# What to fungicides to keep on hand for KBG lawn...



## NELawn (May 7, 2019)

The last few years I have grabbed some Scotts Disease-Ex (Azoxystrobin 0.31%) which is similar to Heritage-G. I hope I won't need it, but if I do Ill have it on hand to use it early. I have a KBG lawn in the back, and a mixed lawn in teh front with a lot of FF.

I know your supposed to rotate your disease products. I have a very small ~2,000sf area. I was just wondering if there is another cost effective fungicide I could keep on hand to rotate with Disease-Ex. Disease-Ex is the first non cost prohibitive fungicide I have found for my smaller yard.

BTW: I do apply Serenade and companion proactively, but unfortunately it hasn't prevented anything yet, which is why i try to keep the disease-ex on the ready.


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

Azoxystrobin and Propiconazole will treat pretty much everything you are likely to get.


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## ABC123 (Jul 14, 2017)

I'm using the Domyown disease program this year.


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

@ABC123 If you can share the info, I am very curious what fungicides they send you and when?


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## FuzzeWuzze (Aug 25, 2017)

DiseaseEx(Azoxystrobin ) + Propiconizole 14.3 from DoMyOwn. The bottle is about $50 for 32oz, at 2oz/K per app standard its only about $3 per 1k sqft and when cycling with DiseaseEx should last you at least a whole season if not more.

DiseaseEx is $20 for a 5k bag at Home Depot, so about $4/1k.


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## ABC123 (Jul 14, 2017)

bernstem said:


> @ABC123 If you can share the info, I am very curious what fungicides they send you and when?


Here's a picture of one I just made up on there site.

10-15ksq ft


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## tgreen (Oct 20, 2018)

ABC123 said:


> bernstem said:
> 
> 
> > @ABC123 If you can share the info, I am very curious what fungicides they send you and when?
> ...


Very interesting. I see there is no propiconazole in the rotation so your lawn will likely die. LOL. Seriously though, first two are strobilurins (heritage and pillar). Would love to hear from someone to compare azoxystrobin to pyraclostrobin and if there is any benefit to one or the other. I would have just gone azoxystrobin as it is more readily available.

The only issue with their program is the third app which is myclobutanil and not as strong as the strob's. I would do a third app of the heritage, personally. Anyway, thanks for posting this.


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## 440mag (Jan 29, 2018)

tgreen said:


> ...which is myclobutanil and not as strong as the strob's. ...


I swear, I cannot visit these forums for even a minute or two and not LEARN SOMETHING NEW! :thumbup:

This year my first two app.s of my preventative program were Azoxy and I missed a week in getting my second app down (I aim to make an app every 21 day's and this last time I went 28 days); I just discovered some leaf spot and I was wondering if I should make Myclobutanil my first rotation next year but, based on your info I think I'll stick with Azoxy first. (My first app. of Myclo for this season was supposed to be today; however; between the crazy gusting winds off the lake this morning and fact we have 4 days of rain coming I thought I better put it off. That was before I came upon the leaf spot! :lol:

OP, my program this year consists of 2 apps each Azoxy then Myclo then 1 app Armada then back to 2 apps each Azoxy then Myclo. I have TM 4.5 on my shopping list for next year: however; I'll order it sooner if it looks like I may run short of either Azoxy or Myclo before season's end ...

Best o' Success!


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## tgreen (Oct 20, 2018)

440mag said:


> tgreen said:
> 
> 
> > ...which is myclobutanil and not as strong as the strob's. ...
> ...


I think that's a good call, particularly with your fescue. I would always go with azoxystrobin over myclobutanil if you can. The azoxystrobin label lets you do 3 apps at 28 day intervals but does say something about if treating for pythium then only two apps are allowed before rotating. I guess that's why domyown only goes 2 apps strob's then on to myclobutanil. Plus, it looks like that is where they are making their money on the subscription (i.e., the myclobutanil). Pythium is pretty uncommon on tall fescue but is possible.

Only other thing is I might take another look at is going on a 21 day interval, I would go 28. I understand environmental conditions may be a problem but I'd stretch as long as I could b/c you don't want to have your third app run out in mid July. Another thing to consider is let's say your first app runs out today but it's unusually cool and no humidity in your forecast for a few days. I'd stretch that first app and wait a few days before applying the second. Again, the goal is to not run out of azoxystrobin protection too early.

I posted this link below many times and it deals with brown patch but I think safe to say most would choose azoxystrobin over myclobutanil for most diseases I'm familiar with

https://www.plantpath.k-state.edu/extension/documents/turf/Brown%20patch%20%20homeowners%202016.pdf


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## rockinmylawn (Mar 25, 2018)

Is there a recommendation for applying azoxy & prop (not mixed together) for leaf spot, melting out, and brown patch?

