# Green's Lawn Journal



## Green

I guess it's finally time to start one of these, and keep everything in one place...


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## Green

Today, picked up 2 bags of Milorganite, 3 bags of 8-0-4 organic, 2 bags of 0-0-50, and 2 bags of SoluCal Lime...

Put it all away, and watered some plants, including the tree I planted the other day in the low-input area.

Swapped the blades on the 21" mower, cleaned the spark plug, and scraped under the deck...

Mowed the main front and most of the side front at 3.75 in perpendicular to the driveway, and hand trimmed around the hellstrip areas, and then made a mad dash to put everything away fast as it started to downpour.

Still a bit humid today...dewpoint of 69F and 61% relative humidity while I was out. Temp was 84.


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## Green

@Ware, please move this to the new lawn journal section...greatly appreciated; thanks!


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## Ware

Done. :thumbup:


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## social port

Looking forward to following, Green :thumbup:


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## pennstater2005

social port said:


> Looking forward to following, Green :thumbup:


Same!


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## Green

Thanks! More to come tomorrow...hopefully dry enough to finish mowing all areas.


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## SNOWBOB11

Would love to see some pics too @Green.


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## Green

Just finished!

Mowed 6.5K...back, side, and far half of low-input area. Trimmed in back. Put down Milorganite 5-4-0 on the upper back area at 1/2 lb of N rate...

Before this, I was mowing another lawn in the family and it took longer than expected. My cousin's family who lives out of state showed up unexpectedly for a few minutes during that, and their baby daughter with her dad starts waving while I'm on the riding mower.

Current conditions: There has been no or little rain for the past,...oh, say, week and a half. I've allowed the lawn to just reach the verge of drought stress, trying not to actually cause anything to brown out. I have had to water some areas this past week, and syringe others. Supposed to be advantageous to make your lawn work for water in the Spring, to help spur deep rooting. But there's a fine line. I've noticed some of my neighbor's lawns have the beginnings of actual drought stress...wilting, browning, etc. That is not advantageous. Fine line!


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## Green

Sprayed FAS at 0.5 to 1.5oz rate on most parts of the front. (Actually, I used 0.6oz of Ammonium Sulfate and 0.85oz of Fe per thousand square feet for some extra Nitrogen.) Went over some areas more than others if they needed more darkening.

Did a few transplants on the side.
Sprayed double rate Triclopyr on some brush and weeds.

Last night, got some rain. Rain gauge says 0.59 inch, while tuna can with ruler was closer to 3/4-inch. Not sure which is more accurate.


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## g-man

I tend to belief the wider opening (tuna can).


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## Green

g-man said:


> I tend to belief the wider opening (tuna can).


Me, too...and it's more in line with the reports of a weather station a couple of miles away (0.79 inch). Unfortunately, the one down the road is offline.


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## Green

Mowed garage side and closest half of low-input area at 3.75 in. Sprayed tree(s) for gypsy moth caterpillars (with Bt), and sprayed main front with Tenacity at 1oz/A rate and NIS.


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## Green

Started up the irrigation system (finally) since it looks like I'll need it soon. Sprayed a half gallon of milk on the upper half of the side (second and final app of the year with that). Swept the driveway, including the edges.


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## g-man

No more milk? why?


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## Green

g-man said:


> No more milk? why?


I actually wasn't planning to use it! There just happened to be a gallon and a half or so of old milk available to me at the end of April, because my grandfather was in the hospital and then rehab for a few weeks. So when I went over to mow his lawn before he came home, I took the milk with me instead of dumping it, realizing it was perfectly good lawn food. I used half of it around that time, finishing the opened gallon and opening the unopened but also expired second one (both dated mid April). I then saved the remaining half gallon for a second app, but didn't get around to using it for some time. I wrote "do not drink" on it, and shoved it way back in the fridge to keep cold all those weeks, and finally got to it this evening. Surprisingly, it didn't smell all that bad, and wasn't really lumpy of anything like the first batch was a few weeks before, so my plan worked to keep it cold. (The first bottle had actually clogged the screen on my hose end sprayer.)

Btw, I was way over the recommended rate!


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## g-man

My kids dont finish a whole gallon before it goes bad, so I end up applying it. I normally just add water and walk around the yard dumping it randomly.


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## Green

Trimmed by hand. Transplanted a few grass plants into the low-input area bare spots where last Summer's Tenacity mishap occurred. Hand-watered those and a few new grass patches in the front. Sprayed Triclopyr on a few clover areas in accordance with IPM guidelines to keep it from encroaching on main lawn areas or getting too thick.


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## Green

Yesterday: Watered the late-season overseeded part of low-input area. Then, mowed the front and upper side at 3.75 in.

Today, I set the main front and upper side zones to water for 2 hours each this morning, broken into 30 minute increments. I sprayed Tenacity at the 1oz/A rate on a part of low-input area with a Poa issue. Not sure if this is going to be the last app or not. Sprayed Serenade on the main front at the 4oz/K rate (first app of the year; I'm behind). Put down a low rate of fertilizer on the Fall-overseeded part of the side font (using 0.25-0.33 lb/K of N from 29-0-4 Ace brand fertilizer). Did a few TTTF transplants into the main front.



(Pictures are before mowing...I'll have to mow tomorrow.) Lens: 16/2.8 fisheye at f/11 on full frame.

I tried out the backpack sprayer over the past two days. It definitely helps speed things up. I bought a stainless steel wand for it at the hardware store because I don't like the plastic one. I had a few rookie mistakes though...First, I got my toes wet with chemicals that first time...this thing sprays out harder than the pump sprayer, and the mist is just enough, especially with tall grass, that it can soak through your shoes! Need to invest in proper boots or something water proof, but affordable...never again do I want wet feet! Apparently the wand I bought was a bit shorter than the standard one, so that didn't help. I ended up interchanging the two stainless wands to put the longer one on the backpack sprayer, which helped a bit the next time. I also apparently tightened the lid down too far, and then had trouble opening it when I was done. Other than those things, it worked well.

Set the side front zone to water tomorrow morning with long soak intervals (1.5-2 hours each)


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## pennstater2005

Looking good @Green! I like the walk.


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## Green

pennstater2005 said:


> Looking good Green! I like the walk.


Thanks. The grass in between the stones is around 6 inches high, maintained with a string trimmer every so often for a natural look. Once in a while I use the trimmer to edge around the stones...I'm due to do it soon for the first time this year. Wanted to get a before shot.


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## pennstater2005

Is that a slope in the second picture or is that the fisheye effect?


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## Green

pennstater2005 said:


> Is that a slope in the second picture or is that the fisheye effect?


There's really not that much distortion from the lens in these shots. The sidewalk is at a mild grade; the lawn at the side of it is at a greater angle. I don't enjoy mowing on it!


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## Green

@g-man, now it's our turn without rain here...haven't had any in a week, and there's not much or any in the forecast for the upcoming week.


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## g-man

ha! we have high water on the roads from all the rain we had and will continue to have.


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## SNOWBOB11

Looks good green. The flagstone walkway looks great.


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## Green

SNOWBOB11 said:


> Looks good green. The flagstone walkway looks great.


Thanks. I need to edge along all of those hardscape areas one of these days...I've been concentrating so much on fertilizer apps (pounding the overseeded areas with N almost weekly) that I haven't had the time for that. It's been alternating cool and then warm to mildly hot here lately. Haven't had to irrigate those specific areas in the photos yet, but likely will in the near future due to the lack of rain.


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## Green

Tenacity amounts used so far this year:

Main front (non-overseed): 4 + 2 +2 +1
Main front (overseed): 4 +2 + 1

Side front: 4 + 2

Side: 4 + 2

Upper back: 4

Lower Back: 4

Low-input area - middle: 4 
Low-input area - FF end: 3 
Low-input area - infested area: 4 + 2 + 1 + 1


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## Green

Speaking of Tenacity, some people may be curious about the Tenacity schedule and rates I used last Fall (2017) that ended up killing a good amount of Triv. Here's rough rundown:

Early Sept., prior to overseeding and after a season of Velocity use: 1.75 tsp over 2.5K.

After early Sept overseed:

Oct. 1: 3-4oz rate
Oct. 14: 2-3oz blanket + 1-2 oz spot
Oct. 27: <1oz blanket + 2oz spot
Nov. 4: 2-3oz (blanket I believe)
Nov. 8: 4-6oz (spot only...but large spots)
Nov. 16: 3-4oz spot only

I may have gone a bit over the limit for the year in the spots. It's easy to do, and hard to estimate a precise rate for spot sprays. Also, there wasn't much rain during this.


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## llO0DQLE

I don't think I've ever seen your lawn over at ATY. Looks great!


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## Green

llO0DQLE said:


> I don't think I've ever seen your lawn over at ATY. Looks great!


Thanks! I've hardly ever posted photos there, and never had a reno thread.
----------------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday, mowed the upper side and the low-input area and continued trimming. Hand watered/syringed some areas in the front.

Day before, mowed the back, trimmed/edged in the back, and planted plugs in the front (main front).

The lower back mows nicely at 4-4.5 inches with the mower set to the top setting of 3.75 in. To the back of the photo is the lower side, and the low-input area is to the left:


The lower back (TTTF/KBG) again. The lower side (TTTF/PR/KBG/FF) is the slightly darker area to the left. It was sprayed twice so far with PGR. At the extreme left corner of the photo is the neighbor's yard. They finally started having it cut and fertilized last year!


The lower side. Some of the lighter patches are Triv. The one near the tree is fine fescue, which was planted on purpose. I'm currently using Tenacity on this area.


After edging some of the sidewalk stones using the string trimmer:


Comparing un-edged and edged stones:


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## pennstater2005

That's some 3-D striping going on there Green! Nice work. Do you push mow 15k? If so......damn!


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## Green

pennstater2005 said:


> That's some 3-D striping going on there Green! Nice work. Do you push mow 15k? If so......damn!


Yes, I do. And the striping is *inadverdant* (get the pun?). Apparently, the mower actually cuts a fraction of an inch higher or lower in the lower back when it's done in that direction, depending on which way I'm going (North-South vs South-North). I think that's what you're seeing. Thanks for the comment.


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## pennstater2005

Green said:


> pennstater2005 said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's some 3-D striping going on there Green! Nice work. Do you push mow 15k? If so......damn!
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I do. And the striping is *inadverdant* (get the pun?). Apparently, the mower actually cuts a fraction of an inch higher or lower in the lower back when it's done in that direction, depending on which way I'm going (North-South vs South-North). I think that's what you're seeing.
Click to expand...

I have 15k and only lasted one season pushing it. Although, I will say I preferred the look of the push mower versus the rider I have now.


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## Green

pennstater2005 said:


> I have 15k and only lasted one season pushing it. Although, I will say I preferred the look of the push mower versus the rider I have now.


To be honest with you, it's not easy sometimes. But KT tape helps!


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## pennstater2005

Green said:


> pennstater2005 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have 15k and only lasted one season pushing it. Although, I will say I preferred the look of the push mower versus the rider I have now.
> 
> 
> 
> To be honest with you, it's not easy sometimes. But KT tape helps!
Click to expand...

I'm a physical therapist assistant so know all too well about KT tape! I don't need it quite yet but imagine it's coming soon


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## Green

pennstater2005 said:


> I'm a physical therapist assistant so know all too well about KT tape! I don't need it quite yet but imagine it's coming soon


Cool. I've been using it on the rotator cuff area. I forgot the name of the muscle that gets fatigued. It's one of the small ones back there, right in the depression where the scapula rotates.

My sitting ergonomics are terrible. So, I just bought a professional audio stand to use as a podium for my textbook when studying at the computer. Sitting has been killing my hamstrings and creating lower back pain for over a year, and being so close to the screen is killing my eyes (I'm studying for entry into school to become an eye doctor). This way I can stand and reduce sitting strain and eyestrain. I've been doing stretches, but may need physical therapy, as it's hard to totally figure everything out myself. So, when I went to the doctor for the tick bites, I got a prescription for physical therapy as well. Now I just hope my insurance will cover it. I would like to get back into weightlifting like I used to do years ago, but can't do much with it until this back thing is sorted out. On occasion, I've been able to almost totally get rid of the pain by making up my own stretches. But then if I sit again for a few hours, it just comes back as things tighten up again.


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## social port

I agree with @pennstater2005 that a pushmowed-lawn looks better than using a rider.
@Green the lawn is looking very good!


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## pennstater2005

Green said:


> pennstater2005 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm a physical therapist assistant so know all too well about KT tape! I don't need it quite yet but imagine it's coming soon
> 
> 
> 
> Cool. I've been using it on the rotator cuff area. I forgot the name of the muscle that gets fatigued. It's one of the small ones back there, right in the depression where the scapula rotates.
> 
> My sitting ergonomics are terrible. So, I just bought a professional audio stand to use as a podium for my textbook when studying at the computer. Sitting has been killing my hamstrings and creating lower back pain for over a year, and being so close to the screen is killing my eyes (I'm studying for entry into school to become an eye doctor). This way I can stand and reduce sitting strain and eyestrain. I've been doing stretches, but may need physical therapy, as it's hard to totally figure everything out myself. So, when I went to the doctor for the tick bites, I got a prescription for physical therapy as well. Now I just hope my insurance will cover it. I would like to get back into weightlifting like I used to do years ago, but can't do much with it until this back thing is sorted out. On occasion, I've been able to almost totally get rid of the pain by making up my own stretches. But then if I sit again for a few hours, it just comes back as things tighten up again.
Click to expand...

Between the physical ailments, studying, and you know...lawn care....you must be a busy individual!!!


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## llO0DQLE

I don't know how much experience you have with weightlifting but I would suggest strength training - squats, deadlifts, overhead presses and bench presses, pull ups (or lat pull downs) as well as YTWL exercises for your rotator cuffs, preferably with a band. Stretch tight muscles and improve mobility. Most rotator cuff, hamstring or anterior pelvic tilt issues are due to sedentary and "too much sitting at a desk" lifestyle.


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## Green

llO0DQLE said:


> I don't know how much experience you have with weightlifting but I would suggest strength training - squats, deadlifts, overhead presses and bench presses, pull ups (or lat pull downs) as well as YTWL exercises for your rotator cuffs, preferably with a band. Stretch tight muscles and improve mobility. Most rotator cuff, hamstring or anterior pelvic tilt issues are due to sedentary and "too much sitting at a desk" lifestyle.


Moderate experience...I used to do most of those exercises. Not sure what YTWL is, though. I have a pulley for the shoulder stretching...need to get the exercise bands....which can also be used to stretch the hamstrings.

You hit the nail on the head with everything. All of the above, but I need to ease into it, and am hoping my insurance will let me get some physical therapy sessions to speed up the progress and teach me some new ideas. The lower back/hamstring tightness was caused by sitting as well. I never had the problem until I started sitting a lot last year. The good news is that at my age (32) long-term damage should be avoidable with proper stretching, strength training, and good habits (which is why I got the audio stand). I'm planning to give up sitting at the computer, except for really short periods. I can actually feel everything tighten up the longer I sit.

Sitting in front of the computer is really bad for the eyes, too. A lot of people don't know that. I use strain-preventing glasses to relieve visual stress and prevent visual deterioration, but it's not foolproof...you still create more of the problem if you keep doing the behavior...sitting in front of a screen too long. That's why I believe in standing part of the time, for the eyes and body. The whole body just isn't designed to sit for long periods (longer than 10 minutes a few times a day, in my view). The best way to counterbalance visual strain is simply to get outside and away from screens...similar to the musculoskeletal problems.

So many people don't even know they have these self-created problems, and then they wonder why they have pain!


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## llO0DQLE

Look up Athlean X on YouTube and watch anything related to shoulders and rotator cuffs. I fixed my hunchback posture and rounded shoulders with all the knowledge I gained. Search Allan Thrall as well.


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## Green

llO0DQLE said:


> Look up Athlean X on YouTube and watch anything related to shoulders and rotator cuffs. I fixed my hunchback posture and rounded shoulders with all the knowledge I gained. Search Allan Thrall as well.


Thanks. I used to watch that channel! Getting reacquainted is in order....before I develop that posture.

Never heard of Allan, but just looked him up. That's some beard!


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## llO0DQLE

Yeah Allan has a video about rounded shoulders and shows some stretches and the YTWL exercises.


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## Green

Update:

Have had to really start watering due to lack of rain the past week and a half.

Sunday morning June 10th: main front and upper side irrigation zones for 2 hours each to get about in inch.

Monday morning: Side front: 2 hours total for about in inch.

Thursday (yesterday): Side front again, but only for 48 min total (all of these were using cycle and soak)
Upper back for the first time (60 min total...somewhat less than in inch. Planning to repeat again Monday.)
Also watered the lower side, using an impact sprinkler in two positions. It was at the wilting point, which is bad for new grass, but I got to it in time. Put down a half inch or so. Also hand-watered the area near the patio that dries out quickly.

Friday morning: lower back zone (including the lower side again, which is part of it). Two hours for about an inch. First time that area was watered all year.

Plan is to hit the low-input area this afternoon.
*Update: watered the first 2.5-3K of the low-input area to about 1/2-inch. Just finished around 9PM. I might do a bit more tomorrow, but I'm not doing the entire low-input area...only the worst/driest parts.


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## llO0DQLE

Are you still using the Toro heads or did you switch back to the Rainbird?


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## Green

llO0DQLE said:


> Are you still using the Toro heads or did you switch back to the Rainbird?


I'm still using the Toros. I have two of them in the hellstrip areas. I haven't gotten a chance to do another tin can test yet. I'll be out there doing supplemental off-day hand-watering tomorrow, though, since the heat is coming. And my neighbors watered about an hour ago and I got some overspray from that.


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## Green

Let's see. Yesterday morning, watered zones 1 and 2 for 80 min. each, and zone 4 for the same. That's like 2/3-inch and almost an inch I believe. Then, trimmed in the front and on one side, and mowed front and back in the evening.

Today, did some hand watering/syringing (including the hellstrips and area by the patio and last year's side front overseed area), shrub watering, and sprayed PGR at 0.3oz rate on front and side. Also attempted to spray Bt into higher trees. I didn't have the right equipment for the job. I ended up breathing in some of the spray apparently. It only takes a tiny bit and you'd never know you did it...until you find yourself coughing later that night.

I've been putting off the Serenade because there's a chance of rain tomorrow (hoping it actually rains for once).

I helped a neighbor yesterday with mowing and watering advice. The other neighbor (back) is watering for the first time I've seen in years, and the fertilizer he had put down last week is turning it dark green.


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## Greenrebellion

Just curious...don't you want the Serenade down before a rain event? For example, on cherry trees Serenade has to be down BEFORE a wetting event to have any benefit against things like Cherry Leaf Spot. I imagine similar principles apply with grass. I use Nu-Film P as a sticker/spreader on my lawn and fruit trees and it can withstand about 1" of rain per the label.


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## Green

Greenrebellion said:


> Just curious...don't you want the Serenade down before a rain event? For example, on cherry trees Serenade has to be down BEFORE a wetting event to have any benefit against things like Cherry Leaf Spot. I imagine similar principles apply with grass. I use Nu-Film P as a sticker/spreader on my lawn and fruit trees and it can withstand about 1" of rain per the label.


I can't answer that directly, but the issue with rain is that it washes it off the grass, and then I'd have to reapply. I'm trying to avoid that. Still not sure if it's actually going to rain tonight or not. It sprinkled for 5 min around 8PM and that was it. There's a chance of thunderstorms between now and 2AM. In any case, I didn't do the Serenade as it was much too windy.

------------------------

This morning, watered side front zone for 26x4 minutes. Continued watering shrubs. Got the front done.


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## Green

Watered the back next to the shed (including plants), corner at the front and side of the house, and the upper front hill (including mulch bed) this afternoon. Then sprayed Serenade on the front and lower back, including watered areas.


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## Green

Mowed side and low-input area. Put down approx 30 lbs of Protene 8-0-4 fertilizer on low-input area. 3 lbs of .15% Dimension 19-0-3 on overseeded part of main front, and 1.3 lbs of 0-0-7 on the non-overseeded part (1.75 lb/M). Sprayed roughly 0.1 lb/M Nitrogen rate of 24-8-16 Miracle Gro with NIS on overseeded part of side front (which still has red thread spots). Will set sprinkler zones to water roughly a half inch on the main front for tomorrow morning.

2 neighbors had irrigation installations started today. One was an extension of an existing system, and the other a new installation. There has been essentially no rain for 2.5 weeks now. I hope our climate isn't morphing over time to one with a Summer dry season...but that's what it seems like. Most people don't have irrigation in CT, but it has become a lot more common as people have had it installed over time. It's going to be tough to grow cool-season grass in this area without dormancy if this weather pattern continues every year...unless you water.

Edit: 12:30AM: Just went to the garage to set the sprinkler system. My neighbor one-upped me...he was actually out in his yard near the road adjusting his sprinklers. I think he has a little bit of lawn nut in him from his father, otherwise he probably wouldn't be doing that at that time of night. I yelled to him about the lack of rain and having to water, (asserting my hardcore lawn-nut personality in the process!) Set the main front zones to 20x4 min and upper back to 30x4 min. Half an inch and possibly over an inch respectively.


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## jessehurlburt

I feel you Green. We had such a nice spring here, too. Hoping Saturday gives us a nice soaking. I've been dragging hoses trying to keep my seeded areas from this spring going.


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## Green

jessehurlburt said:


> I feel you Green. We had such a nice spring here, too. Hoping Saturday gives us a nice soaking. I've been dragging hoses trying to keep my seeded areas from this spring going.


National weather service is saying a 60% chance of rain, estimated 1/10th to 1/4 inch, and possibly more where thunderstorms occur. Northern CT is now abnormally dry. I think we are, too, actually.


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## Green

I have an event to attend tomorrow (friend getting married) and probably won't be doing lawn stuff until Monday at the earliest. The PGR is helping to extend mowing time.

I did a lot of cleanup today...blowing, trim/edge by hand with clippers for a perfect edge, sweeping driveway and road, pulling weeds from both places, mulch and hand watering near the mailbox including hellstrips and many areas in the back. Also watered non-Poa infested far part of low input area. Lots of perfectionism today for that extra level.

Also slightly pruned lower branches on the tree in the main front.

This morning, zones 1, 2, and 4 were set for 20x4, and for tomorrow AM, zone 5 for the same.


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## Green

Yet another impending rain disappeared today. It was an 80% chance of 1/4 to 1/2 inch yesterday, now a 15% chance of light showers. Tomorrow was 80% too, and is now down to 50%. It's going on 3 weeks without measureable rain. The grass is going partially brown even to a degree in regularly irrigated sections. I inspected it, and not much is due to disease, either. It's just going into partial dormancy from heat and dryness. I put down some fertilizer this morning thinking it was going to rain. 0.25 lb/M of N from Scotts 32-0-12 on the upper part of the side. This is nuts.


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## Green

Finally, rain!!!! It's been almost 3 weeks.

I got down about 1/4 bag of 6-2-0 Milo mixed with 19.5 tbsp of Boron on the low-input area just in time. The golfers also finished right before the rain as well.

I watered in yesterday's fertilizer before. Couldn't wait for rain.


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## Green

Just came in about an hour ago...
Fixed an area near the sidewalk that was dug up by the surveyors in our area. They dug up the same areas last month. If anyone has advice on fixing a twice dug area and getting it to re-root during a week of 90 degree heat, let me know!

So far, I repositioned the turf, added native soil to level a couple of holes, added seed to a bare spot, threw down a bit of fungicide (Headway G) on the spots, and top dressed with a handful of peat. I'll go out and do the first watering using a can right before bed, after the dew starts up.

Also mowed the lower back and lower side, and closest half of the low input area.


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## Green

Mowed rest of low input, plus back and side front. Fixed area near sidewalk which got disturbed again today, including adding a bit more fungicide. Fixed the tripod holes, etc. Sprayed PGR on the back. 0.3 oz on the upper back, and 0.2 oz rate on the lower back. First time ever doing PGR on the lower back.


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## Green

Today, sprayed Hydretain ES Plus II on the semi dormant half of the low input area. Then sprayed 3 way herbicide on the weed salad in that area.


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## Green

Finally, real rain! 1.37 inches this morning. It dried out and I was home, so I snuck in a mow of the main front, which was overgrown. Now it's raining hard again.

Edit: got another 2.88 inches later in the day, so that was just over 2 inches total.


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## Green

Lawn looked and felt good to walk on this evening, thanks to the rain. No crunching. It was great to watch the lightening bugs. There were so many of them tonight.

I mixed and spot sprayed some Velocity at the 4oz rate (1.42g in a half gallon of water in this case) on just a few areas to try to burn out the Triv spots this week in the heat.

Then sprayed Serenade at a high rate (possibly over the 5oz rate) on the front, minus the Velocity areas.

Of course, I also used the watering can to water that dug up portion right by the sidewalk that I fixed twice this past week, and will have to water it several times a day over the coming days, due to the heat. 87-100 degrees all week; today was the first day.


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## Green

Hand watered the hellstrip area and damaged area, and syringed the front hill while I was at it.

Watered the closest third of the low-input area (probably overwatered, but oh well).

Finished spraying Velocity. I'm done with that, at least for the Summer. Just one app on a few spots. I actually sprayed some of the same spots again today, so we will see what the exteeme heat does to those areas tomorrow.

In the dark, I mixed some fertilizer and Boron (3 tablespoons per thousand) and applied it. On the side, I used Milorganite 6-2-0 at 0.25 N rate, and on the main front I used Protene 8-0-4 at the 0.5 N rate. Sprayed Serenade on the back, side, and low-input area that had just been watered, as well as the front areas that I had watered or syringed. Did not even measure it...just calculated roughly in my head and poured whatever fraction of the bottle I needed to get slightly over the 4oz rate. Will set irrigation for a half inch for the front and upper side zones to water in the morning tomorrow. Supposed to be around 100 tomorrow.

If I have time, I want to overseed a shaded area tomorrow. Part of me just wants to experiment to see how fast TTTF can germinate in high temps!


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## Green

97 right now with a heat index of 109. Dew point is 73 and humidity is 46%. Even though that's not crazy humidity, it's still pretty hot outside right now, and I was starting to get sweaty after 10 min with long pants and sleeves and hat to protect from the sun. We only get a few days each year this hot here in the coastal Northeast, typically...not like in the inland South where you might have a whole week straight or more near 100 and humid. The grass is showing some heat stress, even with the extra watering this AM in the front.

Sprayed Serenade at 2oz rate on front and upper side.


----------



## Green

7/2/18: Put down 0.5 lb rate of N in the form of Protene 8-0-4 fertilizer mixed with Boron at the 3 tablespoon per thousand rate on the back and the part of the garage side that is on zone 4. I set the irrigation to water in the morning for about a half inch...lower back zone for an hour total, and upper back/garage side zone for 88 minutes total (the latter, I believe is close to one inch of water).

The upper back is almost completely recovered from the mouse/vole damage from the early Spring when there was snow.


----------



## Green

This AM, watered upper back zone for 88 min and lower back zone for 1 hour, 1 inch and 0.5 inches respectively according to last year's irrigation measurement.

Finished my fertilizer finally! Protene 8-0-4 at half pound N rate (and therefore quarter pound K rate) on the side front, mixed with Boron at the 3 Tbs rate. I'm excited about that 2:1 N:K ratio because it let me get a little Potassium down to help with the heat stress. I'll take the Potassium this week, instead of the Phosphorus that's in Milo.

Also watered hellstrips, edges, and some parts of the main front as well as near the patio by hand and with a sprinkler. It was looking a bit brown where the new grass was planted last year.

Dew point was 77 with 91 degree temps (humidity in the high 50 to low 60 percent range) and therefore heat index of 108 (not as high as the other day)...felt like a normal Summer day in Florida. Apparently the other day in Burlington Vermont when it hit 99, it never got below 80 at night for the low that day. Man, it's rare to have a low that high in New England, let alone VT. Speaking of FL weather, some parts of CT got pop-up thunder showers this afternoon, but we only got thunder for about a half hour with the sun out the whole time.

Disease weather!


----------



## social port

Green said:


> Disease weather!


For the past month, I've been saying that every morning when I look out the window. 
I think we are all hot, humid, and bothered right now.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Disease weather!
> 
> 
> 
> For the past month, I've been saying that every morning when I look out the window.
> I think we are all hot, humid, and bothered right now.
Click to expand...

Yeah, thankfully the Brown Patch isn't too bad right now. a little here and there. Keeping an eye on it. Also have red thread and at least one other unknown disease that I get every year in combination the brown patch. Taking a break from going nuts with the Serenade. Will reapply this weekend.

---------------------------

The gypsy moths have been starting to hatch this past week.

This morning, watered the side front zone that I applied fertilizer to yesterday, for 2 hours total. Hand watered the damaged spots around 4PM with the watering can.

The overseeded areas are ok, but have some browning. I think it'll mostly recover fine. I'm going to throw a little more water on it tomorrow morning to hold it over until the rain Friday. Set zones 1 and 2 to 20 and 25 min, respectively. Just a fraction of an inch of water...trying to conserve, and let the rain do the deep watering.


----------



## Green

7/5/18: Mowed the lower back, side, and parts of the low-input area that needed it most and had the least dormancy. Very humid at the end of the day, and the insects tried to get me as I sweated.

7/6/18: We were forecast to get 1/2 to 3/4 inch of rain today, and it ended up being 1/20th inch, so I set zones 1 and 2 to water for at least a full inch tomorrow morning...1 hour on zone 1 and 76 minutes on zone 2.

Also pulled weeds from the front mulch area.

7/7/18: Mowed front, sides, and upper back.

7/8/18: Sprayed PGR at .3oz rate on front and side plus a light touch up app on the upper back corner that is growing faster than everywhere else just like it did last year. Also went a bit lower on the side hill, because as usual, its growth is slower than other places and it's a disease prone area. Hopefully I sprayed enough on the first two strips of the front hill starting near the driveway. I can always add more if needed.

Gypsy moths are laying eggs now. I accidentally let the damaged area near the sidewalk dry out. It looked fine yesterday after not watering but looked bad today. I watered it twice, as well as watering hellstrip snd corners today. Also briefly watered the side hill with a rotor fitted an 8 gpm nozzle and attched to the hose. I don't think much water got put down though because of how short the time was (15 min or so).

Set zone 3 to water for 2 hours and zone 5 for 80 min tomorrow morning. Will have to hand water in the back tomorrow, as we're in the high 80s and low 90s each day with no rain in tge forecast yet again.


----------



## Green

Hand watered in the back behind deck, near stairs, near patio, parts of upper back that were seeded in early Spring, and opposite side of upper back lawn away from sprinklers.

Also watered the worst parts of the low input area that were most dormant, at about an inch of water. The 8gpm nozzle didn't take too long in each spot, even if the hose didn't quite supply that fast. Each time, I had double the amount of water down I expected.

Set upper back zone to water 60 min total, once per hour for 15 min, for tomorrow morning. Remembered to move the grill this time.


----------



## Green

Did more supplemental watering...main front, lower and mid side and a bit of the back near it, parts of hellstrip areas, low input area. I don't like watering in the afternoon. Even using the blower after combined with sunlight and wind, it did not 100% dry by 8PM. But it has been over 2 weeks since we have had any rain, except for 1/20th inch last week.

Dry periods really show you the areas where your irrigation system doesn't put down enough water. And reno or overseed areas may need extra off cycle waterings. And of course, I have 6.5K without irrigation, too. First we went 2 weeks with no rain, then 3 the next time, and now we are over 2 with almost none.

Put down 1/4 to 1/2 inch in most of those areas. Set zones 1 and 2 to water for an hour each tomorrow. Will hand water all hellstrip areas tomorrow as well.


----------



## g-man

What about letting it go dormant?


----------



## Green

g-man said:


> What about letting it go dormant?


It's partially dormant, especially in the low input area. There's no way I could water enough to keep everything green and growing at normal rate with this weather. No way would I want to go into full dormancy.

I'm trying to keep the areas that were overseeded last year alive and prevent loss, and trying to keep the mature lawn areas mostly green (which seems to require less water than new areas). The back yard is pretty easy. It's the front that bakes. Both areas have irrigation, so it could be a lot worse like it used to be before that.

I had 4 inch soil temps up to 93F a foot from the pavement.

But there are a lot of interspersed brown blades in most places, so the grass is definitely partially dormant. The low input area already has some mostly dormant sections. Experience says it will come back. I'll have to get some photos next time, to show the dormancy. I also try not to let the TTTF areas (most of the yard) get too brown, because it's not real good at dormancy. It's all a balance. Just wish the rain would help out.


----------



## Green

Sprayed the 3 way with Quinclorac on most of the weeds I could find in the low input area, including a few crabgrass near the edge, Virginia Copperleaf, oxalis, spurge, an occasional dandelion, plantain, or thistle, etc. Mixed using MSO as surfactant, a bit over an ounce in 2 gallons of solution. That stuff is messy.

Also sprayed Serenade at the 4oz rate on the main front, side, and most of the lower back.

Not going to keep up 2 threads anymore. Everything will switch to here.


----------



## Green

Tested side front sprinkler zone by doing an audit with a bunch of cups. It didn't even require waiting until the end of the hour to see that the two heads near the sidewalk were too low and the water was getting caught in the grass.

After asking some questions and watching some videos on how to do it, I raised one of those heads. Hoping I got the height right, and not too high.

Neighbor put down their 2nd app of chlorantraniliprole with fert. I think they overapplied...0.75 to 1 lb of N, and probably are up to 8-12 lbs of product per thousand for the year by my rough calculations.

"Chemlawn" came to neighbor's house. Guy was new, and asked me a question, so I asked him a couple of questions. He was putting down granular fert, and had to look up what grub prevention they use, but said Merit. Not sure if they did on my neighbor's in June, because they sprayed, so I doubt it.


----------



## Green

Hand watered brown areas and hellstrip areas in front and back, and mowed low input area, including the weed city, and then watered the fall seeded area.

Some weeds were wilting a bit from the herbicide 2 days ago. Crabgrass and oxalis seem unaffected. I never expected the oxalis to be affected, but I'm hoping the crabgrass is just taking longer. If not, I'll spray again next week.

Trimmed.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water an hour each tomorrow starting at 5AM, around a half inch.


----------



## Green

Watered side hill about 2/3 inch, and mowed all other parts of the front and parts of upper back that were in need. Also hand watered other brown areas in front.


----------



## g-man

How is the adjusted sprinkler head performing?


----------



## Green

g-man said:


> How is the adjusted sprinkler head performing?


I am still up and we are getting moderate and hard rain after over two weeks with little to none...which is good, but hopefully the rain is not so violent that the area has the soil washed away where I built it up around the head to get back to the original grade (now that the grass isn't rooted yet to hold the soil).

I tested it yesterday, and the stream is totally unblocked. I don't think I can say that for any of my other heads (but on most it's very minor and not a real issue). There is at least that other one nearby that needs help too, but I think I'm going to swap it for a 6-inch model so I don't have to raise it above the sidewalk grade like the other one. Keep it away from my neighbor's mower and edger blade that way, and snowblowers in the Winter!

My spray heads in the hellstrip are also partially impeded; I'll have to fix that later this year when it's cooler if different nozzles don't do the trick.


----------



## Green

Got 1/3 inch of rain last night!


----------



## Green

Watered hellstrip area and browning area on side front where sprinklers weren't hitting.

Mowed lower back in most areas, a bit of the lower side, and string trimmed the upper side instead of mowing since it's drought stressed and I don't want to stress it by taking off too much. Tedious but should help.

Put down low rate of fertilizer on several areas. 6.5 lbs of SOP (1/2 lb per thousand rate of K) from 0-0-50 on low input area, and 4 lbs of 8-0-4 on the side (0.215 lb of N and 0.1 lb of K rate per thousand).

Still using the watering can on the damaged areas by the sidewalk at least once per day.

Edit: Headway G was put down on the area near the sprinkler I raised on that day. I like to use a fungicide on areas that have to be kept moist almost 24/7 in the middle of the Summer.


----------



## Green

Finally some major rain for the browning grass.


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> Finally some major rain for the browning grass.


Hey neighbor....yeah I got over an inch in North Haven....kinda ironic on the day I got my irrigation system installed lol


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Finally some major rain for the browning grass.
> 
> 
> 
> Hey neighbor....yeah I got over an inch in North Haven....kinda ironic on the day I got my irrigation system installed lol
Click to expand...

Hi. Yeah, you're definitely nearby. Just getting a downpour here now. Should be coming your way in a few minutes. I bet it's near an inch now here too. Haven't been able to go outside to check as it's too wet. Was a half inch a couple hours ago.

Enjoy the irrigation. You will need it yet.


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> JDgreen18 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Finally some major rain for the browning grass.
> 
> 
> 
> Hey neighbor....yeah I got over an inch in North Haven....kinda ironic on the day I got my irrigation system installed lol
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hi. Yeah, you're definitely nearby. Just getting a downpour here now. Should be coming your way in a few minutes. I bet it's near an inch now here too. Haven't been able to go outside to check as it's too wet. Was a half inch a couple hours ago.
Click to expand...

Im going by the weather station at the high school which in like a half a mile from me...Im so excited about the irrigation....no more dragging hoses


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Im going by the weather station at the high school which in like a half a mile from me...Im so excited about the irrigation....no more dragging hoses


1.3 inches so far here.

I had two more neighbors add irrigation this past month...they couldn't take it anymore with the short term lack of rain over and over, as one of them told me.

I still drag hoses. Just not nearly as much. It was unmanageable before.


----------



## Green

Mowed back, side, and side front.

Sprayed PGR on upper back at half rate and lower back at around 1/3 rate maybe.

Sprayed crabgrass and other stuff around upper back and low input area.

Set side front zone to water for 1 hour tomorrow morning. Will have to supplement with hose end sprinkler.


----------



## Green

Supplemented the watering this AM as mentioned, and ended up putting down near an inch, which was probably too much.

I resisted the temptation to water the main front. The KBG and TTTF components of the front northern mix are still doing ok. The PR is not, especially any used in last year's overseed. It's got a lot of brown.

Went to a local event on the athletic fields, and man did they look and feel good under the feet. Like early Fall grass. They must be watering almost every day and using fungicides and Milo. Grass seemed to be at least 3.5 inches high, maybe more.

Mowed 9,000 square feet - the main front and low input area (had to mow over some dormant areas due to weeds, but was careful not to trample all over it haphazardly, and the 21 inch mower is fairly light). Sprayed Serenade on all irrigated portions of the yard. Rain is expected in about 24 hours. Hopefully that's enough time to let it sit on the grass.


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## Green

7/22/18: Got at least 0.8 in of rain today.


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## Green

Here are some pictures showing the current condition of the low-input area as of the other day:









Most of that non-grass stuff to the right is clover. Not a big deal. I'm not going to kill it all, as it helps with Summer stress.

Backing up about 30 feet toward the most drought-stressed area:










The rest of that area from the other side:









On the left, are a bunch of wild plants like Goldenrod, Mugwart, etc. The first couple of feet of grass along that side is brutal in the Summer, and I water that strip every so often so it hangs on. I planted some seed there late last Fall (really late). It's really stressed. The soil is sandy, gets sun in July for a lot of the day, there are tree roots, and most of the grass is fine fescue. I've started using Tall Fescue where nothing else will grow. I also overseeded and planted plugs in the entire area plus more not shown in the photo a few years back. This would be a good area to use Humic Acid on.

Backing up 30 feet or so:









Backing up 15 feet or so:








The dark green grass plugs are TTTF plugs I planted last Fall. I'll add more this year.
The rest is a mix of KBG and fine fescue with some ryegrass as well. And some clover. These spots tend to both Summer kill and Winter kill, as well as ponding sometimes.

Backing up again and turning 90 degrees:








This is the only part of the low-input area (or entire yard actually) that I haven't yet irrigated this year (and don't think I'll need to). It came close to browning out at least once this past month. It's especially prone to ponding, and often has a Poa problem. Most other parts of the low-input area have been irrigated 1 to 5 times this year so far. Some of the brown to the left is due to one Velocity spray a month or so ago to try to knock down some Triv. The dead area all the way toward the background is one of the Winterkill dead spots I had due to ice. This area can't be mowed for weeks sometimes in the Fall or Spring, due to waterlogged soil.


----------



## Green

The other day, sprinkled a little moss out on the corner behind the deck.

Got another inch or so of rain yesterday. So like 1.85-2 so far. Today was dry.


----------



## Green

Around 0.3 inch of rain today measuring after dinner. I bet closer to an inch by tomorrow.

Edit: 1.1 inches total as of today, Thursday AM.


----------



## Green

Mowed front, sides, and back, except side hill which didn't need it (so 8200 square feet). Lower back and main front overgrown in spots. Mower failed to start partway through. Not sure why. Seemed like engine might have flooded. Changing spark plug did nothing. I had to let it sit 15 minutes. Hopefully not a replay of last year's issue, which needed service to fix.

Trimmed in back.

Last night, I pre soaked some Bullseye TTTF seed from 1AM until early this evening. I planted it and added a bit extra fresh seed after raking the small shaded area next to the garage corner. Added a little peat moss and a tiny bit of the thatch I raked up to cover the seed, and watered briefly. This is my first overseed of this year. I've never started this early but heard it works best in shade if you start early before mid Summer in my area. I used just a couple handfuls of seed on an area about 4 feet wide.

Exhausted.


----------



## Powhatan

Green said:


> Exhausted.


It's a labor of love we do :thumbup:


----------



## Rucraz2

Green said:


> Supplemented the watering this AM as mentioned, and ended up putting down near an inch, which was probably too much.
> 
> I resisted the temptation to water the main front. The KBG and TTTF components of the front northern mix are still doing ok. The PR is not, especially any used in last year's overseed. It's got a lot of brown.
> 
> Went to a local event on the athletic fields, and man did they look and feel good under the feet. Like early Fall grass. They must be watering almost every day and using fungicides and Milo. Grass seemed to be at least 3.5 inches high, maybe more.
> 
> Mowed 9,000 square feet - the main front and low input area (had to mow over some dormant areas due to weeds, but was careful not to trample all over it haphazardly, and the 21 inch mower is fairly light). Sprayed Serenade on all irrigated portions of the yard. Rain is expected in about 24 hours. Hopefully that's enough time to let it sit on the grass.


I went to a softball tourney my daughter played in yesterday at some new sports complex that was built a few yrs ago. Boy that was some soft dark grass! Looked and felt amazing. Im going to get in touch with who did the work to see what seed they used. It was cut around 2-2.5 from what I could tell. I would have to say after being on Target field a few times in Minneapolis if they reel mowed this. It would have it beat.


----------



## Green

Got 0.1 to 0.2 inch of rain, in part last night, and in part this evening.


----------



## Green

Tiny bit more rain this morning.

Mowed the top of the side hill, part of the main front that borders the side, the upper side, and about half the low input area.


----------



## Green

Finished mowing low input area using side discharge again. Sprayed PGR at 0.3 oz rate on front and sides. Did some misc. spraying including Triclopyr on clovers, etc., and three way with Quinclorac on crabgrass at the border of upper back. Pulled up some other crabgrass.

Last night (not evening), watered side front zone for 46 min. Addjsted sprinkler coverage before that.

So it's been 4 days since I started soaking the seed. I planted it on day 2. We will see if I get germination, since I only lightly raked the area, which had 2-2.5 lbs per thousand of 0.15% Dimension applied on June 1st. I had forgotten about the pre-M, and didn't rake especially aggressively.


----------



## Green

Got around 0.16 inch of rain from both light rain and a quick tropical downpour. My rain sensor did not trip from this rain amount.

The part of the state with the highest dewpoint temperature today was North Stamford, which came in with a dewpoint of 80F. It was 75 here. Temps were in the mid 80s.


----------



## Green

Mowed the back, side, main front, front hill, and a tiny bit of the side front near the driveway corner when it was still sunny and 99F heat index. Took a lot of breaks for water and even a luttle ice cream once. I guess there was some rebound from the PGR in the last 6 days. Unfortunately, the lawn was a bit crunchy again...I had decided not to water this week due to impending rain.

It started raining soon after. The first half inch came in a half hour. Hopefully that inch an hour rate actually soaks in. The rain sensor did trip during that.

Lots of quick and moderate length intense showers. Right now, the sun is partially out and it's still raining.

Total was 1.37 inch. Basically an inch per hour.

Looks like my neighbor sprayed his CG with the Tenacity I gave him last year. It's starting to whiten.


----------



## Green

Hundredth reply post in this thread!!

Got another 0.15 in or so of rain last night.

I have germination in the overseeded area near the garage corner! I did not water it today, hopefully not a mistake, but checked it. Hoping the pre-M doesn't screw it up...I may try to get some humic acid down on the area next week, as I hear that may help deplete the residual chemicals.

Neighbor's CG is whitening nicely from his Tenacity spray. The real test will be if it affects the Zoysia.


----------



## Green

Got another 0.45 inch of rain this morning. While drought stress/dormancy remains in many areas, there is no hint of actual drought remaining.

Still pulling up pigweed and some Virginia Copperleaf. Sedges are the next thing that's been happening lately.


----------



## Powhatan

Green said:


> Sedges are the next thing that's been happening lately.


Mine have been appearing near the lawn edges, nowhere near I would consider a moisture retaining low spot area, very curious.


----------



## Green

Powhatan said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sedges are the next thing that's been happening lately.
> 
> 
> 
> Mine have been appearing near the lawn edges, nowhere near I would consider a moisture retaining low spot area, very curious.
Click to expand...

Edges with sedges...

I pulled a yellow nutsedge plant out today in the North side mulch area near the house, right where the mulch meets the grass that borders the walkway. It was around 8 inches, complete with a seedhead. I almost didn't see it, but noticed it while pulling out some small crabgrass plants. It doesn't seem like they have the "nut" part this time of the year. Or maybe I'm the nut who is pulling them out.

I haven't seen the Kyllinga near the rose bush yet this year, but maybe it's too early. It looks like grass until it throws up really cool looking star shaped seedheads. I did spray around that area last year with Prosedge, so maybe that did something, even though I removed the seedheads and sedge blades first and only stalks were left when I sprayed.

By the way, since we've been talking texture lately, my TTTF in between the walkway in that area is pretty thick...the blades are at least 1/4 inch wide in some cases. It's only 2 cultivars...Bullseye and Firecracker LS. No other Tall Fescue has ever been planted there.


----------



## Green

Sprayed PGR. Used 0.3 oz of it on each section of the back. I can't believe the dormant spots in the lower back even after all this rain the past 2 weeks...I should double check to make sure there aren't insects.

Had to water zone 2 for 46 min, after spraying shampoo. Also did that on some other areas like hellstrips. It seems to have helped the water soak in immediately after.

I discovered another head that's blocked by the grass...so this has been contributing to the heat stress in the front. I now have 2 more rotors and 2 sprays that need attention. Never ends.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for an hour each tomorrow morning, and will likely supplement it again with the hose due to the blocked head.

Soeaking of the hose, after I sprayed the soap, I washed the mower bag. Toward the end, the hose broke. Always something.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> By the way, since we've been talking texture lately, my TTTF in between the walkway in that area is pretty thick...the blades are at least 1/4 inch wide in some cases. It's only 2 cultivars...Bullseye and Firecracker LS. No other Tall Fescue has ever been planted there.


Interesting. I've noticed that some of my TTTF has wide blades as well. They don't look great when their right beside their thinner counterparts.
I'm hoping that some of the newer varieties have thinner blades.


----------



## jessehurlburt

Green said:


> The real test will be if it affects the Zoysia.


Zoysia in CT?


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> By the way, since we've been talking texture lately, my TTTF in between the walkway in that area is pretty thick...the blades are at least 1/4 inch wide in some cases. It's only 2 cultivars...Bullseye and Firecracker LS. No other Tall Fescue has ever been planted there.
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting. I've noticed that some of my TTTF has wide blades as well. They don't look great when their right beside their thinner counterparts.
> I'm hoping that some of the newer varieties have thinner blades.
Click to expand...

Yeah, and those are top notch varieties, too.

I tried "Summer" in the front last year as part of tge mix. It's supposed to be really fine. So far, yes, but nothing extraordinary, like fine fescue or anything.


----------



## Green

jessehurlburt said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> The real test will be if it affects the Zoysia.
> 
> 
> 
> Zoysia in CT?
Click to expand...

Yes, he's battling that and bamboo. #FloridaproblemsinCT

Looks like another neighbor sprayed Tenacity. I gave some to two last year.


----------



## Green

Did more watering...supplemented brown part of zone 2 with impact sprinkler.

Did tuna can tests on zones 3 and 4, running each for an hour. I learned that in zone 3, the middle head's nozzle needs to be downsized slightly, and the zone needs to run for 2.5 hours instead of 2 to get roughly an inch in most places. Zone 4 needs the last head along the back walkway increased to a slightly larger nozzle, and the head behind the deck probably needs to do 180 degrees instead of 135. It also might need a slight nozzle increase. Zone 4 also needs to run for 2 hours, instead of 1.5 to get around an inch.

Also sprayed shampoo on the side hill and then hand watered the heck out of it...it was going brown and barely grew this past month...even the green grass. This is typical in the Summer there. The shampoo let all the water soak in. I think I watered enough without overwatering...I went until about the saturation point, and eyeballed it. This was after running all of zone 5 for a total of 1 hour.

I then sprayed Serenade at the 2 oz rate on the front and back but not the side. The battery ran out. I may do it later, or not. 2 oz rate so I don't waste a whole app to rain in a day or so.

The irrigation audits took a while, and I'm not happy about the dormant spots in zone 3. Maybe I should have watered more often the past few weeks. I didn't run that zone at all. I thought I could rely on the rain recently.


----------



## Green

0.4 inch of rain.

Edit: currently watering side front for 30 min.


----------



## Green

Reply 111.

Total rain was 0.57 in after a bit more last night. I continued supplementing it by watering zones 1 and 2 for a half hour this morning, plus some hand watering and other sprinklers on the main front. Right near 1 inch total.

Mowed the side front except the front hill and overseeded area near garage corner, and part of the low input area. Again, that area was too long and needed side discharge. I will not be able to mow all the rest tomorrow due to ponding and saturated ground.

I took some of the dormant matted areas down a half inch to chop off the weeds. The oxalis is already seeding. Tried to avoid cutting the dormant grass.


----------



## Green

Today (8/10) finished mowing...low input (which finally dried enough but was way too long...had to side discharge it, and even double mow one part), front hill, main front, and back. Skipped the side as it's ok for now.

Did not water the seed. Hopefully not a mistake.

Also trimmed and blew back walkway prior to mowing.

I really need to put down Lime on the low input area and SOP on other areas one of these days...if it ever dries out after the next rain.


----------



## Powhatan

Green said:


> I really need to put down Lime on the low input area and SOP on other areas one of these days...if it ever dries out after the next rain.


@Green what type of lime you planning on using? My first soil test in spring 2017 recommended 100#/M agricultural limestone. I've put down dolomitic and fast acting since then totaling ~60#/M. I'll have my soil tested again next spring before I put down anymore to see what # recommendation is still needed.


----------



## g-man

You will likely need ~40lbs. The lime type depends on the magnesium (low or high).


----------



## Green

Powhatan said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> I really need to put down Lime on the low input area and SOP on other areas one of these days...if it ever dries out after the next rain.
> 
> 
> 
> @Green what type of lime you planning on using? My first soil test in spring 2017 recommended 100#/M agricultural limestone. I've put down dolomitic and fast acting since then totaling ~60#/M. I'll have my soil tested again next spring before I put down anymore to see what # recommendation is still needed.
Click to expand...

My soil tends to need a lot more calcium added than magnesium.

My current soil plan calls for calcitic fast acting. I normally used a full app, which was 9-12 lbs per thousand, but I decided to go down to 4.5 to 5 lbs for this app based on feedback from the people who analyze my tests. It may be my last app for that area for several years. All the other areas already reached the point where they don't need more Lime. That took 4 to 5 years.

In the future when a small amount of Lime is needed again, I would like to try to find an agricultural Lime that is very slow acting but has the right Ca to Mg balance for my soil, so it dissolves very slowly, now that pH and most ratios are close to ideal.

@g-man, Like you, I may copy that same signature format as I do more write-ups on the site. Unfortunately, the hand-can calibration guide is on hold right now...not enough time currently to do testing and revise the article so it can be posted yet, let alone proof read and revised.


----------



## Green

About 1/4 inch of rain as of this morning. Was enough to trip the rain sensor.
Now, closer to a half inch. Hoping to avoid really heavy stuff.

Pulled weeds in mulch bed. Oxalis and spurge mostly.


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> About 1/4 inch of rain as of this morning. Was enough to trip the rain sensor.
> Now, closer to a half inch. Hoping to avoid really heavy stuff.
> 
> Pulled weeds in mulch bed. Oxalis and spurge mostly.


Lucky you I got blasted this morning


----------



## Green

Total rain was up to about a half inch by this morning, and then another half inch after 3PM.

Threw down some moss out on the corner behind the deck.


----------



## Powhatan

Green said:


> Threw down some moss out on the corner behind the deck.


@Green I got a nice patch of active green moss on the mid/late afternoon shady side of the house that's growing near the heat pump condenser units. That area tends to stay damp this time of year when the A/C runs almost constantly. I've been putting down Virginia Green Stone around the base of the condenser units as landscaping stone and drainage to try to keep that area dryer. Oh, the joys of new home ownership getting things tweaked the way you want them.


----------



## Green

Got 0.7 inch of rain yesterday and last night/this morning.

Raked some dormant spots to prevent matting, and the oil damaged area.


----------



## Green

Powhatan said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Threw down some moss out on the corner behind the deck.
> 
> 
> 
> @Green I got a nice patch of active green moss on the mid/late afternoon shady side of the house that's growing near the heat pump condenser units. That area tends to stay damp this time of year when the A/C runs almost constantly. I've been putting down Virginia Green Stone around the base of the condenser units as landscaping stone and drainage to try to keep that area dryer. Oh, the joys of new home ownership getting things tweaked the way you want them.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it loves shaded corners. There are even some full sun patches in the lawn with trace amounts of moss.


----------



## Green

So far, the area hit with a bit of heating oil 2 days ago is more less ok after all the rain and the rigamarole I went through.

Today, I was able to edge one side of the driveway with a bed edger before it got dark. Tomorrow, the other side and the sidewalk.


----------



## Green

8/16: Finished edging the driveway and front hill along the sidewalk. I ended up with almost 2 full 5-gallon buckets of soil I can use to fill in low spots.


----------



## Green

Mowed the low input area, still using side discharge.

Then put down Lime on the area. One 30 lb bag of Encap brand mixed with 3-4 lbs of Epsom salt.


----------



## Green

Got 0.5 inch of rain last night.

Mowed the rest of the yard and finished right before a thunderstorm that dropped at least another half inch.

After the storm, I sprayed humic acid on the side front hill and some other brown areas in the main front, and then the garage side overseed area and the area where oil was dripped on Monday.


----------



## Green

Put down fertilizer everywhere except low input area. 0.25-0.35 N, and mixed with 0-0-50 at 0.5 lb of K everywhere except the back. 5-4-0 Milorganite and Protene 8-0-4.

Got 0.5 inch of rain yesterday.


----------



## Green

Sprayed PGR on front at 0.3 oz rate and side at lower rate...much lower on lower side. Will hit it again when I do the back. I really need a better nozzle. The aerosol from the Chapin 20v is bad, and I had to wear a mask but still felt like I inhaled some. That can't be good.


----------



## Green

Only 0.1 inch of rain last night.


----------



## Green

Did some trimming and mowed the main front and upper side. Maybe a touch of PGR rebound. Hard to tell.

Also watered the side front zone for one hour. Grass was looking a bit drought stressed.

Got my Ultramate SG humic acid delivered today.


----------



## Green

Catch can audit. Got some issues. The first head in zone 1 got jammed with a few sand particles and was stuck in one spot watering the driveway. Who knows how long it was stuck...possibly up to a month, but I hope not. I just rotated it back and forth a few times to free it up. The takeaway is these things need to be checked every so often.

Looks like zone 2 actually needs to be run 140-160 min. Instead of 120 to get near an inch of water down. This was probably part of my issue with browning grass, since zone 2 was getting both more sun and less water than zone 1 in July due to the sun angle and trees. I was running both for the same amount of time. The type of cups I was using were tapered, and didn't give accurate readings. No wonder some of the ryegrass is dead. Unbelievable...affer 3 years with an irrigation system, I still wasn't calibrating it right. Hope I didn't lose too much of the KBG and Fescue.

Looks like a few heads need to moved and one added...ugh. We didn't know where the exact boundary was at initial installation, so we omitted a head, and hedged the difference, and another head could have been a foot and a half closer to the boundary.

Also will need to decrease the zone 1 mid driveway edge nozzle by 0.5, and the mid road one by 1 gpm once it's moved and a corner head is insralled at the boundary (something 1.5 gpm or less no doubt). Going to have the irrigation guy do the head installation and moves. I'm comfortable with replacing a head, but not ready to take on the next level of complexity yet. I still have a bunch of other heads I need to swap on my own.

Ran zones 1 and 2 for an hour each.

Hand trimming.

Sprayed Triclopyr, primarily in the low input area on oxalis, virhinia copperleaf, vines, violets, etc. Will see if it does anything to the spurge.


----------



## Green

Mowed side front, upper back, and much of low input area minus the thin/dormant/weedy areas sprayed yesterday. Very long again. Side discharged.

Set zones 4 and 5 to water for 2 hours each tomorrow morning. Top and side hill extremely drought stressed.

Tomorrow, need to water hell strips by hand.


----------



## Green

Finally repaired the broken hose in the front so I could water the hellstrip areas. The triangular area was already partly brown near the road.

Noticed the first bit of rust at the border of the upper back. Last year was really bad in that area, and I handled it too late. I will drop more Milo in the near future, and ease up on my PGR rate as well. I sprayed Serenade on the front and most of the upper back at approx. the 2 oz rate before I noticed the rust. I haven't sprayed it in so long...too long. I will finish spraying the other areas tomorrow.

Set zone 3 to water for 2.5 hours at 4AM tomorrow.

Crud...my shoes are still outside drying...probably more damp by now!


----------



## Green

94 degrees today. Watered upper front hill and hellstrips. Resprayed serenade.

Sorayed rest of back.

Pulled spurge and oxalis in walkway.


----------



## Green

Cut garage side overseed for first time using hand shears and pulled some weeds. Accidentally pulled up 2 seedlings which were around 4 inches long and starting to tiller. Replanted. Watered.

Edit: I think the main front zones watered on the morning of the 27th for 120 and 180 min, but forgot to document.


