# Additional Pre em



## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

I recently received a small amount of prodiamine 65 WDG, it was just enough to cover my lawn. This was my first time spraying a pre em & I'm pretty sure I didn't get an even coat down. I have a granular Lesco 0-0-7 Pr Em from Lowes that I want to put down. Would I be fine if I put down 1oz/1000?


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Jason229 said:


> I recently received a small amount of prodiamine 65 WDG, it was just enough to cover my lawn. This was my first time spraying a pre em & I'm pretty sure I didn't get an even coat down. I have a granular Lesco 0-0-7 Pr Em from Lowes that I want to put down. Would I be fine if I put down 1oz/1000?


I would probably not make a second pre-e app from the same group, but we're missing some information:

At what rate did you apply the Prodiamine 65WDG? What makes you think you "didn't get an even coat down"? Did you calibrate your sprayer?

What is the AI in the Lesco 0-0-7? Is it the one with Prodiamine? What is the concentration (e.g. 0.38%, 0.68%)?

And are you saying you put down 1oz/1000 of the Prodiamine 65 WDG? Or you are wanting to put down 1oz/1000 of the Lesco 0-0-7? Neither makes sense to me.


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## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

The WDG is from YM, so I went with the .46oz/1000 that's there recommend rate & I have a 4200 sq ft lawn.

The lowes brand AI is also prodiamine & I'm wanting to put down down the additional 1oz/1000.

I don't think I got full coverage from me spraying, so I'm asking would it be fine to put down a granular to compensate.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Jason229 said:


> The WDG is from YM, so I went with the .46oz/1000 that's there recommend rate & I have a 4200 sq ft lawn.
> 
> The lowes brand AI is also prodiamine & I'm wanting to put down down the additional 1oz/1000.
> 
> I don't think I got full coverage from me spraying, so I'm asking would it be fine to put down a granular to compensate.


0.46 oz/M is a little over half the annual max for Prodiamine 65WDG, so I probably wouldn't apply any more Prodiamine - or any other Group 3 pre-emergents this fall.

As for the Lesco 0-0-7, if you are talking about this Lesco Stonewall 0.68% 0-0-7, the max annual rate is 5.05 lb/M - so I'm having trouble wrapping my head around why you would want to apply that product at 1 oz/M?


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## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

Well I'm grateful for your replies, I think you're over complicating my situation/question. My initial question was, and I tried to ask it in simple terms, was would it be ok to apply an additional granular prodiamine because I felt like I didn't do a good enough job at applying the WDG.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Jason229 said:


> Well I'm grateful for your replies, I think you're over complicating my situation/question. My initial question was, and I tried to ask it in simple terms, was would it be ok to apply an additional granular prodiamine because I felt like I didn't do a good enough job at applying the WDG.


And my answer is still no...



Ware said:


> I would probably not make a second pre-e app from the same group...





Ware said:


> ...so I probably wouldn't apply any more Prodiamine - or any other Group 3 pre-emergents this fall.


As for the rest of my questions/comments - I'm just trying to help get you on the right track. The fact that you have suggested applying that 0-0-7 granular prodiamine product at 1 oz per thousand (1.24% of the max annual rate) tells me you really have no idea what you are doing. My apologies if you feel that I am overcomplicating your situation/question, but it is all very important context and I am truly just trying to help you.


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## Amoo316 (Jul 8, 2021)

As somebody who butts heads with @Ware more frequently then most, I fully support everything he has said in this thread. I think you're good with what you put down, and if you do want to put something else down, it needs to come from a different mode of action.

If you want to put down more Mitosis inhibitors, thinking they are going to help, you'll get the same effect of taking that money, cutting it up into little pieces and spreading it out over the yard. The effect would be the same even if your Fall 1 application was a little spotty here and there.

Here's a link to different active ingredients and their MOA group.


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## Redtwin (Feb 9, 2019)

Still curious about why you feel you didn't get a good app at .46oz/1000sf?


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## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

It's not the butting heads, it's the condescending tone that I've seen more than once while reading his replies. To take a page out of his book, I can't wrap my head around why he would take such a tone when this is suppose to be a teaching forum.


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## Amoo316 (Jul 8, 2021)

Jason229 said:


> It's not the butting heads, it's the condescending tone that I've seen more than once while reading his replies. To take a page out of his book, I can't wrap my head around why he would take such a tone when this is suppose to be a teaching forum.


I try not to read too much into tone on the internet. At the end of the day, we're all human beings and you never know when somebody is having a bad day, but still tries to take the time or effort to help somewhere. My $0.02 on that subject.

Back on topic, I'm with @Redtwin on wondering why you think your first HEAVY app wasn't successful.


