# What To Do To Help This Lawn? [Pics Inside]



## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Hi All,

Super glad I found this forum, and even more glad to see it's active. So I'm a first time...DIYer lawn enthusiast. Bought a Fiskars StaySharp reel mower - hedger - and about to purchase a weed wacker electric for the spots the mower does not do a hot job on (edges mostly) with what I saved up.

I live in Corona, CA and the heat here has stepped up to 90F already in spring....and it'll keep climbing to almost 110F I'm certain.

The lawn used to be green, but in order to save for a tight budget etc. I shaved down the watering of the lawn (may not have been smart) to 2 minutes for 500 Square feet patches 3x a week (only in the morning at 5AM) and 1 minute for smaller patches approximately 45-100 square feet. This includes watering for bushes and semi-large trees (I figure I can water trees less....someone correct me if I'm wrong)!

The grass started to go super yellow - almost hay like is the best description....step on it and you hear a light "crunching" noise. So, I decided to buy chemical fertilizer from Scott's - 24-0-2 I believe and spread it with my hands (because I'm too much on a tight budget to be able to afford the broadcaster now). The front yard got more fertilizer than my backyard.

I did measurements and my lawn is under 5,000 sq feet, yet the fertilizer has only marginally improved the grass in the front to show more green to my surprise (I believed the lawn was dead and fertilizer was my last-ditch effort in hoping it might come back to life).

I'm unsure of the solutions to this problematic lawn situation:


Do I need to use more chemical fertilizer high in Nitrogen (As it seems to have brought back green grass)


Do I simply WATER more? I have only been giving it .25" of water....A WEEK.

To aid this - I myself aerated manually (and hurt myself badly by scraping my skin in the process) my lawn 3 months ago and then watered it a bit more to get the soil more moist to attempt to fix it - but that seemed to not work as well because the grass was mostly still yellow, and getting yellower (Jan-March) to before I put in fertilizer Mid-April.

The big issue it seems is......to keep a green lawn....it comes down to an important factor: money. Whether through supplies of fertilizer, or watering - I need quite a good budget for this (something I just don't have a lot of). I'm trying to be economical while whipping my grass into shape. What do I do here?

Pictures here for reference with appropriate captions in order:

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*Overview 18.6' x 25' of front lawn. Backyard is similar but has less greenery as less 32-0-2 feritlizer was put to it....(5,000 sq feet scotts bag).*










*Grass got greener after 32-0-2 fertilizer I put in last week.....watering 3x a week for 2 mins on 500 square feet roughly. ...but still kind of dead. Hand distributed as evenly as I could*










*Another angle*










*Soil feels dry with little circular lumps of rather semi-hard dirt...not rich deep black soil. Feels like .....clay almost or putting my hand in an old dirt pile....smells like soil but doesn't look like soil from a rich forest, etc!*










*Anyone know what type of grass I have? I believe it's ST. Augustine!*

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## Thor865 (Mar 26, 2018)

Watering for 2min is about as good as not watering at all


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Thor865 said:


> Watering for 2min is about as good as not watering at all


Had to be cut to keep in the budget....I don't think increasing watering at this time would even benefit in enriching or reinvigorating the soil...any more than 2 minutes runs off anyways and I end up with a huge wet driveway. As I mentioned in my post...it seems hydrophobic.

I noticed after aeraring, it didn't runoff as much but still did....not sure if increasing watering will really make much difference


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## Ral1121 (Mar 19, 2018)

Welcome to the forum. First thing I would do is read the Bermuda Bible. It is a great starting point.

https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=1651

Next, focusing on ammending the soil is a long process and someone can correct me if I am wrong but it takes several seasons. Even then you will still need to water the yard more to keep it green and growing. Lack of water and the yard will just go dormant.


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Ral1121 said:


> Welcome to the forum. First thing I would do is read the Bermuda Bible. It is a great starting point.
> 
> https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=1651
> 
> Next, focusing on ammending the soil is a long process and someone can correct me if I am wrong but it takes several seasons. Even then you will still need to water the yard more to keep it green and growing. Lack of water and the yard will just go dormant.


Do you believe my lawn is dormant or dead? I can't tell the difference...guessing dormant as I noticed green again after fertilizing...please note...I can increase watering...but seems like it would run off...I don't mind increasing watering if it's actually effective! Hence if I obviously compost....I would water more frequently as originally mentioned.

My goal would be to create a naturally rich soil so I wouldn't need to keep spending money on crappy chemical fertilizers...


