# Liquid Fertilizers



## Matthew_73 (Jul 9, 2019)

I have been using Green County Soil products, not the 18-0-1.. Bio Stim only

I have applied Carbon X on my yard a week or so ago.. I am debating on using 8-1-8 around Memorial Day and let the Slow release work its magic during the Summer...

Are there any other Liquid ferts I can use instead? Also, would like to apply it with my hose end sprayer...

I am not against Green Punch


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## beardizzle1 (Jun 13, 2019)

I know GC has 7-0-0 GreeNe EfFect with 6% iron.. I've used Bio Stim last year and will be using 18-0-1 & 7-0-0 this year. Still a few weeks out for any fertilizer apps for me though. Still waiting to put the preM down.


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## Matthew_73 (Jul 9, 2019)

beardizzle1 said:


> I know GC has 7-0-0 GreeNe EfFect with 6% iron.. I've used Bio Stim last year and will be using 18-0-1 & 7-0-0 this year. Still a few weeks out for any fertilizer apps for me though. Still waiting to put the preM down.


I put my pre em down last week before the 1894" of rain. Debating of a light 2nd app I only used 2tsp per 1000 at 2-3 months coverage... Ground was not saturated, but now it is.. next four days are dry before 3 more days of rain...

I always thought Green Effect was expensive, but that must be the Punch.


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## beardizzle1 (Jun 13, 2019)

They're both around $25-$30/gallon. I'm just trying them out to see what I like. I still have a bag of AMS in the garage which will get used after this first application. Interested to see how the Greene Punch and Greene Effect will do.


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## Bigdrumnc (Mar 28, 2019)

Both work &#128077;&#128077;&#128077;


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## Dkrem (Mar 16, 2019)

You can dissolve urea in water and apply it with a hose end. You can get a fairly large amount of urea into solution, around 1:1 by weight at 80F. Then just drench that with the hose end sprayer.


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## Scagfreedom48z+ (Oct 6, 2018)

Dkrem said:


> You can dissolve urea in water and apply it with a hose end. You can get a fairly large amount of urea into solution, around 1:1 by weight at 80F. Then just drench that with the hose end sprayer.


What would be a safe and effective amount of urea per gallon?


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## Dkrem (Mar 16, 2019)

Scagfreedom48z+ said:


> Dkrem said:
> 
> 
> > You can dissolve urea in water and apply it with a hose end. You can get a fairly large amount of urea into solution, around 1:1 by weight at 80F. Then just drench that with the hose end sprayer.
> ...


I've sprayed at .25#urea/gallon in mild temperatures with no problems. I don't know what an upper limit might be.


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## corneliani (Apr 2, 2019)

Dkrem said:


> Scagfreedom48z+ said:
> 
> 
> > Dkrem said:
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A local fert&squirt technician told me they spray 1/2#N in 2gal/1000. Not sure how much weight I'd put on that feedback considering the source but maybe someone here can confirm.


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## Drewmey (Oct 3, 2018)

Just thought I would mention that if you decide that you are interested in the 7-0-0 Greene Effect route, it is actually fairly easy to make yourself. The other products are not as easy to make and store because they contain humic (tends to settle over time) and kelp (tends to rot/stink over time). I am not sure how they get away with those two items. The humic is not reconstituted from powder (which is how that works, I get that one) but not sure about the kelp.

Anyway the point is that the 7-0-0 Green Effect is pretty simple.

-Basically the top section is if you wanted to premix a 5-gallon container in which you could follow the 7-0-0 Green Effect rate (5oz-8oz/M). In other words the 5 gal would work for 128M - 80M.
-The middle table is for mixing just (1) gallon at the 5oz/M rate.
-The bottom table is for mixing just (1) gallon at the 8oz/M rate.



Definitely mix the Citric Acid first! That is the ingredient causing the "organic chelation" bond that is mentioned on the label. But it needs to be dissolved in the water before the iron is applied, or some of the iron may oxidize.

