# gm560 Lawn Journal



## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

I am starting the season on the losing end of a war with the brothers Poa. Both triv and annua are abundant in my yard, especially the back. I stupidly skipped my pre-em in the fall in my backyard because I attempted to nuke some triv spots and reseed them, but it is now apparent that was a bad idea on multiple fronts, as the triv has come roaring back and, of course poa a germinated unopposed.

So, I am going to attempt a new strategy for the triv.... 
I saw on @Pete1313's journal he picked up a hex plugger. Prior to this, I did not know this tool existed, but as soon I saw it I knew I needed to have it and placed an order that night. I ended up with a different brand but here is the item I purchased.






Today I took it to some triv spots and I can tell you I friggin' love it. I am 100% certain this is the tool that will eventually rid me of triv. Here is part-way through going after one of my worst spots.



Tomorrow I am heading to a local sod farm to pick up a dozen or so rolls of KBG sod to fill in the spots all over the lawn. If all goes as planned, it should be blended back in pretty quickly. I do think I will be likely doing this for several years, hopefully each subsequent year only requiring me to plug a fraction of the year prior.... but I am very hopeful this is the beginning of the end for triv in my yard.


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

The hex pluggers are a sweet tool! Glad you like it! Is that the 5" or the 7" version?


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Oh and the actual journal stuff.... Pre emergent went down on March 18th. Used granular dimension (Lesco 18-0-0 .21% ) @ 2lbs/k. I planned to go liquid prodiamine, but I couldnt find my charger for the sprayer and wanted to get it down before the rain so I called an audible and did what I could. Never used dimension before so we'll see. No fertilizer yet other than the 0.25 or so from the pre-em (50% of which is poly plus).


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Pete1313 said:


> The hex pluggers are a sweet tool! Glad you like it! Is that the 5" or the 7" version?


7 inch. Thanks for introducing me to this wonderful piece of equipment!


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

No problem!  They are alittle pricey, but they do make life easier! I plan on doing another round of plugging with it this Saturday to try and get the plugs in the ground early on and with plenty of time to establish before summer.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Pete1313 said:


> They are alittle pricey, but they do make life easier!


Yes, but the thought of looking out and seeing no nasty lime green makes me way happier than the extra $200 in my wallet.



Pete1313 said:


> I plan on doing another round of plugging with it this Saturday to try and get the plugs in the ground early on and with plenty of time to establish before summer.


Yea I am hurrying to do it as well. I actually sprayed the triv with some gly earlier this week and was hoping to have some kill prior to removing the plugs. That hasnt really happened, but doing the cost benefit analysis I have decided it best to just go after it now, hope the gly got to the roots and give the sod as much time as possible to establish before it starts to heat up.


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## JerseyGreens (Aug 30, 2019)

Pretty sweet tool...makes the ProPlugger look like the minor leagues.

Did you get out with your sweet new Spreader yet!?


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

JerseyGreens said:


> Pretty sweet tool...makes the ProPlugger look like the minor leagues.
> 
> Did you get out with your sweet new Spreader yet!?


Only on my neighbors lawn. After I transplant the sod plugs I'm going to hit the whole area with carbon pro g, which will be the true maiden voyage


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Well I know what I'm doing this weekend. This is gonna be a ton of work but its gotta be done. First hole plugged. 1 down, 499 to go.

Before:


During:


After:


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## Chris LI (Oct 26, 2018)

How's it going with the plugging? I feel your pain, as I always seem to miss the fall window for PreM. I do like that new plugger you picked up. :thumbsup:


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Chris LI said:


> How's it going with the plugging? I feel your pain, as I always seem to miss the fall window for PreM. I do like that new plugger you picked up. :thumbsup:


Its going. This triv stuff really sucks. Seems like every time I look, I find it somewhere else in the lawn.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Ok I am getting around to updating my journal. I have been taking notes, but off line, basically because I wasn't sure if this was going to a total and complete failure or not. Anyway the long and short of it is I reached a breaking point with triv this spring and I nuked my whole back lawn and am embarking on an experiment of a summer time reno.

