# Grant's Journal



## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Good evening, all.

What a great resource and wealth of information the forum has provided. Almost too much and overwhelming! Makes me nervous to take back the yard. I am a new homeowner, but was fortunate the prior owner's had found a local company who has taken pretty nice control of the yard. The yard is probably in worse shape than the previous owners as we are first time parents (January our son was born) and had moved in shortly before this time and this is our first home.

I am planning on over seeding soon, but here in Southwest PA we have seen 90+ the past few weeks and again for a few more days. I bought 10lb from united seeds TTTF and EH Griffith E Plus mix.

What got me really looking into the yard care is trying to help save some costs, but also be proud of my yard as DIY (nervous I will mess it up!) Anyways, when we moved in, I subscribed for the 5 treatment program + grub treatment. Each costing about $50 so $300 annually for about 5,000 sq. ft. yard. I do have the benefit of seeing what has been put down and listed below (the sport spraying was much sq. ft, but the price doesn't change!)

I figured by starting the journal I can get some successful member feedback, asked questions and provide some insight to limit the damage.

I do need to do a better job of irrigating which will be a priority next year. I finally got around to buying some sprinklers.

Figured I would start with what has been put down so far for thoughts knowing two more treatments are do (late summer and winterize).

Maybe pricing isn't unreasonable, but I do have an EH Griffith close by along with an Advanced Turf. Figured if I buy 50lb bag I can do treatment for 2 years or what is done below is a bad idea.

Product	Amount	Targets	Method/Rate	Treated Area

1	18-0-3 .37 Prodiamine 25% XCU 5lbs/1000sf -- TCS GrowStar Product	25 Lbs	Entire Yard Spreader-	Push5lbs/1000sf	5 1000 Sq. Feet

2	28-2-3	23.64 Lbs	Entire Yard Spreader-	Push4lbs/1,000sf	5 1000 Sq. Feet
2	TRIAD SELECT	0.91 Gal	Entire Yard	Spot - Spray1.5oz/1000SF	5 1000 Sq. Feet

3	Q4 PBI Gorden	0.91 Gal	Entire Yard	Spot Spray3oz/1,000sf	5 1000 Sq. Feet

4	18-0-0 Allectus .225 insecticide 40% XCU 22.5 Lbs	Entire Yard	Spreader- 4.6lb/1000sf	4.5 1000 Sq. Feet

My lawn I think has some fescue, PR and maybe some KBG. I will try and get a few photos tomorrow. I'm working on sourcing a spreader and pump sprayer. Just nervous to take this over myself! Any votes of confidence will be much appreciated.

Also had a soil test done. I will try and see how to upload results, but below is a summary.

PH 6.3

Results of analysis:
P 190
K 337
Ca 2742
Mg 433

Calculated values
Cation exchange capacity - 9.1
K 4.7
Ca 75
Mg 20


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Welcome to TLF

Give the cool season guide a good read(see signature below). It is a good place to start. Don't get overwhelmed and focus on the family first, the yard could wait.

I will stress two key things, pre emergent in the spring and nitrogen in the fall. Those two things will set you up for success.

Advance turf sells dimension without nitrogen in granular (a pre emergent) and Ammonium Sulfate or urea for the fall. Their prices are good. That's most of what you need right now.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Thanks! Yeah, I read the guide and was amazed by the info. I will have to re-read to help instill the concepts. Thank you for putting that together! It's a great resource for a beginner like me.

Do you like dimension more than Prodiamine?

I think if I followed the guide right .10 dimension would be season long where Prodiamine is spring/fall application, correct?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Both are good. Prodiamine in liquid application is very inexpensive, but it involves a liquid application. Dimension in granular is easier to apply in April. Since your profile says 5k, dimension won't break the bank.

Both only last around 5-6months without reapplication.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Well, after 6" of rain last weekend and 90+ temperatures the week before I was finally able to thatch and overseed yesterday. Use a complete mix from EH Griffith and UnitedSeed. I hope it one takes. Watering for about 10 minutes every 5 hours, but looks like another 2-3" possible Tuesday with Florence moving up to the NE. Fingers crossed!

I did a manual thatch and filled up a 90 gallon waste bin of dead grass/thatch. That in itself should help.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

So it's about 8 days into the overseed and some seeds have sprouted up. Not sure if it's the PRG, TTTF or KBG. My guess the PRG.

Anyways, I've read conflicting times on when to put down starter fertilizer. I did a light dose when seed down. Should I do another since I'm a week out or another week? Just don't want to force the growth of the established lawn too.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

On an overseed, I would avoid nitrogen so your current lawn doesn't grow too fast ahead of the seeds.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Thank you!

Any recommendations on cutting time (how many days after overseed) There has been some germination about day 5 (today is Day 9). I was thinking of waiting two weeks to mow but the established lawn is a getting a little long and I think there has to be more seed that hasn't germinated yet.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Anyone help with this label? Never saw two weeds listed? Oliger our of OH bagged this and I picked it up for $2.50 for 5lbs. Don't feel too bad if this is a poor mix, but cultivators has looked promising....


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## rob13psu (May 20, 2018)

Hi there. My guess on the label is 00.00% noxious weed and 2% weeds.


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## Harts (May 14, 2018)

Label says that 2% of the seeds in that bag are weed seeds. I wouldn't use it.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

rob13psu said:


> Hi there. My guess on the label is 00.00% noxious weed and 2% weeds.


Thanks for the reply! I shot Oliger a note, but doubt they'll respond...

I was hoping inert matter as I was trying to draw an analogy to the sequencing on EH Griffith's mix... I think the third item was inert matter and was hoping it was a printing error.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Well Oliger got back to me ASAP this morning! Very friendly. The 2% should be inert matter and looking into why this happened. No big deal, just was a little hesitant to put down with so much weed content.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Hi all.

