# Add soil after removing sod and regrading?



## stotea (Jul 31, 2017)

Among other things, I'm having a landscaping company fill in some low areas and do a general regrading of 4k sf my yard. Afterward, I will be seeding the new lawn.

Part of the landscaper's process involves using a sod cutter to remove the existing turf. It sounds like minimal topsoil will be removed, but I am thinking at least some new topsoil will need to be added before I seed. Additionally, the existing soil is very compacted and in general not very good quality. Therefore, I asked the landscaper for a quote to add 4 inches (depth after settling/firming) of medium loam (40/40/20). He came back with a quote for "seeding soil" (70% compost/15% greens sand/15% peat moss) at $4200, which is more than I want to spend on some dirt.

So, I'm not sure what to do now. I figure I have the following options:

1. Essentially do nothing extra. Have the landscaper do the grading and then I seed on what's left.

2. Landscaper does the grading and I add minimal (roughly 1 inch, loose) soil/compost. ~$500

3. Same as #2 but I add more soil/compost - roughly 4-6 inches, loose. ~$1500-$2500

4. Same as landscaper's $4200 quote but use his default "black dirt" (screened topsoil) instead of the "seeding soil" ~$2000-$2500

Any input you all have would be greatly appreciated.


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## Virginiagal (Apr 24, 2017)

It needs to be properly graded so it drains away from the house and is not higher or lower than your hardscapes (sidewalks, driveway, etc.). Compost and peat moss will decompose, so if a compost mix is used and is level now to hardscapes, it will be lower than the hardscapes in a few years. I suggest using topsoil to fill low places and making sure it is graded properly. A compost mix is fine for raised beds. A lawn is not a raised bed. Why is sod being removed?


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## ales_gantar (Apr 13, 2017)

Hi.
I usually advise my clients to get at least 3 complete estimates with material and service from contractors that should not know each other.

I myself look up the prices of material that I as a non contractor can get (without discounts) and the price for which a contractor would execute the project should not be much over that.

For instance:
You need some 40 cubic meters of material.
I get soil for 20€/cubic meter
Sand for 35€/cube
Peat moss for 56€/cube.

Buy the material and invite some friends and borrow machinery and buy beer for friends. 

Just an idea.


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## stotea (Jul 31, 2017)

Virginiagal said:


> It needs to be properly graded so it drains away from the house and is not higher or lower than your hardscapes (sidewalks, driveway, etc.). Compost and peat moss will decompose, so if a compost mix is used and is level now to hardscapes, it will be lower than the hardscapes in a few years. I suggest using topsoil to fill low places and making sure it is graded properly. A compost mix is fine for raised beds. A lawn is not a raised bed. Why is sod being removed?


Good points. The sod is being removed primarily because it has very thick thatch but also to help prevent layering between the existing and new soils. All three companies that looked at my yard said that that is the best option.



ales_gantar said:


> I usually advise my clients to get at least 3 complete estimates with material and service from contractors that should not know each other.


Well, I *tried* to do that, haha. I initially called four different companies. One was already booked for the entire year and two came out and walked through my yard with me but never called me back. So, the fourth won by default.



ales_gantar said:


> Buy the material and invite some friends and borrow machinery and buy beer for friends.


Yep, that's certainly an option as well. It just seems like an incredible amount of work! And that's assuming I could get my wife's approval. :lol:


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## ales_gantar (Apr 13, 2017)

I know! They enjoy the lawn, as much as we enjoy clean living rooms, and other stuff. 

Seriously; what are the prices of these materials in the US?


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## stotea (Jul 31, 2017)

ales_gantar said:


> Seriously; what are the prices of these materials in the US?


The 70/15/15 seeding soil would cost me $35/cubic yard (plus a flat $65 delivery fee), which I think would be about 33€/cubic meter. Screened and pulverized topsoil is $30/yard and compost is $25/yard from the same supplier.


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## Virginiagal (Apr 24, 2017)

If thatch is the problem, why not simply dethatch? I would fix problem spots and not dig up the whole yard.


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## ales_gantar (Apr 13, 2017)

39 an something.
Are you sure you don't want to just core aerate agresively and level with some sand and topsoil? Grasses grow in the oddest of places, and I think you could make it work with the soil you have.


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## stotea (Jul 31, 2017)

Virginiagal said:


> If thatch is the problem, why not simply dethatch? I would fix problem spots and not dig up the whole yard.





ales_gantar said:


> Are you sure you don't want to just core aerate agresively and level with some sand and topsoil? Grasses grow in the oddest of places, and I think you could make it work with the soil you have.


There are very large areas that need to be filled in and regraded - at least half the lawn would need to be torn up regardless. Additionally, I have a poor quality northern mix with tall fescue and quack sprinkled throughout and would like something nicer (I already bought Bewitched seed). So, I figured I'd rather do a full reno with elite seed than plant more northern mix that I don't like.


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## Virginiagal (Apr 24, 2017)

If the objective is to kill existing grass, it's better to use glyphosate. Quackgrass has rhizomes that can go down several feet. Digging up a few inches will not eliminate it. I suggest filling in just the area that needs fixing (low spots that need topsoil), killing existing grass with several rounds of glyphosate, dethatching,, seeding. It sounds like you don't have irrigation. I hope you have a watering plan for the new seed. I would spend money for irrigation before spending money on replacing soil. You can improve soil.


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