# 2022 Partial Renovation - GCI Blue Heat



## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

So... my lawn is jacked. I'd had a pretty good run going but something I did last year has bitten me in the *** this year and I'm not cool with it. I'm not 100% sure, but my theory is that when I levelled with a mixture of sand and topsoil, the topsoil was contaminated and introduced a whole bunch of unwanted grasses to the lawn. I now have a weak stand of KBG and a mixture of all sorts of clumping (fescues?).

As such, the dude will does not abide and now I'm planning a partial reno of the worst parts, combined with an overseed of the rest to try and keep some level of uniformity. I'm hesitant to reno the whole thing as I think it will be a bit ambitious and too stressful given the shape of my yard. Corner lots with sidewalks are a real b*tch.

Pics below - red lines indicate the parts that will be fully renovated, the rest will be overseeded. Renovated areas coincide with certain irrigation zones.

This post to document the disappointing start to this year.

First, due to the spring we had, everything was VERY slow to green up, except really the clumping grasses. Even now, some areas the KBG is still lagging, although seems to have enough energy to produce a bunch of seed heads.

So far this year I've fertilized, done an app of prodiamine mid-April (4 month rate) and aerated (yes, probably nullified my preemergent barrier but by this time I'd already decided to do the renovation and overseed in the fall.

Anyway, I've purchased GCI Turf Blue Heat as it was difficult settling on a seed and this was available and thought it would be fun to try out. More to come.

This because it's the main yard and the worst of the invaded areas.


This because it's small and easy.


Overseed only.


Reno inside the sidewalk.


Inside the sidewalk.


Inside the sidewalk up to the fence line.


Overseed only.


Same.


Same


Getting nuked.


Nuked.


Nuked.


Nuked.


Nuked.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

For reference, here's peakish lawn from last year.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

The plan:

Targeting mid August for seed down. Looking at annual average soil temps though I'm wondering if this might be a bit early. 


Assuming mid-August seed down:

End of May - Order Seeds (DONE) - went with GCI Blue Heat, a blend of Midnight, Everest, NuGlade KBGs
End of June - Glypho the reno areas.
- fallowing - 
Mid July 
​- Scalp, scarify and level with topsoil (possible a sandy loam) depending on what I can find (open to suggestions here)
​- Top dress areas to be overseeded
​ - 2nd round of Glypho
- fallowing -
​- Irrigation audit / adjustments as needed
- source Peat moss
Mid August
​- Rake (approx 1 week prior to seed down)
​- 3rd round Glypho (2 days prior to seed down)
​- Rake (1 day prior)
​- Seed down (seed rates as recommended for reno vs overseed)
​- Roll 
​- Spread peat moss with Landzie spreader 
​- Spray Tenacity
Next 18 days
​- Monitor and watering

Post germination plan to follow as per the Renovation Guide


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## zeus201 (Aug 30, 2017)

Perhaps skip bringing outside soil in again. Level with straight sand, or core aerate heavily and use the cores as leveling material.


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## jskierko (Sep 5, 2020)

mucknine said:


> Targeting mid August for seed down. Looking at annual average soil temps though I'm wondering if this might be a bit early.


For an all-KBG reno in your area I'd say mid-August is perfect. I'm 200 miles south of you and have had seed down dates of Aug 14 and 15 I believe for my fall renos. It gives you some wiggle room to seed bare areas/washout areas and you remove some of the risk of an early frost damaging the new grass. You just have to be vigilant on daytime watering, but it seems like you have a solid plan in place.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

zeus201 said:


> Perhaps skip bringing outside soil in again. Level with straight sand, or core aerate heavily and use the cores as leveling material.


This was actually my original plan, but I worried about the challenge of keeping seed moist in straight sand. Problem on using the aerating cores is that my soil is very clay based, so they harden up quite a bit.


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

Looks like a solid plan.

I wouldn't worry too much about bringing in more soil. Looks like you're planning on fallowing that for a month or more.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

lbb091919 said:


> Looks like a solid plan.
> 
> I wouldn't worry too much about bringing in more soil. Looks like you're planning on fallowing that for a month or more.


Appreciate the comment and support. :thumbup:


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## situman (Nov 3, 2020)

Core aerating will prob bring up evilness from deep down below.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

situman said:


> Core aerating will prob bring up evilness from deep down below.


Yeah, probably, though that cat's out of the bag.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Got me some seed.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

1st application of glypho down last night. So it begins...


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

A little over 1 day post glypho. Looks to be a pretty even kill based on my experience (sample size of one).

Can't wait for the "Oh no! What happened to your lawn?!?!?" conversations.


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

Did you use 41% gly or did it also contain diquat?


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

SNOWBOB11 said:


> Did you use 41% gly or did it also contain diquat?


