# Weeds before scalp



## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

Happy spring y'all.

I applied pre-e, but my dormant bermuda has tons of weeds showing up as the temps start to climb.

Pre-e went down aug 31 and again jan 24. Used Lesco dimension.

Are my current weeds going to die as temps go up? Or are they now spring/summer weed and I need to kill them off before scalping? Will Celsius work now?

Thx


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## Still learnin (Sep 9, 2017)

Depends on what type of weed they are. Poa and other winter weeds will eventually die off. Pics may help someone identify the weeds.

Most people don't use Celsius until it gets hotter. Speedzone is a popular choice while the temps are cooler, but again it is best to identify the weed to target it.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)




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## MrMeaner (Feb 21, 2017)

I would hit them all with round up and wait a couple weeks scalp..


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

Isnt it getting too warm for that? Going to vary between 81 and 61 the next 7 days. Just trying to make sure not to nuke the grass


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## Keepin It Reel (Feb 20, 2019)

DFWdude said:


> Isnt it getting too warm for that? Going to vary between 81 and 61 the next 7 days. Just trying to make sure not to nuke the grass


I wouldn't use Roundup this late into the season. When it's completely dormant that's fine but once you're getting greenup I would stay clear of it. You can get selective herbicides that will work.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

MeanDean said:


> DFWdude said:
> 
> 
> > Isnt it getting too warm for that? Going to vary between 81 and 61 the next 7 days. Just trying to make sure not to nuke the grass
> ...


OK, thats what I thought.

Any recommendations on herbicides for those weeds in early spring temps?

Thanks!


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## 1FASTSS (Jul 11, 2018)

I'd paint them with roundup. Easiest option if your concerned about spraying.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

Would rather spray with something else. Certainty?


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## bp2878 (Feb 13, 2019)

Speedzone will get 3 out of 4 of those. Certainty will probably get the fourth. Speedzone and certainty are my go to this time of year if I need to blanket, which I did this year. painting with gly is what I'd do if it were only a few local spots. I know you don't want to hurt your grass, but a target painting of weeds will do less damage than a blanket spray right now. Neither will hurt it long term, just don't paint prior to rain and a very little goes a long way. I'm no expert, just what I have done. I've painting weeds in mid summer in the middle of my lawn with great success.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

Sadly, I have way too many to paint.

Can I mix speedzone & certainty and spray at the same time?


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## GrassDad (Sep 18, 2019)

Are you doing a split pre-em application this spring? Since you applied Jan 24th it may be time for the 2nd app.

That purple dead nettle is a winter annual so it will die when temps start to rise. Next fall I would use lesco's stonewall which has the active ingredient Prodiamine and save the dimension (dithiopryr) for the spring...


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## Kicker (Apr 5, 2018)

GrassDad said:


> Are you doing a split pre-em application this spring? Since you applied Jan 24th it may be time for the 2nd app.
> 
> That *purple dead nettle* is a winter annual so it will die when temps start to rise. Next fall I would use lesco's stonewall which has the active ingredient Prodiamine and save the dimension (dithiopryr) for the spring...


Nothing much to add except I believe that's henbit not purple dead nettle. I could be wrong but just want to make sure that it gets correctly identified so as not to go down the wrong path with pre/post emergent strategies if the two have differing treatments.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

GrassDad said:


> Are you doing a split pre-em application this spring? Since you applied Jan 24th it may be time for the 2nd app.
> 
> That purple dead nettle is a winter annual so it will die when temps start to rise. Next fall I would use lesco's stonewall which has the active ingredient Prodiamine and save the dimension (dithiopryr) for the spring...


No split. I used the lesco #2 program so it should be good for 6 months. My issue was likely my AUG application, which was too light and not stonewall.

Thanks


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

bp2878 said:


> Speedzone will get 3 out of 4 of those. Certainty will probably get the fourth. Speedzone and certainty are my go to this time of year if I need to blanket, which I did this year. painting with gly is what I'd do if it were only a few local spots.


This or Celsius.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

I spot applied speedzone and certainty yesterday. How long do I have to wait before scalping?


