# Warm weather (90+) ready to spray broad leaf on bermuda/st aug



## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

My yard is a mix of Bermuda and St Augustine grass. Are the Ortho RTS (st aug version) ok to use with the high temps or can y'all recommend anything else?

Broad leaf weeds.


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

That will work, but I wouldn't take that route because the active ingredients are dicamba and 2, 4-D, both of which are going to harm the St. Aug. and one of which will possibly harm the bermuda. Your lawn will get stress in these high temps, but it would recover if you applied ortho. If you do apply it, make sure to apply at the lowest labeled rate to reduce stress.

There are better options for sure, especially for your bermuda grass. Do you have a budget in mind? Because the best option for both is about $100. It will last you several seasons though. Also, are you only needing to kill broadleaf weeds or are there some grassy weeds like nutsedge in the mix?


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

The reason I suggested those are because I am not sure if I'm ready to mix my own chemicals and spray. I've started getting serious with the yard this year and I've been using granual fertalizer and preemergent and Ortho weed b gone on the yard.

If I were to go your route what would you suggest? Also what is a good hand sprayer/wand because not mixing my own is really a handicap.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Sorry there are grassy weeds also (yellow nutsedge)


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> The reason I suggested those are because I am not sure if I'm ready to mix my own chemicals and spray. I've started getting serious with the yard this year and I've been using granual fertalizer and preemergent and Ortho weed b gone on the yard.
> 
> If I were to go your route what would you suggest? Also what is a good hand sprayer/wand because not mixing my own is really a handicap.


We've all been there, so don't be afraid to give it a try. It's easy to make a mistake mixing herbicides when you don't follow certain cannot-break rules. As you get deeper into the project, if you're unsure about a mix rate, post it up on this board. These guys know their stuff and will be able to confirm you're doing it right or help you adjust.

Here is what I recommend:


Measure your lawn if you haven't already. Get a wheel measure or a long tape measure and just knock it out. There is no point even discussing what rates to apply herbicides if you do not know how many square feet you have. There is very good content on youtube on how to measure your lawn, and several of the forum members videos on lawn measuring







I suggest Celsius WG Herbicide for your mix of grass. Its cost will vary, and you can find it for under $100 sometimes, but it is $105.95 fromthis store where I bought it. Celsius will only slightly discolor your bermuda, and it will likely hurt your St. Augustine to some extent in this heat, but the reality is that there are few herbicides you can apply that won't hurt St. Augustine in high temperatures. Since you only have broadleaf weeds, you can apply the lowest rate of Celsius using a blanket application on the lawn, which should help you mitigate damage to the St. Augustine. Either way it will recover in a month's time.


For sprayers, I can give the the low, medium, and high cost options. Low cost, but VERY reliable (used by this site owner @Ware, is the Chapin 2 gal. pro series pump sprayer. Medium cost is the FH25E battery powered sprayer from Sprayer's Plus, which is a very nice little sprayer and the battery power will really help you spray consistent patterns. Use the code GCITURF for free shipping. High cost is something that many of us have graduated to, which is either the Chapin 20v backpack sprayer or the Sprayers Plus backpack sprayer.


Read the labels on your herbicide you are applying from front to back. I cannot stress this enough. With that, and your square feet, you will have everything you need to prevent yourself from screwing up.


Learn how to mix herbicides from @Ware's method, which is a safe and reliable way to make sure you don't screw up.







Granular fertilizer is perfectly fine. It's actually the preferred method for residential homeowners, although some on here are experts at liquid fertilizers.


Granular pre-emergent is also perfectly fine. I prefer to spray my pre-emergents because it's actually cheaper and they last longer, but the active ingredient you are putting down is much more important than whether you apply granular or liquid.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Excellent reply

i have measured and i know i have approx 9300 square feet of spraying area to spray.

I have no problem going granular fert and pre-m (i use dimension hi-yield), but yes the issue is the post applications where its very limited options for spraying ready to spray items. if i could find that i would just use it but my only options i know of, i cant spray when it is hot, which in southern Louisiana is 3/4 the year lol


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

also this is the one i was talking about @Ecks from Tex s , since i know there are a few different brands out there

https://www.ortho.com/en-us/products/weed-control/ortho-weed-b-gon-weed-killer-staugustinegrass-ready-spray

the other ortho weed b gon i think is not safe for st augustine


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> also this is the one i was talking about @Ecks from Tex s , since i know there are a few different brands out there
> 
> https://www.ortho.com/en-us/products/weed-control/ortho-weed-b-gon-weed-killer-staugustinegrass-ready-spray
> 
> the other ortho weed b gon i think is not safe for st augustine


That's what I figured.