It had diquat. Is that bad?


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## jskierko (Sep 5, 2020)

Glyphosate will travel down to the roots, diquat will not. You may have fried the plant tissue that was exposed, but odds are a lot of the root systems are still kicking.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Dang it. Given I'm planning two more apps, is it safe to say I'll be able to get everything down to the roots if I get the right stuff (can't believe I didn't do my homework) next time?


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

The Diquat will make the lawn crisp in 3 days. Straight gly usually takes 7-10 days before the lawn is fully brown.

I would try and buy straight glyphosate. Water the area the same as you would if you were germinating seeds (3-5 times a day) and see if you can green back up any areas that are just burned. Then apply the gly to the lawn.

If you don't think you have time to ship from the states you can get straight pre mixed glyphosate from canadian tire or home depot. I don't believe it's sold with diquat any more.


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## jskierko (Sep 5, 2020)

It's not to say that the glyphosate won't work to some extent, but usually the diquat burns the plant tissue before the glyphosate translocates. I'm sure there are people that have had complete success with that product, but it's not necessarily "by the book". Start watering every day to see what you can get growing.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks guys. Have already set to water every day and I'll get some straight gly from Canadian Tire for the next app. Talk about stumbling out of the gates. :dumb:


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Just to be sure, this would work if I can get it quickly? https://www.seedworldusa.com/products/weed-pro-41-glyphosate-herbicide-1-gallon


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## jskierko (Sep 5, 2020)

That'd be a winner.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

jskierko said:


> That'd be a winner.


 :thumbup: Ordered. I'm lucky I'm in a border city and have border crossing hook-ups.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

More background around diquat and why not use it.

https://www.totallandscapecare.com/design-build/grounds-maintenance/article/15031290/chemical-care-taking-diquat-out-of-the-mix

Also, check the label for seeding interval after using diquat. I think it is 4weeks.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

g-man said:


> More background around diquat and why not use it.
> 
> https://www.totallandscapecare.com/design-build/grounds-maintenance/article/15031290/chemical-care-taking-diquat-out-of-the-mix
> 
> Also, check the label for seeding interval after using diquat. I think it is 4weeks.


Also, I keep hearing talk about risks to applicators from Diquat, specifically from the guys on the Grassfactor podcast. There doesn't seem to be much online about it, other than brief info referencing one or two studies that diquat may have similar, though less potent effects as Paraquat on people.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

g-man said:


> More background around diquat and why not use it.
> 
> https://www.totallandscapecare.com/design-build/grounds-maintenance/article/15031290/chemical-care-taking-diquat-out-of-the-mix
> 
> Also, check the label for seeding interval after using diquat. I think it is 4weeks.


Thanks @g-man. According to the label, it's safe to plant grass seed 3 days after application.

On the study, it's interesting and they measure uptake and translocation of Gly which would obviously correlate to effectiveness but they don't actually measure/report on effectiveness. I suppose this is me hanging on to hope that I'll still get a deep kill. In any case, I'll fallow my a$$ offf and do app 2 and 3 with Gly41 and hope for the best.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Picked up the good stuff yesterday and got the 2nd app (first of pure glypho) down this morning. Will wait 1 week before scalping, scarifying and leveling with top soil.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Looking for some advice from those with more experience. As you may have read above, I made the error of doing my first glypho app with a product that included Diquat. Perhaps for that reason, despite having applied another round of glypho 41 8 days ago and another application yesterday, I am still seeing some stubborn greenness across the yard. Given the greenness is from the undesirables (see pics from this morning), I'm hesitant to do the scalping and scarifying, and then topsoil leveling until everything is 100% nuked.

Given the greenness of these undesirables, I'd assume they are actively growing and the glypho would do its thing. As such, I'd assume my app from yesterday morning should take affect with visible results in 7-10 days. However, would have thought the same of the app I did last week.

My question is, do I move on to scarifying this weekend or do I wait until I get 100% confidence that all the bad stuff is dead?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

I would spray gly on the green stuff now. Gly will only enter the plant thru the green growing stuff. I'm assuming you plan to fallow the new soil next week with more gly, correct?


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

g-man said:


> I would spray gly on the green stuff now. Gly will only enter the plant thru the green growing stuff. I'm assuming you plan to fallow the new soil next week with more gly, correct?


Did a 2nd application of gly41 yesterday morning so believe I'm good there. Yes, planning to fallow the soil as well followed by more gly. How long would you wait after that second gly41 app that I did yesterday before scalping, etc?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

One sunny day should be more than enough to move it into the roots.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Awesome. Next question is on my topsoil selection. I have access to two that look quite good, clean, screened. Both are sandy loams and quite fine by my eye, but one has 20% compost added. What would you all choose? Main purpose of adding top soil is levelling but will also use some on the overseeding sections.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

mucknine said:


> Awesome. Next question is on my topsoil selection. I have access to two that look quite good, clean, screened. Both are sandy loams and quite fine by my eye, but one has 20% compost added. What would you all choose? Main purpose of adding top soil is levelling but will also use some on the overseeding sections.