Interesting side note. You may see that the low rate is around 2oz of iron sulfate per gallon and the high rate is a little over 3oz per gallon of iron sulfate...with ever so slightly higher total N then total Fe. If that sounds familiar, it is basically the same as what people are doing who follow that FAS thread. In fact, when I mix this for myself, I don't even think about it as GCI product clone. I happened to have learned about it elsewhere first, and then stumbled upon the math later thinking I wanted to try making it myself haha.

I've got a similar table for 18-0-1 but it is obviously a bit more complicated considering it combines both Urea and AS. It also has the Humic and Kelp as mentioned. Though I admit my method wouldn't get the 50% slow release nitrogen that they show. Not sure how that is done in a liquid to be honest. If someone knows, I would be very interested to hear/learn.

I am mentally thinking about creating my own personal formula for something that is in between these two and Super Juice. I think the contents in Super Juice are great and make a lot of sense in terms of balance for grass (for a soil that is already in line) but I can't justify that price.


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## beardizzle1 (Jun 13, 2019)

Drewmey said:


> I am mentally thinking about creating my own personal formula for something that is in between these two and Super Juice. I think the contents in Super Juice are great and make a lot of sense in terms of balance for grass (for a soil that is already in line) but I can't justify that price.


This is good information to have/know about. For me, I'm currently not interested in "making" my own solutions. Would rather just buy it and then spray it. However, in the future this is definitely something I'll be leaning more towards.


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## corneliani (Apr 2, 2019)

Drewmey said:


> ... Though I admit my method wouldn't get the 50% slow release nitrogen that they show. Not sure how that is done in a liquid to be honest. If someone knows, I would be very interested to hear/learn.
> 
> I am mentally thinking about creating my own personal formula for something that is in between these two and Super Juice. I think the contents in Super Juice are great and make a lot of sense in terms of balance for grass (for a soil that is already in line) but I can't justify that price.


I love your thinking bro! Love it. Now I can actually use this 50# bag of Urea I have! lol

Btw, the label says they use "N-(n-butyl) thiophosphoric triamide" or NBPT for the slow release aspect, which is a urease inhibitor (i'm assuming this qualifies as a SRN?). It's the same product I see on the carbon earth label btw.

I've seen the UFLEXX and UMAXX urea granular fertilizers have these inhibitors already added in .. but at 2-3x the cost I say forget about the slow release aspect and just spray the slow rates more often :nod:

Thanks for the breakdown btw.

EDIT: I was wrong on the price of UFLEXX 46-0-0. I'm being quoted $8 more for the bag vs non-inhibited 46-0-0. Just not sure on solubility.
Here's the product link: https://www.siteone.com/pdf/sdsPDF?skuId=503815&resourceId=25259


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## Drewmey (Oct 3, 2018)

corneliani said:


> Drewmey said:
> 
> 
> > ... Though I admit my method wouldn't get the 50% slow release nitrogen that they show. Not sure how that is done in a liquid to be honest. If someone knows, I would be very interested to hear/learn.
> ...


Thanks for the info. I was aware of granular coatings that slowed down the release of nitrogen. But I figured if the product was a liquid (already dissolved) that they wouldn't work. I'll look into these out of curiosity. Though personally, I'd go granular if slow release was important. With liquid fert, the powerful aspect is that you can control what's there /absorbed in a much tighter window.


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## Chris LI (Oct 26, 2018)

@corneliani
As far as your fert & squirt guy goes, that's probably in the ballpark. It's probably more of a soil app than foliar, if they're using that much carrier (water). 1/2# N per k is kind of heavy for a spring app, but very appropriate for a fall app.

As far as coated urea with inhibitors (i.e. stabilized urea), I've used 1/4# N per k with UMAXX on my greens when I had a small pitch putt course, and it worked well. We basically spoonfed the greens bi-weekly until late June and pretty much laid off on any fert for the summer.


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## jprez (Oct 25, 2019)

corneliani said:


> Drewmey said:
> 
> 
> > ... Though I admit my method wouldn't get the 50% slow release nitrogen that they show. Not sure how that is done in a liquid to be honest. If someone knows, I would be very interested to hear/learn.
> ...


