# Should I Nuke My Lawn?



## dfonv003 (Aug 12, 2017)

Hi all, thanks so much for this forum. I've learned quite a bit over the last few days. But I'm curious...

I just moved in a few weeks ago and my lawn is weed infested. Should I still apply the bermuda triangle (certainty + celsius + prodiamine) here in a few weeks. Or can I go at it with Weed B Gon and follow up with prodiamine.

*Actually just trying to see if I can cut cost because I can't cut into the wife's decor budget :lol:

*Back Yard*


*Back Yard Up-close*


*Front Yard*


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## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

Celsius is cheaper in the long run than anything you can get at big box stores and the prodiamine wdg jug for $65ish will last many years. I wouldn't waste money on the weed b gone at this point. Certainty is really only needed in addition to Celsius if you have sedges.

If the weeds you have are annual, then you could let it be until your fall app of prodiamine to start working on next years progress. Be aware that prodiamine will not stop all weeds, but will handle the majority of common pests.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

^^^ What he said. :thumbsup:

Welcome to TLF!


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## Bunnysarefat (May 4, 2017)

Welcome.

I wouldn't waste your money buying any herbicides from the big box stores. Maybe straight glyphosate concentrate, but that's it. Even that's cheaper online when you buy a gallon.

Just make sure you get a scalehttps://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00XWEAGRS/ref=yo_ii_img?ie=UTF8&psc=1
You don't want to be messing around measuring this stuff out, you want to be sure. This one works well for me.


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## dfonv003 (Aug 12, 2017)

Thanks so much! You guys are awesome. I was on the verge of paying someone $800 to spray, aerate, and overseed an annual rye before this forum.

I'm afraid I'll just have dirt if I do Celsius now, so I'll probably just do prodiamine as Spammage suggested and I'll order my scale now Bunnyarefat!


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## jayhawk (Apr 18, 2017)

I'm not a herbicide expert for sure, not trying to sound disagreeable. do you need better tools and methods etc to put out those recommended 'pro' products? from what I understand, Celsius and/or prodiamine require precision or else you might as well use glyphosate?
I used my cheap/junk sprayer to put out $8 Weed B Gon® Weed Killer For Lawns Concentrate (or bayers equiv) for a helpless neighbor ...mainly going after crabgrass.


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## Bunnysarefat (May 4, 2017)

dfonv003 said:


> Thanks so much! You guys are awesome. I was on the verge of paying someone $800 to spray, aerate, and overseed an annual rye before this forum.
> 
> I'm afraid I'll just have dirt if I do Celsius now, so I'll probably just do prodiamine as Spammage suggested and I'll order my scale now Bunnyarefat!


I know how you feel. I moved in my house around this time last year. You're so eager to get after it but the truth is we are turning the corner to the last 1/3 of the growing season. No matter what you do, you can't purchase the time it takes for your grass to grow free from weed competition with the fertilizer it needs.

Keep reading around here to see what is possible for your lawn. Figure out where you want to go and what you can afford before you rush into a rash decision. I know from experience :thumbup:

As for overseeding, it's been brought up on the warm season thread once or twice:http://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=473&p=8824&hilit=Overseeding#p8824
There are definitly pros and cons and I think many angles were covered in that particular thread.. I see you're pretty far North for Bermuda, if you're new to obsessing over mastering a good strong monoculture lawn for your own enjoyment, I would suggest waiting waiting to overseed this year and do two things:
1. Wait and see what your own lawn does. You may be overseeded with perennial, right? You don't know what it's going to do and what will grow. 
2. Carefully observe other lawns and even well-kept public spaces that are overseeded and see how it looks and how it responds to weather changes and the warm weather transition.


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## Rockinar (Jul 21, 2017)

I'm going to go against the grain.

Your yard does not look that bad in my opinion. Hard to see, but looks like mostly broadleaf with some crabgrass, to me. To each their own, but I'd just hit it with the Weed B Gone, see what's left and go from there. Broadleaf weeds are easy to kill and don't need to spend $300 and risk burning up your yard in August to do it. Crabgrass is easy prey with Quinchlorac.(sp?).

Then next year use a pre-emergent and you won't have all those weeds and won't have $300 of chemicals you don't need. I have a box full of hundreds in herbicides I bought and don't need. It was kind of a waste. My lawn was way worse than your last year and it was taken care of with broadleaf killer and quinchlorac. I had to totally lost control of the weeds. I hit it heavy with pre-emergent in March and now it's mid August, still have no crabgrass, and really minimal weeds, where last year it looked like a crabgrass and broadleaf farm. It was probably 30% weeds this time last year and I was out there weekly spot spraying.

For sure no need to nuke it.