Anyone?


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

Compost will break down over the course of months. If you have lower areas and use compost to level after a while you might be back to where you started.

Now your mix only has 20% which isn't bad but I would go with the sandy loam without compost.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

SNOWBOB11 said:


> Compost will break down over the course of months. If you have lower areas and use compost to level after a while you might be back to where you started.
> 
> Now your mix only has 20% which isn't bad but I would go with the sandy loam without compost.


Thanks. I was leaning that way so done deal.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Did the scarifying and scalping today. Looking pretty good, quite a bit of soil exposed. Still going to level though as I could tell while scarifying there are low areas that I can improve. Will focus mainly on that as opposed to covering everything with topsoil for the sake of it.

Did still see a bit of green here and there, but given my 3 apps of Glypho 41, I'm hoping they are well on their way to death.

Going to have soil delivered asap and get the leveling done this week in the evenings. Continuing to fallow.

Kind of ridiculous, but I'm going to miss the nice contrast of the dead lawn against the boxwood hedges.


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## Jeff_MI84 (Sep 28, 2020)

@mucknine looking good so far. I also made the mistake of using Roundup with diquat. Two apps, the last one was a few weeks ago (mid 90° that week). By the time I scalped, I couldn't see any more green (using exact label rate). Like you, I opted to only put topsoil down where it needed it, thankfully I was advised against it. Do you have a roller or a tamper? I found using a tamper very effective around sprinkler heads and corners edges.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Jeff_MI84 said:


> @mucknine looking good so far. I also made the mistake of using Roundup with diquat. Two apps, the last one was a few weeks ago (mid 90° that week). By the time I scalped, I couldn't see any more green (using exact label rate). Like you, I opted to only put topsoil down where it needed it, thankfully I was advised against it. Do you have a roller or a tamper? I found using a tamper very effective around sprinkler heads and corners edges.


Hi @Jeff_MI84 - going to be fun to follow each other's progress. No tamper or roller, but I was planning to rent a roller. I also have a Landzie levellawn which I'll be using. Will be interesting to see once I start leveling how much I end up doing. It's not perfect at all now, but it's not bad, but there's a good chance my OCD will take over.


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## Jeff_MI84 (Sep 28, 2020)

@mucknine I bougbt a roller a year or two ago and am glad I did. OCD and bumps/ divots, uh oh.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Getting there - have put down a bit more topsoil than I was thinking but once I got started, got OCD about the bumps and levelling.

Levelling and rolling, levelling and rolling. Fallow, fallow, fallow.


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

Looking good. The more OCD you are about the level now, the better off you'll be


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Levelling complete. Saved a bit of topsoil in case I notice an areas that settle or could use tweaking. Clearly OCD combined with available topsoil results in me doing a full coverage. 2 weeks or so to seed down. Watering 3x daily and will also tweak/adjust irrigation coverage in the meantime.


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## Babameca (Jul 29, 2019)

Lovely project. Looking forward to see the progress and how thi mix of KBG cultivars ends up looking!
They are all top tier! Everest fan myself.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Looking very good…. Blue heat looks like a nice blend..


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

This morning I sprayed the weeds that materialized through fallowing.

Hoping to go seed down today, but need to do some final tweaks on irrigation. Has been a bit of a pain the last week or so but decided to call in a professional since he'll have all the parts/nozzles needed. If all goes well when he's here today, planning seed down this evening.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Seed is down. Long evening. Why so many chatty neighbors while you're trying to get something done before the sun goes down?

Well, the sun went down but I got it done anyway.





Irrigation set up for 7:00a, 10:30a, 12:30p, 2:30p, 5:00p and 8:00p. Starting there and will see how it's looking.

Let the waiting begin.


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

Congrats on a successful seed down day. Let the games begin!


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks @lbb091919 .

One question to the group:

Given time constraints last night, I wasn't able to get my Tenacity application down. Should I do this now or wait? If wait, till when?


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

It's probably safe to do it now. You won't have germination for a week.


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## jskierko (Sep 5, 2020)

lbb091919 said:


> It's probably safe to do it now. You won't have germination for a week.


^+1


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Cool. 4 Oz rate, correct?


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## jskierko (Sep 5, 2020)

mucknine said:


> Cool. 4 Oz rate, correct?


Yep, basically a tad over half teaspoon (2.5ml) per 1000 sq ft.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Perfect. Threw that down tonight.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

:x

Well, it happened. 1/2" of heavy downpour overnight and I've got a fair bit of washout.





















