# GM1600/Reel mower question



## Browdis (Jul 19, 2017)

I have a Toro GM1600 and am mowing Astro Bermuda.

I have always thought my cut could be better but today I scalped and am still not happy with the cut. I checked HOC 3 times while cutting and it never moved. It inconsistently scalps.

I have added atleast 10 tons of sand to my 2 year old lawn. It is still has some undulations but much better than it was.

My question is - is there something going on with my mower?

Mower passed the paper test prior to mowing so I feel that it is cutting as it should.

Could the 1600 be the issue and every minor undulations causes an uneven cut?


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## J_nick (Jan 28, 2017)

Can you share some pictures? It would let us better understand what's going on.


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## MasterMech (Sep 24, 2017)

Also, what height is the grass you are trying to cut and what height is the machine set at?


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## Mightyquinn (Jan 31, 2017)

Also, depending on how bad(lumpy) your lawn was, adding 10 tons of sand to 20K of lawn is not doing a whole lot to help smooth it out, it most likely will require multiple sanding's to get the job done correctly.


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## Redtenchu (Jan 28, 2017)

+1 to everyone above. A picture is worth one thousand words.

Did you purchase the 1600 local, or online?


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## Browdis (Jul 19, 2017)

MasterMech said:


> Also, what height is the grass you are trying to cut and what height is the machine set at?


Cutting Astro at .250, grass currently around .750.


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## Browdis (Jul 19, 2017)

Redtenchu said:


> +1 to everyone above. A picture is worth one thousand words.
> 
> Did you purchase the 1600 local, or online?


Bought the mower online from Prairie Turf.


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## Browdis (Jul 19, 2017)

J_nick said:


> Can you share some pictures? It would let us better understand what's going on.


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## Redtenchu (Jan 28, 2017)

@Browdis I see the what you are referring to in the pictures.

Are you checking the left and right side HOC?

Is there a hill/slope in the lawn?

I'm assuming you have the grass catcher on? The grass catcher will typically gather more on the operators right side and could be effecting the mower wieght on the right side in the soft soil causing the HOC difference.

You might need to load the 1600 up and try it out on my lawn this week! 🤣😂


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## Mightyquinn (Jan 31, 2017)

Browdis said:


> MasterMech said:
> 
> 
> > Also, what height is the grass you are trying to cut and what height is the machine set at?
> ...


I think this could be it. If you are trying to go from .750" to .250" it's not going to cut everything off and most likely will jam the reel up. I know I have never been able to take that much off at once


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## Browdis (Jul 19, 2017)

Redtenchu said:


> @Browdis I see the what you are referring to in the pictures.
> 
> Are you checking the left and right side HOC?
> 
> ...


Yes. Check HOC on both sides and in the middle. Checked it multiple times while scalping. I mowed 3 different directions. Same result, even without grass catcher.

No major hills or slope to the yard.


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## J_nick (Jan 28, 2017)

It could be the layer of stolons causing the mower to float in some areas. That's why most of us will verticut during the spring scalp to eliminate the floating effect.


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## Browdis (Jul 19, 2017)

I plan to verticut soon. If I am unable to locate a verticutter what other options are out there?


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## SGrabs33 (Feb 13, 2017)

Browdis said:


> I plan to verticut soon. If I am unable to locate a verticutter what other options are out there?


Slit seeder with fixed blades
or dethatcher with flail blades. 
Fixed would be better.


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## Browdis (Jul 19, 2017)

I was talking to a local Toro dealer about getting my machine serviced to ensure it was cutting as well as possible and he stated I likely need to get the reel and bedknife sharpened, which may be true.

He also stated "backlapping is the worst possible thing you can do to your machine".

Is this true? I am still a reelmower rookie but everything I have seen recommends backlapping to reduce sharpening frequency. Maybe he was just trying to sell his services? Definitely was surprised to hear him say that...


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Browdis said:


> ...He also stated "backlapping is the worst possible thing you can do to your machine".
> 
> Is this true? I am still a reelmower rookie but everything I have seen recommends backlapping to reduce sharpening frequency. Maybe he was just trying to sell his services? Definitely was surprised to hear him say that...


Relief grinding (which can be backlapped) or spin-only are two different schools of thought...


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## TC2 (Sep 15, 2017)

While the roller on the 1600 will help prevent scalping, it will also cause an uneven cut if the ground is also uneven. A small undulation will raise one end of the mower higher than the other, reducing the height of the other side, producing visible differences in cutting height.


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## Redtenchu (Jan 28, 2017)

No question, grinding creates a better cut if done correctly. But- If the mower is passing the "paper test" you don't need either!

Benifits of backlapping include: 
1. DIY job.
2. 20 minutes to complete.
3. Cheaper.
4. No special equipment required.
5. Doesn't take off as much marteial from the reel (longer reel life).
6. You'll have a better understanding of your mower. 
7. Your spouse will be impressed.


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## MasterMech (Sep 24, 2017)

Redtenchu said:


> ...
> 7. Your spouse will be impressed.


You were on a roll until that one... :lol:

I can't see backlapping being harmful to the machine, as long as it's done properly. To get the maximum benefit from it, the reel needs to be ground using the relief grind method, rather than just the spin grind. Many golf equipment managers get away from back-lapping because it requires frequent attention from them or their staff. The greens mowers are usually back-lapped at least once or twice a week, if not daily. Going to a spin-grind only method allows them to do fewer services over the course of a season.

I never really liked spin-only. To really keep the units as sharp as frequent back-lapping does, you wear out reels relatively quick by grinding more frequently, mandating you replace them ($$$) more often and by the end of the season, you're mowing with smaller diameter reels and making bedknife attitude adjustments to try and maintain cut quality and the same effective HOC. Relief grinding takes a LOT longer than spin-only unless you have an automated grinder ($$,$$$) but the machines use less fuel, the hydraulics (if applicable) run slightly cooler, and the cutting geometry doesn't change as fast over the course of a season.

None of the above really means Jack Schitt for the homeowner cutting his/her own lawn 2x a week however. Either method is perfectly acceptable so long as the gear is sharp and adjusted correctly.


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## Greendoc (Mar 24, 2018)

Browdis said:


> I plan to verticut soon. If I am unable to locate a verticutter what other options are out there?


Other option is to fit the mower with the carbide tipped groomer. I looked at the pictures under magnification, you have a lot of thatch buildup. That is why it scalps and leaves "lines" when you mow. What I do to a lawn that does that is to keep mowing until I see dirt. That is normally 0.1". Other thing I do for preventative purposes is to cross cut at different directions every mowing. I have seen lawns that are single cut at every mowing and they are all thatch monsters. A little more work at every mowing prevents needing to do a backbreaking job every year or several times a year.


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

What is the gap between the blade and the bedknife?


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