# Help with Midwest Lab reports



## GoDawgs (Jun 18, 2020)

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I ordered the "belt and suspenders" that @Ridgerunner hinted to in one of his many helpful posts. I followed Ware and ridge runners advise when collecting samples with a 6" soil probe.

The first 2 are the lawn and the last 3 are flower beds.

I had hoped the lab would give me a little more guidance but my guess is most people they deal with have a much better understanding of the results than myself.


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

Your version of "belt and suspenders" is a bit different than mine. Regardless, it appears samples 1 and 2 (Bermuda and Zeon) were done using S3M, but I'm unfamiliar with what test package was used for the trees and garden areas unless you requested separate test for Nitrate, OM, pH, BpH and Salt content.
S3M use the M3 extract. Sufficiency level ranges are as follows:
P: 26-54
Ca: 500-750
Mg: 70-140, 60-120 for sands
K: 75-176, 50-116 for sands
Na: unreported/N.A.
S: 15-40
Fe: 50-100
Cu: 0.4-2.5
Zn: 1-2
Mn: 4-8, 8-16 for pH >7
B: 0.4/0.5- 1.5
Micro-nutrients are adequate across the board
Calcium and Magnesium are solidly within ranges as is Potassium which will only need maintenance applications to hold steady (something between .5 to 1 lb/M for every pound of N applied).
Phosphorous is low to deficient. Calculate the amount needed to raise ppm levels to above 26, preferably something in the 40-50 range and then do maintenance applications. Spread the total needed amount over 3-4 apps spaced from early Spring to early Fall/late Summer.
You can use the 8 step guide found here
pH at 6 and 6.1 shouldn't be an issue. Many prefer a lower pH to combat disease. However if you do decide to raise pH, it won't take much lime (e.g. prob. 10-15 lbs/M) with the low CEC whether it's clay or sand.


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## GoDawgs (Jun 18, 2020)

@Ridgerunner thank you for your reply and willingness to share your knowledge with a complete stranger. I should have saved that post for when I had time to reply. Currently traveling. I'll review your reply in detail as soon as I'm back home. I'm thinking maybe they didn't test the way I asked? What I asked for was:
S3c with Olsen P and S3m grass front and back.

S3c flower beds as well

Is that not what I received?


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

The report you received is on a Mehlich 3 template, so you did receive all of the S3M data. On second look, it kinda appears that they may have attempted to populate the S3M template with S3C data which could only partially populate. The S3C data would need it's own template (Ammonium Acetate) to populate correctly. (I've seen similar programing type errors now and then with Midwest Reports) If Midwest charged you for 5 S3C and 2 S3M tests, there is some evidence that they performed the tests and you should have gotten what you paid for, but they did not correctly report them. Give them a call and ask them to adjust the results so that they are on the proper templates and all results are reported. In the meantime, check your Midwest account and make sure there isn't already a separate S3C report on the dashboard.


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## GoDawgs (Jun 18, 2020)

Thank you. I will reach out to them next week and see what I'm being charged for. They didn't not charge me ahead of time so I have no way of knowing what I was charged. I'll report back. Thanks again!


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## GoDawgs (Jun 18, 2020)

Hi @Ridgerunner I was finally able to get a copy of the form I filled out. I'm thinking maybe I did not get what I had asked for. See below. Not overly concerned and it does not look like I was over charged from what I can tell. More importantly I want to make sure I get the proper test done next year.


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

Yes. you paid for 2 S3M (M3) tests for sample areas #1 and #2. Your results are on the form. However you also paid for 3 S3C tests for sample areas #3, #4 and #5. You only got part of the results for those three areas. For each of those sample areas, you should have received S3C values for P, K Ca, Mg and Na. You should have received values for CEC and base cations percentages as well as values for the micro-nutrients S, Zn, Mn, Fe, Cu and B. You didn't receive those results. The spaces are blank. You paid for those values and should get them. Call and explain this to them and ask them to put the S3C results on a separate proper report.