Take a look at the label. It says:



> Apply this product when daytime temperatures are below 90 degrees


It will yellow both of your grasses, which is why I suggest finding a different AI.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Ecks from Tex said:


> Killmeh said:
> 
> 
> > also this is the one i was talking about @Ecks from Tex s , since i know there are a few different brands out there
> ...


Dang sorry about that I must have missed it. Any other ready to spray ones you know of?


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> Ecks from Tex said:
> 
> 
> > Killmeh said:
> ...


Not offhand that you could blanket apply to a lawn. But in all seriousness, mixing herbicides is something you just have to learn to do. Mix a small batch and try it out in an inconspicuous corner of your lot if you're truly concerned. Use blue marking dye if you are worried you won't spray it evenly. There are ways to make it foolproof.


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## Cman (May 4, 2018)

I am also new to spraying and mixing herbicides. This forum is a huge help. I spent the money on Celsius and it was worth every penny. I sprayed one time at the highest rate using a blue marker to make sure
I got every where. I also have st Augustine and it stressed it and slowed its growth for about 2 weeks but it bounced right back and there was not a single weed in the yard. You have to be very patient it kills the weed but takes about 2-3 weeks. As many have said I have plenty left over for probably 2-3 years. It also covers the largest number of weeds.


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## Colonel K0rn (Jul 4, 2017)

The biggest drawback to using Celsius on your grass types is the length of time that it takes to kill when it's not really hot outside. Once it reaches 80°F or higher, it works much faster. The AI's in Celsius are going to stress the grass a little, so there might be some discoloration, but it'll be just fine. Don't be afraid to use the same stuff pro's do, just know your math before you pull the trigger and take the time to read the labels. Ecks gave you solid advice.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

So Celsius WG will do basically everything but nutsege safely in high temps.

Is there any where to buy this in person , and what is the shelf life like? 10oz would allow me to blanket spray my yard 9 times at highest rate, so that should last me approx 4ish years.

So let me see if I have this correct. If I were to use it at the max rate you mix up .226oz per 2 gallons and make sure to spray that on 2000 square feet. Then continue mixing 2 gallon apps until all sprayed?


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## CenlaLowell (Apr 21, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Excellent reply
> 
> i have measured and i know i have approx 9300 square feet of spraying area to spray.
> 
> I have no problem going granular fert and pre-m (i use dimension hi-yield), but yes the issue is the post applications where its very limited options for spraying ready to spray items. if i could find that i would just use it but my only options i know of, i cant spray when it is hot, which in southern Louisiana is 3/4 the year lol


Look at your temperature on a 12 month calendar. I'm in Central La and I will only apply those herbcides in April and October. For us both of those months are below 85 on average. I can't deal with discoloring of my turf.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Looking like mixing my own Celsius is my best option. Time for a new sprayer!


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## Cman (May 4, 2018)

Look for a SiteOne landcape supply in your area. You can usually buy it in person there. If not just look for the landscape suppliers they should have it. You can also look at some surfactant and blue dye as well. The blue dye is really messy but for me it gives me some comfort knowing I'm not spraying the same spots or missed any either.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

How does this look?




I think I have everything covered but nutsege. Was going to see how it goes with just the Celsius before I have a lot of bare ground lol


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> How does this look?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Surfactant is a bad idea in summer months (not to use per Celsius labe). But otherwise looks great.

And just make sure to apply at the lowest rate and you will be in the best spot you can be in.

And you should be able to get the Chapin backpack for $128. And Celsius is cheaper from Solutions Pest and Lawn if you're looking to save a little money.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Thanks @Ecks from Tex , where can I find the Chaplin for that price.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Good catch on the sufficant. That's considered a spray adjuvant?


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> Thanks @Ecks from Tex , where can I find the Chaplin for that price.


Funny you should ask since the answer is Amazon and this is the first time in awhile it is not on sale at $128. I bought it from the exact same seller you have in your cart. And no joke when I linked it for you yesterday in a post it was at $128. Pretty much all of us who have the Chapin 20v on here got it from that seller on Amazon.

