# Help me save my lawn!



## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

My lawn was looking good, then I stepped in.

On February 22, I mixed up barricade and tenacity in my 2 gallon sprayer and applied it to my lawn. 10 gallons of water, 5 teaspoons of tenacity, and 5 ounces of prodiamine 65 wdg over 15,000 square feet. It was all watered in by a couple of inches of rain over the next several days. I now have large ~80% dead areas, mostly in my front yard. My theory is I over applied tenacity. Perhaps it wasn't mixed well enough and settling caused over concentration in areas. Maybe I was just really tired and messed up. Could be my math stinks.

Now I am trying to fix the dead areas. I know the barricade should prevent me from being able to grow new grass from seed. I'm still going to try with a 3700 square foot area.

I have aerated and dethatched heavily (trying to break the barrier). I have removed the thatch and the cores. In 2 weeks, my plan is to aerate and remove cores again, put down Humic Dg from the Andersons, lay down seed at new lawn rate, add 3 tons of sand to a 3,700 square foot area, put down another layer of seed, put down starter fertilizer, spread peat moss, and water.

Am I doing all I can? Would application of a liquid aerator this week help? Or all are my efforts for nothing?

I appreciate any input you can give!

The picture shows my lawn after dethatching and aeration. Waste has been removed. For reference, it used to look like the grass across the street. Perhaps a little better.


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## john5246 (Jul 21, 2019)

these chemicals are meant for professional use, there is a reason you can't buy them at your local HD

If it's dead you need to drop seed at some point. I don't know how that's going to affect your germination so...

can I ask why you mixed them together?


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

After this I am a professional! &#128514;

I thought I had it all figured out and could apply both at the same time. I still think my math was correct. I think a backpack sprayer and more agitation of the mix would have made all the difference. Still, next time I'm going to apply them separately.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

Do you have pics before you dethatched?


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

Sorry. I didn't think to take pictures before I dethatched.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Can you describe what you applied in more detail? 5teaspoon of tenacity in each 2 gallon?


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

@g-man that's a lot of tenacity! I mixed 5 batches. Each one had 2 gallons of water, 1 teaspoon of tenacity, and one ounce of barricade. Each batch was used on as close to 3,000 square feet as I could get.


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## troksd (Jul 27, 2018)

Use a garden weasel / shovel to break the vapor barrier. Put the seed down, use a shovel to stab the area repeatedly or roll the garden weasel. Do both like U are mad. Liquid 'aerators' like Air-8 will not impact the vapor barrier.


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

@troksd thanks for the input. My "lawn master" neighbor suggested something similar.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

@jpskevington then tenacity was not your problem. That's a 1/3 teaspoon per ksqft close to 2oz/acre rate. Also your lawn would turn white first, before going dead. Your prodiamine rate was also ok.

So, you must have a different problem than your application of tenacity or prodiamine.


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

@jpskevington, before you go all drastic and break up your yard and drop seed, let's crunch the numbers. If your measuring is correct and you applied to 15,000 square feet -

5 teaspoons of tenacity in 10 gallons of water to cover 15,000 square feet = roughly 2.5 oz/acre in a .67 gal/M carrier.

5 oz of prodiamine 65 wdg in 10 gallons of water to cover 15,000 square feet = roughly .90 lbs/acre rate in a .67 gal/M carrier.

Both of those are well within normal application rates(as long as your measuring and application is correct) and are compatible tank mix partners per the tenacity label. The carrier rate is within the limits of the labels as well. Are you sure you are just not noticing bleaching from the tenacity, which will grow out in a couple weeks of good growing weather? It can be more severe the first time you use the product. Some close ups can help. For reference here is a link to it in my renovation and also a previous renovation where it was more severe.

https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=22451#p22451


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

@g-man beat me to it!


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

@Pete1313 I think there was settling in the tank. I have since bought a backpack sprayer with an internal agitator. I'm sure I was tired and moving too slow as well. It could just be bleaching and I didn't mess up too bad. I had checked the math repeatedly and felt confident enough to go for it. Lol

If I didn't burn it, then all I'm doing is a ton of extra work and seeding. I may need a bigger garden weasel, because I'm going to attempt the reseed.

I'm just hoping all the soil disturbing I'm doing will break the barrier and let my seeds grow.

The sand was already in the works for leveling bumps. This is going to be a hard learned lesson. Hopefully my yard looks better than ever by mid to late April. I'll post follow ups.


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## john5246 (Jul 21, 2019)

g-man said:


> @jpskevington then tenacity was not your problem. That's a 1/3 teaspoon per ksqft close to 2oz/acre rate. Also your lawn would turn white first, before going dead. Your prodiamine rate was also ok.
> 
> *So, you must have a different problem than your application of tenacity or prodiamine.*


you mean like using a tank sprayer that was used for glyphosate app but wasn't cleaned out?


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

@john5246 i know that isn't it because my dedicated round-up sprayer hasn't been used for over a year.