I had been diligently killing triv using hand and hand, followed by digging it out and replacing by sod. But it never stopped or even slowed. Every day I would go out and notice more. I was running out of sod to replace it with and was amassing a huge pile of dirt I had dug up. My lawn looked terrible. Finally while doing a bit of day drinking with neighbors, my wife said to me... at this point, you should just kill the whole thing. That was all I needed to hear. With the execution order from the queen in hand, the lawn was given its last meal that night, followed by a broadcast of gly the next morning (April 26th).

I am going to document the journey, but I am going to preface that this is probably a bad idea. But its fun and worst case is I wasted some seed and Ill try again later in the summer.

So here we go.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

After I had decided to kill the back yard, which was only a few years old but had become plagued by triv, I had to decide my next coarse of action.

My initial plan was to basically attempt 2 renos in 1 year. I am not sure if this has even been done, but it actually seemed pretty logic to me as a good way to combat triv in a perfect world.

Step 1: Smoke the triv in spring 
Step 2: Seed PRG
Step 3: Water like crazy to keep PRG alive all summer, which in turn should get any remaining triv going,
Step 4: Nuke again in early fall when cool enough for triv to hopefully thrive, if still present
Step 5: Plant KBG

I was pretty sure this is what I was going to do. In fact I even ordered some Champion GQ to put down, however, my world is not a perfect world and I didnt want to have my kids without a backyard in both Spring and Fall. Wasn't fair.

So I pivoted a bit. I took a look at the long range forecast for the North East, was was calling for a relatively cool Spring. I decided that rather than getting the PRG seed down right away, I would fallow the lawn for the entire month of May to see what I could get to come up. Then I would plant a KBG monostand in early June and hope for the best, but expect failure. If that didn't work, I would try again in July, then again in August.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Ok so here are the steps I have gone though so far, with some pictures to document the process.

Here is what my lawn looked like soon after nuking. You can see all the dead spots from the various rounds of killing triv. It was terrible looking. Honestly looked better when the whole thing was dead.



The whole lawn was dead by the 1st or 2nd week in May. I kept watering it...

Now is the time to mention yet another obstacle I had to take care of. Well before i had ever considered this renovation.... because what moron renovates a whole lawn in the summer time, I applied granular dimension in March (LESCO Fertilizer/Herbicide Pre Emergent Dimension 0.21%) at 2lbs/1k, which should have given me protection until July or August. My goal was to break this up using an aerator.

I booked a rental of a Ryan Lawnaire IV for the Saturday, 5/15.

2 days prior to that rental, in an effort to kill anything that had germinated so I did not propagate it when aerating, I did another broadcast app of glyphosate.

On the night of 5/14, I irrigated to soften the soil.

I did approximately 10 passes in multiple directions with the Ryan. It was a sunny day so the cores dried quickly. The ground was beat up pretty good at that point, but for good measure I borrowed a neighbors Classen Power Rake and did 2 passes at the lowest setting. This beat the ground up even more and also broke up the cores. Then I raked up a bunch dead grass and drgged everything out with a harrow rake. Here is after the aeration. I don't know why I didn't take a photo after power raking and dragging, but I guess i was pretty tired and I could hear the beers calling my name inside.



Side note, I was actually pleased that I had to do the aerator. I sand capped my backyard last year and was actually regretting it a bit. I (hope) think this process busted it up pretty good.

With this all done, I fallowed for several more weeks. If any triv still lived in that soil, I really wanted it to come back to life so I could kill it. I am happy to say that I did have some grassy stuff come up in the lawn, mostly in the places that triv was present before. Hopefully I got it all.



While I was killing weeds, I formulated my plan for seeding. Target date was weekend of June 4 which would give me 3 weeks of fallowing post disturbing the soil and 5 weeks total.

I dug into some NTEP reports and decided on my cultivar, which is After Midnight. It is a newer offering that has some limited data available, but it did great so far in the Rutgers New Brunswick trials and also in some warmer climates, which I think is where we are trending. I figured that since I am experimenting a bit, I might as well go with something fairly new. I ordered 15 lbs of seed (back yard is only 2,500 sqft) which should give me plenty of seed, even if I have a round or two of failure.



The other decision I made was that I would try my hand at pre-germinating seed (or priming, I am not actually sure which one I did). My rational was that in June heat waves can happen, as well as flash storms. I figured the more time I can keep the seed in a controlled environment, the better. I also wanted to try it to see what happened. My expectations are already tempered, so why the heck not.