----------



## Green

Watered 80 minutes on the side front this AM.

Hand watered the hellstrips around 4PM. It was 88 degrees and sunny, and has been drying well.

Mowed main front, side, and back. Side discharged due to length. Some PGR rebounding but can't spray until tomorrow.

Went to both HD and Lowes. Saw one bag of Scotts Thiophanate Methyl, so grabbed it. Not sure if they're discontinuing it in favor of the Azoxystrobin or what. I hardly ever use chemical fungicides, so it will last a very long time. I looked at the Vigoro Tall Fescue for the low input area, but didn't buy due to 4% other crop in the batch they had! Cultivars were assorted...Falcon IV in some bags, a bunch of Barenbrug ones, etc. I'll check out Ace and see if they have anything on sale for Labor Day.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 90 and 120 min (2/3 to 3/4 inch) tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Mowed low input area. Mulch mowed and hit everywhere. Wasn't overgrown this time.

Trimmed and sprayed PGR on back and lower side. Went to a lower rate due to rust starting at the edge of the upper back. 0.25 oz rate or so. Sprayed the garage side overseed and oil spill areas near the back patio at an even lower rate.

@social port, @Powhatan, @probasestealer, and others: I will be jumping on the HBG bandwagon, trying it out for the first time, at least since I've been into this stuff. I bought a 7 lb bag of Scotts seed for the low-input area, where there's some dead grass due to the heat. It's tall fescue with 5% HBG. I'll reseed the bare areas with it. It won't match the existing grass, but that's ok...regular KBG, as well as PR and FF thin out and die every year in some of those spots, so I don't have a choice. I want grass!


----------



## Green

Did misc. stuff. Watered hellstrip areas and dormant oatches in lower back. Topdressed sprinkler head in front. Changed a nozzle and adjusted an arc in the back. Went from a 2.5 to 3 gpm in zone 4 last head.

Sprayed PGR on main front areas to be overseeded. Overseeded the first area, near utilities. Bullseye and Bewitched seed. Halfway through the PGR...8oz left of the 16. @Colonel K0rn


----------



## probasestealer

Good luck with the hbg. Which cultivar? I'm assuming thermal blue?

@Green


----------



## Green

probasestealer said:


> Good luck with the hbg. Which cultivar? I'm assuming thermal blue?
> 
> @Green


Thanks. That's correct. Hoping to seed that area next weekend.


----------



## JP900++

probasestealer said:


> Good luck with the hbg. Which cultivar? I'm assuming thermal blue?
> 
> @Green


I used some Bandera last year. It had decent luck with it. It still seems to have went dormant these first few weeks of August. I was on the verge of a meltdown. It seems to be bouncing back now that we're getting some moisture- I didn't irrigate much this year. I'm putting more down out front this year with Bedazzled and maybe some Blueberry.


----------



## Powhatan

Definitely interesting to see how your HBG does next summer.


----------



## probasestealer

Green said:


> probasestealer said:
> 
> 
> 
> Good luck with the hbg. Which cultivar? I'm assuming thermal blue?
> 
> @Green
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. That's correct. Hoping to seed that area next weekend.
Click to expand...

I've tried thermal, bandera and spf30. Spf30 seems the most aggressive to me


----------



## social port

@Green , awesome that you are giving HBG a try. I'm excited about this.

I used that Scott's blend (I'm assuming it's the same mix) last year. I had a nice rate of germination, but I was never able to compare HBG to F percentages. The grass had a very nice color, though, even for little babies.

I'm definitely eager to hear your observations over the next year.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> @Green , awesome that you are giving HBG a try. I'm excited about this.
> 
> I used that Scott's blend (I'm assuming it's the same mix) last year. I had a nice rate of germination, but I was never able to compare HBG to F percentages. The grass had a very nice color, though, even for little babies.
> 
> I'm definitely eager to hear your observations over the next year.


Thanks everyone. I was hesitant to use it at first, but I guess that was because it's something different.


----------



## Green

Today:

Watered side hill and upper front hill.

Quick low dose of Milo on the upper back, shooting for 0.25.

Made more progress on the main front overseed. Actually it's done now. Thankfully not too big an area was dead/thin. Lightly dethatched the dead grass, put down seed, and some peat moss. I left the grass fairly long this time...around three inches...for protection from the sun. I think I'll do a fungicide tomorrow because I know I'll have problems if not. Edit: Tenacity, too. Seed was mostly Bullseye TTTF, with some Rugby II KBG in the real bare spots, and other TTTF on the part nearer to the driveway...Summer and Flame TTTF.

In the next few days, I think I'll start on the side, which is the worst area other than the low input area. We are at the very end of or past the recommended KBG seeding season here, so I'm pushing it.

Edit: left the mower bag outside and to go get it just now.


----------



## social port

Hey, @Green, I am imagining that you are using the Scott's mix out of convenience (nothing wrong with thermal blue, from what I understand!), but have you ever noticed the 'texas-type' offerings at Hogan's?
Apparently, they sell solar green and spitfire. I'm not familiar with either one, but spitfire seems the most compelling of the two, based on my ten-minute google-fu.
I realize that you are probably not running full-clip down the hybrid highway, but I did want to pass this along since you are at least on a small, hybrid backroad.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Hey, Green, I am imagining that you are using the Scott's mix out of convenience (nothing wrong with thermal blue, from what I understand!), but have you ever noticed the 'texas-type' offerings at Hogan's?
> Apparently, they sell solar green and spitfire. I'm not familiar with either one, but spitfire seems the most compelling of the two, based on my ten-minute google-fu.
> I realize that you are probably not running full-clip down the hybrid highway, but I did want to pass this along since you are at least on a small, hybrid backroad.


I think I remember hearing that. I guess those are full Texas, (TBG), as opposed to hybrid (HBG).

You know, I actually didn't go seeking it out. I was originally going to buy Pennington TTTF (Barenbrug cultivars mostly) because it was least expensive. But when I looked at the label at HD, it was all 3.75 to 4.50% other crop, or else had 9 annual bluegrass seeds per lb. I was like no way. So, after going to HD, Lowes, and Ace, I'm standing there looking at the bags for like 15 min, reading all the labels and calculating the cost per lb. The second best deal was the Scotts uncoated with the 5% HBG, so I finally went with it.


----------



## Green

JP900++ said:


> I used some Bandera last year. It had decent luck with it. It still seems to have went dormant these first few weeks of August. I was on the verge of a meltdown. It seems to be bouncing back now that we're getting some moisture- I didn't irrigate much this year. I'm putting more down out front this year with Bedazzled and maybe some Blueberry.


I was reading that they don't really stay green that much longer than KBG. So, what's the major advantage? Is it that they stay alive better during dormancy?


----------



## Green

probasestealer said:


> I've tried thermal, bandera and spf30. Spf30 seems the most aggressive to me


That's good. I don't want something too aggressive, since it's a Northern mix. There are just some areas where the PR dies totally, and the KBG and FF thin out drastically every year, until there are dead patches. Pretty sure it's just heat/drought and not Summer Patch. We get pretty much as hot and humid as you transition zone people...just not as many days in a row each time. It still takes its toll though. So after success with TTTF plugs that I planted very late last Fall, that made it through this Summer, I'm patch seeding with more TTTF and the HBG. So I'll have new dark green areas bordered by existing medium green grass that hopefully will survive long term.


----------



## Green

Powhatan said:


> Definitely interesting to see how your HBG does next summer.


Yeah, that'll be interesting. I was really after the TTTF in the bag, but in hindsight, this might be better than just TTTF.


----------



## JP900++

Green said:


> JP900++ said:
> 
> 
> 
> I used some Bandera last year. It had decent luck with it. It still seems to have went dormant these first few weeks of August. I was on the verge of a meltdown. It seems to be bouncing back now that we're getting some moisture- I didn't irrigate much this year. I'm putting more down out front this year with Bedazzled and maybe some Blueberry.
> 
> 
> 
> I was reading that they don't really stay green that much longer than KBG. So, what's the major advantage? Is it that they stay alive better during dormancy?
Click to expand...

My hope was that it would take longer to go dormant and come out quicker and more successfully. It's hard to tell in an overseed but I do think that even with reduced input on my end that overall the yard held up better. These last few weeks have been tougher but the rain we got last week seems to be bringing back the rough patches. I have one area in the back that has struggled no matter what I try. Probably a patio in it's future.


----------



## probasestealer

JP900++ said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JP900++ said:
> 
> 
> 
> I used some Bandera last year. It had decent luck with it. It still seems to have went dormant these first few weeks of August. I was on the verge of a meltdown. It seems to be bouncing back now that we're getting some moisture- I didn't irrigate much this year. I'm putting more down out front this year with Bedazzled and maybe some Blueberry.
> 
> 
> 
> I was reading that they don't really stay green that much longer than KBG. So, what's the major advantage? Is it that they stay alive better during dormancy?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> My hope was that it would take longer to go dormant and come out quicker and more successfully. It's hard to tell in an overseed but I do think that even with reduced input on my end that overall the yard held up better. These last few weeks have been tougher but the rain we got last week seems to be bringing back the rough patches. I have one area in the back that has struggled no matter what I try. Probably a patio in it's future.
Click to expand...

I'm wondering myself if the HBG isn't mostly marketing. 
So you take a KBG cultivar, cross it with Texas bluegrass and then cross it back 1-infinite times with KBG. So how much texas bluegrass is left? You're left with mainly a *** cultivar right? My KBG did almost as well this summer in the transition and honestly looks better right now. Some of the dormant areas of HBG woke up sooner and is growing faster than the KBG, so maybe it does grow more aggressively during the summer? The HBG does seem to be more aggressive than the NuGlade and Midnight I've compared it to.
So what's the advantage? I don't know. I've got some overseeding to do in a few spots, I'm just going to use KBG in my yard. KBG is prettier. 
Sorry to invade your Journal @Green


----------



## Green

probasestealer said:


> I've got some overseeding to do in a few spots, I'm just going to use KBG in my yard. KBG is prettier.
> Sorry to invade your Journal Green


Good discussion. I've seen @Powhatan's photos. But how does it look different than KBG?

The marketing stuff (which must be based on the research somewhat you would hope) claims deeper roots than KBG and ability to stay green longer in heat. So I guess that's the answer to what makes it different.

There are so many types of bluegrass that aren't used in lawns...


----------



## probasestealer

@Green lighter green and a bit more "shine" in my experience. The SPF30 is a very narrow blade. You may have already seen these pics. 
Comparing HBG to Fescue 

Close-up pic (TTTF, Hybrid bluegrass and NuGlade). Don't comment on the mower blade, yes it was dull when this was taken, haha. If you look closely you can see the hybrid (shiny green), Nuglade (darker, dull green) and some TTTF.


----------



## Green

93 today (73 dew point). Watered a bunch of times...

Watered zone 4 for 2 hours but shed got wet inside. Set zones 1 and 2 to water 30 and 40 min, twice each at like 8 and 10 AM today. Then hand watered at 1 and again around 4. Then put down preventative fungicide on the main front overseed areas due to the long grass, humidity, and frequent watering. This is one of the few situations I use preventative fungicides. I know if I didn't, there would be problems, so as much as I dislike doing it, the situation called for it. I eyeballed the area as roughly 1K, and put down almost 1 lb of the Scotts Thiophanate Methyl, and then watered it in around 6:30 tonight. Hand watered wilting areas around hellstrips and front hill around 4.

Tomorrow watering: zone 5 for 20 min 4 times each hour, zone 3 for an hour, and zone 2 for 20 min.

Tomorrow: Tenacity.


----------



## Green

Hah. It's 83 degrees right now at 9PM with a 75 dew point and 77% relative humidity. It says feels like 91. It's not mid July, though.


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> Hah. It's 83 degrees right now at 9PM with a 75 dew point and 77% relative humidity. It says feels like 91. It's not mid July, though.


I feel ya green this weather sucks. I'm ready for fallj looks like a big cool down for us on Friday tho.


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hah. It's 83 degrees right now at 9PM with a 75 dew point and 77% relative humidity. It says feels like 91. It's not mid July, though.
> 
> 
> 
> I feel ya green this weather sucks. I'm ready for fallj looks like a big cool down for us on Friday tho.
Click to expand...

It's not that bad. It's typical Florida weather. I like the different seasons, so I'm enjoying it. Not the getting sweaty when mowing part, which has been all Summer, but the rest of it. Seed should germinate a day or two faster than usual.

The interesting thing as I went on my walk just now, is that areas that were watered more recently and deeper/longer, have dew earlier and moreso than other areas. Areas not watered in the past few days at all were still dry at 9:15. My overseed area, watered at 6:30, was really wet.


----------



## Green

@probasestealer, interesting photos. Do you think it's a few microns thicker than regular KBG, or more opaque to light, like TTTF?


----------



## probasestealer

Green said:


> @probasestealer, interesting photos. Do you think it's a few microns thicker than regular KBG, or more opaque to light, like TTTF?


I think the kbg is slightly thicker and more opaque. But it's hard to tell in the mix. I'll try to pull pieces of each to compare in the near future


----------



## Green

probasestealer said:


> I think the kbg is slightly thicker and more opaque. But it's hard to tell in the mix. I'll try to pull pieces of each to compare in the near future


Makes sense, I keep reading it blends well with TTTF. But I wonder if it's lighter green (which is fine, since my lawn in that area is mostly medium green and the TTTF in the bag is probably dark). You alluded to that earlier.


----------



## probasestealer

@Green no doubt it's lighter green (HBG). It doesn't really bother me. The yard looks great in the morning and evening, it looks washed out anyway (almost bermuda color) mid to late afternoon in the heat of the day. I try to avoid looking at it this time of the year mid-day. I prematurely dropped some vitamin M, it's already helped with my color. Hopefully I can start hitting it harder in a few weeks, come on cooler weather!


----------



## Green

In the 90s again.

Hand watered front overseed several times, and sprayed Tenacity on it at low rate...maybe 2oz per acre. Sprayed PGR on the area to be overseeded next, on the side.

Hand watered dormant (dead?) areas in lower back again.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for a total of 60 min each tomorrow morning, but with 15 minute waterings at 8:30. 9L30, 10:30, and 11:30 to help with the seed.


----------



## Green

Watered seed twice.

Watered hellstrip area. Water was running off, so sprayed shampoo and watered. Did the same on the upper front hill and lower front hill border near sidewalk.

Sprayed spurge in sidewalks with vinegar.

Dug up and pulled some weeds, including 2 very large dandelions next to each other in the front hill mulch bed, and some Virginia Copperweed and Orchard Grass on the border under the trees. Will have to spray with Triclopyr later in the week.

Set zone 5 to water for 20 min every hour tomorrow morning for 80 min. total. Set zone 2 to 8 minutes at 8:30 and again at 10:45 to help with overseed.


----------



## JP900++

probasestealer said:


> JP900++ said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Probably 70% hype. Just like that to 99% of the population the difference in green between cultivars is mostly lost on them. I figured I'd buy in and give it a try. Every 1/16 inch or extra degree counts. I was just glad it didn't come up looking like 31.
> 
> I was reading that they don't really stay green that much longer than KBG. So, what's the major advantage? Is it that they stay alive better during dormancy?
> 
> 
> 
> My hope was that it would take longer to go dormant and come out quicker and more successfully. It's hard to tell in an overseed but I do think that even with reduced input on my end that overall the yard held up better. These last few weeks have been tougher but the rain we got last week seems to be bringing back the rough patches. I have one area in the back that has struggled no matter what I try. Probably a patio in it's future.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I'm wondering myself if the HBG isn't mostly marketing.
> So you take a KBG cultivar, cross it with Texas bluegrass and then cross it back 1-infinite times with KBG. So how much texas bluegrass is left? You're left with mainly a *** cultivar right? My KBG did almost as well this summer in the transition and honestly looks better right now. Some of the dormant areas of HBG woke up sooner and is growing faster than the KBG, so maybe it does grow more aggressively during the summer? The HBG does seem to be more aggressive than the NuGlade and Midnight I've compared it to.
> So what's the advantage? I don't know. I've got some overseeding to do in a few spots, I'm just going to use KBG in my yard. KBG is prettier.
> Sorry to invade your Journal @Green
Click to expand...


----------



## Green

Today is 92-94, dewpoint 73-75. Probably the last really hot day for a while. Soil temps ranged from 83 to (get this!) 95 in the front, which was taken near pavement.

Watered seed once.

Edit: at least 1/4 to 1/3 inch of rain in that 20-25 minute period. Dew point is back to 70 or so.


----------



## social port

That heat and humidity seem unreal. Every time I think about how intolerable it is in Tenn right now, I remind myself that New England isn't exactly pleasant at the moment. And it's September!

It is such a Petri dish out there now.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> That heat and humidity seem unreal. Every time I think about how intolerable it is in Tenn right now, I remind myself that New England isn't exactly pleasant at the moment. And it's September!
> 
> It is such a Petri dish out there now.


I was outside earlier, enjoying the last of the heat and humidity, watering my seed areas.

And it's amazing what a thunderstorm can do. Rain came through from about 4:30 until now. It's now down to 81 with a dew point of 67, in that short a time!

Hopefully the soil surface where I have seed at the top of the hill on the side is still there.


----------



## jessehurlburt

social port said:


> It is such a Petri dish out there now.


Yup, saw my first fungal issues yesterday. Just a tiny spot.. Wondering if I should get something to treat it or if it will be OK now with the cooler temps. :|


----------



## social port

@jessehurlburt Any idea as to what the disease might be?


----------



## jessehurlburt

I don't know but I am watching it closely to see if it spreads. Temps were in the 90s this week and I was watering this seeded area every two hours during the day. Temps are in the 60's today and are supposed to stay down so that combined with watering much less now (germination in most places already) I am thinking I will be OK. I will try to snag a photo later just in case..


----------



## Green

Got some heavy-ish rain again today. Roughly an inch.


----------



## Green

Mowed main front, upper side, and part of back while it was drizzling.


----------



## Green

Well, my experiment of leaving herbicide in the sprayer for a month or so didn't work out well. The filter clogged. Don't do it!

And of course I'm late. Still havent done most of my seeding projects yet.

Didn't get to water my seed today. I know, risky. Thankfully high temp was 65, damp, and cloudy. Seemed to retain the moisture when I checked tonight.

Hoping to mow Wednesday since I didn't finish yesterday. Going to be overgrown...

Also late with my PGR.


----------



## Green

After rain the kast couple of days, tital was 1.6 inches, including some today.

After being sick today, I'm hoping to feel recovered tomorrow so I can start mowing. We'll see.


----------



## jessehurlburt

Feel better green!


----------



## Green

jessehurlburt said:


> Feel better green!


Thank you. I think I'm getting better. But it's too wet to mow anyway.


----------



## Green

Mowed and blew front and back. Overgrown.

Got another 1/3 inch of rain yesterday.

Tomorrow: PGR, seed, biofungicide, and more mowing.


----------



## Green

Busy weekend. Trying to find lawn time...

Rain sensor is still red.

Today: sprayed pgr on front at roughly 1/3 rate, as well as upper side and part of the back where oil was spilled last month, which is recovered now. Sprayed Serenade on back at 2oz rate.

Tomorrow: buy peat moss, mow non-soggy parts of low input area, overseed side and back damaged areas from Summer heat, and spray more biofungicide.


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## Green

Some photos I meant to post a while back:

The front lawn in the beginning of July:










Balancing a rock on top of TTTF. Yes, you really can do that with TTTF. 
(Calling @pennstater2005!)










Repositioning the sprinkler head that sunk in. That was my first time:


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## Green

More...

Low-input area suffering in mid July. (I will be mowing it tomorrow and will plan out the overseed strategy.)










Dead patches in the front prior to overseeding (early Sept.):




























My fertilizer stock, which I'm itching to use but need to find the time:


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## social port

Green said:


> Some photos I meant to post a while back:
> 
> The front lawn in the beginning of July:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Balancing a rock on top of TTTF. Yes, you really can do that with TTTF.
> (Calling @pennstater2005!)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Repositioning the sprinkler head that sunk in. That was my first time:


wow, @Green that looks really good.

Love the fescue and the rock. It reminds of bermuda and the golf ball shots. Bermuda cut low holding up a golf ball; fescue cut tall holding up a rock


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## Green

social port said:


> Love the fescue and the rock. It reminds of bermuda and the golf ball shots. Bermuda cut low holding up a golf ball; fescue cut tall holding up a rock


Thanks. I have another shot of it I'll dig up eventually.


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## Green

Today:

Watered front overseed areas 3x.

Raked dead patches in the middle side, and overseeded with a TTPR/KBG mix this evening...
-Rugby II KBG, and SR4420, SR4600, and ZOOM PR. Watered.

Unfortunately, I see evidence of Poa Trivialis in the area still. (But there was definitely dead good grass in the patches, and whatever was going to recover in its own mostly has. I also can't wait for KBG to spread when there's Trivialis in the area.)

Rain sensor turned green in the middle of the day. I believe it was in the 80s today with dew points in the 60s. Tomorrow is supposed to be in the 80s too, and then the highs are all 60s-70s for the following 10 days in the forecast! Unbelievable.


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## pennstater2005

@Green Is the area that is suffering that needs over seeding TTTF? I do like the rock sitting on the TTTF! Nice and thick.


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## Green

@pennstater2005, that front lawn is a TTTF/KBG/TTPR mix.

The back TTTF/KBG did better, but still a couple of small dead spots that are big enough to reseed later today. And I have seed, so I will use it.


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## probasestealer

@Green is that the dethatch rake?


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## Green

probasestealer said:


> @Green is that the dethatch rake?


Yup. Groundskeeper II. Very effective. I was able to remove only dead stuff by going lightly...nothing green.


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## Green

Sept. 17th. Watered seed. Mowed main front, including some of the overseeded areas carefully, front hill, upper side, upper back (including walkway), part of lower back, and low input area...which was way overgrown at like 10 inches. I broke the 2/3 rule! Side discharged it. Put up barrier tape in front again.

Next time: more mowing, trim, spray biofungicide, more seeding, pruning, killing vines, planting plugs, fertilizer...whatever there's time for.


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## Green

0.6 inch of rain from what was left of Florence, but most of it was in short fast downpours.

Contractors walked over the seeded areas to some extent, despite barrier tape. Have to add more seed anyway, but it's getting a bit late in the year for TTTF/KBG.


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## Green

Neighbor had aeration and overseeding done. The guy left a couple small piles of seed in the street amounting to a couple of handfuls or half a cup, so I swept it up and tossed it on the border part of their yard in bare spots and blew the rest toward their yard. It looked like a FF/KBG/PR mix. Definitely not TTTF judging by seed size.


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## Green

Neighbor's mowing guy came today, day after aeration and seeding. Actually, I bet it will work out pretty well.

Put down more seed and peat moss on parts of front and side that needed it. Mowed half of low-input area, and mowed area to be overseeded lower...2.75 in.

Watered seed once.


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## Green

Watered seed once.

Prepared and overseeded about 1500 square feet of the low input area.
-TTTF: Scotts coated TTTF blend and uncoated mix with HBG. Roughly 5 lbs.
-America KBG: Maybe a half lb.
-Wicked TTPR - Low rate used...less than 1/4 lb roughly.

Most of the grass is dead from the Summer, hence the need to overseed.

More to do tomorrow.

Did not get to do any mowing either. Overgrown again...


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## Green

Did not start watering the seed yet. So technically seed down is tomorrow afternoon. I prepped another area today and mowed the rest of the low input area. I also found buried construction debris...foam insulation, which took awhile to dig out. I had to go down at least a foot. I'll seed the other area tomorrow, and cover some areas with peat moss after spraying tenacity, then start watering.

This is taking way too long for a late season overseed...

I mowed the main front overseed area with the reel mower, and then mowed most of the side front and back.

Set side front zone to water for 2 hours total tomorrow morning.

Tomorrow: seed, peat moss, fertilizer, tenacity, PGR, biofungicide and fungicide, finish mowing, trim.


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## Green

I got all the seeding done in the low-input area, but still haven't started watering yet. I also started the peat moss. I'll only be able to use it in the areas with least vegetation cover, since I only have so much. Everything West of where the yard opens up to the neighbor's, I omitted the PR in favor of extra CRF (Chantilly) because that area really gets hammered bad in the Summer and PR will just die out. I also mixed in some Baron KBG (which is supposed to retain its green well in early stages of drought) along with the America, HBG, and Scotts TTTF. I then spread a bit more of the TTTF and some CRF on the other area. A tree-root area got a thin layer of bagged topsoil before the seed. Hopefully the resulting Northern mix with HBG and TTTF will persist better in hot and dry weather than the mostly fine fescue with some KBG that was there before.

Looks like starter with Meso is going to be the way to go, due to high wind making spraying impossible tomorrow. At least I have part of tomorrow to finish.

I also raked out the dead spots in the lower back, and put seed down. Most of the spots ended up being small, but there were two that were a foot or more in one dimension, irregular shapes. Bullseye/Rugby II seed mix. The lawn definitely recovered in the past month, but there are a few dead patches that needed to be reseeded.

I assume all of this dead grass (back, side, front, and low-input area) is just from the Summer stress, and not bugs or anything. I've put down grub prevention for the past 4 or 5 years.

I really need to hit the small rust areas in the back and on the garage side with some propiconazole tomorrow.

Unfortunately, I'm late with my PGR, too (a couple days past the 3-week mark). The next calm day will be Thurs or Fri. Hopefully it lasts a bit longer now with the cooler temps, and doesn't go into hyper rebound mode during the upcoming rain Tuesday and Wednesday.


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## social port

Green said:


> Did not start watering the seed yet. So technically seed down is tomorrow afternoon. I prepped another area today and mowed the rest of the low input area. I also found buried construction debris...foam insulation, which took awhile to dig out. I had to go down at least a foot. I'll seed the other area tomorrow, and cover some areas with peat moss after spraying tenacity, then start watering.
> 
> This is taking way too long for a late season overseed...


The best laid plans, Green. I seem to encounter so many unexpected detours while completing my objectives that I have begun to just expect them. I estimate how long something will take and then add two hours. :lol: 
This is to say that I can relate to your sense of things moving slowly.


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## Green

Scotts seed labels. So again, the cultivars for this project are:
TTTF: Faith, Endeavor II, Gazelle II, Dynamic II, Silverado II. That's a lot of IIs.
CRF: Chantilly
KBG: America, Baron
HBG: Thermal Blue
TTPR: Wicked

The Wicked is only on the Eastern half and the now dead 2016 Spring reno strip (killed accidentally by Tenacity). The Baron is only on the Western half. The Western half got more FF as well, since it was essentially bare ground after raking...totally dead. The PR on the Eastern half is to help germination. Seed was feathered into the existing turf areas at the borders to try blend it somewhat with the existing Northern mix of KBG, FF, and PR. The PR seemed to survive somewhat in the partially shaded areas all these years, even though there isn't a ton of it left now after 6 years.

I also planted a lot of weed seeds, too...the Scotts seed, Baron, and Wicked all have some percentage of other crop/weed. On the Scotts TTTF with coating, you have to double the percentages to get the effective numbers.



















Area where I dug out the buried foam insulation yesterday. Still need to remove the pile of insulation and rocks tomorrow, and add some more soil, and then seed it:


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## samjonester

Green said:


> Unfortunately, I'm late with my PGR, too (a couple days past the 3-week mark). The next calm day will be Thurs or Fri. Hopefully it lasts a bit longer now with the cooler temps, and doesn't go into hyper rebound mode during the upcoming rain Tuesday and Wednesday.


Have you ever used https://www.greenkeeperapp.com? It's been spot on with my last two applications. The most recent one, I was actually surprised by an exit! It predicted that I would exit in the beginning of October, but a heat wave in the beginning of September ate through a lot of my GDDs, and I exited early. When I noticed I was getting surge growth I checked, and it had updated appropriately. I had used 103% of my GDDs after the last app. I will be checking more regularly next year!


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## Green

Finally done with the low input area. Peat mossed as many spots as I could. Put down like 20 lbs of 10-10-10 on the whole low input area, so roughly 0.3 lb N, K, and P. Put down starter with meso on the seed areas. Eyeballed like 3 lbs. It was getting dark so no time to weigh stuff out.

Hopefully the seed stays put with the heavy rain coming Tuesday and Wednesday!

Mowed non seeded parts of main front, as well as remaining parts of both sides (including the garage overseed area...finally removed the barrier), rest of the back, and closest part of side front. Trimmed in back. Raked dead patches on upper side. Put down seed and peat moss. Mix of Champion GQ PR blend and Rugby II KBG. Did not have time to add peat moss to lower back seeded patches, except for the largest. Did not get to spray fungicide on the rust patches. Hopefully it won't spread over the next 3 days.

Pulled up some large stiltgrass with seedheads at the border of the upper back.

Leaves are slowly starting to come down again, and I saw color change starting in the next town over.


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## Green

social port said:


> The best laid plans, Green. I seem to encounter so many unexpected detours while completing my objectives that I have begun to just expect them. I estimate how long something will take and then add two hours. :lol:
> This is to say that I can relate to your sense of things moving slowly.


Thanks. Did the best I could. A lot of people are still doing seed here, but it's not ideal unless it's PR. Pretty much the same thing as you seeding around Halloween where you are. Doable but I would have liked to have done it 10-15 days ago.

When I renoed the back in early October, I got soil washout the following Spring because the roots weren't deep enough to hold the new soil on the slopes.



samjonester said:


> Have you ever used https://www.greenkeeperapp.com? It's been spot on with my last two applications. The most recent one, I was actually surprised by an exit! It predicted that I would exit in the beginning of October, but a heat wave in the beginning of September ate through a lot of my GDDs, and I exited early. When I noticed I was getting surge growth I checked, and it had updated appropriately. I had used 103% of my GDDs after the last app. I will be checking more regularly next year!


Not yet, but I'll check it out. Hoping to be able to get it sprayed Thursday, anyway. Interesting anecdote about the hot days.


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## Green

Well, the seeded areas in the low input area are partially under water now.

I'm hoping I don't have to redo it all later this week, but I expect a good portion of the seed went into the neighbor's yard and will grow there nicely. But he mows at one inch, so tall fescue might not do too well.

It's going to be hard to tell in the areas I put peat moss whether the seed is still there.

So, if I have to redo it all, we're out 3 hours of time, cost of seed and peat moss, and about 4 days of germination time lost.

Or maybe most of the seed will stay put despite being under water...


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## g-man

It has been a tough seeding year. Hopefully it works out for you.


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## Green

g-man said:


> It has been a tough seeding year. Hopefully it works out for you.


Thanks. After 3.75 inches of rain today and more tomorrow, I'm guessing it's going to be pretty much a do-over later this week...










All the water and some of the peat moss (with some of the seed?) is going toward my neighbor's yard, which needs reseeding, too. That's the peat moss floating on the top...

I think I need some PGS...


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## g-man

Are you building a pond?


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## Green

g-man said:


> Are you building a pond?


Hey! I'm trying to rebuild the lawn, not a pond! :lol:

The store I buy peat moss from is out of it for a few days, and the price is back up to the normal level. But the one they have doesn't have debris like wood chunks in it.

I have coupons. So I'm going to buy 2 more bales when they get it in, as well as another bag of the Scotts TTTF/HBG if the seed ends up gone. That's another $60. I may also have to use some of my Bullseye seed.

I'll rake whatever needs to be raked, put the seed down, spray 1.5oz rate of Tenacity, and topdress again.

This is once it dries out...probably not until at least Friday or Saturday.


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## Green

Got about another 0.25 in of rain last night or this morning.

Today I inspected the low input area and seed. It's not quite as bad as I expected, but it will require more seed, especially in some areas where there was more water flowing through. On the positive side, some of the seed is cracking open and the root is starting to pop out.

Also sprayed Propiconazole on the rust spots near the front of the garage and at the edge of the lawn behind the garage.

Sprinkled some moss-out on the corner behind the deck and near the side of it.

78 degrees and dew point of 73 today...Summer tried to come back for one day. It was damp the whole day and only a bit of sun.

Turns out 2 nights ago I accidentally left a shovel and the Groundskeeper rake outside during the rain. Found it late today.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> After 3.75 inches of rain today and more tomorrow, I'm guessing it's going to be pretty much a do-over later this week...


Ouch. That looks soggy.

Hang in there.


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## Green

Got another 0.6 or so inch of rain last night, so 0.85 in total.


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## Green

Was able to put down fertilizer on the upper back...3 lbs of Screamin Green for 0.5 lb N, and sprayed PGR on the back and lower side...1/4 rate on upper back, and 1/3 rate on the rest. Rain coming tonight.


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## Green

0.5 inch more rain last night.

Bought 2 more bales of Peat Moss and 3 more lbs of the Scotts TTTF/HBG seed today.



 ken-n-nancy said:


> Hang in there.


Thanks. And by the way, I did the first 5-oz/A Tenacity app with non-ionic surfactant on the side-front hill along the driveway today. It's around 200 square feet. 0.25 gal of solution wasn't quite enough for 3 uniform passes on the area. The area is damp now from all the rain and cloudy weather today. I'll edit this post to upload a photo as it looks now.

More fertilizer on other areas next week. Hate to run sprinklers to water it in after all this rain, but don't see much choice if there's no rain.


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## Green

Sept. 29: Re-raked the Eastern half of the low input overseed and added more seed to fix the washout...around 1 lb of Bullseye mixed with 1.5 of the Scotts TTTF/HBG over 1,500 square feet or so. Tried to walk on it as little as possible as there was some sparse germination in patches but had to in order to rake and make two sets of spreader passes (which also means that adding more mesotrione like I wanted to is not going to happen due to germination). Will finish that area tomorrow and start on fixing the next one.

Luckily, I got 7.6 more cu. ft. of peat moss and the 3lb bag of seed I needed to repair these areas on sale and with a coupon for $30 total. It would have been $43 normally.

Low input area grass is long. Everything is still soggy...I barely watered today.

Also added a bit more seed in the lower back patches in case of washout. Will have to mow tomorrow and then do the same on the upoer side, and gently re-rake and add peat moss where it washed out.


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## Green

Sept. 30: Re-raked the other half of the low-input area that had seed the best I could without trampling to much or disrupting the existing seed. The Groundskeeper rake keeps proving its ability. Put down more seed, and this was the worst washout area. Used about 1 lb each of Bullseye and Scotts TTTF/HBG, mixed with about a half lb of America KBG, about 1/4 lb of Baron KBG, and a bit of the remaining Scotts coated TTTF seed, eyeballing all the amounts.

Again, cultivars for this overseed/reseed are: TTTF: Bullseye, Faith, Tarheel II, Silverado II, Endeavor II, Gazelle II. KBG: America, Baron. HBG: Thermal Blue. FF (CRF): Chantilly. TTPR: Wicked. I hate early October seeding with anything that's not mostly PR, but you have to do it sometimes. Fescues should ideally be seeded by mid Sept here in Southern New England...let alone KBG. We're just a bit over 2 weeks away from the average first frost.

Mowed the front. Still at 3.75 in, but not for long...


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## g-man

Green said:


> I hate early October seeding with anything that's not mostly PR, but you have to do it sometimes.


Athletic fields do this all the time. They have to. Just be careful with walking the area in winter and early spring. Some grass will die, but some will survive.


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## Green

g-man said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> I hate early October seeding with anything that's not mostly PR, but you have to do it sometimes.
> 
> 
> 
> Athletic fields do this all the time. They have to. Just be careful with walking the area in winter and early spring. Some grass will die, but some will survive.
Click to expand...

Temps are going back up into the 70s and maybe even low 80s for a few days starting tomorrow, so that should help a bit.

I once did a reno this time of year. It was a warm October, so no issues. However, the roots did not get deep enough to hold the light compost/sand mixture that we added to the area when squirrels started to dig, so Spring rain caused the soil with some grass seed that was added (to fix squirrel damage from the late Fall and early Winter) to erode over and over until about June.


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## Green

Finished mowing. Sides, back, and low input area. Upper back was super long from PGR rebound.

Put down Fall fertilizer finally...1-2 weeks late, but it will be ok. Used Screamin' Green 16-2-3...one bag.

Main front: Over 1.0 N rate...but no more than 1.5. Single passes in one direction only (East-West), but coverage looked ok.

Side front: 1.0 N rate.

Lower back: 1.0 N rate

Upper back: 0.5N rate (because I did 0.5 last week).

Side: 0.5N rate

Low-input area: Roughly 2 lbs/M of Screamin' Green 16-2-3 with 0.37% prodiamine on non-seeded areas. Also, about 25 lbs of 6-2-0 Milo with 2.5% iron on the same areas.

Tossed a bale of peat moss on the low-input area seed in the dark, and made a mess.


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## Green

Today, I was able to quickly spread out the peat moss that I put down yesterday, before the rain started. And good thing. We're getting some severe storms, so I hope I don't get washout again. There is some visible germination in the area that didn't wash out as much. Good thing I raked it the other day to spread them around a bit.

Also raked and threw down some seed near the furthest corner of the low-input area where there are some bare patches. I used the Scotts TTTF/HBG mix to patch (into the existing mostly KBG with a little FF mixed stand). I honestly don't care if it doesn't match, in the way I'm picky on other parts of the yard. I want something that's going to survive there, period. The low-input area is not for looks...and it's nearly half of the lawn area of the whole yard, but is in a place where only two other neighbors see it, and they're not lawn nuts.

As of this morning, we had 0.05 inch of rain from last night. I could smell the manure and biosolids from the Screamin' Green I put down yesterday, and the urea prills appeared to be gone (dissolved). Not sure if that's good or bad considering how little rain there was. So, it sat like that until 7PM tonight, when it started raining again, sometimes moderately hard.


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## JDgreen18

How did you make out last night with those storms?


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> How did you make out last night with those storms?


We got about an inch of rain last night (10/2-3).

So, it turned out that the peat moss and much of the seed I put down the other day flowed into one area about a quarter the size of the total area. I'm not too concerned by the seed, since TTTF can be seeded pretty heavily. But the peat moss is kind of thick now. I tried to spread it out but could only do so much with it. Tomorrow I'll added some peat moss to areas where it's gone.

I see germination in other parts of the low input area, so that's good. Also saw a dandelion turning white, so the starter with meso is working.

I added more seed, using up the rest of the second bag of Scotts TTTF/HBG. So, 6.5 lbs or so of that type so far. I still have plenty of Bullseye if I need to add any more seed. I also fixed the areas where I had dug out rocks and insulation, adding soil and seed. I used some of the Chantilly CRF seed. Also seeded and added peat moss to the area behind the shed with the same seed (another area that mysteriously burns out and dies in the Summer).

Added peat moss to the patches in the lower back, and created a few more by ripping out some Triv I saw, then seeded those with the Bullseye seed.

Did the same on the upper side, but with PR seed, using up the Fiesta 4 I had and most of the Champion GQ. Just have a little left as extra.

Also added more PR seed, but not peat moss, on the middle side. That area is driving me nuts. It didn't come in well last Fall, either, and I'm not sure why. It's also infested with what appears to be Triv. Maybe I need to water better to improve germination. Maybe the Triv is allelopathic. Who knows.

Speaking of watering, I then hand watered all seeded areas. Tomorrow, I plan to set up sprinklers and seed the last couple of patches in the low input area.


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## JDgreen18

Hey @Green do you want some Hogans par 5 mix. I have a lot left over and during a mishap from Hogans they sent me another 15 pounds of it instead of tttf mix. They told me just to keep it. 
Let me know if your interested.


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Hey @Green do you want some Hogans par 5 mix. I have a lot left over and during a mishap from Hogans they sent me another 15 pounds of it instead of tttf mix. They told me just to keep it.
> Let me know if your interested.


Thanks. It looks like a nice mix. Tons of cultivars. But I have enough Bullseye and the 3 types of KBG from my original mix. The KBG is getting old, so I've been trying to go through it, but you don't need much at a time. So I have plenty of seed.

Hold onto the rest of the Par 5...it will last at least 4 years if stored properly. You'll be glad you did. Always good to have extra of your original mix for repairs.


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## JDgreen18

@Green ok was just checking...Ill use it on some areas of my yard on the outside of my fence towards my wood line.
To be honest Im not crazy about it the fine fescue lays down and im not crazy about the look of it. I originally bought a 50 pound bag for a heavily shaded area in my yard. I decided to take some large trees down to open up the canopy instead. Now they sent me another 15 pounds so I have about 45 pounds. 
Next year Im going to put tttf and kbg in this area now.


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> @Green ok was just checking...Ill use it on some areas of my yard on the outside of my fence towards my wood line.
> To be honest Im not crazy about it the fine fescue lays down and im not crazy about the look of it. I originally bought a 50 pound bag for a heavily shaded area in my yard. I decided to take some large trees down to open up the canopy instead. Now they sent me another 15 pounds so I have about 45 pounds.
> Next year Im going to put tttf and kbg in this area now.


Sounds good. If I had needed more seed, I'd have taken you up on the offer. I did add some more fine fescue in the reseeded areas in the low-input area. Originally, it was mostly fine fescue. Then trees were taken down like 7 years ago, which got me into this whole lawn thing. It was replanted with KBG/TTPR at that time. Actually the bulk of the yard was destroyed and replanted after that. Since then, I added more fine fescue when I had to overseed. Some of the PR from that October 2011 planting is still there, but not that much...a lot died in 7 years. Most recently, the fine fescue started dying in the parts that get the most direct sun after this Summer, since the area isn't regularly watered and is sandy with tree roots. So that's why I'm using mostly TTTF in the reseed areas now, hoping it'll hold up better. I threw a little fine fescue in some areas, as well as a lot of KBG, and a bit of PR.

There are times when I can't tell fine fescue from Tall Fescue immediately. It happened today. For some reason, fine fescue sometimes shoots out a wider blade which doesn't curl up lengthwise, and it looks like a narrow bladed tall fescue when it does that, believe it or not. At first glance, you'd think it was Tall Fescue or PR, but after you look at it, you realize it isn't.


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## Green

Today: Hand watered seed (twice in back, side, and low-input area). Dug out huge mushrooms (Hen of the Woods I think, frequent occurrence) in the front and replaced with sandy soil I had from when I edged last time. Didn't get to mow and spray PGR.


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## Green

Here's a shot of the first Tenacity experiment area right after spraying the first 5oz/A app on 9/28:










Note there is still some Summer-dormant grass.
@ken-n-nancy

It will be interesting to try it with Triclopyr on another area which also has clover to see if it reduces affectivity (yes, affectivity, since we're dealing with "Tenacity"  ), helps kill the clover, or reduces collateral damage to non-FF.


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## Green

The following photos are from 9/15/18. About half the recovery had taken place when these were taken. It never 100% recovered, so I had to seed:

Dormant/dead areas in the lower back (TTTF/KBG). Here are a few as they looked the middle of last month. Really odd patterns, but I really think it was just dormancy/heat stress, and not disease...unless some type of insect played a role:



















Close-up of the upper area in the previous photo:










Summer dormant walkway TTTF starting to recover (never lost all traces of green, but most):










Photos of the side yard (TTPR/KBG) Summer kill/dormancy (both areas reseeded last Fall as well, and then plugged this Spring):

Upper side:










Middle side:


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## Green

Also, these things popped up in my front overseed a couple of feet from the walkway. Can anyone guess what they are? Hint: they're seedlings, but not the desired type. And they're growing fast...










Here's one that's still really small:










They're Poa Trivialis seedlings! And I have no idea where they came from.

Some even have stolons already. I was able to get a bunch out, but not all by any means.


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## Green

Front (the part that didn't need overseeding) as of 9/15/18:


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## Green

Mowed the side front, blew off remaining leaves, and sprayed PGR. 0.3oz over the whole area, omitting the garage overseed, and making two passes on the front hill, hellstrips, and area between the garage and side front.

Watered seed in back, side, and low input twice.

Neighbor's mowing guys are sloppy, taking divots out of edges using zero turn riders, and screwed up the trimming around the boundaries, scalping to the ground onto my side and coming dangerously close to damaging tree trunks. Obviously they're using .105 or thicker line and don't know how to handle the trimmers, because they created a dip in the ground around my mulch bed.


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## Green

I'm starting to really wonder more if maybe Chinch Bugs played a role in the dead/dormant spots (see a few posts above for photos). There were definitely often small insects zipping around at about ankle level during the Summer in those areas. Anyone have any input on whether it was likely only heat stress, or actually heat stress + chinch bugs? @GrassDaddy


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## GrassDaddy

Could be. Do the can test.. cut a bottle or can at the top and bottom and fill with water, any chinch bugs will float.

There are also many other bugs like mites etc that can do similar damage.


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## Green

GrassDaddy said:


> Could be. Do the can test.. cut a bottle or can at the top and bottom and fill with water, any chinch bugs will float.
> 
> There are also many other bugs like mites etc that can do similar damage.


Thanks.

I was under the assumption that it's too late to know, now that it's cooler and the damage has recovered as much as it's going to. But I'm new to this the way you were. What time of year was your can test done? I may never know what happened. Never had this happen before, and it was like it went brown in those spots almost overnight, in early August I believe. To be fair, it was pretty hot and the soil was dry. Watering didn't help much though...they stayed for a couple of months. I'm in the middle of reseeding the patches now, anyway.

The small bugs I saw were flying at ankle level for weeks but didn't seem to bite. Not sure if chinch bugs fly. Maybe mites, if not...

Hopefully whatever it was, was just due to a weird year.


----------



## Green

Mowed the main front. Sprayed PGR there and on the upper side (minus seed areas). Rate was around 1/3 of full rate.

Watered low input seed once at the end of the day.


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## GrassDaddy

I did it about two weeks ago and saw the bugs. At the very least I know to be proactive for next year. The damaged areas are starting to recover in most spots.


----------



## Green

GrassDaddy said:


> I did it about two weeks ago and saw the bugs. At the very least I know to be proactive for next year. The damaged areas are starting to recover in most spots.


So I was at an event today and all of a sudden this swarm of bugs came out. I was like, what are these? This guy said that they look like what his lawn guy said were chinch bugs.

At home, I still saw a few of the same insect flying over the grass. I did the can test, but wasn't able to keep water in it more than a minute each time. I got some snails and a few spiders, but didn't see anything resembling chinch bugs.

I did manage to catch one of the bugs in my hand though, and it didn't look like photos online of chinch bugs to me. Whatever they are, they sometimes go near your face. Not sure if they bite.


----------



## Green

Today got to around 80, and dewpoint of 69 at 70% humidity, so it felt a bit like Summer!

I watered the seed areas, including the front, which I skipped yesterday due to mowing. And sprayed Serenade on all main lawn areas minus some of the overseed. Medium rate (2-3 oz) and a lot more on rust spots. Speaking of which...the rust is spreading now, primarily in the upper back. I didn't get to treat for a while...hoping it works.

There is a hint of new germination in the low input area.


----------



## Green

The Tenacity experiment area is just starting to whiten, so plan is to spray again later this week.


----------



## Green

Watered seed in the back, side, and low input area. Mowed lower back, side, and as much of the non-seeded parts of the low input area as I could.


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## Green

Nice warm day...about 80 and sunny with 68 dewpoint. Enjoying sitting with the AC on tonight...nice and cool. Rain tomorrow, and then the temps drop off a cliff the following day for the rest of the forecast period...50s and 60s for highs, and 40s and a few high 30s forecast at night.

I finished mowing the low input area in the dark, the flood prone part. Earlier I watered the seed areas, minus most of the front, which is getting more established.


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## Green

73 degrees and dew point of 70 with rain and near 100% humidity today. Got about one inch of rain so far.


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## Green

After a dew point of 70 yesterday, it's now 40. The temperature is in the 40s, too.

Rain total was at least 0.8 inch last night. More tomorrow morning.

Pruned tree on garage side.


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## Green

Got another 0.1 inch of rain last night, so I didn't need to water the seed today. I'm down to once per day in general now, since it's cooler.

Speaking of seed, here are photos from 10/9/18 of the low-input area overseed:

First 3 shots. This part is doing the best. It's the area where all the peat moss and seed migrated to after the first storm:




























And the other two-thirds where the seed washed away from:



















Close-up of germination in the second area showing densest germination:


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## Green

Watered the seed in the middle of the day.

Put down fertilizer at a bit over the 0.5 N rate on the side (more on the lower part, a bit less on the upper, and skipped the middle part entirely due to new grass that isn't ready for N yet, as well as Triv that would spread like crazy if fertilized). I used Ace 29-0-4 (with 7% slow release from methylene urea and PCSCU).

Later, mowed and mulched leaves in the front and upper back. Still at 3.75 in HOC for now.

Average first frost is always between today and the 21st, so it's coming...


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## Green

Got 0.2 in of rain last night. Watered seed around 4pm, then pruned the 2 lowest branches off the hickory in front. Blew leaves off side hill and sprayed 2nd 5oz rate app of Tenacity there. Mowed/mulched leaves on upper back and trimmed to get rid of leaves, then sprayed Serenade there and on some other isolated rust patches in the back and on the garage side. Rate: roughly 2.5 oz/1000 sq ft, heavier on worst areas.

"Chemlawn" fertilized neighbor's last Friday.


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## Green

Watered seed areas in low input area, but not the back or side due to having to mow.

Went after vines like Bittersweet. Not sure if it's too late in the season, but hoping it works. I soaked some paper towels in 8% Triclopyr amine concentrate, and cut/peeled the vines, and wiped the solution onto the cut ends.

Hand trimmed near hellstrip areas, and then mowed them.

Also mowed the lower back, side, and part of low input area.

Hand edged the remaining foot or two of the garage side driveway border using the linoleum knife I bought this Summer for edging.

Neighbor across put down fertilizer today. A bit late. Studies show reduced utilization this time of year.


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## Green

Watered all seeded areas, (including the low-input area twice). Went after a few more vines and woody plants with Triclopyr amine. Hoping it works.

Leaves are really coming down with the wind, which is good, because it means they're not all going to come at once in November this year.

The low-input area seeding is going decently well considering everything. Has some leaves on the grass, but it looks like it should be ready to mow in some parts in a few days! I'm going right to the rotary mower to makes sure everything gets cleaned up nicely.

I also pulled up the last few crabgrass plants I saw in the mulch in the back. Not taking any chances with that stuff and the seedheads!

Ordered Ammonium Sulfate for mid-Fall liquid spoon-feeding.


----------



## Green

Hit like 33 degrees last night, so we got frost. First real frost. Plants are dying. Covered plants and sod tray.

Watered seeded areas in back.


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## Green

Mowed the new grass in the low input area for the first time (exciting!), after quickly washing the car because it was over 60 today...warmer than it has been and will be again.

Used a 2.65 inch HOC. then mowed most of the rest of the area, using higher HOCs, but lowering to a degree in some areas. Starting to transition the height down for Fall.

Washed the mower, and then picked up branches and mowed/mulched leaves at 3.75 inch on the side front and hell strips.

That was enough for today. Tomorrow will be too cold...wind chill in the 30s.

Did not water today due to mowing, but we got some light rain last night and might again tonight.

Set side front zone to water for 30 min x4 tomorrow morning. In a few days, will follow up with a soap application and hand watering to help water infiltration.


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## Green

Photo updates of most overseed areas in the low-input area after the first mow yesterday. 
(1.5 weeks after the previous photos):


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## Green

Compare this area in mid to late July:










To yesterday:


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## Green

Watered low input area new grass.

Mowed the side and most of the lower back down to 3.25 in finally. Then picked up sticks, blew, and mowed the front, mulching up the leaves. Quite a few again. Still at 3.75 in. Accidentally hit one of those flag things for marking sprinkler heads, and cut it in half. It sparked and tore up the flag. Hopefully the blade didn't get too damaged.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 120 and 160 min. respectively tonight/tomorrow AM, to get about an inch down.


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## Green

Finished mowing the back, mowed the rest of the new grass area in the low input area and watered all seed areas except front. Mowed some more of the low input area down to 3.25 in. Blanket sprayed Tenacity on the parts where Poa gets bad, using around the 4oz rate. It rained about 45 min later, but experience tells me it will work fine. Also spot sprayed a few areas in other parts of the yard, like Dandelions, some Bentgrass in the front hill, Triv, etc.


----------



## jessehurlburt

Hey @Green I sprayed some clover about 10 days ago and it looks like it is still going strong. Is it too late for another CCO app? I thought I remembered hearing it needed to be about 55-60 for it to be effective..


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## Green

jessehurlburt said:


> Hey @Green I sprayed some clover about 10 days ago and it looks like it is still going strong. Is it too late for another CCO app? I thought I remembered hearing it needed to be about 55-60 for it to be effective..


You can try it again, but it might not work. I would do a follow-up since it's 10 days, and that's what you're generally supposed to do anyway. It's not that cold yet...it might still work.


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## Green

Watered seed from side to low input area. Covered plant but not sod tray since it's supposed to hit 31 tonight.


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## Green

Mowed and mulched leaves on the upper back, front, and far part of low input area. Took HOC in those areas down to 3.25 in.


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## Green

Parts of the low-input area overseed are under water now...the rain is puddling. Thankfully it's not supposed to freeze tonight.

Zoysia in the area is in the process of going dormant now...making note of that in case it turns out to be a good indicator for something else (like Forsythia/Pre-M).


----------



## Green

Got 1.3 inch of rain yesterday.

Sprayed a bit of shampoo on upper front hill, side front hill, and curb areas just now.


----------



## Green

That night, we got another bit of rain. 48 hours later tonight, there was still 1/8th inch of rain left in the container.

Covered plants due to frost likely tonight.


----------



## Green

Mowed side front (twice where needed in opposing directions), upper back, and part of low input area and mulched leaves. Had to bag mow and dump the leaves from the wet, poa-prone area, and part of it was too wet to even do that. Will hit that with a blower tomorrow. I left slight mower ruts in the soil surface where there was no grass. The adjacent area was bag mowed and then relocated.

Sprayed Serenade on upper back. Did not have time to measure, but roughly 4oz rate. Planning to finish mowing tomorrow, after cleaning the mower. Would also like to do my final Milo app of the year.


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## g-man

Milo in November? Interesting.


----------



## Green

g-man said:


> Milo in November? Interesting.


Yeah, but really only as carrier for Boron, so not much will be used. But still something that will help spoon feed while the bulk of it sits until Spring to help greenup. So, it does fit my overall strategy (with the methylene urea from the other fertilizers and whatnot)!


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## Green

Mowed and mulched leaves on the rest. 1-2 inches of rain predicted again, for the next 48 hours. Going to be a mess. I don't want to set foot in the yard for like a week now. Threw a pinch of Ace fertilizer in the sod tray.


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## Green

Got 1.5 inches of rain last night. And then nearly all the leaves came down in my area due to high wind all day. So much for wanting to get some Fall photos.


----------



## Green

Btw, dew point went up to 63 yesterday. I could not believe it. (It's at 30 now, and has been mostly in the 40s and 50s this past month, but has dipped into the 20s as well.)


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## Green

Yesterday: Mulch mowed the front, minus the hellstrips. 3 passes on the side front, and one (going really slow) on the main front. Probably 75 lbs of leaves mulched into each area...estimating.

The blower failed partway through. Luckily I had a backup and was able to finish the front, but there wasn't time to do the back regardless.

The rest of the yard is therefore still under varying amounts of leaves, and now it's going to be raining on and off for the next day or so. It will be 5 days like that before it dries enough to mow again.

The Tenacity experiment seems to be having a real effect, finally...some of the fine fescue is going a white-tan color and getting crispy. Maybe it'll keep it from coming back as strongly in the Spring, and give the KBG a chance to take over more. @ken-n-nancy After my experiment being successful killing Triv (and dramatically thinning the PR/TTTF/KBG in those spots as well) around this time last year with frequent doses of Tenacity, I'm starting to wonder if there's something to that, and that the trick to killing cool-season grasses with it might be doing so in October/November.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> The Tenacity experiment seems to be having a real effect, finally...some of the fine fescue is going a white-tan color and getting crispy. Maybe it'll keep it from coming back as strongly in the Spring, and give the KBG a chance to take over more. @ken-n-nancy After my experiment being successful killing Triv (and dramatically thinning the PR/TTTF/KBG in those spots as well) around this time last year with frequent doses of Tenacity, I'm starting to wonder if there's something to that, and that the trick to killing cool-season grasses with it might be doing so in October/November.


Interesting idea. As you know, I hit made my Tenacity applications on FF at the end of August/beginning of September, which ended up being only partially effective long-term, although it definitely bleached the KBG pretty solidly for about 6 weeks (4 weeks after the final Tenacity app).

Have you seen much of an effect upon the KBG from the Oct/Nov Tenacity application? I'm curious if your KBG regains color after bleaching before winter. I'm wary of sending Tenacity-bleached KBG into winter.


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## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> Interesting idea. As you know, I hit made my Tenacity applications on FF at the end of August/beginning of September, which ended up being only partially effective long-term, although it definitely bleached the KBG pretty solidly for about 6 weeks (4 weeks after the final Tenacity app).
> 
> Have you seen much of an effect upon the KBG from the Oct/Nov Tenacity application? I'm curious if your KBG regains color after bleaching before winter. I'm wary of sending Tenacity-bleached KBG into winter.


Thanks for the feedback, Ken.

I'll take a really good look in a few days after everything dries out, and report back. Maybe some more photos in the near future, too.

In early Sept., there was still marked Summer dormancy, so I held off a while, until early October before starting.

I took the risk, knowing that I have roughly 4 weeks from now until growth stops (7 weeks from when I last sprayed). But initially it didn't seem like it was doing much. The second and final hit was essentially 3 weeks ago on October 16th, and it's really just now showing any major difference.

My guess is most of the KBG will regain color in that area, which faces East-Northeast, and borders the driveway.

However, in the low-input area of the yard, I actually sprayed Tenacity at approx. 3-4oz rate on October 23rd. This area wasn't yet bleached last time I was out there, but if it bleaches (and experience says it will) it's not going to recover fully before Winter. So, we can keep an eye on that area, too. I sprayed for different reasons in that area (prevention of Poa annua germination, but used a surfactant regardless, to make sure I got anything already growing). Not the first time I've done this type of late spraying.


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## Green

Got almost an inch of rain today (and last night)--0.99 inch. More leaves came down.


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## Green

Started mulch mowing the leaves this afternoon. Did the lower back, side, and main front...5,000 square feet.


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## Green

Had sprinklers blown out today.

Finished mowing leaves and grass...did side front, upper back, rinse, and then low-input area (the 2/3 that wasn't soggy or a pond, that is).

Threw a couple tablespoons of the Ace lawn fertilizer on the daffodils near the main shrub bed. Not sure if it'll do anything to help the bulbs.


