# DETHATCH, TOPDRESSING, AND PGR BERMUDA



## JRS 9572 (May 28, 2018)

Looking for some advice on a couple of topics:

1. Would you dethatch or verticut bermuda without topdressing the area? I have clay soil. I've been using some good stuff from Super Sod over the last few years to topdress that's 70% sand and 30% screened compost. At $178.00 for a super sack and 7,700 square feet of turf to do my wallet would like to take a break from all that expense for a year. I've been in the home 4 years. 2015 I put down the Super Sod level mix. 2016 I had a company come in and topdress with Dixie Mix (mushroom compost, and sand mix), Took a year off in 2017. In 2018 I hit it hard with the Super Sod level mix. I'm hesitant to use straight sand (which is a lot less expense) due to the clay soil. Or have I top dressed enough stuff in the four years of the yard that it matters?

2. So I bought a sprayer to pull behind the riding mower. Here's a link to what I havehttps://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200646314_200646314?cm_mmc=Google-pla&utm_source=Google_PLA&utm_medium=Lawn%20%2B%20Garden%20%3E%20Sprayers%20%3E%20Trailer%20Sprayers&utm_campaign=NorthStar&utm_content=282780&gclid=CjwKCAjw2cTmBRAVEiwA8YMgzc8KGjVKPB4fkj_9_nA4hIkeqKC-RRs__QD-LKV6chGV7wGt7065AhoCO9kQAvD_BwE

I also bought a jug of T-Nex this past fall. I'm scared to death of putting this down at the right rate. My thought is to hook the sprayer up with water in it, and pull it behind the lawn mower on a stretch of street to see how much is dumped as I ride in the gear I plan to apply for a fixed distance. Hopefully that time, distance, and volume will tell me how I need to travel over the surface? Anyone have a better solution? I don't want to screw this up, and "nuke" the yard beyond repair. The pump with the sprayer is rated for 2.2 GPM. It has a 21 gallon tank. I have 7,700 square feet of TifGrand bermuda. So at .38 oz per 1000 square feet I would put 3 oz. and fill with water up to 21 gallons? Spray the whole tank over the yard?

3. I just scalped the front yard at one level lower than what I want to mow it going forward. Should I wait until the greens up again before shipping?


----------



## BadDad (Mar 13, 2019)

Curious why you don't want to use "straight sand" in your clay? Is your clay void of organic matter?

For me and many others on this forum it is scalp as low as you can go or as low as the work load you want to do.


----------



## dre white (May 6, 2019)

Some people claim that straight sand over clay will make concrete and maybe that is true in some instances, but I believe that is not always true. Other people say that straight sand has no benefit to the soil and that is true, but that is not why you are laying straight sand on your lawn. The main purpose for sand is to level your lawn and it is great at doing that. 
My motto is if golf courses are doing it, then it is good enough for me.


----------



## Wfrobinette (Feb 3, 2019)

JRS 9572 said:


> Looking for some advice on a couple of topics:
> 
> 1. Would you dethatch or verticut bermuda without topdressing the area? I have clay soil. I've been using some good stuff from Super Sod over the last few years to topdress that's 70% sand and 30% screened compost. At $178.00 for a super sack and 7,700 square feet of turf to do my wallet would like to take a break from all that expense for a year. I've been in the home 4 years. 2015 I put down the Super Sod level mix. 2016 I had a company come in and topdress with Dixie Mix (mushroom compost, and sand mix), Took a year off in 2017. In 2018 I hit it hard with the Super Sod level mix. I'm hesitant to use straight sand (which is a lot less expense) due to the clay soil. Or have I top dressed enough stuff in the four years of the yard that it matters?
> 
> ...


I'm getting 7 yards of a 70/30 sand to compost mix delivered for $280 in 2 weeks.

Call around and you can find someone that will custom mix.

Btw I heard tater dirt is fantastic for leveling.


----------



## dtillman5 (Jul 20, 2017)

Straight sand works fine on my all clay yard. I put down 4 yards on 4K of Bermuda last year and it basically disappeared in about a week, made a huge improvement in the leveling. As for PGR wait for green up on the scalped area to apply. T-Nex is a foliar app, leaf absorbed so I wouldn't spray PGR until I had full green coverage.