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## bp2878 (Feb 13, 2019)

You would be fine after a few days, enough time for the herbicides to get to the roots but I would wait until those broadleafs are dead. Probably about a week. Speedzone works pretty quick. I sprayed on March 1, broadleaf's are dead and I'm scalping tomorrow.


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## dicko1 (Oct 25, 2019)

Top pic is Henbit
Middle looks like Rescue Grass
Bottom looks like Queen Annes Lace

A broadleaf weed killer will get top and bottom, roundup will get the middle. Or just brush roundup onto all. If it is rescue grass, its an annual so a pre emergent will also take care of it for next year.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

****o1 said:


> Top pic is Henbit
> Middle looks like Rescue Grass
> Bottom looks like Queen Annes Lace
> 
> A broadleaf weed killer will get top and bottom, roundup will get the middle. Or just brush roundup onto all. If it is rescue grass, its an annual so a pre emergent will also take care of it for next year.


Thank you brother!


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## Philly_Gunner (Apr 23, 2019)

First two are henbit. Dicamba or 2-4D will work on that. Trimec is a good option for all of those.


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## Buster (Apr 3, 2020)

DFWdude said:


> Happy spring y'all.
> 
> I applied pre-e, but my dormant bermuda has tons of weeds showing up as the temps start to climb.
> 
> ...


Hi @DFWdude Im over in Ft Worth and have the identical weeds popping up too. Got a few others too despite a granular PreEm in Feb and spray Dimension about 2 weeks ago.

I've been pulling a lot by hand, and also wondering why my PreEm is not stopping these guys. I will say that my yard DOES look better than all my neighbors. They have 10x the weeds.

Let us know what you end up doing. I may spot treat with Image as that works well, but I've also damaged my dormant/emerging bermuda with it before too. So kinda uncertain on if I should do that again.


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## DFWdude (Aug 28, 2020)

Buster said:


> DFWdude said:
> 
> 
> > Happy spring y'all.
> ...


I mixed and spot treated w speed zone and certainty on Thursday. No real progress yet, but i'm optimistic


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## corneliani (Apr 2, 2019)

Buster said:


> Hi @DFWdude Im over in Ft Worth and have the identical weeds popping up too. Got a few others too despite a granular PreEm in Feb and spray Dimension about 2 weeks ago.
> 
> I've been pulling a lot by hand, and also wondering why my PreEm is not stopping these guys. I will say that my yard DOES look better than all my neighbors. They have 10x the weeds.
> 
> Let us know what you end up doing. I may spot treat with Image as that works well, but I've also damaged my dormant/emerging bermuda with it before too. So kinda uncertain on if I should do that again.


Pre-emergent herbicides are not 100% effective, even in optimal conditions. Throw in the myriad external factors that affect efficacy (heat/sunlight, traffic, rainfall/moisture, soil microbes, excessive weed bank/pressure, etc etc etc) and that layer of protection becomes even less foolproof. The biggest factor may yet be the application details; the what/where/when of preemergent herbicide application. What weeds are most prevalent, and when do those weeds start to germinate? .. and what is the best herbicide to combat them in your particular region? That should determine what to use, when to apply, and at what interval.

I will say that if your neighbors have it as bad as you say, I can only imagine what your yard would be like WITHOUT your efforts to-date. So create your pre-emergent plan, tweak it as you learn and see the weeds adapt, and whatever falls through the cracks can be handled post-emergence.

EDIT: winter weeds start their germinating period late summer/early fall, as soil temps dip into the 70's. That usually means Sept/Oct for most of us, and that's when you should time your pre-em application for. Feb & March apps are to prevent summertime weeds, mainly crabgrass.


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## southernbuckeye (Sep 29, 2019)

As others have said, Celsius and 24d are good. I've been using 24d since I like to save the Celsius for the hot temps when 24d is not indicated


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## GrassDad (Sep 18, 2019)

Kicker said:


> GrassDad said:
> 
> 
> > Are you doing a split pre-em application this spring? Since you applied Jan 24th it may be time for the 2nd app.
> ...


Correct. I retract my statement. Those little dang purple flowers!!


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## CP3 (Mar 14, 2021)

Still learnin said:


> Depends on what type of weed they are. Poa and other winter weeds will eventually die off. Pics may help someone identify the weeds.
> 
> Most people don't use Celsius until it gets hotter. Speedzone is a popular choice while the temps are cooler, but again it is best to identify the weed to target it.