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## Green

Leaves before mulch mowing the other day:


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## Green

Got 0.7 inch of rain yesterday.


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## Green

Mowed entire yard (except hellstrips) between 3PM and 8PM and mulched leaves. Cleaned mower several times. Accidentally spilled gas twice, hopefully not on lawn, but definitely on mower. Upper back was last area. Mulch beds cleaned out. Good to go for another week. Mowing the low input swamp did not go well but it was covered in leaves. Used the full HOC for that. Anyone else ever tried to mow a swamp-lawn?

Can't believe there's more rain coming tonight and tomorrow...


----------



## Green

g-man said:


> Milo in November? Interesting.


Yeah, it's not happening until Spring (Milo with Boron). It's been too wet. Soon, snow, too. This is the year from hell as far as leaves and rain.


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## JohnP

I had a hell of a time with rain and seed and growth this fall. I used a product called Turface to help soak up rain. Had "swampy" areas that drive me nuts!


----------



## Green

JohnP said:


> I had a hell of a time with rain and seed and growth this fall. I used a product called Turface to help soak up rain. Had "swampy" areas that drive me nuts!


Tell me more...


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## JohnP

Here's where I threw it down. You can see some pictures further on of the standing water I had. It did a good job absorbing but I wished I had thrown more. I could've pry thrown 150# at the peak over the 1800sq ft area and been mentally okay with it.

Here's where you can find someone local.


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## Green

11/13/18:

I am so glad I finished last night and got the leaves taken care of as best I could.

1.13 inches of rain today, and the low input area is a pond. I hope that water doesn't freeze at night, especially on the new grass areas. Today there are also more leaves down again! Next dry and warm day I'll mow again to get rid of them...either Saturday or Monday...at least where there's no standing water or swampy lawn.


----------



## Green

Picked up sticks in the road and driveway. Picked up leaves from edges of driveway, lawn, street, sidewalks. Covered sod tray and will leave it covered. It seems every warm day is either the day of or day before rain.

Zoysia in the area is fully brown now.


----------



## Green

@ken-n-nancy, the Tenacity side front/driveway hill area has a good amount of FF bleached by Tenacity, and some that went brown as well. Some of the other grass (KBG/TTTF) is also bleached, but not as bad. That's about all there is to report right now. I'm happy with the results...they're about as good as I could hope for. The FF that's brown or white does not appear to be growing out at all, while the other grasses do. There was too much FF in that area, and it did not do well in the Summer. I will spray again after greenup next year, but at the 4oz rate the first time instead of 5oz. Remember, I've done two 5oz rate apps this Fall on that area.


----------



## Green

Looks like about 10 inches of snow. I just snowblowed carefully. The lawn (with leaves) is under there somewhere...really hoping everything is dry enough for the mower by Saturday.


----------



## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> @ken-n-nancy, the Tenacity side front/driveway hill area has a good amount of FF bleached by Tenacity, and some that went brown as well. Some of the other grass (KBG/TTTF) is also bleached, but not as bad. That's about all there is to report right now. I'm happy with the results...they're about as good as I could hope for. The FF that's brown or white does not appear to be growing out at all, while the other grasses do. There was too much FF in that area, and it did not do well in the Summer. I will spray again after greenup next year, but at the 4oz rate the first time instead of 5oz. Remember, I've done two 5oz rate apps this Fall on that area.


Thanks for the update on how that went. My lawn is now all buried under 6-7 inches of white stuff. If it doesn't melt this weekend (Sunday is forecast to be sunny with a high of 44F) then it will be here a while, as Thanksgiving week is currently all forecast to have daytime highs no greater than 36F and overnight lows typically in the teens.


----------



## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> Thanks for the update on how that went. My lawn is now all buried under 6-7 inches of white stuff. If it doesn't melt this weekend (Sunday is forecast to be sunny with a high of 44F) then it will be here a while, as Thanksgiving week is currently all forecast to have daytime highs no greater than 36F and overnight lows typically in the teens.


Same here, but we got more like 10 inches. And the following week after Thanksgiving is rain and snow every day at this point. I have leaves both under and on top of the snow! My update for today follows:

-------------
Shoveled extra snow cover off the edges to help it melt on time. There are still about 3 of the original 10 inches remaining in the front, and more in the back. The low-input area is a mess of slush, standing water, and ice...including my overseed. Not cool!

And deer are already eating bushes, so sprayed liquid fence.


----------



## Green

Recent precipitation totals:

27-Oct: 1.3 in rain
2-Nov: 1.5 in rain
6-Nov: 1.0 in rain
10-Nov: 0.7 in rain
13-Nov: 1.1 in rain
15-Nov: 10 in snow (some still on the ground)

That's like 5.25 inches of liquid precip. In the past two weeks. A lot of it has nowhere to go, so it's standing water (soon to be ice) on the low input area overseed.

Dew point went down to 12 the other night!


----------



## Green

Bit of rain last night, but nothing measurable, thankfully. Finally uncovered the sod tray. Walked the soggy main lawn, and shoveled and swept around the last bits of snow to encourage melting early tomorrow so I can use the mower. Then sprayed Serenade biofungicide on the tray and main lawn areas at 4oz rate. Probably my final app of the year. Haven't been able to use it in a long time. Had to spray on top of some leaves, unfortunately. Grass is matted down as expected.

At around 8PM, the grass was frozen solid, and I had to scrape ice off the car winshield before using it. It was 33F.

I'd like to get rid of some of the standing water in the low input area tomorrow, too, before it freezes solid. I may try a snow shovel and bucket, and bail out as much of it as I can.


----------



## Green

Finally got to mow today, as the snow was 99% gone on the lawn and it was warm enough to walk on it. It also wasn't quite as soggy as yesterday.

As expected, there were virtually no grass clippings in the bag (just one or two here or there, but you had to look carefully), which means growth is now stopped. Last mow had been on 11/12, so it was 9 days. I can now see that growth had almost totally stopped between then and now.

I mostly mulch mowed, but bag mowed on the upper back and side front. Many of these leaves had been underneath 10 inches of snow! Added some of the leaves to a part of the back where they could be mulched in. I did not do the lower side, but there weren't enough leaves to justify it today. I'll hit it when I do my final mow in a few days. I also did not get to mow the low-input area (did not plan to today). Which brings me to...

*There was still major standing water in a few spots there, so I went out in boots with a 5-gallon bucket and a snow shovel, and shoveled the water into the bucket and dumped it in the naturalized area. I filled the bucket over 10 times, so it was about 55-60 gallons. That's around 100 shovelfuls. It took 15-20 minutes. I wanted to get as much up as possible before it froze tonight, since it's supposed to go down to 12F tonight, and even lower (possibly much lower) tomorrow night.*

Covered my sod tray in at least 2 layers of cover material and positioned it near the basement step and against the wall, securing with bricks. I brought in the small pot.

Shut off water faucets, worked the valves a bit back and forth, and then turned them to partly open, and brought in all hoses except 2 short ones in the back. My dad actually took a trip to my grandfather's to shut his valves, too, after realizing it was going to be so cold the next two nights. Good thing he remembered.

12:45AM edit: The dew point is currently 3F. Yes, 3! 18 days ago, it was 63.


----------



## Green

It went down to 14 degrees last night, and is supposed to hit 10 tonight. It's 15 right now, and the dew point is, get this...-3! Lawn is covered in leaves again now...day after mowing. What else is new?


----------



## Powhatan

Green said:


> It went down to 14 degrees last night, and is supposed to hit 10 tonight. It's 15 right now, and the dew point is, get this...-3! Lawn is covered in leaves again now...day after mowing. What else is new?


Burr, that's getting cold. I've lived in Wisconsin and Alaska, and the coldest I remember was -20F in Wisconsin at night that lasted for two weeks.


----------



## Green

Powhatan said:


> Burr, that's getting cold. I've lived in Wisconsin and Alaska, and the coldest I remember was -20F in Wisconsin at night that lasted for two weeks.


That's pretty cold! I don't think I've ever experienced that, but it does tend to hit -8 a couple of nights during the Winter. When it's really cold like that, you get some PR dying off if there's no snow. Typically we get the whole 100 degree span from -5 to 95 each year here.

Last year we had a high of 11 one day. And a few years ago, it went over 100 in the Summer in Boston. I was with someone from FL at the time, and she was complaining about the heat!


----------



## Green

Well, the color is gone now. It's a dark gray-green now.

I got a bag of Scotts Starter with Meso from Ace today. Used the Black Friday coupon, and got it for $22. Normal price: $37.


----------



## Green

Final mow and winterizer...

I raked the flood prone low input section, and there was some ice. There is hardly any grass left, and will likely be even less by Spring. Looks like a sand/OM application and a Spring reseed is in order.

Did the final mow, but it was complicated by leaves. So I also had to bag/mulch some leaves. Took the height down to 2.6 in. I did everywhere except the upper back, which I plan to blow off instead next week.

Everything came at the same time this year...today.

The ground in some areas got hard. Slightly damaged my thermometer, but temps were still 36 and above, so I dropped a final winterizer using Scotts Greenmax at roughly the 0.5 lb N rate.

Was getting dark, so had to drop the fert first, and then mow the low input area after it...backwards.

Also dropped a low rate of Hi-Yield 0-0-0 Dimension 0.125% just in case, on that damaged/flood prone area, and across the back of the low input. It won't hurt anything, as these areas are the lowest section of the landscape, so runoff isn't an issue. 1.75 lbs of the pre-M.

Gave the sod tray (which I uncovered) a final trim. I hope the ground thaws a bit with the rain so I have an easier time digging next week to transplant that grass!


----------



## Green

Got 0.55 inch of rain last night, and the flood prone quarter of the low input area is now a pond. So glad I got to it yesterday before this!

Trimmed in back and front. Finished cleaning up the leaves after gutters were cleaned out. Used the blower to blow out of garage side and back beds, and washed the mower, then used it to bag mow the leaves on the sides, part of the lower back, and the upper back. Started on raking front beds. Got 5 bags worth or so with the mower alone.

There are already some more leaves starting to show up in the front. Something tells me I'm not quite done with leaves yet...


----------



## Green

Got 1.1 inches of rain yesterday/last night. Covered the sod tray and brought in the pot.

Rain totals the past month:
27-Oct: 1.3 in rain
2-Nov: 1.5 in rain
6-Nov: 1.0 in rain
10-Nov: 0.7 in rain
13-Nov: 1.1 in rain
15-Nov: 10 in snow (hardly any remnants left in the street)
24-Nov: 0.55 in rain
26-Nov: 1.1 in rain

Almost 8.5 inches of rain/liquid precip this past month.


----------



## Green

This afternoon, I picked up sticks and blew/raked/bag mowed leaves in the front and on the upper side, including the upper front hill mulch bed. I got a tarp-full from that bed, and about 5 mower bags worth of leaves from the lawn, too. It was snow flurrying, and then it turned into a wet, almost liquid snow. So, I was working on wet grass. Took the opportunity to rake some of the matted lawn areas where there was too much leaf mulch debris (front and upper back). I put some of the leaves in the back mulch bed. After, I planted some grass plugs on the garage side, which despite being overseeded starting in late July, is thinning out again already (due to shade problems).

I can't believe how little color is left in the grass. Partly due to weather, but also due to having had rust disease in the upper back, and of course my Tenacity treatments on the driveway hill created a lot of brown grass on that area. I also have a 10-foot-wide circle of especially brown grass around the small hickory tree. Planning to create a 4 to 5-foot diameter mulch area around it next Spring, mostly so the tree doesn't get damaged by mowing/trimming.


----------



## Green

Raked leaves in Northwest corner of yard (low input area). Unbelievably soggy there. Could not use the mower.

Used the mower to get leaves up on the garage side, upper back, and middle third of the low input area.

Planted a bit of the sod from the sod tray on the side front near the two trees, and in the low input area. Covered the tray again tonight, due to impending rain.

Front mulch beds were raked out again.


----------



## Green

The rainfall continues. Got 0.7 inch of rain today. Just checked it, and uncovered the sod tray so it dries out. Tomorrow will be last warm day for a while, but unfortunately damp from the rain. I'll be lucky enough to be able to do lawn stuff, but it will be damp!


----------



## Green

Got out on the lawn before the sun left, and took some measurements of where certain sprinkler heads, etc., are, and drew a rough map for reference. Put some markers in for three others.


----------



## Green

Raked leaves on the side front since my neighbor cleaned up his today. The light raking also got some airflow going.

Also sprayed Serenade on all main lawn areas. Got some water/ice out of the hoses, and shut the back faucet since it's getting cold for a week.


----------



## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> I raked the flood prone low input section, and there was some ice. There is hardly any grass left, and will likely be even less by Spring. Looks like a sand/OM application and a Spring reseed is in order.


What normally has happened with that area in the spring? Was that area renovated this year?

I'm always surprised at how little grass seems to be left in some of the sections of my lawn when I can see it at this time of the year, yet how much it comes roaring back in the spring.[/quote]



Green said:


> Also sprayed Serenade on all main lawn areas. Got some water/ice out of the hoses, and shut the back faucet since it's getting cold for a week.


Was the late Serenade treatment in an attempt as a snow mold preventative? Or has just really just been so that you can feel you did one last treatment before winter?

I've been trying to get a snow mold preventative (not Serenade; trying something different this year) down since just before Thanksgiving, but need the remaining snow to melt first....


----------



## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> I raked the flood prone low input section, and there was some ice. There is hardly any grass left, and will likely be even less by Spring. Looks like a sand/OM application and a Spring reseed is in order.
> 
> 
> 
> What normally has happened with that area in the spring? Was that area renovated this year?
> 
> I'm always surprised at how little grass seems to be left in some of the sections of my lawn when I can see it at this time of the year, yet how much it comes roaring back in the spring.
Click to expand...

No, it was not renovated. It's the area that always collects water. The last time I redid it was several years ago. I used plugs at that time. The grass seems to last a few years, but then thins out from standing water and Winter damage. The water is all ice now. I'm hoping it'll melt next Thursday when it warms up. If so, I'll bail it out again. I'm planning in April to topdress the worst parts of the area with a sand/peat mix to give a covering to help the water percolate below the surface so I can at least mow it sooner after a rain event. I will reseed at that time, using Jacklin "MyHolidayLawn" KBG. I'm also planning to apply Andersons Ultramate SG in the Spring a few times, which is similar to AIR-8 in some ways (it even has some KOH).



ken-n-nancy said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Also sprayed Serenade on all main lawn areas. Got some water/ice out of the hoses, and shut the back faucet since it's getting cold for a week.
> 
> 
> 
> Was the late Serenade treatment in an attempt as a snow mold preventative? Or has just really just been so that you can feel you did one last treatment before winter?
> 
> I've been trying to get a snow mold preventative (not Serenade; trying something different this year) down since just before Thanksgiving, but need the remaining snow to melt first....
Click to expand...

Yes, the Serendae is my attempt at snow mold prevention. No idea if it'll work, but worth a shot. No rain for at least a week now, so it'll stick around a while and have a lot of time to do its thing, I hope. Another reason I applied it is because it's been so wet here the past month. We've had about ten inches of liquid precip. in the past 6 weeks (counting 10 inches of snow around mid November). Who knows what else is going on fungus-wise from all that rain. Since it's been so cold and it already snowed a lot, I figure the snow mold pathogens have probably began up-regulating their metabolism, so maybe the Serenade will help prevent snow mold...who knows. I'm hesitant to use a chemical fungicide for that purpose...in fact, I refuse to do so for a few reasons.

By the way, the FF experiment area looks like dormant FF now. It's mostly brown. There is some green. No idea if that'll weaken it come Spring, or just delay it. FF can get by on such little resources that I'm not sure.


----------



## Powhatan

@Green I see you've been using Protene Organic Fertilizer 8-0-4, how do like that?

I just discovered the local turf & garden store which sells Southern Belle grass seed also sells the Protene Organic Fert 8-0-4 a 50 lb bag for $48.00. There's a price reduction for multiple items purchased. I won't have to pay extra for shipping.

I plan to use more organics next year and whatever retail product I use I'll probably mix it with rabbit chow (alfalfa) pellets.


----------



## Green

Powhatan said:


> @Green I see you've been using Protene Organic Fertilizer 8-0-4, how do like that?
> 
> I just discovered the local turf & garden store which sells Southern Belle grass seed also sells the Protene Organic Fert 8-0-4 a 50 lb bag for $48.00. There's a price reduction for multiple items purchased. I won't have to pay extra for shipping.
> 
> I plan to use more organics next year and whatever retail product I use I'll probably mix it with rabbit chow (alfalfa) pellets.


I love it. I like it the best of any I've tried so far. I've always used the name brand organics...I used to use the Scotts Organic, but they stopped selling it here years ago. Then I used Sustane for a few years. I've used their 4-6-4, 5-2-4, and 8-2-4. The Protene is comparable in price to the 5-2-4 Sustane per bag, with more bang for the buck due to higher N. Also, what's really neat is the Potassium in it is organic...Sunflower seed hull ash. I don't believe there is any soy in the Protene...I stay away from soy due to allergies. I apply 1 lb N in late Spring, using 0.5 lb N from Milorganite and 0.5 lb N from Protene 8-0-4. That's my only fertilizer all Spring.


----------



## Green

Finally repaired/modified the Scotts Edgeguard Mini spreader this evening. Looks like it'll work again. I took the edgeguard part out totally while I was at it. It was just in the way.


----------



## Green

Finished cleaning up the last few leaves. Used the mower on the low input area and got a bag and a half of leaves, and raked/blew a few in the front, garage side, and upper back. Spread 2 bags of mulch in the back. Tried to separate and lay the rest of the sod, but it was frozen solid so after the first few pieces, I took the rest in one chunk and laid it in the low input area where there was a depression where the water collects. Put leaves around the edges to insulate it. Mowing on nearly frozen ground is not fun, and you have to be careful not to tear the surface up. Front hill was still near 40F, warmer than most other areas.

Winterized aunt and uncle's lawn. Zone 7a. It was pushing it as far as timing; most areas were still 38 to 39F at 4 inches, but a few spots were already 33F and hard at 1-2 inches. I'm banking on the rain tonight and warmer temps tomorrow helping to thaw that so the fertilizer penetrates and works. Used roughly 1.5625 lb of Scott's 32-0-12 Step 4, and 8.333 lbs of 6-2-0 Milorganite mixed together, over 1,000 square feet (25x40). Idea was to combine fast release N with slow N that will work in Spring, as well as a bit of K and P. N rate was 1 lb/M, split equally between the two fertilizers.


----------



## Green

Over 50 today. Done with the mower until late Winter or early Spring. Washed it out, changed the oil (used Pennzoil 10W30) and air filter, added stabilizer to the gas, and ran it out. Also rinsed the Earthway spreader, sod tray, and 3-gallon sprayer. Took in the front hoses. Blew some more leaves on the garage side and upper back. Rain coming tonight or tomorrow morning. Brought more snow shovels into the garage.

I still have a few more things to do another day.


----------



## Green

Got 0.53 in of rain yesterday.

Started putting up snow stakes.


----------



## Green

Some photos:

Side front on 11/18/18. Quite a mess of snow and leaves (this was when the original 10 inches was almost gone):









Front in need of another leaf cleanup on 11/30/18. I had just mowed and Winterized a few days before. Color is going:









My sod tray on 12/1/18:









Front after a leaf cleanup using the mower on 12/1/18. Color is really going:









Closeup:









Low-input area progression (in reverse order):

Low-input area on 12/1/18:









Same area after overseeding, mid/late Oct.:









And in July when it all burned out:


----------



## g-man

What cultivars/ grass in the sod tray? Are you keeping it the garage? The color looks great next to the white snow.


----------



## Green

g-man said:


> What cultivars/ grass in the sod tray? Are you keeping it the garage? The color looks great next to the white snow.


Same mix as the front lawn. I finally dismantled it a few days ago and planted the rest of it. It was frozen solid by that time! I was keeping it outside, but covered it at night when it got really cold. The photo was taken after I had it covered for about a week straight during the snow, but before I covered it for about 5 more days straight prior to planting. There was a bit of rust and other disease, which is to be expected when it's covered that much. The white next to it is the cover.

This tray was from when I edged in the Summer. I'm planning to start more trays from seed in the early Spring.

Here's another photo of it from the same day:


----------



## Green

Trimmed some branches off a tree in the low-input area that got split last Winter. Put down about 1/3 of my remaining America KBG seed on the low-input area overseed area. Ground is freezing. Used the new blower to blow the upper back. Then it started raining. 2-3 inches of rain, and winds up to 50mph are forecast...lovely. Just what we need. That low-input area is going to be an ice rink. I really hope my overseed survives the Winter. I will dormant seed again in Feb or March, regardless.


----------



## Green

This is what the lawn looked like today after a lot of rain:









It went above 60 degrees, which is warm for this time of year. The only time it was a lot warmer was a couple of years ago on Christmas Eve when it was 72.

Around 4 inches of rain so far today. Not looking forward to this icing up at night in the next few days. Really hoping it drains better than usual with the warmer temps today. Not the best way to officially start the calendar Winter season.


----------



## Green

The rain gauge was nearly full...got over 4 (but under 4.25) inches of rain yesterday. Thankfully most of what you see in that photo above drained away since yesterday. The rest will freeze tonight.


----------



## Green

Did a leaf cleanup in the front mostly using the new blower, which worked really well after playing with the tubes. I got a whole leaf bag full, compressed. The last few years, it's consistently been around Christmas that I've had to take care of leaves until.

I also bailed about 25 gal of rain water from the flooded part of the low input area.

Took in the last two hoses.

Could get some snow tomorrow.


----------



## Green

Yesterday, got 0.75 in of rain. Some flooding in low input area as expected, once again.

Today, walked the main areas and picked up stuff by hand. A few branches, a wad of tape, part of a dinner roll (?), and about 100 leaves. Am I the only lawn nutso who walks around picking up the few leaves this time of year by hand? Or does anyone else do that too?


----------



## Green

Got at least 1 inch of rain last night. Dealing with flooding in the low input area again.

Hit 54 today in the sun. Soil temps were low and mid 40s in the front, and 40-43 in the back while the air temps were in the mid 40s.

Slight growth has occurred in the front since Thanksgiving.


----------



## Green

Rain totals:

27-Oct: 1.3 in rain
2-Nov: 1.5 in rain
6-Nov: 1.0 in rain
10-Nov: 0.7 in rain
13-Nov: 1.1 in rain
15-Nov: 10 in snow (hardly any remnants left in the street)
24-Nov: 0.55 in rain
26-Nov: 1.1 in rain

Dec. 2: 0.7 in
Dec. 17: 0.53 in
Dec. 21: 4.15 in
Dec. 28: 0.75 in
Dec. 31: 1.0 in


----------



## Green

Jconnelly6b said:


> Green - how did your lawn do this summer after the late spring we had?
> 
> I put a winterizer app down in November of 2017, had the late spring in 2018, and then was late to put down N (I believe I waited until May sometime) and I was hit hard by drought stress and fungus late in the summer.
> 
> I'm thinking, and please someone tell me if I'm incorrect, that the slow start and less vigorous growth in spring of this year resulted in roots not driving as deep. My turf looked much worse at the end of summer this year than years prior, and I did all that hooplah GCF biopack too.


It was a bad year...if you go backward through this thread, you'll see what happened. I can't link to it from the tablet, but page 5.


----------



## Green

Dec 31: Picked up more leaves and sticks by hand. Pulled out a few of what appear to be Perennial Poa annua plants on the garage side. I did not see any stolons this time. No seedheads, either. That stuff has been an issue in that area for years. @fusebox7 Also raked a bit in that area.

Happy New Year!


----------



## Green

Blew/raked the few leaves in the front and swept the curb area of the street.

Saw a patch of red thread disease in the front. I don't think I've ever seen it in January before. So much rain!

Poa Triv is going nuts with this weather...looks like it's spreading by the week.


----------



## Green

Jan. 5th: got roughly 0.75 inch of rain

Jan. 8-9th at night: thunderstorm. 0.25-0.3 inch of rain

Jan. 9th: picked up leaves in the yard by hand. And papers, too.


----------



## Green

The weather cooperated today and I had time, so I blew/picked up leaves and sticks on the main lawn and fluffed up areas that were welded down and frozen to the ground. Very cold weather, and snow/ice/rain are coming the end of the week and next week, so I think this was my last time until March doing anything on the lawn.


----------



## Green

Due to minor work being done inside and a bit of the front lawn being used for assembly and cutting (not ideal in the cold, but I also don't think it'll kill the lawn since the ground is now frozen) I've been cleaning up each night with the blower. Today (1/18/19) I also fluffed up the grass behind the deck to prepare for the storm. Some was matted and welded together from the rain last week and freezing temps after. I've also been using the blower on the areas where the workers have walked. I'm losing some of the leaf material over time from the traffic in the cold. Someone also accidentally drove over the side front edge (and 3rd sprinkler head) yesterday.

I walked most of the yard today as well. Probably the last time for several weeks.


----------



## Green

We had an ice storm two days ago. The day after, was wind and cold...a high of 8F and 0F in the morning. There are tree branches everywhere now, all over the lawn and driveway for example. They broke off.

A neighbor's vehicle deposited some Zoysia stolons and dirt in the driveway today. I swept them up and threw them away!


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> A neighbor's vehicle deposited some Zoysia stolons and dirt in the driveway today. I swept them up and threw them away!


Good call...can't let any of the nasty stuff spread! Is there any chance of you convincing them to nuke it and plant some "nice" grass?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> A neighbor's vehicle deposited some Zoysia stolons and dirt in the driveway today. I swept them up and threw them away!
> 
> 
> 
> Good call...can't let any of the nasty stuff spread! Is there any chance of you convincing them to nuke it and plant some "nice" grass?
Click to expand...

Thanks! You always have to be on the lookout for stuff like that!


----------



## Green

Today was crazy. At least 2.25 in of rain on top of the snow and ice, which mostly melted, flooding the low input area. It's a pond. I expect an ice rink over the coming days. Not sure what that'll do to the grass.

So, it got into the mid 50s. Near torrential rain is rare in late January; snow is much more common. Some places in the state picked up 4 inches near us.

Since the soil started to thaw, I was able to fix the part of the side front edge that someone ran over last week. I also spread out some of the remaining snow/ice near the edges in the front, but it was pretty solid and hard.


----------



## Green

Nothing today. Too cold. My neighbor is out using his push blower even though it's 32 degrees and the grass is frozen. Tomorrow is supposed to get up to 45, and is the day for that type of thing.


----------



## Green

Today was in the mid 40s, so I was able to blow/rake/pickup/sweep the sticks from the front (mostly side front), part of the upper back, sidewalks, and street in front of the house. I got one whole leaf bag full of sticks! The snow (which is like ice) is almost gone from all the lawn areas now. I wonder if this'll be the last time I rake until March...or not? To be continued...


----------



## Green

Going to go down to 2 or 3 degrees tonight and the high tomorrow will be around 15. We picked up a quick half inch of snow around sunset, which should help reduce low temp kill. The traffic over the same spots in the front repeatedly is killing me, though. Hopefully no long term effects from it.

Got 0.25 inch of rain plus snow the night before.


----------



## Green

Nice day. Mid 40s (about 10 degrees warmer than average). I blew and then dormant overseeded the high traffic borders in the front just for insurance. Mix of Bullseye, Flame, and Summer TTTF seed was used. Picked up some sticks.


----------



## Green

Today hit 62.5 degrees, about 25 above average. Swept up sticks in the street.


----------



## Green

Got about 1/3 inch of rain last night. It has also been misting this evening. Wind and some more rain tomorrow morning. The it's going to turn cold again (30s).


----------



## Green

Got almost 1/4 in of rain.

It warmed up to low 50s and sunny again after that. I did a bit of raking of trafficked edges, and finished fixing the area on the side front driveway side that had vehicle damage.


----------



## Green

Some photos from Christmas Eve. Still holding some color, but going...

Main front edges:



















This is the area that would receive a lot of foot traffic a month later. (We'll eventually show a comparison after the traffic):










Side front edge:


----------



## Green

Got some snow and sleet the other day. Everything is white now.


----------



## Scagfreedom48z+

You're still holding on to some color! If that stays, should be an easy and quick spring green up


----------



## Green

@Scagfreedom48z+, that was like 7 weeks ago. There's a lot less color now!


----------



## Green

We are back to average temps for this time of year (mid to high 30s for highs and 20s at night). There is light snow cover in most places. Lawn soil is frozen solid. Color continues to decrease.

I chopped and shoveled some snow/ice off the front near the road to help the piles melt faster and prevent all the salt from concentrating in one place.

That said, the Daffodils are just starting to poke up in the mulch bed, which is around 40 degrees. In a few weeks I'll have to fertilize them, and possibly cover them in cold weather if the buds start forming and trying to open.

It'll also be time to prune trees in a couple of weeks.


----------



## Green

Shoveled some more ice off at the front, and did some tweaking to edges by hand where they were eroding.

For some reason, we can't seem to get just regular snow this year. Every time, there has been sleet, or rain after, creating ice patches that take forever to disappear from the yard.


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> Shoveled some more ice off at the front, and did some tweaking to edges by hand where they were eroding.
> 
> For some reason, we can't seem to get just regular snow this year. Every time, there has been sleet, or rain after, creating ice patches that take forever to disappear from the yard.


Going to get just snow tonight lol...not to much tho.


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Shoveled some more ice off at the front, and did some tweaking to edges by hand where they were eroding.
> 
> For some reason, we can't seem to get just regular snow this year. Every time, there has been sleet, or rain after, creating ice patches that take forever to disappear from the yard.
> 
> 
> 
> Going to get just snow tonight lol...not to much tho.
Click to expand...

That was definitely not "just snow"! It was wet, hard and caked on when I shoveled. Thankfully it seemed to be less than an inch. But it was heavy and wet, as usual for this year. The pattern continues...


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> JDgreen18 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Shoveled some more ice off at the front, and did some tweaking to edges by hand where they were eroding.
> 
> For some reason, we can't seem to get just regular snow this year. Every time, there has been sleet, or rain after, creating ice patches that take forever to disappear from the yard.
> 
> 
> 
> Going to get just snow tonight lol...not to much tho.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That was definitely not "just snow"! It was wet, hard and caked on when I shoveled. Thankfully it seemed to be less than an inch. But it was heavy and wet, as usual for this year. The pattern continues...
Click to expand...

Yeah it was supposed to be just snow lol...oh well NE weather. Im ready for spring my grass looks like crap.


----------



## Green

Got 0.8 in of rain today.

Now back into the low temps. Tues. and Wed. may not even hit 30.


----------



## Green

Back yard has been mostly under snow for over a week now (some areas since 2/12/19...snow mold?), with more snow coming tomorrow night. Temps are still mostly in the 30s (sometimes colder) during the day.


----------



## Green

Picked up some branches, etc. before this evening when it started snowing. Next week will be in the 20s and 30s, and at least 6 inches of snow is expected tonight.


----------



## Green

Got 10-12 in of snow last night. Heavy, wet snow. My snow stake by the curb got broken when the plow pushed the snow because of it.


----------



## Green

Today was a snow melt day. Got over 50F today and was sunny. I started aerating/decompacting the small area along the driveway that got a lot of traffic this Winter. Soil temps in the front range from below freezing to above 40F depending on the area, taken at 6:30PM. Also shoveled some snow off the front.


----------



## Green

Photos from 2/4/2019:

Main front:









And side front:


----------



## Green

Yesterday and today: finished aerating/loosening soil on the high traffic areas, and removing snow from the front.

At this point, most of the snow is melted from the front, and even some in the back is melted. The far end of the low-input area is a pond again.


----------



## Green

It has begun...

Green-up has started. It'll take about a month until it's totally green again. Still mostly brown now, but at least it has started.

Raked mostly hellstrips today. Took 5 min. Easy.

Fertilized front walk daffodils a few days ago, using SOP, Espoma All Purpose organic 4-4-4, and Bonide rodent repellent.

Speaking of rodents, now that the snow melted in some parts of the back, I could see Vole/field mouse trails eaten into the grass, like last year. This time, looks like a tic tac toe board almost. Guess they were playing games. Hopefully it's not as prevalent this year. Will know next week after more snow melts. Too early to fix; needs to dry out first.

Got 0.6 in of rain.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> It has begun...


Congrats, Green! That's a special day.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> It has begun...
> 
> 
> 
> Congrats, Green! That's a special day.
Click to expand...

Thanks. Yup, I confirmed it today on my walk. It's really starting. Also saw some Robins yesterday. There have also been a lot of mosquitoes this past month. Maybe from all the rain. Thankfully they aren't biting.

It'll be interesting to see if my final Winterizer method produces a more robust green-up than average over the coming weeks.

So, first order of business is to start paper towel tests for the KBG seed, which is getting old unfortunately. Then fix the vole damage after that area finishes melting/drying out. Take soil samples in the front. Add gypsum at the edges for the road salt after that. And then tree pruning, which I'm still trying to figure out the best of action for. Also killing gypsy moth eggs.

Finally, during my inspection of the neighbor's yard, who is away, including the lawn, I noticed they have some Poa Triv, too.


----------



## Green

Raked the front hill, and finally removed the lights (don't ask!). Speaking of lights, I found a spike from very old solar lights that had surface in the mulch with the freeze/thaw cycles. Grass was in good shape already, and that area really didn't even need raking. Soil temp there was 44F. All the snow in the front is gone, and most of it in the back, too, except for a few areas (where it's solid, hard, and been there over a month, so hopefully no snow mold).


----------



## Green

Raked some more, mostly in the side front. Next door neighbor's lawn is more green. Compared soil temps, and theirs was 2 degrees higher, so that's the reason. Low 40s in both cases. Went into the backyard for the first time in like 2 months.


----------



## Green

Raked more of the side front and the edges of the main front up to the tree. Ordered Gallery 75DF pre-M. There is no more snow in the front, and it's almost dry everywhere now. There is a little snow left in the back in some spots.

As I rake, I notice the green disappears as the brown is fluffed up.


----------



## Green

Did a lot just now. Raked more of the side front. Finished decompacting edges. Added fertilizer to the bulbs on the front hill bed. Took soil samples from the edges in the front, and then put down gypsum on the edges.

In the back low-input area, I dormant seeded more America KBG, but it ended up being mud in some areas down there. I have to remember to take in the spreader and put out the rain gauge later.


----------



## Green

Got 0.5 inch of rain last night and today.


----------



## Green

Bought a pole saw and hedge clippers (both Fiskars) at HD. Then pruned the Hickory (after cleaning the saw with alcohol and letting it dry a few minutes)to eliminate the second competing leader and some other branches. I accidentally damaged some bark in a couple of places, very slightly, because it was such a tight area. The branch, when I finally got it down, appeared to be at least a foot taller than me, which was surprising. I am average height, so that means it was probably over 7 feet. It was also probably about one inch thick where I cut it off. The buds are still not too big yet, so I wanted to get this thing pruned ASAP.

Covered the daffodils with cardboard boxes because it's going down to 26 and the buds are sensitive now.


----------



## Green

Only a few small patches of snow left in the upper back now.

Front hill continues to slowly green up.

Checked soil temps. Some areas in the back were still frozen solid, but others were as high as 40 in the lower back and low-input area, but it varied how far the thermometer would go in. In the front, temps ranged from about 40 to nearly 50.

Noticed some yellow starting to show up on Forsythia. That means the buds are getting larger and starting to be noticeable at the threshold of human distance vision. Did not see any real yellow a couple of days ago.

Also noticed that the low input ovesreed (which is very rough looking from Winter soil disturbance such as ice and rain) is looking a bit green as well.

I went in the shed for the first time in months, and heard satisfying crunching sounds as I stepped on the dried out matted brown grass in spots. Foot traffic seems to help loosen it up a bit even before it's too early to rake.


----------



## Green

Fixed the vole damage in the upper back a few feet away from the grill.
Lightly raked the areas next to and between the damage to unmat it without disturbing the damage areas. Got down on all fours and systematically uncovered the damaged areas, dropped a few TTTF seeds - Bullseye - into them, pushed the dead grass (straw) back on top, and then stepped on it to lock it all in. Thankfully a lot less area than last year, but this method worked great last year.


----------



## Green

Covered the daffodils last night for the third and hopefully final night. There are just two small patches of snow left now.

Did more raking on the main front, and then took the rest of the front soil samples.

Then went to the low-input area to take soil samples and had all sorts of problems. First, I started hitting rocks/debris and started digging them out. Then I noticed that the soil at 4 inches down in the area that floods is different from everywhere else. I think it's silt or clay. It was red in color initially, turned brown when I mixed it all together, and I could mold it like clay. It has black layer on top of it from all the flooding over time. So, I finished sampling that area and plan to do a separate test for that area. The grass also died there again over the Winter, as expected. So, I'm hoping my sand topdress will help out. Planning to do that in April a little at a time, and then seed.


----------



## jessehurlburt

You thinking the third week of April for prem, Green?


----------



## Green

jessehurlburt said:


> You thinking the third week of April for prem, Green?


I don't know. It's hard to predict. But I will say I don't ever remember it being any later than that. I go by Forsythia/soil temps/GDD tracker as well as past history.

This year could be an exception and be later, though, based on how things look now. I mean, the grass is still mostly dormant right now.

That said, I'm going to have to start doing my pre-M ahead of time, because I will be spraying tank mix of Tenacity/Gallery for the initial round. And I have to use the hand sprayer so I have to break it up over a couple of weeks. Too much to do at once.

When you see me applying Dimension to my grandfather's yard, that'll be the real correctly timed application. Still need to buy stuff.

"Chemlawn" came to neighbor's this morning and blanket sprayed. The liquid coming out was yellow, so it had to have pre-M in it.


----------



## Green

Finished raking the main front and also did the border with the yard next door that was sprayed yesterday. Did near the patio where there was some Winter traffic. There is a one foot wide brown spot. We will see. Took more soil samples in the low input area.


----------



## Green

Got 0.34 inch of rain today. Flood-prone section of low-input area is a pond again...it's getting worse, and I really need to do some things about it this Spring. Noticed yesterday that the last bits of snow in the upper back had melted. Today, there is only a very small chunk in the street still left.


----------



## Green

Lightly pruned the spruces even though you're not really supposed to.

Covered the daffodils (with pillowcases this time instead of boxes as they're too large now to fit boxes) because it's going down to 26 tonight. Flowers are about to open up any day.


----------



## Green

Noticed what appears to be some spots in my neighbor's yard across the way of pink snow mold; though it could be red thread, but it doesn't look like it. Thankfully it seems I pretty much totally escaped snow mold this year. I wonder if my November applications of Serenade helped, or if it was just the lack of multiple long-duration snow cover this year. I did have the areas behind the deck stay covered from about Feb 12th to just a few days ago, so maybe the Serenade actually helped.


----------



## Green

Daffodils are starting to open.

I did some pitchfork un-compacting in the low input area on tire track areas from 2011 and 2012 that I never got to all these years. Also raked the garage side (but not the areas that aren't rooted well toward the back) and the upper side on the opposite side.

Back soil temps were mostly 37 to 43. Still not totally warm or dry enough to rake.


----------



## Green

Some very preliminary forsythia blooms today. Also, yesterday a nearby HOA was given its first mowing of the year. I'm holding off another week or two so the overseeded grass roots better. Going down to 30 degrees tonight.

I will start doing pre-M and grubex on Saturday since I have so much area to spray with the hand can. It'll take about two weeks.

Today, finished taking low input area soil samples and raked the lower back. While taking samples, I hit rocks. The third rock area turned out to be a disaster as I started digging with a hand shovel. 45 min later, I had torn up a good size area and the rocks kept coming. It was a pile immediately below the surface. I only got so much done before it got dark. It was a nightmare. Hopefully I'm done. I don't think I have enough extra soil to fill it all in, either.


----------



## Green

40 degrees today. Neighbor's mowing guy came and mowed for the first time of the year.

In other news, finished up my nightmare project from last night.

Dug out the rest of the rocks but did not have enough soil to fill it back in, so went to buy 5 gallons of sand for under 5 bucks, and mixed it with a bag of compost I had laying around to make soil.

It started sleeting about halfway through.

I'll add photos a bit later.

My hands are killing me.


----------



## Green

Got about 1/3 inch of rain last night. Low-input area flood-prone section is now flooded again, meaning I can't do anything back there.

I watered the fixed area from yesterday, and fixed a couple of smaller areas where there were also rocks that I dug up. Also watered the overseed area along the driveway where there was Winter traffic. It looks like there might be some germination starting; hard to tell. I really need to get my Tenacity/Gallery down on those strips before too many more days go by.

Some shrubs were also trimmed today.


----------



## Green

Put down Grubex on the low-input area minus the corner (~1K sq ft) that was still squishy. Used almost one bag.

Took soil samples on the side. Finally done. Looking forward to resting and no lawn stuff for a couple of days while it rains.

Looked at my cousin's lawn and helped him come up with a Spring plan involving Grubex, Dimension, Milorganite, and the ProPlugger. He had already raked his front yard last week, and it looks great. He was concerned about the brown grass in areas, but I assured him it was normal over Winter, and will grow out over the next month. Talked him away from EasySeed and toward regular seed and separate paper mulch, due to the low amount of actual seed in that product (though it did work pretty well I have to admit; he showed me an area that had been a mulch bed that he converted last year and it looked pretty good). I need to shoot him a quick follow-up email specifying that the pre-M can't be used where he is seeding...


----------



## Green

Got 0.3 inch of rain last night, and have flooding yet again.

Ordered my Gator G3 blade the other night.

Next priority: spraying pre-M starting late this week.


----------



## social port

Hey Green,
As part of my own decision-making process, I'm wondering: What is it that makes you want to cut with the Gator blade? Is it durability, cut quality, etc?


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Hey Green,
> As part of my own decision-making process, I'm wondering: What is it that makes you want to cut with the Gator blade? Is it durability, cut quality, etc?


Just want to try it, and also have a third blade, too! I heard it might help with leaf mulching, but this is the wrong season. Because My hands are in no condition to sharpen blades now after all that digging and soil sampling the past few days, I figured I'd just order it and install it for the first mow to test it out, and keep using it until it's time to rotate to another blade again. I already had bought the G5 version accidently end of last year, but returned it as it was too wide and heavy in my opinion. I'm looking to mow part of the front in the next two weeks for sure.


----------



## Green

Yard To-do list in order of priority:

-Start germination tests in baggies. Meant to do this a couple of weeks ago!

-Buy fert and fertilize Spruces done 4/9/19

-Continue tree pruning. (in progress 4/10/19)

-Clean 3-gal sprayer (done 4/11/19)

-Start applying Pre-M with Gallery tank mixed with Tenacity and surfactant...including most likely accidentally spraying a few feet onto my neighbor's border and their hellstrip, which they gave permission to do because I'm so bad with a sprayer and can't aim to save my life, but technically isn't allowed under residential lawncare, but hey, it's accidental. (*started 4/11/19*)

-Scrape Gypsy moth eggs off trees and destroy in soap. Where I can't reach, spray with horticultural oil (which I bought last year). Most of the trees are on the border, and belong to the same neighbor, and I pointed out all the eggs to him the other day. He said go for it. (*started 4/11/19*)

-Mail soil samples

-Order PR seed (ordered 4/15/19)

-Continue raking

-Continue applying Grubex (done 4/24/19)

-Start spoon feeding last year's low-input overseed (started 4/18/19)

-Read previous threads on glyphosate, and get any needed supplies for glyphosating Triv spots (e.g. citric acid, pH testing supplies).

-Go to TSC and Agway to see what they have that I might need

-Start sod trays

-Research mosquito and tick control because this seems to have the makings of a bad year (started on TLF 4/9/19)

-First mow (in progress; started 4/11/19)


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> social port said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Green,
> As part of my own decision-making process, I'm wondering: What is it that makes you want to cut with the Gator blade? Is it durability, cut quality, etc?
> 
> 
> 
> Just want to try it, and also have a third blade, too! I heard it might help with leaf mulching, but this is the wrong season. Because My hands are in no condition to sharpen blades now after all that digging and soil sampling the past few days, I figured I'd just order it and install it for the first mow to test it out, and keep using it until it's time to rotate to another blade again. I already had bought the G5 version accidently end of last year, but returned it as it was too wide and heavy in my opinion. I'm looking to mow part of the front in the next two weeks for sure.
Click to expand...

@Green I'm curious to hear your opinion on the G3.

@social port , since you were curious.

I have one in my collection of four different types of blades. It's heavier and thicker than my stock bagging blade (and really durable, too). I used to mainly use it in the fall for leaf mulching (turns leaves into dust for great OM), but discovered that it is a very versatile blade. It is a good compromise between the bagging blade and the Ninja mulching blade. I would use it to mulch my sunny front lawn and bag sections of my shady backyard to pick up the poly noses (maple seed pods) that would drive me nuts. It has less vacuum than the bagging blade, but enough to pick them up. Also, I would switch over to it from the Ninja blade (awesome mulcher/zero lift) after the spring flush, to maintain lift in the summer at higher HOC (4"), so the turf wouldn't lay over and be more susceptible to fungus.

@Green Please let me know what you think, once you've tried it in a couple of different applications.


----------



## social port

@Chris LI awesome information, thanks. I'm always on the lookout for things that my improve my mowing experience and results.


----------



## Green

Took delivery of the G3 mower blade. Looks nice.

Bought Evergreen/shrub fertilizer and fertilized the Spruces, as they have a bit too much brown, were recently pruned, and I don't believe were ever fertilized. I think I used just under the recommended amount. Raked it into the mulch right before the rain. Tried to keep it away from the inner areas under each tree, and more along the drip line than anything.

Noticed a Forsythia in almost full bloom maybe 0.25 mile away from home.

Tiny bit of rain today (looked like 0.02 in). I guess my tree fertilizer didn't get watered in.


----------



## Green

Today, raked the lower side and the rest of the lower back, as well as a bit of the upper back (where soil temps read 48F). Cleaned up debris at the street, and pruned a large section off the small tree on the garage side.


----------



## Green

Photos:

Main front on March 3rd, 2019:



















Side front on the same day:










I have never see such extreme brown from the Winter as this year. It's taking forever to green up.

Vole damage in upper back (3/26/19):










The last of the snow in the same part on the same date. (That's a 12-inch ruler):










Digging up rocks in the flood-prone portion of the low-input area while taking soil samples on 3/28/19:


----------



## social port

A couple of those rocks almost look like they could have been decorative at some point -- like the kind of rocks one adds to a bed bordering the foundation of a house.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> A couple of those rocks almost look like they could have been decorative at some point -- like the kind of rocks one adds to a bed bordering the foundation of a house.


Could be. Sawed in half, right? One appears to be coated in asphalt as well...
Now, wait until you see my next post...


----------



## Green

*You know you're in New England when...*

You're probing for soil samples and you keep hitting something hard...

So, you peel back the grass. And then start digging on your hands and knees, and rocks come up. And keep digging, and keep finding more and more and more...a pile of rocks under the ground (my hands are still recovering from this, 4 days later!).










It was actually more rocks than it looks like here, as many are hidden under the pile...I'd estimate more than a 5-gallon bucket-full, or 150+ lbs worth of rocks came out of that 4-foot-wide area, buried ranging from about an inch to about 8 inches under the surface. Now I know why the grass never did well there. I bet the rocks held the heat and heated up the soil a good few feet wider than that area, too...like an oven.

Fill 'er in and hope for the best!










I actually didn't have enough soil, so I grabbed some I had from edging last year, and used that, plus a quarter bag of Scotts Garden Soil, but it still wasn't enough. Went to the local masonry supply and got a 5-gal. bucket of sand, mixed it with a bag of compost I had laying around, and just barely had enough! It was 40F and started sleeting.

Finished job on the second day:


----------



## jjepeto

I feel your pain on the rocks. They are the worst. It's so hard to stop digging when you just keep finding them too.


----------



## Green

jjepeto said:


> I feel your pain on the rocks. They are the worst. It's so hard to stop digging when you just keep finding them too.


You have them, too?! Like finding gold, but in a bad way...


----------



## jjepeto

Green said:


> jjepeto said:
> 
> 
> 
> I feel your pain on the rocks. They are the worst. It's so hard to stop digging when you just keep finding them too.
> 
> 
> 
> You have them, too?! Like finding gold, but in a bad way...
Click to expand...

Turns out I live on a long, narrow, and shallow prehistoric lava flow... According to a friend of a friend geologist who took a look at my rocks.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> My hands are in no condition to sharpen blades now after all that digging and soil sampling the past few days,


Yeah, I get it now.


Green said:


> Fill 'er in and hope for the best!


 :lol:


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> My hands are in no condition to sharpen blades now after all that digging and soil sampling the past few days,
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, I get it now.
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Fill 'er in and hope for the best!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> :lol:
Click to expand...

Yes, the way I sharpen is with a manual file, so...no thanks, not right now. I took it mostly easy for a few days. The discomfort is almost gone now, but not quite. I did more sawing/pruning today...


----------



## Green

Washed out the Lesco/Chapin sprayer, finally. Scrubbed the inside well. Lots of residue because of the 3-way/MSO I left in it for months over the Summer. Still couldn't get the strainer perfectly clean.

Installed the G3 blade and started up the mower. Started on the second pull, as usual. Did some mowing for the first time of the year. Should be ok, since it's only going into the upper 30s tonight. Mowed the hell strips at the third setting down, and triple mowed the front hill, starting at that setting and then doing the next one down twice. I did scalp a couple of areas by accident because the ground is not perfectly even.

I measured the HOC (from driveway to blade) on the G3. I've never even bothered to do that until now. Settings are as follows:

-3 3/4 in (3.75 in)______0.375
-3 3/8 in (3.375 in)______0.75
-2 5/8 in (2.625 in)______0.5
-2 1/8 in (2.125 in)

So, I mowed the font hill at 2.125 in and the hellstrips at 2.625 in.

Weird that the increments between the settings are so uneven.

First impressions: The blade seems fine. It was not super sharp out of the box, but I installed it as-is. I didn't notice it being tougher to start because of the added weight, but it does take a bit longer to come to a full stop, as you'd expect.

Watered those spots in the low-input area that I worked on the other day.

Realized I left the soil thermometer in the ground overnight! On the upper back, it was registering about 45F when I removed it.


----------



## Green

Today, I got my temporary pre-M down on the most urgent areas. I put it down on the most flood prone parts of the low input area, and the overseeded portion, as well as a half app on my hellstrip, and a full app on the neighbor's portion of that hellstrip and borders with the neighbors. I also hit the first two or so feet along the main front driveway edge, and much of the front walkway edge, where I dormant overseeded.

Next door neighbor let me treat at least 2 feet over the line, and all around their bed. He actually wants some more Gallery so he can do more areas on top of those, and will reimburse me for the cost. Speaking of which, I have two neighbors who would like me to pick up some Dimension for them after I offered. How cool is that! I guess I make a decent salesman, lol.

So, my temporary pre/post-M is the 4oz/A rate of Tenacity, the 0.38oz/K rate of Gallery, and in many instances a dash of NIS.

Also put down Grubex on the most flood prone part of low input.

And started scraping gypsy moth eggs into soap to destroy them. Got the front done.


----------



## Green

Got 1.4 inches of rain last night.

Mowed the side front up to garage minus the part done last time. Took the flatter parts down to 2 in. Mowed main front where there was growth at 2.6 in.

Puller a couple of small Poa Triv clumps. But there is far more than be pulled or glyphosated. It's like an infestation all over again after the rain this past Fall and Winter. I'll keep doing what I can.

Put down 50 lbs Dimension 0-0-7 0.15 MOP on grandfather's. Miraculously it was relatively dry after the rain...no real squishy areas. That lawn is in bad need of a trim around the edges, and will need a mow in like a week or so. The reseeded areas from last year look great. Everything looks good overall, so my effort the past few years paid off. I put down about 10 lbs of 10-10-10 on the reseeded areas, using up the bag, and hope they'll strengthen up and survive.

Went lower rate on the main front--split app type of deal

The mosquitoes are bad. I don't ever remember them like this in mid April. I'm looking forward to learning what I can do about them so there aren't swarms this Summer.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> First impressions: The blade seems fine. It was not super sharp out of the box, but I installed it as-is. I didn't notice it being tougher to start because of the added weight, but it does take a bit longer to come to a full stop, as you'd expect.
> 
> Mowed the side front up to garage minus the part done last time. Took the flatter parts down to 2 in. Mowed main front where there was growth at 2.6 in.
> 
> The mosquitoes are bad. I don't ever remember them like this in mid April. I'm looking forward to learning what I can do about them so there aren't swarms this Summer.


I combined a couple of your posts in the quote to comment on them.

Are you bagging or mulching with the G3? I believe that you usually mulch, but might have missed it, if you mentioned it previously. It sounds like so far you have a positive opinion of it. They usually need a little hand file work when they're new, to get a nice edge on them (I think it's intentional, so the paint adheres and the edge doesn't chip in shipping). I'm also a hand file sharpener; so much that I wore out my "Handy File". With the worn file, I couldn't keep an edge on my blades, so I bought the cheapo 4.5" grinder from Harbor Freight, and finish up with the hand file.

How is turf density at the two different heights?

Have you tried mosquito dunks? Maybe you could drop a couple in those flood prone areas.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, I'm mulching. I almost never bag, but did a good amount of bagging in the late Fall last year. Just too many leaves and they would not all break down.

Yeah, the edge of the G3 was coated with paint, but I'm using it as-is. Not a big deal; it's sharper than the blade I took off, I think. My hands are fatigued, so...

I bought a new file, handle for it, and a cheapo balancing stand last Fall. My old file is kind of worn down, too.

The front hill grass is super dense right now; almost like a table top. Other areas don't get as much sun, and haven't full woken up yet. They're less dense.

I'm hoping to get another large chunk of the lawn sprayed tomorrow, and more gypsy moth eggs destroyed, because it looks like after that, the wind won't let up for a long time.

What are mosquito dunks?


----------



## Chris LI

They're biological control 'donuts'. I think they call them 'dunks' because you 'dunk' them in pools, standing water, etc. I got mine from Pestrong a few years ago, but haven't used them much, as you can see.


----------



## Scagfreedom48z+

Green said:


> Got 1.4 inches of rain last night.
> 
> Mowed the side front up to garage minus the part done last time. Took the flatter parts down to 2 in. Mowed main front where there was growth at 2.6 in.
> 
> Puller a couple of small Poa Triv clumps. But there is far more than be pulled or glyphosated. It's like an infestation all over again after the rain this past Fall and Winter. I'll keep doing what I can.
> 
> Put down 50 lbs Dimension 0-0-7 0.15 MOP on grandfather's. Miraculously it was relatively dry after the rain...no real squishy areas. That lawn is in bad need of a trim around the edges, and will need a mow in like a week or so. The reseeded areas from last year look great. Everything looks good overall, so my effort the past few years paid off. I put down about 10 lbs of 10-10-10 on the reseeded areas, using up the bag, and hope they'll strengthen up and survive.
> 
> Went lower rate on the main front--split app type of deal
> 
> The mosquitoes are bad. I don't ever remember them like this in mid April. I'm looking forward to learning what I can do about them so there aren't swarms this Summer.


I feel your pain with the POA T. The stuff is pure evil and is the reason why I'm doing a Reno this upcoming Fall. The outrageous amount of rain last spring and fall has contributed to this for sure. Are you doing anything this spring to fix the outbreak or waiting until fall?


----------



## Green

Scagfreedom48z+ said:


> I feel your pain with the POA T. The stuff is pure evil and is the reason why I'm doing a Reno this upcoming Fall. The outrageous amount of rain last spring and fall has contributed to this for sure. Are you doing anything this spring to fix the outbreak or waiting until fall?


I have killed so much of it over the past few years, and will be killing more of it soon. I'm going to find some citric acid and pH test strips on ebay for my glyphosate. Also adding in ammonium sulfate.

It's too windy to spray more pre-M now, so I decided to do some weeding...looking for small Triv patches and pulling them out. I got about 7 or 8 small clumps just now. But it's the big patches that are the issue. I'll use Roundup on some, and break out the Velocity if needed later in the season.

The problem is, it's in the seed apparently. I only use Blue Tag, 0.00 weed and 0.00 other crop seed on my front lawn areas, but I keep getting these little Triv plants time after time. I'd like to find Gold Tag seed in small quantities, but I don't know where or who has it. I guess for the front I'd consider other cultivars of KBG if I had to in order to get Gold Tag, because this issue is getting old.

Does everyone who plants KBG (or even Fescue/Rye) have this problem with contamination? I doubt the contamination came from my Fescue or Rye seed, though, because those seeds are bigger and they can filter better.


----------



## Scagfreedom48z+

Green said:


> Scagfreedom48z+ said:
> 
> 
> 
> I feel your pain with the POA T. The stuff is pure evil and is the reason why I'm doing a Reno this upcoming Fall. The outrageous amount of rain last spring and fall has contributed to this for sure. Are you doing anything this spring to fix the outbreak or waiting until fall?
> 
> 
> 
> I have killed so much of it over the past few years, and will be killing more of it soon. I'm going to find some citric acid and pH test strips on ebay for my glyphosate. Also adding in ammonium sulfate.
> 
> It's too windy to spray more pre-M now, so I decided to do some weeding...looking for small Triv patches and pulling them out. I got about 7 or 8 small clumps just now. But it's the big patches that are the issue. I'll use Roundup on some, and break out the Velocity if needed later in the season.
> 
> The problem is, it's in the seed apparently. I only use Blue Tag, 0.00 weed and 0.00 other crop seed on my front lawn areas, but I keep getting these little Triv plants time after time. I'd like to find Gold Tag seed in small quantities, but I don't know where or who has it. I guess for the front I'd consider other cultivars of KBG if I had to in order to get Gold Tag, because this issue is getting old.
> 
> Does everyone who plants KBG (or even Fescue/Rye) have this problem with contamination? I doubt the contamination came from my Fescue or Rye seed, though, because those seeds are bigger and they can filter better.
Click to expand...

Curious will adjusting the PH make the glyphs more effective?

Also what would AS contribute?

I'll be killing this crap off in august so just trying to pick brains.


----------



## Green

Scagfreedom48z+ said:


> Curious will adjusting the PH make the glyphs more effective?
> 
> Also what would AS contribute?
> 
> I'll be killing this crap off in august so just trying to pick brains.


I guess the general idea is you don't want the pH too high. The citric acid is used to lower it. I need to go back through all those discussions to make sure I understand it.

The ammonium sulfate also helps lower the pH, and it helps make the herbicide go into the plant better.

That reminds me, non-ionic surfactant, too.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, thanks. I'm going to look into those things.


----------



## Green

So, today I pulled some small Triv clumps. Then, raked more of the back and low-input area.

