# Quack Grass



## Schaef (May 28, 2018)

I've been recently doing some research on quack grass and how much of a pain it is. After doing some reading and how to identify it properly, I went into my yard and realized I have quack grass (not a ridiculous amount, just here and there) :evil: :evil: 
I read the best way to get rid of it is using round-up and basically "painting" the big leaves, but before I buy round-up and starting going to town I have a few questions.

1. One video I watched said you need a high rate of round-up, which I'm guessing means a higher concentrated dilution?
2. Will the round-up penetrate into the rhizome and kill off the entire branch of quack grass?
2a. Will painting the leaves have less effect of this occurring than say spraying the quack grass?
3 How fast would I see results of killing of the entire rhizome chain?
4. Is this a winnable battle without nuking the entire lawn and doing reno (not really an option at this point lol)


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

1) not really. I think I saw a version that was more of a paste than liquid. I be also read of mixing it with corn starch. I just use the liquid stuff and it worked for me.
2)yes
3)if quack is actively growing, within days you should see quack dieing. I can't see the rhizome, but it kills it too.
4) very winanble. You will be amazed how many folks battle it after a Reno. Just don't give it any chance for a year. The lawn might not look perfect that year, but you will win the war.


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## Schaef (May 28, 2018)

Awesome, that's good to hear. So, if I paint leaves on one stem of quack grass, I should see the other grass stems/leaves die if they are connected underground?
Also, will the round-up we have in Ontario (I believe its 7g/L glyphosate) be strong enough to kill it properly?


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## GrassDaddy (Mar 21, 2017)

It's a pain but winnable. I need to get started on my patch, it's pretty small though so I keep putting it off.


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## TLFU (Aug 4, 2017)

I just painted a bunch of quack a couple weeks ago (a complete reno last fall) and sprayed a lot of quack around the perimeter. I got lazy with painting and made big strokes around the quack. It's yellow now (though I see some younglings popping up..round 2?!). Can't really see any green grass below it. Advice: use smaller brush. Be precise with painting. Be patient. Use glyph 41% or w/e that high concentrate is and use blue marking die when painting to help you see where you've already painted. Best of luck.


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## Grasshopper (Nov 12, 2017)

Just bought the 7g/l and will be painting this week.
I think gman tried using it before and said it works.

Didn't know what quack was until recently and I core aerated heavily last fall so its coming up everywhere.... 
Found a few tips of the rhizomes in the sod while digging for a garden bed. Pretty sharp end, no wonder it spreads like crazy.


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## jimmy (Jul 25, 2017)

TLFU said:


> I just painted a bunch of quack a couple weeks ago (a complete reno last fall) and sprayed a lot of quack around the perimeter.


Same here. I used a small cheap foam paintbrush and was pretty liberal with my painting. I killed a bit more of the surrounding grass than I intended, but mostly knocked out the quack. I'll probably go for round two this week if I have time. Not much left, but I want to be thorough so it doesn't come back...though this is the yard on the side of the driveway and my neighbor's yard has a lot of quack, so I'll probably be fighting from his yard. Hopefully the KBG can get thick enough to keep it out.


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## jessehurlburt (Oct 18, 2017)

If you have the 41% glyph, would you dilute it at all? I need to get after my patch. The fact that painting one leaf could take out several other connected leaves makes this seem more doable.


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## GrassDaddy (Mar 21, 2017)

I wouldn't just because it's more of a hassle to mix it for such a small amount


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## jimmy (Jul 25, 2017)

I diluted it, but maybe wouldn't per the label in the future, since I had so much left over and not really a great place to store it. Diluting a quick pour of the stuff with however much water you need would work. It'll probably be stronger than needed, but you are only painting a tiny bit on the leaves.

Either way, make sure you are wearing gloves.


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## Delmarva Keith (May 12, 2018)

jessehurlburt said:


> If you have the 41% glyph, would you dilute it at all? I need to get after my patch. The fact that painting one leaf could take out several other connected leaves makes this seem more doable.


