# new 2020 Honda HRX wheel lockup



## Lawncrzy (Sep 14, 2020)

Hi everyone - first time post but long time reader. I own an older HRX since 2006 and it's a great machine - love the cut etc. I've experienced the rear wheel lockup plague that most users experienced and like everyone else I have to look after it several times a season - what a PITA. 
Anyway I'm considering purchasing a newer 2020 HRX with the GCV200 motor and wondering if Honda has fixed their design flaw of the rear wheels. It's the only nemesis that has kept me from pulling the trigger and re-considering a Toro comparative if they haven't.

Would appreciate any feedback or suggestions.

Thanks in advance


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

Following! I have a 2018 or 19 with the same issue. The repair guy cleaned it etc and it's better, but not good. He says it's because in reverse it's still spinning all the gears.

If I get one more issue with it, I'm selling it and getting a Stihl electric.


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

I have an older HRX. If you are referring to the wheel not freely rolling when pulling the mower backwards, in my experience, regular maintenance with at least yearly greasing of the rear wheel pinion key and gear is key to preventing wheel issues. There is a key and spring that needs to move freely or the wheel stays locked to the drive shaft. When it gets dirty it doesn't unlock. You can take the wheel off then disasseble and clean/replace the pinion key/gear, but it will still need greasing. The current parts catalog shows the same gear assembly as the older models so I expect it has not changed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJw3ow1nkns

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvpqyWQUb48

The Toro self propelleds that I have owned have had a similar drive mechanism with similar issues and maintenance requirements.


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## Lawncrzy (Sep 14, 2020)

Hi Bernstem, thanks for the info. That's a shame that Honda hasn't paid any attention to the consumers and hasn't redesigned this known problem. 
Yes my HRX is also an older model - bought brand new back in 2006ish. I'm familiar of the repairs and done it several times. Last fall I cleaned and replaced all the pinion gears, keys and springs with new parts and greased and it worked like a charm (not the first time). Used it one time after the service - cleaned the machine and stored it for the winter - first mow of the season and it's sticking again. I don't really have any concerns with this machine as I know how to fix it.

My concern is I'm looking to purchase the new 2021 version of the HRX and don't want to spend $1100.00 + taxes(CDN) on a Honda -especially if they still haven't fixed an issue that's commonly known, have recalled and still occurring. I was really hoping that they would have changed this along with all the newer changes they've made...That's a shame as it's an awesome mower.

So now more curios if any of the new (2020) HRX owners are experiencing this common/re-occurring problem - backward wheel lockup.

Thanks for letting me know that the same issue exists on your Toro...first I've heard of it and will be looking into that as well.

Thanks again!


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## Lawncrzy (Sep 14, 2020)

SCGrassMan said:


> Following! I have a 2018 or 19 with the same issue. The repair guy cleaned it etc and it's better, but not good. He says it's because in reverse it's still spinning all the gears.
> 
> If I get one more issue with it, I'm selling it and getting a Stihl electric.


Sorry to hear bro...I feel your pain. Get's frustrating for me when I'm mowing and it locks up on a turnaround and the wheels dig into my lawn.


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## PodScot (Mar 18, 2021)

Lawncrzy said:


> Hi everyone - first time post but long time reader. I own an older HRX since 2006 and it's a great machine - love the cut etc. I've experienced the rear wheel lockup plague that most users experienced and like everyone else I have to look after it several times a season - what a PITA.
> Anyway I'm considering purchasing a newer 2020 HRX with the GCV200 motor and wondering if Honda has fixed their design flaw of the rear wheels. It's the only nemesis that has kept me from pulling the trigger and re-considering a Toro comparative if they haven't.
> 
> Would appreciate any feedback or suggestions.
> ...


Does it only happen while the engine is running?


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## briansemerick (Apr 11, 2021)

thought it was just me. I have a few years old HRX and the back right wheel seems to stick when backing up. I replaced the wheels recently and I thought maybe it was that.


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

Lawncrzy said:


> SCGrassMan said:
> 
> 
> > Following! I have a 2018 or 19 with the same issue. The repair guy cleaned it etc and it's better, but not good. He says it's because in reverse it's still spinning all the gears.
> ...


