# Hybrid Bermuda choices for next year renovation.



## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

I am looking into renovating my common Bermuda lawn next spring. I will be killing everything and replacing it with a hybrid Bermuda sod. I am located in NW Tennessee.

My backyard is full sun. And my front does have a small cherry blossom tree. So it will have some shade part of the day but the common Bermuda I have now doesn't have many problems growing under it. I can get a picture later if needed currently at work.

Right now I have narrowed down to 2 choices. Tiftuf or latitude 36.

Any opinions on these two varities would be nice to help me figure out what I want. Or even any other opinions on others would be nice.

Other options being tifway 419, celebration, discovery, northbridge.


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## adgattoni (Oct 3, 2017)

I am building a house and will be installing bermuda sod later this year, so I've also been researching this topic heavily.

I was originally dead set on Tiftuf, but I'm starting to change my mind. I was wanting it for it's drought tolerance and the claim that it only uses 68% of the water that tifway 419 uses. However, after researching it further I've seen some sites say that this isn't quite true. It will maintain an "acceptable" appearance on that much water, but I really don't think I want to settle for "acceptable." A lot of the pictures I've seen also look more like a lime-ish green than the deep blue green you can get with 419 (which I prefer).

Latitude 36 is probably my favorite, but it's a lot more expensive than tifway 419 (prices the builder quoted me for 419 were half of what I saw online for Lat 36).

Discovery would be very interesting, but IIRC it uses a lot more fertilizer to look great ($$$).

I also like Tifgrand for it's dark green color, but it needs to be mowed really short to keep that look. I have the mower to do it, but I'll have about 20k to maintain and I don't want to try to keep it at 0.3" all season long.


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

adgattoni said:


> I am building a house and will be installing bermuda sod later this year, so I've also been researching this topic heavily.
> 
> I was originally dead set on Tiftuf, but I'm starting to change my mind. I was wanting it for it's drought tolerance and the claim that it only uses 68% of the water that tifway 419 uses. However, after researching it further I've seen some sites say that this isn't quite true. It will maintain an "acceptable" appearance on that much water, but I really don't think I want to settle for "acceptable." A lot of the pictures I've seen also look more like a lime-ish green than the deep blue green you can get with 419 (which I prefer).
> 
> ...


Yeah tiftuf around my area is more expensive than the latitude. About a $500 difference for my 14k. Tifway 419 is by far the cheapest I've had quoted about $1000 cheaper than the latitude.


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## adgattoni (Oct 3, 2017)

Myricia said:


> adgattoni said:
> 
> 
> > I am building a house and will be installing bermuda sod later this year, so I've also been researching this topic heavily.
> ...


I've seen lat 36 at $295/pallet, whereas the builder quoted me $135/pallet for the tifway 419. I just don't think it looks that much better, especially when my neighbor's 419 will creep in over time.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Tiftuf, Tifgrand, or Lat 36 are my votes.

I like that Tiftuf greens up sooner, stays green longer, and requires less water.

If you're going to be cutting reel low, Tifgrand would be a strong contender in my book.

Lat 36 is a strong option as well, just depends what your options are.

Are you looking to source from McCurdy?


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Movingshrub said:


> Tiftuf, Tifgrand, or Lat 36 are my votes.
> 
> I like that Tiftuf greens up sooner, stays green longer, and requires less water.
> 
> ...


I plan on keeping it real low if I can get my leveling right on this lawn. I can only maintain 1.5 inch right now due to all of my small hills and holes. So I'm hoping a Harley rake in the spring will help get it pretty level.

McCurdy is my source for tiftuf. Tri-turf sod farm in Paris, TN and Winstead turf farms in Arlington, TN would be my source for the late 36. Haven't been able to source any tifgrand close by, it was one of the others I wanted when I first started looking.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Are you going to sod, plug, or sprig?


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

The plan is to sod. Suprisingly 2 of the sod farms have said they don't do plug and the third won't answer me. So I would end up having to make plugs out of sod which might not be too bad if I had enough help to pull it off.


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## M311att (May 22, 2017)

Speaking of Winstead....they are going to be a grower of Tahoma 31. I'm curious what that will look like. I live in Arlington so I hope to visit them soon.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

I know Mccurdy will sell Tiftuf sprigs because I have asked them myself. No snark here - what's the appeal of plugs? They seem like a lot of work vs sprigs.