Of course we hadn't had any rain like this in weeks if not months.

I've got enough seed left to try and fix but my main challenge will be to figure out where I have no seed and where I have concentrations hidden by peat moss. Seems like I'd be well served to get some erosion blankets to prevent future washouts too. Looks like I can get some from Grainger in Canada but what are you supposed to use to tie it down?

https://www.grainger.ca/en/product/EROSION-CONTROL-BLANKET%2C4-X-112-5-FT-/p/WWG34FY05?analytics=cart


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Round 2. Here we go. Ding ding. Replenished with another 1.5 lbs/M of seed. Another thin layer of peat moss.

Ready for the next storm. Kind of feeling like Lieutenant Dan on the top of the mast right now.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Sorry to see that.. it happens to everyone sooner or later.. Fresh seed and peat moss is like wet concrete to thunderstorms…

Even with most washouts like what you got, you probably would have ended up with pretty good results.. just thinner in some areas. It all eventually fills in..


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks for the encouragement @Stuofsci02. I guess this being my first and relatively small renovation I was up for the extra effort. Had I already been a serial reno-er I might have left a section as is to test.


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

Looks good as new!


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

lbb091919 said:


> Looks good as new!


 :thumbup:


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## rookie_in_VA (Sep 27, 2021)

Good luck on round 2.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

We have babies. Very small litter to start, probably in undisturbed areas from the weekend. Still, like seeing some progress.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

More babies

This is 6 DAS. Pretty impressed.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Awesome.. Seems about right to start seeing action.. I thought you seeded last Wed? DAS 7? Eitherway, right on time for optimal germination.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Stuofsci02 said:


> Awesome.. Seems about right to start seeing action.. I thought you seeded last Wed? DAS 7? Eitherway, right on time for optimal germination.


Ha, funny that you mentioned 6 vs 7 DAS. I seeded Wed night, this was taken Wed morning, so it's really 6.5 DAS. I actually debated what to call it as I was posting.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

mucknine said:


> Stuofsci02 said:
> 
> 
> > Awesome.. Seems about right to start seeing action.. I thought you seeded last Wed? DAS 7? Eitherway, right on time for optimal germination.
> ...


Haha.. At least you know I am following your journal closely .

I have the same thing when comparing my reno last year.. I seeded in the morning last year and late in the day this year, so they are off 6-8 hours when comparing.. Seems trivial, but 6-8 hours is quite a lot in the early stages...


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

:evil:

Queue the grumpy old man lawn chair and cane, fist ready to be shaken.


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

Got to love living in a corner house.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

SNOWBOB11 said:


> Got to love living in a corner house.


Really not great. More to take care of, no real benefit.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

mucknine said:


> :evil:
> 
> Queue the grumpy old man lawn chair and cane, fist ready to be shaken.


Mother F**ker... Why do people do that...


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

That is so frustrating. People will never understand.


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## Chris LI (Oct 26, 2018)




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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Chris LI said:


>


That's the one!


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## LIgrass (May 26, 2017)

mucknine said:


> :evil:
> 
> Queue the grumpy old man lawn chair and cane, fist ready to be shaken.


You could rope or string it off to stop people from cutting across


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

LIgrass said:


> mucknine said:
> 
> 
> > :evil:
> ...


Definitely considered it, but the pessimist in me thought that would be an invitation to mess with it. Going for the 'fly under the radar' approach which doesn't seem to be working either.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

You'll pardon the frequent progress photos. I'm enjoying this immensely.

7.5 DAS


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## uts (Jul 8, 2019)

Daily updates are the only way to do this! Been following along.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Looking fantastic for 7.5 days....


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks @uts , @Stuofsci02 - I gotta admit I'm pretty geeked. Didn't necessarily expect to be in such a good spot at this stage.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

mucknine said:


> Thanks @uts , @Stuofsci02 - I gotta admit I'm pretty geeked. Didn't necessarily expect to be in such a good spot at this stage.


Since the area is small I assume you have very good/even watering coverage. Your prep was also very good with everything covered in peat moss. The results show.. I wish I could have managed this for my 15,000 reno


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Stuofsci02 said:


> mucknine said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks @uts , @Stuofsci02 - I gotta admit I'm pretty geeked. Didn't necessarily expect to be in such a good spot at this stage.
> ...


On the watering coverage, you'd think that because it's small it's easier to be even, but in my case, the shape is really jacked up, so it creates its own challenges. There are definitely inconsistences in there. I think coverage is good in that all areas get water, but there are definitely areas that get more or less water depending on the setup of heads. I wish I'd been more diligent when the system was installed but there were too many things going on all at the same time for me to focus (pool, concrete, fence, landscaping, etc). Excuses, and regrets.