I kept watching weather and at about a week out, my target weekend forecasted a mini heat wave, that would break in the middle of the following week. My wife also wanted to go to the beach so we did that instead. Seed down date was moved to June 9th.

With this new date circled, I started pre-germinating seed on the 3rd, giving it 6 days to soak. I measured out 5 lbs of dry seed. I decided to go pretty light at 2 lbs to conserve seed and avoid over crowding in the heat of summer (fungus problem). I put the seed in 2 old pillow cases and soaked them in a 5 pound bucket. As instructed in other places I changed the water every 12 hours. I did 9 am and then again at 9 pm. This made it pretty easy to remember. The reason for changing the water, I discovered, seems to be that the seed emits a toxin as it gets ready to germinate. So leaving it in that toxin for a long time can hamper the process.

The day before seed down, I did one last broadcast app of gly.

On June 9th, I planned to put seed down after I finished working for the day. So at about noon, I took the pillowcases out of the bucket and put it outside in the shade to drain a bit.

After work, it was seed down time! I mixed some of the seed with a few items to make it spreadable. In a plastic tub, I put in some Greens-Grade Milorganite. This is just what I happened to have, I am sure normal would have worked fine, too. I didn't weigh it out but my guess is I used about 35 lbs to the 5 lbs of seed, which was roughly what Milorganite says to use on their website when pre-germinating.



I also mixed in about 25 lbs of Lesco Carbon Pro G. Once again I had this on hand and planned on putting it down on the new grass, so figured why not mix it all together.

After it was all mixed up I put some in my sweet new Lesco 50 Pound Spreader (shout out to @JerseyGreens) and let it fly.



I was running out of time, so I went lazy and spread granular Scotts Starter + Meso.

Finally, since I could not find peat moss ANYWHERE, I decided to get mulch pellets again. I happened to be at Lowes and saw Pennington Slopemaster Pellets. I bought 4 bags of it and used that as my seed cover. I actually liked these much better than the Pro version I used last time. They were cheaper than I remember but more importantly, they were easier to spread.

With that done my seed was down and it was time to pray and water.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

My expectations were quite muted at this point. I was mentally preparing myself for the seed to not even germinate as a result of the pre-emergent. Or at least be pretty sparse. Luckily for me, this hasn't been the case. Here have been my observations since seed down.

The pre-germination seems to have been extremely effective. I saw the first seedlings germinate on June 14th, essentially 4-5 days post seed down. The next day, germination was wide spread, with the tennis ball fuzz look across most of the lawn.



Things were looking good and I was certainly happy, but I was still trying to temper my expectations. For all I knew the dimension was going to kill all these seedlings... so I kept watching and waiting and i haven't seen anything bad, yet. Fingers crossed.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

So here I am today, things keep progressing. I have a few thin spots, but compared to my fall reno a few years back I am WAY ahead of where I was at 19 days post seed down and also 14 days DAG. I think part of this is luck, as I have had some pretty agreeable weather, but also the pre-germination worked far beyond my expectations.



I am obviously not out of the woods yet as summer has just begun. I have had a few 90+ degree days, but this week will be the first true test. High 90s-100 degrees is in the forecast until Wednesday. Even temps in the mid to high 80s at night. I applied axozy a few days ago and will be following up with propi tomorrow. Other than that water water and more water.

Edit: I dug this up, this was 17 Days after seeding the regular way last time. Regardless of if all these get toasted by heat this summer, I think I am always going to soak KBG before planting going forward.


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## JerseyGreens (Aug 30, 2019)

First off - didn't even know you had a journal. 
Secondly a Spring Reno? You sure kept that hush hush when we met up.

With the wild and wacky weather we've had since seed down I'll say this looks great. Can't wait to see it after you hit it with the GM.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

JerseyGreens said:


> Secondly a Spring Reno? You sure kept that hush hush when we met up.


I didn't know it was happening yet.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

I would really like to get the first haircut and spoon feeding in, but this weather is scaring me off... 86 degrees at 10pm. Yuck.



Thursday at noon looks primo as of now. Plan will be to suspend irrigation in the morning so I limit damage when mowing. Will start with the manual reel. Not sure when I will roll out the Greensmaster on the new grass. Maybe in a week or two. Going to start very light with 0.15/N per 1k using Ammonium Sulfate and will let mother nature water it in for me.