I've seen it suggested to dilute it down to 30% AI. Basically you are doing an experiment with two things going on. One: you need to have the plant transport enough gly to all of its growing points to kill the plant. Since you will just paint part of a leaf or two, you need a high rate. But two: if you apply too high of a rate, plants with intertwined roots (like the turf right next to it) will also get a dose and may also die.

I've never gone higher than 13 oz. of 53.8% gly per gallon of water (5.5% AI). At that rate, covering just part of a plant leaf is still very effective. Interpreting the label a little bit,, directly brushing even undiluted onto an undesired plant is still legal. You might run some trials real quick and see what rate based on your painting technique results in weed kill but no or minimal turf damage.


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## TLFU (Aug 4, 2017)

jimmy said:


> TLFU said:
> 
> 
> > I just painted a bunch of quack a couple weeks ago (a complete reno last fall) and sprayed a lot of quack around the perimeter.
> ...


Yea, quack is the worst!! they spread like crazy. best of luck. I'll go for a round 2 too. :thumbup:

Also, I didn't dilute it when using.


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## jessehurlburt (Oct 18, 2017)

I wonder now how many leaves are apart of a single plant. Since they grow via rhizomes how many leaves could potentially be connected? So if you paint one leaf and there are 20 other shoots off that rhizome you can kill them all with painting one leaf?


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## Schaef (May 28, 2018)

jessehurlburt said:


> I wonder now how many leaves are apart of a single plant. Since they grow via rhizomes how many leaves could potentially be connected? So if you paint one leaf and there are 20 other shoots off that rhizome you can kill them all with painting one leaf?


This is kind of what I was wondering, I'm curious to know how far it would travel.


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## beastcivic (Mar 26, 2018)

Not sure the full strength (41%) is needed. I diluted mine down to 2 oz per gallon (I wasn't super accurate, it might have been more like 2.25oz per gallon), and lightly sprayed the orchard and quack in my in-laws yard. It took a full 7 days to really look like it was dying, by 10 days it was totally brown, definitely dead.

But if you're buying a small bottle and don't want any left over, go for full strength if you want to. Just seems like over kill (no pun intended).


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## Alan (Apr 23, 2017)

Found this during a Google Image search...yuck:


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## ABC123 (Jul 14, 2017)

If your concerned with quack light N apps will help battle quack over several years. I've done it to a large property, but if you ever let off the N and have mostly poa it will convert back in about 18 months. It's a very aggressive plant and it can regenerate from roots 3x over.


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## Schaef (May 28, 2018)

Now, to find a way to do this without my neighbors thinking that I've lost my mind because I'm painting blades of grass with a paint brush. :lol: :lol:


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## chrisben (Sep 11, 2017)

Wear dark clothes and do it in the dark? =)


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## gene_stl (Oct 29, 2017)

I was just at Home Depot looking at what they stock and there is a Roundup branded gel applier intended for "painting" type jobs. It was $10. I didn't buy one but I was tempted.


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## TLFU (Aug 4, 2017)

Heard those gel applier isn't that effective, If you do decide to get one, YMMV.


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## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)

ABC123 said:


> If your concerned with quack light N apps will help battle quack over several years. I've done it to a large property, but if you ever let off the N and have mostly poa it will convert back in about 18 months. It's a very aggressive plant and it can regenerate from roots 3x over.


@ABC123 Sorry.... I'm not quite sure what you mean with the "light N apps"? I'm having struggles with all sorts of weeds and plants due to neglect and I do see plenty of quack, which I know does not have an easy solution. Even roundup is verboten in Manitoba, so painting is out, as is the nuclear option... my only choice would be a complete mechanical removal of the current grass, then sod and hope for the best, something I can't afford right now.


