick (Mar 25, 2019)

Scagfreedom48z+ said:


> Kissfromnick said:
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 Always was using Barenbrug hgt with rtf this time I decide to go with the Titanium and 4millennium ttf i know it should be darker color for now not really noticeable will see next spring.


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## jvf1095 (Aug 8, 2019)

Well I've read a lot of ideas here. Started raking & pulling out the Triv today. Still more to do. I raked INTO the Triv, not away from it, & then pulled what I could by hand. Because someone said that raking might spread the stolons, I took my leaf vac & completely vacuumed the areas I did; even vac'd the good Fescue near the pulled Triv. Nothing browned out is left in the areas I did. I know Round Up won't kill the Triv that might still be lurking because it's dormant. But I'm going to blanket spray Tenacity just to see what turns white. In the fall, if I see any growth in the bare spots because it's coming out of dormancy, I'll hit it with Round Up. (Don't care if it turns out to be a waste of time in the fall; I just want this stuff dead)!! I like what "green" did leaving spots bare. I plan to do the same, maybe just top dressing with good topsoil. Then in the spring if I see any growth in the bare areas, I'm going to use Round up & hope I got it, since unfortunately I don't have Xonorate or Velocity. Is this a decent plan of attack guys? THANKS!!!.


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## NJ-lawn (Jun 25, 2018)

It's a marathon not a sprint. It will take many seasons.....stay the coarse. Because it will spread


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## jvf1095 (Aug 8, 2019)

Yeah, I hear that! I'm at least trying to nail the big areas, & even if it comes back, hopefully the areas will be smaller & smaller & be manageable. Would love to get my hands on some Velocity or Xonorate! By the way, should I go with Tall Fescue in these areas when I do re-seed, or is there another type of grass that will give the Triv some competition? Thanks.


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## Scagfreedom48z+ (Oct 6, 2018)

Kissfromnick said:


> Scagfreedom48z+ said:
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How many apps of glypho did you hit it with?


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## jvf1095 (Aug 8, 2019)

I didn't yet. I'm going to hit the raked/pulled areas with Tenacity first to see what else turns white, then hit it with the Round Up.


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## Redeye (Mar 29, 2019)

I plan was to apply* Prodiamine 65 WDG* in late Summer Early fall (before soil temperature goes below 70 degrees F) at a rate of .415 oz. per 1,000 f^2 & another application in early spring (before soil temperature goes above 55 degrees F) at the rate of .415 oz. per 1,000 f^2.

Has anyone tried this or think this might help? Thanks!


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## Kissfromnick (Mar 25, 2019)

Scagfreedom48z+ said:


> Kissfromnick said:
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 Did 2 apps of Xonerate 2 weeks apart over entire lawn and onces glypho spots only. Here picture of left side driveway overseeded 2 weeks ago.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Redeye said:


> I plan was to apply* Prodiamine 65 WDG* in late Summer Early fall (before soil temperature goes below 70 degrees F) at a rate of .415 oz. per 1,000 f^2 & another application in early spring (before soil temperature goes above 55 degrees F) at the rate of .415 oz. per 1,000 f^2.
> 
> Has anyone tried this or think this might help? Thanks!


Help with POA t? No
Help with POA a? New germination, yes
Early spring one will help with crabgrass.


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## jvf1095 (Aug 8, 2019)

After I HOPEFULLY kill off the poa-Triv (& I know it's going to be an up hill battle reading through this forum & it's not going to be in one shot); what grass can I over seed with that will give the Triv a run for it's money that spreads the best. (Read that Barenbrug has a Tall Fescue that spreads). Thanks!!


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## tgreen (Oct 20, 2018)

jvf1095 said:


> Hello & thanks for having me as a member. Here's my issue...
> My front lawn is infested with Poa Trivialis. At this point it's dormant.
> I read that the best time to spray to kill it is in the Spring, but I didn't know I had Triv till now. Also, I don't have Velocity which I
> understand will kill it if sprayed in the spring without killing my Tall Fescue. What I'm thinking is this. I want to rake all the Triv out now, & spray the area with Tenacity to weaken what might be left, avoiding Round up. Then put down Dimension to kill any unwanted Poa or other weed seed. I'm not going to seed the area in the fall, just leave it bare & seed in the Spring. This way, if the Triv starts to grow back in those areas in the Spring, I can spray it with Round Up & just kill the Triv without killing my Tall Fescue because I'll know where the Triv was & I'll know it's Triv that's growing back. Then I'll top dress with clean top soil & seed at the right time with Tall Fescue after the growing Triv is dead. Does this sound like a good approach, or can you please advise me otherwise?
> Thanks!!!...Joe


I don't 100% follow your plan but am concerned you are over-thinking it. I don't see any pics but I'm trying to imagine your situation and I would rake out the dormant stuff and spray roundup all around the area(s) whether you think it's dormant or not. I'd then seed it. The triv is likely to come back but you probably have put a dent in it with this plan.


