# Cut Lower or not at last cut of year?



## nikmasteed (Apr 30, 2020)

We're not there yet but I've been doing the fall nitro blitz and thinking ahead to the last cut of the year, whenever that may be within the next several weeks. I plan to cut until no more growth is occurring.

I feel like I saw somewhere that it might be best to cut a notch lower than normal heading into winter. Is this fact or fiction and if fact, what are the benefits? Usually we are cutting to promote growth, but if there is no more growth occurring going into winter dormancy does it matter?

I have a mostly TTTF mix. Just applied my last app of urea for the blitz (2.5#/sf total N since last week of Aug). I usually cut at 2.5" spring/fall.


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## badtlc (Aug 22, 2019)

Do what you want. You won't hurt anything. Some feel it helps prevent snow mold.


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## estcstm3 (Sep 3, 2019)

if you cut to aggressive i find you will lose color over the winter


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## Babameca (Jul 29, 2019)

Go 1/2'' lower for last 2 mows. The lower, the better. Don't lower at last cut and not more than 1/3 of your usual fall HOC


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## themishmosh (Jul 3, 2020)

i get less vole damage over the winter if the grass is shorter. Not too concerned about snow mold-- has never had any lasting damage at any cut height.


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## JimFromLawnGuyland (Jan 15, 2020)

Just be aware any scalping will be there till spring


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## 440mag (Jan 29, 2018)

This is an interesting question for me due to some extenuating circumstances known as whitetail deer. Yankee tree huggers in our POA assure the rest of us that the N.C. Wildlife Resources Officer they asked said there is no overcrowding of deer in our subdivision so, I won't argue that point (never mind the officer is not an actual biologist) but what we do know is that, by Jan every year, the sheer numbers of whitetail deer grazing our yards have whittled TTTF grass blades down to, literally, a quarter of an inch! :shock: Every year it's getting worse and the last 2 or 3 years by Feb our 28k sf yard is littered with scores of thousands of TTTF clumps that the deer have pulled from the moist soil, in an attempt to nibble what little shoot remains above the blade crowns. Instead, the entire tiny clump of grass is pulled from the soil, dropped from the deer's mouth and lays exposed to whither, dry and die atop the surface of the turf.

I am NOT looking forward to the extensive damage this year and like you OP, I am pondering if not going as low (1-1/2" to 2") as I normally do this year might give the turf stand a better chance of survival ... ?

I am also considering extending my spoon feeding up to just ahead of the first real freeze in our area, which can be quite late some years, as opposed to just regular overnight frosts ... maybe just pick a 4K or 5k sf test area or two, out of the whole property ....


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## Dan1234 (Aug 31, 2018)

Hey - checked out your journal , the lawn and landscaping look great!

I'm also in SEPA.

If you are cutting at 2.5" in the fall you should be set for winter. I don't think there's any reason to go lower than that.

I do 2.75" due to mower settings on the time master and seems fine.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

I don't know how old this article is from Purdue, but here is an interesting take; although it doesn't specifically mention HOC:

_Many people ask how long to continue mowing into the fall. The answer is to keep mowing as long as the grass continues to grow which is normally into late October or early November. Frequency of mowing can decrease but continue to mow into the fall. Also avoid the urge to set the mower down and scalp your lawn for the final mowing. In years past, publications have recommended mowing low late in the fall and again in the spring. About the only advantage to this is that the leaves will blow into your neighbor's yard. Agronomically, this should be avoided because photosynthesis is very high during the fall even with cool temperatures. The higher the photosynthesis, the more energy a grass plant will store for winter and next spring, and the healthier a grass plant. Mowing off leaves reduces photosynthetic capacity of a plant, reducing energy storage, and decreasing turf performance next summer. Be sure to continue mowing until the grass stops growing in the late fall. Unmowed grass encourages snow mold which is a damaging turfgrass disease._

If there is a more update perspective, I'd love to see it.


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## OhDeere (Apr 12, 2019)

440mag said:


> This is an interesting question for me due to some extenuating circumstances known as whitetail deer. Yankee tree huggers in our POA assure the rest of us that the N.C. Wildlife Resources Officer they asked said there is no overcrowding of deer in our subdivision so, I won't argue that point (never mind the officer is not an actual biologist) but what we do know is that, by Jan every year, the sheer numbers of whitetail deer grazing our yards have whittled TTTF grass blades down to, literally, a quarter of an inch! :shock: Every year it's getting worse and the last 2 or 3 years by Feb our 28k sf yard is littered with scores of thousands of TTTF clumps that the deer have pulled from the moist soil, in an attempt to nibble what little shoot remains above the blade crowns. Instead, the entire tiny clump of grass is pulled from the soil, dropped from the deer's mouth and lays exposed to whither, dry and die atop the surface of the turf.
> 
> I am NOT looking forward to the extensive damage this year and like you OP, I am pondering if not going as low (1-1/2" to 2") as I normally do this year might give the turf stand a better chance of survival ... ?
> 
> I am also considering extending my spoon feeding up to just ahead of the first real freeze in our area, which can be quite late some years, as opposed to just regular overnight frosts ... maybe just pick a 4K or 5k sf test area or two, out of the whole property ....


Same issue here. These vicious grass-thirsty deer are tearing up my yard, piece by piece. It really is a shame that nobody seems to care about TTTF. :lol:


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## nikmasteed (Apr 30, 2020)

Thanks everyone for the thoughts. @Harts that Purdue article certainly makes me second guess lowering. On balance, I dont see much downside to leaving the height as-is so that's probably what I'll do. I also have someone from my local PSU county extension office calling me back today on another topic, so maybe I'll try to get her opinion on this.