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## JayGo (Jun 13, 2019)

@Jason229, as Ware stated, just use a different pre-emergent from a different group. If you feel you didn't get an even application across your lawn, that's probably your best option.


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## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

&#128077;


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## Bombers (Jul 14, 2020)

Did you run out of your tank mix before finishing over 4000 sq ft? or did you not follow your walk pattern correctly? I would add another pre-em like simazine (cheap), or wait and hit whatever you miss with a post-em herbicide you have in your arsenal.


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## LittleBearBermuda (Sep 25, 2020)

I definitely would not apply another round of Prodiamine granular or spray. Wait until early spring. In the meantime find another pre emergent with a different MOA.


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## cldrunner (May 14, 2019)

@Jason229 I agree with @Ware and @Amoo316 . They are very helpful and knowledgeable.



Jason229 said:


> I recently received a small amount of prodiamine 65 WDG, it was just enough to cover my lawn. This was my first time spraying a pre em & I'm pretty sure I didn't get an even coat down. I have a granular Lesco 0-0-7 Pr Em from Lowes that I want to put down. Would I be fine if I put down 1oz/1000?


Did you buy the 5oz bottle? How much of that do you have left? What does not compute with me is that you applied at .46 oz/1000 and you have 4.2K yard. This means you should have only used 1.93oz out of the 5 oz.

These guys are trying to get you to use a different mode of action. That is a good idea. A good analogy would be if you keep taking the same Tylenol(even a different brand that is generic) for that headache over the recommended rate it is not good for your liver. In grass terms they are trying to prevent you from hurting your root system.


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## Guest (Oct 6, 2021)

Ware is just trying to help you out. We all are here to support and learn from each other..I'd say if you really want to put down another pre'em app to "make sure" go for the simazine as other have suggested. It's cheap and a different MOA as well.


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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

Jason229 said:


> It's not the butting heads, it's the condescending tone that I've seen more than once while reading his replies. To take a page out of his book, I can't wrap my head around why he would take such a tone when this is suppose to be a teaching forum.


My apologies if I have hurt your feelings, but what I saw in your OP raised several questions that needed to be answered before any of us could make an informed recommendation on how you should proceed.

For example, if you had said you applied the Prodiamine 65 WDG at 1/4 the annual max (split fall apps is a common strategy), I might have suggested going ahead with another app at an appropriate rate. But that would also depend entirely on what you meant by _"I'm pretty sure I didn't get an even coat down"_ - which I still don't think you have answered. If you went way too heavy on some areas with intentions of applying what we now know was a little over half the annual max rate, it is quite possible that you shouldn't apply any more Prodiamine for up to a year to help minimize root damage in those areas. But again, without knowing both exactly what you did and the specifics of what you are asking is okay, there is no way for us to know.


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## FATC1TY (Jul 12, 2017)

Let him apply again. He feels like it's not enough. He can then get upset at the replies when his next thread in the spring is "why is my yard not greening up and growing?"

What's another .25# of granular Lesco gonna do anyways but waste some time.


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## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

Finally getting a chance to reply, long day at work(gotta love running a Target). I'll say this again, I just wanted a simple question. I appreciate the response but I still feel some of you over answered. The reason I feel I didn't get a good coating is I remember earlier in the week my kid was fiddling with my wand & about half way through it started to leak. Who knows I may or may not make a post about "why my lawn isn't greening up" isn't that what this forum is for?


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## Redtwin (Feb 9, 2019)

Jason229 said:


> It's not the butting heads, it's the condescending tone that I've seen more than once while reading his replies. To take a page out of his book, I can't wrap my head around why he would take such a tone when this is suppose to be a teaching forum.


Not trying to poke the wasp nest but with the hyperlinks and tables in his reply, I think it was a pretty darn helpful response.

Since your not sure of the rate for the app you already put down, Prodiamine and Dithiopyr are out. You could probably put down some Simazine or Isoxaben at the label rates to fill any gaps.


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## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

Never had a problem with the links bro…


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## Shizzlestix66 (Aug 30, 2020)

You might be better off hiring this out to one of the lawn companies. 4000sq ft is a pretty easy app of prodiamine to make. If you knew beforehand your kid was messing with the wand commonsense would have been to double check the calibration.


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## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

Nah applied pre em last year and had little no weeds my friend. So common sense told me not to hire said lawn company. Common sense should tell you what's easy to you may not be to easy to the next person. Kind of like the saying "one man's trash, is the next man's treasure"…


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## Shizzlestix66 (Aug 30, 2020)

I'm not the one on the forum getting ill with other people offering advice. You have been given some great info early on by some very knowledgeable people. I wish you good luck with your yard.


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## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

For the last time…I never had a problem with the advice.