This is all assuming I can avoid stress and/or disease pressure over the next 2 days.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

The new grass seems to be hanging on nicely. I just walked it and no signs of stress of any kind. Just need to get through the 100 degree heat over the next 12 hours and I should be in the clear for a few days at least.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Heatwave is over and now getting some needed precip. Put down 2 lbs of Lesco Solugreen 21-0-0 for 0.17 lbs of N per 1k shortly before it began.


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## dleonard11122 (Jun 24, 2020)

I didn't know you had a journal too, I'm following now. This is amazing. Now you have me wondering if I can soak some KBG and overseed my TTTF this fall.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

dleonard11122 said:


> I didn't know you had a journal too, I'm following now. This is amazing. Now you have me wondering if I can soak some KBG and overseed my TTTF this fall.


thanks @dleonard11122. I think you definitely could get more KBG to take in an overseed if you pre soaked the seeds..


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

We are heating up again here this week into the 90s, but looks like we should be getting almost daily t-storms that should cool things down periodically. I cut the longer sections with the manual reel this weekend. Will hit it with another small dose of AMS tonight or tomorrow and plan on tuning up the greensmaster when I can to hopefully get it on the grass this weekend.

27 Days from seed down:


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## Duxwig (Jun 6, 2021)

Edit: woops, missed page 2 updates


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Duxwig said:


> Edit: woops, missed page 2 updates


I was gonna say, that photo was from about 2 hours ago. You want a livestream?, haha.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

What's the link to the Livestream?


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

g-man said:


> What's the link to the Livestream?


Working on it.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Applied another 2 lbs of Lesco Solugreen 21-0-0 for 0.17 lbs of N per 1k.


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## Biggylawns (Jul 8, 2019)

This looks great. Did you just put the seed in a pillow case all by itself?


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Biggylawns said:


> This looks great. Did you just put the seed in a pillow case all by itself?


Yup. What else you thinking about putting in?


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Hoping for a little advice here. So yesterday morning I noticed a few small patches of some sort of disease on the new grass. It is pretty isolated in 4 spots, the largest being about the size of a salad plate. This isn't a super shocker, it has been hot, rainy and humid for the past 10 days or so. I immediately applied DiseaseEx at the 4lbs/k curative rate across the whole lawn. As of this morning, I do not see any indication of it spreading. My question is what would you all do from here? A lot of more of the same weather foretasted this week, precip, clouds, hot and humid.



Would a contact fungicide be worth it, or is it a fools errand with all the rain? Other fungicides? I am pretty well stocked... on hand I have liquid copper, chlorothalonil, propi, cleary's, eagle, serenade and a few more bags of DiseaseEx.

I wanted to mow and have been spoon feeding 0.17 lbs/k of AMS weekly on Wednesdays. My instinct says to not mow and skip the fert this week.

I'll post a picture of one of the spots in a few minutes.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Here is a photo:


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## JerseyGreens (Aug 30, 2019)

Doesn't look bad. I'd agree on skipping any more N and just riding it out.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

JerseyGreens said:


> Doesn't look bad. I'd agree on skipping any more N and just riding it out.


Thanks. Yea normally I wouldn't even bat an eye at this, but since its so young... it makes me a little more nervous.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

I don't like to see the purple or using granular azoxy as a curative. How is your P levels?


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

g-man said:


> I don't like to see the purple or using granular azoxy as a curative. How is your P levels?


Well I think it would be a wee-bit disingenuous to have a thread called breaking all the rules and have had a soil test done, don't you think? 

In all seriousness, last soil test was done last year and at that time I had no real problems except my soil ph was high. At seeding I also put down some starter and milo, so I would assume I am not deficient... but you know what they say about assumptions.

You thinking its melting out?


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

I'm thinking i don't like the purple leaves. One of the potential issues is low phosphorus. Since we don't know your levels and you are saying high pH. I think you should try to fertilizer with something that has P in it. I would target at least 0.5lb P/Ksqft.

For melting out, i think the leaves are green and then turf yellow and die. You already did granular azoxy. I prefer liquid because it is faster, but granular does work.

I would avoid the DMIs and just spray your tomatoes with daconil as a preventive.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Thanks @g-man. I do have some triple phos that I can put down.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

I cut it today. 7/8 HOC. It was pretty long in some places and the grass was a little wet, so the reel missed some blades, even with a double cut. I think Ill get at it again on Thursday as we should have some decent weather. Exciting that it is starting to look like a lawn again.