That's a 30 dollar difference, I would honestly wait a day or two and see if the price changes on Amazon. I've seen it at 128 too much and would think it will go back there soon.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Solutions pest and control is showing $146.99 for the celsius


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Ecks from Tex said:


> Killmeh said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks @Ecks from Tex , where can I find the Chaplin for that price.
> ...


Dang. I won't be ordering until next week anyways so we shall see.


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> Solutions pest and control is showing $146.99 for the celsius


Sorry, meant Lawn and Pest Control Supply. That's where several have gotten it recently. https://www.googleadservices.com/pa...ahUKEwjP0tLaseLbAhVB7qwKHQb8A2sQwg8IJg&adurl=


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Quick question, I was reading the label and they put the dosages in oz/1000ft and g/1000ft. If WG is a wettable granular, I get why it's in grams, but why oz?


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> ...where can I find the Chaplin for that price.


That was Amazon's price last week. It went back up a couple days ago.


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## dfw_pilot (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Quick question, I was reading the label and they put the dosages in oz/1000ft and g/1000ft. If WG is a wettable granular, I get why it's in grams, but why oz?


Here's why:


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Quick question, I was reading the label and they put the dosages in oz/1000ft and g/1000ft. If WG is a wettable granular, I get why it's in grams, but why oz?


There is liquid fluid ounces and dry weight measurement of ounces.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Movingshrub said:


> Killmeh said:
> 
> 
> > Quick question, I was reading the label and they put the dosages in oz/1000ft and g/1000ft. If WG is a wettable granular, I get why it's in grams, but why oz?
> ...


The rates in the table are ounces (weight) and grams...


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

My point is that ounces is a weight measurement while fluid ounces are a volumetric measurement. I think the reason the label has ounces and grams is simply providing measurements in both British Imperial/US Customary measurements and the metric system to cater to the individual user.


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Ware said:


> Movingshrub said:
> 
> 
> > Killmeh said:
> ...


Yes @Killmeh, the Celsius makers have done residential homeowners a favor and given us a table to measure in grams or oz *per 1,000 square feet* how much wettable granular product we need to tank mix, whichever you can most accurately measure. With the scale you bought, you should measure grams for increased accuracy. The other ounces application rate is for applications *per acre* and should largely be ignored by homeowners, as it's something that is more helpful to golf course superintendents.

*But more importantly, the Celsius bottle should come with a pre-marked measuring cup. That will be the easiest way for you to pre-measure the amounts out, but I usually put them on the scale to confirm before mixing.*


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Thank y'all so much, it makes sense now. I was thinking in liquid ounces and not dry weight ounces.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

I just want to make sure I am on the right thought train. So with Celsius for example, if you have a 4 gallon backpack, you would add (middle rate) .085oz/gallon of water (.34 oz for entire 4 gallon tank) and just make sure that sprays evenly over 4000 square feet, correct?


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> I just want to make sure I am on the right thought train. So with Celsius for example, if you have a 4 gallon backpack, you would add (middle rate) .085oz/gallon of water (.34 oz for entire 4 gallon tank) and just make sure that sprays evenly over 4000 square feet, correct?


*Not per gallon of water, per 1000 square feet of yard*. That's why I mentioned in my other post it was critical to measure your lawn and have an accurate measurement at that. I actually have a map I drew of my lawn, with the measurements of each quadrant that I spray.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

He did say:



Killmeh said:


> ...and just make sure that sprays evenly over 4000 square feet, correct?


@Killmeh you got it. :thumbup:


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## Colonel K0rn (Jul 4, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Good catch on the sufficant. That's considered a spray adjuvant?


Yes


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

So, guessing a trial run with the blue marker should be a good thing.

Should get my bonus tomorrow and begin hiding from the wife haha


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Or practice with just water on the driveway, after measuring off 1000 sqft


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Great idea


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

@Killmeh here's a few more tips I pulled from another thread on the spraying. You've got it, so hopefully in 3-5 weeks you'll be weed free!