Before that, I scraped/destroyed gypsy moth eggs on trees in the back.

I then got the mower out and went over parts of the side front again because some more Oak leaves dropped. (Yes, the final leaves are finally dropping now!).

And then after the wind died down a bit, I did more of the super tedious hand-can spraying with the Pre/Post Tenacity/Gallery/NIS mixture. I finally finished up the front. Thankfully not too many bugs today, but it was humid because it was misting/sprinkling. I wore a dust mask so I didn't breathe in any drift.

My neighbor who always uses Lesco Dimension 19-0-7 was putting it down while I was spraying. I could tell due to the yellow bag. His lawn is still about half brown in the front because it faces North. I guess the N in that stuff will wake it up. I think he has 8,000 square feet, maybe 9, so that's a fairly high rate of Dimension, and that would mean at least 1.0 lb/M of N if he used a full bag (not sure how much he used).


----------



## Green

As of today, everything is dramatically more green, including neighbors yards that face North. I would say last night's thunderstorms must have released some Nitrogen!

Forsythia are in full bloom. So are some trees. I noticed trees dropping flowers today before the leaves emerge.

I ordered seed: a few lbs of America, a lb of Mercury to try in the low-input area, and couple lbs of Karma and Fiesta 4.

Got about 0.87 inch of rain last night.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> I would say last night's thunderstorms must have released some Nitrogen!


Yes! I love those days just after a thunderstorm. :nod:


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> I would say last night's thunderstorms must have released some Nitrogen!
> 
> 
> 
> Yes! I love those days just after a thunderstorm. :nod:
Click to expand...

Yes! And an interesting quote from Bill Kreuser hinting at another potential contributor to rapid Spring growth (and maybe green-up, too):

"_Turf usually grows at a rapid rate once soil temperatures remain around 50-55F. This explosion of growth is thought to be from freeze-thaw cycles during the winter which release plant available nitrogen._"

I had never heard this before @g-man posted the link last night.

I like that for the next couple of weeks, as long as it doesn't get too warm too fast, the grass will behave like it's under PGR.


----------



## Green

Bought more of my Spring supplies today...Dimension, a couple bags of Milo, and a bag of 8-0-4. Picked up Dimension for two of my neighbors while I was at it (a nice gesture, but also my way of making sure the crabgrass in the neighborhood stays under control!)

Speaking of which, my neighbor across the street put down his pre-emergent today, and next-door neighbor did their first app on the weekend, so we're making progress. The pros still haven't gotten to our neighborhood just yet. I'm hoping to get more of my own spraying done tomorrow evening.


----------



## Green

Raked the rest of the upper back. I'm done with raking now, except touch-ups and the walkway area.

It was too windy to spray, so I put down Grubex on the front instead. I also put down about 0.12 lb/M of N on the garage side. I saw that thing G-man posted, and wanted to give it a try. I used Green Max since it was handy and easily flows through the hand-spreader. I focused more on the really thin areas. The trees have not leafed out totally yet (just starting), so I think I did it in time. The grass has not fully waken up yet there, but oh well.


----------



## Green

Still a little windy, but was able to spray pre-M on the side, and the next 500 sq. ft. section of the low input area. Still have about 4000 sq ft left to do next week.

Put down moss out on the corner behind the deck. Pulled a Triv plant in that area.

Pulled a large amount of flowering Chickweed, some very large by now, mostly in the side bed.

Finally did the first spoon feed Nitrogen app on the low input overseed area. I used a bit under 8oz of ammonium sulfate, so maybe 0.05 lb/M of N. I sprayed the excess on the area that the furnace guy killed over the Winter, and the area adjacent to it that has shade problems in Fall and early Spring. Also some on reseeded patches from last Fall.

Updated the lawn to-do list:
https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=3351&p=142962#p142962

GDD tracker for crabgrass pre-M hit exactly 500 today, so we're getting into crunch time for pre-M...


----------



## Green

Dug out a couple of Orchardgrass plants on the garage side. I've drastically reduced the amount over the years in this area. It's just a plant or two every now and then now.

Removed the stake and tie from the Hickory in the front. I had had it supported all these years, but it doesn't need it anymore. I think the tree was holding up the support for the past year instead of the other way. Hopefully the bark will grow back soon where the tie was covering it before.

Let my neighbor borrow the garden weasel because he had been seeding, and chemlawn had sprayed pre-M a couple of weeks ago. Unfortunately, he may have inadvertently partly broken the barrier in other non-seeded areas, by raking.

Neighbor next to him on end continued raking today. He does not use a pre-M. He only fertilizes sometimes; he did not last Fall, but when he does, often uses Ringer.

Second neighbor I picked up Dimension for may have applied it today.

I also bought a bag of that Scotts "Foundation Soil Improver" with Biochar in it to try in the low-input area. On sale for 25 (regularly $30).

2AM Friday night updates:
-saw my first KBG seedheads today in the hellstrip.
-the current dew point is 63 at 66 degrees. Crazy.


----------



## ruxie88

Green said:


> Removed the stake and tie from the Hickory in the front. I had had it supported all these years, but it doesn't need it anymore. I think the tree was holding up the support for the past year instead of the other way. Hopefully the bark will grow back soon where the tie was covering it


I'm going on two years since my trees were planted. How many years was it before you removed the stakes?


----------



## Green

ruxie88 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Removed the stake and tie from the Hickory in the front. I had had it supported all these years, but it doesn't need it anymore. I think the tree was holding up the support for the past year instead of the other way. Hopefully the bark will grow back soon where the tie was covering it
> 
> 
> 
> I'm going on two years since my trees were planted. How many years was it before you removed the stakes?
Click to expand...

I think about 2 years, maybe 3 though. I had the tie in a different position on the bark before that. It was time to remove it.


----------



## Green

Got about 1.54 in of rain yesterday, and another .02 in today.

I noticed a few KBG seedheads in the hellstrip starting a few days ago.

Yesterday, bought a 36 lb bag of 6-4-0 Milo for $15 before everything switches over to the newer 32-lb bags that cost the same.


----------



## Green

Time to catch up on some photos as green-up progresses prior to mowing:

4/11/19: Area I've been spraying with Tenacity to try to reduce FF. Note the KBG (dark green patches) spreading in progress:









Front hill on 4/11/19 after first mow (2 inch HOC):









------------------------
Photos from 4/13/19:

I first noticed dandelions blooming in my neighbor's:









Flat part of side front before mulch mowing Oak leaves (the last of the leaves finally fell):









-------------------------

The areas in the low-input area prone to flooding are flooded now. Here is a photo (pardon the small image size, but you get the idea) from 4/20/19:


----------



## g-man

Green, it does seem like the low input area does take a lot of your time and input. Where is the water suppose to flow? What about digging a trench and grading the rest towards the trench to help guide the water out of there?


----------



## Green

g-man said:


> Green, it does seem like the low input area does take a lot of your time and input. Where is the water suppose to flow? What about digging a trench and grading the rest towards the trench to help guide the water out of there?


There really is no place for it to flow. It's a low spot and it also has poor drainage. I'm doing a soil test just of that area to start. So there may be amendments needed that will help drainage. I also have an Anderson's product with KOH, similar to AIR8.

I'm also planning to do a light sand topdress with a little bit of peat for OM, and then reseed, starting next week. There really is no grass left at this point.

As far as where it's supposed to flow, the best option would probably be the isolated semi-wetland patch to the left. I don't think trenching is a good idea due to the almost wetland nature of the nearby area, but maybe using the sand to help regrade...


----------



## Green

The saga continues...

I wonder if this is Jungle Rice grass?

@Powhatan

Also, what was that cocktail that was supposed to kill it? Tenacity plus quinclorac? If this is Jungle Rice, I'm not messing around, because I have tons of it! I think I'm going to order pure quinclorac if this is truly Jungle Rice. I thought it was Poa Triv, but I guess I was wrong.

Or is glyphosate the only thing that kills it? Please tell me no!!!!

It's also confusing, because some of it doesn't have the brown or red color at all, but it all looks the same otherwise.

Here we go...

Photos:


----------



## Green

More:














































I think the last two, maybe three photos are real Poa Trivilais...not fake Poa Trivialis, aka Jungle Rice...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Today:

Got about 1/3-inch of rain last night.

I mowed the hill portions of the side front at 3.375 inches. Will have to go back down in a few days. Hellstrips are fine at that height I think.

Also mowed portions of the overseeded area in the low-input area (first time this year). 2.625 in. It's super patchy right now, with large gaps.

Examined my grassy weed patches, per the above photos.

Pulled Poa annua on the upper side.

Put down some iron (moss-out) on the lower side under the neighbor's tree where there's tons of moss.

Looks like more pre-M application will have to wait until Thursday morning.


----------



## jay12645

I'm curious to know how your moss out application goes. I used some earlier in the season, admittedly went a little lite on the application but it speckled the moss so now it's half dead. It did ok but I was expecting a little better.


----------



## Powhatan

@Green

In your pictures, the single stems with a lot of maroon are definitely junglerice. The clumps are kinda hard to tell from the picture, but they do look very similar to what I saw earlier in the spring. The other stems without much maroon still look like junglerice, but as you say may be poa t. The difference without much maroon might be due to either being younger age or cooler temp?

@Jconnelly6b recommended "Tenacity + Quinclorac is the recipe". I don't have a spray tank, so I just found Roundup ready to spray for Northern Lawns that included 1.80% quinclorac and sprayed my whole lawn. It's been a week, nothing dying drastic showing yet for these weeds. I can't find any stronger % quinclorac in RTS so may have to either spray again or go back to using non-selective glyphosate or Dr. Earth.

With all the lawn pictures I take, I failed to take a picture of these weed clumps before I started killing them. The below picture is after the first application of non-selective Dr. Earth Final Stop Weed & Grass Herbicide. About a week later I sprayed it again and included areas further around it. It finally died in about two weeks. I've sprayed several using glyphosate and they died using one application.



I have a lot of it also. The back yard on this side is the worst. The brown areas I've already killed the clumps. Late last year with all the rain we had kept this soil moist for several weeks to months. Probably the perfect breeding conditions for junglerice.


----------



## Green

Thanks, @Powhatan. I ordered some Quinclorac, which I should have by early next week. Where is the recipe for the mixture of Quinclorac and Tenacity? @Jconnelly6b

The clumps in the fist photo are what the single plants I photographed came from. it looks like the brown coloration occurs after it's been growing for a month for so. I seem to have caught images of it forming that color.


----------



## Powhatan

@Green what we are seeing might actually be poa triv as discussed in another thread.

Since I'm not sure exactly what I have now, I'll just go back and consider it triv and continue killing it as before using either Dr. Earth or glyphosate. It will bite the dust one way or another.


----------



## Green

Powhatan said:


> Green what we are seeing might actually be poa triv as discussed in another thread.
> 
> Since I'm not sure exactly what I have now, I'll just go back and consider it triv and continue killing it as before using either Dr. Earth or glyphosate. It will bite the dust one way or another.


@Powhatan, now I don't think it's either one, to be honest.

It's not Triv, though. The gross morphology is totally different. But I don't think it's Junglerice, either, I think we messed up IDing it...twice.

"Poa Secunda" seems to fit the best, now. Let me know what you think.


----------



## Green

@g-man , @Powhatan...

Or maybe "Poa anceps"???

So, it's between Poa secunda and Poa anceps at the moment...


----------



## Green

Where to start for today...?

Got a bit of rain last night.

Grass seed is germinating now in the front where I dormant seeded along the driveway. It was really just insurance.

Put down Grubex on the side and back. Not sure why there's so much leftover.

Mowed the main front at 3.375 in. Next door neighbor put down Gallery on his edges and sprayed Tenacity to kill Winter annuals.

Weeded in mulch in front.

Unfortunately, my blade is too dull out of the box after all; I've got frayed tips.

Noticed some red thread disease in the front.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> Unfortunately, my blade is too dull out of the box after all; I've got frayed tips.


Is that the Gator blade? If you put a good edge on it with a hand file, it should have a nice quality of cut.

I've noticed that no matter how sharp my blade is, TTTF always has frayed tips.

My kbg doesn't seem to suffer as much.


----------



## social port

I'm noticing frayed tips on some of my fescue. It only happens in certain sections of the yard. It is strange. I'm beginning to think it is a combination of my mower and turf thickness.
With a pushmower, the cut is almost always clean. I see the frayed tips only when using the zero turn.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, I tried to get away without sharpening. Bad idea.

@social port, mine are very frayed...but I know why.


----------



## Green

Sprayed the gypsy moth eggs I could see with dormant oil. Used 5.5 oz to one gallon of water, high rate, since they'll be hatching soon. Sprayed Neighbor's Maples, too.

Continued applying my temporary pre-M, Tenacity plus Gallery plus surfactant. Finished the low input area, but did not get to the back yet. Went a bit lower than the 4oz rate on the extreme near end, as usual.

Grass is getting high on the side and in the lower back and low input area. But I need to wait out the rain, then sharpen my blade, take plant samples, and start killing that mystery Poa grass first.

Applied some Nitrogen (Green Max) to the garage side again (patchy part only this time). Leaves still not fully open. I did 0.55 lb of N rate this time. I also did about 0.25 lb N on the area in the front under the neighbor's tree and near the utility boxes. Last year, Chem lawn overshot onto that area with granular fert/pre-M for the neighbors, but this year they sprayed and did not. The N should really help both areas. Also applied to spot that furnace guy killed, which is starting to come back. And the lower side area where I used moss out the other day (eyeballed the rate).

Did some more raking in spots in the back.

Pulled more Poa annua on the side, and sprayed the ones on my border of the low input with neighbor yard.

Zoysia in my area is in the earliest stages of green-up in some places.


----------



## Green

jay12645 said:


> I'm curious to know how your moss out application goes. I used some earlier in the season, admittedly went a little lite on the application but it speckled the moss so now it's half dead. It did ok but I was expecting a little better.


I checked it the next day, and a lot of the moss was brown. I applied somewhat heavy based on past experience.


----------



## Green

Updated outdooor to-do list:

-Start germination tests (done)
-order terjet nozzle
-mail soil tests (done)
-take grass samples of unknown Poa species with red stems, and send for lab ID (done - 2 labs)
-Drill trays for drainage
-plant trays

-Research and order mosquito products (partly done - got dunks)

-go to TSC and Walmart (changed my mind - not going)
-look for faucet parts and contact plumber to repair
-dig out dandelions and errant plants in back lawn

-finish pre-M (done)
-buy supplies for glyphosate (may be ok with the regular stuff)
-dig up grass samples and submit (done)
-start spraying/painting glyphosate (first round done, and second one started)
-second Tenacity spray on front (did the side front along the driveway)
-spray front walk

-check sprinkler programs 
-remeasure and mark sprinklers
-start system
-contact sprinkler people for heads (done)
-install new controller

-string trim (done)
-sharpen blade (done)
-first mow on side, lower back, and low input area where needed (in progress)
-use proplugger

-prune shrubs
-finish tree pruning after leaf-out

-apply micronutrients
-2nd spoonfeeding spray
-first biofungicide spray

-get sand for topdress
-start leveling
-start flood prone area

-apply humic acid
-troubleshoot why Earthway spreader started leaking
-fix Scott's spreader
-source parts for chapin sprayers
-disassemble and clean 3-gal sprayer to hopefully fix air leak
-put air in wheelbarrow tire and lubricate
-lubricate mower wheels

-fix brick and rock bed borders
-edge hellstrip and patio by hand

-calculate how much mulch needed, and source it


----------



## Green

Got/are getting a lot of rain today and some thunderstorms/downpours. More flooding. Tomorrow we'll see how much rain there is.

Neighbor's (side) irrigation company came to turn on their system; the guy spent a long time, like 40 minutes or more this time. Hopefully he fixed the overspray issue, and programmed the controller so it no longer waters every day. That would be nice.

My second neighbor who I picked up Dimension for put it down within the past week.

My grass seed order from Hart Seed came today. They packaged in plastic bags this time, instead of the weave bags. Maybe because I ordered under 5 lbs...

Everything is Blue Tag 0/0, except for the 1 lb of "Mercury" KBG seed I got for the low-input area to try at some point, which is 0.01% weed.

The Quinclorac came, too!

Finally started my germination tests tonight. America, Rugby II, Bewitched, and My Holiday Lawn. Will check in about one week. The first 3 are 2012/2013 crop, and had fairly low percentage germination last year when I tested, but they did work, so we'll see. I'm hoping to get one more year out of the seed.


----------



## Green

Got 2.3 inches of rain yesterday. Had a few sun showers today, but didn't see any rainbows while driving. Still hear a few Spring Peeper frogs in the back.

Forsythia have been starting to drop their yellow the past couple days. I really need to get my pre-M applications finished...it's crunch time!

Neighbor D mowed for first time today. He didn't fertilize last Fall, but has decent green due to the rain.

Actually wore a Winter hat this afternoon for the first time in a while. It was mid 40s and windy. Even turned on the heat briefly an hour ago!


----------



## Green

Today was rainy. Not a lot, but light rain for most of the day. I ended up overseeding an area on my aunt and uncle's lawn that had died out probably due to crabgrass and/or leaves that were never cleaned up a few years ago. I raked it up to get rid of the dead grass, put down seed, starter with meso, and some Triple Start mulch. For seed, I combined a few types together. Roughly:

-30% Creeping Red Fescue (VNS)
-50% Jonathan Green shade mix (not the type with Triv in it!)
-5% Baron KBG
-15% Ace Tall Fescue Blend (Barenbrug)

As such, the individual species components of this custom mix work out to about:
-37.5% CRF
-35% TTTF
-10% TTPR (or PRG if you prefer)
-10% KBG
-7.5% Chewings Fescue

So, approx. 45% FF and 35% TTTF, which means 80% Fescue...good for low-input.

They are coastal CT, Zone 7a, technically on the Northernmost fringe of the transition zone (though it rarely gets above 90 in the Summer due to the sea breeze from Long Island Sound, and rarely goes below 0 in Winter).

Temps are supposed to drop to 36 tonight.


----------



## Green

Mowed grandfather's lawn for the first time this year, but it was the first time using his tractor style riding mower since the Fall, and the battery was almost dead, so I had to charge it. Took a while, but eventually started. Put me behind by about an hour. I string trimmed, then mowed. Then transplanted a couple of plugs into dead spots near the front corner. I hand-applied Lebanon Dimension/Acelepryn/25-0-5 fert to those areas after. I then sharpened and balanced one of my mower blades.

The grass I planted in his front yard bare spots last September (Creeping Red Fine Fescue plus Baron KBG in the center, and HBG plus TTTF along the edges) is looking good. Both seemed to blend in well with the existing grass in those areas (old KBG and FF cultivars in the middle, and KY-31 and weedy pasture grasses along the side).

By the time I got started at home after changing my blade, it was almost 7:30. I mowed the side front up to the walkway--3rd mow for most areas; second for the flat part. The garage side has yet to need mowing. I also mowed for the first time about 1500 sq ft of the low input area that abuts the lower back. Finished before it got dark.

Tomorrow evening, I want to finish applying pre-M, and then start spraying glyphosate on areas with Poa Triv.


----------



## Green

Another wet, cloudy day. Got 0.15 inch of rain between last night and today.

Finally got the back (upper and lower) done with the Tenacity/Gallery. GDD Base 32 was 760 today, so it's awful close.

Prior, I collected samples of the mystery Poa species and boxed them up and mailed to two different labs for ID.

Hoping the grass will be dry tomorrow morning so I can glyphosate the worst, most isolated patches, and then hit some other patches with @Jconnelly6b's cocktail to see what it does.

Received the rest of my seed today, including the sod quality Bewitched. Now that I got it, I won't have to worry about the UPS guy spreading glyphosate around with his feet anymore.

Side and back are badly in need of the first mowing, but I'm holding off until I get the herbicides down.

Gypsy moth caterpillars started hatching yesterday or today. Hit an egg clump on the side of the house and the caterpillars near it with dish soap. Will try to destroy it totally tomorrow.


----------



## Green

Sprayed glyphosate on Triv patches today. Looking to mow side and back for first time tomorrow.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> Sprayed glyphosate on Triv patches today. Looking to mow side and back for first time tomorrow.


Green, I'm curious to know how you are planning to manage the damage from the gly interventions. Are you planning to seed these areas before summer, or are you planning to have bare spots until the fall? Or perhaps you are trying your hand at painting?


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sprayed glyphosate on Triv patches today. Looking to mow side and back for first time tomorrow.
> 
> 
> 
> Green, I'm curious to know how you are planning to manage the damage from the gly interventions. Are you planning to seed these areas before summer, or are you planning to have bare spots until the fall? Or perhaps you are trying your hand at painting?
Click to expand...

I'm going to use seed and self-grown tray sod, and plugs or individual KBG plants in May and June, and then seed again in late August. I just hope that my new seed doesn't have more of the same.

If I didn't do anything now, it would have gotten worse. I killed a lot, but only killed patches or plants that were defined. There is a lot of interwoven stuff I can't do much about.


----------



## Green

Leaves are opening up now.

I mowed the main front at 3.375 in, and the lower back and side at 3.75 (first mow). Glyphosate seems to be just starting to cause browning. Mowed part of low input overseed at 2.625 in. It looks patchy and also weedy due to all the rain.


----------



## Green

Not seeing too much change yet from the Roundup. Just some minor browning starting in a few spots. Not looking forward to seeing a bunch of dead spots, but am looking forward to having the Triv and whatever else some of those were, gone.

Got some rain today.

Walking yesterday and today, I noticed Zoysia is at least half greener up now.

I also noticed that the lawns in my neighborhood that are mostly TTTF and FF with a bIt of KBG, currently look the best (in terms of density), especially those that were recently edged. The Fescue is fully awake now and growing vigorously.


----------



## Green

Rain was 0.3 inch.

After dividing and transplanting some plants, I did my second Tenacity treatment on the area I want to reduce FF. I did 5-6 oz rate (closer to 5), and added a second area nearby. Actually two others. I did not add Triclopyr, as it seems to be a pain. I also don't have the Ester version. The article discussed using the Ester. Will spray again once it whitens. Wish I had gotten to this last week while it was still white from the initial spray. I can do one more, and then I'm maxed out for a while as far as allowable limit.

I then string trimmed for the first time on the side and in the lower back and near the shed.

Roundup seems to be working, but it's pretty slow. I see slightly more browning each day, but you still can't tell from a distance.

Tree are still blooming, and leaves in the process of opening. We've had average temps alternating with cool temps and lots of rain. The grass is behaving as if it's under PGR even though it's not, which is awesome.

In my seed tests, the Bewitched is showing the early signs of germination starting. None of the others are yet.


----------



## synergy0852

Do you have a link to the article you're referring to by chance? I'd love to thin out the fine fescue in my yard as well...hate the lighter color in spring and fall and brown haze during summer.


----------



## Green

synergy0852 said:


> Do you have a link to the article you're referring to by chance? I'd love to thin out the fine fescue in my yard as well...hate the lighter color in spring and fall and brown haze during summer.


Ok. So, the article isn't about FF. It's about using Triclopyr in Tenacity to reduce whitening. I personally didn't find it useful to try yet, but if you'd like I'll link to the article.

We already have some threads going about Tenacity to thin out FF from other grass. It was something a few of us kind of just stumbled upon by accident. We're still not sure yet how well it works, but we're trying. Preliminary results of mine seem to show it does something, but I don't think the effect is going to be night and day, more of a slight transition.

I have some areas that really bake in the Summer, and there was way too much FF there, despite overseeding with KBG several times over the years. The medium to high dose Tenacity treatments might be the missing link in getting rid of some of the FF.

I did 2? treatments in the Fall, and am doing three this Spring. After that, I'll fertilize. I'm also doing an area I didn't hit in the Fall. I'm not trying to totally get rid of the FF, but there is just too much of it; there were some small areas where it was the dominant grass, where it really shouldn't be. I want the KBG to get more of a foothold, because it tolerates heat better.


----------



## synergy0852

I have the exact same issue with it in my lawn as well. I'm going to give the Tenacity a try at the higher rate then. Typically I've only used a 4oz/A rate. Thanks for the tip!


----------



## Green

Steady rain all day today. Probably will be about an inch when it's done...at least. The Spring peeper frogs in the back are loving it. I'll just need to be careful of them when I mow. Temps were in the low 50s all day, believe it or not. Great grass weather.

Bought a bag of Jonathan Green Siduron (Tupersan) plus fertilizer today. It's made by The Andersons. Wanted to have some on hand since that AI is being phased out. Never used it before. Not cheap...$50 for 15 lbs (covers 3,000 sq ft area). Had a $10 off coupon. Got the last bag on the shelf.


----------



## Green

Got 1.17 inch of rain yesterday.

Today, mowed main front, side, and lower back at 3.3 in. Second mow for the latter 2 sections. Color is darkening and grass is now dense. The new growth phase is over in much of the front. Also mowed part of the non-overseeded region of the low-input area.

Glyphosate is starting to show results in the front after some sun today. I noticed there are still more patches of that Poa-whatever that I missed the first time I sprayed. Aiming to spray again Wednesday.

I need to get a new pair of shoes.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> I noticed there are still more patches of that Poa-whatever that I missed the first time I sprayed


I hate it when that happens.

Also, time for some pics :nod: 


Green said:


> Color is darkening and grass is now dense.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Also, time for some pics :nod:


Yes, time for some pre-Roundup photos, since that was the best it's going to look for the next few months.

Today, I went outside real quick and put down a low rate of fertilizer on the low-input overseed right before it started to rain. I did all except the part closest to my next-door neighbor's yard, because I ran out of fertilizer in the spreader, and it started raining. Putting down 1.75 lbs of Expert Gardener 29-0-3 over 2,000 square feet is not easy with small regular urea prills and polymer coated prills. Scotts is so much easier to spread evenly in low amounts due to the smaller size of its particles!

Rate was 0.25 to 0.333 lb of N per thousand.

I then blew off some areas where I had clippings left from the last time I mowed on the front hill, and from trimming just now.

Before that, I string trimmed in the front, and near the garage. First time there this year.

Roundup spots are proceeding along "nicely". Planning to spray again tomorrow, including hitting some spots I missed.

Germination tests as of this morning showed widespread germination in the Bewitched bag (about 50%), but nothing yet in any of the others.


----------



## Green

Got a tiny bit of rain last night.

Finally got mosquito dunks for the flood-prone area until I can fix that issue since it holds standing water. (Thanks @Chris LI !). Unfortunately, while most of the recent water had dried up (still soggy but not currently ponding), there were a lot of mosquitoes around. I wish I'd known about and gotten these things a month ago. I broke one in half and put the halves in each side of the area.

I also started the second round of Roundup, but only got about halfway with it. One gallon sprayed so far. Will have to mix another gallon and finish up tomorrow morning. After that, I'll have to get gas for the mowers, and then get ready to go over and mow at my grandfather's.

I pulled up some small Triv plants in the upper back and examined and photographed them. I'm nearly convinced now that's what the stuff we've been trying mightily to ID is. Thanks to all who are taking part and helping out with the process in that thread.

I inspected the currently soggy, far part of the low input area, and it looks like some of it is all interwoven Poa Triv right now, outgrowing the good KBG and Fescue. I believe I only irrigated the area one or two times a year the past couple of years.

Finally, placed an order for a Toro 22" Recycler (#20379) with Honda engine! $349 before tax, and $371.16 with tax.

-----------------------------------

Tomorrow:
-Finish 2nd round of glyphosate
-Get gas and add stabilizer
-Mow grandfather's (and trim and pick up sticks)
-Finish trimming and mowing at home
-Put down fertilizer on rest of low-input overseeded area

Weekend:
-Mow
-Start up sprinkler system and measure
-Start grass trays


----------



## ruxie88

Green said:


> Weekend:
> -Mow
> -Start up sprinkler system
> -Start grass trays


What are grass trays and why?


----------



## Green

ruxie88 said:


> What are grass trays and why?


A tray that I plant seed in to transplant later. I can grow a lot more than in individual pots that way. Plus, with TTTF and PR, you really need sod. Plugs won't cut it unless the holes you're fixing are very small.


----------



## ruxie88

Green said:


> ruxie88 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What are grass trays and why?
> 
> 
> 
> A tray that I plant seed in to transplant later. I can grow a lot more than in individual pots that way. Plus, with TTTF and PR, you really need sod. Plugs won't cut it unless the holes you're fixing are very small.
Click to expand...

Understood. Thanks.

I think i want to continue introducing KBG to my lawn via plugs and overseeding/ dormant seeding during the right time of year.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> Finally got mosquito dunks for the flood-prone area until I can fix that issue since it holds standing water. (Thanks @Chris LI !). Unfortunately, while most of the recent water had dried up (still soggy but not currently ponding), there were a lot of mosquitoes around. I wish I'd known about and gotten these things a month ago. I broke one in half and put the halves in each side of the area.


You're welcome! Good luck. I hope you reduce the population significantly. They act as a larvacide and it is good to drop the dunks once you notice some pooling. I forget the exact timing, but I think it's about a week to develop into adults from larvae. You have to monitor frequently to stay on top of things, but I know that's not an issue for you, from past experience. Our county Vector Control would monitor traps at least twice weekly for the facility where I used to work.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, what do you have to monitor with the dunks? To make sure they're working?


----------



## Green

@tgreen, my Velocity program from 2017:
(I went way too low and too often, and started too early, but had some positive results.) The g/gal entries were spot sprays. I'm only going to do blanket sprays this year.

4/20/17: 0.7g/gal Velocity (note: roughly 1oz/acre)

4/24/17: 0.4g/gal Velocity

4/27/17: 0.55g/gal Velocity

5/1/17: 0.7g/gal Velocity

5/9/17: 1.0g/gal Velocity

5/16/17: 1.2g/gal Velocity (note: roughly 1.75-1.85oz/acre)

5/30/17: 1.3g/gal Velocity

6/7/17: 1.62g/gal Velocity (main front)

6/15/7: 0.4g/gal (main front)
..........2.0g/gal (side front and back, and side blanket spray)

6/21/17: 2g/gal (main front)
6/25/17: 2.3g/gal (all except main front; side: blanket spray)

7/3/17: 2.94g/gal (front including blanket on main front)
7/4/17: 2.94g/gal (back spot and side blanket)

7/17/17: 2.94g/gal (back spot and blanket on main front and side)
7/25/17: 2.94g/gal (spot sprays on side and a bit on main front to use up mixture from 7/17)

8/3/17: 2.94g/gal (blanket on main front and side. Spot on side front and some parts of back)


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> @Chris LI, what do you have to monitor with the dunks? To make sure they're working?


Once you have enough standing water to be able to see it pool, look up close for larvae swimming around. They'll look like tiny worms. If you had recently applied one of the dunks and you can see the larvae, it's time to toss another one (or part of one in for a small area, as you did). If the water is clear of larvae, continue to check on it every day or so, to keep an eye out for hatched larvae and apply the dunks as necessary.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, thanks, I just threw them onto the ground. The package said no issue if it dries out.


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## Green

Sprayed 2nd round of Glyphosate today, including a few more patches. I also merged some areas that were a few inches apart by spraying the green between them. That way, if any Triv was there, it doesn't come back in the same spots.

Pulled up a few Timothy tillers in the upper back.

Mowed grandfather's lawn (overgrown; it was 10 days. I should really get there in 5-7 days the next time based on that).


----------



## Green

Mowed today. Mowed the front and sides plus the lowest and highest parts of the lower back. Mowed the upper back for the very first time this year. Mowed the far part of the low input area (at 3.75 in since it was a bit high) for the first time plus a lot of the rest of it including the overseed from last year. Almost everything has now been mowed at least once.

Hand trimmed in front.

I find that the first mow causes an increase in growth rate, so I was putting off doing that soggy, far end of the low input area. The ground is so uneven now from all the rain. Crazy.

@social port, I'm having basically the same situation you had a month earlier. Are you still getting too much rain? I think we had rain every day for 3-4 weeks. That's what someone said! Too bad I couldn't put my seed down on the areas I'm killing, yet. It's been perfect for that, and just my luck it'll be drier once I'm ready to seed.

Also threw some Green Max on the opposite end of the low input overseed area to help thicken the extremely thin grass. And on that area that I dug up back in March where the rocks were as well.

Scraped that dead gypsy moth egg mass off the wall finally and into soap.

Opened the irrigation system.


----------



## social port

Hey @Green , yes, I'm still getting lots of rain down here. It has pretty much been raining all day today. I had planned to take advantage of that by applying some products that need to be watered in, but I didn't get the opportunity. Once Sunday passes, I am headed into a solid 5 days with no rain, so at least I may be able to get a post emergent spray down early next week.
Temps are conducive to disease. Locals say that we had a short spring.

Daily rains complicate mowing and postM plans. It makes me wonder how LCN and other Florida lawn hobbyists get things done.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Hey Green , yes, I'm still getting lots of rain down here. It has pretty much been raining all day today. I had planned to take advantage of that by applying some products that need to be watered in, but I didn't get the opportunity. Once Sunday passes, I am headed into a solid 5 days with no rain, so at least I may be able to get a post emergent spray down early next week.
> Temps are conducive to disease. Locals say that we had a short spring.
> 
> Daily rains complicate mowing and postM plans. It makes me wonder how LCN and other Florida lawn hobbyists get things done.


It's already getting hot there?

A far as Florida, I don't know. Good question. One idea though is that the almost daily rain tends to occur in the late Spring through early Fall (that whole period is Summer there), when it's typically 80-95 degrees for daily highs, and the sun is really strong in South Florida during those times of year as well, so I would guess it tends to dry out quicker as well, considering that and also that the rain often only lasts a half hour. During the late Fall through early Spring, it's typically cooler (60s and 70s for highs are common), but there is also less rain in general. Fort Myers, for example, gets about the same amount precipitation per year as my area (50 or so inches), but mine is evenly spaced out over the entire year and some of it is snow. Your area seems to get a lot spaced out over the whole year, too.

What you and I have been having the past 6 months, is more like the PNW from what I hear! How do they get anything done?


----------



## social port

I've seen temps of 89 degrees already, but projected highs for next week fall in the low 80s. Definitely humid. Seeing probable signs of disease in lawns around town.


Green said:


> What you and I have been having the past 6 months, is more like the PNW from what I hear! How do they get anything done?


I have no idea, but they seem to be able to make it work. That makes me think of PNW George (or a name close to that) who has an amazing lawn with stellar landscaping to match. I believe he grows creeping bentgrass. He won, or was at least nominated for, LOTM last year.


----------



## Green

@social port, 89 is crazy. I remember one year in early or mid May a few years ago here, it was in the low 90s for like 4-5 days, and there was no rain at all. Everyone (who cared about their grass) was going crazy trying to water to keep everything from burning out. That is not how you want to start the Summer off.

Today's high was about 45 with the rain, I kid you not. You could see it when you breathe. Quite a way North of us in Northern CT and Mass, there was apparently some snow, and the Mass DOT was actually plowing on the highways. I'm not complaining about the weather here, that is for sure! Grass is acting like it's under PGR. That means root growth is happening.

Yeah, PNW_George, Shindoman (Vancouver), etc. Apparently, they also hit 89 already this year.


----------



## Green

Got 1 inch of rain yesterday.

Had my irrigation guy here first thing this morning to change some things up in the front. One of the heads was set too far in from the boundary and was moved. Another was too close my tree, which has gotten bigger, so it was moved and interchanged for a 6-inch pressure regulated head (which should also help overall coverage since it's more centered between two others now). Along the road, he moved the center head 3.5 feet to the left, and then added a head at the right corner (also a 6-inch pressure regulated head; I never had a corner head there). To top it all off, while he worked on those, I worked on one on the opposite side of the driveway near the curb, and swapped it out for a 6-inch regulated head, and him check what I did before I filled it back in. So, lots of upgrades today.

Note to self: the head near the tree had a 3.5 LA gray nozzle, and the front sidewalk one had a 0.75 black nozzle. I'll need to replace the current ones with those when I adjust the heads. I think I'll put the 1.0 in the new head.

And it started raining again.

Guess what I just saw in the cracks in the road starting to come up...crabgrass. It's that time of year.


----------



## Green

Got 0.42 inches of rain yesterday.

Sprayed glyphosate today for the 3rd time. I used 1.5-2oz per gallon this time. Each time, I've been finding new Triv areas to spray. But I can't do any more new ones the next time. I already have too many. I'm going to have to start reseeding soon. I hope the spots that were sprayed 3x will be dead soon. I lightly raked before spraying to expose more of the green. Been using AMS and NIS each time.


----------



## Green

Got this today. New mower! Toro Recycler 22-inch with Honda GCV-160 engine. :mrgreen: 
Started up on the first pull.
Photos before using it for the first time:





































Put it together, set it to 3.25 in, and tested it out by mowing the Side-front, lower back, and side. First impression: Pretty powerful engine! I like it. It decimated a couple of small sticks I forgot/neglected to pick up because I was so excited to mow.

Watered the areas where the sprinkler work was done the other day.

Ran the mower for 15 minutes on the driveway before using. Then mowed for about 40 min. Have to keep track, and change the oil after the first 5 hours.


----------



## social port

Oh Nice!!

I can't wait to hear about your experiences with it.

Congrats!


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Oh Nice!!
> 
> I can't wait to hear about your experiences with it.
> 
> Congrats!


Thanks! I wanted the Honda engine so badly...$349 before tax. May is the best month overall to buy mowers...they have the most sales.

The old mower will be used for leaf mulching, which is messy, as well as some other things.


----------



## JDgreen18

Nice mower green you will love it. I got my Toro super recycler last year with the honda engine always first pull start everytime. Btw, grass is looking lush in the mower pics &#128077;&#128077;


----------



## SNOWBOB11

Always good to take a picture of the mower when it's new. It will never look that good again. :lol:


----------



## Green

@SNOWBOB11, yeah, especially with all the pollen this week!

@JDgreen18, so far I'm pretty impressed. The only negative is the large rear wheels somehow make it harder to push and turn. But that's nitpicking. There was no Toro 22" with Honda engine and smaller wheels currently available. Thanks. I haven't shown the Roundup spots yet...a necessary evil. Though you can see one small one in one or two of the photos.

Used it about another half hour, so about 1.5 hours so far. Took my foam grip off. Still adjusting everything. Mowed the main front.
------------------------------

Watered the install areas.

Mowed and trimmed at grandfather's. Took 80 min to mow and extra time to trim. Wasn't overgrown from a week ago, thankfully. Picked up some sticks.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> large rear wheels somehow make it harder to push and turn.


I take it that the mower isn't equipped with the personal pace system?


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> large rear wheels somehow make it harder to push and turn.
> 
> 
> 
> I take it that the mower isn't equipped with the personal pace system?
Click to expand...

No, it doesnt. And I have fairly strong feelings on this topic. It was a hard decision and I actually started researching all these models last year. In the end, I actually didn't want a Personal Pace system after talking with my neighbor who bought one a couple years ago, because I wanted to be able to easily go manual and push on demand, and opening the grip to release it it fairly natural. The Personal Pace is nice, but is always on, and was a deal breaker due to that. The ideal system would probably be a Personal Pace system that also allowed locking the system off on demand with a quick motion to go fully manual. But that doesn't currently exist. Every mower available now is a compromise in that regard.

I'm really liking the 2-bail system, though, because I can go manual on demand. It's a good alternative. This is the first self propelled mower I've used. The front wheel drive on it is pretty good; you just don't want to set it too fast or it goes all over the place and you can't mow straight. I also rarely bag mow. For someone who goes slow and hardly bags, FWD is a fine system. I also like being able to make turns without releasing the drive. There were also no Toro Honda engine mowers currently available around here with Personal Pace (except the more expensive 21" Super Recycler), which made the decision easier. But yes, I prefer the standard handle due to ease of going manual, and also the hand position comfort (No plastic handle). Being average height, it's also at a good level. My neighbor with the Personal Pace is a bit on the tall side (3-4 inches taller), so his hand position may be slightly different with respect to comfortable level. Allyn Hane, who is slightly shorter than me, sometimes comments that the handle on the Personal Pace is a bit high for him, especially on the higher setting. And he doesn't have hills to go up.


----------



## Chris LI

Good luck with the new mower! It's always nice to be able to start it and go. I replaced a really good second hand 21" mower, because I got tired of replacing all sorts of parts and having to band aid it, just to mow the lawn. I saved it for a future restoration project.

If you have any bumps or unevenness in the lawn, the larger wheels will help reduce wheel hop and provide a smoother ride.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, yes, there are definitely bumps and uneven ground!
-------------------------------------------------------
Today, watered the sprinkler work areas.

Then, mixed up my seed and started reseeding the Roundup patches in the front, starting from near the driveway and front walk. Also did the two small spots on the side front near the driveway.

Before seeding, I raked the dead grass and clipped it down to about 2 inches using the hand shears, and then put down the seed, lightly raked, and stepped on it. The dead grass will act as straw to keep moisture in. I'm not even bothering with peat moss at this point...no need for it. It might be too much covering, actually. Believe it or not, some of the dead grass still had a hint of green.

Then, watered it. I'll have to water by hand 2-3x per day for a few weeks.

My seed mix for the front was composed of:
-80% TTTF
-10% TTPR
-10+ percent KBG

-2.5 lbs Bullseye
-1 lb Firecracker SLS
-0.5 lb total: Titanium 2LS, Flame, and Summer

-0.5 lb total: Apple SGL, Karma, and Fiesta 4 (going a bit higher on the Apple SGL than the others)

-0.3 lb Bewitched KBG
-0.45 lb sod cert. Rugby II KBG (germination test with paper towel showed zero germination after 2 weeks, so just threw some in as extra)

All seed was 0.00 weed and 0.00 other crop. The Bewitched and Rugby II were old (2013), but the Bewitched still tested well. Maybe because it was stored in a plastic bag instead of a mesh bag?

I also went a bit heavy on the seed, maybe 10 lbs per thousand (threw it down by hand), to compensate for the fact that some of the seed was a bit old, and that the old dead grass might inhibit some of the germination by shading it out. I can always overseed lightly later in August if needed. I used slightly less seed, plus extra straight "Summer" TTTF on the areas closest to the front walk like I did the last time I seeded (it's a finer textured grass than most).


----------



## Green

Also, we've been getting a little rain almost every day still, but it looks like that's dwindling down lately. There are now days or even two in a row here and there with none.

Lots of spraying needed over the upcoming days. Not sure how I'm going to do it all:
-1st app of PGR on the front
-Second app of Tenacity on the main front and front hill
-First app of Biofungicide
-Bt spray on Hickory tree (I noticed a few small gypsy moth caterpillars munching away the other day.)
-Tenacity second app on low input overseed area
-Final(?) app of Roundup on a few areas
-Spoon feed app on low input overseed

Also need to get the garden fence somewhere, and research more about mosquito control and decide if I'm ordering that other stuff.

*It's a little less than 2 weeks since the second Tenacity app to try to thin FF out some more on the side front along the driveway, and it's whitening. Sometime in the next week, I'll spray the third and final app on those areas, at 5oz/A again. The Tenacity is also whitening the Poa Triv that I discovered in the top of that area last week.

Lawn photos coming soon.

Reminder: check soil temps tomorrow. Been a while.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> 2.5 lbs Bullseye
> -1 lb Firecracker SLS
> -0.5 lb total: Titanium 2LS, Flame, and Summer
> 
> -0.5 lb total: Apple SGL, Karma, and Fiesta 4 (going a bit higher on the Apple SGL than the others)
> 
> -0.3 lb Bewitched KBG
> -0.45 lb sod cert. Rugby II KBG (


What a nice list!
Was the firecracker from an old batch from a previous year?


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> 2.5 lbs Bullseye
> -1 lb Firecracker SLS
> -0.5 lb total: Titanium 2LS, Flame, and Summer
> 
> -0.5 lb total: Apple SGL, Karma, and Fiesta 4 (going a bit higher on the Apple SGL than the others)
> 
> -0.3 lb Bewitched KBG
> -0.45 lb sod cert. Rugby II KBG
> 
> 
> 
> What a nice list!
> Was the firecracker from an old batch from a previous year?
Click to expand...

Thanks. The Firecracker SLS was from 2017, I believe. But I bought more last month, too. The Bullseye is the one that's no longer available. That was 2017 or even 2016 crop.

Not sure if the Rugby II will work at all so just threw some in as extra. I didn't use any America, either. I figured less KBG used, less chance of more Triv in the reseed. 
-----------------------------------

Last night, I checked my paper towel tests, and the Bewitched from 2013 (provided and stored in plastic from the dealer) has at least 70% germination, very strong showing. None of the others have any signs of germination, and I had to discard the Rugby II due to mold. All those were in standard seed bags. Wonder if there's a connection.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> social port said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> 2.5 lbs Bullseye
> -1 lb Firecracker SLS
> -0.5 lb total: Titanium 2LS, Flame, and Summer
> 
> -0.5 lb total: Apple SGL, Karma, and Fiesta 4 (going a bit higher on the Apple SGL than the others)
> 
> -0.3 lb Bewitched KBG
> -0.45 lb sod cert. Rugby II KBG
> 
> 
> 
> What a nice list!
> Was the firecracker from an old batch from a previous year?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks. The Firecracker SLS was from 2017, I believe. But I bought more last month, too. The Bullseye is the one that's no longer available. That was 2017 or even 2016 crop.
> 
> Not sure if the Rugby II will work at all so just threw some in as extra. I didn't use any America, either. I figured less KBG used, less chance of more Triv in the reseed.
> -----------------------------------
> 
> Last night, I checked my paper towel tests, and the Bewitched from 2013 (provided and stored in plastic from the dealer) has at least 70% germination, very strong showing. None of the others have any signs of germination, and I had to discard the Rugby II due to mold. All those were in standard seed bags. Wonder if there's a connection.
Click to expand...

Sorry to hear about the Rugby II. That is a very cool seed selection, which fits in with the conversation we were having earlier in the spring. Can you send photos of it, when appropriate?


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, I'll be taking photos tracking germination. The thing is, I forgot I still had a little bit of Champion GQ left (which is Poa free). It might not have been enough, though. I think I'll use it in the mix on the garage side (which has less of a Triv issue).

To be clear, the Ruby II test was discarded, not the actual seed bag from the dealer. Some of it should work. But last year, only one seed germinated in my test.


----------



## Green

In addition to watering install areas, I seeded the dead patches in the front. There are still some more where the kill is in progress and I couldn't seed, though. I noticed that the soil was totally dry by 1 PM, so I'll water earlier and consider top dressing too.

I ended up using the string trimmer on the dead grass before seeding.

Tomorrow I'd like to get the garage side done, as well as spraying some products, and mowing. And Lime if it's dry enough.

Tossed out the rest of the germination bag tests. Nothing other than Bewitched germinated. Moral: store seed in plastic bags.


----------



## Green

Did not get to spray due to wind (next few days are windy).

Watered the seed in the front twice.

Mowed the lower back and lower side and low-input area (half the yard). I used the old mower on the weedy portion, set to 3.75 in again. Then cleaned both mowers with water.

Added two more mosquito dunks in the flood prone area, broken into halves.

Put down Lime at 9 lbs per thousand (SoluCal - one 50 lb bag) on the rest of the low input area. Did not do Epsom salt today due to time.

The yard that abuts the low input area appears to be almost totally that stalky red-stemmed Poa (Triv?), and is about a foot high.

Ran the Toro for another hour. So 2.5 hours so far. Need to buy oil for the 5 hour mark.


----------



## Green

Got about 0.2 in of rain last night, including melted hail.

Today was warm and sunny (mid 80s) and a bit humid (mid 60s dew points). I watered the front seed and install areas once.

Before that, I applied my first PGR app to the main front (0.5oz with NIS, 4 gallons). It was already getting windy. Between the rain and wind, spraying has been tough to get in.

Trimmed with hand shears.

Sprayed a little shampoo on the front borders, and ront hill/side front up to the marker and edge of the flat part.

Got another 0.1 inch of rain this afternoon.

I pulled weeds, including a few Stiltgrass plants at the edge of the street. Really need to get another Tenacity app down soon.

Neighbor's mowing guy came, and he also mowed my neighbor on the other side as well. Looks like his mower was set to 3 inches, but it mowed under 1.5 in some spots due to the ground. Better than those knuckleheads from last year.


----------



## Green

[mention]Chris LI[/mention, are the dunks supposed to dissolve fairly quickly and disappear, or stay around and visible for a while?


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, are the mosquito dunks supposed to dissolve fairly quickly and therefore disappear after a few days, or are they supposed to stay around and continue to be visible for a while and dissolve slowly?


----------



## Green

20 mph wind...mowed during it. Front, side, and upper back (2nd mow there). My allergies were tested as it was raining pollen, maple keys, and sticks. Pain to mow around all the seeded spots. Probably ran new mower another hour. Front hill a bit overgrown. Lower side is growing fast...this was the second mow this week there. Must be the PR.

Watered the spots in the front 2x. Watered the main front road border as well.

Tomorrow: trim. Hopefully also peat moss and more seeding. More spraying?? Water hellstrips.

Soils temps were 60s to 70s in the front today.

Ordered a quart of "MosquitoBarrier" from the manufacturer.


----------



## Green

Finally put peat moss on most of the front spots. They were just drying out too quickly for comfort. Watered the spots before and after.

Hand watered the hellstrips/edges, including where I had dormant seeded along the main front driveway edge in front of the car to the sidewalk.

Sprayed 0.3oz of PGR and 4oz rate of Tenacity with NIS on the side front. A bit heavier on the front hill. And 4oz rate of Tenacity with NIS on the main front (there was still a bit of PGR un the tank, too).

Sprayed Roundup 2nd app on the spots that needed it with what was leftover from last time. Hopefully it'll work. I'll have to make up another half gallon next week to finish up, I guess.

Tomorrow: trim and seed the garage side spots.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> @Chris LI, are the mosquito dunks supposed to dissolve fairly quickly and therefore disappear after a few days, or are they supposed to stay around and continue to be visible for a while and dissolve slowly?


I think it takes a little while. I had a tarp covering my patio furniture over the winter and I dropped a dunk in a pool of water on it during the rainy spell this spring. A week ago Saturday, I pulled the tarp off of it and discovered about half of it was still there.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, thanks. I swear the previous ones dissolved.


----------



## Green

Watered the main front overseed spots, but not the install areas today. Got a tiny bit of rain this AM (immeasurable in the gauge) and a tiny bit (even less) now.

String trimmed and blew in back.

Planted the Roundup spots on the garage side this evening. 80% TTTF (60% Firecracker SLS and 40% Bullseye), 10% PR (Champion GQ - SR4600, SR4420, and Zoom), 10+ percent KBG (10% sod cert. Bewitched, plus a bunch of the old sod cert. Rugby II thrown in). No peat moss. Left the dead grass full length as straw, and stepped on it to substitute for rolling.

Mowed and trimmed grandfather's lawn, and topped off Dimension barrier on main front and ac side using 2.75 lbs of Lebanon 25-0-5 Acel/Dim. Also applied a little to the area on the opposite side that had been overseeded. Maybe 0.3 lb there.


----------



## Green

Noticing the first bits of germination today. 6 days. Watered once.


----------



## Green

I'll update this post, but here's what I want to get done:

-Not really planning to mow, because tomorrow is supposed to be 88, but I want to get seed down on the side and will have to mow there prior. I can do the rest of my mowing on Monday. But if I get the side done, I may decide to also do the back.

-I'd like to do several errands for soil, etc. Really need stuff to fill holes from where I dug out samples of the Triv. Reminds me I need to wash out the bucket first.

Also need to adjust and set my sprinklers, and water the low input overseed. I really need to do some watering before the heat hits.


----------



## Green

Hand watered areas. Adjusted sprinkler heads in front.

Started the Dramm oscillating sprinkler on the low input overseed areas, and moved it once. Did about 3 hrs. per spot for a half inch or so of water. Great sprinkler, btw. Nice and solid, really good quality. Watered the areas most likely to dry out.

Picked up sand, Scotts Garden Soil, and Winter Fert.

Mowed upper side at 3.25 in, then raked and leveled small dips with the soil I mixed up. Seeded the area down to the wall.

Mixed 75% KBG and 25% PR. Bewitched, a little America, some of the old Rugby II that I'm not sure still works, Apple SGL, Fiesta 4, and Karma. Seeded heavily. Maybe too heavily. Put peat moss on the spots with no dead grass left. Not all the Triv is totally brown, as some was only sprayed twice. Oh well. Hopefully the 88 degree heat tomorrow will help with the kill.

Set irrigation to water zones 2, 4, and 5 for one hour each tomorrow morning. I will also hand water hellstrips, use my spike mounted rotor in place of a sunken head, and activate zone 1 when I get up.

Also set zones 1 and 2 to water for 6 minutes 3x during the day to keep the seed moist.


----------



## Green

Did everything on the list, plus watering hellstrips and pots this AM, and then the seed areas on the side front once I got home around 8:00pm. It apparently got to 87 and sunny here today, but where I was it was considerably cooler.

Now everything is overgrown and I need to mow and trim tomorrow. I'd also like to do some spraying (including the tree), maybe some pruning, and more seeding. Goal is to finish most of the seeding before June 1. It's going to take a lot of hand watering this Summer to keep the seeded areas alive. That reminds me, I really need to get biofungicide down in the front at least tomorrow, too. Maybe that Epsom salt app in the low input area, too. And maybe start a tray as well.


----------



## Green

Today, mowed the lower side and lower back at 3.25 inches. Will mow again in a couple days, then seed the bare spots.

Watered the front and side seed once.

Also mowed the low input area. Parts were overgrown, so I mowed some areas at 3.75 inches and some at 3.25. Also noticed the ground was cracking...hmm. Added two more halves of a mosquito dunk donut to the area that flood in anticipation of water collecting again next time it rains. Put down about 10-11 lbs of Epsom Salt on the other 5.5K. Old mower was tough to restart after having used it once, but eventually worked after about 20 min and a few more pulls. It sounded like there was an obstruction for a second or so.

Finally, seeded a few more large roundup patches in the main front but no peat moss yet.

The other day, I spilled 1/16th to 1/8th lb of America KBG seed into the crack in the basement step near the door. So, if any KBG grows, I guess I'll pull it out.


----------



## Green

Got 0.1 inch of rain last night.

Watered the front seed areas.

Mowed the side front (kind of overgrown) but didn't get to the main front due to running out of gas and it starting to rain.

Put down Dimension on the low input area minus the flood prone area (approx 5.5K). Used 19-0-3 on the overseeded area, and 0-0-7 SOP on the rest (about 2.6 lbs per thousand) and tried to avoid the roundup areas.

Speaking of which, I mixed a little under 1/2 gallon of glyphosate, and did another app on some areas.


----------



## Green

New to-do list:

-Get gas for mower
-Mow front
-spray Bt on tree
-Finish seeding on front and side
-moss out
-Nitrogen on upper back thin areas
-Seed back
-plugs (not doing this now)
-peat moss (back)
-Tenacity on side
-Trim in front and side
-seed low input area spots

-order Nu-Film 17

-second PGR app (front)

-Drill trays
-plant trays

-spray rest of Hydretain on low-input area overseed (not doing)

-biofungicide on front

-post pics in lawn journal

-pray mosquito barrier

-check spruces for mites

-Spray weeds in low input area

-read greenkeeper app and Certainty instructions

-set up sprinkler on side for germination (not doing)

-get oil for new mower
-change oil
-change air filter and check spark plug in old mower (checked filter)
-Download and read manuals for new mower
-empty and run out snowblower
-Request Stihl catalog

-Submit alleged Triv seedheads to lab (not needed; talked with scientist. He had seedheads already.)

-buy more mosquito dunks

-final Tenacity app on FF thinning areas
-also back and low input area (not doing this)
-Dimension on side front

-check sprinkler programs 
-take care of sunken head near door
-irrigation audits
-install new controller
-test spray heads

-Prune dead wood off boxwood (started 6/4/19)
-finish tree pruning

-apply Milo and micronutrients (started applying 8-0-4 fertilizer)

-calculate and source mulch

-Dig up and regrade small area near patio in back and replant grass plugs

Low-input area:
-Jar test
-get sand for topdress
-start fixing flood prone area

-apply humic acid as needed

-wrap trees

-troubleshoot why Earthway spreader started leaking
-fix Scott's spreader
-source parts for chapin sprayers including teejet nozzles
-disassemble and clean 3-gal sprayer to hopefully fix air leak
-lubricate mower and wheel barrow wheels


----------



## social port

@Green, the next time that I feel like I have a lot to do, I'm going to look at your list. That should make things feel much more manageable. 
You get things done.


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## Green

social port said:


> Green, the next time that I feel like I have a lot to do, I'm going to look at your list. That should make things feel much more manageable.
> You get things done.


Thanks. I take my time. Quality over quantity. But that list is huge, yes.


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## Green

Got 0.75 in of rain last night. Mowed main front, but at 3.75 in because it was damp and overgrown. Could not mow back because it was too wet. Sprayed 4mL of Tenacity mostly minus surfactant on the side, because the seed was starting to germinate. Since PR is a durable seed, I took the risk and sprayed it anyway. We had rain a few hours later. Also sprayed the edge of the main front, including some crabgrass on the border. Applied some N fertilizer to a couple thin spots in the upper back and low input area, and some iron to moss there and in the front utility area.

Grass looks terrible due to running out of N, and disease setting in after all the rainy days. Really need to get the Spring fert app going in the next week or so.


----------



## Green

Watered seed. Pretty much finished seeding in the front, but did not compact it or start watering yet. There's good germination in the previously seeded spots. The side is showing some germination. I raked the spots in the back, but did not get to seed yet.


----------



## Green

Today, I sprayed Bt (trees) first. Caterpillars are eating the leaves; not cool. Watered seed.

I then went to mow grandfather's lawn (3).

Then got back and seeded most of the back spots. It took 5 rounds of seed for the 5 cultivars. Still no idea if the Rugby II is any good, but I used a lot of it. I'm planning to do a test tray of it soon.

I then mowed the back. Upper back was overgrown (12 days since the 2nd mow), but I didn't feel too bad about cutting off more than half in some areas, because the grass isn't that dense yet, and a lot of the height was due to seedheads. Some areas also hardly grew/awoke yet too, so it cancels out. I mowed at 3.25 in with the Craftsman, which is a bit lower than the Toro at the same setting. I like the fairly short grass right now. Maybe I can sneak a mow of the front in tomorrow...? But I do have to finish seeding still. The Northern facing areas don't burn out as badly, so I don't feel foo bad about seeding in early June. I know I'll need a touch up seed in a couple months, too.