34 Days after seeding, 28 Days after germination:


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## JerseyGreens (Aug 30, 2019)

Looks great for a spring Reno and our crazy weather pattern.


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## TheCutShop (Jun 24, 2021)

g-man said:


> I don't like to see the purple or using granular azoxy as a curative. How is your P levels?


Could you expand on this please? I have the same colors on a couple spots and my P levels are 17.11.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

I quick article that explains it better than I can.

https://turf.umn.edu/false-spring-false-colors-what-does-purple-turf-mean-part-1

https://www.extension.iastate.edu/turfgrass/blog/purple-discoloration-creeping-bentgrass-fall


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## TheCutShop (Jun 24, 2021)

Thank you


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Cut it again today @ 7/8. Have so far skipped this weeks low dose of N. I am pretty sure I halted to disease I saw last weekend, but going to give it until Saturday just to be sure and then I will resume. I am also considering a blanket app of Tenacity at that time since I am now 30 DAG. My weed pressure is low, but I want to bridge the gap to when it is safe for prodiamine. It has been a strange summer so far in terms of weather and I don't want to miss the chance stop the Poa A from returning.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

40 Days after seeding
34 Days after germination

Really didn't do anything in the yard this weekend. Just updating with a photo to show the continued progress. Had some pretty primo weather for promoting disease pressure the past week, so just happy to make it out alive.



The wide shot doesn't show this, but in person it is also starting to darken and thicken up. The blades are starting to look more mature. There are still a few thin spots and areas where the grass looks more juvenile, but over all this is representative of the density I am working with.



Planning to resume spoon feeding this week as well as the followup Tenacity app. I have really dialed back the irrigation this last week and I am watching the weather to see if I can count on it to water this app in, but I have a feeling I will need to irrigate again soon.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Did my follow up app of tenacity today on the reno. Also did diagnostic on app on the front yard to look for hidden triv. Found some not so hidden triv, too. This is some creeping into a spot I nuked in the spring... slithering like the serpent it is. Something tells me I didnt get it all....



Also applied a spoon feeding of N @ 0.15/1k via Solugreen 21-0-0.


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## Chris LI (Oct 26, 2018)

FYI-I just nuked some clover with Triclopyr and it took out a bunch of what I believe to be triv. I'm keeping an eye on it, but I need to get down on my hands and knees to confirm. Only one small section of the triv infested area right behind the house went dormant this summer, with the rainy days we've had, so I hope it's toast, and I can reseed (I know spring glypho on triv with seeding is typically the best recommendation). I hope this collateral damage pans out.  I wasn't going to post anything in my journal until I could confirm.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

I have been down the shore since last Saturday. I was surprised to come home to some poa a (including some with seedheads) in the reno area. I have to say I was not expecting that, but I guess it makes sense. I had plenty of poa a this spring that put out seed prior to me killing it. The constant water and reasonably mild summer I guess allowed it to germinate along side the KBG. Shows how much can break through the meso at seed down. I also did my second broadcast app of tenacity 11 days ago and seeing almost no whitening, perhaps due to the lack of sticker.

I hand picked what I saw, but pretty sure plenty still out there. I have etho on hand, so think I will run it out as pre + post em on the poa a. According to the Poa Constrictor label I have to wait until 60 DAG, which is 14 days from today. This is also the day I had planed for prodiamine. Anyone ever tank mix them?


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

I haven't updated in a while. Backyard coming in nice. The "After Midnight" is getting much darker. I think it may be darker than the old, predominantly "Midnight" lawn but it is tough to tell. Laid some stripes with the greensmaster and took a pic. I suck at striping, but I think the grass is doing its best to throw me a bone.



I have some Poa A in the lawn. I have been hand pulling, but can't keep up. I am going to try to beat it back with some etho and tenacity, Hopefully the timing is right. Soil temp was exactly 70 degrees. So if I get it down this weekend, I can follow up a few days after Halloween.


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## situman (Nov 3, 2020)

Will the poa a and triv turn completely white with Tenacity?


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

situman said:


> Will the poa a and triv turn completely white with Tenacity?


They should. Hopefully no triv.


