# Squire515's City Guy New to Lawn Care Journal



## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Hello everyone. Firstly, thank you folks for sharing your knowledge on lawn care. I learned a great deal from this forum, and I really appreciate it.

My girlfriend and I moved into this home about 2 years ago. While the inside of the house was more than I ever dreamed of, the outside landscaping has been neglected for many years. There is an insane amount of leaves that fall, mud pits, and wood. Not just pieces of wood, log rounds that were cut and left to sink into the dirt! I dug out and split about 4 cords...

Since the beginning of this year, I read a lot of publications from the local University and educated myself On growing and maintaining grass. I found this forum a few weeks ago and enjoyed reading the posts and journals, so I decided to make a journal myself.

Facing my street, this is a picture of the front of my house, right side. It is 5,424 square feet and there is a drainage swale on the far right, separating my property from my neighbors. It is actually kind of nice being outside doing work with the sound of water flowing, since it flows slowly well after it has finished raining. Luckily it rarely overflows onto my lawn.

You can also see a pile of dirt the previous owners left, which is on top of what was once a gravel pad, and the start of my above ground but below ground sprinkler system, that I later disassembled.


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

This is a better view of the condition of the lawn. It was mostly weeds and moss. The soil wasn't compacted, but I removed about an inch of thatch, rocks, and a ton of acorns from throughout the years.

The second and third picture is after I nuked it for the second time. The red dye I had from amazon didn't work too well, so I went legit and used some blue turf dye the second time. I used a Flowzone Typhoon 2v with a red tee-jet tip. It worked great. After that, I applied Lilly Miller moss killer to kill the moss, which killed the moss almost instantly, but may have been an unnecessary step. I Had to dethatch this area so many times the moss didn't stand a chance anyway.


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

In between dethatching, scalping, and applying glyphosate, the gravel pad still needed removal. I borrowed a family members compact tractor with a bucket and a rear mounted plow, and removed about 3 inches of dirt and rocks.

We plan on laying asphalt over about half of the gravel pad, so I only removed the gravel from the area we don't plan on laying asphalt. This left us with about a 10 X 20 foot cutout, about 3 inches deep. I swear I felt like a gold miner stripping overburden. I had a few family members to help.

I also used a pole saw to remove about 10 low branches from those four trees, and removed a stump from a tree I had cut down that had scratchy and ugly leaves. That was a devilish tree!


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Before I payed down topsoil, I applied 90 Lbs. of XSoil to condition the soil and add some organic matter. It stunk up the neighborhood!

Last Monday, we had 15 yards of screened topsoil delivered. We used the tractor and a DIY lawn leveler I made out of PVC to fill in some low spots and spread the topsoil.

We also filled in the void from the gravel pad, tamped it, and filled it again. We should have spread a thicker layer before tamping it. I'm not sure if it's because the ground was wet, but one step on that area and you're sinking into the dirt. That was a mistake.


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Last Tuesday, I spread a mix of 90% TTTF shade mix, 10% Mazama KBG, and starter fertilizer all purchased from seed superstore. I figured if I'm starting over, I might as well use a great seed.

It took almost the whole day raking it in and spreading peat moss. If I could do it differently, I would just rented a slit seeder. It would've been cheaper than peat moss, and probably would have yielded better results, especially considering it rained almost an inch overnight from an unforeseen thunderstorm, and I left the sprinkler timer on for the Wednesday morning. When we woke up Wednesday, the lawn looked like the second picture.

I'm a little nervous I just washed away all that seed and hard work!


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Things I would've done differently include fallowing, using a lawn roller and a slit seeder, not setting my sprinkler timer until I see the lawn becoming dry, and tamping the low spots and gravel cutout better. It seems like if I step anywhere, I'm going to leave a footprint. I hope I didn't just do all this work for nothing.

My plan for Saturday is to re-spread the peat moss that bunched up due to all the water and apply tenacity at the 4oz/acre rate. I'm not sure if it's too late to apply tenacity, and if I see any signs of germination I'm going to have to reread the tenacity label and see what they say about applying it to newly germinated seed.

If anyone has any input on the things I should've done differently and the current state of the land, I would appreciate it.

Thanks for reading.

Rob


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## Zcape35 (Sep 17, 2019)

How are things looking right now Rob? I wouldn't stress out that you didn't fallow, you can just kill off the weeds down the road.
Everyone learns lessons after their first reno, I didn't fallow my first one either. I didn't even put down a pre-emergent after it matured a bit during the fall (busy with work). It all turned out pretty good regardless!


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## JerseyGreens (Aug 30, 2019)

Just looking at this now neighbor (down the road from me!).

Props to you for the prep work. You did a great job there.

Washouts are the biggest nemesis of lawn reno - here is the positive you are using a combo of TTTF and KBG. On top of that - it's nice and warm outside. If you truly feel like a lot washed out, throw 'er down.

The only downside is that crowding seeds can cause fungus issues down the road - again, just like weeds, those can be dealt with many different ways.