Hoping to spray Tenacity/PGR on the back tomorrow too. And I need to trim in the front.


----------



## JDgreen18

@Green how is your germination/reno areas going. I have had success in all my areas so dor this spring. All this rain is helpful especially in the areas I didn't have irrigation. I was just reading your journal your to do list looks like mine lol, dont you love it.


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## Green

@JDgreen18, it's going well, but I got a late start. I still have more areas I haven't seeded yet! It's in the pout stage in many cases, but thankfully that doesn't last long for Tall Fescue. It would have been better if I'd started two weeks before, when we were getting rain every day. I'll try to take some photos soon. Hoping to almost finish seeding tomorrow.

I'm going to start crossing off done items from the latest to do list.


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## Green

Today, I really just got to water some seed areas. I did pick up a brief rainstorm later, which helps.


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## Chris LI

You're really knocking things off the list. :thumbup:

I'm just trying to keep up with mowing, and falling behind with the extras. Keep up the good work! I'm looking forward to the photos of your progress.


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## Green

Watered seed again today. 0.1 inch of rain between yesterday afternoon and last night.

I guess the neighbor's mowing guy destroyed one of my border flags near a sprinkler than I had dug up a few weeks ago, because it's gone.

It's still cool enough that I have both warm and cool season weeds in mulch beds at the same time!

Speaking of temps, we think it's hot when it's 90 and humid. But I read on weather.com that India recently hit a record 123 degrees. That's dangerous.


----------



## Green

Bought supplies to finish the reseeding, but didn't get to do any today.

Watered seed once.

Trimmed in the front, including around all the seed areas...tedious.

Mowed the front, and took it back down to 3.25 inches with the craftsman.

Finally sprayed Serenade for the first time this year (on the front). I noticed some red thread (possibly) and dollar spot (definitely) there. I really need to get Nitrogen down in the next few days. I'll also take this as a cue to start the Certainty treatments soon (which will be on the upper part of the side, a small part of the front, and part of the low in put area), because Poa Triv is very susceptible. @MassHole.

Also sprayed some wasp nests starting on the house with water.

Finally, I started hacking down the dead parts of the boxwood.

*Found out today that my previous neighbor (who gave his house to his daughter and her husband a while back) is moving back to the neighborhood, 4th house down.

-updated the to-do list

First thing tomorrow, I'm spraying Tenacity/PGR on the lower back, then watering seed spots, finishing seeding, and finishing mowing and trimming.

It actually feels like I live in a true cool-season area this Spring, for once! Only one day in the upper 80s so far, and plenty of rain for the most part. Hoping to push the seeding envelope...normally, June seeding is out of the question.


----------



## social port

hey @Green, doesn't Certainty injure cool season turf as well? Does it offer an advantage over gly in getting the triv?


----------



## Green

social port said:


> hey Green, doesn't Certainty injure cool season turf as well? Does it offer an advantage over gly in getting the triv?


Yes and Yes. I'm planning on using that on a few areas because I want some grass left, and Velocity on some other areas for the same reason. I've used Velocity before, so I don't think it will totally kill mature KBG. This way, only the very worst spots are a total redo. I have Triv intermixed almost everywhere in the front. Certainty will kill Tall Fescue and some KBG varieties (not to my knowledge the ones I have), but I'll overseed in August.

I have already glyphosated far too much area.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> It actually feels like I live in a true cool-season area this Spring, for once! Only one day in the upper 80s so far, and plenty of rain for the most part. Hoping to push the seeding envelope...normally, June seeding is out of the question.


Amen! Good luck with the seeding. With work trying me up in May as usual, I chickened out on additional apps of Tenacity and didn't glyphosate any areas. Hopefully, your seed comes in with the cooler spring we've had. I forget, do you have irrigation?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Amen! Good luck with the seeding. With work trying me up in May as usual, I chickened out on additional apps of Tenacity and didn't glyphosate any areas. Hopefully, your seed comes in with the cooler spring we've had. I forget, do you have irrigation?


I have irrigation on 8.5 out of 15 thousand, but I try not to use it to water the seed patches too often, because it messes with the existing grass and doesn't wet the seed enough with a few minutes of run time. But I've done it a few times that way already. I've been hand watering once a day when possible, but I think I'm going to need to increase to twice most days.


----------



## Green

I'm finally done! I seeded all the patches I wanted to. I'm not doing all of them; there are a few in the upper back and low input area I'll either live with for a while, or do plugs into.

I also top dressed most of the back areas with peat, and some with hydro cover pellet mulch because I ran out.

I also ended up getting some Scott's EZ Seed Sun and Shade to try on the low input spots along with my own seed, since I wasn't sure what to use to blend in properly.

I also mowed the low input area, but it was overgrown from the fertilizer on the overseed part, and I had to go up to 4 inches. I'll take it back down to 3.75 later in the week.

Trimmed in back too. The grass seedheads near the walkway in the upper back were probably 10 inches in spots.

And I sprayed Tenacity at 4oz rate and about 1/6th oz of PGR on the lower back.

Edit: I hear a cricket outside. I don't recall hearing any before today. It's chirping really fast. Temp right now at 11:30pm is 69, and dew point is 65.


----------



## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> Also sprayed some wasp nests starting on the house with water.


Never heard of that before. What is spraying wasp nests with water supposed to do? How much water?


----------



## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Also sprayed some wasp nests starting on the house with water.
> 
> 
> 
> Never heard of that before. What is spraying wasp nests with water supposed to do? How much water?
Click to expand...

Knock 'em down! I think they were wasp nests...looked like mud.


----------



## Green

Been watering seeded areas twice most days. My nozzle broke without warning. Thankfully I had an extra. The water was just spurting out even with it off. I tried fixing it, but couldn't...took it apart.

Speaking of watering, watered the side front this morning for 90 minutes, about 2/3 in of water. Later, I hand watered the adjacent hellstrip areas--grass and plants.

I think I forgot to seed an area on the side last week, so I did that today. Mowed the upper back at 3.25 in, and the lower side, but increased it to 3.75 in. It's fairly shaded recently.

I finally sprayed "Mosquito Barrier" everywhere. Will have to wait and see how effective it is.

Also did my final FF thinning Tenacity spray; 1.5oz rate. The FF in those areas is nice and white, with some browning from fungal disease. Also sprayed some Bentgrass that was white from the blanket app, on the front hill, and some Poa annua on the back border.

I then sprayed Triclopyr, mostly in the low input area, on wild violet in the lawn, some clover, and some larger plants/brush. Decided to try dish soap this time instead of NIS, but I added too much.

I then sprayed Serenade on the back and side (first app of the year there). Standard 4oz rate.


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## ken-n-nancy

Wow. You are always one busy fellow with lawn care tasks. Good to hear that you got your first Serenade app down. You're behind on that. What is your baseline plan for application frequency and rate?


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## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> Wow. You are always one busy fellow with lawn care tasks. Good to hear that you got your first Serenade app down. You're behind on that. What is your baseline plan for application frequency and rate?


I am behind. I wanted to start that a month ago, at least, but the Triv/glyphosate/reseeding stuff really set me back as far as eating time. The constant rain and wind also prevented spraying anything for a few weeks. I saw little reason to spray Serenade if it was just going to be washed off after a few days from daily rain. There's already some red thread and dollar spot starting, unfortunately. The goal is Serenade at 4oz rate every couple of weeks now, but I'm looking into that Nu-Film that was suggested to me, to help prolong the effectiveness and help prevent the new seedlings from getting diseased. I'm actually still trying to germinate grass seed, too. it's going to take a lot of hand watering of those new grass spots/areas all Summer, which is another reason the disease management becomes so important. Check out the threads on ATY on these topics if you haven't yet. Thankfully I'm doing a lot with TTTF, PR, and Bewitched, which are all fairly quick germinators.


----------



## Green

Watered zone 1 and 2 for an hour each. I think that's a half inch, but I need to do testing and calibration. Watered the part of the low input area that got sprayed yesterday. Set up an orbit sprinkler to substitute for the head that needs to be replaced.

First hint of germination in the back.


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## Green

Mowed the closest to street ~1K of the main front, the side, and the low input area (all at 3.75 in). I noticed one brown patch lesion on some Tall Fescue, so add that to the disease mix. Then in the low input area, I noticed a lot of large brown/saturated (color, not water) yellow patches. It honestly looks like maybe the early stage of rust...yikes. Not something I expect this time of year. It usually happens August to October or November. Will watch it.

In any case, I was planning to start dropping fertilizer anyway. I put down roughly 0.5 lb N from Protene 8-0-4 on the low input area, upper back, and side front.

I found another area in the front I forgot to drop seed last week, so I did it today.


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## Green

Got 1.35 inches of rain last night. More seed is germinating now.

Watered it once, just now.


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## social port

I noticed a thread from you asking about mowing too soon after germination. I take it that germination has really taken off since the 8th?


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## Green

social port said:


> I noticed a thread from you asking about mowing too soon after germination. I take it that germination has really taken off since the 8th?


Yeah, kind of. I staggered the seedings (too much to do all at once), so the very first areas I did are almost completely germinated now. The most recent ones are just showing the first few bits of action the last couple of days. Weather has been cooperating well, thankfully (not too hot, and no torrential rain). This has to be the best Spring for seeding in a long time.

That also means the photos I'm planning to post from last week are going to be behind, so I'll have to take more at some point as well.


----------



## Green

Here are photos from June 6 showing the areas I killed and am reseeding:

Main front lawn (TTTF/PR/KBG):








-I believe there's a bit of annual rye germinating, because there are some huge plants that look sort of like Tall Fescue or even Perennial Rye, and have clasping auricles, but are lighter green and growing too fast. I pulled one out to look at, and I'd say annual rye. I've never seen it in person before today. I'll take photos of another one at some point and post them. I also have some Maple trees germinating in almost every patch I've redone. I've pulled a few out.

Close-up of area in foreground right of previous image:










Extreme close-up:









Another area:









Back (TTTF/KBG):


















Side (PR/KBG):









-The furthest spots from me are roughly the border of the yard; everything past them is the neighbor's
- you can see where I forgot to drop seed last week in the foreground


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## SNOWBOB11

The grass around those glyed areas is looking great. Hopefully your seeds will fill in soon.


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## Chris LI

It's filling in nicely. You're encouraging me to not chicken out with the Tenacity and to go for the glyphosate. :thumbsup:


----------



## Green

SNOWBOB11 said:


> The grass around those glyed areas is looking great. Hopefully your seeds will fill in soon.


Thanks. No fert yet at that point (since November)


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> It's filling in nicely. You're encouraging me to not chicken out with the Tenacity and to go for the glyphosate. :thumbsup:


Yeah. I got a little carried away. Originally I wasn't planning to gly much extra radius around the spots as some recommend, but very slight wind drift and a bit extra spraying 3 times ended up doing it for me. That Triv (and the good grass) is dead, dead, dead. Also glad I bought that 20 lbs of Bullseye seed a few years ago before it was phased out. It really came in handy. Now I just hope they grow Rugby II KBG this year so I can get some for my touch-up seeding in August or Sept.


----------



## Green

Sprayed PGR at very low rate on front. Say between 1/6 and 1/10 of full rate, parallel to driveway only. I was pressed for time. I think I'll do another app at some point, and use greenkeeper to figure it all out. Obviously I'm not spraying the seeded areas.


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## social port

wow, @Green. The color of the TTTF KBG mix looks phenomenal.


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## Green

Just got back from a gig, and checked the rain gauge. 0.38 in. Not bad. And I don't hear a crap ton of caterpillars munching on the trees this year. Their poop was so messy and they defoliated trees in past years.

Today was unbelievably cool...about 56 all day and tonight during the light rain. Still good grass seed weather.


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## Green

social port said:


> wow, Green. The color of the TTTF KBG mix looks phenomenal.


Thanks. The Bullseye and the Rugby II KBG have really solid medium to dark color that ties everything together. The Bewitched is even darker, and the America is lighter. Color is starting to fade since last week, so my organic Nitrogen apps, which I've been in the process of starting, are on schedule.

Another cool day. Didn't even hit 70 and wasn't sunny, and I'm taking advantage of every day like this for the seeding. From tomorrow into much of the foreseeable future though, we'll be in the low 80s with lots of sun, and 60s at night. This means the fungal pressure is going to increase. I need to get my plan biological prevention implemented for the new grass by the middle of next week ideally.

Tomorrow I need to mow. It's a bit long. I'm going to try and get away with 3.25 inches on the Toro, and use the Craftsman for the tighter areas near where I reseeded, and then the trimmer for immediately around them. The PR and Fescues in the front are continuing sending up seed stalks, as the grass gets higher. I don't think their activity has peaked just yet (especially the PR). The KBG has already slowed down with the seed production.

Ideally, I'll continue fertilizing tomorrow, too.


----------



## Green

Sat. 6/15/19:

Bought Mobil 1 extended performance oil, and more Miracle Gro soil. Changed the oil on the Toro. Then mowed with it. Need to keep an eye on the level, since I only put in 12oz. Did most of the front and lower back/lower side at 3.25 in, and low input area at 3.75 in. I need to finish mowing Monday. Still have about 2,000 square feet left, including mowing and trimming around seeded areas.

I need to learn how the greenkeeper app works tomorrow so I can time my PGR properly. Aim is also to do that and finish my 8-0-4 fertilizer and do potting when weather permits.

I have pretty much not mowed or fertilized the flood prone area this year. I may have mowed it once. I have a little sward of TTTF and KBG there in the center temporarily (from my seed tray last Fall) that I allowed to go unmowed and grow seedheads a la @Powhatan style. The goal is for it to help absorb the water that pools in the area faster. I think it's working. Problem is, a lot of the other grass (ring of grass around the dead area) in that area is likely Triv, and some of it is seeding. I need to cut and collect the seed stalks on the Triv at some point when it's dry to keep it from dropping seed.


----------



## Green

Mowed the rest of the front around the seeded areas with the Craftsman at 3.25 in, and the upper side at 3.75 before it started to rain much. The mower engine is starting to not sound as good as after it was serviced last year. I guess I need to check the spark plug. The air filter is fine; just a little oil on it.

Grass has poor color now from a combination of disease and lack of N. Dollar spot is mixed in everywhere.


----------



## Green

Today's lawn stuff was crazy. Both my sprayers failed, one I think from low battery and the other due to a seal issue. As a result, I could not do all the spraying I wished to.

But I did accomplish a good amount nonethelessless: Mowing the garage side and upper back at 3.25 in, trimming along those areas, mowing the spots I didn't get to last time around the seeded areas in the back...

Then put down 2 lbs per thousand of Dimension 0.15% 0-0-7 SOP on the side front and hellstrips. More where it's sunny and less in shade. Accidentally got some on one of the small seeded patches, and then picked most of it out by hand.

After that, I decided it was a good time to get 16 lbs of the 8-4-0 down on the main front, and then do my first Certainty herbicide application. I'm treating a small portion of the main front, the upper side (minus seeded areas), and approx. 1800 square feet in the low input area. Hopefully it won't kill the lawn entirely, lol! When my handheld sprayer stopped working, I had to pour everything into the backpack to continue.

(@MassHole ). Perhaps on the weekend, I'll start my Velocity apps as well.

I was able to (at about 9pm) spray Serenade at the 3-4oz rate on approx. 1,000 to 1500 square feet of the low input area, and at the 4oz rate on the main front, but nowhere else since the battery crapped out. Saturday or Sunday I should get to do more areas.

Around 11pm after showering for the second time and then accidentally injuring my elbow while getting out, I went back out because I realized I forgot to replenish the mosquito dunks. I tell you, the grass was soaked with dew already, everywhere. Unbelievable. Dew point was a bit on the humid side, 64F and 80% humidity, so I guess that explains it.


----------



## Green

This post will report on the first Certainty app, areas and ratios.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> Around 11pm after showering for the second time and then accidentally injuring my elbow while getting out,


The things we do to take care of our lawns!


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> After that, I decided it was a good time to get 16 lbs of the 8-4-0 down on the main front,


I looked back a little in your posts, but didn't see any details on the 8-4-0. What are you using?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> After that, I decided it was a good time to get 16 lbs of the 8-4-0 down on the main front,
> 
> 
> 
> I looked back a little in your posts, but didn't see any details on the 8-4-0. What are you using?
Click to expand...

Protein 8-0-4 Fairway Grade (red and white bag). 0.6% out of the total 8% is fast release N, rest is slow. Has molasses too for thatch prevention. The seeding put me behind applying it. Was still tough to apply evenly since I couldn't roll the spreader over all those areas. As such, I'm delaying fertilizing the side lawn (where there's a large redo area in progress) until the new grass can be walked on. I'll be doing Milo, soon too, to add up to 1 lb N.


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## Green

Got 2.065 inches of rain today as of about 10PM. We were an inch behind, and now we're not. Rather not have it all at once though. Low input area flooded, so super glad I went out last night to put out the two halves of that mosquito dunk and weighted them down with rocks. Need to buy more now.


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## Green

Sprayed Serenade on the back and side front, but not the side due to time. It'll sit for some hours before the next rain washes it off. Between red thread and dollar spot, things don't look too good. The red thread is even affecting a good amount of KBG, and even a bit of TTTF.

The Chapin 20v sprayer pressure got far too low again, even with the fully charged battery and 1.5 gallons in it.

Looks like chemlawn came next door.


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## Green

75, cloudy, damp, misty, and a dew point of 71 today. I just threw a little more PR seed out on a few spots on the side, and marked some areas so people hopefully won't walk through them.

Local lawn co dropped synthetic on neighbors today. I really need to get the rest of my fertilizer applied over the next week or so.


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## Green

Got 0.15 inch of rain since yesterday, and then the sun came out in the late afternoon. Longest day of the year.

I hand trimmed some of the most established seeded patches in the front for the first time with shears. I think I'll do a few each day until I've done all the areas that need it and where it's practical. I cut at about one inch or so.


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## Green

It rained twice in short bursts this afternoon so I did not get to mow. Grass is long. Probably under a quarter inch of rain.


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## Green

Got gas (2 gal.). Mowed about half the total lawn area: Low input, upper back (3.25), and side front (3.75). Had to go up one level in height in many places since it was too long (low input area was cut at 4" on most of it, and 3.75 on the area sprayed with Certainty last week). Did not get to hellstrips yet. Watered once today, but will likely have to do twice tomorrow. The areas that get hit by disease most readily are doing so (like side front along driveway), and the areas that usually start drying out and getting hydrophobic are doing so it seems.


----------



## Green

Finally finished mowing, but didn't get to trim. Used the old mower, and I'm up to 3.75 inches in the front now (and side), but still at 3.25 in the back.

Grandfather's lawn was done yesterday by someone else, who of course cut it shorter than I would and apparently left clumps (it had been 11 days since I last did it). Just in time for 4 days in the high 80s. It'll probably brown out.

Put up gypsy moth plastic on front trees. Thankfully, a lot of the caterpillars seem to be dying from the fungus or virus. And there aren't a lot this year, thanks in part to my prevention strategy.

Did more fertilizer...0.5 lb N on lower back from 8-0-4. 0.3 lb N from 5-4-0 Milorganite on low input area - 29 lbs (assuming 5.7% N analysis instead of 5.0%). Would like to finish in the front next week.

Need to check and clean/fix the 3 gal sprayer Wednesday so I can use it again. It's not staying pressurized and is leaking out the pump arm on top.


----------



## Green

Got 0.2 inch of rain today. Pulled a few weeds in the street and sidewalk (what a crazy mix of stuff...Purslane, Spurge, one that flowers white but not sure the name, Poa annnua, crabgrass, Oxalis, Stiltgrass, and chickweed), and measured soil temps at 4 inches. Mostly low 70s, but hellstrip was 80. It had just rained, was cloudy, and air temp was low to mid 70s.

Since it's going to be near 90 for 4 days starting tomorrow, I will have to really step up the watering. Seed areas will need light watering 3 times. Additionally, I plan to put down a half inch of water on the side front Thursday morning, and then water the hellstrips by hand. The following day, I'll water the main front. I should make sure both side sprinkler heads are off prior to spraying, and I can water that area manually.

Just took apart the 3 gal sprayer and cleaned and lubricated it as it started losing pressure and liquid out the top again (worst ever so far). Nobody likes chemicals bubbling out the top! It's working again, but who knows how long. I think I need a new seal, but am not sure if Chapin sells that part by itself outside of the repair kit. So, at least I have one sprayer working correctly now. I'll have to check the screens in the 20v sprayer tomorrow, as @g-man suggested...it could be a simple clog in that one.

Tomorrow there is a LOT of spraying to do...
Velocity first app in the front, PGR on the lower back, Tenacity on the Bentgrass spot in the front and at the back border, Serenade in as many places as possible, Bt for the caterpillars, and a second app of Mosquito Barrier. But the first lawn priority after watering is to get the plugs that I've had laying around for a few weeks (literally laying around, almost dead now) into pots.

12AM edit: quick downpour.
12:30: little more rain


----------



## Green

New to-do list for lawn and landscape - week of June 25th, 2019 and beyond:

*Keep on top of watering seed areas during near 90-degree temps this week
-up to 3x per day light hand watering
-- or as needed

6/26/19:
-Pot grass plugs
-Velocity app #1 in front
-PGR on lower back
-Tenacity on Bentgrass spot on front hill, and back border
-Serenade (ongoing)
-Mosquito Barrier (2nd app)
-Bt (not needed again)

Later in week after heat/before rain:
-Set sprinkler programs
-Trim
-Apply Dimension to edges of upper back lawn to prevent crabgrass and Stiltgrass along natural area
-Mow
-PGR on front??
-Milorganite on front and back
-Triclopyr app 2 (hard to believe it's almost 3 weeks since the first) (too hot; wait until late Summer)
-Cut new grass on side for first time??
-Edge sidewalk and transplant to killed spots in front

-fix/replace broken hoses (in progress, July)

-Find faucet parts

Beyond:
-Finish Roundup (not needed)
-Spray and water in leftover Hydretain on low input overseed area (too late; save for next year)
-Tricure wetting agent on parts of side front

-Check spruces for mites

-New pics in lawn journal

-start cleaning up supply area

-Grab more grass for plugs
-Drill trays
-Start trays

-solar lights

-Check spark plug in old mower
-Empty and run out snowblower and put shovels away

-fix sunken sprinkler head in front
-irrigation audits
-install new controller
-test spray heads

-finish tree pruning
-micronutrients (once I hear back about which ones and how much to use)
-calculate, research, and source mulch

-Dig up and regrade small area near patio in back and replant grass plugs

Low-input area:
-Jar test
-get sand for topdress
-start fixing flood prone area

-apply humic acid 
-apply Scotts with biochar in Summer

-troubleshoot why Earthway spreader started leaking
-fix Scott's spreader
-source parts for Chapin sprayers including teejet nozzles
-lubricate mower and wheel barrow wheels

Stuff to buy:
-Locally:
--extra watering nozzle
--CCO herbicide
--Mosquito dunks
-SiteOne
-TSC?
-Walmart
-Hoses

Online:
-Teejet nozzles
-Sprayer seal/repair kit
-Long wand
-Pressure gauge
-CF valve
-Straps

-Source SLS


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## Green

ET Data for June 2019 so far:


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## Chris LI

I didn't fully update my journal, but I noticed you have Mosquito Barrier to spray on 6/27. I sprayed some for the first time yesterday, although they suggested not to do so before rain. I think I still smell it a little, and my sprayer stinks, even though I rinsed it. Hopefully, it does the trick.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> I didn't fully update my journal, but I noticed you have Mosquito Barrier to spray on 6/27. I sprayed some fir the first time yesterday, although they suggested not to do so before rain. I think I still smell a little, and my sprayer stinks, even though I rinsed it. Hopefully, it does the trick.


Yeah, first app was on 6/7, and I hope to do the second tomorrow (today, 6/26). I don't know how I'm going to get the smell out of my sprayer. I filled it with soap and water and never emptied it since last time because it was smelling up the basement. I read something about stainless steel bars being available for this purpose at culinary supply companies, but have to look into it.

As far as whether the stuff works, I'm not sure yet, but I think it's doing something...

Initially it seemed to attract more mosquitoes the first few days, but then there seemed to be a reduction. But that is wearing off now, and we're starting to get the bigger, more aggressive types now. We'll see how well it works on them.

It was amazing how many mosquitoes flew out of bushes while spraying (and tried to bite). But I think a lot died after a few days, because they were gone before a week from the first spray.


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## Green

Watered seed areas twice. Tomorrow probably 3x.

Sprayed approx. 1/6 oz of PGR on the lower back, trying not to get it on the new grass.

Then sprayed Velocity first app on the main front and a little bit of the side front at approx the 3oz/A rate, minus seeded areas. Accidentally got it on one, but rinsed it off within a half hour.

It may have gotten to 89 today, and may for the next two days as well. Hopefully the Velocity doesn't kill the lawn. It has more activity when it's hotter out.

Did just a little bit of trimming.

Set the side front zone to water for 30 min. X 2 tomorrow morning for around a half inch.

Did not get to pot the grass, or spray the Tenacity, Biofungicide, tree stuff, or Mosquito stuff yet. Aiming for tomorrow.


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## Green

Watered seed twice and hand watered hellstrips and main front lower edge. Used oscillating sprinkler on side to get a half inch. 88 degrees. Sprayed Serenade with the Nu-Film 17 I recently got at 4oz rate on the main lawn areas and low input overseed. Got a headache now.

Hopefully the mosquito stuff tomorrow evening.

Set zones 1 and 2 for an hour each tomorrow morning.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green, I'm curious as to when you commenced your Serenade applications this year, particularly as I see you've been having some fungus challenges in recent weeks. What has been your actual Serenade application timeline in 2019?


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## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> Green, I'm curious as to when you commenced your Serenade applications this year, particularly as I see you've been having some fungus challenges in recent weeks. What has been your actual Serenade application timeline in 2019?


Hi (Ken, I presume),

From records:
-All 4oz rate unless noted

-App 1: 
--Front including new grass: 6/4/19*
--Back and side including new grass: 6/7/19
--Nearest ~1.5K of low input area (~3.5oz rate): 6/17/19

-App 2: 
--Main front including new grass: 4 oz rate: 6/17/19
--Back and side front including new grass: 6/19/19
--Low input 2018 overseed area (with Nu-Film 17): 6/27/19

-App 3:
--All main lawn areas including new grass (front, back, side; with Nu-Film 17): 6/27/19

*Onset of noticeable disease threshold in front (red thread and dollar spot) was around Memorial Day. That said, I noticed red thread on one isolated spot starting in January 2019, and noticed it starting to happen more around the third week of April. I did not have time to do Serenade in April and early May due to my Poa Triv tribulations (lab submissions, 3 hits of Roundup, and then reseeding a ton of spots in May). The second half of April to mid May featured light rain essentially every day. Then in later May, it seemed that it was still either raining and/or windy every single day, so I did not see the point in spraying even on days without wind if it was just going to get washed off in a day or two.

My side front hill along the driveway gets hit hard with disease every year. A lot of it is the grass types...what I presume is Boreal Creeping Red Fescue (very prone to red thread) and some old cultivar of Kentucky Bluegrass that is medium green/blue and susceptible to all the main diseases (red thread, dollar spot, leaf spot, brown patch, etc.). That area gets stunted once Summer hits, but disease hit even earlier this year. Ironically, that's the same area I did the FF thinning experiment (which seemed to work), but the stress from the Tenacity coupled with frequent rain in mid Spring seemed to enhance disease pressure if anything. It's already stunting and thinned out compared to how it looked in early May. My TTTF and newer KBG cultivars seem to be mostly holding their own and aren't as affected by the disease, but there is a lot of the older KBG that is. I'm stopping the PGR on that section (last application was far, far below normal rates anyway) and may even hit it with a little extra N in early Summer if it doesn't seem to recover on its own.

I also see red thread and dollar spot in the main front, but less in the back (which is all newer cultivars). That said, there is some rust creeping in the past few weeks as well (but no spore stage yet). I'm late with my organic Nitrogen due to all the Triv stuff and reseeding and not totally done applying it yet (but not as late as last year).

It's not an outbreak, but there's definitely some disease present and it does detract from the color.


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## Green

90-91F today at peak around 4PM (and sunny), but not humid (mid 50s dew points and 30-40% relative humidity). In addition to watering the seeded areas twice, I set up the orbit gear drive sprinkler in place of my sunken head near the front door, and let it go for about an hour and a half (almost an inch). Also watered the sunniest portion of the low-input 2018 overseed area with the Dramm oscillating sprinkler (about 3.5 hours, and 0.5-inch).

Front hill and hellstrip grass is growing very quickly. It may be PGR rebound, but I haven't gotten the greenkeeper app totally figured out yet.

I believe my neighbor put down the second split app of pre-M (a few weeks late) yesterday per my instructions (2 lb/M to last into September) using the Dimension 0-0-7 I picked up for them in the Spring. Their first app back in April was with Scotts/Pendimethalin, but the barrier ran out a few weeks ago, as evidenced by the fact that there is some crabgrass now. That said, late is better than never. Had them create a buffer zone without Dimension near my reseeded area that meets the property border.

I continue to see (and pull up) occasional stiltgrass plants at the edge of the road where it meets the curb (not just in front of my yard).

The last two comments remind me I need to get some Dimension down along the edge of my upper back where it meets the natural area.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> Hi (Ken, I presume),
> 
> From records:
> -All 4oz rate unless noted
> 
> -App 1:
> --Front including new grass: 6/4/19*
> 
> ...


Thanks, Green, for the details on your Serenade applications this year. That's helpful information to me.

The reason for my asking is that I've been having fungus challenges on my Bewitched side lawn, every year starting in the late summer of the first year for the Bewitched. I've been trying to get ahead of the fungal issues by using Serenade as a preventative, but I think my problem may be just not starting the Serenade applications early enough. I have generally been making my first Serenade application in mid-June, which has been before I've noticed significant disease. However, I've been thinking lately that mid-June just isn't early enough for a first-of-the-season preventative Serenade application to be effective, even with our comparatively northern location.

Our first mowing isn't usually needed until about May 20th-25th, but I'm starting to think that I should be making our first Serenade application about that time. This year, I made the first app on June 3rd, but in hindsight, I think it should have been a little earlier. Due to weather and other busy-ness, I didn't get our second app down until June 23rd, which I also think was too late after the first application. I'm starting to think that I should get a first application down around May 20th-25th, with subsequent applications every 10-12 days, at least until I've had a mostly disease-free year.

In any case, thanks for the details on what you did this year!


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## Green

@ken-n-nancy, I agree. I generally like to start in May. Or ideally, I would do one app in mid April, too. But timing can be difficult when it comes to spraying as I've already covered. I would definitely agree with starting Serenade in May as you suggest.

I think my first mowings have been as early as late March and as late as late May, depending on the area and its microclimate and condition. Possibly June once for the upper back, maybe, the year there was all that snow mold damage (we discussed pre-M versus seed that year). There was also one year I mowed in late Feb. just because I could. This past Winter, I let everything grow in fully before mowing in April, since it was a rough Winter for the grass (never seen lawns go so brown in Winter as they did this past year in my area).

You're welcome.

In a normal year, I'd have made it up to this point without noticeable disease. It's rare to get Spring disease...I usually face early Summer and mid or late Summer disease. I call red thread a cool-season disease, but I don't know if that's accurate or if it can hit when it's hot out, too. But I think it was last year, I had terrible red thread on a section of the low-input area (again, lots of Boreal fine fescue, I believe). This year, it's just patches...and now that it's getting warmer, it's essentially remnants. But there is also a good amount of active dollar spot, leaf spot (I think), the rust I mentioned, and scattered brown patch lesions here and there (which I don't want to get bad in the middle of the Summer).

Rust seems to like Bewitched. Dollar Spot, too. I've found it fairly tolerant of red thread.

By the way, I think the cool-season annual weeds (like chickweed) are finally coming to an end. I had both warm and cool season weeds for the past month, co-existing in mulch beds, etc.


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## Green

Mowed most of the side front and hellstrips and upper back. 3.75 in.
Mowed the low input area. 4 in. Did not want to mow while it was hot and sunny to cause burning, so it was on the long side. Certainty treated area is not showing much growth, but it wasn't before spraying, either.

Put 6 halves of mosquito dunks out, after purchasing a new pack. Used rocks that were in the area to weigh them down.

Watered most seeded areas once. It was still warm (87F) and was humid (70 dew point), so didn't want to water again and spur disease.


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## Green

Got away with watering most of the new grass areas only once.

Mowed the rest of the upper back that I forgot last time, the main front, and the side. 3.75 in. On the main front, I carefully mowed over most of the new grass areas, finally, though they didn't get cut.

Then put down 0.3 lb of N (5 lbs per thousand) of 6-2-0 4%Fe Milorganite on the back. It got too dark and buggy to also hit the front and side, so I'll continue tomorrow.

Set zones 3 and 4 to water for 30 min x 4 and 22 min x 4 respectively tomorrow morning. Grass was just starting to look a little stressed in spots. Screwdriver test in one really bad spot revealed what was likely gravel...I'll have to eventually dig it out. First time watering the back this year...I made it to July 1st.

Same neighbor put down Step 2 today. Wet the grass first as you're supposed to. But may have applied more than a full app; not sure. Let's see if it works, or if it causes fert burn since we're going to be around 90 again starting mid week. I think they were careful again to avoid my seed with it after discussing it the other day.

Tomorrow: trimming, finish Milo, and Tenacity and PGR where needed. Water hellstrips. Turn on side sprinkler head. I need Dimension along the upper back edge, too.


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## Green

I used a handheld spray bottle of Tenacity to spray the Bentgrass patch in the front hill. I believe this is technically app #3...maybe even 4. It's dying! Soon after, I sprayed PGR on the side front (not the middle section/slope, which is stunted and diseased, as usual for this time or year). Used 1/7th to 1/6th oz and applied more of it to the front hill and hellstrips. Then, while the PGR was still wet, I (practically in the dark) put down Milorganite on the side front and adjacent hellstrip areas. Same 0.3 lb/M of N, using 6-2-0 4% Fe Milo. I had to guess the application patterns, since it was too dark to see what was happening.

Side front grass looked stressed today. Hand watered the hellstrip areas and edges, the worst of which are starting to brown out. Also set the sprinkler zone to water for 90 min. tomorrow morning on the side front, for about 0.75 inch of water.

Tomorrow: trimming and Milorganite on the main front and side; water low-input area.

I'm stopping PGR on the main front now. One of the herbicides I'm using already has growth regulating effects.


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## Green

Yesterday, trimmed and put down Milorganite on the rest of the areas...Main front, and side. It now smells in the heat. Never had that happen before like this. It's not keeping the small animals away, though...they started digging up some of the new grass, so I put out some repellent today. Also watered low-input area closest corner end to about 2/3 inch yesterday.

Yesterday, also mowed grandfather's lawn. There were clumps (which I should have raked up first) from the previous person, who took 6-inch grass down to 2 inches and made a mess. I managed to get it all mulched and cleaned up with the tractor, but it like mowing straw...dust everywhere, in my eyes, etc...great for allergies. I still refuse to take allergy medicine this year...trying not to break my streak. I think I did pretty good, all things considered.

Today, 90 degrees. This morning, watered the main front...zone 1 for 40 min x 2 and zone 2 for 45 min x 2. Set up the Orbit sprinkler after that since the head near the door is still sunken. Hand watered the area near the patio, which was stressing, as well as some spots in the front, and of course, the seed areas.

Tomorrow, I'll have to water the hellstips and middle of the low input area, and probably the driveway side of the hill area, if not the whole side front (will check ET data tonight).


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## Green

Calculated that the grass used 3.47 in of water between June 18th and today. Rain on the 18th until now was 2.5 inches, plus irrigation two days ago (side front) of 0.75 in yields 3.25 in of water applied, so I'm going to set that zone for an hour (about 0.5 inch) tomorrow morning. I did not let the soil moisture get to zero the other day, and I'm not going to again tomorrow. I don't want soil moisture decreasing too low, since it's still hot the next day or two. Grass looked like it was stressing and even needed hand watering in a few spots today, so that fits with the data.


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## Green

Watered seeded areas, some areas multiple times since it was over 90 and sunny. The new grass is starting to take a hit...not sure how much is drought stress/heat versus disease. But I'm not taking any chances. I sprayed Serenade at low volume on all seeded areas and plan to repeat tomorrow since the dew point is forecasted to be in the upper 70s. Unfortunately, several hours after I sprayed today, my neighbor's sprinklers went on from 8:45-9:15PM in that area. So, being the perfectionist I am, I went back at 9:15 and sprayed another half gallon of water with approx. an ounce of Serenade on all the border areas that got wet . I'll do the same tomorrow.

Pulled a crabgrass plant from the side overseed. So obviously my barrier from Tenacity is expired. That's fine.

Hand watered all hellstrip areas, most edges, a bit of the side front toward the middle, and a bit of the upper front hill that was just starting to brown. Some years, it has gone very brown, likely due to the tree roots in the area. I may need to hand water it again tomorrow. Thankfully, the hose broke after the bulk of watering today. See below.

Also watered the next portion of the low input area, almost to the end of the area I overseeded last Fall. Watered for about 3.5 hours, and it looked like maybe 0.33 inch in the can. The soil was a bit squishy after, so I'm glad I didn't put down more. Guess the drainage is poor even in that area. Humic acid is on my list of soil amendments to use.

I had another hose break today. That's 4 with leaks plus one with broken coating, and another remnant that needs fittings now. No more left without holes, I think. Planning to try to find some self fusing silicone tape and at least one new hose at HD.

Set zones 1 and 2 in the main front and upper to middle side for 30 and 45 min. respectively, and will run it again manually in the late morning, for about a half inch of water. Lots of brown grass, but not sure how much is actually drought stress versus fungus. I do see some active red thread still.


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## social port

@Green, I'm sure that there are better hoses out there, but I have at least 7 of those zeroG hoses (should be readily available at Lowe's), and I haven't had one issue with any of them.


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## Green

social port said:


> Green, I'm sure that there are better hoses out there, but I have at least 7 of those zeroG hoses (should be readily available at Lowe's), and I haven't had one issue with any of them.


I'll take a look. How many years have they lasted so far?

These are all over 5 years, that are breaking. One may be from more like 15 years ago from Costco. It was the best, but could never find another like it. It says contractor grade. Very flexible and light but durable and not too flexible either. Hopefully it can be cut and reused with a new connector. Some of the others may be too far gone by the Fall, even if the tape temporarily fixes some of them.


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## social port

Whoa, yours have way more mileage than mine. They are only two years old.


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## Green

No rain in a week and a half, and it's been around 90 and sunny many days, so I've been irrigating up a storm. Deep and infrequent, which is relative, is now 0.5-0.75 inch of water every other to 3 days on the front and upper to middle side for established grass. The newly germinated grass is also getting taxed, and I water it 1-2 times per day by hand generally, with a good amount of water.

Some browning is acceptable at this point due to heat stress, fungal disease, Poa Triv, and herbicide stress (to control the Poa Triv), but my goal is not to let it get too stressed or brown.

I did not have time to spray Serenade again on seeded areas today.

Sometimes it's good to water during the day. I realized that one of my in-ground heads was jammed up and stuck in one spot due to sand. Turning the head back and forth a few times through the full range of motion generally solves the issue by working the sand out, but you wouldn't know it was watering in only one spot without checking it.

Each time I water the main front, I set up an additional Orbit H2O head in place of the head that's sunken, until I can fix the issue.

I also watered with a small oscillating sprinkler in two areas: the part of upper back adjacent to the lower back, which tends to brown the soonest due to both direct sun and some gravel in the soil, and the part of the lower back/low in put area right next to the shed. I put down about a half inch in both areas, and watered the nearby plants at the same time as the grass.

Hand watered a little spot on the front hill and the Bentgrass spot there to help mitigate the Tenacity stress, as well as the driveway edge of the flat portion of the side front. Looks like the Bentgrass in the front hill may eventually need an additional spot application in 10 more days or so.

Got a little mulch from HD. $2 per bag of Vigoro and $2.50 for Scotts. I think today was the last day of the sale. Got some self-fusing silicone tape to try to repair the hoses. Did not see any new hoses that I liked there. Ace had more of a selection last time I was there.

I'm going to be due for my 2nd Certainty app in the next few days, so I need to review the data from the previous app. So far, the Triv is not dead. I wonder if this will work.

Also put down some (eyeballed it) Hi-Yield Dimension 0.125% 0-0-0 along the edges of the upper back (I've been starting to see Crabgrass the past few weeks in the mulch). I ran the extra out of the spreader along the border of the low-input area/neighbor's yard. Maybe 2-2.75 lbs per thousand rate on the upper back edge.


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## JDgreen18

I had to really up my watering too this past week. I noticed some early heat stress on my kbg as the blades were thinning like needles a d changing color. Really easy to see in the sun. I watered yesterday 30 min a zone and today another 25 min after the mow. All stress was relieved as grass was looking good again.


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> I had to really up my watering too this past week. I noticed some early heat stress on my kbg as the blades were thinning like needles a d changing color. Really easy to see in the sun. I watered yesterday 30 min a zone and today another 25 min after the mow. All stress was relieved as grass was looking good again.


Yup. When it's 90 consistently, I tend to go for a half inch of water 3x per week in sunny North-facing areas, based on experience. That's 1.5 inches per week split up into 3 days. (I used to try to water a whole inch a week all at once, and it didn't keep it green during those hot conditions).

This is established grass. This is about as deep and infrequent as I can go in this heat, without introducing even more browning.

When it's in the lower 80s in July/August, I back down to about 0.75 inch twice a week.

In June, I do the whole inch all at once unless it's unseasonably hot.

September, a whole inch all at once, but if it's really hot still, I'll do an extra, but shallower watering during the week, too.


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## JDgreen18

I have been playing with my watering techniques during this heat wave. In the full sun area if I water 2 days in a row 30 min a zone I can go 3 days without irrigation then back to 1 or 2 days in a row depends on how the grass is looking, seems to work good. I have sandy soil so my watering needs are going to be higher. Also the deep and infrequent is fine but I can't go more than 3 days without seeing some stress with my soil, if drains to quickly so putting down a whole inch at a time is kind of a waste.
In the shade is a different story I only watered once in this heatwave and the grass looks great....besides my reno area.


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## Green

Watered seed areas at around 1PM. The new grass was really drought stressing by the time I started. I'll probably lose some since a lot more days around 90 and sunny are forecast. I am going to need to add another hand watering earlier in the day.

Soon after I watered, we got thunderstorms that dropped about 0.4 inch of rain in 30 min or so.

And I think I'm going to spray all the seeded areas with Propiconazole in the next few days, as now that it's stressed I believe I'm definitely seeing early disease starting. I'd like to prevent it before it takes out much of the new grass.


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## Green

Mowed upper back, side front, and low input area with the Toro. Grass was a bit too long in the low input area even at the 4 inch setting. I ended up trying out the side discharge shoot, and did a second pass in some areas to get rid of any clumps.

I think I'm going to have to mow the new grass tomorrow. Probably will try to use the manual reel mower, but it's not easy because there are so many spots. But it's supposed to be around 90 almost every day for the next two weeks after tomorrow. Then water the heck out of it and spray Propiconazole to arrest the disease that's starting (I think it's early stage rust, mostly, since there's rust in many of the adjacent areas). I also noticed some clumpy fungi that were shooting out spores when water hit them as well. Not sure what those were. Mowing is going to make a mess of those spores.

This has to be the worst Summer for lawn disease I've experienced so far, due to very frequent rain during much of the Spring.


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## Green

7/8/19:

Mowed main front, side, and lower back with the old mower. Cut some of the new grass areas at 1.75-2 in with the Fiskars. Watered all new areas once, but will need to increase to 3x some days now. Still using a hose and manual nozzle by hand. Planning to spray Propiconazole tomorrow. Back TTTF/KBG lawn is extremely dark green now, likely a combination effect of Milorganite iron (used the 4% Fe formula!) and the heat. But there is some rust disease. Hope It doesn't spread to other areas via the mower.

Mowed grandfather's lawn (1)--but not all of the front since it's browning. Neighbor turned around and really scalped in several areas. Not just small areas, either. A lot of it was courtesy of a very low HOC. I don't get why some homeowners (without irrigation) lower their mowing height down to like 1 in in the middle of the Summer. In other news, the new seed I planted last year that came in great without irrigation (including a lot of TTTF and HBG) does appear mostly dead now. Considering going with KY-31 the next time, because the existing KY-31 or similar Tall Fescue in the lawn is still green at this time.


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## Green

7/9/19:

Watered seed areas twice. Watered the upper front hill (and flower bed for the first time), middle of side front, hellstrips, and edges. About a half inch.

Bought one new hose today. Got a 50 ft 3/4" hose. It's too thick and unwieldy for casual hand watering. I think I'll stick to 5/8" hoses for that purpose, but this one will be good for use with sprinklers.


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## Green

7/10/19:

89 again but not constant sun, so one watering of the new grass.

Watered main front and side zones 1 and 2 for 90 and 135 min plus orbit head for 3/4 inch or so. Put down an additional 1/3 to half inch on the upper side with oscillating sprinkler. Watered sunny 2/3 of the far end of low input area with oscillating sprinkler - first time this year. About a half inch of water, which pooled and didn't soak in quickly. Hope I can improve that.

There is very little of the yard left that has not been watered at least once yet this year now. Maybe 2,000 sq ft max.

Sprayed Propiconazole on all new grass areas except most of the side. I guessed my areas were approx 1,000 square ft. in total, so mixed up 6oz of Bayer Propiconazole (2.42%) in about 1.45 gal of water. Went a bit heavier on the areas that had more yellowing.

I'm not a fan of fungicides, but I occasionally use them, sometimes in a somewhat proactive fashion--lately it has been once a year or so on select areas with definite disease or new grass.

Made sure my neighbor's sprinklers were not on. It seems they are set to 7:15-9:15PM, on Thursday nights for one.


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## Green

Watered side front zone for 20 min. x3 once per hour spray and soak for about a half inch of water.

Watered new grass areas once, but too late, and the heat was already getting them. They can't take much more of this...I need to get it done earlier and split it into two waterings per day when it's near or above 90 and sunny.

I put down a bag of Scotts "Foundation" on much of the low-input area and garage side, which is new and I've never used before. It's got Biochar and some other things in it, and I figure it can only help with the heat stress, so this was probably as good a timing as any, especially with rain coming tonight.

I'm done with chemical weed control for most of the Summer now, because it's too hot and the grass is too stressed now. I missed my window for a follow-up Triclopyr spray (@social port) but the first app did kill/subdue a good amount. I pulled a few weeds today, including random broadleaf stuff and what is likely Yellow Nutsedge in the low-input area. Most of the sedge actually pulled out well with the roots intact. No nut-like roots. But a few did break off.

I'm also getting some Spurge in the seeded areas in the low-input area. It could be that the Gallery I used at the 0.38 rate is wearing off, or maybe I worse down the barrier when I raked prior to seeding. In any case, it's easy to pull out.

I also pulled out some of the Annual Ryegrass in the new seed areas throughout the yard, a bit of Crabgrass, etc. Nothing difficult.

I did notice some of the Nimblewill coming back in several parts of the low-input area where I didn't totally control it another year. In one area, I hand pulled a small patch and I think I got it all. In another area, I made a mental note that I'll need to spray at some point. At the far end of the low-input area, there is either Nimblewill and/or Bentgrass encroaching once again from the borders, and it has really set up and spread pretty far into the lawn. I'm not sure which it is, or if it's a mix of the two in that area...this will be challenging, since it's also the area I'm spraying Certainty on, and the Certainty has no effect upon whatever it is, but is making the Tall Fescue stressed, as expected.


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## Green

Got roughly 0.7 in of rain last night, but in a short period (~45 min.).

Due to the rain and partial clouds, the new grass was not overly fried when I went to water.

I also decided to repair the back hose, which was leaking and spurting water...very annoying when you're trying not to get your shoes wet. I found an old hose repair coupler from the 1990s (!) lying around a while back, and decided to use it. It seemed to work pretty well. This style does not appear to be made anymore.

Cut off about 2 feet of the hose.





































I noticed another break starting in the hose after I repaired it. I used the self fusing silicone tape in it, but it seems it won't be durable when dragging the hose around, so I will probably cover it with electrical tape. Hopefully that combination holds it and keeps it from breaking more.

Hickory nuts have been starting to drop for a couple of weeks now. At first, they were small, but are now getting larger. They are dropping on my seeded areas among other places.


----------



## Green

Mowed low input area at 4" and pulled some weeds, including Nutsedge, while mowing. Neighbor's yard in back appears to overrun with the stuff.

Mowed the front hill/hellstrips and the lower side front at the same setting after washing out the mower, but didn't take much off. Maybe a half inch. Will keep it at 4" while the temps are above 90, then take it back down. Most of next week is supposed to be over 90.

Also mowed the part of the main front (and upper side) where I'm spraying Certainty, so I can do the second spray Monday.

Set side front zone to water for about a half inch (20 min x 3 on the hours) tomorrow morning. Will also water hellstrips and part of low input area tomorrow.

Neighbor appeared to fertilize yet again today, though maybe it was Lime. If it was fertilizer, I swear it's going to really burn next week.


----------



## Green

89 today. Watered seeded areas once. I'm still not sure what's causing the seedling decline in some areas. It's hot, but there's enough soil moisture. I sprayed a fungicide a few days ago. Any ideas?

Hand watered hellstrips/edges. Watered sunniest part of the low input area. Put down about a half inch of water. Will continue tomorrow.

85 tomorrow, and then it goes up into the low/mid 90s for a week or so later in the week. Going to have to water the new grass areas twice a day during that period, and the established front/upper side lawn areas almost every other day for a few days. I'm going to temporarily raise the mowing height a bit on those areas, too.

Grandfather's lawn is dormant now (brown/crunchy in the front for the most part, and still somewhat green in the back, but not growing much). So, no need for mowing. Really hoping no one mows it...they'll destroy the grass.


----------



## Green

Also: Sprinklers in the front/upper side were set to water about a half inch for tomorrow. Planning to finally pot that grass that's been laying around, and need to finish mowing tomorrow, and in the near future get down some fertilizer (mostly Potassium).

I may have started seeing a couple of gypsy moths today...

This has a been a great year for Fireflies (which are a type of beetle).


----------



## social port

Green said:


> 89 today. Watered seeded areas once. I'm still not sure what's causing the seedling decline in some areas. It's hot, but there's enough soil moisture. I sprayed a fungicide a few days ago. Any ideas?


Does it look like a fungal infection? Can you ID it?
I know very little about fungicides, but I wonder if you could supplement with Azoxy for wider coverage?


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Does it look like a fungal infection? Can you ID it?
> I know very little about fungicides, but I wonder if you could supplement with Azoxy for wider coverage?


I've been trying to figure this out, if it's heat damage only, or disease. The new grass has some dieback in spots now, but no lesions that I can tell. It started as color loss, and seems that when I didn't water exactly 24 hours after the previous watering, it progressed.

There is disease (various types) on nearby grass, but nothing that mature grass can't handle. I may post some photos of the new grass soon. As for Azoxystrobin, if I use it, I think I would use it in late July as the second application. I'm hoping I can just control/prevent stuff with the organic stuff soon, but we'll see.

The other thing I'm wondering, is if it's overwatering. The problem is, you have to water at least once a day on seedlings when it's 90 degrees...otherwise they won't make it. They start wilting, and then you worry.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> social port said:
> 
> 
> 
> Does it look like a fungal infection? Can you ID it?
> I know very little about fungicides, but I wonder if you could supplement with Azoxy for wider coverage?
> 
> 
> 
> I've been trying to figure this out, if it's heat damage only, or disease. The new grass has some dieback in spots now, but no lesions that I can tell. It started as color loss, and seems that when I didn't water exactly 24 hours after the previous watering, it progressed.
> 
> There is disease (various types) on nearby grass, but nothing that mature grass can't handle. I may post some photos of the new grass soon. As for Azoxystrobin, if I use it, I think I would use it in late July as the second application. I'm hoping I can just control/prevent stuff with the organic stuff soon, but we'll see.
> 
> The other thing I'm wondering, is if it's overwatering. The problem is, you have to water at least once a day on seedlings when it's 90 degrees...otherwise they won't make it. They start wilting, and then you worry.
Click to expand...

Have you tried varying the amount/time of water? 
I would also check for sub-surface rocks, just to be sure.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Have you tried varying the amount/time of water?
> I would also check for sub-surface rocks, just to be sure.


When it's over 90 and sunny, I plan to water at least twice a day if needed, but back off the amount. I can't take moisture samples, because it would disturb the new grass badly. As far as rocks, there are always some, but some of this is happening in areas where soil was brought in 6 years ago, so it can't be that in those areas.

The general wilting and bit of dieback seems to point to heat stress. But I'm not sure what the deal is with the lightening/yellowing that seems to precede it. I'm also not sure if foliar Nitrogen in low concentrations is ok on seedings in this heat, so I might just use the Milorganite, which I'm due for a low amount of over the whole yard, anyway (only dropped 0.7 lb N on most areas so far this year...still need to drop another 0.3 or so and will regardless of the heat).


----------



## Green

Today, watered main front and upper side zones for about a half inch (60 and 80 min. I believe, plus the manual sprinkler).

Watered seed areas once, and went lightly on the ones that looked yellowed in case it was too much water doing it.

Did some hand watering of spots in the upper back and garage side that were browning.

Continued watering the low-input area. Put down about 2/3 inch of water. One more section to go later this week.

Still hand watering the area where I dug for a sprinkler head back in May near the sidewalk.

*Did my 2nd Certainty application this evening. Details to follow.


----------



## Green

Mowed the back (now at 3.75 in with the Toro) and trimmed. Put down 0.5 lb N on the side from 8-0-4. Applied 2nd Velocity app in the front (and first one on the lower side). Hopefully the grass doesn't end up dead after near 100 degree temps late this week. But we are supposed to have a high of only 76 on Thurs. (88F has been about the 3 week average), plus clouds and rain at times, so it should get hydrated. Watered the dry corner of the low input area (about 0.33 inch of water).

This morning, watered the heck out of the back zones...
Upper back: 30 min x 4.
Lower back: 150 min.

Watered hellstrips by hand around 4PM. Still watering new grass areas once, but skipped a lot of the back ones today since they were already watered.


----------



## Green

It was 94 and low 70s dew points, but I did some things in the heat, to prepare for later in the week when it's supposed to be near 100 for a couple of days.

Sprayed PGR plus NIS at a very low rate (under 1/8th oz used) on the lower back including most new grass areas. (I use a gradual tapering strategy for the application rate when stopping, to avoid rebound after the final app...I've found that doing it this way spreads the rebound over a longer duration so you don't notice it). I'm planning one more, even lower app on that area, and will likely use greenkeeper to help with timing.

Finished mowing. Mowed the main front and partly shaded lower side, upping both to 4" during the upcoming heat to help mitigate herbicide stress and retain some green. Mowed the front hill and hellstrips as well.

Front hose broke during use, so I cut it and removed and reinstalled the coupling.

Trimmed grass and weeds in flood prone part of low input area.

Put down 0-0-50 SOP on the front and low input area, plus Tricure granular wetting agent on the side front slope, which is rapidly browning, and hand watered it knowing rain or sprinklers would just run off.

It started to thunder and lightening as I started putting down SOP on the low input area. I ran inside and got material on the floor which I had to vacuum up. But after just a quick rain, I was able to go back and finish.

Watered the sunniest front new grass areas. I think I've been overwatering some of the new grass and that's part of what's making it yellow. As soon as the heat breaks, I plan to decrease the watering a bit.

Picked up a quick inch or so of rain tonight, in under an hour. Hopefully it soaked in, and did not wash away the fertilizer.


----------



## Green

Got 1.16 inches of rain last night. Today was only about 76 for the high, and under 70 for dew point. Tomorrow is supposed to be about 90-92, and then Saturday and Sunday near 100. Plan for tomorrow is to water the new grass areas if needed, pot the grass that's been laying around for like a month finally, and spray Biofungicide.


----------



## Green

So, today it hit around 90, right near where it's been most days for the past three to four weeks. But tomorrow and Sunday are forecast to hit 97 (and probably 100 in more inland locations in the state). And Saturday night, the temp is not supposed to drop below 77. That is very rare at night for the Northeast, and more in line with typical Florida weather. (Speaking of which, Miami actually broke a record recently...the highest low temp ever in July was 84 one night last week.) I feel like we may break a similar record...some forecasts are indicating that the low may be 78 or even 79 tomorrow night. Right now the dew point is about 74, and was 76 a few hours ago. My clothes got soaked from sweat while spraying the lawn. I then showered, and went to an outdoor concert for a half hour, and was a bit wet again after.

I watered the front new grass areas once, but did not do the side or back since it rained yesterday (and greened up nicely). I'll hit all the areas with water tomorrow late morning, and then a second time later in the day if needed.

I finally potted my grass that had been laying around.

I also removed the plastic from the trees (for gypsy moth prevention). I think we're past the caterpillar stage now, and it appears various conditions killed off a lot of them! I've seen very few of the moths (just two over the weekend).

Finally, I sprayed Serenade at the 4oz rate on the front, side, and back.

My neighbor decided to mow this evening, and then turned on the sprinklers after. I did not have the gumption to go back out and re-spray the three feet of width that were wet near the border at 10:15PM. I'll wait until tomorrow evening. I have Propiconazole down on the new grass areas, anyway. I need to help them adjust their heads one of these days...


----------



## Green

It's still about 82 degrees now at 11 PM. I can feel the beginning of dew starting; moreso on the watered areas. I've noticed areas that were watered more recently transpire more. The side front is still mostly dry, which is good. But the back had noticeable moisture, even though it wasn't watered. It faces North.

High was 96 today, dewpoint of 76. I watered new grass areas (twice in the front). The heat was starting to get to it.

I sprayed Serenade with Nu-Film on all new grass areas, plus the whole side front today after the last watering.

Low temp tonight is projected to be somewhere between 76 and 78 around 5 or 6 AM.


----------



## Green

Today hit 97, but felt better than yesterday. The breeze was stronger today, and the dewpoint was about 70 at midday and 72 in the afternoon. It could have been worse though. A few days ago, the forecast was for 100 on Saturday and 98 today.

I hand watered all new grass areas at least once, and the bulk of the front twice. It also rained a trace amount in the late afternoon, which counted as a second/third watering.

I also hand watered the grass and plants near the mailbox at 4PM or so, plus the immediate road, driveway (lower section), and sidewalk edges.

Sprayed vinegar on the weeds in driveway and road cracks.

Soil temp in the front was around 80, but 90 near the road, an hour or so after watering.


