# What the heck is this stuff?



## NewEnglander (Aug 20, 2018)

Hi guys, still a newbie to the forum here. Been driving myself crazy trying to ID this stuff. Before I spray and pray anything I figured I'd ask a group of experts.

My gut is telling me this is poa triv, but I am not certain. It looks very similar to photos I've seen of heat stressed triv. There are some green tips on the end of the stalky stuff. Here in NH it's been pretty hot, so not sure I'd be seeing triv come back already?

It fit the symptoms of being floppy before it actually kicked the bucket for the summer.

I am not certain that the first pic is the same as the other stuff.

I sprayed quinclorac about a month ago, but the dead crabgrass doesn't look like this everywhere else.

Is this triv? Something else? Pretty sure my girlfriend is going to leave me if I keep spending hours on identifying this stuff.

Thank you for reading!


----------



## SpiveyJr (Jun 7, 2018)

I have seen other members posting on here with the same or very similar "grass" you have and theirs pulls up very easily because of the shallow roots. I too have this is in some areas of my lawn (the shadier areas) and had sprayed apps of tenacity without any signs of damage.


----------



## NewEnglander (Aug 20, 2018)

Thanks for the info. Yeah, I think I've entered analysis paralysis. I've read so many different things and seen so many pictures of things that kinda look like it that I don't know which way to go.

Glad Tenacity worked, I imagine I need to wait for it to revive before spraying for the full impact? How many apps did it take for you?

Thanks again!


----------



## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

Looks like bentgrass. Tenacity should be able to get rid of it if it is bent. Read the tenacity label for info and rates for bentgrass. If tenacity can't get rid of it then it could be triv.


----------



## NewEnglander (Aug 20, 2018)

Thank you! That's the other way I was leaning. Much appreciated. Will update after trial and error.


----------



## Miggity (Apr 25, 2018)

I have bent grass and what I have finally concluded is Poa triv all over the shady part of my lawn thanks to a core aeration spreading it two years ago. Two apps of Tenacity put a serious hurt on the bent, the third took it out. The triv whitened, mostly on the upper leaf surface but did not die. It did however make identifying my problem areas much easier. It got a healthy dose of glyphosate 4 days ago for a 2000 sf reno. I am seriously considering using a blacktop tar torch after scalping, just to make sure it is dead and reduce the surface seedbank.


----------



## SpiveyJr (Jun 7, 2018)

I thought it was bentgrass but my apps of tenacity did not work (2 x 4oz) which makes me believe it's poa triv for me. If it's clumped together then you might as well glyphosate it since you are trying to kill it.


----------



## SpiveyJr (Jun 7, 2018)

Here's a good article that delivers bad news about POA Triv, if it is indeed what you have.

http://www.golfdom.com/an-integrated-strategy-for-controlling-poa-trivialis/


----------



## NewEnglander (Aug 20, 2018)

Thanks, yeah, I read that one but somewhere inside me am hoping it is not triv. This part is inspirational.....

Although it's difficult to hear, rough bluegrass is most consistently controlled with glyphosate followed by reseeding. But even this is no easy task.

I used to think crabgrass was tough to control. Now it looks like a cakewalk. I'm going to hope it's bentgrass and not triv &#129310;


----------



## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

If you think poa t is hard, you need to meet Bermuda.


----------



## NewEnglander (Aug 20, 2018)

Lol I read one guy who said the easiest and cheapest way to get Bermuda out was to move.

Gives me the glass half full perspective though.


----------



## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Go read @social port journal and you will see how hard it is to kill the bermuda weed. It survives round up.


----------



## ken-n-nancy (Jul 25, 2017)

g-man said:


> If you think poa t is hard, you need to meet Bermuda.


Nah, Bermuda is no problem to kill off here in New Hampshire, even _*Southern*_ NH.

Just wait for a cold week in January, and that Bermuda grass will be dead _*forever*_:

*Bedford, NH, Temperatures, Jan 2018 *







_Poa trivialis_, on the other hand, will come roaring back in the spring despite those winter temps...


----------



## NewEnglander (Aug 20, 2018)

Yikes. I read RoundUp won't always kill it. What if I dig the whole lawn up a foot? An expensive gamble, and not sure the new soil wouldn't have it, so not sure if I should go that route.


----------



## social port (Jun 19, 2017)

ken-n-nancy said:


> g-man said:
> 
> 
> > If you think poa t is hard, you need to meet Bermuda.
> ...


Hmmm... that gives me an idea.
I wonder how much trouble it would be to secure some liquid nitrogen from the local children's science center...


----------



## ken-n-nancy (Jul 25, 2017)

Did you get a positive ID on the type of grass that it is? If it's bentgrass, then Tenacity will take it out in 2-3 applications without any trouble. If it's _poa trivialis_ then you've got a battle on your hands. I'm horrible at grass ID via pictures online, so I'm afraid I'm not much help in making a positive identification. What you have looks different than the _poa trivialis_ I get in my lawn.

Regardless of what it is, in order to have it be susceptible to a herbicide, you first need to wait for it to come back after this heat breaks. Good news is the heat is breaking tonight, but it will still take a week or more for the grass to recover. Then, Tenacity to kill bentgrass or glyphosate to kill the _poa trivialis_. It's unlikely that the first attempt will get it all, especially if you have a lot of it.

To eliminate _poa trivialis_ patches in my lawn, I've been having to glyphosate the patch plus 8" of "good grass" around the patch. I then wait for the _poa trivialis_ to die, cut out the dead patch with a sod cutter and replace with sod from a "donor" section of the lawn. So far, the approach holds promise, but I won't really have a sustainable plan until after this year's renovation is complete. (https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=5671)


----------



## NewEnglander (Aug 20, 2018)

You're giving me hope! I'm hoping it's bentgrass, but I don't know for sure. It's good to hear that it doesn't look like your triv. All the research basically put me in a giant circle.

I got some Tenacity last week, so when it starts livening up, I'll throw down a few apps. There's tons of reading material here on how to do it.

Thank you for your insight and helpfulness!


----------



## Delmarva Keith (May 12, 2018)

I had a patch of what I'm pretty sure was triv and sprayed with Tenacity / triclopyr mix when out spraying some bermuda (just to see what would happen). About three weeks later it died stone cold dead. Note fescue around it was unaffected. It did completely outcompete the fescue where it was though


----------



## Delmarva Keith (May 12, 2018)

Here is what the same mix does to bent. Same deal - the fescue around it was lush and healthy but it completely crowded fescue out where it was.


----------



## NewEnglander (Aug 20, 2018)

That's very similar to what mine looks like. I guess I'll wait for it to come back and try to kill it off with Tenacity. Then next spring hopefully I can get some seed going and established before summer.

Thanks for the pics!


----------



## Mozart (Jul 17, 2018)

That looks like bentgrass to me. Did you treat it with Tenacity when it was hot? If so the plant may have been dormant and immune to the treatment. I sprayed tenacity without a surfactant on bentgrass right before a mild period (75-85) and it showed damage (leftover tenacity from PreM treatment) but did not fully die out (wasn't expecting it to).

I think I found some Poa Triv in my yard about a week ago. Not 100% sure but probably 85-90% certain this is triv.

Note the triangular shaped ligule, the boat shaped leaf tip and the weird double line surrounding the midrib.

If you let it grow or find a sample without the tips cut off, one way to eliminate a bentgrass/triv diagnosis is to look at the vernation or the leaf tips. Bent has a pointed tip and rolled vernation. Triv is folded vernation and boat tips.


----------