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## Ral1121 (Mar 19, 2018)

Yes I believe it is dormant. As far as the runoff issues,. There are several things that can cause that. Soil type, compacted soil, or a thatch problem can all cause excess run off.

Couple of things that would probably help out
What kind of soil do you have?
Do you have a sprinkler system?
If so what kind of spray heads?
Could you possibly get a core sample picture so we can see more closely what you are dealing with?


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## Ral1121 (Mar 19, 2018)

I missed the part where you said you think you have St Augustine. I am not sure what kind of grass you have. Maybe someone else will chime in. If you have Bermuda, it is definitely dormant. If it is st Augustine I'm not so sure.


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## TC2 (Sep 15, 2017)

You could try shampooing the lawn to see whether it will help with the hydrophobicity issue.


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## Ral1121 (Mar 19, 2018)

Shampooing is cheap. Get baby shampoo and put it down at a rate of 3oz/1000. It might take a few treatment but it should help out.


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## Txag12 (Apr 22, 2018)

Your issue is a complex one. I would suggest aerating and watering more first. Getting your soil out of it's hydrophobic state is the first thing you need to accomplish. With regards to your tree, your shallow watering will lead to it's roots coming to the surface (depending on tree species) otherwise it'll get it's water deep. I wouldn't put any more fertilizer out (for your budgetting reasons). Once you get the soil back I would use a humic acid or Milorganite instead of Scott's fert.


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## Cory (Aug 23, 2017)

95% sure it's tall fescue. Lived in Temecula for 10 years in 4 different houses and they all had fescue. Needs a lot of water early in the morning.


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## Colonel K0rn (Jul 4, 2017)

Welcome to TLF, we're glad you're here. :thumbup:

From the looks of some of those pictures, it appears that you don't have St. Augustine, nor Bermuda (I didn't see any stolons, and the grass blades aren't wide enough for St. Aug/too wide for Bermuda). It more closely resembles Zoysia/Fescue that is deficient of water. When grass gets dried out and placed under high heat and drought stress, the leaves will fold/curl up to slow down transpiration(water loss). You'll see a needling effect. That's what it appears to be to me regarding your grass blades. I'd like to see some closer pictures of the blades, from the crowns (what's just above the surface) to the top of the leaf blade. Grab a plugger, trowel, something to get us a profile that we can closely help you identify your grass type with. That's going to be the key thing to helping us provide you with a better direction to point you in.

Irrigating based of time is a poor practice when it comes to thinking that you're doing your wallet and your yard any favors. Watering deep and infrequently is going to be the best thing for your yard rather than 5 minutes every other day. The root systems will be shallow, and never have to stretch themselves to get to cooler soil temps, nutrients and more importantly, deeper sources of water. An irrigation audit would be a good thing to perform, as our site admin said succinctly in another irrigation related post:


Ware said:


> Hard to say... "10 minutes" doesn't really define anything meaningful unless it is coupled with the precipitation rate. Are you using a hose end sprinkler or in-ground system?
> 
> For example, MP Rotators have a precipitation rate of 0.4 in/hr, so 10 minutes of runtime on a properly designed system is only ~0.07" of irrigation. A similar zone using sprays could have a precipitation rate of 1.50 in/hr, so 10 minutes of runtime would put down ~0.25" in that scenario. Rotors can vary wildly depending on which nozzle is installed. The best way to determine your actual precipitation rate is to do an irrigation audit with some gauges like these.


I'd recommend a soil test as well, and that's another bucket of worms to kick open.  For the budget-friendly approach, you can visit your local extension office/university that can provide you with a soil test to tell you if you're at least in the neighborhood of having decent soil to start with. Your agent/Master Gardener there can be a very valuable local resource that you can become pals with. There's other options from other labs available, and nothing wrong with Soil Savvy either. Frankly, I'd rather go with Waypoint Analytical or Logan Labs as there are more experienced people here that can help you interpret your results for less than what the SS test cost, and you'll generally get your results back quicker.


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## TC2 (Sep 15, 2017)

Cory said:


> 95% sure it's tall fescue. Lived in Temecula for 10 years in 4 different houses and they all had fescue. Needs a lot of water early in the morning.


When I started getting into lawns I read about people being recommended, or planning to plant, "drought tolerant" fescue for the socal region (I lived in San Diego for a few years). Doesn't make any sense to me.