15k vs my 1750 sq ft. I cannot imagine a 10x scale of my reno but can understand why you'd have to make some trade-offs.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

8.5 DAS

Still a couple of areas to fill in but overall pretty nice.

Second from the bottom is the worst of it. Just realized I've got a head that partially covers this zone from another zone and on my regular watering days from non-reno areas it's definitely getting too much water. Thus, I assume, slower germination. Also, it ran this morning and I noticed what potentially looked like a fungus? See the last image. Looks like water droplets hanging on the blades. Any ideas?


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Wow.. looks amazing…. You sure you don't have 50% prg in that mix lol…


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Just double checked. Turns out no! :lol:


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Golden-ish hour. Had to, felt like a bit of a cheat code.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Put her on cruise control…. The only thing to be thinking about is overcrowding, but that can be solved with a heavy dethatch next year.. I think you added more seed after your washout?


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Stuofsci02 said:


> Put her on cruise control…. The only thing to be thinking about is overcrowding, but that can be solved with a heavy dethatch next year.. I think you added more seed after your washout?


Yeah, that's correct. Hopefully I didn't overdo it. I added another 2 lbs or so per 1000 sq ft. So I'm at 6 lbs minus washout vs recommended was 4 lbs.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Current events. Is this what cruise control looks like?


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## livt0ride (Jan 10, 2021)




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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

livt0ride said:


>


Exaaaxtly. Although this wasn't what I had in mind for the pout stage.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

You will be surprise how much actually survives.


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## Jeff_MI84 (Sep 28, 2020)

@mucknine I feel your pain. Metro Detroit got hit with 1/2" so far.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Yeah, maybe not so bad. Just seems to have washed around the peat moss. Although that was just round 1. Another bigger one supposed to be rolling through in a few hours.

Fortunate I got such good germination so quickly


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## jskierko (Sep 5, 2020)

Definitely looks much better than expected after the amount of water that was in your pics. I doubt you'll even have to drop more seed.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

I wish my reno looked like that… you are still in good shape..


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

Don't even worry about it. Even your after pictures don't look that bad. You'll be good.

On a side note I like how you kept that small area beside your garage grass and not a big garden. I was thinking it would actually make a good area to put a putting green.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks for the support fellas. Given my virgin status on renos it's helpful to have the reassurance. I don't feel too stressed, just might come down to advice on what I should do, if anything after the second wave tonight.

Will report back in the morning.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Jeff_MI84 said:


> @mucknine I feel your pain. Metro Detroit got hit with 1/2" so far.


Same storm, I'm just across the border. You're basically my preview. Fingers crossed for tonight my friend.

How'd you make out on the first storm? We had some decent sized hail for a bit too.


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## Babameca (Jul 29, 2019)

Just coming over to us... not a concern by now for me, but had similar to yours on around DAS 12.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

I think I made out just fine. We were supposed to get an even bigger storm during the night but it didn't materialize.

I'm tempted to use a broom/rake to even out the peat moss that has collected in washboard patterns. Any reason not to? I haven't been walking on it at all yet (except to level out bike tracks - :evil.


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## livt0ride (Jan 10, 2021)

Don't do it. You will just end up pulling out grass. You still look pretty decent. Just sand level later. I assume you were planning on that anyway.


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## Babameca (Jul 29, 2019)

I had absolutely no issue with slightly raking peat back. Used a stiff sparse rake and not digging at all. It worked great. Look at my journal.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

@Babameca @livt0ride - Might gently try a couple of areas to see what happens. I get the sense though that it's rooted fairly well just feeling around on there (as you would). I was actually more worried about walking on in and trampling it.


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## Babameca (Jul 29, 2019)

mucknine said:


> @Babameca @livt0ride - Might gently try a couple of areas to see what happens. I get the sense though that it's rooted fairly well just feeling around on there (as you would). I was actually more worried about walking on in and trampling it.


Your grass is not dense as a mature stand. No pulling will occur. Keep the handle almost horizontal to avoid digging. Don't worry about the walking as long as it is with a purpose.


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## 7824 (Oct 23, 2019)

mucknine said:


> Golden-ish hour. Had to, felt like a bit of a cheat code.


Looks great! You want the ultimate cheat code....try bending down and shining a flashlight across it after dark. You will be amazed at how it shows all the baby sprouts that the sunlight hides. Your growth might be past that stage by now though. However, it will help identify germination in areas that you are worried may have been washed out.


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

learningeveryday said:


> Looks great! You want the ultimate cheat code....try bending down and shining a flashlight across it after dark. You will be amazed at how it shows all the baby sprouts that the sunlight hides. Your growth might be past that stage by now though. However, it will help identify germination in areas that you are worried may have been washed out.


Agreed. Night time shots with a flashlight are what keep you sane during this stage!