I am open to being persuaded but never really quite understood the benefit of plugs.

UTK has a map of each county that shows which grass types grow best in that area based on both soil and climate. Is Bermuda suggested for your area?


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Movingshrub said:


> I know Mccurdy will sell Tiftuf sprigs because I have asked them myself. No snark here - what's the appeal of plugs? They seem like a lot of work vs sprigs.
> 
> I am open to being persuaded but never really quite understood the benefit of plugs.
> 
> UTK has a map of each county that shows which grass types grow best in that area based on both soil and climate. Is Bermuda suggested for your area?


My mistake I didn't see sprigging in your previous comment. Yeah McCurdy mentioned it to me and it really is cost effective. I'm more afraid of my ability with sprigging than anything. 

Honestly I know of no benefits myself to plugging other than cost vs sod but sprigging is much cheaper. It just seemed easier to myself to plugging than to sprig. Other than that I got nothing XD.

Never knew about that map. I am having some issue locating it.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

https://extension.tennessee.edu/publications/Documents/PB1576.pdf

Check page 5.

It wasn't the document I was looking for but gets the idea across.

If you want to talk sprigging, let me know.

You have full irrigation coverage?


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## jayhawk (Apr 18, 2017)

Although 419 is cheap sod....the others will look better in the thick of summer and fall (Inputs being equal). I intentionally killed mine after all the fun of trying to keep it green during those times of the year.

If one of those varieties can do w/o pgr ....I think that'd be a nice attribute


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

If you don't want to have to cut it all the time I think discovery is the slow grow Bermuda cultivar. There might be others.


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Movingshrub said:


> https://extension.tennessee.edu/publications/Documents/PB1576.pdf
> 
> Check page 5.
> 
> ...


Thanks! I'm showing up as zone 3 which is saying preferred warm season grasses.

I currently don't have full irrigation coverage. That will be done before I level out the yard. I just finished the front having to wait a little while to get the money for the back.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Understood. Expect to have trenches settle after installation.


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Yep already dealing with that now especially with all the good soaking rain I've had lately


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

What's your plan to kill off the common bermuda?


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Right now I plan on many treatments of Roundup and possibly fusilade and a little luck. I'm hoping after 3 treatments of Roundup and watering in between that it will get the majority out.

Then afterwards I'm hoping keeping it cut low will help keep the stragglers and what's from the neighbors down to a minimum. As far I can tell and know about the previous owner it's just regular common Bermuda not any kind improved variety.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

I'd suggest a mix of triclopyr, glyphosate, and fluazifop. You will need to space the apps apart by 3-4 weeks.


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## adgattoni (Oct 3, 2017)

@Movingshrub & @Bunnysarefat

Sorry for slight thread hijack - but are you guys able to get that deep blue green look that 419 gets with PGR and iron? I'm completely sold on the benefits of TifTuf, but this one aspect has been holding me back.


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## high leverage (Jun 11, 2017)

I've had better luck using Sethoxydim, Triclopyr, Mesotrione to eliminate common Bermuda than Fluazifop, Triclopyr, Glyphosate in my experiments. Still takes 2-3 apps but nothing has shown up in over 72 days. I Haven't had a chance to experiment with Diquat yet but it should provide better results than glyphosate. Of course there is always Scythe


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## high leverage (Jun 11, 2017)

Latitude all the way. Of course I'm a little biased living only 60 miles away from where it was developed. The handful of lawns we have sodded with Latitude 36 have turned out amazing. Although no customers are using reel mowers to maintain them regularly.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

adgattoni said:


> @Movingshrub & @Bunnysarefat
> 
> Sorry for slight thread hijack - but are you guys able to get that deep blue green look that 419 gets with PGR and iron? I'm completely sold on the benefits of TifTuf, but this one aspect has been holding me back.


I haven't seen them side by side but I think the colors are supposed to be similar.


This is a few weeks ago. I am only using AMS. I tried foliar iron and didn't get a noticeable color response, which led me to conclude that the turf was getting all the iron it needed from the soil.