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

Yes. you paid for 2 S3M (M3) tests for sample areas #1 and #2. Your results are on the form. However you also paid for 3 S3C tests for sample areas #3, #4 and #5. You only got part of the results for those three areas. For each of those sample areas, you should have received S3C (AA, B1 and B2 and Olsen) values for P, K Ca, Mg and Na. You should have received values for CEC and base cations percentages as well as values for the micro-nutrients S, Zn, Mn, Fe, Cu and B. You didn't receive those results. The spaces are blank. You paid for those values and should get them. Call and explain this to them and ask them to put the S3C results on a separate proper report.


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## GoDawgs (Jun 18, 2020)

@Ridgerunner Thank you for confirming. I have reached out to them via email and I will let you know if I can get the other results. Your knowledge is greatly appreciated!


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## GoDawgs (Jun 18, 2020)

@Ridgerunner i was able to obtain the rest of what I had ordered. Does this look more like what I should have received? Any further recommendations or comments you can offer?

I've put all 3 reports below.


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

Yes. You now have the results you paid for (but not all that you requested, which is good as you saved some money and didn't need all of them as your pH is <7). Images #1 and #3 are what you need to work with, throw away image #2. I've already posted the ranges for M3 above, and the sufficiency ranges for S3C can be found here: https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=19625#p19625 and https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=19631#p19631 and https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=19632#p19632. Check your values against the ranges and identify those that are outside of range. Then check the write up on how to adjust and maintain in my guide. If you have questions feel free to ask.


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## GoDawgs (Jun 18, 2020)

Thank you @Ridgerunner i have some homework to do. For some reason this is a foreign language to me no matter how many times I read it.


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

My pleasure. Feel free to give me a shout should you get stuck or have questions. Once you get the hang of it, you'll see how simple stupid and easy it actually is to do the calculations.


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## RichS (Jan 28, 2019)

A side note that this brings up: Something's going on with Midwest. I requested the same S3M (M3) test as I've received from the the last two years and they basically refused. They sent me the Ammonium Acetate/DTPA report above, at twice the price, and said I could talk to their agronomist about why it was better because they provide recommendations, and how to translate from my "old" data.

So not being able to compare year-over-year changes, I just tossed it and won't be using them again. (I also am dropping Logan, so Waypoint and A&L Great Lakes will remain my go-to's).

(The test also said my pH was 6.1 vs consistently 6.4-6.7 over several years from all labs, including their own M3).


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

RichS said:


> A side note that this brings up: Something's going on with Midwest. I requested the same S3M (M3) test as I've received from the the last two years and they basically refused. They sent me the Ammonium Acetate/DTPA report above, at twice the price, and said I could talk to their agronomist about why it was better because they provide recommendations, and how to translate from my "old" data.
> 
> So not being able to compare year-over-year changes, I just tossed it and won't be using them again. (I also am dropping Logan, so Waypoint and A&L Great Lakes will remain my go-to's).
> 
> (The test also said my pH was 6.1 vs consistently 6.4-6.7 over several years from all labs, including their own M3).


What did the agronomist have to say? You have been getting testing done by Midwest, Logan, Wayside and A&L for the past 2 years? It'd be interesting to see all of those results.


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## GoDawgs (Jun 18, 2020)

@Ridgerunner i have struggled to find the time to research this enough. From what I can tell I need a fertilizer with high P and no K. I'm not having any luck finding something like that so that tells me I'm barking up the wrong tree. Can you recommend something for me?

I was also told the melich was not what I should be using to test in the future. As much as I wanted to stay with one company I think I'll move on to a different next year. I need something that is straight forward and that I can comprehend. Unfortunately life is not allowing me to put in the time to actually learn what I need to in regards to soil results and how to correct.

Any input would be extremely appreciated.


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## Ridgerunner (May 16, 2017)

Easiest option: For this season use a triple NPK (10-10-10, 12-12-12, 19-19-19, etc.) as your regular fertilizer for both the Bermuda and the Zeon. Retest Spring of next year.


> I was also told the melich was not what I should be using to test in the future.


Who told you this? What method dd they suggest?


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## GoDawgs (Jun 18, 2020)

Thank you for the rec and all of the helpful information. The agronomist at Midwest said next time not to use the melich. Unfortunately I can't remember what he said I needed to ask for. He was none to happy with my lack of understanding his lingo. And I completely understand that. I may try out a different lab next year but I'm definitely going to find time to learn a little more about it between now and then.


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