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## situman (Nov 3, 2020)

Ordered some After Midnight myself for next yr while prices are still reasonable from Twin City Seeds. Everywhere else is asking for insane prices for seeds.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

situman said:


> Ordered some After Midnight myself for next yr while prices are still reasonable from Twin City Seeds. Everywhere else is asking for insane prices for seeds.


Nice. I have been impressed so far. Even as a youngster in a humid summer it did pretty well to fend off disease. It also stays very compact, which I like, but I have still seen some pretty good spreading to fill in a few thin spots. I am going to see if I can push the color even more. It has only had nitrogen so far. Contemplating adding some PGR and Iron to the mix.


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## situman (Nov 3, 2020)

Hows the After Midnight looking?


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## KCturffanatic (Oct 21, 2020)

Nice yard. I'm glad to see the After Midnight is doing so well. I just did a monostand renovation with After Midnight in my back yard. I'm really impressed so far. Can't wait to see how it does in the transition zone during the summer.


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## situman (Nov 3, 2020)

KCturffanatic said:


> Nice yard. I'm glad to see the After Midnight is doing so well. I just did a monostand renovation with After Midnight in my back yard. I'm really impressed so far. Can't wait to see how it does in the transition zone during the summer.


Do you have pictures?


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

@situman @KCturffanatic For anyone looking for more After Midnight pics, my front lawn was renovated with it this fall. So far for me, it is slower growing than the back lawn with older cultivars. It will be interesting to see if the slower growth holds through next year.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

I was working on inside projects this weekend, planning a mow this week and I will post some pictures. It's looking great right now.


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## KCturffanatic (Oct 21, 2020)

bernstem said:


> @situman @KCturffanatic For anyone looking for more After Midnight pics, my front lawn was renovated with it this fall. So far for me, it is slower growing than the back lawn with older cultivars. It will be interesting to see if the slower growth holds through next year.


That's good to know. This is my first go around with an all KBG lawn, so nothing to compare it to. I'll keep a watch on your journal. I also did a test plot of "Mazama" and "After Midnight" in a section of my side yard that sits under a few River Birches. I'll be seeing which one performs best, or even performs at all under very shady conditions. It should be interesting. So far, they are coming up and performing very similarly.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Feel like the lawn season started this weekend in NJ. We were way behind on rain and temps in April. Got the first real mow in (did some clean up jobs in March and April but not much grass was cut).


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

1st spray app:

Anuew PGR @ 12oz per Acre rate
Tenacity @ 1.6oz per Acre rate
Nitrogen (Humic Coated Urea) @ 0.12/lb per 1k
FEature @ 1oz per 1k rate

Tenacity is an attempt to clean up some Poa A that germinated with the reno grass last summer and made it through winter. Going to try to kill it low and slow with 10 apps of low rate tenacity every 4 days. I will use the same cocktail as above, less the PGR and Iron most of the time. Plenty of the poa a has already gone to seed, so I put down dimension earlier in the spring and will follow with and app in June and again in August.


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## MJR12284 (Jun 21, 2020)

Would you recommend doing the 10 low rate Tenacity apps to battle Poa A even if you did not include all the other goodies? I don't currently have any of those but have a Poa A infestation on my hands which is only getting worse.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

MJR12284 said:


> Would you recommend doing the 10 low rate Tenacity apps to battle Poa A even if you did not include all the other goodies? I don't currently have any of those but have a Poa A infestation on my hands which is only getting worse.


I can't _recommend_ it for anyone frankly. This is my first time attempting this. The literature I have read on this approach does not include any of the other items. The other stuff was just to maximize the spraying I was doing.

https://archive.lib.msu.edu/tic/golfd/article/2012oct33.pdf
https://sportsfieldmanagementonline.com/2010/11/12/using-tenacity-for-poa-annua-control/4488/

Also check out @TheSwede journal from last year:
https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=16956

Anuew (and PGR in general) seems to hinder the Poa A pretty good, too. @g-man also posted about his experience attacking poa a with T-Nex, as well. However really not sure if it was a good thing to add _with_ the tenacity or not.... somewhat concerned the combo may trigger self defense mode and send it into a dormant state... we shall see.


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## JerseyGreens (Aug 30, 2019)

Good to see you posting in 2022. Following.