The brown colored grass on the bottom right is me tracking mud from a deck construction project onto the grass. The grass itself isn't brown.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

high leverage said:


> Latitude all the way. Of course I'm a little biased living only 60 miles away from where it was developed. The handful of lawns we have sodded with Latitude 36 have turned out amazing. Although no customers are using reel mowers to maintain them regularly.


lat 36, tifgrand, and Tiftuf are the contenders to me, depending on where you live in the county.

To the OP, I would check out these two links's
https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=2543

and

https://tinyurl.com/y82t3gds


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## Thor865 (Mar 26, 2018)

Tifgrand if you want to maintain at .5" or lower. If above that I'd get tif tuf.


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Thanks for all the great info. After visiting the local sod farms yesterday and talking to some of the people I'm gonna go tiftuf.

Now I just got to figure out if I want to take my chance and test myself with stolonizing or just get sod.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

So so so so so much cheaper to stolonize or sprig. It just has to stay wet. Plus, who wants to install a bunch of sod?


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## Atlanticlawn (Jun 30, 2018)

Have you looked at Celebration at all ? Tough stuff and sorta shade tolerant. We have some customers that mow at 1" and it looks very good.


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## Tellycoleman (May 10, 2017)

I am so interested in this conversation.
Plus I can get sprigs from the same farm as you. Maybe we can get 
I want to renovate 
Wondering if I should start the kill this winter.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

I am just looking forward to not being the only Tiftuf stolonizing thread.


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Here's to hoping I'm not the first failed tiftuf stolonizing thread. :lol:


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Myricia said:


> Here's to hoping I'm not the first failed tiftuf stolonizing thread. :lol:


It's not a complex formula.

Get sprigs.
Spread on dirt.
Keep them from drying out
Add N regularly.
Win.

My concerns were: How do I get a good kill on the old stand? How do I control weed pressure during grow-in? How much N do I need to apply, and when? How do I keep sprigs from drying out (meaning, how much water on what intervals)?


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Yeah the water one is my most worried part. I found a pretty good guide as far as sprigging goes from University of Tennessee that should help me out on some of the basics like fertilizer and watering.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

Is it the W160-D document from the extension office? If so, that's what I used initially.


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Yep that's exactly the one. It looks decently comprehensive. I'll have to still figure out what watering times I need. I need to do a soil test again last year I had some high pH soil(around 7.5) so I need to check before committing to ammonium sulfate since it's easier and cheaper for me to get here.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

If your pH was 7.5, AMS will be fine.


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## Suburban Jungle Life (Mar 1, 2018)

AMS does lower ph but not much. You have to use a lot to see a difference so I wouldn't worry about using it.


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## Myricia (Apr 19, 2018)

Awesome! Thanks everyone.

I'm working on getting my irrigation finished in the backyard now. I got 2 zones hand dug and laid today. Sadly had to rush to get the dirt filled back in since it's going to rain the next 3 days. So I didn't get to leak check here's hoping they are good. I marked all the coupling and such so I can dig them out later to leak check them.


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## Bunnysarefat (May 4, 2017)

adgattoni said:


> @Movingshrub & @Bunnysarefat
> 
> Sorry for slight thread hijack - but are you guys able to get that deep blue green look that 419 gets with PGR and iron? I'm completely sold on the benefits of TifTuf, but this one aspect has been holding me back.


This year, I wasn't able to get the nutrient input into the lawns like I wished to, particularly iron. But I've certainly seen it have a positive effect on color when I've used it, and to a lesser degree PGR. It seems, like other bermuda types, the lower you cut the harder it is to get a deeper green look. All things considered, it's my opinion that yes, TifTuf is going to be lighter green than most of the other hybrid bermudas given the same nutritient inputs. This is probably TifTuf's greatest weakness overall as a turf grass. However, I think it's probable that it's color profile is related to some of its drought tolerance characteristics, so perhaps you can't have one without the other. Just speculating but seems possible to me.

I've confessed before on here, I don't exactly have the best color vision, but I can see the difference. A higher cut helps, but with the right inputs at the right time I think you can get it to have a nice color. All of its other characteristics I've found to be fantastic. Although, with our 3rd record setting rain month of the year I can't say I've tested its drought tolerance properly. But I've always just considered the drought tolerance a nice card to keep up your sleeve just in case a real bad year hits.


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## Movingshrub (Jun 12, 2017)

https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=421&start=180#p70561
Different Tiftuf photo.

Find some where that grows it locally next year and go look at it in person.


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