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## jvf1095 (Aug 8, 2019)

Thanks tgreen. Just can't stand the stuff & will try anything to kill it!


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## Scagfreedom48z+ (Oct 6, 2018)

2nd spot spray app on POA T and bentgrass in a weeks time.


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## Scagfreedom48z+ (Oct 6, 2018)

What's the best and most efficient way of removing the dead POA and bentgrass from the dead spots? Raking it out would take forever. I was thinking of weed eating all the spots to get them bare anyway. I am buying a dethatcher as well.


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## ryeguy (Sep 28, 2017)

Running a weed whacker down to dirt is what I've done in the past, it's pretty easy and effective at removing dead stuff. Just vacuum up all the clippings with your mower afterwards.


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## FuzzeWuzze (Aug 25, 2017)

Scagfreedom48z+ said:


> What's the best and most efficient way of removing the dead POA and bentgrass from the dead spots? Raking it out would take forever. I was thinking of weed eating all the spots to get them bare anyway. I am buying a dethatcher as well.


One of those electric dethatchers should do quite a job on it, even though they say not too, get your area nice and wet(like spongy wet) and pull the thing backwards, it will rip the shit out of anything in front of it. You can whip any remaining grass to the ground if you want.


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## Bkell101 (Jun 25, 2018)

Wolverine said:


> The b---- with Poa T is that it is a perennial grass and it has a 5 year seed bank. You can kill this year's germinating seeds while others lay dormant waiting for perfect germination timing, maybe 2 or 3 years later.
> 
> Some other things to try are watch your watering very closely, Don't water your desirable grass until it shows stress. Water deep and infrequent. Poa T will not survive with very little surface moisture.
> 
> ...


So this is scary.

I have triv and wanted to kill and sod.

I sprayed glyco twice. Used sod cutter and removed the dead lawn.

So are you saying that if I spend the money on sod it's possible end up with a triv lawn again?

If so, the money on sod doesn't seem worth it.

I'm not confident to seed my yard without irrigation system built in.

Is there a fool proof way to guarantee no more triv?

Wait another week or so and apply fertilizer and water the bare ground to get stuff to grow the glyco a third time?

Cover with black plastic and wait till fall?


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## Wolverine (Jan 17, 2018)

Bkell101 said:


> Wolverine said:
> 
> 
> > The b---- with Poa T is that it is a perennial grass and it has a 5 year seed bank. You can kill this year's germinating seeds while others lay dormant waiting for perfect germination timing, maybe 2 or 3 years later.
> ...


Sod will be your best chance at eradicating this perennial grass as others have noted before.

Yes, fallow the soil as long as possible. I would also use a cheap form of N (Urea) and apply once your next round of weeds/grass shows up. Spray anything green until Fall with gly would be a solid plan. Disturb the soil as little as possible before sod.

Irrigation is a must. Don't spend the money on sod or seed until you have this in place.

No guarantee to eradicate Triv or any weeds in the future. Mother Nature doesn't care about your perfect lawn

Most importantly, relax and have fun with your lawn project!


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## Bkell101 (Jun 25, 2018)

Wolverine said:


> Bkell101 said:
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> > Wolverine said:
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appreciate the help!

I want to make sure I understand correctly....what is the theory behind fallow the soil as long as possible? just to see if any triv pops up between now and fall right? Allows me to draw more out of whatever was left behind and nuke it?


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## Wolverine (Jan 17, 2018)

Bkell101 said:


> Wolverine said:
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Correct. And any other lingering undesirables.


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## Carlson (Apr 16, 2020)

I'm working thru gly-ing some big patches in my front yard this spring - gonna do a few apps a few weeks apart.

Planning/hoping to get irrigation installed this summer, after which I'm gonna go ahead and do a full reno in the front.

I'm just hoping I can kill enough of it this season and get good coverage with the reno in the fall, and then move to dig-it-out mode for (hopefully) smaller patches moving forward.


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## Doug E Dee (Oct 19, 2017)

Curious if anyone has tried spraying 50/50 bleach and water on poa triv?


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## Kissfromnick (Mar 25, 2019)

this is look promising.


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## Carlson (Apr 16, 2020)

@Kissfromnick what'd you use on it?