In other words, are they supposed to be delivered to foliar or root (misty or coarse)?


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

@rockinmylawn Azoxy and Propi will treat root and leaf diseases if watered in. They will only treat leaf diseases if applied to the leaves. I would definitely water in for root and crown diseases with 0.1-0.2 inches of water. For leaf diseases you can skip watering in, but it won't hurt. I have tank mixed Azoxy and Propi without issues.

Propiconazole and Myclobutanil are both FRAC group 3 fungicides and should have very similar coverage, but I don't use them for the same thing. I use Myclobutanil for roses where it works well at preventing black spot. Propiconazole isn't as good. In the lawn, Propiconazole seems more effective to me against dollar spot and leaf spot.


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## rockinmylawn (Mar 25, 2018)

bernstem said:


> @rockinmylawn Azoxy and Propi will treat root and leaf diseases if watered in. They will only treat leaf diseases if applied to the leaves. I would definitely water in for root and crown diseases with 0.1-0.2 inches of water. For leaf diseases you can skip watering in, but it won't hurt. I have tank mixed Azoxy and Propi without issues.
> 
> Propiconazole and Myclobutanil are both FRAC group 3 fungicides and should have very similar coverage, but I don't use them for the same thing. I use Myclobutanil for roses where it works well at preventing black spot. Propiconazole isn't as good. In the lawn, Propiconazole seems more effective to me against dollar spot and leaf spot.


Ah ok so watering hits both leaf & root. 
Excellent thanks @bernstem !

Can I wait 24 hours before watering in?
Just rather use free rain H20 than turning on irrigation.


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## HoosierLawnGnome (Sep 28, 2017)

Depends what fungus you're fighting, so, ask yourself first what fungus you get year after year, and go from there.

I get rust, dollar spot, sometimes some leaf spot, so I use Propacanazole.


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## john5246 (Jul 21, 2019)

you can get the concentrate from domyown, the cost should not be more than $200 and it will last you a long time.

What you showed on that print out is very expensive. I manage my entire $5000 sqft lawn for barely $150/yr and that includes applications of prop and azoxy funcides as well as bifen for insects and all my fertilizer. Let's be smart about this stuff.


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## Ohio Lawn (Mar 20, 2019)

If you tank mix Azoxy & Prop, how many apps can you do before rotating to another FRAC? (Cool season lawn)


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## troksd (Jul 27, 2018)

Adding a third or fourth or fifth FRAC is better than rotating. Perhaps add something from FRAC 1 instead.



Ohio Lawn said:


> If you tank mix Azoxy & Prop, how many apps can you do before rotating to another FRAC? (Cool season lawn)


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

rockinmylawn said:


> Can I wait 24 hours before watering in?
> Just rather use free rain H20 than turning on irrigation.


If you wait 24 hours, then the fungicide will be absorbed by the leaf and will not get to the roots so it will be a foliar only application. Odds are the label tells you how long to wait after a foliar application for it to be absorbed before you can water. If it does not, then 4-6 hours is a reasonable minimum (longer is better but 12 hours is more than enough for most everything). Similarly, if you want a soil application, the sooner you water the better. The longer it sits on the leaves the more will be absorbed.


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## Ohio Lawn (Mar 20, 2019)

troksd said:


> Adding a third or fourth or fifth FRAC is better than rotating. Perhaps add something from FRAC 1 instead.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If you add a third FRAC to the tank and run a 28 day cycle, is the odds of successful mutation slim?


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## gmorf33 (Jul 30, 2019)

I've been happy with what i've seen a few of the youtuber's (paul & matt) suggest for a general purpose preventative program: Azoxy + Prop mixed together at the low rates. I've been applying about every 28 days (i know their is a gap in prop's duration, but it's cheaper this way and seems to be working for me). You can also mix in a RGS/RGS-clone for additional micros and stress-aid.

I use DiseaseEx for the azoxy portion, as it's easy and i can usually find it on sale cheap here (TCS had it for $8 a bag a couple weeks ago and i regularly find it for $12-15). Prop i got the generic concentrate from DoMyOwn and mix it with the Kelp4Less humic/fulvic/kelp blend.

Mixing the 2 fungicides which are different groups is supposed to reduce/eliminate the need to rotate as the odds of a fungus developing resistance mutation to 2 separate MoA's is practically zero. This appeals to me for economical and simplicity reasons.