Make yourself a map of your property and input the square feet in each section. Then, at your desk and not under the stress of actively mixing the herbicide, go through the Celsius label and write down the application rate for each portion of the lawn. Add a blank in each portion of the lawn for your sprayer calibration, which you will do when the backpack arrives. My basic map looks like this (it is actually a layer in my irrigation design, but I have a separate handwritten one with my lawn measurements and my herbicide application rates that I use for all my commonly applied stuff




when you get your Chapin backpack. Calibrate it. Use the @GrassDaddy method. It's easy and it works, just don't change your spray nozzle without doing a new calibration. Here are a couple of his videos where he discusses the method












Apply the LOWEST rate of Celsius unless you have one of the weeds listed in this chart (which you may)






I recently had to apply the highest rate of Celsius on my St. Augustine. It yellowed it pretty bad, but it recovered. So if you have to apply the medium rate, just know in this heat it's going to yellow the St. Augustine. The bermuda might get a little discolored, but it will recover quickly. Celsius is your best option regardless.


Apply Celsius according to the label PER 1000 square feet at the rate you need to apply. The gallons in your tank is not what you base your Celsius rate on, but rather determined by your separate sprayer calibration (which will ensure that you have enough liquid to cover that entire zone of lawn).

Say one of your spray zones is 2375 square feet. I would round down and call that 2300 square feet to make your measurements easier and to be on the conservative side to give you a little room for error. Now say in that zone of lawn, you calibrated your backpack sprayer and determined at your normal walking pace you need 2.1 gallons of water to cover that entire zone. There you have everything you need and can perfectly mix Celsius.

So if you are applying the MEDIUM rate of Celsius at .85 oz (or 2.4 g) per 1,000 square feet, your mixture is......

.085 oz x 2.3 = .1955 oz total mix (decimal moved on 2,300 sq. feet to 2.3 because rate of .85 is PER 1000) *Edit: I forgot to move a decimal for the .085 rate here. Sorry.*

or grams for more accuracy

2.4 g x 2.3 = 5.52 g total mix

So then, you pre-measure that in your Celsius cup provided with the product, double check that measurement on your small scale you purchased, and then your ready to mix using the Ware method. Since you are buying the Chapin sprayer, you can easily mix right in the backpack tank. For this particular zone, you KNOW you need 2.1 gallons of water, so you fill the tank up about halfway (around 1 - 1.5 gallons), mix in your Celsius, agitate thoroughly with a paint mixer/drill, and then pour in more water until you get to 2.1 gallons. Re-agitate with the new water and then you're ready to spray


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> So, guessing a trial run with the blue marker should be a good thing.


I would stay away from using the blue any more than you have to. It's nasty stuff and it gets everywhere. Be very cautious about pouring it when you actually apply the Celsius "for real." Your practice run is the calibration run, and I would just use plain water. Do it after you have mowed recently so you have some lines in the grass to sort of follow.

Use the blue for the actual application. It can save your butt then, but otherwise it's awful stuff that seeps through your gloves and stains your driveway.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

+1, I try to stay away from the blue marker dye.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

You read my mind, was literally drawing the map on Google.

My next question, to simplify my spraying, my front yard comes out to 4380 feet and 4260 on my back. How bad would it hurt the herbicide if I rounded those down to 4000 feet since that's the furthest I should theoretically be able to apply with one tank?


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> You read my mind, was literally drawing the map on Google...


This is a helpful tool for finding areas: http://findlotsize.com/


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> You read my mind, was literally drawing the map on Google.
> 
> My next question, to simplify my spraying, my front yard comes out to 4380 feet and 4260 on my back. How bad would it hurt the herbicide if I rounded those down to 4000 feet since that's the furthest I should theoretically be able to apply with one tank?


That's 250 sq feet difference.

Will you still kill weeds? Sure, especially for the weeds rated at the lower rate.

Will it be effective against weeds at the medium rate? Likely not AS effective, but will still kill many I'm sure.

But here is the problem with what you're wanting to do that I see - forget application rates, you may actually have a tough time covering 4,380 feet with 4 gallons of liquid. Meaning you may not be able to walk fast enough to keep pace with how fast your Chapin sprayer and TeeJet nozzle is putting the liquid down. You'll only be able to confirm that once you get the backpack and calibrate it, but my guess is that's where you're going to end up.

I would try to split that into 3-4 spray zones as opposed to 2, but you'll know for sure if it can be done the way you think once the backpack arrives.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Basically I broke it down into 6 very easy to distinguish lots on my yard.

Front yard has 3 areas consisting of 3424, 337, 625 
Back yard has 3 areas consisting of 1324, 393, 2551


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Ecks from Tex said:


> Killmeh said:
> 
> 
> > You read my mind, was literally drawing the map on Google.
> ...