----------



## JRS 9572 (May 28, 2018)

BadDad said:


> Curious why you don't want to use "straight sand" in your clay? Is your clay void of organic matter?
> 
> For me and many others on this forum it is scalp as low as you can go or as low as the work load you want to do.


I don't have it to link to show. But I've read previously that it wasn't a good idea to add sand to clay soils. Of course I found it on the internet.....you know how that goes.


----------



## gpbrown60 (Apr 7, 2018)

1. Yes, you can dethatch or verticut without topdressing
2. Your 3 ounces is correct but not sure how many gallons total it will take
3. One notch should do it! Wait before shipping?


----------



## viva_oldtrafford (Apr 4, 2018)

Topdressing post verticut isn't necessary.


----------



## erdons (Apr 3, 2018)

I have clay and have top dressed with sand multiple times and still don't have concrete.


----------



## viva_oldtrafford (Apr 4, 2018)

erdons said:


> I have clay and have top dressed with sand multiple times and still don't have concrete.


Yeah, layering it isn't an issue. It's more to do with incorporating the sand into the clay.

Op, if you want to topdress, get sand with OM incorporated. You can put that stuff on / in clay all day with no issues.


----------



## tcorbitt20 (Aug 31, 2018)

I have read that mixing clay soil with sand can cause it to get locked up, but that's only if you mix it all to several inches deep - as in tilling it up and mixing it together to create almost a homogenous mixture. Adding sand on top of clay soil won't hurt a thing. I've done it as have many others here.


----------



## dre white (May 6, 2019)

Your first application of the year of T Nex should always be put down at half rate to have your grass acclimate to the product and to avoid yellowing. After that, you should be good to go at full rate. And you should never apply if your turf is under stress.


----------



## drewwitt (Jun 25, 2018)

tcorbitt20 said:


> I have read that mixing clay soil with sand can cause it to get locked up, but that's only if you mix it all to several inches deep - as in tilling it up and mixing it together to create almost a homogenous mixture. Adding sand on top of clay soil won't hurt a thing. I've done it as have many others here.


What he said.

If you mix clay and sand 50/50 and add water you get an adobe brick. Leveling is fine.


----------



## Tellycoleman (May 10, 2017)

Why were you leveling so much in the first place? Was your lawn very bumpy?
As far as getting you pull behind calibrated. Don't do it on a straight road unless you yard is like that. Do the test on you lawn with just water. Fill your tank up. Spray with water at the pace you want you go. Look and see how much water you used and adjust if needed. 
Just curious how tall are you cutting?


----------



## JRS 9572 (May 28, 2018)

@Tellycoleman not being a smart @#$. But I guess because I wanted to? 
Well the 1st year. It was newly laid sod by the building (see pic). Lots of uneven places, and dips in the seems. Plus it was nothing but pure red clay with some construction site sand in places. Wanted to add some good soil to it. After taking some core samples last night. Looks like I've got some good soil on top of the red clay. See pics.

May 2015 move in top dress. No aeration or verticut. Sod had just been laid.



A few weeks afterward



Last evening samples pulled





Height of cut around .75 right now. I'll probably go up one more level to just under an inch where I like it. This was Tuesday night after I had cut it really low on Sunday for the 1st time after getting my McLane mowers up and running. Had been using a Troy Built push mower at 1" until I could get the reels going.


----------



## Wfrobinette (Feb 3, 2019)

drewwitt said:


> tcorbitt20 said:
> 
> 
> > I have read that mixing clay soil with sand can cause it to get locked up, but that's only if you mix it all to several inches deep - as in tilling it up and mixing it together to create almost a homogenous mixture. Adding sand on top of clay soil won't hurt a thing. I've done it as have many others here.
> ...


Actually it's 30% clay to 70% sand! This is how myths live on.

https://www.gardenmyths.com/sand-and-clay-dont-make-concrete/


----------



## drewwitt (Jun 25, 2018)

Wfrobinette said:


> drewwitt said:
> 
> 
> > tcorbitt20 said:
> ...


great link. thanks for sharing.


----------



## tcorbitt20 (Aug 31, 2018)

drewwitt said:


> Wfrobinette said:
> 
> 
> > drewwitt said:
> ...


+1 :thumbup:


----------