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## ABC123 (Jul 14, 2017)

N stands for nitrogen and the common form used is the quick release type called urea. If you have any bluegrass your yard can greatly improve and be rather inexpensive.

https://dodge.uwex.edu/2011/07/quack-grass-control/


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## Delmarva Keith (May 12, 2018)

kaptain_zero said:


> Sorry.... I'm not quite sure what you mean with the "light N apps"? I'm having struggles with all sorts of weeds and plants due to neglect and I do see plenty of quack, which I know does not have an easy solution. Even roundup is verboten in Manitoba, so painting is out, as is the nuclear option... my only choice would be a complete mechanical removal of the current grass, then sod and hope for the best, something I can't afford right now.


I read it to mean frequent low rate fertilizer apps to try to thicken up the desirable turf. In addition, you can aggressively aerate and overseed in late summer every year with that goal in mind. Use the most agressively growing seed for your region that you can get your hands on. Unfortunately it's unlikely you will ever completely eliminate it but I'm not sure you have a lot of other options in Canada.


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## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)

ABC123 said:


> N stands for nitrogen and the common form used is the quick release type called urea. If you have any bluegrass your yard can greatly improve and be rather inexpensive.
> 
> https://dodge.uwex.edu/2011/07/quack-grass-control/


@ABC123 @Delmarva Keith Thanks for the link and the clarification. Yes, our hands are tied in Canada.... not much left on the shelves to buy and the internet source often quoted here seems to be charging double of what a product is sold for at regular stores that can still sell it. I suppose I can't blame them from wanting to make a quick profit.

The method is clear now and I know that urea is a "quick" nitrogen vs some of the organics. I am wondering though..... can an organic type fertilizer be used to give the same spoon feed N levels? I realize it wouldn't have the instant "shock and awe" effect, but after a couple of apps, I'm thinking it might even out?!?!?! I don't know of course, I'm just airing the cobwebs in my tiny little brain.

Regards

Kaptain "Huh.... what?!?! Oooh..... doughnuts!" Zero :mrgreen:


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## Delmarva Keith (May 12, 2018)

kaptain_zero said:


> ABC123 said:
> 
> 
> > N stands for nitrogen and the common form used is the quick release type called urea. If you have any bluegrass your yard can greatly improve and be rather inexpensive.
> ...


The plant doesn't know or care if the N source is synthetic or organic; all it does is take up N that is in a form available for uptake. Slow release is what you want. That can be organic or synthetic, makes no difference. On a bag of fertilizer it will tell you what percent of the total N is water insoluble N. A good guideline is around at least third of total N be water insoluble N.

Another approach could be very low rates of fast release water soluble N very often (like a sixteenth to an eighth pound N, depending on the weather, once a week). I don't see that as practical unless you really, really enjoy pushing a spreader all the time or have your own grounds crew to do it when you tell them.


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## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)

@Delmarva Keith Thank you again! I think 2 weeks between applications will be plenty. I've already had to step up to mowing twice a week (we had almost no rain all last summer, this year we're drowning).

As for that lazy, no good for nothing, grounds crew I have...... <sigh>


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## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)

Just in case my math skills are worse than I think they are, my poison of choice will be Turkey Trot 6 -4 - 6. I have roughly 3000 square feet of turf and my plan is to use 5lb per 1000 sq f. If my math holds up, this should give me about 1/3lb N per 1000sq. f every 14 days. Perhaps a touch light, but that lets me get 3 feeds out of a 20KG bag.

If anyone notices some fatal flaw in my plan or math, please yell at me!


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## gene_stl (Oct 29, 2017)

Ornamec 170 is labeled to kill quackgrass. It can be sprayed on tall fescue and zoysia. Rather than going crazy with RoundUp maybe you could spot spray it. MSMA


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## Lawnmower_Man (Oct 1, 2017)

Do they sell this type of Round Up in Canada?

I see the spray bottles, but not sure if this is the high concentration one.


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## Lawnmower_Man (Oct 1, 2017)

I have quackgrass, but I also have some sort of vegetable (lettuce?) all over my backyard as the previous owner had a garden that they just stopped maintaining.

