# Second Tenacity App



## Mozart (Jul 17, 2018)

So the second Tenacity app should be about 30 days after seed down, correct? Should it be applied with or without a surfactant? How about mowing - avoid within several days of tenacity?


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## JDgreen18 (Jun 14, 2018)

Mozart said:


> So the second Tenacity app should be about 30 days after seed down, correct? Should it be applied with or without a surfactant? How about mowing - avoid within several days of tenacity?


I was just having this delema....I used @Pete1313 reno as a guide he reapplied at day 45... I believe you use a surfactant when applying to foliage and not when applying to the ground at seed down.
Also at domyown the questions and answers it says not to mow 2 days before or after application.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

@Mozart @JDgreen18 It is in page 12 of the label:


> Wait until the newly germinated turf has been mowed two times or four weeks after emergence (whichever is longer) before making a postemergence application.


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## MichiganGreen (Aug 7, 2018)

Mozart said:


> So the second Tenacity app should be about 30 days after seed down, correct? Should it be applied with or without a surfactant? How about mowing - avoid within several days of tenacity?


Hi @@Mozart 
Side note, I need a good pre emergent for ththe spring,and tenacity keeps coming to the top of my list because of the bent grass it will take care of. Honestly I'm scared to use it because of all the other things it will kill off and my lawn will look like a splotchy mess. Other part is I'm just not too comfortable using a full yard powerful spray like this, evenly. considering using one of the blue dye products to help keep it even.

Option B is using tenacity around the bentgrass patches, and a granular pre E throughout the rest of the yard.

Any thoughts?


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## Mozart (Jul 17, 2018)

Thanks, so for KBG 2 mows would almost certainly be longer (45 days makes sense). So it will have some pre emergent qualities but primarily the second app is applied to kill any active weeds?

Will maker blue harm the baby grass?


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## Mozart (Jul 17, 2018)

MichiganGreen said:


> Mozart said:
> 
> 
> > So the second Tenacity app should be about 30 days after seed down, correct? Should it be applied with or without a surfactant? How about mowing - avoid within several days of tenacity?
> ...


Hi @MichiganGreen, honestly I'm not sure how to advise but I have a bentgrass patch too and my plan is to hit it with tenacity in the spring. I will apply prodiamine separately as tenacity only lasts about 4 weeks as a PreM. I would only use tenacity as a PreM for seeding. Otherwise I would use it as a herbicide and not count its PreM qualities.


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## MichiganGreen (Aug 7, 2018)

Mozart said:


> MichiganGreen said:
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> > Mozart said:
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Prodiamine is really the one that I'm iffy on using. That one is even more delicate is it not?


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## FuzzeWuzze (Aug 25, 2017)

What do you mean delicate?


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## MichiganGreen (Aug 7, 2018)

FuzzeWuzze said:


> What do you mean delicate?


Bad choice of words - meaning it can work great it applied correctly but easy to screw up and harm the lawn as well.


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## SpiveyJr (Jun 7, 2018)

MichiganGreen said:


> FuzzeWuzze said:
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> 
> > What do you mean delicate?
> ...


That can be said with anything you put on your lawn from too much seed, too much N, too much water, too much herbicide, etc... I wouldn't stress too much about it.


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## MichiganGreen (Aug 7, 2018)

SpiveyJr said:


> MichiganGreen said:
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> > FuzzeWuzze said:
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Well obviously....but like anything it's all relative, you know what I mean? Hurting your lawn with water vs. Prodiamine isn't really an appropriate side by side comparison. I have plenty of time to look into it though fortunately.


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## FuzzeWuzze (Aug 25, 2017)

I've never heard of anyone overdoing Prodiamine, you have to screw up pretty bad i think for that to happen.

More prodiamine just = longer coverage but also means you hit your yearly max sooner. So most people do it in 3-4 month sprays, but if you went heavy and it was equivilent to 5 mo your not going to really do anything to your grass.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

@FuzzeWuzze We had a couple of members that have over applied prodiamine by mistake (10x). It causes damage to the roots of the grass.


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## ken-n-nancy (Jul 25, 2017)

g-man said:


> We had a couple of members that have over applied prodiamine by mistake (10x). It causes damage to the roots of the grass.


I just made the below post in a different thread, but it's also relevant here, even though we're getting a bit off the original thread's topic of Tenacity and going on a tangent for prodiamine...

Aapplication of pre-emergents (including prodiamine) slows down the rhizome growth of Kentucky Bluegrass. More pre-emergent is not better.

You want to apply the minimum pre-emergent to get the protection you need against whatever weeds make you decide to apply a pre-emergent, whether crabgrass, or _poa annua_, or ???

Don't just take my word for it, though. There are lots of studies on this topic. Below is one from CalState/UMass quite a few years ago. (Warning, this isn't an easy read, but there are some excellent charts at the end which show how the pre-emergents reduce tillers and rhizomes, and that the effect increases with the more of the pre-emergent that is applied.)

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.553.3928&rep=rep1&type=pdf

Accordingly, I make multiple lower-rate pre-emergent treatments (i.e. two 3-month rate treatments after one another, rather than a single 6-month treatment), as I think the grass tolerates the multiple smaller treatments better than single larger applications. (This is kind of the "spoon-feeding" mentality, but for the pre-emergent, instead.)

Some conclusions I would make include:

Don't apply pre-emergents if there isn't a weed you're trying to prevent

If there is a weed you're trying to prevent, a pre-emergent can prevent that weed for only a minor reduction in rhizome/tiller growth, if the pre-emergent is applied with a proper dosage.

Don't apply more of the pre-emergent than you need to get a level of control that is sufficient for your needs.

Make multiple smaller applications of a pre-emergent, rather than a single larger application, in order to reduce the total amount of the pre-emergent used over time.


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## FuzzeWuzze (Aug 25, 2017)

g-man said:


> @FuzzeWuzze We had a couple of members that have over applied prodiamine by mistake (10x). It causes damage to the roots of the grass.


Ok true enough, I suppose everything in such extremes will hurt your yard, hell if you put down 10x the amount of water your lawn needs your likely to kill a bunch of it.

But in general i just wanted him to not think that Prodiamine is going to fry your lawn if you put in 1.25 tsp instead of 1 tsp per gallon(or whatever the rate is).


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## ken-n-nancy (Jul 25, 2017)

FuzzeWuzze said:


> But in general i just wanted him to not think that Prodiamine is going to fry your lawn if you put in 1.25 tsp instead of 1 tsp per gallon(or whatever the rate is).


Agreed. I hope I didn't give the wrong impression in my post above. Basically, all of the selective herbicides we use have an effect upon the desirable grass, too. The trick is managing the dosage applied to harm the weeds enough to kill them and affect the desirable grass only a little bit, so that the desirable grass survives, and, preferably, isn't even visibly affected.


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