Oh ok I see what you are saying, I keep forgetting it all depends on how fast i walk with the backpack and how fast it puts it down. Guess we will see once the backpack arrives sometimes next week or the following week.


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> Basically I broke it down into 6 very easy to distinguish lots on my yard.
> 
> Front yard has 3 areas consisting of 3424, 337, 625
> Back yard has 3 areas consisting of 1324, 393, 2551


Would it be practical to spray the 1324, 337, and 393 together? That's about 2000 sq feet. Then you could maybe combine the 2551 and 625 to have a 3000/3100 sq feet area, and leave teh 3400 sq feet area by itself.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Anything is possible just have to remember which is which lol. Using the tool that Ware posted I got this

Front Yard: 3328, 607, 329
Back Yard: 2430; 409; 1279

So its within 200 sq total, which could be my human error either way.


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> Anything is possible just have to remember which is which lol. Using the tool that Ware posted I got this
> 
> Front Yard: 3328, 607, 329
> Back Yard: 2430; 409; 1279
> ...


Well I wouldn't do it in a way that you have to jump around or memorize special areas. That's how mistakes are made. Need to figure out a way where you can do smaller portions of the lawn than 4000 sq feet by breaking it up into zones that are natural and have natural boundaries. Makes it easier


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Agreed, just wondering, how fast does one have to walk to cover 4000 square feet with 4 gallons?

and I'll revisit this as soon as i get the sprayer in and can calibrate. I have no problem doing 3-4 different sprays if it makes it consistent and work.

Best case scenario I think is if i can maintain 3300 square feet sprayed on 4 gallons worth of water, then I can do Zone A by itself (3328) Zone B, C, D Together (3366), Zone E, F together (1688)

Looking at the map that would be the easiest way to group the zones together...provided i can match the spray rate.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> Agreed, just wondering, how fast does one have to walk to cover 4000 square feet with 4 gallons?
> 
> and I'll revisit this as soon as i get the sprayer in and can calibrate. I have no problem doing 3-4 different sprays if it makes it consistent and work.
> 
> ...


also @Ware wanted to ask, the yellow tip in my amazon post (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CMU6YPG/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ACTMCSY86PQ5P&psc=1) I saw in a searched post that you had one on your sprayer. How do you like it? and I want to double check my research but it should connect to the Chaplin sprayer without any other components correct?


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> also Ware wanted to ask, the yellow tip in my amazon post (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CMU6YPG/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ACTMCSY86PQ5P&psc=1) I saw in a searched post that you had one on your sprayer. How do you like it? and I want to double check my research but it should connect to the Chaplin sprayer without any other components correct?


Yeah, I like that nozzle for spot spraying. The TT11004 might get you closer to 1 gallon per thousand for blanket apps though. Here is the performance chart if you want to nerd out. There are several variables to consider, but at 20" nozzle height and 20" spacing between passes you would likely land somewhere in the circled areas below with each nozzle...

​


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

I should probably just get the TT11004, since I don't spot spray really much of anything.


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## Ecks from Tex (Apr 26, 2018)

Killmeh said:


> Agreed, just wondering, how fast does one have to walk to cover 4000 square feet with 4 gallons?
> 
> and I'll revisit this as soon as i get the sprayer in and can calibrate. I have no problem doing 3-4 different sprays if it makes it consistent and work.
> 
> ...


That looks like a good plan to me. It's not impossible to cover 4k sq. feet with 4 gallons, but depending on the obstacles, etc. you might have to walk a little faster than comfortable, which could cause you to make mistakes on keeping the wand at a steady, consistent height from the ground. My focus when spraying is always waking a straight line and keeping the wand at the same height/distance from the grass, so you get an even spray. But like you said, you know what to do and will know for sure once you get out there and calibrate.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Only one on Amazon is the TT11004-VP, correct one?


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Here is the paint mixer I use in my drill for mixing lawn chemicals.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Only one on Amazon is the TT11004-VP, correct one?


Yes, this one. The -VP suffix just designates the material. The TT's are only available in polymer.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

And it will screw directly onto the Chaplin?


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Ware said:


> Here is the paint mixer I use in my drill for mixing lawn chemicals.


Added to cart, thanks.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

@Ware before i order the teejet nozle, can you confirm if i need any sort of adapter to fit on the chapin?


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Ware before i order the teejet nozle, can you confirm if i need any sort of adapter to fit on the chapin?