If this lettuce (or whatever it is) has a similar root system to quackgrass (it looks like rhizones when I pull them out) I assume that painting them with Round Up should work just the same, no?


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## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)

@Lawnmower_Man No, we're not allowed to use Roundup or glyphosate of any kind for "cosmetic" purposes and thus most of Canada cannot purchase it. [The Federal Government has approved it, but Provinces can do whatever the heck they like] It is available some places here as we can still use it for noxious plants such as poison Ivy and the like. The same applies to the classic 3-way herbacide we all used to use, but again... a noxious weed problem still allows for it.

Example, Lowes in Canada notes in the "Super Concentrate Roundup" : This item is only available for sale in British Columbia, Alberta and Saskatchewan.

The Chelated Iron Eco stuff in a 1 liter bottle concentrate says it will cover 2000+ sq feet, but inside the label are dilutions with coverage of only 500 sq feet. So... at $40 a bottle at full strenght dilution spraying a 3000 sq. f lawn is going to get costly. And as someone mention earlier, 3 applications got 90% of the dandelions. Canadian Tire says even THAT is "Not available in NB or PEI due to provincial regulations." Pretty soon I'm expecting a law that says you have to filter your tap water before watering your lawn!

I'm even dissapointed with my Kobalt 80V mower.... it works OK, but for baging.... nowhere near the suction of my old superbagger 21. I think Lowes has a 90 day return, so I may be taking it back and going down the the local lawn shop and get me a Toro Super Recycler instead. I don't care for the gas noise and having to run to the gas station when I just want to mow... but these electrics just don't seem to be there yet.

Chris


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## b0nk3rs (Aug 21, 2017)

kaptain_zero said:


> @Lawnmower_Man No, we're not allowed to use Roundup or glyphosate of any kind for "cosmetic" purposes and thus most of Canada cannot purchase it. [The Federal Government has approved it, but Provinces can do whatever the heck they like] It is available some places here as we can still use it for noxious plants such as poison Ivy and the like. The same applies to the classic 3-way herbacide we all used to use, but again... a noxious weed problem still allows for it.
> 
> Example, Lowes in Canada notes in the "Super Concentrate Roundup" : This item is only available for sale in British Columbia, Alberta and Saskatchewan.
> 
> ...


The Super Recycler is a fantastic mower and really makes you WANT to mow the lawn


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## kaptain_zero (Jun 2, 2018)

b0nk3rs said:


> The Super Recycler is a fantastic mower and really makes you WANT to mow the lawn


I've always had a thing for nice tools. They make the work so much easier.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

@kaptain_zero I'm going to start using the natural fert from Home Hardware (9-2-2). @Sinclair uses it and does weekly apps of 2lb/1,000 - which yields 0.18lbs N/1,000 or about 3/4lb N per month. They don't carry it in store, so you will have to go in with the product number and ask them to order it from the warehouse. Mine should be coming in today.

As for Round Up Super Concentrate, check out this link. Canadian company and will ship to you. I just order Killex from them (with 2,4-d and Dicamba) and it arrived yesterday.

https://lawnproducts.ca/products/round-1l-super-concentrate

If you do decide to go with the Turkey Trot, your math is correct - approx. 0.3lbs N/1,000.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

The HH fertilizer in Winnipeg is $67 for a 55lb bag. That will get you 9 apps of 2lbs/1,000 if you did it weekly (based on your 3,000 sf lawn).


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## HoosierLawnGnome (Sep 28, 2017)

Schaef said:


> 1. One video I watched said you need a high rate of round-up, which I'm guessing means a higher concentrated dilution?
> _Use surfactant, glyphosate, a dash of soluble N fertilize, and a splash of blue mark.
> _2. Will the round-up penetrate into the rhizome and kill off the entire branch of quack grass?
> _Sort of. The glyphosate penetrates the leaves of the plant it is painted on, gets translocated to other parts of the plants, and kills it. Usually it takes several painting sessions to get everything in an area._
> ...


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