Thanks for this formula, I'll be interested on seeing the 18,0,1 and any other that you have. I'm just got the bio stem pack and the green effect and started thinking that I could mix something similar for cheaper. I feel that if I can get 80% of the results for 40% cheaper that would make sense. This would be my first year that I'll be really taking care of my lawn.


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## jprez (Oct 25, 2019)

Drewmey said:


> Just thought I would mention that if you decide that you are interested in the 7-0-0 Greene Effect route, it is actually fairly easy to make yourself. The other products are not as easy to make and store because they contain humic (tends to settle over time) and kelp (tends to rot/stink over time). I am not sure how they get away with those two items. The humic is not reconstituted from powder (which is how that works, I get that one) but not sure about the kelp.
> 
> Anyway the point is that the 7-0-0 Green Effect is pretty simple.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that formula. I'm really interested in the 18,0,1 and any other one you have. I just got the bio stem pack with the green effect and I was thinking if there's a way to replicate them. I think that if I can get 80% results for 40% less that would be money. This really my first official year of law care so any info can help.


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## Matthew_73 (Jul 9, 2019)

Drewmey said:


> Just thought I would mention that if you decide that you are interested in the 7-0-0 Greene Effect route, it is actually fairly easy to make yourself. The other products are not as easy to make and store because they contain humic (tends to settle over time) and kelp (tends to rot/stink over time). I am not sure how they get away with those two items. The humic is not reconstituted from powder (which is how that works, I get that one) but not sure about the kelp.
> 
> Anyway the point is that the 7-0-0 Green Effect is pretty simple.
> 
> ...


I'm confused. Is this 5/8 oz mix for can sprayers? How could this be achieved for a hose end sprayer? Where do you get the urea and iron at? Citric avid I assume is the same as most stores. Could you add some Humic 12 into the mix to get that. Or just spray that out. Sorry. New to all this.

Edit: So the 5 gallon container recipe. This would be like the 5 gallon size at Greene county?


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## Drewmey (Oct 3, 2018)

Matthew_73 said:


> Drewmey said:
> 
> 
> > Just thought I would mention that if you decide that you are interested in the 7-0-0 Greene Effect route, it is actually fairly easy to make yourself. The other products are not as easy to make and store because they contain humic (tends to settle over time) and kelp (tends to rot/stink over time). I am not sure how they get away with those two items. The humic is not reconstituted from powder (which is how that works, I get that one) but not sure about the kelp.
> ...


-The 5/8 oz mixes could be mixed in a small quantity of water (instead of the 1 Gallon mentioned), and be used through a hose end sprayer. I have never done this. But as long as you can get it to properly dissolve and use the right amount of product per thousand sf, I can't see why it wouldn't work.

-I get my Urea and Iron at a local golf course/landscape supply store. If you can't find one of those, look for a farm supply store. A local coop probably being better than like something commercial like Tractor Supply. Though you may be able to find it there too. The last and final place I would look, if all else fails, is get the ferrous sulfate on the internet and look for a bag of 46-0-0 at Lowes or Home Depot. The price will not be nearly as good. But if it is 46-0-0, it is Urea.

-I have not been able to find Citric Acid locally but there are probably a couple large food supply stores I could still try. I have just gone with amazon. My lawn is 4k SF, so 10lbs for $25, although maybe not the best deal in the world, lasts me a long time (about 60 applications).

-The top section of the spreadsheet table is to make (5) gallons of concentrate that could be used at the same rates as the 7-0-0 Green Effect. Since Citric Acid is not the best chelator in the world for iron, I like to just mix it before I use it. I don't want some of the iron to oxidize. I am not enough of a chemistry guy to know if Green County Fert has a better way of mixing the citric acid and the iron to make sure the chelation lasts and doesn't oxidize in the container while stored.