----------



## Green

The heat broke today. I doubt it got much over 80. Mowed most of the low input area before it started raining. Threw on the side discharge since it was a bit overgrown. Did not get to mow other lawn areas, which are also high. Wednesday will be the next chance.

Photos from yesterday:

Here is the lower back, with patches I killed and reseeded this Spring:




























Upper side, including reseeded patches:










And here is the part of the low-input area where I've been using Certainty:



















And there is still green Poa Triv there a few days after the 2nd application and after two days in the upper 90s:


----------



## Green

Other day, I pulled up a mystery grass plant (actually, two side-by-side that came apart after) growing in the front walkway. It had seedheads similar to KBG, but really looked nothing like a Bluegrass. Thanks to @fusebox7's journal, I figured out it was Bentgrass. No idea where it came from.

Next thing I need to do is pull Annual Ryegrass (which didn't die in 97 degree heat...I thought it might) and finish mowing, and then spray growth regulator on the front hill/hellstrip areas.


----------



## Green

Got 1.45 inches of rain last night. Pulled up some annual ryegrass. Noticed what appears to be some Nimblewill on the lower side starting up.


----------



## Green

Mowed the main front, front hill, back, and rest of adjacent low input area. Back is up to 4" now since it grew a lot after the rain. Watered new grass areas once, lightly.


----------



## Green

Mowed closest portion of side front and opposite side. 4 inches except raked and took lower side down to 3.75 in due to matting. Trimmed in back and side. Sprayed final PGR app on front hill and hellstrip areas at very low concentration.


----------



## fusebox7

@Green it will be my first time dealing with bent in my lawn. An adjacent lawn has a patch of roughly 500 sq ft that is creeping into my yard too. Probably going to just have to do a little overspray and maintenance on that side to beat it back. I hear Tenacity does a good job with bent.


----------



## social port

The sight of reseeded kill sites looks so familiar to me.

Have you been able to investigate whether or not you have had more triv come up?


----------



## ken-n-nancy

fusebox7 said:


> .... I hear Tenacity does a good job with bent.


Yes, Tenacity is awesome on bentgrass. One app will get most of it; two apps (about 10 days apart) will get it all and keep it from coming back.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> The sight of reseeded kill sites looks so familiar to me.
> 
> Have you been able to investigate whether or not you have had more triv come up?


I think it's KBG. Specifically, the cultivar "America"...it starts out really light and sometimes yellowish. I planted one of those seedlings I pulled out in a pot, so we'll see soon.


----------



## Green

Trying to think...

I think yesterday (July 27) I just pulled some crabgrass and other weeds, and hand watered the slope on the side front and watered the flat near portion near the driveway to about a half inch.

I messed up setting the irrigation for this morning (July 28)...only the orbit sprinkler went on, so I'll have to redo it the day after tomorrow. Thankfully we got a pop-up shower today which saved me from my error, so nothing got fried. Maybe 0.25 inch of rain. At the time, I was watering in the low-input area. Finally, after the rain kept up a while, I shut the sprinkler off. Later, I measured 6/16ths of an inch on my tuna can...2/16ths probably from the sprinkler, and the rest from rain. Finished trimming this evening.

Set the side front zone to 23 min x2 tomorrow morning to top off today's rain.

Hand trimmed.

Mowed grandfather's lawn (1 - specifically, the back). Pulled horseweed. Dug up a Queen Ann's Lace plant and relocated it. Will have to go back later in the week and trim (mostly weeds). I don't know how much of the grass I planted in bare spots last year in his front lawn is still alive at this point. I'm not sure that first year grass does dormancy in any way that's fully recoverable. If not, KY-31 seed to the rescue this year...

Comments-

Tomorrow is 14 days since my previous Certainty application. I think I will reapply at least the low input area section, roughly at this time, the minimum interval, since the first two of three apps have not killed the Triv sufficiently yet.


----------



## Green

90 degrees. Today, watered the next part of the low-input area for about an hour and a half, roughly 0.25 in of water. That's all it can take at once...it got squishy. Hoping to help improve the soil structure over time. This was the area where I've been using Certainty. Hand watered the main front edges and some of the browning areas.

Set zones 1 and 2 to 45 x2 and 56 x2 minutes (2/3 inch?) to water tomorrow morning. Also zone 3, which is contiguous, for 75 min, or about a half inch.


----------



## Green

90 again today. hand watered the edges of the main front and front hill. Hand watered hellstrips/plantings. Set up a sprinkler for the back garden area.

Set zone 4 to water for 30 min x 2 (about a half inch) tomorrow morning. 
-Decided not to. Better not to water if mowing tomorrow evening. I'll simply hand-water the problem areas instead.


----------



## Green

To-do list for August 2019:

*Keep on top of watering new grass areas

-Put down SOP on side.

-Car maintenance*

-Start reseeding/plugging rest of Spring killed patches

-Serenade (ongoing)
-Mosquito Barrier (2nd app)

-Certainty 3rd application
-Velocity 2nd/3rd (front) applications

-Final Tenacity spray on front hill Bentgrass
-Start Tenacity sprays for Nimblewill

-Kill vines

-Lime on Low input area around August 12th

-Milorganite and micros 
-Triclopyr app 2 (hard to believe it's almost 3 weeks since the first) (too hot; wait until late Summer)
-Edge sidewalk and transplant to killed spots in front

-fix/replace broken hoses (in progress, July)
-Find faucet parts

-crushed rock for near deck

-calculate, research, and source mulch
-Check spruces for mites
-solar lights

-New pics in lawn journal

-start cleaning up supply area

-Grab more grass for plugs
-Drill trays
-Start trays
-Call Hogan

-Check spark plug in old mower
-Empty and run out snowblower and put shovels away
-order bulbs
-change oil (old mower)

-fix sunken sprinkler head in front
-irrigation audits
-install new controller
-test spray heads

-Dig up and regrade small area near patio in back and replant grass plugs

Low-input area:
-Jar test
-get sand for topdress
-start fixing flood prone area

-apply humic acid

-troubleshoot why Earthway spreader started leaking
-fix Scotts spreader
-source parts for Chapin sprayers including teejet nozzles
-lubricate mower and wheel barrow wheels

Stuff to buy:
-Locally:
--extra watering nozzle
--Mosquito dunks?
--Better waterproof/sunproof gloves for watering
-SiteOne
-TSC?
-Walmart - oil, yardwork clothes
-Hoses

Online:
-SoilMoist seed coat for family members' lawns (powder type)

Chapin stuff:
-Teejet nozzles
-Sprayer seal/repair kit
-Long wand
-Pressure gauge
-CF valve
-Straps

-Source SLS

-Edge Driveway to prepare for sealcoating


----------



## JDgreen18

@Green DAMN!!! Now that's a to do list lol


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> @Green DAMN!!! Now that's a to do list lol


I hope to get 2/3 of it done next month.


----------



## Green

Today, watered the nearest end of the low input area. About 2.5 hours and a half inch of water. Grass was in need of it.

Hand watered dry spots in the back and marked some that failed screwdriver test.


----------



## social port

Green, how often are you using humid acid. I don't recall you mentioning it very often, but I may simply not remember.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green, how often are you using humid acid. I don't recall you mentioning it very often, but I may simply not remember.


I haven't used it at all this year, and rarely other years. So, not much. Since it's not essential, I hardly find the time.


----------



## Green

Picked up about 7/16ths inch of rain in less than an hour. I guess I won't be mowing. But we need some rain.

5PM: Another 5/16ths or so.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> Since it's not essential, I hardly find the time.


No wonder why...


Green said:


> *Keep on top of watering new grass areas
> 
> -Start reseeding/plugging rest of Spring killed patches
> 
> -Serenade (ongoing)
> -Mosquito Barrier (2nd app)
> 
> -Certainty 3rd application
> -Velocity 2nd/3rd (front) applications
> 
> -Final Tenacity spray on front hill Bentgrass
> -Start Tenacity sprays for Nimblewill
> 
> -Kill vines
> 
> -Lime on Low input area around August 12th
> 
> -Milorganite and micros
> -Triclopyr app 2 (hard to believe it's almost 3 weeks since the first) (too hot; wait until late Summer)
> -Edge sidewalk and transplant to killed spots in front
> 
> -fix/replace broken hoses (in progress, July)
> -Find faucet parts
> 
> -calculate, research, and source mulch
> -Check spruces for mites
> -solar lights
> 
> -New pics in lawn journal
> 
> -start cleaning up supply area
> 
> -Grab more grass for plugs
> -Drill trays
> -Start trays
> -Call Hogan
> 
> -Check spark plug in old mower
> -Empty and run out snowblower and put shovels away
> -order bulbs
> -change oil (old mower)
> 
> -fix sunken sprinkler head in front
> -irrigation audits
> -install new controller
> -test spray heads
> 
> -Dig up and regrade small area near patio in back and replant grass plugs
> 
> Low-input area:
> -Jar test
> -get sand for topdress
> -start fixing flood prone area
> 
> -apply humic acid
> 
> -troubleshoot why Earthway spreader started leaking
> -fix Scotts spreader
> -source parts for Chapin sprayers including teejet nozzles
> -lubricate mower and wheel barrow wheels


But it raises the question: Why humic at all? I'm just picking your mind here...really just wondering if you are all that impressed with its effects. Given that it isn't a major part of your program, I am guessing not.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> But it raises the question: Why humic at all? I'm just picking your mind here...really just wondering if you are all that impressed with its effects. Given that it isn't a major part of your program, I am guessing not.


I don't know...something different to try. It's not essential, but might be fun.


----------



## Green

Not much more rain...negligible.

Today, mowed the front hill, part of side front, back, and most of the low input area. It was too long, so I side discharged the low input. We're talking between 5 and 12 inches, cut at 4". Average height was probably a bit over 6 inches.

Back new grass areas are totally waterlogged since yesterday's rain. I may not even water the front again tomorrow.


----------



## Green

Today, only watered the middle side front new grass areas. None of the others. Trying to let things dry out a bit still.

Went to SiteOne and picked up granular seeding mulch. Asked about Tenacity pricing and if it was competitive with other sources, or a fixed agency price. It was the latter...$102. manager: "No, it's not competitive with online, unfortunately." I can do a lot better with cost than that, but will check one more local source first. I remember my first bottle a bunch of years ago. I think I got it from JDL (now SiteOne), and I think it was like $75 back then. Met one of the local CT TLF members and got 4 bags of Carbon-X fertilizer from our local group buy, and talked about lawn stuff for about 20 min.

At home this evening, finished mowing...did the rest (Certainty treated and flood prone sections) of low input area using the old mower at 3.75 in. Also did the sides and main front with the new mower at 4". The Velocity is not only browning a lot of the grass, but slowing the growth of what it hasn't browned, like a PGR. The lower side really didn't even need cutting, but I evened it up. Lots of brown there, and in the front. Speaking of slow growth, I still have not mowed the middle section of the side front. It hasn't needed a cut in weeks. This happens every Summer for whatever reason. That said, I think it'll bounce back nicely in the late Summer or early Fall.

Really looking to lower the mowing height on more areas in the coming week.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> got 4 bags of Carbon-X fertilizer f


very cool, Green. I missed my chance to apply Carbon-X this spring. I want to use it this fall, and it looks like both LCN and GCI have it in stock. I think I'm going to get two bags.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> I want to use it this fall, and it looks like both LCN and GCI have it in stock. I think I'm going to get two bags.


Thanks. I may share one bag (no more than half, and at actual cost of course) with someone else...there is a local pro who might be interested in testing it. If he's reading this, he already knows who he is as we've talked about the product in person in the past.

For me, it would be a Fall application...I'm essentially totally organic/natural in the Spring now, after slowly transitioning over a few years ago. Still not sure if I'm going to use it instead of what I normally use in late Summer/early Fall, or use different things on different areas, or some of each on all areas.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> social port said:
> 
> 
> 
> I want to use it this fall, and it looks like both LCN and GCI have it in stock. I think I'm going to get two bags.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. I may share one bag (no more than half, and at actual cost of course) with someone else...there is a local pro who might be interested in testing it. If he's reading this, he already knows who he is as we've talked about the product in person in the past.
> 
> For me, it would be a Fall application...I'm essentially totally organic/natural in the Spring now, after slowly transitioning over a few years ago. Still not sure if I'm going to use it instead of what I normally use in late Summer/early Fall, or use different things on different areas, or some of each on all areas.
Click to expand...

What do you normally use in late summer/early fall?


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> Went to SiteOne and picked up granular seeding mulch.


Hey Green is this that hydrocover? If so I used this last year and I didn't like it. It didnt spread in a spreader as the pieces are all different size. I had to do it by hand which led to other issues like putting it on to heavy and it clumping. If its not this product Im curious as to what you got...


----------



## Green

@JDgreen18, yes. I've used one other bag previously. It's 1000x better than actual hydro mulch, which I'll never use again. Nothing's perfect, but it's supposed to be one of the better granular mulches out there. I like to keep one bag on hand just in case. I normally use peat moss, but can't always get it.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, Screamin' Green. Or sometimes Milorganite plus Scotts or other generic.

Based on research relating timing and ratio of fast/slow release with efficiency of uptake. Last year I was late.


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> @JDgreen18, yes. I've used one other bag previously. It's 1000x better than actual hydro mulch, which I'll never use again. Nothing's perfect, but it's supposed to be one of the better granular mulches out there. I like to keep one bag on hand just in case. I normally use peat moss, but can't always get it.


I'm going to look into this, do you remember the name of it the cost per bag, and how much it covers


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> I'm going to look into this, do you remember the name of it the cost per bag, and how much it covers


@JDgreen18, I just wrote a big long response covering all products and my experience with them, and got an error when I hit submit. Which product were you asking about, by the way? The one I got yesterday was Hydrocover Triple Start, which you said you didn't like. Everything else (paper/wood products I've tried) have been inferior so far.


----------



## Chris LI

Thank you. It sounds like we're in the same ballpark as far as late summer fertilizer. The Bioplex I use is kind of similar to blending Milo and Screamin' Green.


----------



## Green

Yesterday: Hand watered the hellstrip/curb areas around 5PM (not the best timing for fungus but it was time to do it).

Today: Watered the side front zone for 90 min total (30 min. x 3); about 0.75 inch this morning.

Set zones 1 and 2 for 90 and 120 min respectively tomorrow morning (0.75 inch??). Also set up the Orbit sprinkler on a timer near the door for 75 min as usual. Not the best thing to water for a couple of minutes in the evening, but oh well.

Skipped hand watering new grass today due to timing, but it's fine. Moving to every other day now, but may even skip tomorrow in the back, as it's still a bit moist from the previous watering.

Tomorrow: Goal is to Spray Certainty application number 3. And biofungicide on some areas if time.


----------



## Chris LI

Just curious...did the rain you received earlier in the week help much? We only received about 0.03" this week and it's been tough trying to keep up with the watering. I've been able to keep most areas out of dormancy, but almost all are showing some degrees of stress. Luckily, I've been able to water a section or two a night fairly heavily, except for tonight, where I'm running short times per zone, to make sure everything is addressed.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, that inch or so of rain on July 31st definitely helped. But we haven't gotten any since then, so I've watered the front once. The low input area is drying out so if we don't get more soon, I'll have to water that. Also brownish dry spots are appearing in the back. I think the ones in the lower back may be the reseeded areas from last year (which had died out due to...insect damage??) And which don't have good roots yet, and the ones in the upper back might be from rocks, so I've been spray painting dots after doing screwdriver tests where I want to go back and dig later. I also watered a bone dry, hard, shaded area next to the garage today. Thankfully I could hear the water absorbing.

There's some level of dormancy happening. Even though it's low to mid 80s now, the August sun angle is pretty harsh compared to July.

Surprised you didn't get rain the other night. On the radar it looked like most of LI got some.


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## Green

Yesterday (Monday 8/6/19): Hand watered some of the front new grass later after the sprinklers, where they didn't reach. Hand watered the back part of the garage side. It was really dried out and compacted (couldn't even pull soil cores the other night). I actually used a tuna can to make sure I got a half inch. I could hear the water absorbing, which was great. I broke it up into parts and let it absorb a few times.

Then, I mowed most of the lower back and low-input area (not the Certainty area). Still at 4" HOC, but it grew a bit since the last mow. I was trying to clean up all the clippings left in the low input area (from the last time when it was overgrown and I side-discharged), but it didn't totally work...there are still too many clippings that aren't breaking down. Guess I'll have to mow it again in 4 more days or so.

Did not get to spray due to wind (and mowed instead), so hopefully tomorrow morning or something...barring rain, etc.

And it looks like my pre-M barriers are all basically running out or have run out now...I noticed a piece of crabgrass in the low-input area today and pulled it out. So, the Dimension barrier is gone, too, not just the Gallery one. Maybe I can use higher rates the next time. An additional 0.25 to 0.5 lb/M of Dimension should have extended it another week or two, in theory. I used 2.6 lbs/M on May 29th (0.15% Dimension). So that's like 10 weeks. That's 2.5 months. 1.04 lb per month. That's good though...I can seed if I want to.

Chem lawn came to neighbor's, and just spot sprayed weeds. No fert. From the smell, I bet it was a 2,4-D and Quinclorac mix with blue tracker dye.

Tomorrow: 
-Certainty (low input area and maybe side and front)
-Finish mowing back and marking areas where screwdriver test failed
-SOP (side)
-Lime/Epsom salt (low input 5.5K)
-Biofungicide
-Check mosquito dunks
-Seedheads
-Trimming
-PGR (lower back)?

-Humic acid? Seeding in back or garage side?
-Edging? Vines? Solar lights? Snowblower?


----------



## Green

Today:

I did not water the seeded areas. This is like a few days since I've watered in the back. But it was mostly cloudy until late.

Sprayed final Certainty application on the low-input treatment section. This time I upped the rate to 0.37 oz per acre (using 0.216 g twice in 1.8 gal. of water with 3.6 tsp of NIS, over the 1.8K area. Still have the front/side areas to do another day. Mowed the front portion at the same time I did the side, so it's ready in a few days.

Finished marking areas in the upper back, and then mowed there, after cleaning the mower. Still at 4" HOC.

After that, put down Lime on the low-input area (minus the flood prone area). Used one bag of Solu-Cal over ~5.5K area. The grass is starting to yellow/brown out a bit more now from Summer stress catching up to it. The Lime should help with that. Did not do the Epsom salt today; will another time. Also checked/replenished mosquito dunks.

Then, put down SOP 0-0-50 on the side...I used 3.5 lbs and feathered it out a bit over the adjacent edges of the upper lower back and neighbor's border. Noticed more crabgrass in the area, and will have to spot spray it one of these days I guess as it was too big to pull out. It's not seeding yet, anyway.

Finally, trimmed in the back. Oh, and collected most of the seed heads for planting experiments. Very excited to try to grow my own grass from my own seed! Also got rid of as many potential Poa Triv seedheads on the middle side as possible. Hopefully they're KBG, but you never know. Some had already fallen off and dispersed. Oh well.

Oh, and finally ran out the snowblower. The bit of stabilized gas I removed (no more than a drinking glass quantity) is old and had yellowed. I plan to dilute it with new fresh gas, add enzyme treatment to reduce engine damage, and use it in the old lawn mower. I should have done this a few months ago.


----------



## Green

Mowed the main front. It started raining during that. I finished, but the mower might be a little messy. Since then, we've had some rain and thunderstorms come through. As of 7:30PM, we had gotten roughly an inch of rain (in about an hour). Some flooding in the low input area. Thankful for this rain since I hadn't watered at all...including the new grass areas--still did not water them today. It was actually sunny earlier today and didn't look like rain.

Total rain was 1.22 inches by 1AM. I took the gauge away, but the chance of additional rain is fairly low.


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## Green

It looked like it was going to rain again tonight. It got dark, the wind whipped up, and there was a severe thunderstorm watch. There was some rain, but not too much. I think that was it.

Earlier today, the roof was redone. (Thanks @Shindoman for advice.) The grass made it through, but it was a test for the baby grass...it ended up all matted down from the foot traffic and tarp (so did the mature grass), as they carried the new shingles up the ladders by hand as they needed them. The blower can only stand it back up so much after as it gets wilted from the traffic, but I did blow it to fluff it up and picked up debris after--not much stuff, because they got most of it, and they used a magnetic sweeper for the nails. I am actually going to buy a small one tomorrow to get any residual nails before I mow or step into the mulched area. Better to buy that than have an injury or damage the new lawnmower. Thankfully it was not too sunny, so my grass did not totally fry in the heat under the tarp. I also fixed the grass at the driveway edge on the side front, as it got run over by a truck backing out at the end of the day apparently...same place, always prone to that. Plan is to stay off it tomorrow and let it get some sun, and then mow on Saturday after sweeping for nails again, taking the HOC down lower, and then fertilize lightly the next day.


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## Green

Hand watered the trampled section of the front, plus many of the new grass areas (and the ones on the side, and a few in the back/low input areas). Hand watered across the main front, the lower half of the driveway edge, and across the sidewalk on the side front.


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## Green

Went to HD and purchased one of those nail/screw picker-upper magnetic things you can roll around. I picked up 33 nails with it today, so the contractors missed a few when they used a large version of the same tool (as expected). Also bought another hose, which is badly needed. They currently have 100' 5/8 hoses on sale for $20.

After picking up nails, I mowed the side front (except garage side--where the rust is getting worse and it's matted...need fertilizer STAT). Front hill was overgrown a bit, so I had to stay at 4". I finally mowed the middle section of the side front for the first time a number of weeks, and there was a bit of growth intermixed with the dormant grass.

I mowed the main front (which has a lot of matted grass now and some burn marks starting to show). I took the HOC down to 3.75 on those areas, and mowed the rest at 4" since it was a bit longer. I wore safety glasses in case I missed any nails.

New mower (Honda engine) backfired for the first (maybe second) time ever on the second start after stopping it to pick up sticks that were in its path. Sputtered a bit upon re-start, but worked fine after running and calming down a few seconds later. Not sure if that indicates anything.

I'm not watering tomorrow (except for hand watering), as things are still somewhat moist.


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## Green

Mowed most of lower back, side, and low input area. Watered the brown and stressed areas from the construction project. Put down 8 lbs of 6-2-0 Milorganite mixed with about 5.25 tbsp of Boron and Zinc on the side front. Set irrigation in that area to water for 30 min x3 (30 min soak) tomorrow morning. Will hand water hellstrips tomorrow.


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## Green

8/12/19: Watered the new grass areas (most). Hand watered all hellstrips/lower main front driveway edge. The main front road edge is browning out...

Watered a half inch on the sunny open part of the low input area. It's starting to appear slightly brown, too. Didn't realize there was rain coming tomorrow.

Finished mowing the back and low input area, including the flood-prone section that I want to fix up soon. Used the old mower on those areas in the low-input area. There is some sort of invasive grass that is very fine-bladed, stoloniferous, and light green. I thought it was Poa Triv, but am not sure now because it's not dying in the heat, and the Certainty isn't killing it either. Hmmm. This is a head-scratcher. Might have to send a sample out to the guy who helped me out the last time.

Eyeballed the area behind the grill that went patchy brown the last couple of days, and figured 7x12 feet. Calculated how much Green Max fertilizer I'd need for a 0.25 N app. It was 1.3oz. I threw it out by hand. Hopefully that helps to get it recovering.


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## Green

So, the rain never happened. Only got 0.05 inch. So, I just went and hand-watered in the fertilizer I put down yesterday. And watered the adjacent garage side grass while I was at it. Good thing I started watering yesterday. I think I'll finally get that Milorganite down tomorrow, and then water the next day. And really need to get my seed down in the back on those Roundup spots from the Spring that I haven't redone yet.


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## Green

Watered the closest end of the low-input area (0.5 in). Pulled weeds (mostly spurge) in the new grass in that area. Still trying to figure out if the weather will cooperate to do anything else now; it was cloudy and drizzling and now it's partly sunny.

The damage from the tarps took a few days to progress; it seems to have peaked yesterday/today. I don't think it's getting any worse now.

Photos:


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## social port

Say, @Green, I can't believe how much spurge I've been spotting in my yard over the last week. Have you ever experienced negative consequences (e.g., vigorous regrowth, spreading) from pulling it?

I like to pull when possible, but the idea of pulling some of those broadleaf weeds makes me nervous, but mostly due to lack of knowledge.


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## Green

social port said:


> Say, Green, I can't believe how much spurge I've been spotting in my yard over the last week. Have you ever experienced negative consequences (e.g., vigorous regrowth, spreading) from pulling it?


No, not at all. I tend to get the whole root, so no issues. The type I have every year (spotted?? It has small green leaves.) pulls fairly easily and cleanly if you grab it right, but I've seen what I think is another type that doesn't in other yards/places. And I've never had the skin irritation from it that I've seen mentioned online. It has actually helped insulate the new grass from sun damage as it grows in, so I consider that a plus. I just don't let it get out of hand and take over or go to seed. The Virgina Copperleaf or Copperweed is also easy to pull.


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## social port

Thanks, @Green. I think I will try pulling as I continue to see them.


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## Green

social port said:


> Thanks, Green. I think I will try pulling as I continue to see them.


Yeah. But there's definitely less this year in the area, now that the grass is denser. The Gallery also helped outside of the Spring reno patches (where I roughed up the soil in May), but I may have applied it too early and/or not a high enough rate as there's some breakthrough in thinner spots.

I just added photos of the tarp damage above.


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## Chris LI

I jumped over to your journal to see what's going on, after replying to your comments in mine. I see you did get the Milo down. Things should perk up for you soon. The tarp damage doesn't look too bad, just some leaf tip burn. Hopefully, with the Milo, water and a mow or two, it will grow out.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> I jumped over to your journal to see what's going on, after replying to your comments in mine. I see you did get the Milo down. Things should perk up for you soon. The tarp damage doesn't look too bad, just some leaf tip burn. Hopefully, with the Milo, water and a mow or two, it will grow out.


Yeah, I got it put down in the front, but not in the back yet (where most of the damage was).


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## Green

Today, I mowed the front hill, main front, side, and started mowing the low-input area. I noticed that the front sections were on the verge of overgrown after 5 days since last mow, so the growth rate is picking up again. I'm still at 4 in HOC. I haven't been able to reduce it yet due to taking too much off. I also noticed that the blade on the Toro is in need of sharpening...it's not mulching as well anymore and I'm not getting clean cuts. I never sharpened it since I got the mower, so I guess it's time. It didn't seem dull the way some blades are when new, but it didn't have the type of edge that looked like it would last too long before dulling, either.

I also put down the Milorganite with micros on the side and main front after mowing. I applied it after it started getting dark. Amounts: 
-Side: 10 lbs 6-2-0, 2.5Fe Milo with ~4.5 tbsp. Boron and Zinc - up and down only, not side-to-side
-Front: 17 lbs 6-2-0 4Fe milo with ~7.5 tbsp. Boron and Zinc - mostly parallel to driveway, except for some passes between street and Hickory tree, and between the side and the front walk.
Spreader: Eathway at 9.5. Maybe try slightly lower setting next time to get more passes.

This is roughly 0.4 lb N rate.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 90 and 120 min tomorrow morning (~0.75 inch). Will need to supplement with Orbit sprinkler near house. Also need to water hellstrip areas tomorrow. Would like to start getting seed down, too.


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## Green

Finished mowing today. Took the near flat part of the side front down to 3.75 in.

Put down Milorganite on the back. 6-2-0, 4% Fe Milo.
Upper back: 7 lbs Milo with 3 tbsp of Boron.
Lower back: 8 lbs Milo with 3.5 tbsp of Boron.

Mowed and trimmed grandfather's lawn (1). Did not mow over the totally brown parts. No reason to damage the dormant lawn with the weight of the tractor. The amount of horse weed growing in the hardscape was crazy, and it was 3-4 feet high and starting to flower. Cut them all down with the trimmer. I hope there were no seeds yet. Planning to get some KY-31 seed for the corners near the road there, because the Fescue/HBG mix I planted last year has mostly died out this Summer.


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## Green

Watered hellstrip areas.

Did final Certainty applications on the experimental area in the front, and the upper side, avoiding the new grass as much as possible. I used 0.02g on the front, and about 0.05g on the side. The excess got used to spot spray (a 4th app of sorts) in the low-input area and blanket spray the flood prone area grass (for whatever it's worth).

Also did my final Velocity application on the front (main front minus new grass areas) and the little strip on the side front. Used as close to the standard 3oz rate as I could get. Used the excess (I made too much) to do the second app on the lower side. I am not looking forward to the grass turning brown again, as it had mostly recovered since the previous app.

Spot sprayed a large crabgrass plant in the new grass area on the side, with Tenacity using a hand spray bottle.

Set irrigation zones to water tomorrow morning for a half inch or so on the two back zones and the side front. Not sure if we're going to get any rain tomorrow, so I just set them for a half inch instead of 3/4.

Did not get to do the biofungicide yet. Also need to blanket spray Tenacity on a section in the low-input area where there's Nimblewill. And I need to kill the invasive Bittersweet vines.


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## Green

Got about 1/3-inch of rain last night. Combined with the sprinklers running this morning, the areas that needed water are good now.

Took out some Hen of the Woods mushroom clumps in the front, and an annual ryegrass clump in the side, destroying two areas of the new grass. I fixed them as best I could and marked with flags so I know where to water.

Finally sprayed Serenade Biofungicide today, mixed with Nu-Film 17. Sprayed all main lawn areas except the walkway grass (so I didn't stain the walkways). Sprayed the closest 2/3 or so of the low-input area. I used the full rate. Hopefully whatever disease is there is halted by this and the Milo app.

I see what I believe are stressed Poa Triv areas despite the heat and herbicides, like they're hiding out the heat because I mow high and the good grass shields them. @tgreen, this Triv appears to have a very short ligule (like KBG) this time of year. Ever noticed that? I think these are turf types, as well...they're super fine in texture. I don't know what else they could be other than Triv. I will spot spray them with Velocity at some point in the future, and see if they die. I sprayed some others, in the low-input area, with a high rate of Certainty, and they seem to be browning more. Has to be Triv. Almost looks like a fine-textured light green Ryegrass, or even Fine Fescue, but it can't be. I see stems that look like stolons when I pull some out.

Next few days:
-kill invasive vines
-spray Tenacity on area with Nimblewill in the low-input area
-spray Mosquito barrier (once there's no more rain in the forecast)

9:15PM: started raining. Let's see if we get much.


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## Green

Put down roughly 10 lbs of Epsom salt on the non-flood-prone ~5.5K of the low-input area really quick before it started raining. Went mostly parallel to the length, with a bit of extra diagonal passes in the middle areas. Was trying to beat the thunder and lightening and rain. Probably won't be much rain. Last night wasn't really measurable. Got something down, at least.


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## tgreen

Green said:


> @tgreen, this Triv appears to have a very short ligule (like KBG) this time of year. Ever noticed that?


Yes, I did a youtube video on the ligule but it was still early in the season and the plant was still large so the ligule was relatively easy to see. Once the heat hits and the triv starts to lay-out and the stolons get going then it is nearly impossible for me to see the ligule. I spot the triv at this time of year mostly 1) by its light color and 2) the ease with which it pulls off the soil. There is one other way I ID questionable triv vs KBG at the time of year but it's difficult to explain. I'll try to pull some and post a picture over next few days.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> Put down roughly 10 lbs of Epsom salt on the non-flood-prone ~5.5K of the low-input area really quick before it started raining. Went mostly parallel to the length, with a bit of extra diagonal passes in the middle areas. Was trying to beat the thunder and lightening and rain. Probably won't be much rain. Last night wasn't really measurable. Got something down, at least.


Did you get the "appropriate" amount of rain? Check my journal, lol!


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## Chris LI

tgreen said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> @tgreen, this Triv appears to have a very short ligule (like KBG) this time of year. Ever noticed that?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I did a youtube video on the ligule but it was still early in the season and the plant was still large so the ligule was relatively easy to see. Once the heat hits and the triv starts to lay-out and the stolons get going then it is nearly impossible for me to see the ligule. I spot the triv at this time of year mostly 1) by its light color and 2) the ease with which it pulls off the soil. There is one other way I ID questionable triv vs KBG at the time of year but it's difficult to explain. I'll try to pull some and post a picture over next few days.
Click to expand...

Your video was very helpful with ID for me. Thank you. From my understanding, repeated shots of glyphosate in the spring when it's actively growing is the best tactic in the triv battle, but is there anything effective we can do this time of year? Before I knew what it was, I ripped out a 3'x3' patch almost exactly a year ago and reseeded, which seemed to help. It doesn't appear to have been invaded again, yet.


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## Green

tgreen said:


> There is one other way I ID questionable triv vs KBG at the time of year but it's difficult to explain. I'll try to pull some and post a picture over next few days.


Is that the "string test" by chance? Because I use that all the time.


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## Green

tgreen said:


> Yes, I did a youtube video on the ligule but it was still early in the season and the plant was still large so the ligule was relatively easy to see. Once the heat hits and the triv starts to lay-out and the stolons get going then it is nearly impossible for me to see the ligule. I spot the triv at this time of year mostly 1) by its light color and 2) the ease with which it pulls off the soil. There is one other way I ID questionable triv vs KBG at the time of year but it's difficult to explain. I'll try to pull some and post a picture over next few days.


Ok, so it's not just me, then. Also, there is a guy from CT on the other site struggling with IDs right now in a current thread there. He got an expert ID saying "Red Fescue", but I think that was wrong. He said there were no intact blade tips on the sample he sent them. I think I gave him some decent advice. He has tons of photos posted. It's either Triv or KBG.

That's really interesting that the ligule disappears this time of year. I have shriveled, weak grass that has been hit by Velocity 3x including the other day for the third time, exposed to lots of temps over 90, etc. Pretty sure it's Triv. But it doesn't have a noticeable ligule.

The only constant with Triv seems to be the "string test". Annua passes it, too, though.

Have you ever found Velocity-resistant Triv that won't die/go brown even with spot sprays?


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Put down roughly 10 lbs of Epsom salt on the non-flood-prone ~5.5K of the low-input area really quick before it started raining. Went mostly parallel to the length, with a bit of extra diagonal passes in the middle areas. Was trying to beat the thunder and lightening and rain. Probably won't be much rain. Last night wasn't really measurable. Got something down, at least.
> 
> 
> 
> Did you get the "appropriate" amount of rain? Check my journal, lol!
Click to expand...

No. It looks like under 0.2 inch counting both today's and last night's rain. So 0.1 inch today so far (I think we're done now, but we'll see) at most.

Very glad I sprayed the biofungicide with duration extender yesterday.


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## Chris LI

Good call. This week may be a roller coaster for fungus.


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## tgreen

Green said:


> tgreen said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I did a youtube video on the ligule but it was still early in the season and the plant was still large so the ligule was relatively easy to see. Once the heat hits and the triv starts to lay-out and the stolons get going then it is nearly impossible for me to see the ligule. I spot the triv at this time of year mostly 1) by its light color and 2) the ease with which it pulls off the soil. There is one other way I ID questionable triv vs KBG at the time of year but it's difficult to explain. I'll try to pull some and post a picture over next few days.
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, so it's not just me, then. Also, there is a guy from CT on the other site struggling with IDs right now in a current thread there. He got an expert ID saying "Red Fescue", but I think that was wrong. He said there were no intact blade tips on the sample he sent them. I think I gave him some decent advice. He has tons of photos posted. It's either Triv or KBG.
> 
> That's really interesting that the ligule disappears this time of year. I have shriveled, weak grass that has been hit by Velocity 3x including the other day for the third time, exposed to lots of temps over 90, etc. Pretty sure it's Triv. But it doesn't have a noticeable ligule.
> 
> The only constant with Triv seems to be the "string test". Annua passes it, too, though.
> 
> Have you ever found Velocity-resistant Triv that won't die/go brown even with spot sprays?
Click to expand...

Ok, I'll try to find the post and take a look at the red fescue post.

Not sure exactly what is the string test? My experience is the ligule size is proportionate to the size of the plant. When the plant is big in the spring and early summer, I find the ligule is easy to see. As the plant spreads and stolonizes (not a real word) then the ligule ID doesn't work. It's too small. It's not so much that it disappears but rather the plant and blades are too small to easily see it.

The observation I referred to is the space between the blade and the plant stem where the ligule is located is close and tight on poa triv whereas it's separate and open on kbg. Like I said, hard to explain in words so will try to post some pics.

As far as the velocity, I don't know that poa t is 'resistant' but there seem to be so many factors on how thorough the kill is, e.g., temperatures, rates, time of year, luck?, etc. If you told me you are spot spraying velocity on triv multiple times with no effect then I would say it's not triv. One app is not enough so I would believe that.


----------



## tgreen

Chris LI said:


> tgreen said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> @tgreen, this Triv appears to have a very short ligule (like KBG) this time of year. Ever noticed that?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, I did a youtube video on the ligule but it was still early in the season and the plant was still large so the ligule was relatively easy to see. Once the heat hits and the triv starts to lay-out and the stolons get going then it is nearly impossible for me to see the ligule. I spot the triv at this time of year mostly 1) by its light color and 2) the ease with which it pulls off the soil. There is one other way I ID questionable triv vs KBG at the time of year but it's difficult to explain. I'll try to pull some and post a picture over next few days.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Your video was very helpful with ID for me. Thank you. From my understanding, repeated shots of glyphosate in the spring when it's actively growing is the best tactic in the triv battle, but is there anything effective we can do this time of year? Before I knew what it was, I ripped out a 3'x3' patch almost exactly a year ago and reseeded, which seemed to help. It doesn't appear to have been invaded again, yet.
Click to expand...

Chris, glad that vid helped and thanks for letting me know. You are right that the research says killing in the spring seems to be the most effective. However, I had two large areas of triv that I killed in the Fall and reno'd in 2 consecutive years. On the first one, the triv exploded the following fall but on the second it did not. The obvious question is why and I still have not figured it out. My current thinking is that aerating, overseeding and topdressing with a layer of compost was responsible for the triv explosion. Between the constant watering and the layer of compost, I think the triv thrived. In year 2, I skipped the compost topdress and did not see as much triv. Total guess but I think the water retention of the compost could have had something to do with it.

Bottom line, I would hit it with roundup NOW and reseed it. Don't wait for spring.


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## Chris LI

@tgreen 
Thank you. I kept it mostly out of dormancy this summer, so I might have a shot with roundup.


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## Green

@tgreen, You know the "strings" you get sticking out of the cut tips when mowing with a dull mower blade sometimes?

The string test is where you take a grass blade off and try to stretch it like silly putty. It will snap in half at some point, but if done right, you'll get a broken grass blade held together by one or more "strings" when it's Triv. In KBG, that hasn't happened yet...the strings snap off at the same time as the leaf tissue in KBG, leaving a cleanly ripped grass blade without strings sticking out.

This works so well that I use it as a diagnostic test to tell Triv/annua from KBG. Problem is right now, with heat-stressed Triv, you have to do it on a number of blades before you see the strings because they're so shriveled up and weak from the heat and/or herbicides. Also, I haven't tested every KBG cultivar that exists, of course...it's possible that some of them could "string" as well.


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## Green

Mowed the main front, front hill/hellstrips, and upper side real quick. Still at 4 in. I didn't have any more gas left after what was in the mower. Need to get more tomorrow.

Put most of a new pack of mosquito dunks down in the flood-prone area.

Really need rain tomorrow.

It's been high 80s/low 90s again the past few days. Looking at the long-term forecast, it's going to be perfect seeding weather after a few more days...highs in the 70s and 80s and lows in the 50s and 60s. Can't argue with that since I need to put down some seed, and won't have to water a zillion times a day.


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## Green

Got rain a few times today. ~0.375 inch in the rain gauge.

Set up Orbit sprinkler for 80 min near door and zones 1 and 2 to water for 45 and 60 min respectively tomorrow morning (about 0.35 inch).

Might also water low-input area about 0.2 inch tomorrow or the next day, depending on mowing schedule. Or, might just wait until the next cycle, since 0.375 inch of fairly hard rain should have penetrated to the roots pretty well...probably better than 0.5 inch from a sprinkler, actually. I think I'll wait it out until the next cycle.


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## Chris LI

Has the rain helped your lawn to rebound from the high temperatures this week?


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Has the rain helped your lawn to rebound from the high temperatures this week?


It started to improve during that cooler period we had for about 2 weeks. But no further improvement yet since then. I'm actually surprised it's improving as much as it has already. Normally August lawn condition is a lot worse. I guess having normal soil moisture this year in July was the key. The last 10-15 years or so, there has been under 3 inches of rain on average in July. I believe we had around or a bit over 5 inches in July this year (4.6 in or so being normal based on historical data).


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## Green

Nothing today, except check the rain gauge, and transplant some grass in the back for fun.

For fun, here are some shots showing TTTF rhizomes:


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## social port

I am trying to think of another picture showing TTTF's rhizomes, and I can't come up with anything. This may be the first one I've seen. Thanks for posting this! Very cool.


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## Green

Overgrown lawn.

Mowed most of front hill, back, lower side, and most of low input area. Had to double mow many parts. Side discharged and double mowed low input area.

Got another 0.11 inch of rain last night/this morning. As a result of that, clouds and low temps under 80, today was damp and felt humid despite being technically less humid.

Also cut the three pumpkins off the vine. One is near perfect; the other two got bitten and/or attacked by insects to some degree.


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## Chris LI

I think we're over the hump with high temp trends over 90* for the season. We should hit low 60's tonight, with some areas in the 50's. I'm still waiting for that 59* night.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> I think we're over the hump with high temp trends over 90* for the season. We should hit low 60's tonight, with some areas in the 50's. I'm still waiting for that 59* night.


Supposed to get to about 57 tonight, and low 50s over the weekend. It was low 60s when I went outside on the lawn because I thought I left something out. The grass was saturated with dew. Dew point is 55.

I have disease everywhere now because I waited too long to mow...over a week.


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## Chris LI

Hopefully, it will recover quickly with the lower temps, and lower humidity. Do you know which disease(s) you have?


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Hopefully, it will recover quickly with the lower temps, and lower humidity. Do you know which disease(s) you have?


No, I just took a real quick look. Didn't recognize it. Should get better with some sunlight.


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## Green

Mowed the Certainty-treated part of the low-input area at 3.75 in with the old mower. Not overgrown, probably due to the herbicide and the wetness reducing the growth rate. There is still lots of mystery grass there (fine-bladed Triv?) that didn't get killed by the Certainty. Some did, some didn't. I should do a Tenacity spray there soon to try to knock it back more while it's still impacted by the Certainty. Maybe it'll whiten, and then I can spot spray it over and over until it browns...whatever it is. There's also probably Nimblewill or Bentgrass there, so the Tenacity is a must. Actually, I think I'll use it a temporary pre-M so I can seed as well.

Then mowed the upper side, main front, and hellstrips with the new mower. Still at 4 in, but not for long...

Did pruning on the garage side.

Crabgrass is now going to seed. Need to get rid of those.

Set the irrigation to water the side front for 30 min x2 with 30 min soak tomorrow morning (half an inch or so).

Tomorrow: more pruning, pick up nails, measure bed areas, trimming, Tenacity on area with Nimblewill. Hopefully start edging, too. Need to spray Mosquito Barrier one of these days as well.


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## Green

Getting spoiled with great weather this weekend, continuing tomorrow. Highs are in the 70s and it's going into the mid--possibly even low--50s. Dew points are in the 50s.


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## Green

In the low-input area behind the shed, there is a shady sloped area that levels off. There are also some small junk trees there. This is where there's Nimblewill. Unfortunately, it's starting to go dormant from lack of direct sun. But I blew the leaves off and then sprayed app #1 of Tenacity with NIS at approx. 3.5oz/Acre rate on the area. I used some of the remaining Tenacity to spray some misc. things, like a few Crabgrass plants on the side and a Lily plant that's trying to grow in the hellstrip area, and one at the top of the hill.

I then trimmed in the back, and then mowed much of the side front at 4 in. I then mowed the main front, and took it down to 3.75 in. I also reel mowed an area of new grass that got too high on the side, 3rd setting down from top. Plan for Wednesday is to finish mowing as long as there's no rain.

I watered the new grass areas on the side front, and one in the low input area. Tomorrow I'll water the back ones.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water main front and upper side for 80 and 100 min. respectively tomorrow morning.

The top of the front hill is browning/thinning and not growing, as often happens sometime between July and September. I think it's the tree roots stealing water that's causing it.


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## Green

Hand watered new grass areas in back, low input, and side.

Helped a family member with some yard stuff, weeding, transplanting a bush, etc. Watered the grass I seeded there in April. Some is dead, but it looks like some will make it through the Summer. Put some 6-4-0 Milo on the area before watering. We'll see how it looks once the weed pressure decreases.


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## Green

Outdoor To-do list for this week:

-Order catch cans. Rain sensor. Faucet. Car. Shoes.

-Mow hellstrips, rest of side front, back, lower side, and low input and Trim where needed. Repaint Marks if needed. Measurements in front.

-Measure and check for nails in mulch, etc. Figure out where to get from.

-start reseeding spots in back (late)

-edge driveway and sidewalk

-Milorganite and micros on low input area

-Mosquito barrier app 2

-Finish pruning

-Get sand and compost and spray any weedy stuff in flood prone area.

-Tenacity spray.

-Check notes for when final Velocity spray on lower side should be done.


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## fusebox7

Green said:


> Outdoor To-do list for this week:
> <Long list of stuff>


Dizzamn duder. I'll have what you're having!


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## Green

Got 0.42-0.5 inch of rain yesterday.

Mowed the back, side, and most of the low-input area. Totally overgrown (6 days since the last mowing, and I wanted to do it 2 days ago). It doesn't help that I'm now mowing with a dull blade (working on getting it off to sharpen, but didn't have the right tools).


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## Green

Edged one side of driveway. Mowed front hill at 4 in (lower 2/3).

Set side front zone to water for 30 min. x3 tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Edged the other side (the side front). It was difficult, partly due to the hill and the design of the edger (has a piece near the blade mount that sticks out and hits into the previously edged area). Cutting into the hill was not easy and required many passes and holding the machine in weird positions, constantly fiddling with the blade height, backing up, stopping to check, and then hand-edging with a hand-spade after, all of which was quite strenuous. It took several hours. Also, the driveway was not made right in the first place. It's not even up and down, and I over-edged some areas into the dirt by accident. But the goal is to get the driveway ready for seal-coating, so it's good enough.

Tomorrow: finish edging. Pick up nails. Measure. Mow some areas. Trim? Kill vines. Seed. Spray?? Finish milo??? Online orders. Buy extra bucket.


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## Green

Edged the front hill/cleaned up everything. Mowed the main front at 3.75 in. Mowed rest of low input area with old mower.


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## Green

Mowed the side front, which I didn't have time for last night. Brought the front hill portion down to 3.75 inches finally. Back is still stuck at 4 inches. Need to get that lowered this week, too.


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## Green

Got a total of 0.4 inch of rain yesterday/last night (about 0.10 inch during the day, and 0.3 at night all at once).

This dull mower blade is driving me crazy...looking forward to sharpening it in the coming days, finally. The grass is going a bit diffusely brownish in some areas (like the lower back), and I'm not sure if that is why, or if it's drought, stress, or too high a HOC, or disease, or maybe even that "shedding" thing that can happen this time of year (which I've never witnessed before, but there's a first for everything). The dull blade is also causing grass clumps in the right wheel's path.

I mowed the lower back tonight, and it was verging on overgrown again. Still cannot get that darn HOC below 4 inches...
Hopefully I will have good weather tomorrow morning and be able to finish mowing other areas before the rain.

I really hope I did not have seed contaminated with Poa Triv when I killed and reseeded those areas this Spring. I cannot for the life of me tell the difference between KBG and Triv when the grass is new and not mature. But some of it is light green/yellowish and higher than the surrounding grass, and a few blades passed the "string test" too, which is not a good sign.

I sprayed Tenacity (~4oz rate) on the furthest 2,500 or so square feet in the low-input area (a bit passed the Mulberry Tree). This will provide a good pre/post emergent against Poa A, Poa T, Nimblewill, Bentgrass, and the Sedges and Crabgrass at the border of the neighbor's yard. Additionally, I spot-sprayed the alleged Triv patches with the extra that was left over to get a higher dose on them. I just know a lot of this area is going to light up bright white in a week or two (doesn't help that there's fine fescue mixed in)...that will be something to see...

Mowed grandfather's lawn (1).


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## Green

Finished mowing. Did the upper back, redid some of the lower back due to clippings left yesterday, did the side, did the front (took off a little), and did the rest of the low input area (had to side discharge some of it). Washed the mower.

Got 0.4 inch of rain from a downpour with melted hail this evening. It's not going to soak in on the slopes.


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## Green

Trimmed in back and did an irrigation audit in upper back for one hour. I have some issues...the head near the back garage corner (especially) and the one across from the shed (may try a low angle nozzle because it's flooding the shed) are outputting too much water. Average output might be 5-6 16ths in the zone.

Also hand trimmed and mowed hellstrip areas (4 in) and double mowed front hill at 4 and then 3.75 in. There is matting going on, just like in the back. Raking and trimming was the solution in the back near edges.

Also pulled some crabgrass at the back borders and then what I think is Switchgrass in the low input area border. Also pulled up some shriveled grass in the lower side. It's either Poa Triv or some type of Fine Fescue, but is not rooted past the soil surface.

Threw 2 more half mosquito dunks into the water in the flooded area for insurance. Really hoping it dries out soon and we don't get too much rain so I can get to the area and start applying sand soon.


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## Green

Started reseeding bare spots. Did all the spots in the upper back and garage side (where I had killed Triv in the Spring but hadn't reseeded yet). Did the spot in the lower back where I pulled up grass the other day. Added some seed to the reseeded spots from the Spring that were lacking.

And also overseeded/spot seeded a bit of the side front where the grass stressed in the Summer. Nothing great...just roughed it up/dethatched a little, sprinkled seed, and stepped on it, the way a normal person would.

In a few days, I'll do the main front.

Measured for mulch.

Already feeling a little wind and rain and from the outer bands of the hurricane, even though it's still down near VA/NC. It actually got cloudy yesterday from it. They're currently predicting a second landfall in Nova Scotia as a Cat. 1 in a few days.


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## Green

@g-man, I'd like your opinion on something.

I had planned to do a small reno on the flood-prone area using MyHolidayLawn KBG. But it's getting late, and I'm not even ready. Instead of waiting until Spring (risky because of water/ice damage over Winter and then Summer temps) I was thinking of doing a couple of trays of the grass starting now. That would give me time to get the area topdressed with sand/peat moss first while the sod grows, and then I can transplant it. It just might work in time with the season.

I was wondering your opinion on fertilizing it early (during pout) since it's tray sod and doesn't need deep roots (2" tray depth at most, maybe less). Do you think that's ok? And do you think doing so at low doses would help it develop faster and be ready to harvest and transplant in late October maybe?


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## g-man

I think going at it from two approaches. Round up the area and drop the sand/peat moss. If you want mix sand with some compost in the bottom layer and sand/peat in the top layer. Peat will help in moisture retention for germination. And drop seeds at the same time of the sand. Get them underneath the sand by 1/4in.

Then also grow your pots. Transplant them if needed. Also use the canvas style pots that you plant. Taking the soil out of the plastic ones makes a mess. Or you can use kbg from another donor area of the lawn via a plug.


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## Green

g-man said:


> I think going at it from two approaches. Round up the area and drop the sand/peat moss. If you want mix sand with some compost in the bottom layer and sand/peat in the top layer. Peat will help in moisture retention for germination. And drop seeds at the same time of the sand. Get them underneath the sand by 1/4in.


Good advice. Thing is, I probably can't make it in time with the KBG via regular seeding. I'm totally set on doing MyHolidayLawn KBG, though. It will be a fairly small area. The area is shaded, and right now under water. I'm not sure, but it might still be under water even after topdressing with sand. I can't even spray Roundup right now...there's too much water. Plus, leaves are starting to drop on it. This is going to be a total mess. That's why I'm thinking sod. That and the timing. If I start growing the sod now, I should have time to make it work. That's why I asked about giving the sod trays Nitrogen while still in the pout stage...they don't need deep roots anyway. And then it'll already have Nitrogen so I won't have to worry about trying to put down more if it floods again after planting the sod. I also have very limited amounts of this seed. I also do not want to disturb the soil by digging to plant plugs even if I could, because there are lots of Poa annua seeds there. I'm also dealing with a soil horizon with OM stuck in the top layer, and likely clay below it...totally different from the rest of my soil. I believe that's why it retains water. I meant to treat it with Andersons UltraMate SG this year (which has KOH) but haven't had time yet. The area is far from the house, and not easy to get a hose to, but it retains water, so moisture for germination is not an issue, lol. I'll post a recent photo of the area so you can see what I'm working with. I purposely have not fertilized the area this year, and have only mowed or trimmed it a handful of times all year.


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## Green

Got 0.1 inch of rain yesterday, which helped with the seed. I'll be watering those areas regularly now as needed. Also pulled up some fine bladed mats of Poa Triv in the front. Totally different than the coarse, stalky type I killed in the Spring (though both were present in the Spring). This fine bladed stuff never died out in the heat this Summer, even with Velocity applied three times. It looks like spaghetti.

Neighbor had aeration and overseed done.


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## g-man

Dig a trench to channel the water out of there.


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## Green

g-man said:


> Dig a trench to channel the water out of there.


Sounds intimidating, lol. If you can convince me that it can be done effectively and easily and without screwing things up more, I would consider it.


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## g-man

In your property, for this area, where is the water suppose to go?


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## Green

g-man said:


> In your property, for this area, where is the water suppose to go?


In theory, it's supposed to go about 30-40 feet in one direction, and then about 100 feet in the perpendicular direction, and drain into a culvert. That never worked, though. It only drains like that when the entire low-input area gets flooded. But even then, this particular area always retains a little bit. Just enough to be an issue. Last Fall, I bailed it out using a snow shovel and 5 gallon bucket, filling and dumping it. The adjacent area stays soggy and spongy when not flooded, from this time of year until late Spring...unless given time to dry between rain and with wind/heat.


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## g-man

So you need to address this either by adding soil and creating a grade towards the culvert or a trench toward the culvert. Another option is to make it a no mow zone and plant some native watershed plants.


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## Green

g-man said:


> So you need to address this either by adding soil and creating a grade towards the culvert or a trench toward the culvert. Another option is to make it a no mow zone and plant some native watershed plants.


An easier decision would be to have it drain into the adjacent natural area only a few feet away. But I'm still not sure how one goes about doing that properly. I don't know if I can change the grade enough by adding a thin layer of sand topdress. The problem is there are some dips that need to be evened out. But the area is full of Poa seeds and there is that soil horizon as well. Nothing penetrates the dark brown OM layer on top. Below it is orange soil that looks like a clay.


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## Green

@g-man, here are photos of the area. I'm not sure if I can redo the entire area. I might have to pick part of it to do now, and then do the other part in the Spring, because it's about 500 sq ft and I have other priorities currently. I would want to start with the part furthest from the main lawn (closest to the natural area in the rear of the photos) to do now. If you have any suggestions, it would be appreciated. I would like to ideally work mostly with the soil that's already there, except for topdressing with sand and peat/compost to help firm up the surface. Poa seeds are an issue, but Tenacity would be useful.

The first photo shows the left boundary of the area in late August. The second one is showing a bit more to the right and a bit more of the rear and is from late June. The bare spots are the lowest, most flood-prone areas. The big sward of dark green grass was my sod tray from last year. I plunked it down there at the end of the year, and have not cut that sward it once this year. It has helped absorb some of the water, and I let it grow seedheads and harvested them as an experiment.

It's flooded right now as it's been cloudy and cool/damp. More rain is forecast for Wednesday night.


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## Green

@g-man, actually, I think I should start with this area in red this Summer. That way, I can access it from the adjacent lawn area during minor flooding to maintain it. It's also the one that floods the worst. I will have to regrade toward the natural area behind. I should be able to handle it since it's small. As I said, I'm set on the KBG. I can also topdress the surrounding existing grass perimeter (foreground in the photo) with the sand as well so it's less soggy. What do you think?


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## Green

Pulled some Spurge in the reseeded low-input/back patches. It's got seeds on it now, so best to get it out of there.


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## Green

@g-man, any references or other info for the trench method? I don't have an image in my mind of how it would hold together, etc. It sounds like the easiest way.


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## g-man

I'm trying to understand the property from the images. In the back of the image, it looks to be a hill. If so the water from this hill needs to flow out of there somehow. Which way you want it to go? Right thru the middle of the lawn?

There are multiple ways to hand the water. One will be to create a swale. This will handle a lot of volume of water (like all the water from the hill). Once you have a way to handle the large water quantity, then a trench can be used to help an area dry faster. The trench should be build to have a grade that goes deeper in the direction you want the water to flow. Depending on the depth you have, you can fill it with pipe, rocks, then fabric, then sand, or just sand. The idea is for water from the soil to percolate to the sand/rock and then slowly flow towards the culvert.

Here is an image I google from a fairway trench.


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## Green

@g-man, the "hill" in back is not really a big issue, because the natural terrain it's composed of has a very large water holding capacity. Any water that hits the hill gets tied up in organic material (leaves, tree roots, etc.). When I bailed out the water, I dumped it right on the border of the natural area, and it never flowed back into the lawn area. I should make a short trench going back toward that area. I suppose filling it with sand is the best and easiest method.

This is the lowest part of the property and all the properties nearby. But the water does not readily flow from other parts of the property into here. Nor does it really ever flow from other properties...unless the depth of water exceeds several inches in the entire yard, which rarely happens. But it occasionally does, and that's fine. I just need to get rid of the residual standing water that lasts for several weeks (and creates ice in Winter).

Thanks for the photo.


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## FuzzeWuzze

I wonder if something like a flowell dry well would help at all. We had one put in our back yard when they put the paver patio in to prevent huge runoff into the grass unless it gets overwhelmed by huge rain then it just overflows into the grass and out. There is no easy way to get water out from the patio area otherwise the grass would always be soaked.


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## Green

Mowed basically everywhere. Accidentally disturbed a baby bunny den in the middle of the low input area. I really hope the bunny is old enough to survive on its own without the mother. It eventually left the area but might only be 2 weeks old. I didn't know you were supposed to put them back in and recreate it. The strange thing is I swear it wasn't there last time I mowed. Not happy (hoppy) about this.

Watered the side front zone for between 45 min and 60 min total and did an audit. All cans had between 5/16ths and 8/16ths inch per 0.75 hour (mostly 7/16ths), but made a few adjustments to try to improve head-to-head coverage. Took out a dark blue 1.0gpm from the second head from the road along the driveway and put in a dark blue 1.5 to get a little more water on the area near the pavement. Removed a 0.75gpm SR from the sidewalk head on neighbor border and put in a 30Q which reaches further.