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## Kissfromnick (Mar 25, 2019)

Carlson said:


> @Kissfromnick what'd you use on it?


First did blanket covet with tenacity 4oz per A and 2 spot apps Acclaim Extra 7-10 days apart. 1 more tenacity app next week. Also looks like quackgrass(last fall seeding bonus  ) frying too.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Kissfromnick said:


> Carlson said:
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> > @Kissfromnick what'd you use on it?
> ...


I've been seeing similar results using fenoxaprop, too. Same deal, 2 sprays 10 days apart. I used the Bayer stuff from Lowes instead of Acclaim. I am excited so far by the results but bracing myself to walk outside one day and see it recovering....


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## Kissfromnick (Mar 25, 2019)

gm560 said:


> Kissfromnick said:
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Fingers crossed 🤞


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

@Kissfromnick when did your second app go down and when was that picture taken? I am considering a 3rd... I feel like I have it on the ropes...


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## Kissfromnick (Mar 25, 2019)

gm560 said:


> @Kissfromnick when did your second app go down and when was that picture taken? I am considering a 3rd... I feel like I have it on the ropes...


Picture took today when Apply fertilizer. Second app of Acclaim 3 days ago.


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## Carlson (Apr 16, 2020)

I just nuked my big zone out front with gly on May 2nd.

I'm going out for round 2 this coming weekend to get anything I missed the first time. May do a 3rd round in the spring still, but I'm planning to do a full reno up there come early fall so I may just wait & have round 3 be my reno prep. We'll see what attempts to grow back over the summer.


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## Kissfromnick (Mar 25, 2019)

Here poa T after 1 app of xonerate 0.07 ml per gallon and 2 apps Acclaim Extra Ttf and kbg wasn't damaged.


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## Wolverine (Jan 17, 2018)

Do you guys ever notice most Poa T problem areas are in a shaded area next to some sort of woods or forest. My last house was in a development in an old clay farm field and no Poa T. Then I moved to an older development in a previous wooded area by a creek and boom. It seems like a loosing battle.


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

Good looking results so far @Kissfromnick. Hopefully you have minimal triv come back.


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## Carlson (Apr 16, 2020)

Wolverine said:


> Do you guys ever notice most Poa T problem areas are in a shaded area next to some sort of woods or forest. My last house was in a development in an old clay farm field and no Poa T. Then I moved to an older development in a previous wooded area by a creek and boom. It seems like a loosing battle.


Definitely. Shade (and the resultant extra moisture) are Poa T's best friends.

I've even seen shade seed blends that have Poa T in them on purpose. Seedsuperstore I think sells a variety of Poa T seeds, too.


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## Carlson (Apr 16, 2020)

Kissfromnick said:


> Here poa T after 1 app of xonerate 0.07 ml per gallon and 2 apps Acclaim Extra Ttf and kbg wasn't damaged.


Looks good - hopefully it doesn't rise from the grave!


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## Ohio Lawn (Mar 20, 2019)

I have some spots of Poa Triv in the 1000sq' side yard of my house. Can I hit it with glyphosate now, leave the bare spots alone, and seed them in fall?


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## ryeguy (Sep 28, 2017)

Ohio Lawn said:


> I have some spots of Poa Triv in the 1000sq' side yard of my house. Can I hit it with glyphosate now, leave the bare spots alone, and seed them in fall?


The triv needs to be actively growing to fully absorb the glyphosate. Since it goes dormant in warm weather this might not be the best time to do it. You could give it a shot now but you might have to reapply in the fall. I'm north of you and have noticed triv patches turning brown this week.


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## Ohio Lawn (Mar 20, 2019)

ryeguy said:


> Ohio Lawn said:
> 
> 
> > I have some spots of Poa Triv in the 1000sq' side yard of my house. Can I hit it with glyphosate now, leave the bare spots alone, and seed them in fall?
> ...


What fall temps does it come out of dormancy?


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## BobLovesGrass (Jun 13, 2020)

My front yard has large areas of POA T the heat wave has made it lay down but it doesn't seem to be dying as we keep getting rain and it is well shaded.
If it is still alive in August can I begin the hit it with gly?
How much soil over the top would it take to bury remaining stolons and have a decent shot at few of them coming thru. Some no of the area needs regrading and that is actually the highest traffic area so I was hoping a few rounds of gly then cover and reseed could all be done this fall rather than open dirt for months. 9 kids in the neighborhood and they go house to house and I hate to have much open dirt in a main corridor for long as kids and dogs track.mid everywhere.


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