Overall you did a great job - just need to get the germ now!


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Zcape35 said:


> How are things looking right now Rob? I wouldn't stress out that you didn't fallow, you can just kill off the weeds down the road.
> Everyone learns lessons after their first reno, I didn't fallow my first one either. I didn't even put down a pre-emergent after it matured a bit during the fall (busy with work). It all turned out pretty good regardless!


Hey Zcape, it's looking decent. We had a surprise rainstorm the night I seeded, and It washed a lot of the peat moss into bunches. The grass is germinating very well in the areas where it bunches up to, but not so much in the spots that were left without peat moss.

I'm in the standing there with hands on hip phase, wondering if I should reseed, and if so just rent a slit seeder this time. Spreading peat moss didn't work out so well.


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

JerseyGreens said:


> Just looking at this now neighbor (down the road from me!).
> 
> Props to you for the prep work. You did a great job there.
> 
> ...


Howdy neighbor. Thanks for the compliments! It wasn't an easy property to deal with, and I definitely underestimated the amount of work it would take haha.

I purchased a bag of Headway G, which I planed on throwing down after my first mow. The Reno'd area was very prone to fungus and moss so o figured I would apply preventatively.

I'll post pictures tomorrow of the germination I'm seeing (and not seeing).


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## shadowlawnjutsu (Jun 9, 2020)

Wow, you're @jerseygreen's neighbor. You're gonna be lawn buddies. Good luck on your reno!


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

shadowlawnjutsu said:


> Wow, you're @jerseygreen's neighbor. You're gonna be lawn buddies. Good luck on your reno!


Thank you! You too. It's looking great.


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Here are some photos I took 8 days after seed down, and about 3 days after germination. Compared to last night it looks like it grew a lot. However, there are some areas where is it growing very thin and not at all.

I applied tenacity at the 4oz/A rate last Saturday. Im not sure if I should give it another week and fill in the spots with some more seed and peat moss, wait to reseed in 30 days so that the tenacity wears off, or do nothing.


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Hey folks, I could use some input here.

I've had some great germination, but I definitely have a few veins from washout that need reseeding.

When should I start to fertilize based on the results of my soil test, and how often should I apply it? My soil test says to apply 6 lbs of 8-1-8 per 1000 sq ft.

Also, Should I minus off the N applied according Reno guide, which is .2 lbs per 1000 sq ft. ?

Thanks.


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## shadowlawnjutsu (Jun 9, 2020)

Squire515 said:


> Hey folks, I could use some input here.
> 
> I've had some great germination, but I definitely have a few veins from washout that need reseeding.
> 
> ...


You should do spoon feeding instead of dropping all the 6lbs of nitrogen after a reno. You can start feeding 14 days after the germination.


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

shadowlawnjutsu said:


> Squire515 said:
> 
> 
> > Hey folks, I could use some input here.
> ...


Thank you.


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## Justmatson (Apr 4, 2020)

Looking good so far!

Did your soil test say that 6lbs is a one time application?

Drop it all at once. Thats only 0.5lb of Nitrogen. Your young grass needs the food. I would recommend doing that at 30 days post germination, then every 2 weeks keep spoon feeding it N.

Don't worry so much about a reaching a limit on nitrogen. Young grass needs it.
I did a spring seeding and I'll be close to 8lbs of nitrogen for the year.

Did you use a starter fert or anything at seeding?


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Justmatson said:


> Looking good so far!
> 
> Did your soil test say that 6lbs is a one time application?
> 
> ...


Hey justmatson, thank you!

the fertilizer the soil test recommended was organic at 5-5-5 at 10.5 lbs per thousand square feet. It didn't say whether it was a one time thing or not.

I put down 19-26-6 starter fertilizer. I purchased 8-1-8 fertilizer thinking that my phosphorous would be ok after using the starter fertilizer. Converting the 5-5-5 to 8-1-8 comes to 6lbs per square feet.

I'm just not sure how to balance that with spoon feeding like the Reno guide says. I'm also reseeding a decent amount and wondering if I should give it a spoon feed of starter fertilizer.

Thanks for your help, and forgive my typos as I am on my phone!


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## Justmatson (Apr 4, 2020)

If your dropping more seed i wouldn't put down more starter with it. Phosphorus and potassium stay in the soil for quite sometime (unless the plant uses it, which the grass will)

What I did was 1.4lbs/m of Phosphorus (it was a starter fert 18-24-12) you probably put down 0.75 or 1lb of phosphorus? 
If that's the case you could put down another 0.5lb of phosphorus (that starter) at 30 days post germination.

Is that 8-1-8 organic?

That guide is just that a guide.... most of us deviate from it in some way. Climates are different, soil, grass type lots of factors. 
At 30 days then every 2 weeks for a while i was dropping 0.5lb of Nitrogen (organic 10-2-5) i also have kbg so i was trying to help it spread.

