# HVAC questions



## Guest (May 5, 2018)

Well I think my trane is on it's last leg. It's 2001 model and I've not had any issues till this month since we've lived here for 3 years. It was 5.5lbs low on freon. So the part is leaking at the condenser coil and at cost it's over 1000$. 
So would y'all replace the entire unit given it's 17 years old or fix and wait for the next thing to break. 
It's a heat pump unit and I'm jealous of all the natural gas folks, but maybe some day we will get it here. Just wondering if anyone knows more about these than me. I've heard try a Goodman or a carrier or Rheem even and it turns into a Chevy vs Ford contest.


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## Powhatan (Dec 15, 2017)

The older R-22 freon is being phased out in 2020, R-410A is the newer freon. If your unit is using R-22 it be more cost effect in the long run to switch over to the newer R-410A, plus the newer heat pump units are more energy efficient. I suggest getting some estimates for unit repair vs system change out and go with what you think is the best for your budget and long term HVAC needs. The HVAC vendor may offer resonable financing.


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## Guest (May 5, 2018)

Powhatan said:


> The older R-22 freon is being phased out in 2020, R-410A is the newer freon. If your unit is using R-22 it be more cost effect in the long run to switch over to the newer R-410A, plus the newer heat pump units are more energy efficient. I suggest getting some estimates for unit repair vs system change out and go with what you think is the best for your budget and long term HVAC needs. The HVAC vendor may offer resonable financing.


Thanks, I didn't know it was getting phased out. That's good to know information. I will check out some estimates. I think since we plan to stay her long term we may replace it. The heat in the winter was killing us on our electric bill so a new one should help a little I would hope.


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## gene_stl (Oct 29, 2017)

Freon R-22 is currently over $30/lb and a repair person is likely to mark it up. Heat pump systems are usually a bit heavier duty and usually a bit more efficient than A/C only units. A 17 year old unit could be pretty efficient. The payback on higher efficiency replacements versus less efficient depends on your local electrical rates and what kind of financing is available. Often the electrical utility will have programs to help as will the equipment manufacturer's and even the sellers.

FWIW in 1991 I installed an Armstrong A/C unit on my old house in 1991 and other than giving it a squirt of R-22 every six years or so and replacing condenser fan motors every ten years or so (get a condenser fan that has permanently lubricated ball bearings rather than sleeves you have to oil every year. Although the sleeves are quieter if that may be an issue) and the unit was still air conditioning fine when I sold the house in 2016.

I also like American Standard Units.
I prefer units that have copper condenser and evaporator coils. I have heard guys say that aluminum is better but I have had two aluminum ones leak.

The Chevy versus Ford analogy is a good one because there are far fewer companies making the components that go into them. It is hard to evaluate components. Just because it is from china doesn't mean it's a piece of crap and just because it was made here does not mean it is super duper. The unit has to be well engineered and components selected well. In general the higher efficiency ones also have better components and bigger evaporators and condensers which can withstand higher pressures and should be able to withstand more cycling without fatigue. That was why I went with American Standard in about 2008 and actually brought that unit with me when I moved although it turned out to not be sized right for here. One of the units in my new place had an unfindable leak. (searched for with fluorescent dye in the oil and with Inficon state of the art leak detectors. I couldn't find nor could a friend of mine who does nothing but high end refrigeration nor could the guy sent by the Home Owners warranty company. (He couldn't find it and they would only install a mid grade unit with aluminum which is what the old one had.)

Carrier invented and commercialized refrigeration as we know it and used to be at the higher end. Things change and less passionate people get ahold of trademarks. Goodman's is likely pretty good too. Ask who makes the compressor. Copeland is good. You will see their units in every grocery store running the coolers. Tecumseh engines went out of business and are gone but their refrig compressors are not. But I think they were taken over by Embraco which makes compressors all over the world. And at many price points.

Leaking systems can be maddening. One is currently maddening me at work. A big environmental plant growth chamber that can control its temp humidity lighting and CO2. The freon leaked out. I recharged it telling them , the (copeland) condenser system we installed ten years ago when I first got there, either had a ten year leak or a new fast leak. It was the latter so I put fluorescent dye in and recharged it. I got into the evaporator confident I would see a big splash of glowing oil. Nothing anywhere. Using a 200 watt UV reflector arc lamp. It is possible to have leaks that are very hard to find and don't leave oil puddles.
Good luck


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

Replace the whole works. Likely your state will have some energy credits for energy efficiency etc.

If you're in the south like me, a poorly running AC working too hard could easily cost you $100-$200 extra a month, or more importantly to me, not get it down to that <72 degree range.

Check Costco if you have one nearby, they usually have people who will do a whole system and you get a member discount.

Plus Scott's greenmax is on sale


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## Guest (May 8, 2018)

SCGrassMan said:


> Replace the whole works. Likely your state will have some energy credits for energy efficiency etc.
> 
> If you're in the south like me, a poorly running AC working too hard could easily cost you $100-$200 extra a month, or more importantly to me, not get it down to that <72 degree range.
> 
> ...


Haha Ok. Will talk the wife into a trip to Costco for HVAC 😜


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

firefighter11 said:


> Haha Ok. Will talk the wife into a trip to Costco for HVAC 😜


Mine absolutely despises Costco as well


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