Yes, exactly... and I have Zeon which rips up very easily, and grows back in slowly. Plus the absolute aggravation I experience working in the heat anyway.


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## Lawncrzy (Sep 14, 2020)

PodScot said:


> Lawncrzy said:
> 
> 
> > Hi everyone - first time post but long time reader. I own an older HRX since 2006 and it's a great machine - love the cut etc. I've experienced the rear wheel lockup plague that most users experienced and like everyone else I have to look after it several times a season - what a PITA.
> ...


Hey Podscot - happens regardless of engine off or on. It either locks up on a turn or when you manually pull it backwards - straight or turning. Wheels will either dig into the ground and skid while ruining the grass. If it frees up you hear the clicking grinding pinwheel.
Not concerned about the problems on the old one...just don't want to buy their new model with the same illness - which is a slap in the face for consumers because this is a known issue by Honda and they didn't take the time to add this to their new redesigned models....or did they?....according to previous poster (Bernstem)the same old design is in the Repair manual.


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

Just going by the parts catalog (https://peparts.honda.com/powerequipment#/browse/lm/hrx/hrx217) the pinion gear, pin, and spring have the same part numbers across generations. My mower is ~2012. It started acting up ~2018.


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## confused_boner (Apr 5, 2021)

I have the 2018 gcv200, not locking fully but 80%. Was able to adjust the cable as per the manual and get some fluid film down into the wheels and axle and no longer having issues pulling mower backwards.


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## Lawncrzy (Sep 14, 2020)

bernstem said:


> Just going by the parts catalog (https://peparts.honda.com/powerequipment#/browse/lm/hrx/hrx217) the pinion gear, pin, and spring have the same part numbers across generations. My mower is ~2012. It started acting up ~2018.


Thanks for that bernstem, Very helpful.

Follow-up question:

So what did Honda do to fix this when they recalled this issue - especially since the parts and design still looks the same (I'm assuming the design is still the same based on the parts catalogue - referenced).


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## Lawncrzy (Sep 14, 2020)

confused_boner said:


> I have the 2018 gcv200, not locking fully but 80%. Was able to adjust the cable as per the manual and get some fluid film down into the wheels and axle and no longer having issues pulling mower backwards.


At 80% already...Based on experience don't be surprised if it progressively re-occurs....and will eventually become worst and need frequent lubrication/dis-assembly.
Or hope you're lucky and it works it's way out  ....because it is an awesome mower. I'm very interested in getting another one but I'm second guessing it based on this issue.


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## mrp116 (Mar 2, 2020)

I have owned Toros with the Personal Pace system since 2003, and I have never experienced a problem with the rear wheels not allowing me to pull it back. I used my first one for 15 years without ever having an issue backing it up, and I bought a new one three years ago and have never had that problem with this one either.


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## Lawncrzy (Sep 14, 2020)

mrp116 said:


> I have owned Toros with the Personal Pace system since 2003, and I have never experienced a problem with the rear wheels not allowing me to pull it back. I used my first one for 15 years without ever having an issue backing it up, and I bought a new one three years ago and have never had that problem with this one either.


Thanks mrp116 - good to know. Seems like I'll be back into the "HRX or SR" consideration very soon...many posts exists on that debate lol. Guess it will have to come down to personal preference, For me it would be a no brainer if it wasn't for the HRX wheel lock up. Having owned one for 15 years (and still working like a beast) the cut is too sweet for me. And they also have a lower cut than the Toro's which works great for me when needed. Just not happy with the fact that they haven't re-designed that flaw and afraid if it'll re-occur on the new models.


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## JayGo (Jun 13, 2019)

I still use my 6-year-old Honda rotary to mow 2 neighbors' yards, and I'm pretty sure I've tried everything on YT over the last 4 years. I fix the problem only to have the issue reoccur.
There is no ongoing maintenance. It's a full-out repair every time. Even the local authorized service guy says so.


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

JayGo said:


> I still use my 6-year-old Honda rotary to mow 2 neighbors' yards, and I'm pretty sure I've tried everything on YT over the last 4 years. I fix the problem only to have the issue reoccur.
> There is no ongoing maintenance. It's a full-out repair every time. Even the local authorized service guy says so.