Does a fungus die in the cooling temps? We had stretch of 65-70 nights and I noticed some fungus, I think.

If not I'm going to drop the HOC a bit and treat maybe with Scott's disease ex.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

It depends on the type of fungus.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

I'll snap some pictures. Between warmer nights and keeping soil most for overseas I think caused it. It cooled off a bit this week finally but the last stretch there of September was wet and warm....


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Has a red tint to it too


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## pennstater2005 (Jul 17, 2017)

Just thought I'd add I use Oliger seed. It's always good cultivars. I just used their 50/50 KBG/PRG blend and it was excellent.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

pennstater2005 said:


> Just thought I'd add I use Oliger seed. It's always good cultivars. I just used their 50/50 KBG/PRG blend and it was excellent.


Yep, I was glad the 2% was a typo! They were nice about it too and fixed the lot in their system.

I got a good deal on the tttf mix at $2.5. I put some down about a week and half ago. Just hoping that first frost holds off a few more weeks...

I also got Oliger Fairlawn shade mix for under a tree that pretty thin. It was mostly Zodiac Chewings, Creeping red and a VNS KBG. WE'll see how it does.

My overseed from 9/15 was a bit of a disappointment. The front years is not super thick. Maybe the seedlings that are there need a year to mature... it's weird now when I walk on the front I hear a crunching noise... I don't remember that from the spring.

However, I was able to recover some areas that were bad off... next year I'll use more peat moss as arrears I put on thicker seemed to do better.... now I'm just battling moles. I can't seem to get them.

I bought the nomol traps, Trapline and then the yellow stop on to set trap. I just can't seem to get them! I have one in the front and back!


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Just lowered the HOC from Friday from 4" to 3.5" today. Hopping the cooler weather will help and if it's a fungus die-off...


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Hi all - will the cold weather take care of this or should I drop some fungus control?


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Well, 2019 I took over from the lawn care company who did a nice job, but I hope for more!

I just put down some 0-0-7 .43 barricade after originally buying a Pre M with nitrogen I decided I'd go ahead and go buy another bag.

First time spreading fertilizer so hopefully it works out! Pictures to come.... probably put down some Screemin' Green in May.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Anyone overseed in the fall and not see the results until late spring the following year?

I overseedeed in the fall and haven't noticed "great results" more POA Annua than before, but figured maybe it's a little early to notice. Yard is nice and green, but still working to make it thicker.


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## Chris LI (Oct 26, 2018)

Creppin said:


> Anyone overseed in the fall and not see the results until late spring the following year?
> 
> I overseedeed in the fall and haven't noticed "great results" more POA Annua than before, but figured maybe it's a little early to notice. Yard is nice and green, but still working to make it thicker.


Did you find any seed that germinated last fall? If you did, you could spoonfeed some urea or AMS in the spring, to aid in thickening. If you have the time, dig the poa out.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Yep, had spots where there was not much competition germinate for sure. I think this up coming weekend I might try some N. Need to get my soil test out this week before.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Thought I'd get some feedback on what to apply. I figure I need to find some 0-0-50 SOP? It's recommended to be 5lb so half in spring and fall.

Any other recommendations or type of potash?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

This is an easy one. Urea for nitrogen, no more phosphorus and SOP for K. Great soil. SOP goes down at 2lb/ksqft per month, when the grass is growing (avoid droughts, late fall and winter).


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

g-man said:


> This is an easy one. Urea for nitrogen, no more phosphorus and SOP for K. Great soil. SOP goes down at 2lb/ksqft per month, when the grass is growing (avoid droughts, late fall and winter).


Thanks Gman! Also thank you for the reviews on waypoint. It was an easy process and very friendly folks there.

I had a soil test done last year by the lawn company who also said K was low. They said it would get plenty through the normal program, but hindsight I think that's false.

Going to look for some Urea and see if there is any slow release type too. I have some Andersons HCU put was going to use for the nitrogen blitz this year.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Coated ureas provide a slow release. Some are time delayed, others are temp delayed and others styles. I think someone posted of all the different types.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

g-man said:


> This is an easy one. Urea for nitrogen, no more phosphorus and SOP for K. Great soil. SOP goes down at 2lb/ksqft per month, when the grass is growing (avoid droughts, late fall and winter).


Two quick questions:

1: should there be any concerns applying the Potassium with Disease Ex? I have signs of Red Thread beginning.... I was able to source some 0-0-50 SOP

2: Growing Season - would you consider May June then again in September start up? Or would you also go throughout the summer, unless no rain for a while. I seem to have read different interpretations of growing seasons. To me, it's spring and fall, but I could be convinced it's April - October or so.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

1) I don't think so.

2) if you have irrigation and your lawn is still growing (mowing), then continue applying. If you don't keep it green in the summer and it is 100F with no rain 3 weeks, then don't apply it.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Perfect! Thank you! Will hopefully get the disease ex and SOP down Friday.

I need to read the fungicide guide need to get a find a good fungicide.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

I'm going to let the front go this summer and dormant. I need to get the POA under control. I was going to overseed the back, but debating now about a heavy nitrogen blitz with an August drop of Pre M.


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Has anyone drawn a correlation with their lawn and low potassium with disease?

I seem to get red thread pretty easy, which I guess is common, but how much of this can be attributable to the potassium deficiency?


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

KBG or POA Triv?


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## Creppin (Aug 28, 2018)

Hoping for some Grass ID help. It's lighter green but it's been warm so I don't think it's triv or Annua, but I could be wrong! No ligule it looks like so that's how I ruled it out a bit. I have gone light on nitrogen and haven't put anything down since mid May other than some K and grub control.


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