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## Bunnysarefat (May 4, 2017)

You can calculate how much watering your lawn actually costs by looking at your water bill and doing some calculations on your irrigation. Your lawn needs about an inch of water per week, so assuming no rain falls we can look at it like this:

To provide your lawn with one inch of water takes a little over half a gallon per square foot (0.623 gallons).

So if you have 5,000 sq ft of lawn, you need 3,160 gallons of water. Now you need to look at your water bill, assuming your sewer rates are constant, calculate how much your water costs per gallon. I've been paying $0.003944 per gallon recently. So to irrigate your lawn with no supplemental rainfall would be about $12.45 per week.

So you can see if you can really afford, then do some calculations on how fast your sprinklers put out the water to find out how long to run your sprinklers. Hope this helps you start to see if more irritation is doable for you.


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## Cory (Aug 23, 2017)

TC2 said:


> Cory said:
> 
> 
> > 95% sure it's tall fescue. Lived in Temecula for 10 years in 4 different houses and they all had fescue. Needs a lot of water early in the morning.
> ...


It's because it goes dormant in the summer so you technically don't need to water as much and it will still retain some green if it's healthy. However most people don't know that and run their sprinklers the same amount all year. And if you have enough shade you can keep it green all year. If you go to most Home Depots or Lowe's in SoCal and look at their pallets of sod they keep in stock 99% of the time it will be tall fescue or bluegrass, the exception would be the high desert and Palm Springs areas.


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Cory said:


> 95% sure it's tall fescue. Lived in Temecula for 10 years in 4 different houses and they all had fescue. Needs a lot of water early in the morning.


Woah  Temecula is super close to me.


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

TC2 said:


> You could try shampooing the lawn to see whether it will help with the hydrophobicity issue.


Never heard of shampooing a lawn! o_o Doesn't shampoo have a lot of.....chemicals? Oh man I hope you are talking about Hair Shampoo or I'll sound silly.


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## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

@AggravatedMower I believe you have a TTTF (turf type tall fescue) lawn, which does go dormant with drought stress, but not for long before it just dies. I would get water to that lawn immediately. You should not apply fertilizer to a lawn under drought stress either, as this can exacerbate the problem.

Two minutes of water should not run off like you are describing, unless you are using a fireman's hose. Watch the irrigation system and make sure you don't have heads spraying directly onto the concrete. Some soils can become more hydrophobic as they dry out. The shampoo is an easy and inexpensive way to try to increase the soil's ability to accept water and can be applied through a hose end sprayer.


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## Cory (Aug 23, 2017)

AggravatedMower said:


> Woah  Temecula is super close to me.


Lived next to Pechanga :thumbup:


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Bunnysarefat said:


> You can calculate how much watering your lawn actually costs by looking at your water bill and doing some calculations on your irrigation. Your lawn needs about an inch of water per week, so assuming no rain falls we can look at it like this:
> 
> To provide your lawn with one inch of water takes a little over half a gallon per square foot (0.623 gallons).
> 
> ...


Amazing. I will admit I did not think of it in terms of proper cubic feet.


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Everyone here has given great answers...

I will up the irrigation but what's stressing me out is I don't know how to measure "1 inch" of water with my eyes. I have a live water meter - they calculate that towards the end...or it's some sort of "bill estimator" that kind of estimates CCF....I may have to pick up a gauge!

Also...I do believe the soil itself is a big issue...

P.S. shampooing????? Can someone elaborate what that is exactly and what I need to do it properly? P.S. I have a sprinkler system - and yes some of the "spray" does kind of hit concrete...I know there's screws on top to fix the shoot-out...but I think it comes at the cost of not reaching far enough for parts of the lawn.

Additional questions:

*Assuming my soil is great (more rich, dark, and not clay-like/ugly dirt) how much watering do I need or how do I figure that out per station? I have 10 stations (lawn + tree/shrubbery areas). Assuming an ideal situation?
*

*Not sure what "5 minutes 3x week" means. Per station? Total?? *

I'm just very lost when it comes to irrigation.

*Lastly before I did fertilizer last week or so - I noticed parts of my lawn in the backyard (getting same sunlight as dormant areas) - has green? Like it looks as if the grass is "Fresh" and lively...no fertilizer. Can anyone explain why only PARTS of the grass has went dormant, and some "patches" haven't?*


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Colonel K0rn said:


> Irrigating based of time is a poor practice when it comes to thinking that you're doing your wallet and your yard any favors. Watering deep and infrequently is going to be the best thing for your yard rather than 5 minutes every other day. The root systems will be shallow, and never have to stretch themselves to get to cooler soil temps, nutrients and more importantly, deeper sources of water. An irrigation audit would be a good thing to perform, as our site admin said succinctly in another irrigation related post:
> 
> 
> Ware said:
> ...