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

learningeveryday said:


> mucknine said:
> 
> 
> > Golden-ish hour. Had to, felt like a bit of a cheat code.
> ...


Thanks! @learningeveryday I've been doing the flashlight thing but I think I'm now at the stage where my favorite angle is driving up sitting low in my car, almost looks like a full lawn. Viewing under diff lights and angles is all part of the fun for sure.


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## Jeff_MI84 (Sep 28, 2020)

It wasn't that bad for me, the worst of the worst didn't last too long.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Jeff_MI84 said:


> It wasn't that bad for me, the worst of the worst didn't last too long.


Glad to hear it!


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

16 DAS
10 DAG

Early morning shots.

Checked most areas with flashlight last night. Looks like coverage is good, just masked in the daylight in the areas where the peat moss washed out. Not planning to add any seed at this stage.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Looks great... Should really pick up in the next 10 days...


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks @Stuofsci02


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

I would start adding nitrogen in 4 days.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

SNOWBOB11 said:


> I would start adding nitrogen in 4 days.


I like it, works out great for a lil' Labour Day activity. I've got a bag of starter granular and a stock of AS and Urea. Was planning to drop the granular at bag rate. What would you recommend?

Granular is all SCU and bag rate would be 0.75 N/M.


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

Forget the starter for now. Do 1 lb AMS per k or 1/2 lb urea per k weekly once you get going. .75 lb/k nitrogen is too much for young seeds right now.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

SNOWBOB11 said:


> Forget the starter for now. Do 1 lb AMS per k or 1/2 lb urea per k weekly once you get going. .75 lb/k nitrogen is too much for young seeds right now.


OK, I would have thought the slow-release N at 0.75 lbs/k would work well, plus the additional P would be good for the new babies though.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

mucknine said:


> SNOWBOB11 said:
> 
> 
> > Forget the starter for now. Do 1 lb AMS per k or 1/2 lb urea per k weekly once you get going. .75 lb/k nitrogen is too much for young seeds right now.
> ...


Did you apply starter at seed down?


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## 7824 (Oct 23, 2019)

On a coner lot and didn't even need to rope it off! Well done. You have some courteous neighbors! That's great.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Stuofsci02 said:


> mucknine said:
> 
> 
> > SNOWBOB11 said:
> ...


Nope. Believe renovation guide suggested seeds have all they need so skipped it.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

learningeveryday said:


> On a coner lot and didn't even need to rope it off! Well done. You have some courteous neighbors! That's great.


I had a couple of issues you'll see a few posts back but overall not too bad.

Funny, tonight walked the dog with the wife and when we approached our house a kid took a half a step on the grass. I was silent and she jumped all over him. Gotta love the spousal support


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

mucknine said:


> Stuofsci02 said:
> 
> 
> > mucknine said:
> ...


Then now would be the time IMO….


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Stuofsci02 said:


> mucknine said:
> 
> 
> > Stuofsci02 said:
> ...


4-letters. LOTM.

Ok, I'll buy from you.


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

Well I haven't won LOTM so it's understandable if you don't want to take my advice but if you want to re look at the renovation guide it (as well as a few university studies) do recommend a fast source of nitrogen for your new grass. Maybe that will change your mind maybe it won't but worth it to consider.


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## Babameca (Jul 29, 2019)

I would completely skip starter if your soil is high enough on P and your new grass doesn't show signs of P deficiency as was the case with another forum member. Now a YT star.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

mucknine said:


> Stuofsci02 said:
> 
> 
> > mucknine said:
> ...


I don't think that is a good reason. Unless you know you P is good, or if you already have the starter fert and were planning to put it down, now would be the time for the starter. If your P is good then you could go to straight Ams or urea.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Sorry @SNOWBOB11 I meant no offense. I can't stress enough how much I appreciate the support and advice from this group.

Based on my soil test I have medium P. I had already bought the starter fert and ended up putting it down this morning.

Assuming I'll be able to switch over to fast N with weekly spoon feeds in 3 weeks or so?


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Your Reno is going great!! With the starter down I agree that switching to a fast release in a few weeks is the way to go. This is going to look great…. It's one I am watching…


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thinking we might almost be ready for a first cut with manual reel mower. Opinions?


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Looks great. I think you could certainly put the manual reel on it. You could also give it a few more days.. Either way…. Great work. One of the nicest Reno's I've seen..


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Haven't mentioned since my first posts but I'm also doing a (somewhat late) aggressive overseed of my non-reno'd areas. Right on schedule, 6 days post seed down we have babies again. Now it's just about timing a mow. Even the I scalped and scarified and held off any N, still get growth out of the existing KBG.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Very cool! Was your overseed PRG or did you overseed kbg?