I'm debating on going through this adventure too but a lot of Poa A is already getting fried in my lawn...but I guarantee more is striving within the turf. Can you post pictures along your journey for others that may follow suit?


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Sure. @JerseyGreens. Ill take a picture of the starting point today. I just went out to do so but the spotted sun coming through the trees makes it tough to see.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Anyone know how to rename this thread? I feel like such an old man. I can't figure it out.

NM. GOT IT!


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

2nd app down today. Also did a clean up mow with the rotary to get some junk off the lawn. Amazing how slow the wake up has been this year it seems like we are at least 2 weeks behind previous seasons.

Tenacity @ 1.6oz per Acre rate
Nitrogen (Humic Coated Urea) @ 0.12/lb per 1k


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Tenacity @ 1.6oz per Acre rate
Nitrogen (Humic Coated Urea) @ 0.12/lb per 1k

This was 1 day early (schedule for tenacity vs poa a is Mon/Thurs for a total of 10 apps) but we are supposed to get have t-storms tomorrow and work makes it tough to get down in the am so figured the best thing was to do it this evening. It was getting dark, so no pictures but I'll try to grab one tomorrow before the storm. This is one week into the treatment.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

As of this morning. Overcast sky helps the poa a pop, for better or worse.


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Planted a bunch of annuals this weekend. In total it was about 100 impatiens and about 50 petunias (with some other various thrillers and spillers) throughout containers, window boxes, and the landscape. Also planted up the cucumbers and most of the tomato bed. This upcoming weekend I have another 50-75 petunias to get into the landscape in the front yard, too. Then, mulch. My goal this year is not to suffer the same fate as usual, which is having the plants eventually decimated by deer. So, I put down a barrier of Deer Scram Professional granular around the beds and surrounding the property, followed by a complete spray of "Deer Out" concentrate. I did some research on programs to keep the deer away and most people recommend rotating scents. I will attempt to do this weekly in rotation of different spray solutions. Deer Out is pepperment based. Next week will be a homemade solution that closely mirrors "Deer B Gone" of putrefied eggs, clove oil, and cinnamon oil. The third is at this point undecided. Probably a putrefied egg/garlic/fish meal solution.

Welp, this was an appetizing update. Lunch time.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

Hey @gm560

I saw you bought seed from Twin City. I was wondering if you had any input on their shipping costs to the Northeast, and whether all of their seed is certified, or just the ones that they post tags for. I have a neighbor who might only need 5 lbs of seed, and Hart Seed currently has a 10 lb minimum, so I was thinking maybe Twin City would be a better deal. But they don't list shipping costs online. Just wondering if you had experience. Thanksl


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## gm560 (Feb 22, 2018)

Green said:


> Hey @gm560
> 
> I saw you bought seed from Twin City. I was wondering if you had any input on their shipping costs to the Northeast, and whether all of their seed is certified, or just the ones that they post tags for. I have a neighbor who might only need 5 lbs of seed, and Hart Seed currently has a 10 lb minimum, so I was thinking maybe Twin City would be a better deal. But they don't list shipping costs online. Just wondering if you had experience. Thanksl


Hey @Green. Actually I have never ordered from them. I think that is where @bernstem and @situman said they bought their After Midnight, but I actually purchased mine from Hogan. I do see they have free shipping if you buy $75 of seed.... (coupon is on the top of the homepage), but not sure if #5 is gonna get you there. Sorry I can't be more help!


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

Green said:


> Hey @gm560
> 
> I saw you bought seed from Twin City. I was wondering if you had any input on their shipping costs to the Northeast, and whether all of their seed is certified, or just the ones that they post tags for. I have a neighbor who might only need 5 lbs of seed, and Hart Seed currently has a 10 lb minimum, so I was thinking maybe Twin City would be a better deal. But they don't list shipping costs online. Just wondering if you had experience. Thanksl


I bought from Twin City Seed. I don't know if they will do small sizes - I bought a full bag. I don't remember what shipping was, but I don't think it was crazy. They were very responsive by e-mail and phone.


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## Green (Dec 24, 2017)

bernstem said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> > Hey @gm560
> ...


Thanks. They do 5 lbs now (see their site). Many places have a 10 lb min.


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## bernstem (Jan 16, 2018)

Green said:


> bernstem said:
> 
> 
> > Green said:
> ...


Wow, that is over twice what I paid for seed.


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