Thank you for the welcome! I'm so happy to be on an active lawn forum. yay.

As for watering infrequently to develop shallow roots - does that mean deep and wide so it holds moisture better? I'm looking to create a soil situation where I don't have to water a lot...does that not exist? Seems that's just simply not the case even in a perfect soil environment?

Lol maybe I'm being delusional on what I want.

Anyways here are some more pictures for you all as requested. Took them JUST now....

In order:

*PLEASE HIT RIGHT CLICK > VIEW IMAGE to ZOOM in (the forum doesn't allow this)*









*
Picture to identify type of Grass*









*
Cross-section to identify soil type/issues*










*
Cross-section to identify soil type/issues*










*Picture of dirt for extra reference
*


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## J_nick (Jan 28, 2017)

Water deep and infrequent.

Deep, water long enough where the soil is moist down to the 6" level. Depending on your soil type you might need to put down 1/2" of water or 1".

Infrequent, water the lawn only when it needs it not everyday. The more you look at the lawn (when it's healthy) you'll be able to see areas start wilting and showing drought stress. This is when you want to turn the irrigation one for the next morning.


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## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

@AggravatedMower that is definitely TTTF (fescue).

The soil looks good to me, meaning only that I would trade you for my silty clay, but only a soil structure test will be able to tell you the physical make-up of the soil. A standard soil test will tell you about the nutrients in the soil and how to improve it.

Shampoo is a surfactant like any other soap, so it makes water "wetter". You want to find one that has ammonium laureth sulfate or sodium laureth sulfate as one of the first two ingredients as this is the actual surfactant. You aren't trying to clean your grass, and you don't want a detergent soap. This can be applied at 2-4 oz/1000sf of lawn through a hose end sprayer available at big box stores for about $10-15.

Measuring the water output of your system will require sprinkler audit catch cups as previously discussed, or you can use tuna cans or similar straight sided containers. Run the system for 10 minutes, measure the depth in the catch cup, and that will tell you how long you have to run the system to get one inch of water. If the soil is "tight", you may have to run the system for a few minutes, allow it to soak for an hour, and repeat until you get an inch without runoff.


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Thank you! Now I know what I'm working with I can look up its properties. I ordered a sprinkler gauge yesterday.

I'm surprised to hear my soil is fine. Is it supposed to feel sort of dry? I imagine soil should be....well....kind of like super wet and black like a forest, but this one is crumbly....and kind of ......"ashy"

I figure it's because I'm not watering it enough? I heard some people mention that their soil is "clay" which I'm not sure what that means in all honesty. This feels like it has circular dirt clumps as can be seen in the picture ...they're semi-hard but if i rub them, they crumble.

I hope someone can answer my additional questions at the top of this thread


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Just wanted to bump this for the additional questions I had :thumbup:


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## Colonel K0rn (Jul 4, 2017)

I wanted to give you an analogy to think about when it comes to watering your lawn, and how you can help it out. Think of your soil as being a sponge (which it actually is). Take a bowl of water, and toss a brand new sponge in it. What is going to happen?

It floats.

Not until you get some water into the pores of the sponge does it start to take on more water, and actually become saturated. You've got to get your soil really wet, and I mean soaking, down to around 4-6" deep to where the irrigation that you're providing will actually get down into the soil profile and the root zone and get the grass the water that it needs. Until you get your soil moist enough to where the water you put on the soil is absorbed, it's going to continue to run off. @Spammage gave you the same advice that I'm giving you. Water until your soil gets to where it's not running off.

As far as measuring the water in different areas, that's why I linked the 10 pack of the gauges. You want to put those in multiple areas of the lot that you're irrigating. Let the system run long enough to collect 1" of water that will saturate the ground, not run off. Once one of those gauges reaches 1", cut the system off, take note of how long it took you to collect that amount and see if you have 1" in all of the gauges. If not, you'll need to adjust the sprayers to provide even coverage. You might have one that's not diffusing the water enough, and it's shooting a straight stream over the whole area, and not dispersing droplets. Conversely, you might have one that's spraying a curtain of mist, and not putting droplets over the area. Without seeing your system in person, it's hard to tell you what your next course of action should be.

Irrigation tutorials has a wealth of information about irrigation, and many people here have studied this site to design their system, myself included. Granted, I don't have one installed, I'm using this to make sure that I'm designing it correctly.