Watered the upper portion of the front hill for an extra 25 min with a sprinkler to supplement because it's still a bit brown from the tree roots taking the water.

Rust disease everywhere. It's like an orange cloud when mowing. Need Nitrogen, a sharper blade, biofungicide, and a little rain or irrigation. Actually rinsed the entire mower after mowing because it was orange. Need to clean my shoes too.

Got a new bottle of Tenacity in the mail.


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## Green

FuzzeWuzze said:


> I wonder if something like a flowell dry well would help at all. We had one put in our back yard when they put the paver patio in to prevent huge runoff into the grass unless it gets overwhelmed by huge rain then it just overflows into the grass and out. There is no easy way to get water out from the patio area otherwise the grass would always be soaked.


Don't know. But I'm going to do whatever is easiest (think I've started to figure it out with everyone's help).


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## Harts

What was the advice shindoman gave you regarding your roofing project? I'm trying to get mine done this fall and worried about my grass!


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## Green

Harts said:


> What was the advice shindoman gave you regarding your roofing project? I'm trying to get mine done this fall and worried about my grass!


There's actually a whole thread, and other people had good input, too:

https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=7394&p=125727&hilit=roofing#p125709


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Edit Green I was thinking about this if you wanted a more slow release maybe mixing CX with something like XGN or even Milo might give you what you are looking for. Just a thought.


Yup, that's the plan. I think it's going to be 1 bag of Carbon-X, and 3 bags of Milo over 15K area, roughly. Been playing with the numbers a little already. Basically, making my own blend like Screamin' Green does. I aim for a 50/50 ratio of fast and slow release per osuturfman's suggestions, and it works well without a lot of surge growth. I think I'm going to drop more than 1 lb N in a short period this September, like 1.3 lb/M or so. I've only dropped 1-1.5 lb of N this entire year so far (2019).

Here's the original post on another site: https://aroundtheyard.com/forums2/viewtopic.php?t=21074


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## JDgreen18

Green said:


> JDgreen18 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Edit Green I was thinking about this if you wanted a more slow release maybe mixing CX with something like XGN or even Milo might give you what you are looking for. Just a thought.
> 
> 
> 
> Yup, that's the plan. I think it's going to be 1 bag of Carbon-X, and 3 bags of Milo over 15K area, roughly. Been playing with the numbers a little already. Basically, making my own blend like Screamin' Green does. I aim for a 50/50 ratio of fast and slow release per osuturfman's suggestions, and it works well without a lot of surge growth. I think I'm going to drop more than 1 lb N in a short period this September, like 1.3 lb/M or so. I've only dropped 1-1.5 lb of N this entire year so far (2019).
> 
> Here's the original post on another site: https://aroundtheyard.com/forums2/viewtopic.php?t=21074
Click to expand...

Great minds think alike lol.


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## Green

Tried to get the blade off the new mower using my uncle's 25" breaker bar and a deep snap-on socket. Ended up busting the socket and partially splitting the wood block used to hold the blade back. Plan B: bring the mower to the mechanic and let him use his 800 ft-lb torque impact gun and heavy-duty sockets (assuming I can fit the mower in the car to transport).


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## JDgreen18

Green said:


> Tried to get the blade off the new mower using my uncle's 25" breaker bar and a deep snap-on socket. Ended up busting the socket and partially splitting the wood block used to hold the blade back. Plan B: bring the mower to the mechanic and let him use his 800 ft-lb torque impact gun and heavy-duty sockets (assuming I can fit the mower in the car to transport).


Hey Green if you plan on getting the fert from me this week I can help you with this. I have an impact gun plus the heavy duty sockets.


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## Harts

Thanks!


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Hey Green if you plan on getting the fert from me this week I can help you with this. I have an impact gun plus the heavy duty sockets.


Thanks...I am hoping to get it straightened out tomorrow morning and the guy is on the way to where I'm going anyway, so it should be a quick in and out. Will probably have him put a quick edge on the blade while I'm there so I can mow again the next day. Wish me luck and thanks again for offering to help out. I'm sick of the clumps and torn grass.


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## Green

Got 0.11 inch of rain. Heat made a small return with mid to high 80s the other day, and humidity with dew point around 70-71 yesterday and today. But it still feels like it's more early Fall than late Summer overall. This is not a warm September, so far. Probably below average overall. Leaves are starting to change color in some cases.


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## Green

Mowed main front (3.75), lower back and part of low input (4"). Now that the blade has been sharpened, the mulching actually works again. Not as much clumping tendency, though I did still have to side discharge a lot in the low input as it was too thick and long to mulch. (My mechanic said the blade was on there way too tight, and it took him a few tries with the pneumatic impact gun to get the bolt to loosen.)

Baby bunnies appear to be in good health; marked off the area where they currently live so I don't hurt them. Will have to be very careful when mowing from this point on, since even the mowed grass is higher than them. And no herbicides for a while in that area. Didn't even know they were still there or that there was more than one, until today. I saw three of them, and was able to get inches away from one of them (something tells me this was the same one I accidently hit with my foot the other day). The other two ran out of the nest when they heard the mower coming and that's when I saw them. The third didn't move until I tried photographing it from a couple inches away with the phone, and then went in the opposite direction and crouched in the grass. They're really cute.

Mowed grandfather's lawn.


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## Green

Nothing. Too wet and cloudy today.


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## Green

Nothing. Too wet and cloudy today.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> Nothing. Too wet and cloudy today.


How much rain did you get? We cooked in the sun up until about 3 pm, and then it clouded up with barely a sprinkle. It's very dry here and I'm having to pour the water on.


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## Green

Got 0.11 inch of rain yesterday. @Chris LI

Finished mowing everywhere today. Picked up Hickory nuts first.

I have seed germination in the areas behind the deck starting.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 60 and 80 min tomorrow morning (half inch).

Next on the agenda: transplant grass plugs to bare areas, spray N on rust areas (mostly new grass), spray biofungicide and Tenacity, replace sprinkler head near door, spray mosquito barrier app 2, continue pruning, trim everywhere, continue seeding, figure out flood prone area and get materials, apply Nitrogen everywhere including micros on low input area.


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## Green

Watered top of front hill about 0.7 inch with a sprinkler. Still a bit brownish looking.

Mixed 0.1 lb rate of Nitrogen from AMS and Miracle Gro and sprayed on various areas, like new grass areas with rust on middle side. Used 2oz 1-0-0 AMS and 1.6 oz 24-8-16 Miracle Gro with micros over approx 0.5K area. Will do a blanket app on the back and follow-up app on the side in the next week.

Changed the sprinkler head near the door for a 6-inch model. Will install the nozzle and test it tomorrow.

Planted extra grass sod pieces in the bare area near the street where I killed Triv in the Spring but hadn't replanted. There were still a few roots left, but nothing that appeared alive.


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## Green

@g-man, I guess it's too late to seed with KBG now. Do you think I should just do the sand/compost topdress this month, no Roundup, no seed, dig the trench if there's time but not worry about it if there's not, and then pick up where I left off in the Spring with seed, etc.? Do you think the sand topdress will stay put without seeding? Or should I seed a low rate of PR this year for cover, and in the Spring do the Roundup and KBG seed (which will help with killing the Triv, which I know is in there right now)? I'm just disappointed because the same thing happened to me last year...it got too late. But I want to do this right, and if it takes a little longer, so be it. It just seems too late and is too much to tackle all of it right now this Summer/Fall. There are already leaves falling on that area, and I have to get some stuff done before it rains again if I want to be able to walk there.


----------



## g-man

I would prioritize getting the water to flow out of there. Trenches, then sand, then seeds. I would avoid a complete reno until you address the water issues first.


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## Green

g-man said:


> I would prioritize getting the water to flow out of there. Trenches, then sand, then seeds. I would avoid a complete reno until you address the water issues first.


I should be able to make some progress on that this Fall. First step is pruning low branches from overhanging trees to get more airflow. It's not a big deal to wait for Spring for the reno. If I need seed this year, I'll use PR for now to close the spots after the sand.


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## Green

Watered the middle side (with rust) about a half inch, spot sprayed Tenacity on the two Crabgrass plants there, removed wood decay mushrooms at the border, and picked up nails in the shrub beds using the magnetic sweeper. Watered some other new grass areas.


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## Green

Mowed main front at 3.75 in. It was a bit long. Mowed/hand trimmed hellstrip areas at 4 in, and did an extra mow on the front hill at that same time. Mowed garage side and back at 4 in. Grass is really starting dry out, and I will have to water it.


----------



## Green

I mowed the rest of the areas that needed it, including most of the side, and the low-input area. Still at 4 inches on those areas. I side-discharged the low-input area in general as it was a bit too long again.

The grass is drought stressing noticeably. I've gone too long without watering (knowingly). I hand watered an area in the main front near the road under the tree near where I resodded the other day. Also watered about 0.3 inch on the area where I replaced the head, using the Orbit sprinkler as I still didn't install a nozzle in the new head. I also ran zone 5 (side front) for 30 min. x 3, and swapped out one of the hellstrip spray nozzles for a different one and did a quick one-can audit on that area. I got about a half inch in one hour, which was my target. Not bad. Coverage is not perfect, though. It doesn't water the whole area, and overshoots onto the sidewalk a couple of feet. I took out the Toro 8Q and put in a Rainbird 8Q, I believe. I then hand-watered those areas to fill in for what the heads didn't do.

It actually went into the low 40s last night, and there was even one report of frost and a photo on the news in an isolated location in one part of the state. Unbelievable for late Summer.


----------



## Green

Super busy.

Trimmed in the back. Pulled up another patch of grass in the main front with Triv.

Put down Carbon-X fertilizer on the back, side, and main front. 
Initially I was aiming for 0.625 lb N, but it was tough to spread that little, so I increased to 0.72 lb N (3.5 lb of product). It was still a bit tough to get two passes, so I would recommend applying it at 0.75 lb N just based on spread ability. It seems to spread similarly to urea.

I will aim for 1.5 lb N total after the Milo is added to the total, and we'll see how that goes.

Set all zones in those areas to water 0.5 inch to water it in tonight/tomorrow morning. Shut off the head behind the deck, and the one near the door is still off, too, so I'll set up sprinklers on those areas tomorrow morning.


----------



## Chris LI

What's your opinion on Carbon-X?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> What's your opinion on Carbon-X?


Don't know in terms of results yet; first time trying it. Spreadability was similar to regular urea. It was a bit dusty...not sure if I should have been breathing the dust...probably not. I put down 0.72, so it was about 0.60 fast release N and 0.12 slow release. I'll be following up with Milo over the coming days.


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## Green

Watered all except the portions of the low input area that have moss or Poa problems. Watered it all day.

Sprayed Biofungicide on main lawn areas at extra high rate, 6oz, with Nu-Film.

Spread mulch.


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## social port

Green said:


> Chris LI said:
> 
> 
> 
> What's your opinion on Carbon-X?
> 
> 
> 
> Don't know in terms of results yet; first time trying it. Spreadability was similar to regular urea. It was a bit dusty...not sure if I should have been breathing the dust...probably not. I put down 0.72, so it was about 0.60 fast release N and 0.12 slow release. I'll be following up with Milo over the coming days.
Click to expand...

I saw a very nice ( as in, two thumbs way up) color response around day 3-4. The green up was especially striking for the TTTF.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> I saw a very nice ( as in, two thumbs way up) color response around day 3-4. The green up was especially striking for the TTTF.


Sounds good. I need that, because many areas are yellowing from Rust disease. The back and upper half of the sloped side, for instance, have an overall yellow/orange tinge from a distance. The main front and low-input area are the only areas that still look good or decent. But the Rust is starting in those areas, too.


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## Green

Mulch, watered top of front hill, hand watered including triangular hellstrip area, some trimming.

Tomorrow: get gas, brushes, bug spray. Finish edging driveway. Mow, kill vines, blow nuts away, milorganite with micros on low input area, water hellstrip areas, transplant more grass. Apply synthetic on side front if rain is forecast.


----------



## Green

First day of Fall, but 85 degrees. Gnats (I think) are really bad right now, and seem immune to repellent. They go for the face.

Finished shoveling mulch today. Mowed most of main front and also front hill and hellstrips, skipping where not needed to save time. Upped HOC to 4 inches due to it being too long and because of the drought stress.

The sun angle is now such that the Southern exposure really heats up and burns out; moreso than in the mid Summer.

Finished edging driveway.

Edit: 12:45AM: Picked up 0.31 inch of rain late tonight with a gust front containing some thunderstorms, and may get a bit more still overnight. I'm happy because I won't have to water for a couple more days now.

Next few days: more mowing, Milorganite on back and with micros on low input area, Carbon-X on low input? Seeding. Transplant grass.

Irrigation audits.

Get gas, brushes, bug spray. Kill vines,


----------



## social port

Green said:


> nats (I think) are really bad right now, and seem immune to repellent. They go for the face.


I've been seeing swarms of them as well. I have to be aware of closing my mouth when I'm on the zero turn. 


Green said:


> I'm happy because I won't have to water for a couple more days now.


I know that feeling. Every little bit helps.


----------



## JDgreen18

I read that nats go for the mouth and eyes because they are looking for a moisture source. They really are a pain in the a$$.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> nats (I think) are really bad right now, and seem immune to repellent. They go for the face.
> 
> 
> 
> I've been seeing swarms of them as well. I have to be aware of closing my mouth when I'm on the zero turn.
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm happy because I won't have to water for a couple more days now.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I know that feeling. Every little bit helps.
Click to expand...




JDgreen18 said:


> I read that nats go for the mouth and eyes because they are looking for a moisture source. They really are a pain in the a$$.


They're really bad. We also have EEE disease being found and killing a few people via mosquitoes recently. I'm hoping to spray that stuff later in the week or on the weekend, 2nd app I never got around to.


----------



## Green

Today, mowed the back, side, and started on the low-input area. Currently at 4 inches everywhere again. Will finish mowing tomorrow. And then mow again on the weekend, lol.

Driveway was done this morning.

Grass is overall brownish looking and thinning out in the back from Rust disease, and the Rust just coats everything and goes into the air while mowing. I really would like to get my Milorganite down tomorrow, and Carbon-X app on the low-input area (which isn't brown yet). I could also use a good foliar N app on the back later in the week to help with this disease.

Low input area where I overseeded a year ago really looks good now. The overseeded area (about 1/3 of the total area) is a mix of Tall and Fine Fescue, with KBG, HBG, and PR, and it's been holding up really well. I've got Bullseye, Faith, Tarheel II, Silverado II, Endeavor II, Dynamic II, and Gazelle II TTTF; America, Baron, and unknown KBG; Thermal Blue HBG; Garnet, Chantilly, and unknown FF; and Wicked and various ASP cultivars of PR in the mixture. The roots seem to be going a lot deeper than in previous years when it was mostly Fine Fescue with some KBG. Even though it's first year, it's gotten by really well with minimal watering. I have not watered it as often as the front this year, or with as much water each time. I did about a half an inch once a week this Summer, whereas the front got over an inch a week in 2-3 waterings. I have to wonder if the different grass types are using water from different rooting depths, and that the deeper rooters, like TTTF are bringing up water and nutrients from down deeper, and that's how the lawn is doing so well.


----------



## Green

Anyone have ideas on what to do for weak patches of Spring seeded new grass where the roots aren't pushing down and topgrowth is stunted? Would like to get the roots going down, and the grass to start filling in more. Some of these areas have partial shade. The grass is starting to tear out as the squirrels scratch, etc.


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## SNOWBOB11

Green said:


> Anyone have ideas on what to do for weak patches of Spring seeded new grass where the roots aren't pushing down and topgrowth is stunted? Would like to get the roots going down, and the grass to start filling in more. Some of these areas have partial shade. The grass is starting to tear out as the squirrels scratch, etc.


I don't know if there's really anything specific you can do other than try to feed it. I know what your talking about when you say it's stunted. Problem is you also say it's in the shade and that can be a issue.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> Anyone have ideas on what to do for weak patches of Spring seeded new grass where the roots aren't pushing down and topgrowth is stunted? Would like to get the roots going down, and the grass to start filling in more. Some of these areas have partial shade. The grass is starting to tear out as the squirrels scratch, etc.


Fertilizer comes to mind for me as well. A little N and a little more P. Could you further enhance root drive with fork aeration without doing too much damage? And I don't recall you using air-8, but I would supplement with that as well. To my mind, P+aeration+air-8 is what makes the most sense to get those roots pushing.


----------



## Chris LI

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone have ideas on what to do for weak patches of Spring seeded new grass where the roots aren't pushing down and topgrowth is stunted? Would like to get the roots going down, and the grass to start filling in more. Some of these areas have partial shade. The grass is starting to tear out as the squirrels scratch, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> Fertilizer comes to mind for me as well. A little N and a little more P. Could you further enhance root drive with fork aeration without doing too much damage? And I don't recall you using air-8, but I would supplement with that as well. To my mind, P+aeration+air-8 is what makes the most sense to get those roots pushing.
Click to expand...

I've been considering purchasing some Air-8, for this reason and general compaction, as the baby shampoo is not doing the trick. I still have some Simple Lawn Solutions liquid aerator (similar to SLS in baby shampoo), but the AI in Air-8 is different, so that's the reason for my interest. I would think that Milo or similar (I use Bioplex 5-3-1), would help with the small amount of OM, as a bonus. This past spring I drilled and filled some areas underneath my Norway maple with a 13" masonry bit (3/4", I think), with mason sand. I think it helped a little, since it gave a place for the roots to go. I think the Air-8 would be worth trying there to help my overseed as well as the established turf in that location.


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## Green

Today: Finished mowing the low-input area. Blew/picked up Hickory nuts near street, and transplanted sod plugs into the second bare area near there (from when I killed Triv in the Spring - this was actually quite a job to do properly, and I ran out of donor grass partway through and had to figure out where to get more).

Neighbors' mowing guy came today, and I think side front neighbor's sprinklers went off this morning.

Photos of the sod replacement:

1.) Bare spot with dead grass - before sod plugs (how it has looked since Spring, with grass shears for scale):










2.) After removing the dead grass, scraping out some topsoil to level, loosening up the soil surface slightly with a garden weasel, and then smoothing it with a gloved hand:










3.) After placing the sod plugs and adding the topsoil back to the low areas:


----------



## Green

Picked up Hickory nuts and got a quick mow at 4" of the area in front of the garage in. Started raining during it. Got 0.2 in of rain.


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## Powhatan

We got 0.3" inches of scattered rain last evening, basically a heavy dew. The last significant rainfall was about a month ago. The high sitting over the east coast sure is making temps higher and blocking cool/rain fronts from moving through.


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## Green

Making progress.

Mowed main front at 3.75 in (slightly overgrown - 1 day maybe; last mowed at 4" on 9/23; will aim for every 4-5 days going forward) and front hill at 3.75, and all hellstrips at 4 in.

Put down Milorganite and Carbon-X:

Back and side: 0.78 lb N from 6-2-0 4% Fe Milo

Side front: 
-0.75 lb N from 6-2-0 2.5% Fe Milo (22 lbs)
-0.75 lb N from 24-0-4 Carbon-X (5.5 lbs)

Did irrigation audit on lower back/lower side, using 24 containers (10 mini gauges plus 14 tuna cans). Results: I need to increase the nozzle size in the center head. Amounts in 75 min ranged from 0.1 inch in non-critical or overlap areas with other zones, to approx 2/3 inch in some areas. Average was maybe 0.33 inch. Hopefully I'll get the chance to re-run this zone audit once more this season. But I might not, as there are still other zones to evaluate.

Set side front zone to water for 22 min x 3 tomorrow morning (over a half inch). Will have to water one hellstrip section and the garage side manually tomorrow.

Tomorrow and next week: finish applying Milo and Carbon-X (main front and low input area for Milo, micros on low input, and Carbon-X on low input). Tenacity, mosquito barrier, vines, and seed the spots that need it.


----------



## Green

Put down seed on some spots in the front and added some in the back. Ran zones 1 and 2 this evening for a few minutes to check and adjust the heads and put a nozzle into the new head near the door. Hand watered.

Set zones 1 and 2 for 30 and 40 min x2 respectively tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Mowed the lower back, the side, and about half the low input area. Lots of dust, some from rust fungus, but some from the dry conditions. Still at 4 inches in the dry conditions. Also reel mowed the driveway hill where I did that quick overseed a while back. Pretty sure some of the seed took.

Raked out and spot seeded some more areas in the front. Pretty much done here. But I was surprised by the dead (and dormant?) Poa Triv that's embedded. I just used a small plastic rake this time. I also pulled up some live Triv. In one area, on the side, I grabbed some and a whole almost foot-long chunk of the turf came right out...yikes. I don't know if that was already there before I killed and reseeded, or if my seed had Triv in it. Hopefully not. It was right at the border of a killed and reseeded area.

Judging by the dead Triv from today, I might have to dethatch (but not seed; just use N) more areas in the front and possibly low input area this week. May need to break out the Groundskeeper rake for this.

For the seeding, I'm using soil moist seed coat, peat moss, and the blue granular Hydrocover Triple Start.


----------



## Green

Met up with another local member this AM to pick up some fertilizer. This will be my first time trying Baystate.*

Mowed rest of low input area at 3.75 in with old mower. Bagged the leaves in the flood prone area.

Put down 30 lbs of Milorganite on the main front (5-2-0 4 Fe and 6-2-0 4 Fe mostly*).

Pruned the tree near the garage.

Went over to my neighbor's and gave him my extra bag of Carbon-X and got reimbursed, as he needed fertilizer and wanted to try it. Explained how to use it and what it could do.

Did quick irrigation audits on zones 1 and 2 between the wind. 30 and 40 min respectively. Head near door nozzle needs to be increased by 2 steps. Lower side head can use a slight increase. Head closest to juniper can possibly be increased. And maybe the middle zone 1 head, too (possibly). Aim was 0.25 in, and I got that in many areas. It doubled as watering in the Milo. Not a fan of evening watering, but it was not humid out.

*I will be posting something interesting soon related to Milorganite.


----------



## Green

Got a highly unexpected rain this morning. Ran out to cover fertilizer I had left out, but it was already soaked as who knows how long it had been pouring. Now with rain and cool temps forecast for like whole week, I'm not sure how I'm going to anything.


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## social port

With respect to seeding, it is kind of now or never, is it not?


----------



## Green

social port said:


> With respect to seeding, it is kind of now or never, is it not?


I've never had much success beyond early October (in a good year, with fast-germinating seed like mixes containing Ryegrass). So, yeah. Since it's going to get cool in a couple of days, it's going to be really slow.


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## Green

Today, I got out for about an hour or so and started digging up an area in the back I needed to level. Then, I sifted the soil I had from when I edged (it had dead grass plants, rocks, etc. in it) and spread it to try to fix the depression and fill in the low spot. It's not perfect, bit it's better than it was. I'll have to finish it tomorrow since it got dark.

Also picked up some Miracle-Gro 10-52-10 to spray on the several Spring seeded patches that are still struggling to root and even grow at all. We'll see how this works (plus the P I put down with the Milo). Goal is to apply enough to provide about 0.25 lb P, and it will be a foliar N spray at the same time.


----------



## Green

Photo showing the area I worked on today. It was sunken in because after the area was graded back in 2013, someone dug a trench for a gutter tube, and never got it level enough, so it sunk more over time. Then last Winter, a furnace repair man dumped hot water there and killed a bunch of grass. It started to regrow from rhizomes in the late Spring, but then I killed even more of the area with Roundup because of Triv. So, it's still bare, and this is what it looked like:










Now, the area immediately to the right is where most of the sinking happened. It sunk a couple of inches, and I wanted to fix it, so I dug up the turf. 15 min later, the whole area looked like this:










I didn't have time to go removing the topsoil, keeping the top layers on top, etc. Plus there were some rocks in it. So, I got my buckets of soil from when I edged a few weeks ago, and my garden sieve (sifter? sounds better). I screened two bucketfuls of soil to eliminate rocks, junk, and dead grass plants. Then leveled, compacted (using boots) and tried to make a slight declining grade as well. Half an hour later:










More to come tomorrow. I'll almost definitely need some seed in there.


----------



## Green

Full day of lawncare today, and here's why:

It was in the low to mid 80s today, and sticky--dewpoint of 68. But it's going to rain tonight or tomorrow, and the high is supposed to be 30 degrees lower--53! It will be rainy, cold, and windy for the next few days. And it could go down go into the mid 30s later this week at night! What?!

So, I did as much as I could today, and it was not for the faint of heart. Literally. Kept on moving and rarely took a break. Only when I really had to for safety reasons or to get water. Sweaty mess. Elevated heartrate, often out of breath while mowing due to threat of rain, etc. Drank a few glasses of gatorade after. Showered. Ate dinner. I'm recovering now.

First order of business was finishing that low spot. I got the grass all put back, and then added a little Bullseye seed and peat moss.

After that, I put down roughly 20 lbs of Baystate on the low input area (minus flood prone part as I don't want that to grow too much.

Then I mixed 10 lbs of Carbon-X with with 13 lbs of Screamin' Green plus Prodiamine, and spread that over the whole low input area, trying to avoid the bare spots.

Next, I cleaned up the mess from the leveling project.

After that, I seeded the bare spots in the low input area, and overseeded a thin area on the side (using the Apple SGL Ryegrass seed). I'm done with seed now until Spring or maybe dormant seeding. Oct. 2nd is the latest I'm typically successful--with Ryegrass and Fescues. Not so much with KBG.

Then, I cleaned the mower.

Then I mowed the main front, front hill, hellstrips, back, and upper side, dropping those last 3 down to 3.75 inches. That's approx 6,000 sq ft.


----------



## Green

Photos and some more information from today's lawn work:

Here is the completed leveling project. It's not perfectly level, but improved. I can always topdress in the Spring.

After putting the grass back in place (will push this area with N every week through October or as long as I can get away with):










Note, I sometimes use the "hair graft" approach as I did here, as it results in quicker fill-in than using only large plugs. Detail showing the result of this approach in the center of the area (I also added seed here):










Carbon-X 24-0-4 mixed with Screamin' Green 16-2-3 plus Prodiamine (this combo acts like a 19-1-3):










Closer:










Closer:









Ain't that just beautiful? The results sure will be.

It was actually so humid that some fert I spilled started to break down on the hardcape even though it never got wet:








Note the urea prill dissolving from the humidity condensing on the hardcscape surface (the fertilizer was stored at about 68 degrees inside, and it was in the mid 80s with a dewpoint of 68 outside.

Spot seeded areas in the low-input area today (from when I killed Triv back in the Spring):


















Most of these areas were in a no-mix without TTTF, so they got Chantilly CRF, Wicked TTPR, and a little bit of Scotts EZ Seed, which contains Jump Start Kentucky Bluegrass, which is supposed to be one of the faster germinating KBG cultivars. The larger spots especially got more of the EZ seed so there will hopefully be some KBG in them.

Some of the other spots were in last year's overseed; those were small and got Wicked TTPR and Scotts coated TTTF seed (Faith, Endeavor II, and Gazelle II).










This larger spot got Jonathan Green Black Beauty Dense Shade mix- which contains 40% TTTF and 20% TTPR for fast germination, 15% Chewings Fescue and 15% CRF for shade and tree root tolerance, and just under 10% KBG for self-repair.

The garden weasel was a lifesaver and made quick work of the soil prep.

The low-input area is not too bad, all things considered. It hadn't received any N since late Spring for the most part, until today. Here's the area I overseeded at this time last year as it looked earlier today:


----------



## social port

That's a good day, Green! Congrats! And congrats on getting the seed down!
I really like the garden weasel, too. So handy for spot seeding.
Bonus points for those close-up shots of the fert and prodiamine. 
I'm glad that you have a supply of carbon X. A single app made me a big fan of it. My fescue loves it.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> That's a good day, Green! Congrats! And congrats on getting the seed down!
> I really like the garden weasel, too. So handy for spot seeding.
> Bonus points for those close-up shots of the fert and prodiamine.
> I'm glad that you have a supply of carbon X. A single app made me a big fan of it. My fescue loves it.


Thanks! I'm still resting from all that. Sitting here in air conditioning relaxing. This could be that last time AC is used this year, which is sad because I like the airflow. This week may also have been the last time I really water this year, except for hand watering (or maybe the odd hose and sprinkler session for a slightly larger area if it dries out too much between rain events). With the temps we're going to be getting soon, you can go 1-2 weeks on an inch of water.


----------



## Green

So, Carbon-X on the main front almost two weeks ago at ~0.75 N rate made it nice and green, grow a bit faster, etc. (Especially the new grass), but that's all subsiding a bit now. I assume the effect from the uncoated AMS (and maybe the urea, too by now) is being used up by this time. This agrees to my eye with the ~4% out of the 24 being slow release (16.67%). The slow release portion and the Milorganite I recently put down should take over now.

Neighbor on the slope side had their irrigation blown out in the past week (late Sept.). Today, local lawn co. fertilized neighbors. Guy didn't blow the edges at all to clean up (but it was raining, so probably useless to do that).

Also noticed that areas stressed from rust disease are simply not growing as fast as normal, even with the recent fertilizer. The stress must be causing higher N demand, with less resources allocated to growth, especially in the older grass, which seems to be hit hardest.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> So, Carbon-X on the main front almost two weeks ago at ~0.75 N rate made it nice and green, grow a bit faster, etc. (Especially the new grass), but that's all subsiding a bit now. I assume the effect from the uncoated AMS (and maybe the urea, too by now) is being used up by this time. This agrees to my eye with the ~4% out of the 24 being slow release (16.67%). The slow release portion and the Milorganite I recently put down should take over now.


This seems like the perfect mixture of fertilizers. An excellent strategy. Plus, isn't there some iron in the milo, which would further improve color? I'm seriously considering giving this approach a try.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> So, Carbon-X on the main front almost two weeks ago at ~0.75 N rate made it nice and green, grow a bit faster, etc. (Especially the new grass), but that's all subsiding a bit now. I assume the effect from the uncoated AMS (and maybe the urea, too by now) is being used up by this time. This agrees to my eye with the ~4% out of the 24 being slow release (16.67%). The slow release portion and the Milorganite I recently put down should take over now.
> 
> 
> 
> This seems like the perfect mixture of fertilizers. An excellent strategy. Plus, isn't there some iron in the milo, which would further improve color? I'm seriously considering giving this approach a try.
Click to expand...

Yeah. The reason I do it is to try to match the 50% fast/50% slow release September/most important app of the year parameters that some of the University people have been advocating for about 5 years now. For you, mid to late October would be perfect timing for this. I dropped 1.5 lb N total, the most I've ever put down at once, and it's working great. I've been trying to streamline applications, and thought this would be a good way to get half the yearly N down at one time. It's like doing 3 0.5N apps, or 6 0.25N apps, but you only have to apply once!

I've done all sorts of combos...and honestly, Screamin' Green used alone is just about perfect for this use, btw. The only thing it and Carbon-X are missing is methylene urea, but I'll use that in my Winterizer later on.

I've also tried Milo plus Scotts, Milo plus 10-10-10, etc. All the combos work really well. The trick is calculating roughly that 50/50 ratio of fast versus slow release to determine how much of what to use if you're mixing. Those researchers were really onto something with that ratio.

I still have more Milo left to drop on the low-input area (~20 lbs left with micros added in to reach my desired total amount), and then I still have other yards in the family to do (thankfully one of those is in zone 7a, so mid October works fine there). I was just thinking, I should probably mix the milo and micros ahead of time when I get the chance. Then I can put it back in the bag and label it, and it'll be ready to use.


----------



## social port

Hmmm... thanks for the info and the recommendation. A mid October app of carbon x and milo would line up perfectly for my fall app plans. I'm going to give this more thought.

I've always wanted to try screaming green, but now, I'd rather just support Matt as much as possible and then pick up some bags of milo on the way home from work one day.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Hmmm... thanks for the info and the recommendation. A mid October app of carbon x and milo would line up perfectly for my fall app plans. I'm going to give this more thought.
> 
> I've always wanted to try screaming green, but now, I'd rather just support Matt as much as possible and then pick up some bags of milo on the way home from work one day.


Yeah. I don't really see anything in Screamin' Green that's not in the Carbon-X/Milo combination. You're just getting more convenience in one bag with the SG, but the nutrients are almost the same (with the exception of possibly SOP; my Carbon-X has MOP in it per the label, but that could change over time). The only other huge difference is the SCU versus Carbon Earth slow release via Biochar.


----------



## Green

@social port, and of course the ratios...because SG contains roughly a half bag of biosolid (OceanGro, I believe), it has that nearly 50/50 fast/slow ratio. Since Carbon-X is approx. 16.67% slow release, you get that by spiking it with your own Biosolid.

Otherwise, all of these product combos achieve similar things regardless of exact ingredients or slow release methods--they all have synthetic/organic and fast/slow release N, with some iron.

But I try to get the September app close to that ideal 50/50 WSN/controlled release ratio.

Only reason I mixed the Carbon-X with SG yesterday, is because that particular SG had Prodiamine in it, which I needed, and I had already calculated both into my fast/slow N ratios. I wanted to be able to spread both easier, but there wasn't much of each going down, so I mixed them to have more quantity to make it easier.

Btw, I finished my bag of SG with 0.37 Prodiamine now. I no longer have a source for getting more of it; I had one bag that I have used for the past 4 years each Fall. I just have literally a handful of product left in the bag now, along with the label, in case I want to look at the particles again to figure out more about the composition or something.


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## social port

Let me run this one by you, @Green, as I expect that you've thought about this consideration:
Is there any concern about evenness of product application when mixing granular products? For example, I understand that carbon x and milo can be mixed together prior to application. But once the mix is in the hopper, what guarantees the intended CX and Milo ratios? 
Many of my apps are lite doses, so I keep my spreader on a very narrow setting. Hypothetically, I could imagine that if the milo prills are smaller than the cx prills, one half of my lawn gets mostly milo while the other half gets most cx. Wouldn't the smaller prills come out faster with a narrow setting?


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## Green

social port said:


> Let me run this one by you, Green, as I expect that you've thought about this consideration:
> Is there any concern about evenness of product application when mixing granular products? For example, I understand that carbon x and milo can be mixed together prior to application. But once the mix is in the hopper, what guarantees the intended CX and Milo ratios?


I have the same concerns. So, I rarely mix things that are drastically different in size or density. For example, grass seed...I'm not a big fan of mixing TTTF and KBG seed in a spreader. The vibrations can cause the larger TTTF to come to the top (or more accurately, the KBG probably filters down through the spaces in the larger TTTF seed), so by the time you get down to that last bit of seed, it might be all TTTF. So, I've typically applied the seeds separately with the spreader.

Same holds for fertilizer. But yesterday, for example, I made the decision to mix the Carbon-X and Screamin' Green because I felt it was better to do so since the amounts of each were too low (10 and 13 lbs respectively, spread over 6.5 K area). Plus, both are already blended products with similar densities and particle sizes, so out of the bag, they already have this issue on their own, and blend pretty well when mixed with each other.

Prof. Pete has a video on how he mixes products; maybe you've seen it. I don't remember his method, but I used a fairly foolproof one: I added a lb of each at a time, alternating, and mixing after every increment was added, and visually kept checking the mix to see if it looked uniform.

But again, in blended products, even out of the bag, you can tell they're not exactly uniformly mixed. My Carbon-X had a lot of the urea/AMS particles on top, and as I dig down further with my measuring cup, I encountered a more even mixture, but it wasn't that bad. I also encountered some fertilizer dust and broken bits, but that's another story. I'm not so picky that this sort of thing bothers me...my spreading technique probably is not so good that the limiting factor is the fertilizer dust.

A more important thing was probably the dust itself from the C-X and Milo...SG apparently has some dust inhibitors, so it tends not to be as bad. I know I breathed in some of the stuff, which can't be good. So, I didn't want to use a dust mask, but I did yesterday, finally.

Long story short, I did not mix my Milorganite and Carbon-X. I applied each on its own. But just as much of that was time constraints...mixing was just too labor intensive to get it uniform. I could spread faster using each one alone.


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## social port

Thanks, @Green . It sounds like we are on the same page. I haven't seen the Prof. Pete video you mention, but I'll search for it. I've been on a Connor Ward kick lately.
Any update on the milorganite observation you teased a few posts back?


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## Green

social port said:


> Any update on the milorganite observation you teased a few posts back?


Remember all the formula changes that occurred over time? It's related to that. It's going to be a type of comparison of all those Milorganites. :mrgreen:


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## Green

Got 0.36 inch of rain yesterday/last night.

The area I leveled the other day is 25 sq ft. I mixed urea in water at the 0.2 lb/M rate, using 0.17 oz of urea in a half gallon of water, and sprayed it. Watered a half hour before and after. Also sprayed some of the areas that are in the process of germinating, my grass pots, etc. Between urea, AMS, Miracle Gro, and other fertilizers, I have plenty of stuff to alternate with.

I'm going to aim to put down 0.2 lb/M on this area every 5 days.

Going down into the upper/mid 30s tonight for the first time this Fall.

Tomorrow/this weekend: Water seeded areas, Tenacity on half of low input area, put down rest of Milo, pick up nuts, finish mowing, trim, kill vines and other plants.

Notes for next week: Get more mosquito dunks, find plumbing parts, work on sprinkler head, pull switchgrass, finish mulch and picking up nails, pruning, topdress hellstrips where sunken in, fix brick borders and rock borders.


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## Green

Watered seeded areas.

Went to grandfather's. Mowed. Trimmed. Put down fert. Roughly 0.5 lb N rate. 1 40-lb bag of Baystate, and roughly 1/3 bag (so around 14 lbs) of Expert Gardener 29-0-4 with urea, MOP, and 4.35% PCU. Went heavier on thin areas since I couldn't seed this Fall. Blew the fert off the drive and walk areas as the last thing.


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## Green

Sprayed Tenacity over roughly 3K area on the far end of the low-input area in the middle of the day. I mixed for the 4oz rate, but kind of eyeballed the area, so it may not be exact. I will most likely be forced to mow it tomorrow, even though I'd prefer to wait 2 days.


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## Green

Watered seed once today.

Reel mowed the small middle side overseeded area to avoid sucking up seeds.

Neighbor had Hickory at front border pruned. Awesome. Other neighbor's lawn was mowed.

Mowed low input area. Near third was a bit overgrown after 8 days. Side discharged most of it at 4 in but mulched some at 3.75. Seeded areas were annoying to work around with the air blowing out.

Blew leaves off the flood prone area (too much OM tied up in the soil surface already anyway). Now moss is growing. Really want to start working on the area next week if possible, then reno it in April.

Then I mixed up micro nutrients, Zinc and Boron, in 20-30 lbs of 6-4-0 Milorganite and applied it to the low input area. Finally done with early Fall Nitrogen and Milorganite.

Had one more mosquito dunk left. Cut it in half and put it out. There were still some old small pieces left out there, too. Need to buy some more.

Been 10 days since my 1.5 lb/M huge N drop on the side front using the 50/50 method, and I'm pleased with results so far. It's getting darker green, but not surge growing.

Took a soil temp in the main front today while air temps were in the high 60s or low 70s (low 60s dewpoint). Soil was 65F (at the usual 3 or 4 inch depth). According to the Milorganite website, that's fine.

I am still finding Triv and pulling it up in the front, the best I can.


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## Green

To-do list:

Tomorrow: pick up nuts, finish mowing, trim, kill vines/plants, spray fert on Spring planted grass that is stunted, transplant plugs if time permits. Spray shampoo on front hill?

Beyond...

Spray N (blanket) on back *rust disease

Get more mosquito dunks, find plumbing parts, work on sprinkler head, pull more switchgrass, finish mulch and picking up nails, pruning ?, topdress hellstrips where sunken in, fix brick borders and rock borders.

Spray Gallery on areas prone to weeds

Spray Tenacity on rest of low input area, main front, hill, and upper/middle side. Can use low rate.

Spray Triclopyr where needed

Kill dandelions or dig out (several)

Order rain sensor and sprayer tip(s)

Pull more Triv


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## Green

Got 0.43 inch of rain yesterday.

Mowed, but did not get done everywhere...will have to cut some areas at 4" (and trim, which I didn't get to either) on Saturday or Sunday...

Raked, blew, and picked up Hickory nuts on the main front border so I could finally mow that area. Took a while. Mowed main front at 3.75. Mowing guy came next door at the same time, and did the entire yard with his zero-turn in the time it took me to do that (I was going extra slow as it was long). I also mowed the front hill and hellstrips, then changed the height to 4 inches and did the resodded areas near where the nuts were, and the other area where there were nuts from the garage to the marker. Then mowed at 3.75 inches on the lower back and lower side. Did not get to do the upper back and upper side as it was dark and the grass was wet from dew as I was finishing up.

One of the areas (near the sprinkler head behind deck) has been germinating really nicely for a couple of weeks now; the others nearby have hardly anything yet. I've been using grass shears to cut the individual seedlings at about 1 inch HOC, and they're already tillering to 2 and 3 blades in some cases. They got one app of spray Nitrogen last week, too. Since I planted late, I think this aggressive cutting and fertilizing method is going to be the way to go.


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## Green

If anyone has any suggestions for my Fall problem areas...

Where I raked is somewhat shaded (Neighbor had the tree pruned the other day, yes!!!) and the grass is super thin. Some of it even pulled out when I raked, so it's not rooted well. It was the same in the Spring (thin), and I did an extra Nitrogen app at low rate in early to mid Spring after reading one of the University guys recommending that for shaded areas. It definitely helped, but now it's thin again. This is also where my new grass from the Spring isn't growing well. I already dropped my Fall fertilizer everywhere the past couple of weeks, but I need to do something else. Thinking of just spraying that whole area with the 10-52-10 Miracle Gro at 0.25 lb P rate, and watering in lightly a few hours later (or timing near rain). Maybe also an AMS spray at 0.2 lb N rate. Any other suggestions?

Then the back is the other issue. The rust really did a job on it. It's starting to be less active now, but the grass lost its vigor and has a lot of brown. The grass in the back will start to shut down for the season in about a month. I'd like to get it back to normal. Was thinking of doing a couple of AMS sprays over the next couple of weeks. Any other advice?

Also, I don't have AIR-8, but may try the Andersons Ultramate I have on the area under/near the tree, now and again in Spring.

These are my two Fall issues I often deal with.


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## Green

It's raining now, and probably will for two more days. We could get 2 inches. They said this storm could turn into a subtropical storm, and there's supposed to be 40 mph wind tomorrow. Let's see what happens...


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## Chris LI

I think you're on the right track for both problem areas. I would try the foliar apps as you mentioned. Also, maybe weekly granular apps of urea now, too (or alternating them). This applies to both trouble areas.

It's ironic that I have similar experiences. For those thinning areas, I did some foliar apps of kelp/humic/molasses/baby shampoo over the summer. I avoided urea at that time due to the heat, and did not have AMS on hand at that time (I picked some up in September to try next year). This is the area under my Norway maple that I "drilled and filled" using a 13" masonry bit and funneled mason sand in, to break through the dense, matted surface roots. I think all of this helped some. I still needed to reseed, and used my Mazama/Beyond blend, along with Bewitched.

For my year old Bewitched mini renos around the deck construction that got nailed buy rust, I've been doing the aggressive fall regimen with weekly 0.5 lbs N of urea. There really wasn't any foliage for a foliar app. It's definitely helping, but has a way to go. I also reseeded with my 3 way kbg blend, to get the other two cultivars in there, with the hopes of better rust resistance (Bewitched is susceptible to rust, if memory serves).

I recently picked up some K4L Extreme Blend, which I will be using next year and might try if temps are warm enough in the next couple of weeks.

Hopefully, that tree pruning your neighbor did will be a game changer. I need to do some this winter, if I can get to it.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Hopefully, that tree pruning your neighbor did will be a game changer. I need to do some this winter, if I can get to it.


I was more concerned about my young tree (same type) 10 or 15 feet away. It has a little more room to grow now. Not sure how much it will help the grass, but it should somewhat. I'm also thinking about dormant seeding that area in very late Winter or early Spring, with a shade tolerant TTTF. Any seed I put down last week probably blew away when I blew the nuts yesterday, and some of the grass pulled up when I raked. Nitrogen and Phosphrus now, and seed in late Winter should help.

Last year, my neighbor's sprinklers were adjusted wrong and wet that area every day, really messing it up. But I think they got that adjusted this year (the spray and schedule). They actually had them blown out over a week ago.


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## JDgreen18

Green said:


> It's raining now, and probably will for two more days. We could get 2 inches. They said this storm could turn into a subtropical storm, and there's supposed to be 40 mph wind tomorrow. Let's see what happens...


Yeah its been pretty windy today...I was able to sneak in a quick mow before the rsin started thus morning.


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## social port

I've been thinking about the two fall issues. What keeps coming to mind regarding issue 1 is that it sounds like the soil in this area stays wet. I'm imagining an area with saturated soil. What does the grass look like when there is no rainfall and you haven't watered this area?


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## Green

social port said:


> I've been thinking about the two fall issues. What keeps coming to mind regarding issue 1 is that it sounds like the soil in this area stays wet. I'm imagining an area with saturated soil.


Sometimes. Like last September/October when my neighbor's sprinklers were blasting the area every day because they were mis-aimed. It was saturated, and my seed (I overseeded last year) looked like it wanted to rot.

This year, not so much. I had a sprinkler head installed there this year as there never was one, but it's not getting overwatered, as we've mostly relied on rain the past month. In fact, my neighbor's sprinklers were blown out the last week in September.



social port said:


> What does the grass look like when there is no rainfall and you haven't watered this area?


It looks green in the shaded areas. And sometimes threatens to go brown near the pavement. But I water to prevent that. The thing is, there's the tree. Then there's my young tree about 10-15 feet away. There's also an evergreen shrub. And then several utility boxes/access points...all in that area or surrounding it. And the road borders the other side. A few years ago, an electrical contractor dug up the area (went down like 5 feet) to work on my neighbor's electrical system. Some of the roots of the shrub got killed in the process, but it has done fine (it's my neighbor's). But the soil seems to still not have fully gotten back to normal yet. I think that was 4 years ago. I don't know...maybe a sand/compost topdress is in order...but then again, maybe more soil differences in terms of layers would just make it even worse and keep the roots from deeper. Or maybe I should try that Andersons stuff with the KOH. I really don't know.

Compost was put down there a few times over the years, as well...

The grass is just thin, especially the closer you get to the shrub and utility boxes. And the roots don't go deep. I think shade from the bush is the main issue in one area.

I feel like getting a good shade-tolerant cultivar in there will help. And maybe I should give the humic stuff with KOH a shot now and again in early Spring.


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## Green

Post #778 in my journal...

Rain gauge had 0.6 inch from yesterday, and it actually dried out and was sunny this morning. I snuck in a quick mow of the upper side at 4 inches, which was overgrown. Also did the upper back at 3.75 inches. And then the garage side and the middle portion of the side front at 3.75 inches with the old mower. Believe it or not, this was the first (or maybe second for some of it) time that the new grass in that area (planted in May) was cut...it just didn't grow through the Summer. It stayed alive, but didn't need cutting until now. Also was the first mow with a gas mower on the slope since I overseeded last month. I prefer the old mower for this, as it's lighter and has both smaller and wider wheels, so it doesn't have anywhere near as much chance of damaging new grass. It kind of glides right over.

My seed is starting to germinate, which is awesome. The squirrels digging up everything is not. I fixed a lot of spots.

And I got in my second liquid fertilizer spray today on the leveled area in the back and new grass/seeded areas in the upper back. I sprayed everything whether it germinated or not yet. Also did some other problem areas in the front, etc. for the first time. Mix was approx. 1.5 oz of 24-8-16 Miracle Gro, 1.5 oz of 10-52-10 Miracle Gro, and 2/3 gal of water...enough for approx. 0.5K area.

On the weekend, I will do trimming, start mowing again, and do an AMS spray on the back. Upper back and rear part of garage side looks terrible from the Rust (all brown and a lot is dead), and the grass is starting to pull up there, too, from too much surface moisture/shade and being on a slope. There is too much KBG in the area. If there was more TTTF, I think it would be doing better with the disease, shade, and rooting. The KBG tries to spread laterally, but it's not rooting downward enough to hold the soil. I may well attempt a dormant overseed fairly early this Winter in that area if it doesn't recover fully this Fall.


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## Green

Just watered seed a little with the hand can today. It sprinkled few times, but was windy.

I think I will do an extra low-rate granular N app on the upper back this weekend, as it's really struggling to recover from the rust disease. It's that bad. I will also be spraying problem areas with fertilizer for the next several weeks.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

@Chris LI, I have some photos for you from today, taken while it was like 55 degrees out:










Bet you know exactly what type of grass this is.

Closer:










Closer:









I would say it's around 6 inches, and it's keeping its color better than stuff that gets mowed regularly. How much does it tend to grow per year? I doubt it really gets fertilizer where it was. It's green for a solid 5-5.5 months here (versus 7-8 months for cool-season grass). Cool-season grass obviously doesn't go totally brown like Zoysia, but can come close.

Cool-season grass on the left; the same stand of Zoysia on the right:









Look which one is denser...


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## Chris LI

That is one helluva side-by-side! That small drain/path may not be strong enough to hold that Zoysia back! Lol.

Yup, the density is wonderful, but the lime green color and 6+ months of dormancy kills me. It should be great in the south. However, what I find so interesting, is that while it grows a thick, dense mat for us in the north (when most of us want to kill it), the warm season folks seem to struggle to grow it down south. It seems as though the grasses that should be optimized for each region, still have challenges to live up to peak performance.

As an aside, there was some experimentation with one of the newer Zoysia cultivars for golf turf at Bethpage Green Course (with tees) several years ago, with Prof. Frank Rossi (Cornell). We were there for a field trip for another project, and he pointed it out while we were there. I have no idea what became of it, but I figured it might be something interesting to point out, as far as turfgrass research. I think he was also on the team that developed the golf course in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil for the 2016 Olympics (they used Zoysia on some/most parts of the course, if memory serves me). I'm not sure if there was any correlation between the two, but it wouldn't surprise me.

It's a curse that I remember some of this trivia, when I'm trying to manage/kill it all the time.


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## Green

11/12/19:

Mowed closest half of low input area at 4 in.


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## Green

Started trimming real quick.

Tomorrow and Tuesday goals: Mow, trim, spray Tenacity, spray Nitrogen, kill vines, mulch, peat moss, apply granular Nitrogen, pull weeds, fix/calibrate sprinklers.


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## Green

Sprayed Tenacity on rest of low-input area (3K) at roughly 4oz rate (and lighter on FF areas and heavier on weedy areas). Idea is to prevent/kill any germinating nasty stuff like Poa annua. Then sprayed at roughly 2oz rate on main front (minus sodded/plugged redo areas and seeded areas).

Mowed far end of low-input and flood-prone area with old mower, bagged/blew leaves from there to help it dry out before the next rain. Then mowed and trimmed most of back, and most of sides.

Will finish mowing/trimming tomorrow. Also:

-Need more mosquito dunks because 1-2 inches of rain is expected mid-week.
-I'd like to put down an app of the Ultramate SG maybe trying out the Wizz spreader, on the flood-prone area.
-Pick up sticks and finish mowing and trimming
-Put down granular and spray foliar fertilizer on Rust damaged areas
-Spray shampoo on upper front hill and maybe flood-prone area and upper back as well
-Prune overhanging branches/brush/vines near flood-prone area to help it dry out after the next rain
-Kill/paint Triclopyr on vines, etc. (they're going to go dormant soon and won't be responsive to the herbicides)
-Spot-spray Triclopyr while I'm at it with the vines
-Reel mow side overseed area
-Finish with the mulch in the front
-Plugs
-Sprinklers


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## uts

Quick question, with that much rain expected would it be a waste to put down fertilizer due to concern for leaching?


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## Green

uts said:


> Quick question, with that much rain expected would it be a waste to put down fertilizer due to concern for leaching?


Don't think so, since 2 inches is the max forecasted. But maybe runoff if it comes down too fast and heavy. I'm not going to worry about that, since the backyard water can't really run off into the street in my case. I'm not really fertilizing the front.


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## Green

Finished mowing back, and mowed front after picking up sticks. 3.75 in, except flat part of side front from marker to garage front, which was 4 in. Reel mowed the middle side overseed area carefully 2x perpendicular at roughly 3 in and blew to scatter clippings after.

Put down Carbon-X on areas with worst Rust- 
1.5 lbs on upper back/garage side, 1.5 lbs on lower back, and approx. 1/3 lb on the middle side overseed (that's a fairly high rate since it's a small area, but I did not calculate. I'm sure it's safe). Tried out the Scotts Wizz spreader for the first time. It doesn't seem real accurate, but it sure got the job done fast, which was great, since it was getting dark. Made sure not to get too much fert into newly germinating areas.

Mowed grandfather's lawn. The cooler temps, rain, and fertilizer are really bringing it out of dormancy.


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## Green

This morning, sprayed Ammonium Sulfate at roughly 0.1-0.25 lb rate (depending on the area). Sprayed the back seeded areas, worst back rust area near deck, garage side, side-front slope, and upper front hill, as well as some other areas near there that had a lot of rust/brown.

Pruned/cut down brush/vines/tree near the flood-prone area, and then blew leaves and used the mower to suck them up. The idea was to get it as opened up as possible before the rain so it might dry out faster, since we could get up to 3 inches of rain.

Also put down Andersons UltraMate SG using the Wizz on that area, and some adjacent areas. I didn't measure, but eyeballed the amount. I've never used it before. It was messy. But applying this way was sure faster than trying to mix and spray it. Hoping the KOH helps create "liquid aeration" to help the area drain a bit faster as well. Also bought a new pack of mosquito dunks, and broke them in half and put them all out in the area.

Finally, sprayed shampoo on the same front areas where I applied the Nitrogen earlier.

The rain is watering it all in now.

Really hoping the combination of Carbon-X with urea and AMS, plus the AMS I sprayed, help the worst rust affected areas recover.


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## JDgreen18

@Green the Ultramate sg isnt that a soluble powder that is supposed to be mixed with water to make a liquid app? I have this item as well and sprayed it a few times last year. Kind of curious as to how it would be putting down as a powder.


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> @Green the Ultramate sg isnt that a soluble powder that is supposed to be mixed with water to make a liquid app? I have this item as well and sprayed it a few times last year. Kind of curious as to how it would be putting down as a powder.


Yeah, but I had no time to mix it, so I tried the Wizz. I figured out that shaking it side to side helps it come out. Only my second time using that spreader. I used it with Carbon-X the other night. The Ultramate coated it black; I'm going to need to clean it.

The rain will dilute the Ultramate SG, lol.


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## Green

Got 2.8 inches of rain with this storm. It also made a lot of leaves and branches come down. Started picking them up in the driveway. Still fairly windy.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Yup, the density is wonderful, but the lime green color and 6+ months of dormancy kills me. It should be great in the south. However, what I find so interesting, is that while it grows a thick, dense mat for us in the north (when most of us want to kill it), the warm season folks seem to struggle to grow it down south. It seems as though the grasses that should be optimized for each region, still have challenges to live up to peak performance.


Why does Zoysia tend to be light green? I've noticed it too around here. There are about 5 yards with it in within 5 minute walking distance. I figured the people don't fertilize regularly. I've seen photos on this site of dark green Zoysia.

It still has some green, but it's going. I'd guess it'll be totally straw brown in early November.



Chris LI said:


> As an aside, there was some experimentation with one of the newer Zoysia cultivars for golf turf at Bethpage Green Course (with tees) several years ago, with Prof. Frank Rossi (Cornell). We were there for a field trip for another project, and he pointed it out while we were there. I have no idea what became of it, but I figured it might be something interesting to point out, as far as turfgrass research. I think he was also on the team that developed the golf course in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil for the 2016 Olympics (they used Zoysia on some/most parts of the course, if memory serves me). I'm not sure if there was any correlation between the two, but it wouldn't surprise me.


I've been wondering, what do you do for work that you get to go on these field days every so often? I know you said you manage ball fields as part of work, but the guys who mow seem to not always listen to instructions for different areas, like with the mowing height around your building. I assume you mean municipal baseball/softball fields in the town/city.


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## Green

Ordered a rain/freeze shutoff sensor for the front/back irrigation today.

Weekend to-do list:

-Pick up sticks
-Mow/blow
-Trim/blow
-Kill vines and weeds
-Pull weeds
-Spray N/P
-Spray Gallery Pre-M
-Fix sprinkler(s)
-Transplant grass plugs


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## Mrotatori

@Green I noticed you are transplanting plugs. When is it to late in CT to do plugs?I did a few last week, but was not sure if they will make it.


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## Green

Mrotatori said:


> @Green I noticed you are transplanting plugs. When is it to late in CT to do plugs?I did a few last week, but was not sure if they will make it.


You can keep doing it through November and into December if the ground is soft enough. Most of them tend to make it. But of course now is better than later. Some of mine might already be dead due to drying out, but I'll try planting them anyway.


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## Chris LI

I believe Zoysia is just genetically lighter in color. Also, I think typical owners of Zoysia yards love it because they have to basically do nothing, to have grass. They mow it whenever, never fertilize or water and they still have grass. I speak from experience talking to a couple of friends/neighbors. Most of us on TLF drive ourselves crazy trying to have a nice lawn. Since mine is well fertilized, it tends to be darker than typical Zoysia lawns that I've seen. The Zoysia at Bethpage was also on the darker side. I'm guessing that it is a combination of a darker cultivar and better fertility. The leaf texture was finer too, like a kbg.

As for my occupation, you pretty much hit the nail on the head. I wear many, many hats at my job and turfgrass mgmt is only a small (but most favorite) part of what I do for a living.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> As for my occupation, you pretty much hit the nail on the head. I wear many, many hats at my job and turfgrass mgmt is only a small (but most favorite) part of what I do for a living.


So, public domain as opposed to private. Is it the kids' sports teams that use those fields?

Every once in a while when I'm searching for grass or fertilizer info, a bid sheet will come up from a town or city's Park and Rec dept, or a school district's facilities, showing the sheer quantity of stuff they purchase. We often forget that the sports fields don't just maintain themselves!

Also, do you do anything with the non-athletic field areas (e.g. town lawns/greens, school yards, etc., too? I've rarely seen a public school with a really nice lawn area. Most are Crabgrass and weeds/brown/dirt. In fact, CT outlawed all pesticides/herbicides for grade K-8 school properties a while back, including lawns, and...athletic fields.