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## CrackedCornCrack (Jan 25, 2020)

@Pete1313 @g-man ,

I'm @jpskevington 's neighbor. And as an uninterested third party observer, it wasn't tenacity's bleaching. The fescue was/is dead dead in some places, straw colored and shriveled up like a severely dehydrated blade/nitrogen burn.

@jpskevington had mowed before his application but I don't remember the exact time table... any thoughts if that could contribute?

I think the yard will look great again in a month or so, the multiple times of breaking up the soil surface should get (some) percentage germination.... I think people have had success with that strategy. Has anyone experienced a different or better way?


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

@CrackedCornCrack thanks for chiming in and giving steadying input. 
"Has anyone experienced a different or better way?" 
That is the question I was hoping to have answered! I'm doing everything we discussed, but thought I'd seek additional input. You never know who has direct experience and knowledge.


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

@CrackedCornCrack i mowed the same day of application.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

I think it is important to get to the root cause of the issue. Tenacity bleaching is very noticeable. Neither of you observed it, so let's think the next possibilities: nitrogen burn, fungus or pest. We had a lot of rain lately and it is not hot enough or dry enough for dessication.

Any nitrogen this year? How much? What type? Any other thing applied to the lawn?


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

I haven't put anything in my lawn since the fall nitrogen blitz. It looked pretty good until I applied the herbicide on 2/22. I'll take close up pics tomorrow from affected and unaffected areas.


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

And also, just to confirm, there was nothing else in the spray tank? Just mesotrione, prodiamine, and water? No dye, surfactant, other herbicide, acidifier, ammonium sulfate? Something does not add up. If not, it is either just a coincidence that your symptoms line up with your spray app and it is actually something not related, or like you said you didnt mix thoroughly. I dont have true agitators on either of my spray tanks, but one thing I do and recommend is using a pre mix bucket and then filling the mix into the sprayer.


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

Each tank also had 8 ml surfactant and one ounce lazer blue marking dye.


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

Grass in unaffected areas.


Grass in affected areas.


Back yard only suffered a little.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Can you get more pictures of the affected areas? Even closer. That looks like a fungus.


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## Drewmey (Oct 3, 2018)

Any time I have ever "damaged" something with Tenacity, it has turned white first. This has been with Poa A, Bentgrass, certain undesired grasses that I thought were Fescue (haha). Is there any chance your grass blend has a large amount of Fine Fescue? @ken-n-nancy mentioned in this thread https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=5671&start=40#top, that Tenacity turned his fine fescue straight brown and not white, like his KBG. Fits with your description here but the only two times I have ever heard it described.

Is it possible that your aeration and dethatching made it look worse? That could explain some of the damage by itself.


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

@Pete1313 thanks for the mixing bucket tip. I will do that next time. Do you have a problem with bubbles when doing that with a mix that includes surfactant?

@g-man i will upload closer pictures as soon (if it ever) stops raining.

@Drewmey My grass is a mix of fescue sod and TTTF with fine blades. The aeration and dethatching didn't make it look better 😆, but I don't think it made it look worse.

The grass in that area was weaker than the rest of the lawn before 2/22, but it wasn't as bad as it is now.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Actually, I think you should grab a sample and send it to a pathology lab. I found that UT has a method to send samples. It will cost you $15. https://ag.tennessee.edu/spp/Pages/PDI.aspx

What fungicides you have at hand? Try to clean the mower between the good areas and trouble areas.


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## Pete1313 (May 3, 2017)

jpskevington said:


> @Pete1313 thanks for the mixing bucket tip. I will do that next time. Do you have a problem with bubbles when doing that with a mix that includes surfactant?


I dont, but when I need to add an adjuvant I add Cide-Kick II. It doesn't foam up like some other ones. You could always add it last in the bucket and gently stir to minimize the bubbles.


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

The lawn appears to be on its way to recovery. Top picture is Monday, bottoms is today (Thursday). I put down 32-0-10 fertilizer yesterday at about half rate. 


I think it will be OK. I will still post images of my spring seeding if anyone is interested.


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)




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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

@g-man I sent in a sample as you suggested. UT said it is ascochyta blight. "It should subside with warmer weather. Fertilize according to soil test. Do not apply excess nitrogen; sometimes splitting nitrogen applications into smaller quantities can help. Fungicides such as those containing propiconazole or tebuconazole can be helpful in preventing further infection and slowing infections that are present."

I spent a lot of time blaming myself only to find out the incredibly wet last several months and bad luck were the culprits. Lol

It was already growing out. My efforts at improving the lawn should still pay off.

Thanks to @Pete1313, @Drewmey, @g-man, and @CrackedCornCrack for your help and suggestions.

Here is how it looks now.


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## g-man (Jun 15, 2017)

Keep and eye on it. If it doesnt improve, apply a fungicide. I would use azoxy.


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## SwardEnthusiast (Jul 25, 2019)

I applied a preventative and curative broad spectrum fungicide, Strobe Pro G.

It is still improving.


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## Stuofsci02 (Sep 9, 2018)

That's looking a lot better. I am glad the grass came around...


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