My feeling based on here and the repair guy is that it's a faulty design. The gears should disengage when pulling back.

Next time anything major breaks I'm getting the stihl electric, and or a greens mower again


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## Lawncrzy (Sep 14, 2020)

SCGrassMan said:


> JayGo said:
> 
> 
> > I still use my 6-year-old Honda rotary to mow 2 neighbors' yards, and I'm pretty sure I've tried everything on YT over the last 4 years. I fix the problem only to have the issue reoccur.
> ...


Poor design is exactly what the problem is. But just disappointed that they (Honda) has not payed heed to their consumers and re-designed a known flaw (especially when they initially did a recalled on them). Revamping the new 2020? models and not doing anything about it is a slap in the face...would expect a company to do better than that. sigh!!1


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

Lawncrzy said:


> SCGrassMan said:
> 
> 
> > JayGo said:
> ...


I agree on all points, except that its on a 5 year warranty, and I am happy to make them repeatedly fix it until it far exceeds the entire gross cost of what I paid for the mower for them.


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## Lawncrzy (Sep 14, 2020)

SCGrassMan said:


> Lawncrzy said:
> 
> 
> > SCGrassMan said:
> ...


I hear you SCGrassMan - and everyone should do that - then they'll learn (hopefully) after they see the cost they're paying out on their repairs and their competitors selling better products. It's just stressful when you're in the middle of a mow and your lawn is getting ripped up in a turn-around and the inconvenience of downtime taking it back to the dealer. For me mowing my lawn is something I enjoy and a great stress reliever - ripping my lawn up in a middle of a mow has the adverse effect :shock:


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## SCGrassMan (Dec 17, 2017)

Yeah I'm 100% with you on that, especially with Zeon. It's not like Bermuda where that patch will be gone next week.


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## PALawnGuy5 (Apr 19, 2021)

I bought the HRX217VKA this year and haven't had an issue with wheels locking up.

I had that issue with the Toro Recycler it replaced. I had to lift it up and pull it back on the front wheels only. Quite the workout.

I prefer the Select Drive controls on the HRX to the Personal Pace of the Toro. The Personal Pace had a tendency to engage my wheels early and tear up the yard. I also like being able to pull back on the bar of the Honda and not feel the Personal Pace bar slide around and feel loose.

The only complaint with the Honda is the bag. It's not flush against the back of the mower so grass build up and makes a mess. The bag is also wider than the lawn bags i dump into, making it an absolute pain to empty. The old Toro bag fit nicely inside the lawn bag.


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## UltimateLawn (Sep 25, 2020)

Is this problem on all new-ish HRX mower models? I purchased an HRX217HYA with the Hydrostatic Transmission/Cruise control. Is this only a problem on the Variable Speed Select Drive models or am I destined for the same issue.


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## r7k (Jan 25, 2019)

> happens regardless of engine off or on. It either locks up on a turn or when you manually pull it backwards - straight or turning


The lever on the transmission, where the cable connects coming from the handle with the yellow button, if that lever is not fully to one side, i.e. neutral, then the transmission will lock up and not allow the wheels to spin in reverse. Hydrostatic == oil filled transmission == oil not compressible. So if the transmission valve lever is the slightest bit engaged... such that the mower would go forward 0.001 mph, then it will lock up when you try to spin the wheels backwards. There is a spring on it such that if your transmission cable were to break, the hydrostatic trans should always be in neutral. So you have to get under there and make sure the valve lever on the transmission will go fully to one side under that spring force.

when you say turn, you must mean a 180° in place turn where you are causing one wheel to spin backwards. There is no way a wheel can lock up in a turn when both wheels are still turning forward. Each rear wheel can only over run whatever the axle speed is. And then if the little sping in the axle that pushes the woodruff key outward that engages the axle to the wheel pinion is missing or week then you would get no axle engagement to the wheel.

somebody post a youtube video showing the problem so i can see exactly what you're talking about. My HRX is a 2006 and I've had it completely apart a few times over the years for various maintenance tasks, so i am intimately knowledgeable with everything on it. I've never had a wheel lockup problem that was not expected.


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