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## Biggylawns (Jul 8, 2019)

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't soil/foliar apps affect the entire plant but it's a timing thing? If I spray something foliar, it still affects the roots, just slower than if I did a soil app since it's uptake is through the blades and vice versa. Is this not accurate?


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

Biggylawns said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong but don't soil/foliar apps affect the entire plant but it's a timing thing? If I spray something foliar, it still affects the roots, just slower than if I did a soil app since it's uptake is through the blades and vice versa. Is this not accurate?


Products such as propiconazole and azoxystrobin are xylem-mobile systemic, which means they only move upwards in the plant. As far down as you get them, is as far down as they will work. As mentioned earlier .1-.2" is a good target for irrigation after applying them. I believe the only fungicide product that moves downward(as well as upward) are the phosphites. Also, some products have higher Koc values which mean they will bind to organic matter at the soil surface faster. Propiconazole has a higher Koc then azoxystrobin. If you want to get the products down to the roots, it is important to apply that irrigation as soon as possible after putting down a liquid fungicide.


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## Biggylawns (Jul 8, 2019)

@Pete1313 good info and thanks for clarifying!


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

@Pete1313 Great explanation. The only phloem (downward) mobile fungicides I know of are the Phosphites.


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## troksd (Jul 27, 2018)

Correct. The more modes of action reduce the risk of mutation.



Ohio Lawn said:


> If you add a third FRAC to the tank and run a 28 day cycle, is the odds of successful mutation slim?


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## tgreen (Oct 20, 2018)

Ohio Lawn said:


> If you tank mix Azoxy & Prop, how many apps can you do before rotating to another FRAC? (Cool season lawn)


Three. There is a product called Headway that contains both. Label says three, same as if you applied azoxystrobin alone (which is what I would recommend).


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## tgreen (Oct 20, 2018)

Pete1313 said:


> Biggylawns said:
> 
> 
> > Correct me if I'm wrong but don't soil/foliar apps affect the entire plant but it's a timing thing? If I spray something foliar, it still affects the roots, just slower than if I did a soil app since it's uptake is through the blades and vice versa. Is this not accurate?
> ...


I don't follow this. Is the suggestion that granular and foliar apps are different in how quickly they work? I've seen recent research on azoxystrobin on brown patch that concluded the method of app didn't matter. If anything, I would have expected someone to say a foliar app provided possible contact benefit but was certainly a systemic uptaken by the plant.


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

@tgreen Applying to leaves will allow leaves to absorb it and treat leaf diseases, but it won't travel to the roots. Applying and watering it in will allow the roots to absorb it, and it will travel up into the leaves. For Brown Patch, a foliar disease, it doesn't matter how you apply an upward mobile fungicide because both foliar and root absorption will get it to the leaves. For a root disease, like Summer Patch, a foliar application will not be effective since the fungus attacks the roots, and foliar applications are not carried down into the roots.


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## tgreen (Oct 20, 2018)

bernstem said:


> @tgreen Applying to leaves will allow leaves to absorb it and treat leaf diseases, but it won't travel to the roots. Applying and watering it in will allow the roots to absorb it, and it will travel up into the leaves. For Brown Patch, a foliar disease, it doesn't matter how you apply an upward mobile fungicide because both foliar and root absorption will get it to the leaves. For a root disease, like Summer Patch, a foliar application will not be effective since the fungus attacks the roots, and foliar applications are not carried down into the roots.


Don't we need to be specific about the chemical and its mode of action? If we have a contact fungicide, do you agree it should be sprayed? If a systemic fungicide, it could be sprayed or applied as granular? I understand summer patch is a root disease affecting KBG and brown patch a foliar affecting TF but that doesn't mean for example, that I can't spray a systemic for brown patch on TF, right?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

The first page of the Rutger fungicide article tries to explain each of the mobility characteristics of fungicides. The mobility influences if it is better to apply as a contact vs a systemic, or it doesn't matter.

http://www2.ca.uky.edu/agcomm/pubs/ppa/ppa1/ppa1.pdf


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

@tgreen Only systemic fngicides will be absorbed and move within the plant. Contact fungicides stay on the outside. A contact fungicide sprayed on the plant and watered into the soil, would only treat root diseases. If sprayed on the leaves and not watered in, it would only treat foliar diseases. There are other types, but they still mostly fall into contact or systemic. Daconil, for example, is a contact fungicide.

I prefer contact fungicides to be sprayable for the reason you mention. Some contact fungicides, though, are sold as fine granules. Instructions will usually say to apply when the grass is wet for foliar diseases so it sticks to the leaves and doesn't drop to the soil.


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