@Dan1234 thanks for the compliment! I'm overdue for a journal update- I think I'm gonna post some of my full-season stats there soon. Glad to meet another SEPA lawn guy, send a message anytime!


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## always_creative (Aug 28, 2020)

440mag said:


> This is an interesting question for me due to some extenuating circumstances known as whitetail deer. Yankee tree huggers in our POA assure the rest of us that the N.C. Wildlife Resources Officer they asked said there is no overcrowding of deer in our subdivision so, I won't argue that point (never mind the officer is not an actual biologist) but what we do know is that, by Jan every year, the sheer numbers of whitetail deer grazing our yards have whittled TTTF grass blades down to, literally, a quarter of an inch! :shock: Every year it's getting worse and the last 2 or 3 years by Feb our 28k sf yard is littered with scores of thousands of TTTF clumps that the deer have pulled from the moist soil, in an attempt to nibble what little shoot remains above the blade crowns. Instead, the entire tiny clump of grass is pulled from the soil, dropped from the deer's mouth and lays exposed to whither, dry and die atop the surface of the turf.
> 
> I am NOT looking forward to the extensive damage this year and like you OP, I am pondering if not going as low (1-1/2" to 2") as I normally do this year might give the turf stand a better chance of survival ... ?
> 
> I am also considering extending my spoon feeding up to just ahead of the first real freeze in our area, which can be quite late some years, as opposed to just regular overnight frosts ... maybe just pick a 4K or 5k sf test area or two, out of the whole property ....


Up here upstate New York, my city culls the deer herd with bait and sharpshooters, then shoots the remaining does with contraceptive darts to slow population growth. Maybe your treehugger neighbors will be on board with the darts, or culling if they know that's what their yankee friends do?

My city: https://ourcity.syrgov.net/2020/05/city-of-syracuse-reports-deer-management-results/
Town Next door: http://www.townofdewitt.com/WhiteTailedDeer.aspx


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## thebmrust (Jun 29, 2020)

There are deer deterrents. I guess it depends on the association rules and your pocketbook.

I'm sure there are also stupid rules like:
-no deer fences/deterrents
-grass must be pristine at all times of year
-no scaring deer off yard
-yard must be perfect shade of green and xx# of blades per square foot and no clumps allowed 24/7

My disdain for HOA's is evident.


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## cityofoaks (Sep 8, 2020)

I bring cool season down from 4 inches to 2.5 for the fall and winter, granted there is rarely snow to deal with in this area.

NC has an urban archery season for deer that last all the way into Feb to cull deer populations, problem is it is up to each individual municipality if they want to participate or not and you know how that goes.

There are deer repellants both granular that you put out with a spreader and liquids you can mix and spray like anything else, not sure of their effectiveness though. Deer that cause damage tend to ahem, disappear down east year round :lol:


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## macattack (Nov 2, 2020)

I just cut the lawn at 3", its still growing enough, maybe 1.5-2"" in 10 days. Recent warm spell hasn't helped. Last mow wont be til early December, i'll go one setting lower. I didn't think that the deer came around to just eat the grass, they certainly damaged my garden, but that has been gone for a couple weeks. Saw more scat and area of lawn where clearly they have been laying down. Need to get a trail cam.


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## rockinmylawn (Mar 25, 2018)

Started lowering to about 2.5 from 5 since October began. 
Saw what lower than that did in past years in my zone; short non-growing dormant grass didn't look so good.


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## MDJoe (Sep 16, 2019)

440mag said:


> This is an interesting question for me due to some extenuating circumstances known as whitetail deer. Yankee tree huggers in our POA assure the rest of us that the N.C. Wildlife Resources Officer they asked said there is no overcrowding of deer in our subdivision so, I won't argue that point (never mind the officer is not an actual biologist) but what we do know is that, by Jan every year, the sheer numbers of whitetail deer grazing our yards have whittled TTTF grass blades down to, literally, a quarter of an inch! :shock: Every year it's getting worse and the last 2 or 3 years by Feb our 28k sf yard is littered with scores of thousands of TTTF clumps that the deer have pulled from the moist soil, in an attempt to nibble what little shoot remains above the blade crowns. Instead, the entire tiny clump of grass is pulled from the soil, dropped from the deer's mouth and lays exposed to whither, dry and die atop the surface of the turf.
> 
> I am NOT looking forward to the extensive damage this year and like you OP, I am pondering if not going as low (1-1/2" to 2") as I normally do this year might give the turf stand a better chance of survival ... ?
> 
> I am also considering extending my spoon feeding up to just ahead of the first real freeze in our area, which can be quite late some years, as opposed to just regular overnight frosts ... maybe just pick a 4K or 5k sf test area or two, out of the whole property ....


I HATE $#&**@#[email protected]#$ DEER! I am not lying when I say I'd shoot every damn one of them if I could get away with it. Those SOBs destroy everything not inside a fence. They even ate a prickly pear CACTUS!! A #@&*$# CACTUS!


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## Oneacer (Sep 27, 2020)

Funny you mention the prickly pear cactus ... I mistakenly put them in one year, boy ... picking out those hair like needles from your hands that jump at you when you get near them was a real pain in the ___.


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## MDJoe (Sep 16, 2019)

thebmrust said:


> There are deer deterrents. I guess it depends on the association rules and your pocketbook.
> 
> I'm sure there are also stupid rules like:
> -no deer fences/deterrents
> ...


Anytime some "Karen" on Facebook or Nextdoor goes on about how horrible it is that people want to keep the "beautiful" deer out of their yards, I wish I could load a bunch of them on a truck and dump them in her &R$*#[email protected](* living room.


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