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

@Stuofsci02 I overseeded KBG. Wanted to go with the same stuff as the reno to see if it would blend a bit with the reno'd areas. I know overseeding KBG is not ideal, but plan is to reno all these areas next year anyway so call it a bit of an experiment. What's the worst that can happen?


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## rookie_in_VA (Sep 27, 2021)

Looks tremendous.


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## Chris LI (Oct 26, 2018)

I'm really enjoying watching your progress! It looks fantastic!


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

rookie_in_VA said:


> Looks tremendous.


Thanks! I'm definitely thrilled with the results so far. As @Stuofsci02 said a while back it seems possible I'll end up with crowding but will deal with that if and when it comes.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Chris LI said:


> I'm really enjoying watching your progress! It looks fantastic!


Thanks! Been a joy thus far.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

mucknine said:


> @Stuofsci02 I overseeded KBG. Wanted to go with the same stuff as the reno to see if it would blend a bit with the reno'd areas. I know overseeding KBG is not ideal, but plan is to reno all these areas next year anyway so call it a bit of an experiment. What's the worst that can happen?


That's awesome.. You are having amazing results with that Blue Heat..


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

First mow (with manual reel) coming tonight. I'm giddy.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

That was fun. Blue heat looks like it might be stripey. My old stuff I really had to burn em in.

Manual Fiskars on 1" HOC setting.

I think it was good to get a cut in, some areas were definitely ready.

Looks really yardy already.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Spider webs I think.

Haven't put down any preventative fungicide. Have some Headway G. Probably a good idea?


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## rhart (May 7, 2020)

Looking great!


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

rhart said:


> Looking great!


Appreciate it a lot - you've set a pretty strong benchmark with your reno last year but I'm very happy with how things are with mine so far.


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

Those look like spider webs. I applied Azoxy at seed down and then Propiconazole at 50 DAS when some DS showed up.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Spiderweb.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

@lbb091919 @g-man :thumbup:


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

2nd cut. Manual reel set to 1".

Was also gonna gently trim the overseeded areas but too wet. Unfortunately going away for 4 days and will just have to let it ride. Fingers crossed. Fortunately I can adjust irrigation remotely if necessary.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Looks great.. two more weeks and most people will not know it was recently seeded..


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Back after 4 day work trip. Got off the plane from the UK and went for the mower basically first thing. Fair bit of growth while I was away, both height and thickening.

Colour wise, to my eye looks like it's gotten a bit lighter, could be lighting, could also be less soil/pest moss showing through.

Been about 11 days since I put down starter fert and I'm thinking it might be time for a light app of straight N via AS.


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## livt0ride (Jan 10, 2021)

Great job on the Reno. Looks like smooth sailing from here.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

To this point, I'd been slowly dialing back the watering frequency and increasing the duration but was still going 4x per day. Just changed to 2x per day. Given state of the lawn, does this sound about right?


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

That sounds about right. I reduced my frequency/increased duration right after the first mow. Next reduction was at 30 DAG 1x per day.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

lbb091919 said:


> That sounds about right. I reduced my frequency/increased duration right after the first mow. Next reduction was at 30 DAG 1x per day.


Super helpful - thanks for confirming.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Found a couple of these guys. Given I have 3 varieties of of KBG and boat shaped tip, thought it was possible it was not an undesirable, but given fineness of the majority of lawn thus far it and the fact that I only found a few I think they're unwanted. Any ideas on what these are? I'm useless on ID'ing weeds/grasses.

You can see the finer blades on the left of the second image.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

They are things you don't want in the lawn... Without getting up close it is hard to say.. Could be some annual rye..


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

4th cut today. North/south stripes are my favorite. Fiskars manual reel set at 1" HOC. Keeps growing in. Still stubborn in the one area that gets the most shade. Hopefully thick enough that it will fill in completely over time.


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## Babameca (Jul 29, 2019)

This looks good! You will have a full coverage next summer. Don't stress out too much. Feed it and it will spread crazy the first full season.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Eyeing up one of these bad boys. Like a lot about what they've done on the design here. Really everything but the price point.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Babameca said:


> This looks good! You will have a full coverage next summer. Don't stress out too much. Feed it and it will spread crazy the first full season.


I agree with this statement except I will change next summer to end of season…


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

mucknine said:


> Eyeing up one of these bad boys. Like a lot about what they've done on the design here. Really everything but the price point.


I would consider buying the ego with a tool. You basically get the tool for free.

For example, this backpack blower gets you the charger and a 7.5ah bat for $599.

https://www.lowes.ca/product/cordless-electric-leaf-blowers/ego-power-56-volt-lithium-ion-600-cfm-backpack-blower-kit-with-75ah-battery-and-charger-2546184


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Stuofsci02 said:


> mucknine said:
> 
> 
> > Eyeing up one of these bad boys. Like a lot about what they've done on the design here. Really everything but the price point.
> ...