No, it will drop right into the Chapin cap/gasket. :thumbsup:


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Nice, sprayer will be here Saturday And nozzle monday so if everything goes right I'll do my calibration Monday or Tuesday and then spray whenever the chemical comes in.

Wondering if I should start spraying the prem also (in September) instead of using the dimension granuals (hi-yield)


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Nice, sprayer will be here Saturday And nozzle monday so if everything goes right I'll do my calibration Monday or Tuesday and then spray whenever the chemical comes in.
> 
> Wondering if I should start spraying the prem also (in September) instead of using the dimension granuals (hi-yield)


Awesome!

Spraying something like Prodiamine 65WDG is typically much cheaper than applying granular pre-e. You can get 5lbs for less than $60, and the max annual rate is 0.83oz per thousand square feet per year:


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Ware said:


> Killmeh said:
> 
> 
> > Nice, sprayer will be here Saturday And nozzle monday so if everything goes right I'll do my calibration Monday or Tuesday and then spray whenever the chemical comes in.
> ...


I'll have to look into it. What is your opinion on dimension vs prodiamine?

if my math is correct..i could do 10 apps on a $60 bottle?

if so, i think thats the best route since the granular was running me around $100 a year total and that one bottle of prodiamine will pay for itself year over year


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> I'll have to look into it. What is your opinion on dimension vs prodiamine?
> 
> if my math is correct..i could do 10 apps on a $60 bottle?
> 
> if so, i think thats the best route since the granular was running me around $100 a year total and that one bottle of prodiamine will pay for itself year over year.


How much area are you spraying?

The cost is about $0.75/oz, so at 0.83 oz/yr your pre-e cost would be about $0.63 per thousand square feet per year.


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## rhanna (Jun 7, 2017)

Dimension (Dithiopyr) will give you some post emergent on very young crabgrass but I believe the pre-emergent barrier doesn't last as long as prodiamine.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Ware said:


> Killmeh said:
> 
> 
> > I'll have to look into it. What is your opinion on dimension vs prodiamine?
> ...


About 9000 square feet.

$6 a year sounds great, I think I'll make the switch to that for the prem.

Do you put that down in March/September?


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Do you put that down in March/September?


Yeah, I do two apps a year at half the annual max. Some split it into more apps - it's really up to you and your situation/needs.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Ware said:


> Killmeh said:
> 
> 
> > Do you put that down in March/September?
> ...


2 sounds really good. Thanks for all the help!

One more question though lol if I put it down in september, when I usually do an milogranite app at the same time, put down the prem first then the milogranite and water it in?


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> ...One more question though lol if I put it down in september, when I usually do an milogranite app at the same time, put down the prem first then the milogranite and water it in?


That would work fine. The Prodiamine label calls for 1/2" of rainfall or irrigation within like 14 days of application. I don't push that window though - I like to get it watered in as soon as I can (a day or two).


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Same here. I have a rain train that works pretty well just kinda slow. I want to set up a better above ground irrigation system I can move around but haven't gotten around to figuring that out yet.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Update!

@Ware and @Ecks from Tex maybe y'all can help me out one more time.

First off...sprayer is badass and the tip is nice! Now I'm going to preface this by saying I am a fast Walker and it (as weird as this sounds) pains me to walk too slow.

I measured out 3000 square feet and filled the sprayer with 3 gallons of water and some blue dye. Side note: wearing Crocs is not smart, now my toes are Smurf colored a little lol.

So I walked at a decent pace, only thing I can relate it to is how fast you try to walk with your wife at the mall to get her out of a store lol. I did the 3000 square feet and only used 1.5 gallons on the dot.

Sun was starting to get lower in the sky and I was getting hungry so I decided (and I really hope I didn't screw up) to spray the yard using the correct mixture for 3000 square feet at a time. And the last part was only 1700 square feet.

So my question is, besides the extra steps and energy used, is walking the 3000 square feet twice a bad thing compared to spraying one round if the end result is the same (correct amount of chemical going down per 1000 square feet?)

I tried walking slower and it started to hurt my bum knee a little, so just wondering.


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## raldridge2315 (Jul 1, 2017)

Spraying twice can actually be a good thing. Make the second pass perpendicular to the first. Remember, it's not how much water you spray, it's how much product you spray. As long as you know that you mixed it properly and know the square footage accurately, it doesn't matter how many passes it takes to put the material down. What counts is even coverage. That's why I said do the second pass perpendicular to the first. It's to make sure you don't miss any spots.