I had some of those at spots too. I went out and pulled them up since it wasn't very many. Just make sure you get the whole root.


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## Redtwin (Feb 9, 2019)

southernbuckeye said:


> As others have said, Celsius and 24d are good. I've been using 24d since I like to save the Celsius for the hot temps when 24d is not indicated


This is exactly what I have done for the past couple of years with no noticeable harm to my bermuda. This year I have notice the spots I sprayed are significantly delayed in greening up. I have a friend who had the same issue on his TifTuf. Have any of you noticed delays in greening up when using 2,4-D? It straight up smoked the dollarweed I had in a few spots but it's obvious where I sprayed. Maybe I was a little heavy handed this year.


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## southernbuckeye (Sep 29, 2019)

Yes, it does seem harder on it then Celsius, especially if you're already exiting dormancy. Here in SC we're way behind you though in terms of green up. Florida people always seem have first world problems when it comes to Bermuda &#128514;


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## Redtwin (Feb 9, 2019)

southernbuckeye said:


> Yes, it does seem harder on it then Celsius, especially if you're already exiting dormancy. Here in SC we're way behind you though in terms of green up. Florida people always seem have first world problems when it comes to Bermuda 😂


Yeah, Bermuda loves the heat and humidity!

My favorite meme from @Redtenchu:


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## Redtenchu (Jan 28, 2017)

Redtwin said:


> My favorite meme from @Redtenchu:


It's you 100% :lol:


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## Turfsup_pal (Mar 16, 2021)

Asked this before but looking for more affirmation - can you blanket spray with Certainty while dormant and or during green up (zoysia) ?


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

@TurfsUp _*From the label*: Use of this product may result in temporary chlorosis, and may affect the growth pattern or delay green-up of the desirable turf._

So yes, even thought green up MAY be delayed it is in my opinion better than having a lawn full of weeds. Apply at lower rates to prevent delay if worried. I would not be worried.

_*From the label*r selective control of annual bluegrass (Poa annua), apply this product at 1.25 to 2.0 ounces per acre. Use the higher rate of this product for control in areas of established, dense weed infestation.
Best results are obtained when weeds are in the early stage of growth and prior to tillering.
IN DORMANT BERMUDAGRASS ONLY, tank mixtures of this product with Roundup
®®
PRO orQuikPRO herbicidesmaybeusedtoincreasethespectrumofvegetation
controlled. Read and follow the label directions, precautionary statements and all other label information on Roundup PRO or QuikPRO herbicides. Refer to the Roundup PRO or QuikPRO product labels for approved application rates. Always apply tank mixtures according to the most restrictive precautionary statements of the products being used._

I would not mix roundup but it is further evidence of the label saying it is OK if dormant.


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## Turfsup_pal (Mar 16, 2021)

Ok I will give it a shot - I will test a small area first as I have multiple patches up to 20'x20" of green grass growing up through the dormant canopy- I'm guessing my fall application of pre-emergent is not affecting this type of grass? as it has been present for multiple seasons - I have pulled some for ID and it came back as rye / Kbg through the "PictureThis" app. I'm most likely over worrying lol I appreciate the information - AGAIN!


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## FlowRider (Apr 7, 2019)

After the Great Arctic Blast iced over my lawn, trees and shrubs, many weeds showed signs of frost burn. The yellow nutsedge and kyllinga died off (on the surface, anyway).

I spot sprayed with Trimec that included Quinclorac with the 2,4D and dicamba.

It has really killed off the broad leaves and volunteer St. Augustine. I still need to knock back the grassy weeds. I am trying to use up all my old chemicals, and I have one quart bottle of Image for the grassy weeds.

Then I will switch to Celsius and Certainty from then on, but after lawn greenup. My Bermuda went full dormant after the ice & snow, so I did not want to adversely affect greenup.

I used dithiopyr on November 15th for pre-emergent. It seems to have worked pretty well. Far fewer weeds.
And only a little bit of Poa Annua this year. My neighbor's yard is all Poa. Nice and green, for pure weed lawn!


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