# Spurge?



## marshtj (Apr 9, 2018)

So apparently my preemergent was washed out this spring and I've got a spurge outbreak on my hands. What is the least Bermuda stressing chemical I can spray to knock this out?

On hand I have:
Celsius
MSMA
Mansion (lesco MSM)
Drive 75
Certainty (maybe)


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## Dangerlawn (Sep 13, 2018)

I've successfully killed spurge with Celsius, but it took multiple apps and makes me think there might be a better option.


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

Celsius is not a strong herbicide for Spurge. MSM(Mansion, Manor) is. O.3 gram per 1000 sq ft applied as a broadcast not spot treatment. Reason why you broadcast this is MSM is a pre against many common broadleaf weeds but that effect is not apparent when only applied to individual weeds. Second, it is very easy to overdose areas when spot spraying something. 0.25 oz per acre or else 0.15 gram per 1000 sq ft is safe. 0.5 oz per acre or 0.3 gram per 1000 sq ft is still safe. 1 oz and 2 oz per acre risks sterilizing the soil and or killing nearby trees that pick up the product via their roots. It is very easy to apply 4 x of what is intended by using a normal sprayer to spot spray weeds.


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## marshtj (Apr 9, 2018)

Greendoc said:


> Celsius is not a strong herbicide for Spurge. MSM(Mansion, Manor) is. O.3 gram per 1000 sq ft applied as a broadcast not spot treatment. Reason why you broadcast this is MSM is a pre against many common broadleaf weeds but that effect is not apparent when only applied to individual weeds. Second, it is very easy to overdose areas when spot spraying something. 0.25 oz per acre or else 0.15 gram per 1000 sq ft is safe. 0.5 oz per acre or 0.3 gram per 1000 sq ft is still safe. 1 oz and 2 oz per acre risks sterilizing the soil and or killing nearby trees that pick up the product via their roots. It is very easy to apply 4 x of what is intended by using a normal sprayer to spot spray weeds.


This makes perfect sense.


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## Dangerlawn (Sep 13, 2018)

Wow, such a super small amount of the product per 1,000... I'm tempted to pick up a bottle since it's only $20 for a 2oz bottle... but it seems difficult to measure if you have small yard


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

I use a scale that measures down to 0.001grams


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## JWAY (Oct 16, 2018)

Recommended by Ware.

https://www.amazon.com/American-Weigh-Scales-AWS-600-BLK-Nutrition/dp/B000O37TDO/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1537818798&sr=8-4&keywords=gram+scale&tag=lawnforum-20

On the same page you'll see other options that will give more precise measurements for a few more $.


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## TN Hawkeye (May 7, 2018)

Greendoc said:


> Celsius is not a strong herbicide for Spurge. MSM(Mansion, Manor) is. O.3 gram per 1000 sq ft applied as a broadcast not spot treatment. Reason why you broadcast this is MSM is a pre against many common broadleaf weeds but that effect is not apparent when only applied to individual weeds. Second, it is very easy to overdose areas when spot spraying something. 0.25 oz per acre or else 0.15 gram per 1000 sq ft is safe. 0.5 oz per acre or 0.3 gram per 1000 sq ft is still safe. 1 oz and 2 oz per acre risks sterilizing the soil and or killing nearby trees that pick up the product via their roots. It is very easy to apply 4 x of what is intended by using a normal sprayer to spot spray weeds.


There is nothing that you or @thegrassfactor say that I don't consider getting tattooed on my body somewhere. Your (plural) knowledge is unparalleled. It is so amazing that we have people like you on this forum.


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

To add to this. I do not count on Prodiamine or Dithiopyr for Spurge control. I count on MSM and if the budget is there Isoxaben(Gallery) as my pre for Spurge. The Spring pre for Spurge can be Prodiamine+Gallery on lawns with a known issue with that weed.


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## FlaDave (Jul 10, 2018)

Great info, thank you. I've read many times not to use msm turf around trees, more specifically oaks. Any worry of damage to crepe myrtles? If so what distance is considered safe? I've got spurge popping up in the majority of the lawn, but my hell strip between the sidewalk and the street has 6 crepe myrtles so I've avoided spraying msm there.


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

MSM takes no prisoners. I would treat with Three Way + Pre around the Crepe Myrtles


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## FlaDave (Jul 10, 2018)

Got it, thanks again.


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## jayhawk (Apr 18, 2017)

TN Hawkeye said:


> There is nothing that you or @thegrassfactor say that I don't consider getting tattooed on my body somewhere. Your (plural) knowledge is unparalleled. It is so amazing that we have people like you on this forum.


If greendoc has a business card, brochure....put that in quotes. (Re tattooed)


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## BenC (Mar 27, 2018)

Greendoc said:


> MSM is a pre against many common broadleaf weeds.


I've never thought of metsulfuron as a PRE. Is there further reading on that? I wouldn't doubt that it is, just never heard of this.