This is just my opinion based on my experience.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Rockinar said:


> ...Broadleaf weeds are easy to kill and don't need to spend $300 and risk burning up your yard in August to do it...


I would argue it's just as easy to burn up your yard in August by using a 2,4-D Weed B Gon product for broadleaf weeds in these temperatures. Products like this or this are not labeled for use when temps are above 90°F.


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## dfonv003 (Aug 12, 2017)

Bunnysarefat said:


> dfonv003 said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks so much! You guys are awesome. I was on the verge of paying someone $800 to spray, aerate, and overseed an annual rye before this forum.
> ...


Thanks for the pointers! Yeah, overseeding is what the lawn guy pitched to me, but I wasn't convinced. My first thought was is all this perennial rye going to die in the spring or will he be pitching a secondary spray in the spring to kill it. But all of this was when I first moved in, before I ran into this forum.


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## dfonv003 (Aug 12, 2017)

Rockinar said:


> I'm going to go against the grain.
> 
> Your yard does not look that bad in my opinion. Hard to see, but looks like mostly broadleaf with some crabgrass, to me. To each their own, but I'd just hit it with the Weed B Gone, see what's left and go from there. Broadleaf weeds are easy to kill and don't need to spend $300 and risk burning up your yard in August to do it. Crabgrass is easy prey with Quinchlorac.(sp?).
> 
> ...


I truly appreciate the opposing opinion. Just an FYI for you and Ware, I never intended on spraying now. Just prepping for next month! But still, I greatly appreciate the perspective. I could easily rack up $3000 in chemicals, sprayers and nozzles, sand, and a reel mower today...but I'm sure my wife would leave me :lol:

So your perspective is appreciated! And everyone else's as well. I'm learning that this is a game of patience.


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## J_nick (Jan 28, 2017)

As for buying $3000 in chemicals, that's where the Bermuda Triangle is so valuable. It's a steep cost up front but cheap in the long run. Prodiamine will stop most weeds from coming up then Celsius/Certainty will kill 99% of the ones that make it through the Prodiamine.


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## dfw_pilot (Jan 28, 2017)

+1


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

dfonv003 said:


> I truly appreciate the opposing opinion. Just an FYI for you and Ware, I never intended on spraying now. Just prepping for next month! But still, I greatly appreciate the perspective. I could easily rack up $3000 in chemicals, sprayers and nozzles, sand, and a reel mower today...but I'm sure my wife would leave me :lol:
> 
> So your perspective is appreciated! And everyone else's as well. I'm learning that this is a game of patience.


There is definitely more than one way to do things - but whichever product you decide to use, it's important to read and understand the entire label. If you don't understand something, don't hesitate to ask - there is a wealth of knowledge on this forum. :thumbup:


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## Adrian82 (Jun 5, 2017)

I can't agree enough Bunny about waiting. Bermuda is an amazing grass. When I purchased my home 14 months ago, I was depressed at the state of my yard. I contracted with Tru-Green to treat my yard. Other than that, I did routine work expected of the average homeowner.

Since June 2016, the yard has recovered more than I ever imagined. At one point, the bad side was 60-70% bare clay because stormwater was away dead grass and weeds. Next year, I will properly prepare and manage my yard from Day 1.

May 2016 - The builder maintained that the sod only needed water


June 2016


June 2017


August 2017


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## Bunnysarefat (May 4, 2017)

Since quinclorac was mentioned, I'll go ahead and give my hot take on it.

Quinclorac works quite well and you can get it generic for around $40. I don't think it lists any specific temperature restrictions, it just says not to spray when it's "excessively hot."

I'm just going to come out and say it, totally unsubstantiated, backed by nothing but my own intuition, the stuff seems very toxic. When I received the package in the mail, just holding the box I could smell it so strongly and just got the sense I was inhaling a strong poison. It's like the feeling you get walking down the weed killer/insecticide isle at the big box store, the same sense but only coming from a tiny 1 pound bottle. And when you spray it, that same smell lingers for several days.

So, maybe that's a little melodramatic, but it does work.

So, as rockinar said, and is probably true for most people who follow a schedule, if you stay on top of your preemergent you may almost never need to spray. But, since this is a new lawn, it's hard to know what is going to pop up. I can't sell you on Celcius because I've never used it... I have 10 more years of quinclorac to use up before I can buy another herbicide with good conscience!


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## high leverage (Jun 11, 2017)

With your lawn being mostly weeds my last concern would be any unintentional damage from herbicides. I would personally spray today and try to rid what you can before next season. Start with the Weed B gone if you already have it and go from there.