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## Drewmey (Oct 3, 2018)

jprez said:


> Drewmey said:
> 
> 
> > Just thought I would mention that if you decide that you are interested in the 7-0-0 Greene Effect route, it is actually fairly easy to make yourself. The other products are not as easy to make and store because they contain humic (tends to settle over time) and kelp (tends to rot/stink over time). I am not sure how they get away with those two items. The humic is not reconstituted from powder (which is how that works, I get that one) but not sure about the kelp.
> ...


This is close but not exact. The things that I know which would be different are:

This does not include slow release nitrogen like the 18-0-1. I don't imagine this is a drastic difference, but I might be hesitant to apply it at the max rate in hot weather due to this.
The humic is a reconstituted powder. I don't find that the settling is drastic or problematic but I also don't mix more than I am going to use that day. Personally I don't find that this is drastically different but there are some very knowledgeable individuals who say otherwise. Yes, they sell products but they have way more knowledge than me.
I've heard that reconstituted kelp powder can stink if left out in the heat for a while. I heard people have had success storing in a refrigerator. Again, I would simply just mix what I nee.



To get quantities for the rates on the label, simply convert the 5 gallons to oz. Convert the lbs to oz for the ingredients. And use just the amount called for on the label. I can do that later if you need but had never set up for this one because I don't even really use it. Have not gone fully liquid so I typically just apply humic/kelp in one application and FAS/7-0-0 in another application.


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## jprez (Oct 25, 2019)

Drewmey said:


> jprez said:
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> 
> > Drewmey said:
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Thanks for this. I'll give it a try. I'm sure it will have great results. 👍🏽


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## Matthew_73 (Jul 9, 2019)

Drewmey said:


> Matthew_73 said:
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> > Drewmey said:
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## Drewmey (Oct 3, 2018)

Matthew_73 said:


> So if I were to make a gallon, i would divide this by 5. i get this . if i make a gallon, would i be ok making with without using the CA?


I'm not really sure. But if I had to guess, I'd expect that iron would turn to rust and you would see significant particulates settle in the solution over time.

If you're curious, I would divide everything by 5 to get to gallons, then by 16 to get to cups. Now let that cup sit for a while and see what happens. If it fails, you barely wasted any ingredients.

I think the optimal solution would be to premeasure baggies that are the size of your lawn or maybe sprayer. Then you have it measured ready to go every time you need it.


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## Matthew_73 (Jul 9, 2019)

If I buy Chelated Iron, would this work? I am new to all this and want to learn...


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## Dkrem (Mar 16, 2019)

IMHO use or not use of the Citric acid really depends on your water chemistry. The water at my house is quite high pH, in the 8+ range, high enough that it is still above neutral after adding ammonium sulfate. If I add the Iron at that point it starts out nice blue-green but turns orange within a minute. So I add some citric to bring the mix to below 7 before the iron goes in, then I add the iron and it doesn't change to orange. This all by my experimental observations.


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## Matthew_73 (Jul 9, 2019)

https://www.bulkapothecary.com/raw-ingredients/other-ingredients-and-chemicals/citric-acid/?sku=M-005-M-5-chem-23&gclid=CjwKCAjwguzzBRBiEiwAgU0FT03xH7pIYTg-Ujygcimt-753rTJqlh7XFM9wttP8c22L86KcXn6QdBoCUmkQAvD_BwE

would this work?


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## Dkrem (Mar 16, 2019)

Matthew_73 said:


> https://www.bulkapothecary.com/raw-ingredients/other-ingredients-and-chemicals/citric-acid/?sku=M-005-M-5-chem-23&gclid=CjwKCAjwguzzBRBiEiwAgU0FT03xH7pIYTg-Ujygcimt-753rTJqlh7XFM9wttP8c22L86KcXn6QdBoCUmkQAvD_BwE
> 
> would this work?


That would be the stuff. I purchased a #50 bag last year from a local water treatment and chemical company.


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## Matthew_73 (Jul 9, 2019)

Here is my sheet I did for the 5 and 1 gallon mix for 7-0-0


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