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## SwBermuda (Jun 9, 2019)

which MSM do you guys use? The pre or the one that just says herbicide or both? You just follow directions and pop it in your sprayer? I'm having a little spurge outbreak myself in my lawn as well as the OP. Used the BioAdvanced which cleared it out for a month but it's back in full force and out of nowhere!


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## SwBermuda (Jun 9, 2019)

What kind of concoction would you guys use to get rid of spotted spurge? Problem I'm going to have is going to be the temps. In El Paso we will be in triple digits for the foreseeable future and don't want to bake the lawn. TIA!!


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

Here's what I do to broadleaves that need to be sprayed in hot weather. MSM 60DF at 0.3 grams per 1000 sq ft. Quicksilver(Carfentrazone) 1 ml per 1000 sq ft. Non ionic surfactant at 1/2% of solution volume. MSM applied to an area denies it to growth of broadleaf weeds . The normal broadleaf weed killers like what can be bought at Lowes or HD do not have a residual in the soil


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## SwBermuda (Jun 9, 2019)

Greendoc said:


> Here's what I do to broadleaves that need to be sprayed in hot weather. MSM 60DF at 0.3 grams per 1000 sq ft. Quicksilver(Carfentrazone) 1 ml per 1000 sq ft. Non ionic surfactant at 1/2% of solution volume. MSM applied to an area denies it to growth of broadleaf weeds . The normal broadleaf weed killers like what can be bought at Lowes or HD do not have a residual in the soil


is there a generic Carfentrazone out there?


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

https://www.amazon.com/QuickSilver-...ver+herbicide&qid=1560223765&s=gateway&sr=8-5 Smaller quantity


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## SwBermuda (Jun 9, 2019)

got it. Thanks @Greendoc Do you mix it all in 1 application? I only have a 2.5k sqft lawn.


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

You can. Quicksilver has a range of use from 0.5-2.5 ml per 1000 sq ft


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## SwBermuda (Jun 9, 2019)

Thanks! Ordered a scale to get all these measurements exact. Cannot thank you enough for the help. Will put it down when Amazon delivers it all on Thursday.


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## JWAY (Oct 16, 2018)

Greendoc said:


> https://www.amazon.com/QuickSilver-...ver+herbicide&qid=1560223765&s=gateway&sr=8-5 Smaller quantity


@Greendoc , since that smaller quantity has 12% active ingredient vs 21% for the larger quantity versions, about twice as much should be used, right?


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## gooodawgs (Jul 10, 2020)

Will Dismiss take on the Spurge as well??


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## tincan (Sep 4, 2020)

gooodawgs said:


> Will Dismiss take on the Spurge as well??


I have success with Dismiss (Sulfentrazone) on spurge, and it didn't harm my Bermudagrass.


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## Awar (Feb 25, 2019)

Greendoc said:


> To add to this. I do not count on Prodiamine or Dithiopyr for Spurge control. I count on MSM and if the budget is there Isoxaben(Gallery) as my pre for Spurge. The Spring pre for Spurge can be Prodiamine+Gallery on lawns with a known issue with that weed.


@Greendoc I've been having spurge issues year after year and I totally agree with what you said. I used to have lawn service and they were never successful preventing spurge. The last 2 seasons I used Prodiamine & Dithiopyr as my pre-emergent and I still got a good (i.e. bad) amount of spurge germinate. This year I'm reel mowing so it's much easier to spot the tiny spurge weeds and pull them by hand early.

I already invested in Isoxaben for next spring so I'll add that to my Prodiamine and/or Dithiopyr routine. @Greendoc *do you know at what ground temperature it is best to apply Isoxaben to prevent Spurge?* I start seeing spurge in July and they continue popping up throughout September here in GA!


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

I am not familiar with applying according to ground temperature because every month of the year is weed season for me. But, if you start seeing Spurge in July, that means your Isoxaben should go down in Late May/early June or else the second application of your Prodiamine split if you apply 2 applications in spring


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

@Greendoc Wow! you make a really good point with the soil temps. What is the lowest soil temps you see in HNL.


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## Awar (Feb 25, 2019)

Greendoc said:


> I am not familiar with applying according to ground temperature because every month of the year is weed season for me. But, if you start seeing Spurge in July, that means your Isoxaben should go down in Late May/early June or else the second application of your Prodiamine split if you apply 2 applications in spring


Thanks! I'll apply Isoxaben late April or early May just to be safe then! I still have one app of Prodiamine and I have plenty of Dithiopyr so I think my Prodiamine app will be late February (as usual) and I'll put down a Dithiopyr app along with the Isoxaben late April or early May.

Pre-emergent overkill for next season!


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

cldrunner said:


> @Greendoc Wow! you make a really good point with the soil temps. What is the lowest soil temps you see in HNL.


Mid 70s. Normally it is too hot for Poa Annua to germinate. But, last year, there was a 2 month period from January-February where daytime temperatures were literally 70 and 55 at night. Poa came up. 
Otherwise, it is warm enough for Spurge to germinate and Goosegrass to germinate. Oddly, it is normally also too hot for Crabgrass to want to germinate.


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