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## Redtenchu (Jan 28, 2017)

Spammage said:


> Celsius is cheaper in the long run than anything you can get at big box stores and the prodiamine wdg jug for $65ish will last many years. I wouldn't waste money on the weed b gone at this point. Certainty is really only needed in addition to Celsius if you have sedges.
> 
> If the weeds you have are annual, then you could let it be until your fall app of prodiamine to start working on next years progress. Be aware that prodiamine will not stop all weeds, but will handle the majority of common pests.


+1


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## J_nick (Jan 28, 2017)

high leverage said:


> With your lawn being mostly weeds my last concern would be any unintentional damage from herbicides. I would personally spray today and try to rid what you can before next season. Start with the Weed B gone if you already have it and go from there.


With temperatures hovering around 90* for the next 10 days in Clarksville 2, 4D would be very risky.


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## J_nick (Jan 28, 2017)

Personally I would just buy some pre emergent to put down within the next month or so. If you have a sprayer then the Prodiamine WDG is the best way to spend your money but they also make it in granules that you can spread like fertilizer. It's green now and we have less 3 months of growing season left and everyday there is less and less daylight. I would just live with the weeds and fight the good fight next year.


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## high leverage (Jun 11, 2017)

J_nick said:


> high leverage said:
> 
> 
> > With your lawn being mostly weeds my last concern would be any unintentional damage from herbicides. I would personally spray today and try to rid what you can before next season. Start with the Weed B gone if you already have it and go from there.
> ...


His lawn is all weeds, whats the risk? I've personally sprayed 2,4-d In temps above 90 with no ill effects.


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## J_nick (Jan 28, 2017)

high leverage said:


> His lawn is all weeds, whats the risk? I've personally sprayed 2,4-d In temps above 90 with no ill effects.


We must be looking at different photos. Front yard has a lot of Bermuda. That back has more weeds but there is definitely bermuda all mingled in.


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## high leverage (Jun 11, 2017)

J_nick said:


> high leverage said:
> 
> 
> > His lawn is all weeds, whats the risk? I've personally sprayed 2,4-d In temps above 90 with no ill effects.
> ...


I guess if you consider 20% of the yard a lot of Bermuda.


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## J_nick (Jan 28, 2017)




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## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

I don't get the 20% either. Some Fall and Spring prodiamine, a little fertilizer and that yard could be great next year.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Spammage said:


> I don't get the 20% either. Some Fall and Spring prodiamine, a little fertilizer and that yard could be great next year.


I agree with Spammage - I don't see anything there that overly concerns me, and getting on a pre-e regimen is the critical first step (i.e. don't miss the fall application). If you are not comfortable spraying pre-e, there are some granular Prodiamine and Dithiopyr (Dimension) products available. Spraying is cheaper, but granular would not be cost prohibitive on your ~6k lawn.

Then you can start addressing the weeds as the temps subside and time permits. The reason there are so many proponents of Celsius WG for post-emergent weed control here is it only costs about $1.20 per thousand at the high rate, it takes care of most broadleaf and grassy weeds, and there are no temperature restrictions. Where I live, it is common to start seeing 90°F temps in mid-June, so selecting a product that can be safely applied to my lawn at any time during the growing season was important to me. Everyone's priorities are a little different though.

Keep us updated with your progress! :thumbup:


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## dfonv003 (Aug 12, 2017)

Adrian82 said:


> I can't agree enough Bunny about waiting. Bermuda is an amazing grass. When I purchased my home 14 months ago, I was depressed at the state of my yard. I contracted with Tru-Green to treat my yard. Other than that, I did routine work expected of the average homeowner.
> 
> Since June 2016, the yard has recovered more than I ever imagined. At one point, the bad side was 60-70% bare clay because stormwater was away dead grass and weeds. Next year, I will properly prepare and manage my yard from Day 1.
> 
> ...


Man that's incredible! Thanks for sharing!


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## dfonv003 (Aug 12, 2017)

J_nick said:


> Personally I would just buy some pre emergent to put down within the next month or so. If you have a sprayer then the Prodiamine WDG is the best way to spend your money but they also make it in granules that you can spread like fertilizer. It's green now and we have less 3 months of growing season left and everyday there is less and less daylight. I would just live with the weeds and fight the good fight next year.


Yeah, this is what I'm doing. Got Prodiamine and a scale. Just going back and forth on the sprayers/nozzles


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

dfonv003 said:


> ...Just going back and forth on the sprayers/nozzles


Not sure what your budget is, but I would consider the Chapin 63985 20V Backpack. It is a nice sprayer for making broadcast applications because you don't have have to pump or worry about the pressure variation associated with pumping. Whichever sprayer you decide on, you will want to calibrate it to you using a fan nozzle (not adjustable cone). If using a pump sprayer, I would highly recommend adding a CF valve to regulate the pressure. This helps ensure even coverage.


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