What you could try is once the first germination reaches 30 days drop another 0.5lb of phosphorus then every 2 weeks between 0.2 - 0.5 lbs of Nitrogen from your 8-1-8. Obviously watch the grass and see what it does.

When it gets to 2" start mowing often if you can. Helps promote spreading. I was lucky enough to be home so I was mowing every other day, sometimes daily.


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Justmatson said:


> If your dropping more seed i wouldn't put down more starter with it. Phosphorus and potassium stay in the soil for quite sometime (unless the plant uses it, which the grass will)
> 
> What I did was 1.4lbs/m of Phosphorus (it was a starter fert 18-24-12) you probably put down 0.75 or 1lb of phosphorus?
> If that's the case you could put down another 0.5lb of phosphorus (that starter) at 30 days post germination.
> ...


Thanks for explaining this. I kind of like to have instructions set in stone when I undertake new things.

I put down 1.3 lbs of phosphorous per thousand square feet, so I guess I'll lay off the starter fertilizer. I'll give it .5 lbs of N after 30 days, and then start spoon feeding every 2 weeks.

The 8-1-8 is organic. Does that change things? I realize it will be slower to release, so should I space out my spoon feeding more?

Thanks again for your help


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## Justmatson (Apr 4, 2020)

I was the same way when I did my seeding in the spring.

I actually followed another members spring reno. I asked him a lot of questions and he was really helpful.

No you can use the organic 8-1-8..... when is your average first frost for your area? 
You might be better off, after 30 days, switching to urea. Get that grass established before winter.

* I just saw that you put down Tenacity. You won't be able to drop more seed for at least 30 days, if you didn't already know *


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Average first frost is October 8. It has a 30% probability.

I just thought that you couldn't apply to newly germinated grass, and had to wait 4 weeks or two mows to respray. I'm pretty sure if you can apply tenacity to grass seeds, you can apply grass seeds to tenacity. Of course I could be misreading the label.

I was looking at a synthetic fertilizer. Maybe I'll pick up some 24-0-4. Would it be a bad idea to apply the 8-1-8, which is slow release, followed by the urea every two weeks?


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## Justmatson (Apr 4, 2020)

Squire515 said:


> Average first frost is October 8. It has a 30% probability.
> 
> I just thought that you couldn't apply to newly germinated grass, and had to wait 4 weeks or two mows to respray. I'm pretty sure if you can apply tenacity to grass seeds, you can apply grass seeds to tenacity. Of course I could be misreading the label.
> 
> I was looking at a synthetic fertilizer. Maybe I'll pick up some 24-0-4. Would it be a bad idea to apply the 8-1-8, which is slow release, followed by the urea every two weeks?


I'm sorry yes you are correct. I was thinking you were going to apply more tenacity with the wash out seeds.

As for the fertilize question, no that would be a great idea. I've always been told to care for/ look after the soil first. 
I've used organic fertilizer this whole year and am very with the results.


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

Justmatson said:


> Squire515 said:
> 
> 
> > Average first frost is October 8. It has a 30% probability.
> ...


Ok, that's what I'll do then. Thanks again for your help, and good luck with your lawn. That looks like a lot of work and it turned out great.


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## Justmatson (Apr 4, 2020)

> Ok, that's what I'll do then. Thanks again for your help, and good luck with your lawn. That looks like a lot of work and it turned out great.


Thank you, much appreciated! 
Its been a labor of love...

If you got anymore questions please feel free to message me or post it in the cool season subforum. Lots of very helpful guys on here.


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## JerseyGreens (Aug 30, 2019)

This looks like it's coming in quite well! Should be thick in no time!


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

JerseyGreens said:


> This looks like it's coming in quite well! Should be thick in no time!


Thank you. Yours as well!

I plan on reseeding some areas tomorrow, and giving it .5 lbs of N in a few days. What's your future plans/N applications looking like?>


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## JerseyGreens (Aug 30, 2019)

Squire515 said:


> JerseyGreens said:
> 
> 
> > This looks like it's coming in quite well! Should be thick in no time!
> ...


I want to throw down .25lbs N via starter fert but asked the experts before dropping it tomorrow.

Growing 100% KBG has been stressful!!


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## Squire515 (Jul 25, 2020)

JerseyGreens said:


> Squire515 said:
> 
> 
> > JerseyGreens said:
> ...


I can't imagine. I was pulling my hair for only a few days lmao.

I actually asked the same question in this thread, and @Justmatson offered some great insight. He said that the P should still be in your soil but the grass is using it, and I had already applied close to the same amount as he did.

Did you get around to conducting a soil test? My P was just under the optimal range, so when I reseed today I'm not going to apply any fertilizer. However, when I hit the 30 day mark of the original germination date, I'm going to apply .5 lbs of N using 8-1-8, so I'm hoping that little bit of P helps with the reseed.

I really am new to this though, so I could be thinking about this wrong.

Also, great idea on the new thread. I should've posted this there.


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