# Options for Damp Heavily Shaded Area?



## NikeFace (Feb 14, 2018)

This is a weird one but I'm at a loss. Hoping for some creative ideas...

Half of my backyard gets a lot of shade (almost no sun), is on the north side, and is covered by large oaks owned by my neighbors.

I have recently established fine fescue there which is doing okay. Neighbors allowed me to trim as many branches as possible to help with shade but it barely made a difference. Neighbors have no interest in them/me removing entire trees.

The problem is that this area is always moist or damp. The grading is great and there is never any standing water; however, like I said, it almost never dries out.

This is a big problem when it comes to mowing (ruts, ripping grass roots, fungus, etc). I can't just go the mulch, hosta, etc route because it's an ~1,500 sq ft area that is half of my backyard...

I don't think anymore soil condition is the answer... It's more a need to help soil to "dry" better.

Any ideas that may help? Adding sand or something else that I'm not aware of?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Could you post some pictures to help visualize?


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## GrassDaddy (Mar 21, 2017)

I aerated and filled the plugs with sand. It seems to have helped. Been about 2 weeks so not sure long term if it'll be the fix but it dries out faster in the morning now and after the crazy rain we had a few days ago it seems to be fine.


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## NikeFace (Feb 14, 2018)

Grassdaddy, this is along the lines I was thinking. However, I'm terrified to aerate the area because I finally established some grass there and I'm afraid aerating will rip it all up (the moisture issues).

G-man, I'll post pics but most likely not until the weekend. I'm at work during the day and would want to take a pic on a Saturday/Sunday during max sun period to give you the most realistic best case scenario.


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## Bkell101 (Jun 25, 2018)

I'm in the same boat and have your same problem. Fine fescue is what I've got growing under my two oak trees that are on half of the yard. Super soggy and not much shade. Graded perfectly just like yours so that never have standing water. Just takes a long time to dry out and the water run off towards the sidewalk bends over the grass when we get a lot of rain. I've basically seeded this area twice with success initially but as soon as we get a large rainfall, the new grass gets flopped over and sticks together and dies off. I recently cut down one of the shade trees, raked up the most recent failed seeding/dead grass and seeded again. So I feel ya. I'll post pics too but I'm anxious to see what folks recommend.


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## GrassDaddy (Mar 21, 2017)

I suppose you could try top dressing each year some sand, so it's gradual. But yeah it did dig up some of the grass in spots. I wasn't concerned because I have KBG and it'll fill back in but you'd have to seed if you didn't.


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## maynardGkeynes (May 23, 2017)

Even if there is no standing water, no grass will thrive if the roots are soggy all the time. Oxygen and nutrients can't get to the roots. It sounds to me like this is a drainage problem, and not a shade problem. Grading is the best solution, but sand can help in some cases. However, my experience is that it takes a lot more sand than one might think to remedy this.


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## JohnP (Oct 24, 2017)

The old saying goes, you have to break some eggs to make an omelette. I'd aerate and backfill with sand then treat that area like @Colonel K0rn has been. AIR-8, does it work? And some pics


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## Miller_Low_Life (Apr 12, 2017)

I think I have a similar problem in my yard. How long have you been working on it? Mine is year 5 and has improved each year with basic practices.


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## iowa jim (Jan 22, 2018)

This may be a stupid idea and i have not tried it, but what about trying to incorporate some peat moss into the soil? Maybe somebody that has tried it will chime in.


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## Mozart (Jul 17, 2018)

Just a side note: in most states you are allowed to cut trees branches on neighboring properties without the neighbor's permission so long as those branches are in your "air space".

Per Macero v. Busconi Corp, Massachusetts is one of those states.

It's always a good idea to let the neighbor know what you plan to do first. If they object just explain that you weren't asking for permission!


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## NikeFace (Feb 14, 2018)

Thank you for the feedback. I'm going to post pics this weekend.

For five years, while struggling (unsuccessfully) to establish grass, I have top dressed with compost, peat, and soil conditioners, soil tests etc. I have trimmed back the branches as much as possible (over ~25 ft up). My neighbors are cool about that, they just don't want to remove the trees. Thats understandable, they like their shade.

Now, that I have established some turf, I'm hesitant to ruin it. But, you're right, I may have to "crack an egg."


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## Mozart (Jul 17, 2018)

You could also do something insanely crazy (or insanely awesome?) and seed Poa Trivalis - Sabre III.

Triv loves damp, shady areas.

This is what poa triv could look like


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## NikeFace (Feb 14, 2018)

Mozart, I have been viewing ATY for 5+ years and stubbled upon that post years ago. Not going to lie - I haven't completely written off the idea... That side of the backyard gets almost no foot traffic and we have no dogs.

As mentioned, I finally got fine fescue and chewing going in that area. I recently over seeded again. If the turf is gone come next fall, I may just seed Sabre III. Desperate measures...

Plus, not sure the Sabre will look any worse than the chewing.

My only worry is that the other half of the backyard looks great. KBG and PRG with some TTTF. The two areas are connected so the thought of the Sabre spreading over to the "good side" is horrific.


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## Miggity (Apr 25, 2018)

iowa jim said:


> This may be a stupid idea and i have not tried it, but what about trying to incorporate some peat moss into the soil? Maybe somebody that has tried it will chime in.


I did, but on top not incorporated into the soil. It retained too much moisture but was quickly consumed by soil biology. Didn't do squat in the end.


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## NikeFace (Feb 14, 2018)

Miggity, I'm with you. Over five-ish years, I have probably seeded and/or overseeded this area 8-10 times. Each time has been with peat moss. Separately, I've topdressed with peat and compost another 3-5 times. Plus, kelp, humic, baby shampoo, you name it...

Combined with soil test, no doubt it has helped with the overall health of the soil but it hasn't helped with the dampness issues in the least. It comes down to the fact that it's the shady north side of the yard and I can't cut more tree canopy.

If my grass survives the winter, I'll likely start lightly topdressing with sand (slow but consistently). I'll work up to aerating and plugging with sand as suggested by GrassDaddy.

If grass doesn't survive, I'll jump right into GrassDaddy's approach and reseed again... meh. Sabre III has always been considered my last resort.

Edit: also doesn't help that I have hundreds of chipmunks around the yard and they love this area. Chasing and filling burrows like it's my job. I explored options of getting rid of them but there is way too many.


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