Spraying a lawn is like anything else that one tries to do. It takes practice. It's why it's recommended to "calibrate" a sprayer with water first. It's not really calibrating the sprayer, it's learning how it works with you and not some engineer who designed it. None of us did it perfect the first time. Many of us (me included) don't do it perfect now even though we've done it for several years. Most of the products that we use are a little forgiving (not PGR!!) and bermuda grass is near impossible to kill. So, don't worry about it, just keep notes (literally) and try not to make the same mistakes twice.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

raldridge2315 said:


> Spraying twice can actually be a good thing. Make the second pass perpendicular to the first. Remember, it's not how much water you spray, it's how much product you spray. As long as you know that you mixed it properly and know the square footage accurately, it doesn't matter how many passes it takes to put the material down. What counts is even coverage. That's why I said do the second pass perpendicular to the first. It's to make sure you don't miss any spots.
> 
> Spraying a lawn is like anything else that one tries to do. It takes practice. It's why it's recommended to "calibrate" a sprayer with water first. It's not really calibrating the sprayer, it's learning how it works with you and not some engineer who designed it. None of us did it perfect the first time. Many of us (me included) don't do it perfect now even though we've done it for several years. Most of the products that we use are a little forgiving (not PGR!!) and bermuda grass is near impossible to kill. So, don't worry about it, just keep notes (literally) and try not to make the same mistakes twice.


+1 :thumbsup:


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

I was thinking the same thing but wanted some reassurance.

I almost rather do the two passes and yeah I was getting damn near perfect coverage, I would run out of water right at the end almost perfectly.

And I love the spray the teejet puts out, this is by far the best sprayer I've ever had.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

But yeah I quadruple checked the amount of chemical I was putting into each of the three loads just to make sure.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

I had 2 sections that were both 3400 square feet that I use 10.88 grams on (high rate is 3.2 grams per 1000) and one section was 1700 that I use 5.44 grams). My math was correct right?


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

One more question that I wanted to ask. I cut the grass Saturday, sprayed Monday, be ok to cut Wednesday?


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> I had 2 sections that were both 3400 square feet that I use 10.88 grams on (high rate is 3.2 grams per 1000) and one section was 1700 that I use 5.44 grams). My math was correct right?


What product were you spaying?


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> One more question that I wanted to ask. I cut the grass Saturday, sprayed Monday, be ok to cut Wednesday?


Yes


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Movingshrub said:


> Killmeh said:
> 
> 
> > I had 2 sections that were both 3400 square feet that I use 10.88 grams on (high rate is 3.2 grams per 1000) and one section was 1700 that I use 5.44 grams). My math was correct right?
> ...


Cesilus


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Movingshrub said:
> 
> 
> > Killmeh said:
> ...


Your math was correct. I've sprayed the high rate when spot spraying, but I've switched to broadcast applications at the medium rate, under the assumption that I may want to do another broadcast application in the future to finish off any thing that didn't die before. If I was at the max rate, I'd exceed the annual limit by doing two broadcast apps. Just something to consider for the future.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

True. I was thinking do I high rate to hopefully kick everything in the teeth, the come back with a low rate in the future. Once it's cool enough I can spray with 2-4d also. But...seeing this summer that's long ways away.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Also was wondering, I love the spray pattern of the tt11004 nozel, will it be ok to use that on soil applications such as pre emergences?


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Also was wondering, I love the spray pattern of the tt11004 nozel, will it be ok to use that on soil applications such as pre emergences?


Yeah, the Turbo TeeJet nozzles are sort of middle of the road...


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Guessing soil = systemic?


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## Spammage (Apr 30, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Guessing soil = systemic?


 :thumbup:


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Killmeh said:


> Guessing soil = systemic?


Sort of - someone made the argument the other day that some products like glyphosate are applied foliarly, but are technically a systemic product. I don't disagree, but in this context we're really talking about droplet size - and your Turbo TeeJet nozzle sort of lands between an XR nozzle and an air induction nozzle.


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Awesome, thanks for the help!


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Update: some weeds turning yellow and a little bit of the saint Augustine also, so far so good.

How slow action is Celsius?


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## Killmeh (Mar 1, 2018)

Also noticed that I haven't had to cut since Wednesday and it hasn't grew much since I sprayed it. Probably has more to do with the fact that it hasn't rained much in the past 4 days.


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