Another option you could consider, and I'm not sure if it is an option, is a shallow well, strictly for irrigation. There's several people in my area that use shallow wells for irrigation. Cost for installation is $2-3K, but you don't have to pay a water bill to the utility company.


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## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

AggravatedMower said:


> Thank you! Now I know what I'm working with I can look up its properties. I ordered a sprinkler gauge yesterday.
> 
> I'm surprised to hear my soil is fine. Is it supposed to feel sort of dry? I imagine soil should be....well....kind of like super wet and black like a forest, but this one is crumbly....and kind of ......"ashy"
> 
> ...


I'm not saying your soil is fine, I just said I would trade you based on the pics you posted. Clay is generally in all soils to some degree and holds moisture well, but when clay is the primary component the soil can be very challenging. Your pic looks more like a decent loan based on the crumbling texture that I see, but mine either looks like pottery clay (when wet) or concrete (when dry). You can do a soil structure test on your own, or send a sample to have it analyzed.


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Thanks guys. I have figured out 16 minutes = 1" water for the 500 square feet. It takes less time for the "smaller" pieces of land (guessing ratio of sprinklers to that area is greater).....as I doubt amount of grass has an impact on water flow rate correct?

Also - im noticing green on my backyard. But I'm still noticing a lot of ....grass. I know a few people here mentioned my grass is dormant. The backyard grass when I pull it - seems to come out pretty easily and looks like...what I imagine hay/straw looks like in those TV shows....

Is it dead? Some of the grass I can't pull out, some I can easily. Should I dethatch? With what type of rake? Leaf, Bow, Thatch?

Thank you!


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

@Ware please move this to cool season


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

AggravatedMower said:


> Ware please move this to cool season


 :thumbup:


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

Bumping this up for my cool-season brothers.

Need your help please!

Feel free to see the original post and note these changes:

I know what my grass is now (Not St. Augustine but TALL TURF TYPE FESCUE).

I'm now watering 1" (16 mins) as opposed to .25" a week (4 mins each station) with my irrigation system. 
The front yard Grass HAS gotten way greener Yellow does exist for a good portion....

The backyard has gotten greener - but there exists a lot of yellow grass where the grass pulls out easily (is this 100% dead grass?) Some yellow grass in the backyard is "rooted" so not as easy to pull (I believe this is DORMANT as its not easy to pull out - feel free to correct me). Anyone that can answer this would mean a lot.

Also should I dethatch with a bow rake or leaf rake in terms of getting rid of "dead" grass and not dormant if this is the case? Wouldn't dead grass help heat stress even if it adds growth stress?

From a soil test - I have LOAM soil.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Welcome. I just read your entire thread.

Could you describe how you measure the 16min = one inch of water? It takes me 1hr to get an inch of water and it is rare to have irrigation systems capable to delivery that amount of water. You said that you lowered the irrigation time, what was the original?

Base on the images, and your descriptions and your weather, it looks really simple. Your soil is super dry. Your current weather going into summer is not going to help. How do your neighbors lawn look like?


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

g-man said:


> Welcome. I just read your entire thread.
> 
> Could you describe how you measure the 16min = one inch of water? It takes me 1hr to get an inch of water and it is rare to have irrigation systems capable to delivery that amount of water. You said that you lowered the irrigation time, what was the original?
> 
> Base on the images, and your descriptions and your weather, it looks really simple. Your soil is super dry. Your current weather going into summer is not going to help. How do your neighbors lawn look like?


Hi 

I put a sprinkler gauge in all the areas and ran them for 15 minutes. Most showed 1" in 15 mins. My neighbors grasses look green naturally - they never cut their water and watered it more frequently for longer than I did than deep/infrequent.

As for the rate of yours vs mine. Not sure what to say. Mine definitely went to 1" in 15 minutes.

I would like to know about the dormant vs dead grass if you can answer those questions, would appreciate it.

I noticed parts of my soil where a screwdriver of 8" goes in like butter, other parts where it just "Gets stuck" after 4 inches and it requires a lot of my energy to push it past that....lol. I may shampoo those areas...


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## Jconnelly6b (Mar 4, 2018)

I would suggest continuing to water and monitor the grass in the back to see if it is in fact dormant or dead. In another week's time you should be able to tell... the grass that is dormant will be yellow and if it's dead it will be brown.

I would suggest to still do the baby shampoo process it will not hurt it will only help.