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## Highlife159 (May 19, 2021)




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## Ware (Jan 28, 2017)

I couldn't figure out why I trigger the OP, so I did a quick search and found that this is not the first time we have worked through a misapplication. He applied some fast release Nitrogen at over 3.25 pounds of N per thousand last summer and we had to walk through why his math was incorrect. I can imagine his displeasure when that damn Ware showed up with his calculator again. This is all making more sense now.

Burn Marks


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## Shizzlestix66 (Aug 30, 2020)

Good thing is his yard is 4000 sq ft. When he rootclubs it to death the reno wont be to expensive.


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## Bombers (Jul 14, 2020)

I think OP used the entire 5 oz bottle which is 1.3x the annual amount &#128550;. If he had any left he wouldn't have asked to apply the granular lesco. You're done with prodiamine until 2023 man, and please don't apply the granular lesco next spring either.


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## Jason229 (Apr 4, 2020)

Ware said:


> I couldn't figure out why I trigger the OP, so I did a quick search and found that this is not the first time we have worked through a misapplication. He applied some fast release Nitrogen at over 3.25 pounds of N per thousand last summer and we had to walk through why his math was incorrect. I can imagine his displeasure when that damn Ware showed up with his calculator again. This is all making more sense now.
> 
> Burn Marks


That isn't the case. I welcome any & all tips/suggestions. Like I stated before you came across rude & condescending. I've read plenty times on the forum before where you have came off this way. You often times come across like you seem aggravated that people with less lawn knowledge post question that may seem like common knowledge to you but not to them. What I can't wrap my head around is that you went & did research on somebody in all likelihood you'll see. I'm grateful for all the knowledge I've come across on this forum. I was all to take a 4000 sq dirt yard to what I'd say is 85% full Bermuda lawn with minimal weeds. So if you're trying to make me look bad with my trails & errors(which I'm sure 99% of the members here have gone through) then try again. I'd say that's a win in my book, but also at the end of the day…it's grass & it'll grow back.


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## Amoo316 (Jul 8, 2021)

Jason229 said:


> The reason I feel I didn't get a good coating is I remember earlier in the week my kid was fiddling with my wand & about half way through it started to leak.


I'm going to ignore all the BS going on and just attempt to help here.

Based on what you have told us, you're at the top of your rate for Prodiamine. SImazine is a relatively cheap and easy solution to this problem and IMO is the route you should go if you're worried about breakthrough. Max app rate is 2oz/K. Needing 8oz total this would last you a LONG time.

If you're into a 1 and done and don't mind the weed killer portion you can pick up this from Lowes as the active is Isoxaben and it treats 4500ftsq of Bermuda.

Isoxaben is a cellulose inhibitor and won't overlap with the Prodiamine you already put down.


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## FATC1TY (Jul 12, 2017)

Jason229 said:


> Nah applied pre em last year and had little no weeds my friend. So common sense told me not to hire said lawn company. Common sense should tell you what's easy to you may not be to easy to the next person. Kind of like the saying "one man's trash, is the next man's treasure"…


So first time spying PreM or first time spraying? Your original post says first time spraying PreM.

Applied last year and had little or no weeds, yet you burned up weeds only with a 3x application of fertilizer… checks out.

Seems like it's your first time on the internet too, you are correct, people here are willing to help, you just aren't willing to read.

Stop being sensitive to corrections, you seem to do it enough to ask questions and get upset when it's not to your liking.

Use another pre emergent active ingredient, or don't. They've provided the perfect fix to your problem. Or apply a few ounces of granular Lesco and sleep better based off your calculations. Right or wrong, it might grow back, it might not.

No one here has said they've been perfect. But most of the successful people aren't deflecting corrections to confused and incorrect applications.

There's little room for error for improper applications to your lawn, for more reason than "it's just grass, it'll grow back. "


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## jayhawk (Apr 18, 2017)

Post makes me want to light a cigar

https://alexgoeltz.tumblr.com/post/20763297376/last-one-for-tonight-my-cat-tattoo-is-simply-for">https://alexgoeltz.tumblr.com/post/20763297376/last-one-for-tonight-my-cat-tattoo-is-simply-for


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Jason229 said:


> I recently received a small amount of prodiamine 65 WDG, it was just enough to cover my lawn. This was my first time spraying a pre em & I'm pretty sure I didn't get an even coat down. I have a granular Lesco 0-0-7 Pr Em from Lowes that I want to put down. Would I be fine if I put down 1oz/1000?


I'm going to lock this thread. It is not going anywhere. The OP asked if he can add 1oz/Ksqft of a granular product because the spray was not even. 1) adding more prem can exceed application or annual label rate and 2) trying to evenly spread 1oz/ksqft of a granular product is impossible.


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