Now that's a good idea. I've got the power head with string trimmer and edger. Have DeWalt blower but maybe that gets taken to the cottage and I get a new Ego one for home. Will see what else there is… good call.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

27 DAG

Midday mow, good lighting.

Also, pulled the trigger on the Allett Stirling 51. Xmas coming early (again). Supposed to have it in a few weeks.

Tonight, I'm gonna spray .25 lbs of N for the first time. Exciting stuff.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Looks good and ready!


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

Congrats on the early Christmas present and the first N app. It's looking so good.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

:thumbup:

@Stuofsci02 @lbb091919


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Been noticing some unevenness in the colour. I'm thinking either it's some plants that are more mature (hoping it's this) or there are some unwanteds in there (doesn't look like it to me).

Hoping that N application will push growth all over and catch things up and even it out.

Also, I have not applied a fungicide at all yet. Perhaps a mistake but thinking I'll do that now. Have Headway G on on hand. Any recommendations on rates? Anyone know if it's possible to do foliar application of Headway G?


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## SNOWBOB11 (Aug 31, 2017)

It looks like it needs nitrogen.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

SNOWBOB11 said:


> It looks like it needs nitrogen.


Thought so too. Did 0.3 lbs of N via Urea last night. We'll see how that kicks in.

Put down some Headway G today too. Figured can't hurt.


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## solarcrisis (Jun 24, 2019)

mucknine said:


> Found a couple of these guys. Given I have 3 varieties of of KBG and boat shaped tip, thought it was possible it was not an undesirable, but given fineness of the majority of lawn thus far it and the fact that I only found a few I think they're unwanted. Any ideas on what these are? I'm useless on ID'ing weeds/grasses.
> 
> You can see the finer blades on the left of the second image.




Does this look like what you have? 
If it's identical.. you have goose grass.. also called silver grass


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

solarcrisis said:


> mucknine said:
> 
> 
> > Found a couple of these guys. Given I have 3 varieties of of KBG and boat shaped tip, thought it was possible it was not an undesirable, but given fineness of the majority of lawn thus far it and the fact that I only found a few I think they're unwanted. Any ideas on what these are? I'm useless on ID'ing weeds/grasses.
> ...


I don't think so, but fortunately it's difficult to check as I haven't found any more since I posted. If I do I'll compare so thanks for posting.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

30 DAG

Nitrogen is doing its thing so I've got that going for me. Which is nice. Temperatures fell off a cliff today from about 85° yesterday to high of 63° today.

I'm now going to a once daily watering schedule. Mowing every 2-3 days atm.


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## rhart (May 7, 2020)

Congrats on a great looking reno!!


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## lbb091919 (Apr 26, 2020)

Looking excellent. I think everyone is enjoying these cooler temps.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thought this looked nice.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Was looking hungry again already. Sprayed another 0.25 N from Urea after an early morning mow.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Fresh cut fresh pics

34 DAG


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## Marzbar (Aug 2, 2020)

It's filling in very nicely. Congrats.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks @Marzbar !


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Haven't done any post germination Tenacity application, seeing very little weed pressure. Reno guide suggests 28 DAG. Still ok to do one now? And then late season Prodiamine too?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

If weed pressure is low, then you can skip it.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks @g-man 

sounds good.


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## Ben4Birdies (12 mo ago)

Looking really good! Spring is going to be fun to see it really take off.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks @Ben4Birdies 
If Spring is anything like the last couple of weeks have been I’m gonna love it.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Looks like a perfect reno! Well done!


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)




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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Sprayed 0.25 of N and first little shot of FS and citric acid.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

First cut with the Allett Stirling. Looking pretty good. Was away for over a week so she’s due some N.









…and then I edged the reno for the first time and the sun came out. A guy came to pick something up and asked me how I liked my artificial turf. That’s a compliment, right?


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## nismodrifter (6 mo ago)

Looks very good. Love seeing Canadian content. 

Did you have a striping kit on your Fiskars? If so, what kind of setup were you running. 

Congrats on the Allett.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Thanks.

Yes, I made a DIY striping mod to the Fiskars. Essentially just added a front roller out of ABS plumbing and fit it in between the front wheels with threaded rod. Works decent.


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## Marzbar (Aug 2, 2020)

Wow! Great looking Reno. What is your HOC?


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Marzbar said:


> Wow! Great looking Reno. What is your HOC?


Thanks! Had the Stirling set to 7/8”.


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)




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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Looking really great.. Just wait until next fall.. You will have your flabber gasted..


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## mucknine (Jul 8, 2019)

Stuofsci02 said:


> Looking really great.. Just wait until next fall.. You will have your flabber gasted..


Haha. Gives me a year to prepare my flabber!


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