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## FuzzeWuzze (Aug 25, 2017)

Also not sure what your budgeting is like, but if watering is worrying you a smart controller like Rachio might not be a bad upgrade depending on what your using now.

Living in Cali you can get $80 rebates back from the city after you buy one (about $170 for a Gen2 on Amazon). 
Or if you wait and set alerts on sites like Slickdeals you can get them for 150 or less on sale.
http://www.socalwatersmart.com/images/PDFs/qualifying_list_wbics.pdf

Damn Fresno county is giving away Rachio's now....one upside I suppose to living in drought country.


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

FuzzeWuzze said:


> Also not sure what your budgeting is like, but if watering is worrying you a smart controller like Rachio might not be a bad upgrade depending on what your using now.
> 
> Living in Cali you can get $80 rebates back from the city after you buy one (about $170 for a Gen2 on Amazon).
> Or if you wait and set alerts on sites like Slickdeals you can get them for 150 or less on sale.
> ...


Thanks...budget is a concern...but my lawn needs what it needs...1" of water regardless....I don't mind looking at my lawn and manually doing it. Never heard of Ranchio before, but how exactly would a smart weather controller benefit me if the goal is to water deep/infrequent?

Purely rebate purposes or...? I don't see the point in it if it's weather based. It would be cool if it were lawn based and had a probe that told me my lawn was dry or something lol.


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## Colonel K0rn (Jul 4, 2017)

I wish I could get a rebate for a Rachio 

Regarding soil sensors, check out https://support.rachio.com/hc/en-us/articles/115010541408-Soil-Sensor-FAQ


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## FuzzeWuzze (Aug 25, 2017)

AggravatedMower said:


> FuzzeWuzze said:
> 
> 
> > Also not sure what your budgeting is like, but if watering is worrying you a smart controller like Rachio might not be a bad upgrade depending on what your using now.
> ...


They do allow you to use moisture/rain sensors, but weather based gets you 95% of the way there. They know your soil type(assuming you enter it in right), they know how much water they put down, and they know the weather(evaporative rate). Thats pretty much all you need to have a pretty good idea of when your lawn will need water.

Might make sense for some regions more than others, for mine that has sporatic rain nearly year around, i dont need to be fiddling with sprinkler schedules so that I dont dump 2 hours worth of water on my lawn at 5am the day rain is expected.

Also people use it in regions that have water restrictions, it can be weather based but also be sensitive that your only allowed to water MWF for example and do its best to water accordingly.


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

It sounds interesting but why would evaporation rates matter? If the water is deep/in the soil to help the roots grow out, why would I be concerned about the surface water content? Seems to me that would only promote frequent watering, and not deep if it just bases it off of weather?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

This image from rachio explains it better.










Some of the water is used by the plant, some is lost too deep, some evaporates. The rachio keeps track of all of this to water when the "bank" is depleted. Some of us keep the math in our own spreadsheet.

https://support.rachio.com/hc/en-us/articles/115010542148-What-are-Advanced-Zone-Settings-


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

After reading that...and learning they do take root zone depth into account...I may buy one now! :thumbup:

I'm curious is this good for deep/frequent irrigation? Efficiency level is interesting...they mention the DU efficiency needing to be done with a sprinkler gauge for an average....I assume 100% efficiency is "the lawn is equal in all parts" sort of thing.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

This is very good for deep/infrequent irrigation. It takes into account the sun/shade/lawn slope/soil type. Sprinkler effiency = how good even coverage you have. No system is 100% since you loose some water to mist/evaporation as it travels thru the air or run off.


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

In the meantime - I dethatched and raked as much dead grass as I could. I fertilized the yellow areas regardless of the stress growing may or may not have.

I'm curious - does deep irrigation take into account fertilizer water needs? Doesn't fertilizer need to be watered more frequently than deep/infrequent?


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## AggravatedMower (Apr 23, 2018)

My lawn blows....

I did a soil probe last night - keeps hitting cement all around my lawn...or what seems to be rock. I dug up on of them in the corner...and it seems to be rock AROUND a PVC drainage pipe (the pipe is filled with dirt/soil and open and not capped) - the rock seems to be all around it and unable to budge....like it's AFFIXED to some foundation underneath my lawn.

Depresses me as we all know cement/rock is not great UNDER lawn...and not beneficial AT ALL to lawn growth. It definitely sucks.....


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## JohnP (Oct 24, 2017)

Did you contact builder to find out about the crazy bits you found? What's status with HOA? Plans for the fall?


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