Check this out: http://www.turf.uconn.edu/pdf/research/reports/2017%20UConn%20Annual%20Turf%20Research%20Report.pdf


----------



## Green

Today: Picked up sticks on the side front. There were a lot.

Mowed and mulched up leaves. Mowed the front hill and middle of the side front with the old mower at 3.75 inches (slightly lower than I've been cutting, and each mower has its strengths and weaknesses in terms of cut quality, weight on saturated ground, etc.). Mowed the closest half of the low-input area with the new mower at 4 inches.


----------



## Green

Picked up sticks and mowed upper back at 3.75 in with old mower. Got most of it done before the rain started. Hopefully not much rain tonight, so it'll dry out tomorrow so I can finish up before the next big rain Tuesday or Tuesday night. Still lots of areas with leaves down that need to be mowed, trimmed, blown, sticks picked up, etc.

Strongly considering dropping a final 0.25 lb N from Carbon-X while I'm at it...in addition to the foliar sprays I plan to do this week and next.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> Chris LI said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for my occupation, you pretty much hit the nail on the head. I wear many, many hats at my job and turfgrass mgmt is only a small (but most favorite) part of what I do for a living.
> 
> 
> 
> So, public domain as opposed to private. Is it the kids' sports teams that use those fields?
> 
> Every once in a while when I'm searching for grass or fertilizer info, a bid sheet will come up from a town or city's Park and Rec dept, or a school district's facilities, showing the sheer quantity of stuff they purchase. We often forget that the sports fields don't just maintain themselves!
> 
> Also, do you do anything with the non-athletic field areas (e.g. town lawns/greens, school yards, etc., too? I've rarely seen a public school with a really nice lawn area. Most are Crabgrass and weeds/brown/dirt. In fact, CT outlawed all pesticides/herbicides for grade K-8 school properties a while back, including lawns, and...athletic fields.
> 
> Check this out: http://www.turf.uconn.edu/pdf/research/reports/2017%20UConn%20Annual%20Turf%20Research%20Report.pdf
Click to expand...

We only maintain adult use sports fields. No kids or school use. We don't use pesticides at the current time, and and use cultural practices as the core of our maintenance program. We also maintain formal grass panels. That's why finding the best seed for our location and growing conditions is important. Overseeding is a large part of repairing issues and strengthening the turf stand to deal with traffic. Thanks for the info, I'll definitely check it out.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, just a few more field related questions for you. What do you mean by formal grass panels? And where are those located (near the sports fields?) and what do they get used for? Are they large areas? What is formal about them?

Also, I'm trying to understand the usage of the sports fields. Adult use can be anything from older retired people in their 90s to professional sports teams. Is it the whole range of users in this case? Are these fields that groups could use for events like festivals or business events, too? Because that's a totally different type of wear.

In that pdf is a study on pesticide-free.


----------



## Green

Got 0.1 inch of rain last time.

Today, picked up sticks on main front. Mowed middle side overseed. Finished mowing low-input area, including cleaning up flood-prone area. Blew/raked/bag mowed to get the leaves out. A few got mulched in.

Looking to finish stuff tomorrow morning before rain hopefully:
-Kill vines
-Clean mowers
-Pull up more Triv
-Finish picking up sticks, mowing and then trim
-Fix bricks
-Apply fertilizer
-Spray weeds?
-Pull weeds??
-Spray shampoo
-Replace sprinkler head if time permits
-Apply another app of Ultramate if time permits
-Tenacity??
-Apply Lime to low-input area????

Gallery pre-M and plugs will have to wait a few days.

Dates of sprinkler blow out (winterization):
Oct. 28th, 2019 (planned date for this year)
Nov. 8th, 2018
Nov. 7th, 2017
Nov. 16th, 2016 (got good use right up until the last minute)
Nov. 17th, 2015


----------



## Green

Got stuff done!

-Finished picking up sticks and mowing. Had to raise up to 4" in a bunch of places, and did a sloppy job of mulching the leaves due to time.

-Replaced the sprinkler head (spray head by the driveway/sidewalk). The old one was stuck and would no longer adjust. It also wasn't giving proper coverage, as the grass was blocking it. So, I upgraded to a 6" model. The new one is also regulated to 30 psi instead of 40, so it should produce less water waste with the nozzle I used. After changing the sprinkler, I ran the zone for a while with the flush cap on to clear out any debris, and then put in a Rainbird HE-VAN 8 green nozzle. The other sprinkler nearby is a 4" 40 psi model with a Rainbird 8Q green nozzle. We'll see how it goes next year when I do an irrigation audit.

-Put down 50 lbs of Solu-Cal Calcitic Lime on the low-input area (minus the flood-prone area, which had different test results and will be addressed next Spring). Still need to put down Epsom salt at 2lb rate--maybe late this week.

-Put down low rate (~0.25N rate) of Carbon-X 24-0-4 on the back in lieu of spraying Ammonium Sulfate due to time. Also put some on the garage side, side slope of side front, and upper front hill (all areas where rust is the worst). This will be my last granular fertilizer this year, until I do my late-season app. It's always a challenge to spread such low rates of large prill AMS/urea.

-Sprayed shampoo on the side slope and upper hill of the side front prior to running the sprinklers. Total runtime was at least 10 min to test everything out. It helped get everything wet I guess.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> Got stuff done!


 So much planned, too! You are still so active in the lawn. When do you expect things will begin to wind down?



Green said:


> Sprayed shampoo on the side slope and upper hill of the side front prior to running the sprinklers. Total runtime was at least 10 min to test everything out. It helped get everything wet I guess.


Curious about the timing of the shampoo. My strategy is to do a shampoo app before summer. Earlier today, I was wondering if a pre-winter app might actually help water get down deeper into the soil. Then, I see this from you...


----------



## Green

@social port, Thanks. That's the goal. The tree roots in that area and October sun angle were causing drought stress. There's also rust. Trying to get it to recover. Also, anything I can do to keep the top soil layers from being saturated this time of year is helpful. I'll probably be shampooing other areas, later in the week.

October can be busy, and the grass still grows fairly fast. November tends to slow down, but is still pretty busy due to frequent mulch mowing for leaves.

Quick question: what was your recipe for the WBG CCO and AMS? I'm going to do some tomorrow and you had good results.


----------



## Green

Today:

Got 0.365 inch of rain last night.

Fixed bricks near driveway.

Killed vines and other plants (or at least attempted to) using almost straight WBG CCO stock solution with some AMS.

Trimmed the area near patio, including trimming the new grass for the first time, which is only about an inch high right now. Trimmed to about half inch.

Also trimmed around a weedy grass clump I plan to brush glyphosate on. I'm using scissors to cut out as much of the good grass as possible so I don't kill much of it by accident.

Changed nozzles in two sprinkler heads in zone 4...removed a 3.5 LA from the one near the back corner of the garage, and put in a 2.0 LA. Removed a 3.0 light blue from the one across from the shed, and put in a 2.0 light blue. Turned all heads back on in that zone. More zones to do tomorrow, as I get ready for system winterization. Need to increase middle head in lower back zone slightly, increase lower side zone 2 head slightly, increase zone 2 head near door substantially (2 increments), increase zone 2 head near juniper slightly, and try to remove the cap and clean out the middle driveway head in zone 1, and measure head positions along driveway.


----------



## Green

Nice day today. Sunny and fairly warm (upper 60s). Finished testing the sprinkler zones and swapping nozzles. I took a 1.5 dark blue out of the center head in the lower back, and put in a 2 gpm dark blue. I think the gpm of that zone is now maxed out...like 13 or 14gpm. Thankfully I don't use that one much. On the side, I removed a 3.0 from the lower head in zone 2, and put in a 4 gpm dark blue. Also in zone 2, I removed a beige 30H (approx. 3.8 gpm, and stubborn to remove) from the head near the juniper, and put in a 4 dark blue (4.1 gpm). And for the head near the door, I removed a dark blue 1.0 gpm and swapped in a 2.0 gpm light blue. I also removed the caps and washed out the adjustment ports on some of the heads, including the middle driveway zone 1 head.

Used this as an opportunity to water the seed. And then of course the delivery guy has to walk right through the wet lawn...you'd think they like getting their shoes wet or something.

Trimmed the new grass behind the deck by hand. Hope it makes it through Winter.

And spent a lot of time today washing the car. Will wax tomorrow.


----------



## social port

I'm sorry, @Green. I'm late to the party.
I fill my tank with water at 70 percent of the final amount. 
I add about two oz of AMS per gallon. You could do 3oz/g if you are in the mood. 
Mix
For spot spraying, I add one fl oz of WBGCCO per gallon. 
Then I fill with water to the target amount.
Add a generous splash of NIS.
Mix.

I highly recommend it.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> I'm sorry, Green. I'm late to the party.
> I fill my tank with water at 70 percent of the final amount.
> I add about two oz of AMS per gallon. You could do 3oz/g if you are in the mood.
> Mix
> For spot spraying, I add one fl oz of WBGCCO per gallon.
> Then I fill with water to the target amount.
> Add a generous splash of NIS.
> Mix.
> 
> I highly recommend it.


Thanks!! That's what I was looking for. Not sure when I'm doing it. Hopefully tomorrow...no days to waste as it gets cooler. Only issue is I will have to mow the next day.


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## Green

Mowed low input area, part of front, and back.

Tomorrow:

-Finish cleaning car
-Spray N, P, Tenacity, CCO
-Paint gly
-Finish mowing
-Trim
-Clean up low input flood-prone area
-Move extra mulch


----------



## Green

I got two of those things done today:

-Finished mowing/mulching leaves
-Got leaves out of the flood-prone area (it finally dried out...I think the pruning helped with that)
-Also pulled up some Poa Triv in the main front. Best to control the large patches now. Can always add seed in early 2020.

We could get 1-2 inches of rain tomorrow. There is such a thing as too much at once. Hopefully it's not 2 inches, and hopefully it dries out at some point so I can get to the soon to be flooded and soggy areas again soon to mow.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> I'm sorry, Green. I'm late to the party.
> I fill my tank with water at 70 percent of the final amount.
> I add about two oz of AMS per gallon. You could do 3oz/g if you are in the mood.
> Mix
> For spot spraying, I add one fl oz of WBGCCO per gallon.
> Then I fill with water to the target amount.
> Add a generous splash of NIS.
> Mix.
> 
> I highly recommend it.


Looks like I may have to spot spray (as planned) and then let it dry for a few hours, and then mow later the same day...as I'm going to be due for a mow, but every day counts now for spraying weeds...the sooner the better. I don't want the first app to be in November...that's too late.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> social port said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm sorry, Green. I'm late to the party.
> I fill my tank with water at 70 percent of the final amount.
> I add about two oz of AMS per gallon. You could do 3oz/g if you are in the mood.
> Mix
> For spot spraying, I add one fl oz of WBGCCO per gallon.
> Then I fill with water to the target amount.
> Add a generous splash of NIS.
> Mix.
> 
> I highly recommend it.
> 
> 
> 
> Looks like I may have to spot spray (as planned) and then let it dry for a few hours, and then mow later the same day...as I'm going to be due for a mow, but every day counts now for spraying weeds...the sooner the better. I don't want the first app to be in November...that's too late.
Click to expand...

Gotcha. Hopefully, the leaves will have time to absorb the herbicide. I have been known to mow around recently-sprayed weeds. Looks bad, so I am not sure how much of an option that might be for you.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Gotcha. Hopefully, the leaves will have time to absorb the herbicide. I have been known to mow around recently-sprayed weeds. Looks bad, so I am not sure how much of an option that might be for you.


Possibly. But I also have a feeling that if I keep my HOC at 4 in for one more mow, I won't be taking off too much weed material...they don't seem to grow as high as fast the grass. Basically a few violets, and I want to knock back some of the clover where it's too dense.

I wonder if it'll work on dandelion, too.


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## social port

Green said:


> I wonder if it'll work on dandelion, too.


Ha! I wish I could tell you. I sprayed the solution on 5 or so dandelions during my last app. They are discolored, but it is too early to say whether or not they will be eliminated.


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## Green

Had sprinklers blown out (winterized - using multiple keywords here so I can easily search this later) this morning.

Got like 1.68 in of rain yesterday. Everything is either flooded, or areas that aren't, are soggy now. I hope the weather cooperates the rest of the week, but there's more rain in the forecast, with a chance every day. And this is the last truly warm week...it's going to be 50s/30s starting late in the week...just in time for November. Then in December the average highs are in the 40s, and of course 30s for Jan and Feb. It isn't until March that we usually get back to 40s for average highs. When it rains a lot in December or January (or even Feb occasionally--we've had thunderstorms before), it does NOT dry up readily...it just freezes where the flooded areas are.

Got car exterior done.

Measured sprinkler positions. Put a couple of hoses away.

To-do list between now and weekend:
-Trim and finish picking up nails
-Mow
-Sharpen blade
-Spray N and P
-Paint gly
-CCO
-Add more CCO to vines
-Plant grass plugs
-Vac car
-Gallery
-Dig up rock areas and fix
-Tenacity
-Shampoo
-Pull Triv and other weeds
-Get crushed rock
-Fix area drug up due to rock
-Test hoses
-Mulch
-Biofungicide
-Check battery in sprinkler controller
-Download data
-Put down Epsom salt


----------



## Green

Constant mist today, rain tonight. Hoping it dries out.

Pulled up some Triv in main front. As far as Triv, I definitely made a dent in it, but it's hard to totally get rid of. Going forward, the strategy is going to be pulling out what I can, especially this Fall. If there are some defined spots, I will consider the spot kill and redo again on a much smaller scale next Spring.

I think the comparisons with Bermuda as far as invasiveness are accurate. I imagine Bermuda presents a similar challenge that is hard to ever entirely remove.

Neighbor had "Chemlawn" come. They appeared to have put down around 0.75 lb per thousand of N from urea. It's a bit late...this is supposed to be a week into the start of the pause. Then again, I don't think it was fertilized in a couple of months, so it'll probably work fine. But it's going to be getting a bit cold soon.


----------



## social port

@Green, it doesn't look like you've done your CCO apps yet?
I want to pass this along: I noticed substantial discoloration in my bluegrass today in the spots that I hit with the CCO AMS mix. I did not see any discoloration to my TTTF.
I began to think about my mix and possible mistakes, as I've never observed damage before, even when mixing the CCO with quinclorac, 2,4-d, and dicamba.
I thought the AMS rate might have been too high, but I just cross-referenced my rate with SJL's, and it looks like he is actually doing 2.5 as a standard--even higher than what I typically use.

So, I say all of this as a precaution and as a recommendation to stick to that 1floz/g of the CCO. With my last app, I think it is possible that I mixed a little hot. The solution also sat in the tank for over a week, so that may have been a contributing factor.


----------



## Green

@social port, thanks. There was no time to do it yet. I'm still hoping I'll have the opportunity this Fall. We'll see. If tomorrow morning is dry (not likely) I'm going to trim, mow, and spray the Nitrogen. Unfortunately, mowing is taking priority once again.


----------



## Green

Looks like chickweed, etc. is going to start germinating any day...so Gallery along the edges and areas where Winter annuals normally grow is a priority as well.

I say this because not only are the temps dropping soon, but I noticed a crop of oxalis has been germinating. Also, we're on the very last crop of the Summer stuff, like Spurge and Purslane now. I saw some fairly green (but stressed-looking) crabgrass last week while out and about. I was surprised. But we haven't had frost yet.


----------



## Green

Got at least an inch of rain yesterday. Lots of wind. Power went on and off a few times today.

Big weather changes coming. Last night at 2AM it was 70F with a dewpoint of 69. Tomorrow morning, it's supposed to get down to 33 or 32. Picked the rest of the tomatoes, green or not.

Still pulling Triv here and there. Started picking up sticks.

Checked 4-inch soil temp in one area of the front this evening. It was 58F. It will continue growing until it hits 40 or so. The back lawn is likely a couple of weeks away from that. The front will probably keep going for another month, but will start slowing down more in the meantime.

I've got one more 0.1 lb/M Nitrogen application left, which I hope to do tomorrow morning on the bad rust areas, and then anything after that will have to be at a lower rate if at all.


----------



## Green

Did a mow/leaf mulching on the upper back. Need to finish tomorrow, but I want to get that gator blade sharpened first.

Probably won't get half the stuff I want to done over the next week. For example, I think herbicides are pretty much done based on impending weather, and I don't know if I'll get the chance. By the end of the week, a little snow is forecast, and the highs will be in the upper 30s and lows in the upper 20s.


----------



## Green

Finally sharpened and installed the gator blade today. Planning to use it tomorrow to mulch the leaves. It was around 50 today, and hitting the upper 20s tonight. All the leaves on the lawn will serve as insulation tonight. It went down to about 33 the other night. It may hit the mid to low 20s on the weekend. Picked the rest of the tomatoes today.


----------



## Green

Got the front mowed, and mulched a good amount of leaves doing at least double passes. @Chris LI, the blade is pretty darn good. Not a miracle like the Groundskeeper rake, but definitely useful.


----------



## Chris LI

It seems to shine better when the leaves are heavy. Do you have the ability to side discharge with either of your mowers? Some rear baggers also have a spring loaded door on the right side that you can insert a side discharge chute or prop open with a bungie cord. If you do, that will help to power through heavy piles with full width passes, without stalling the mower. If not, it's not a big deal. Also, experimenting with technique goes a long way. Sometimes, leaves squirt out one side of the deck, more than the other, different types of leaves mulch differently, wet leaves vs. dry leaves, deck height/levelness etc. It may take a season of leaf mulching as a learning curve.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, yeah both mowers have side discharge ability, including the one with the gator blade (the 21 inch). I tend to use side discharge earlier in the season when the grass is too long to fully mulch. I wasn't using it on the leaves today since I was working in smaller areas some, and I didn't think of it for the 2.5K area. Instead, I did a weird alternating pass thing on that area, sort of like a more random version of your zamboni cut I think. Goal is to get the leaves evenly distributed. Then I mowed a second set of passes perpendicular after...same as I've often done with the standard blade. The grass under the leaves was a bit wet. I went over some branches I didn't know were under there.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> @Chris LI, yeah both mowers have side discharge ability, including the one with the gator blade (the 21 inch). I tend to use side discharge earlier in the season when the grass is too long to fully mulch. I wasn't using it on the leaves today since I was working in smaller areas some, and I didn't think of it for the 2.5K area. Instead, I did a weird alternating pass thing on that area, sort of like a more random version of your zamboni cut I think. Goal is to get the leaves evenly distributed. Then I mowed a second set of passes perpendicular after...same as I've often done with the standard blade. The grass under the leaves was a bit wet. I went over some branches I didn't know were under there.


Exactly! Oh, yeah! You got it down! :nod: Those are some of the exact techniques that I use. Do you have a spy drone hovering over my house? Lol. I used to fret about leaves until I embraced mulching them. For a clean look, I sometimes throw the bag on after mincing them into itty bitty pieces.


----------



## Green

Did a quick leaf mulch and mow on the back and side just now as it got dark. Currently at 3.75 inch HOC with the older mower, which is a bit lower than that setting on the newer one. I'm really itching to go down to 3.25 soon, but it's going to have to wait until after the snow, as I've been taking quite a bit off. Final couple of mows for the year in 3-4 weeks will be at ~2.6 inches.

Continued pulling up Triv in the front. Planning to keep fighting this right now, regardless of forming gaps in the turf as a result of removal. It's been coming up so easily. Some of the good grass comes with it, but there's always going to be a little collateral damage. I'll fix it in March and April.


----------



## Green

Blew and re-mowed the back and middle/lower side using the bag. Added the leaves to the low-input area, and started mulching them in. Pulled up some more Triv, and planted some plugs. Blew leaves out of the (now mostly dry) flood-prone area.


----------



## Green

Got 0.25 inch of rain.

Got the low input mowing finished, and it's down to 3.75 in now, but it was raining. I don't recommend trying to mulch leaves during rain. What a mess! But no mowing for a few days as it'll be too cold. After rinsing the mower, I brought in my front hose. Back ones are still outside for now. Also brought in my grass pots. Neighbors had fertilizer put down today. We are squarely in the pause now, so that can't be a great idea...similar to applying in the middle of Summer.


----------



## social port

@Green , I will say that it's a no-go for triclopyr and dandelions - at least for one app. I noticed leaf damage from one app, but the plants will recover. FYI.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green , I will say that it's a no-go for triclopyr and dandelions - at least for one app. I noticed leaf damage from one app, but the plants will recover. FYI.


Thanks. Still unsure if I'll do a spot spray this year for the other stuff, since it's getting cold and the amine version apparently doesn't so well in the cold. But they say Fall is better than Spring for control. If I had some of the Ester, I'd try it if I had time. But since I only have the amine, I'm not sure.

Also read on this site today that apparently NIS doesn't do so well on violets, and an oil is better...have you heard that one?


----------



## social port

Green said:


> social port said:
> 
> 
> 
> Green , I will say that it's a no-go for triclopyr and dandelions - at least for one app. I noticed leaf damage from one app, but the plants will recover. FYI.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. Still unsure if I'll do a spot spray this year for the other stuff, since it's getting cold and the amine version apparently doesn't so well in the cold. But they say Fall is better than Spring for control. If I had some of the Ester, I'd try it if I had time. But since I only have the amine, I'm not sure.
> 
> Also read on this site today that apparently NIS doesn't do so well on violets, and an oil is better...have you heard that one?
Click to expand...

No, but I have certainly read that wild violet is difficult to control. I thought that I had a few patches earlier this year, but I think I misidentified them, because the plants I had were taken out with one app of a 3-way plus triclopyr.
Obviously, I am speculating a bit, but I can't imagine why oil would be that much better for violet specifically. That raises the question of whether MSO might be better than NIS for waxy leaves more generally.

Personally, when given the choice, I always use NIS. It pairs well with every herbicide that I use, and that keeps the shelves in the garage a little less cluttered.


----------



## Green

High of 36 today. Like typical late Dec/early January temps almost two months early. We might break a couple of local records. Going down to about 20 tonight.

Garage side neighbor had sprinklers blown out this evening The guy used too much PSI. I could hear the air rushing through from in the house about 50 feet away, and it was spraying up like steam. Way to heat up the piping.

Made sure the water faucets were open tonight. Put insulation in basement window as the cold air was rushing in.


----------



## Green

Went down to 22 the other night. Tonight they're saying 33. That seems "warm" in comparison--above freezing. Today and tomorrow have highs of 50s...very nice weather. This coming Wednesday, the high and low are forecast to be 32/14.

I blew leaves and mowed the side front, back, and garage side, going down to 3.25 in finally with the gator blade. I picked up a little from the side front, and mulched the rest. I mulched the grass clippings and handful of leaves in the lower back, and collected the leaves and clippings from the upper back and garage side. Added them to the upper side for mulching tomorrow.

My neighbor who typically only mows from May through September mowed today and cleaned up his leaves, mulching them in. That's a first, but welcomed action.

Shooting for a 0.05 lb rate N spray tomorrow. Don't think I should push any higher with the weather. Then maybe again next week.


----------



## Green

So, I have several lawns to look at that got fertilized during the pause...3 of my neighbors had lawn services do it, and one other already winterized his own lawn prematurely last week. There is also a municipal lawn that I think got fert the last week of last month. Really interested in seeing if what I noted last year holds again...

Last year, lawns with these sorts of timings did pretty well. Makes me wonder if we are wrong about the optimal pause duration, too.


----------



## Green

High 50s today. Did more mowing and leaf mulching...

Brought the main front down to 3.25 with the new mower. Mowed the side at 3.75 with the old mower. Mowed the low input area at 3.75 diagonal with it as well. Still cut off a little bit of grass with these settings. Blew leaves out of the flood-prone area, which was moist still.

Brought in the rest of the hoses.

Painted glyphosate on a weedy grass clump in the back that I let grow tall. We'll see how that goes...

Sprayed Nitrogen at 0.05 lb/M rate on the back (1.5 gallon per 1K area; parallel to low-input area spray direction) to try to get the rust to improve more. Also sprayed the garage side, and areas in front that needed it, including the new grass areas, edge of side front side slope hill, hellstrip areas, etc. Everywhere except the lower back, I had some P mixed in as well. The mix was done using AMS and two types of Miracle Gro.

Neighbor L winterized today. Probably early technically, but most people don't time it right, and I doubt his grass is going to grow much more...it usually stops earlier than mine due to the varieties, soil, sun, etc. So he's probably good.


----------



## Green

To-do list for Friday (next warm day - forecast to be sunny and around 50):

-Mow/leaf mulch 
-Trim
-Check for/Pick up nails
-Pull Triv
-Plant plugs
-Spread rest of mulch
-Put down Epsom salt (low input area)
-Spray Ultramate on flood prone area (previous app seemed to help)?
-FAS (front)?
-Biofungicide (for rust)?


----------



## Green

Late Winter/Early Spring 2020:

-Order shade tolerant TTTF seed and KBG seed (Hogan)

-Dormant overseed: 
--garage side, portion of back behind that, spots behind deck, main front corner (TTTF)
--end of low-input area (Hard Fescue)

-Start buying bagged mason sand

-Work on flood-prone area once it melts/dries out enough to dig
--trench to drain water - fill with sand
--topdress whole area with light coating of sand/compost/peat and level


----------



## Green

Today: got about 0.035 inch of rain last night. High of 33F and low supposed to hit 17 for both today and tomorrow. Also we're supposed to get a little snow this afternoon--first time this year. I saw a few flakes earlier.

Edit: There was no snow; just those few small flakes.


----------



## Green

Well, guess what? Growth in the upper back lawn (first area to always go dormant) has stopped for all intents and purposes. Temps are below 40F, with a couple of nearly frozen pockets (which will thaw out during a warmer day). I will be applying my winterizing fertilizer on that area in the coming days.

The other areas will follow soon after; temps are about 40F on average in the other areas (with some a bit below, and some up to 45). It's on the verge of stopping growing now, and is that green-gray color.

I mowed and mulched leaves on the side front (mostly bagging the leaves) and there were hardly any clippings in the bag...mostly leaves with a few short pieces of grass mixed in...less than 10% grass.

Here are my historic dates for growth stopping/lawn winterization for comparison:

2018: Nov 24th

2017: Dec 5th

2016: Dec 6th

2015: Dec 21st

2014: Nov 23rd

2013: Nov 29th

2012: Nov 30th

Average of all those is December 3rd; December 1st without counting 2015.

The earlier-than-usual 2019 will give me plenty of time to do my winterizing N experiment.


----------



## Green

Bag mowed the upper back and added the leaves to the side. Not that many clippings; mostly leaves, since it has stopped growing. Mulch mowed the side and took the HOC down to 3.25 in. Did the same on the main front. The other areas are still growing very slowly, but the ground in the back is threatening to freeze in spots...it's getting hard.

Mowed grandfather's lawn - last regular mow for the year, and took the HOC down to setting 5. Picked up sticks and mulched in a ton of leaves. Grass was nice and green, surprisingly. Thanks to the fertilizer I put down two months ago. Riding mower did not start...needed to charge the battery for abut 30 min. Siphoned the ounce or two of old gas from a year ago out of the snowblower and added it to the tank to burn off in small amounts.


----------



## Green

About 35 degrees today. Winterized the first two areas, which were both threatening to freeze...

The upper back: I just started including about half of the garage side in this area, so about 1.1 K now instead of 1.0 K. Basically, sprinkler zone 4, or up to my neighbor's first large tree. On this area, I targeted 0.5 lb/M of N. So, I put down 2.75 lbs of Scotts 27-0-2 GreenMax.

The flood-prone area: I blew the leaves out of the area yet again. Then, I applied about 0.7 lb of the same fertilizer, only on the areas that had grass. About half of it is bare soil, or moss. This is the area I will be killing, fixing the drainage on, and then renovating to a KBG monostand in the Spring. It's about 1,000 square feet.

I never got to do my Epsom salt application this Fall. It will have to wait until Spring.


----------



## Green

Put my grass pots outside tonight so they get watered when it rains and some light tomorrow. They had been in the garage for a couple of days due to the cold.


----------



## Green

Got 0.29 inch of rain last night. Now the flood-prone area is flooded. So it was a good thing I already winterized with Nitrogen on that area.

Today, I pulled some more Poa Triv in the main front and side. I also checked the front soil temps (roughly 45F), and sprayed 0.02 lb/M of N from AMS on the front hill (and the brown areas of the adjacent side slope edge along the driveway, my grass pots, the area I dug up a couple of weeks ago to replace the spray head near the driveway, and the seeded/resodded area next to the patio). Front hill is 0.44 K, and I mixed about 0.68 oz of AMS into a gallon of water. I did at least 3, maybe 4 passes for even coverage, and spent more time spraying the brown/rusty areas than the green ones that have already recovered.


----------



## Green

Pulled up more Triv, some rocks, did some leveling in those spots. Very cold out. Apparently Triv grows better than good grass where there are rocks. Get rid of the rocks, and the good grass may do better.


----------



## Green

Mulch mowed the low input area perpendicularly, taking it down to 3.25 in. The amount of leaves has decreased a lot now.

Took the hose back out and rinsed both mowers. Mowed the main front, hellstrip areas, and front hill with the new mower at the 4th setting down (2 7/8). Did not cut much off.

Then, mixed and sprayed an FAS app on the front hill/side front slope (1oz FS and 0.85oz AMS in 1.5 gal) and main front (1oz AMS and I think 1.5oz FS, parallel to street with extra on areas with worse color, judged by eye in the twilight). No surfactant. Did this because the color needs help. I also have a theory that darker grass might help keep the soil temps higher. We'll see how it looks tomorrow.

Weedy grass clump in the back I painted glyphosate on last week is wilting and purpling on some tillers.


----------



## Green

Got a small amount of rain (under 0.05 inch). Passed probably at least 20 Zoysia lawns today, and all are totally brown now. Gutters cleaned out.


----------



## Green

Today:

-Bag mowed the garage side and first part of side front to get leaves up (and blew leaves from the middle portion of the side front prior to mowing).

-Mowed lower back and lower side at 3.25 in with older mower and Gator blade (North-South).
--13 days since last mow according to notes. Mowed same direction again today, with the bag on. Got a fair amount of clippings from both areas. Still growing, slowly.

-Mowed Northwest corner of low-input area in preparation for my Winterizing Experiment (same mowing specs as above, except mowed East-West).

-Put down N for my Winterizing Experiment!

-Dumped the clippings and leaves on the area behind the shed and mulched in the OM.

-Blew leaves from the upper back into the natural area (too damp/saturated ground for mowing)

-Blew/raked leaves from main front

Rust disease is starting to decrease in some areas, like the lower back, finally. I think my Nitrogen sprays must have helped.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Hey Green ,
> 
> ...I took the readings out of my own curiosity and was hoping for feedback from other members.
> 
> Thanks, again!


I'm pretty sure I'm going to drop my lower back and lower side Winterizing app Tuesday ahead of the rain Wednesday...even if still growing very slowly. There is a cooldown and possibly snow coming next week. My experience is that being slightly early is OK and doesn't push growth. The front, however, will likely have to wait another week or so. The good thing about the lower back still having grown a bit, is that the active Rust disease is starting to get pushed out and cut off. I doubt it all will over the next week, but it helps. I still want to lower my mowing height to 2.6 inches in most areas, but I'm undecided about it in the lower back. I'll have to look at last year's notes.

I'll probably also wait for early Dec. in the coastal area as well...Thanksgiving Day will likely be too chilly and windy for lawn work, anyway.


----------



## Green

Got 0.98 inch of rain between 12Am and 8PM or so today, as noted in the experiment thread. This caused pooling in the low-input area (not only in the flood prone area, but also in some of the adjacent test plots).

I need some new photos in this journal!


----------



## Green

Low-input flood prone area still has water, and likely will stay indefinitely at this point or until until I can manually remove some of it...it'll probably freeze some night.

Did a few minutes of trimming of borders and edges by hand. Also fixed a bunch of squirrel holes, matted grass, etc. (Leaf mulching seems to cause matted areas where the wheels went.)


----------



## Green

Mowed low input area and front down to 2-2.6 in with old mower on 3rd setting down, and new one on 5th setting down. Only old mower in front--mulched and bag mowed leaves at same time...perpendicular to street, avoiding the normal areas prone to scalping and using the top setting along the edges.

Blew upper back off.

Hoping to finish tomorrow morning before rain:
Trim/Mowing, winterize more areas, take photos, plant plugs, swap out flags for stakes on the pots, pull up more Triv, wash mowers and spreader/drain and take in hose/shut off water.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, although I avoided and/or scalped a couple of uneven areas or edges, I will say there is something special about cutting in the 2-inch range. All that leaf matter I had been mulching the past week or two gets cut up into fine pieces, as it should, and excess leaf material is removed from the grass. I try to do the last mow or two at this HOC so I'm going into Winter only with what's necessary and not extra. The gator blade on the old mower is really good at mulching, but the Toro mower with the standard blade produces more suction, which can also be useful out in the low-input area. I had too many leaves to mulch and had to bag and dump some. Not that there were a lot, but I've reached the limit for leaf mulching, as the stuff from the past week or two still needs to break down and I don't want to pile more on. Other years I pushed past that limit, creating bunch of stuff that didn't decompose fully until May, and regretted it later. I remember last January, raking some of it out and realizing I had mulched in too much. I couldn't see the grass anymore in some spots...just chopped leaves. That was bad. Of course, there were also a lot of leaves last year. More than average.


----------



## Chris LI

^+1
Are you reading my mind?

You summed it up, pretty much verbatim, as Iwould have stated. I drop to 2" for the same reason and bag the last mow/mulching to get up excess leaves that may smother any grass or block seed to soil contact for my dormant seed, if they don't break down in time. With moderate temperatures and rain predicted this week, hopefully it will help speed the decomposition process. The 2" HOC also helps reduce matting and will allow more light to hit the soil for soil warming in the spring.

Anything that I bag goes in the garden in different piles by particle size, so I can place the smallest on the bottom, after I break down the vegetable garden. The last couple of years I didn't get to do it until late winter/early spring due to snow.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Anything that I bag goes in the garden in different piles by particle size, so I can place the smallest on the bottom, after I break down the vegetable garden. The last couple of years I didn't get to do it until late winter/early spring due to snow.


Wow, quite a system.

I wanted to use the leaves in the low-input area like I did the last few times, but it was already getting dark, and there was/is no time with the rain tomorrow and then cooler temps following later in the week (and potentially snow...lots to get ready for and so little time). I had saved some leaves the other day, too, but ended up dumping them all into the natural area. I'm hoping the rain holds off so I can finish in the morning.

I actually bag mowed at 3.75 inches where the leaves were denser (and the edges to avoid scalping), and then went down to the 2-inch range and mulch mowed (several passes in some places with slightly longer grass, like the low-input area).

I still walk around with a rake or just my hand, and free up areas with too much leaf mulch.


----------



## Chris LI

I don't go nuts with the piles...just 2-3 different sizes; sucked up/bagged, lightly chopped/bagged, and minced/bagged.

I've occasionally used the backpack blower to redistribute exceptionally thick residual leaf mulch across the lawn.

Do either of your mowers have the capability to side discharge?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Do either of your mowers have the capability to side discharge?


Both do. I use it Spring through early Fall when the grass gets too long, in order to prevent clumps.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> Chris LI said:
> 
> 
> 
> Do either of your mowers have the capability to side discharge?
> 
> 
> 
> Both do. I use it Spring through early Fall when the grass gets too long, in order to prevent clumps.
Click to expand...

I think I might try that, too. I like to side discharge leaves with the Gator. I think that combo works really well to pulverize the leaves and blow through large piles without the mower stalling. The turbulence from the Gator keeps the leaves under the deck a smidge longer to get chopped a little more, 
before it discharges them (I think). When I mulch with the plug, a few always seem to get away, but not when side discharging.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> When I mulch with the plug, a few always seem to get away, but not when side discharging.


Interesting. The exact behavior may come down to the specific mower. Both of mine have some blow out that side even when it's covered entirely. I think it's due to the direction the blade rotates; it just blows some leaves out from underneath. A bit annoying, but I assume all mowers do it.


----------



## Green

Today:

-Finished mowing. Mowed the lower back and the side down to the 2-inch range, double mowing part of the back and the whole upper side. There were a lot of clippings, because the grass was over 3 inches. Fairly messy, some clippings on the lawn, and my allergies are feeling it now. There's a huge difference between the 3.25 inch setting and the 2.x setting (which I measured at 2.6 with the gator blade, but a lot of areas get cut lower due to unevenness in the ground).

This was the last scheduled mow for the year. (I'll mow once more in the front only if it grows enough to warrant it and is warm enough, but we'll see. The back is basically done.) I had to leave it at the 3.25 inch setting for the last two up-and-down-the hill strips along my neighbor's side, as the grade got higher as I went over toward that side. Lost a good bit of color in the process of cutting.

-Winterized (last fertilizer drop of the year) the lower back/lower side and the rest of the low-input area. I put down 10 lbs of Green Max 27-0-2 on approx. 5,000 square feet in the low-input area. And I measured the lower side (roughly from the patio level) and got approx. 0.54K area. So, I put 3.25 lbs down there (1.7K lower back/lower side). 0.5 lb/M Nitrogen rate.

The upper side and the front are not ready yet, but I'm not certain when I'll be doing it because the weather is up in the air as of now.

Speaking of weather, it was supposed to rain in the late afternoon/evening (70% chance). It then changed to 0% at around 3PM. Then back to 30%. We got a few minutes of rain at around 4PM, and then about another minute of rain around 7PM, but I don't think that's enough to water it in. Next precip. chance is Sunday, and it's supposed to be windy the next couple of days. Volatilization?

About 2-3 hours before the first brief shower, I sprayed FAS on the front again (first time for most of the side front this year). I targeted the 1oz rate on the main front again (2.5oz FS and 2oz AMS; applied parallel the driveway this time, following the mower tracks). And 2oz rate on the side front (3.5 oz FS and 3.5oz AMS). Added a little NIS this time. Hopefully that will start showing results over the next day or so...the previous sprays plus the lower cut do seem to have removed a lot of the brown from the rust and helped green it up in some areas. If the front hill and hellstrips need one more app, I'll do it if the weather is conducive. Otherwise, I may do an app in April.

After growth fully stops, I plan to (on a warm, windless day) spray the biofungicide with a sticker/anti-transpirant. I want to see if it helps protect against desiccation and/or snow mold.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> -Winterized (last fertilizer drop of the year) the lower back/lower side and the rest of the low-input area. I put down 10 lbs of Green Max 27-0-2 on approx. 5,000 square feet in the low-input area.
> 
> Speaking of weather, it was supposed to rain in the late afternoon/evening (70% chance). It then changed to 0% at around 3PM. Then back to 30%. We got a few minutes of rain at around 4PM, and then about another minute of rain around 7PM, but I don't think that's enough to water it in. Next precip. chance is Sunday, and it's supposed to be windy the next couple of days. Volatilization?
> 
> About 2-3 hours before the first brief shower, I sprayed FAS on the front again (first time for most of the side front this year). I targeted the 1oz rate on the main front again (2.5oz FS and 2oz AMS; applied parallel the driveway this time, following the mower tracks). And 2oz rate on the side front (3.5 oz FS and 3.5oz AMS). Added a little NIS this time. Hopefully that will start showing results over the next day or so...the previous sprays plus the lower cut do seem to have removed a lot of the brown from the rust and helped green it up in some areas. If the front hill and hellstrips need one more app, I'll do it if the weather is conducive. Otherwise, I may do an app in April.


If I recall correctly, the Green Max is coated, so you shouldn't have volatization issues.

I'm curious how the turf will respond to the FAS this time of year, since it's part of a winterizer app. What's your air temp and do you have a ballpark on soil temp? Can you post pre-post photos?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> If I recall correctly, the Green Max is coated, so you shouldn't have volatization issues.
> 
> I'm curious how the turf will respond to the FAS this time of year, since it's part of a winterizer app. What's your air temp and do you have a ballpark on soil temp? Can you post pre-post photos?


It's not coated. It's 19.6% AMS and Urea. 7.4% Methyleneureas. Thankfully volatilization is low this time of year...but it started breaking down last night and was windy today.

I don't have any before photos for the FAS. I did a split app last week and this week. And I did a couple of AMS spray apps on a couple areas earlier this month. Seems like the first couple of apps already show major effects. The first FAS app from last week also showed some effects. Air temps have been between 36 and 56 for highs, and 20s to 40s at night.

Tomorrow I need to get the latest batch of leaves up, finish putting down winterizer, etc. Could be under snow for a week after Sunday.


----------



## Chris LI

Wow! I didn't realize it had so much WSN...maybe a little hose dragging to wet it down a little would be some insurance.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Wow! I didn't realize it had so much WSN...maybe a little hose dragging to wet it down a little would be some insurance.


Nah. I'll just let it sit until Sunday. There are still prills there. Not perfect. That's real life. The test areas, on the other hand, were watered in a long time ago (via rain). Could always add a slight bit more fert tomorrow in those areas I'm concerned about. Maybe I'll do that.

Soil is actually pretty damp. I plan to wash out the mower after I finish with the leaf pickup tomorrow, and then take in the hose. I'll change the oil someday in December on a warm day if I get to it, but I'll run both mowers out of gas tomorrow. Then refill later on if I change the oil.


----------



## Green

Got 0.04 inch of rain yesterday evening/night.

My cousin in RI said he did his Winterizing app last week, and mowed for the last time yestersay.

Happy Thanksgiving to everyone.


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## Green

@Chris LI, based on a chart from Montana State, after 4 days at 40 degrees with 0.05 inch of irrigation, it appears I might have lost 33% of the N. So I guess I'll add a little more to compensate. It also appears that 0 inch of rain results in more volatilization than 0.05 inch of rain, opposite of what I expected. I thought there might be a cumulative threshold and early reversal effect, but I guess not.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> @Chris LI, based on a chart from Montana State, after 4 days at 40 degrees with 0.05 inch of irrigation, it appears I might have lost 33% of the N. So I guess I'll add a little more to compensate. It also appears that 0 inch of rain results in more volatilization than 0.05 inch of rain, opposite of what I expected. I thought there might be a cumulative threshold and early reversal effect, but I guess not.


Interesting. Thanks for the info.


----------



## Green

Today:

Put down a bit more of the Green Max winterizer fertilizer to compensate for losses from volatilization over the 4 days from Wed. to Sun. Added 1 lb on the lower back/lower side going parallel to the low-input area, and added 3 lbs on much of the low-input area going the same direction.

I swept, raked, blew, and picked up more leaves and picked up sticks. Thankfully the amount of leaves has been decreasing. Also, since there is a Winter storm coming Sunday, everyone was out today doing the same. Even that one neighbor's house that has essentially never picked up their leaves all these years (and they always blow everywhere), actually picked up most of their leaves today. That helps immensely. I helped my next door neighbor by blowing the property edge before he got to my side with the mower.

I used the bag for almost all the mowing today. Mowed the front hill 3x, first to collect leaves at the 3.25-inch setting, and then lowered back down to the 2-inch range and mulch-mowed the grass diagonally, and then parallel to the driveway to shorten it down. Also used the bag and 3.25-inch setting to pick up leaves on the rest of the side front. Did the same on the main front, but went perpendicular to the street. Got quite a bit of clippings; most were probably leftovers from when I mulch mowed the other day. It was nice to clean everything up. I also shortened the garage, deck, and stair areas of the upper back using the 2.6-inch setting with the bag.

Also trimmed with the string trimmer in the back, on the side, and in the front, but not too short, because it helps to keep leaves where they belong. Got leaves out of some of the mulched areas as well.

Blew off the leaves from the upper back.

Rinsed the spreader and the old mower out. I will be using the spreader again tomorrow, but it was filthy as I hadn't cleaned it in months. Ran both mowers out of gas for the season. Not sure if I still need to shut off the fuel supply on the Honda engine or not. Brought in the hose, and once again turned off the water faucets.

Also, finally emptied the cups with the soap and gypsy moth egg scrapings, lol. They'd been sitting in the shed since like April.

Was outside finishing up until it got down to 34F.


----------



## Green

Tomorrow, I hope to do the following:

-Get gas

-Put down fertilizer on front and upper side and blow overshoot off of driveway/sidewalk/street
-Take pics
-Take soil temps
-Put in stakes for snowblower/shoveling/plow
-Topdress sprinkler head in main front that's elevated a bit and in danger of getting clipped
-Remove clips from spray head
-Remove sign and hand trim near it

Misc:
-Check for nails
-Spread and/or move rest of mulch

If warm enough:
-Rinse sprayer
-Pull rest of Triv patches that are marked
-Plant plugs, including grass pots
-Blow leaves in low input area
-Replace flags with wood stakes in test area
-Move supplies out of garage and into shed/basement
-Clean Milorganite out of wheel barrow

And that will be it for grass stuff, until the coming snow melts. After that, it'll likely just be cleaning up leaves with a blower and rake every now and then between now and January 1st or so for the most part, when it's warm/dry enough outside and conducive. Eventually, I may do an app of biofungicide/antitranspirant/sticker, and will be dormant seeding at some point, but likely not until late Winter at the earliest, due to voles. Maybe also an app of a natural vole repellent this year.


----------



## Green

Put down the winterizer fertilizer on the front and upper side at 0.55 lb N rate. 1.75 lbs of Green Max on the upper side, 5 lbs on the main front, and 3.5 lbs on the side front/hellstrip areas. I went slightly lower on the middle side overseed area which was still green and didn't look hardened off entirely (that was where I dropped extra Carbon-X a while back). I'm all done with fertilizer now.

Next door neighbor put down his fertilizer today too, but didn't have time to blow the sidewalk, so I did the whole span. He used the one with Potassium, and put it down heavy, like probably 1.6 lb N rate. We'll see if his yard gets more snow mold.

Neighbor across from home mowed for the last time today.

Pulled up more Triv.

Dug up a patch of PR in my TTTF/KBG back lawn in front of the shed. Not sure how that got there. Saw a worm underneath. Used the grass as plugs in the front. Did not get to plant the rest of the plugs yet, though.

Put up stakes near sprinkler heads (for snowblowing).

Moved 4 bags of mulch, a bag of peat, and a hose out of the garage. Got gas. Started up snowblower and ran for 5 min.

Soil temps were mostly 40 in front and side. Front hill was 45, as expected. Upper back ground is now somewhat frozen, and registered 33F where I could get the thermometer in.

Didn't get to work on low input area, but took photos of the plots.


----------



## Green

Got snow and ice yesterday, last night, and into this morning, totaling about 4 inches.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI, not to overload you with questions in the near-term...

But also when you have the chance can you go over how you do the "drill and fill", from drill bit and technique to spacing and depth, material, etc.? Hoping to maybe get a Black and Decker Matrix switchable cordless drill/impact driver for Christmas, and figure it'd be a great tool for that purpose, in addition to mixing spray solutions. It even takes the same battery as the backpack sprayer, so I would be able to literally pull the battery off the drill after mixing, and put it on the sprayer and go spray. How cool would that be?

https://www.blackanddecker.com/products/power-tools/portable-power-tools/drills/matrix-20v-max-lithium-drilldriver/bdcdmt120

Thanks!


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> @Chris LI, not to overload you with questions in the near-term...
> 
> But also when you have the chance can you go over how you do the "drill and fill", from drill bit and technique to spacing and depth, material, etc.? Hoping to maybe get a Black and Decker Matrix switchable cordless drill/impact driver for Christmas, and figure it'd be a great tool for that purpose, in addition to mixing spray solutions. It even takes the same battery as the backpack sprayer, so I would be able to literally pull the battery off the drill after mixing, and put it on the sprayer and go spray. How cool would that be?
> 
> https://www.blackanddecker.com/products/power-tools/portable-power-tools/drills/matrix-20v-max-lithium-drilldriver/bdcdmt120
> 
> Thanks!


Sure, no problem. The drill and fill explanation is quick, so I'll briefly describe it. I used a long masonry bit in my cordless drill. I think it was 3/4" x 13". Drier soil is better, but moist soil is ok. I used bagged mason sand that I dried out in an aluminum pan (in my boiler room)and used a large funnel to drop it in the hole and used the bit to lightly tamp it in.  When I get a chance, I'll check out the link above and get you that info on the Zamboni pattern.


----------



## Green

The snow melted in a small area on the front hill, and from what little bit I can see, it looks like all those recent N sprays over the past month have helped out with the disease recovery. The grass looks fairly green going into Winter...a lot better than it would have been if I hadn't done those sprays and hadn't kept mowing after doing them. It was so brown before.


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## Green

Last week's Winterizer fertilizer app is finally getting watered in fully today, as the snow melts and it rains. At least with the snow cover, there was no volatilization to deal with. Low input area is flooded. Hoping that soaks in before it freezes. Forgot to put my grass pots outside yesterday to get sun. Hoping to plant them next week.


----------



## M32075

Green said:


> Last week's Winterizer fertilizer app is finally getting watered in fully today, as the snow melts and it rains. At least with the snow cover, there was no volatilization to deal with. Low input area is flooded. Hoping that soaks in before it freezes. Forgot to put my grass pots outside yesterday to get sun. Hoping to plant them next week.


I put mine down Sunday with over a 2 inch rain on Monday with more to come. Do you think it was to much rain for it to work?


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## Green

M32075 said:


> I put mine down Sunday with over a 2 inch rain on Monday with more to come. Do you think it was to much rain for it to work?


Depends on how quickly the first half inch to inch came down, and whether it caused runoff. But you used a high rate of fertilizer and aren't on a slope from what I saw, so I doubt it all washed away or leached even if some might have. You should be fine, unless you get another 2 inches in the next week.


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## Green

Got 1.6 inches of rain the past two days, which combined with melting (liquifying and sublimating) snow. (There is now none left.) So, there's flooding in the low input area, and it's going to freeze as it gets cold. The past two days were in the 50s, even over night, but it's back into the 30s (and 20s at night) going forward. Soil temps were mostly around 42F tonight.

I think it's safe to say the winterizing fertilizer on the back, rest of low input area, side, and front, is now fully watered in.


----------



## Green

Got about 2.5 inches of snow two nights ago, so we're covered again. Looks like a very short window for cleaning up leaves before the next snow. Unfortunately, it will be windy on the one nice day that's likely after this melts, which is going to be Sunday. That night, the next snow storm is coming.


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## Green

The snow is gone, but replaced by flooding. Lovely...


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> The snow is gone, but replaced by flooding. Lovely...


How many inches of rain did you get?


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> The snow is gone, but replaced by flooding. Lovely...
> 
> 
> 
> How many inches of rain did you get?
Click to expand...

Just checked. 2.32 inches of rain. Grass will get some air and a day or two of much needed (possibly cloudy) sunlight, before being covered up again...

I won't be able to spray the antitranspirant/biofungicide/extender/spreader/sticker, due to wind. Just cleaning up leaves/branches tomorrow morning is going to be a challenge. Still hoping I can do the application at some point in late Dec. or early Jan., though, during a warmup. Really want to try it.


----------



## Green

Raked/blew/picked up leaves, twigs, and a few sticks. Not easy in intermittent 18 mph wind with gusts up to 25 or 30, but got it done to avoid the snow piling up on top of leaves. Got one whole leaf bag full from the front and back. Took out flags on the test plots, and put in wood stakes, but it was very soggy back there...I was able to push some of the stakes in without the hammer.

Flood prone area still flooded; will ice over.


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## Green

Here comes (astronomical) Winter...
and now sunset times will once again start creeping later in my area.

But I tell you, this past late Fall was a cold one...it might as well have been Winter already for the past month. Lots and lots of days with highs in the 30s already.

I still want to do my final spray application/experiment to put the lawn to bed for the year. And I have my grass pots still, which are frozen solid for now...if the coming warm temps (40s this weekend and early next week) don't thaw everything enough to dig, I might use warm water to achieve it, so I can transplant these.

3 months to go until I can actually work on totally unfrozen ground and mow...


----------



## Green

Sprayed Serenade biofungicide with Nu-Film 17 on all main lawn areas and used the leftover on the low input area. Not sure if this combo will do much to prevent snow mold or desiccation, but I wanted to try it.


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## JDgreen18

Hey Green how goes it. Even tho its been a colder December my grass is holding its green much better than it did last year. You notice this? Im thinking maybe a couple things one my lawn is more mature being its second winter and 2 using the spoon feeding plus the iron I applied throughout the year.


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Hey Green how goes it. Even tho its been a colder December my grass is holding its green much better than it did last year. You notice this? Im thinking maybe a couple things one my lawn is more mature being its second winter and 2 using the spoon feeding plus the iron I applied throughout the year.


Hey! I'm not noticing good color the past month and a half or so. I think your spoonfeeding apps are probably the reason it held better for you. But I had rust. And I tried to spray it out with N. It helped, but it still browned out more than it should have. So that situation didn't help the color. I did a comparison of different areas in another thread, of various lawns and areas, and color is holding better in areas that got spoonfeedings, late fertilizer apps, etc. It's a lot more complicated than that, but that's the rough trend I'm seeing. Any areas I did spoonfeed or where put down a very high rate of Carbon-X back in the early Fall (not many areas) have good color. So does an areas I winterized before it stopped growing 100%. I think new grass is also more responsive to N, and so holds color better under those conditions. I'm starting to wonder if a 4-6 week mid Fall pause is really a good idea or not. I'm thinking it should be more like 4 weeks and not 6 based on what I see.

I had a few years in the beginning when I first started, with really good Winter color, but the past few have not been as good.


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## Green

@Chris LI, I'm really thinking of doing some hardcore testing of "late winter" fertilizing this year to see if I can mimic a late fall winterizer response. I have a test plot I can do this on, and I also have a family member's lawn. (We lost a family member this past week, and I'm trying to think about positive things.) If I can time it for when we hit soil temps of like 35F so as not to interfere with greenup and not cause surge growth, I'll apply 0.25 lb of soluble N and see what happens. I'm guessing more robust greenup, similar to the late Fall/winterizer app. It should have like a month or so to do its thing before green-up if we have a normal Spring.


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## Green

Today, I did some blowing and raking of stray leaves in the low-input area, near the lower back as well as near the test plots. The ground is partly frozen; it makes cracking noise in some areas when you walk. The area is almost dried out now, just in time for the next rain, so there was a very short window to get the leaves up. Also noticed in some areas there are grass clippings in mulch beds. I guess maybe from animals eating the grass.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> @Chris LI, I'm really thinking of doing some hardcore testing of "late winter" fertilizing this year to see if I can mimic a late fall winterizer response. I have a test plot I can do this on, and I also have a family member's lawn. (We lost a family member this past week, and I'm trying to think about positive things.) If I can time it for when we hit soil temps of like 35F so as not to interfere with greenup and not cause surge growth, I'll apply 0.25 lb of soluble N and see what happens. I'm guessing more robust greenup, similar to the late Fall/winterizer app. It should have like a month or so to do its thing before green-up if we have a normal Spring.


Sounds interesting...what form of N were you thinking of using (urea, AS, other)?


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## Green

@Chris LI, either one, or a blend. I doubt it would matter much.


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## Green

Got 1.56 inches of rain yesterday. Grass looks like it may have grown slightly in the past month, as expected. Happy 2020.


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## Green

Got 0.27 inch of rain yesterday/last night/this morning.

Probably 8-10 weeks until we mow again here. Lawns in the area are in good shape overall, probably due to sufficient rain in most of 2019; I think this coming Spring is going to be a heavy seedhead year because of it.

Second half of January and most of Feb. might be colder than average and very snowy, but I still think there is a good chance for an early start to Spring.


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## Green

Blew and/or raked up leaves almost everywhere (except the side and lower back). Got one leaf bag, loosely filled, from about 8-9K area.


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## Green

A number of warmer than average days and even some nights (like tonight only going down to 44) over the past couple of weeks. And more to come over the next week as well. Cold Winter weather is currently on hold. Going to take advantage of it and do a few things in the yard.

At least the grass isn't growing. At least not in any noticeable way week-to-week.


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## Green

@mowww, I noticed you list MyHolidayLawn KBG as your grass type. Did you do a renovation? I haven't tried it yet, but do plan to do a small renovation section this Spring. I actually need to buy more seed in March, as I only have about a pound or two of fresh seed for 1,000 square feet, and I know I'll need extra, since I always do with these projects.

Some people have badmouthed this variety without trying it, saying that it couldn't possibly be KBG. But I researched it, and it definitely is...it's not Poa Triv, annua, supina, alpina, compressa, or any sort of hybrid of two species. Jacklin says it's Kentucky Bluegrass and the selection process was long, nonlinear, and arduous. They almost gave up on it.


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## mowww

@Green We're building a new home and once things warm up that's what we'll install. I have been impressed with it at field trials. Doubling my lawn size but I still want to enjoy the mow and not make it a chore.


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## Green

mowww said:


> @Green We're building a new home and once things warm up that's what we'll install. I have been impressed with it at field trials. Doubling my lawn size but I still want to enjoy the mow and not make it a chore.


Very cool, and good luck. Any idea when you'll be seeding? I'm guessing in the Spring??

And did you get to see field trials in person? If so, how did it look?


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## mowww

@Green hopefully June if all goes as planned. The plots at UW-Madison looked great. Weeds are awfully easy to spot and pull.


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## Green

mowww said:


> @Green hopefully June if all goes as planned. The plots at UW-Madison looked great. Weeds are awfully easy to spot and pull.


Cool. So are planning to do 2 lbs per thousand?


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## mowww

Green said:


> mowww said:
> 
> 
> 
> @Green hopefully June if all goes as planned. The plots at UW-Madison looked great. Weeds are awfully easy to spot and pull.
> 
> 
> 
> Cool. So are planning to do 2 lbs per thousand?
Click to expand...

@Green, yes that is the current plan. Maybe a touch heavier if I can.


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## Green

Went up to 64F today, and only dropping to like 57 tonight. Soil temps were right around 40F in the front. Did not bother in the back, since the ground is likely solid.

My neighbor's was a degree or two higher.

My family member's lawn in coastal CT was in the low 40s.

Standard 4 inch or so depth.

It hit 68 today at the airport.


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## Powhatan

Yep, got up to air temp 74F and soil 51F yesterday with rain showers last night, it's 68F already this morning as I write this. Looks like we're temp tracking higher than last year, we'll probably have a bumper crop of ticks this year.


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## Green

Got 0.2 inch of rain last night. And now the flood prone area is ponding again as the ground can't take anymore water.

One more really warm day today...then we are likely done until late Feb to mid March. 68 right now. Tomorrow I plan to do a final leaf cleanup and plant my grass from the pots, finally.

@Powhatan, I hope not. We have already had some intense cold here this year, and no doubt there's another 6 or so weeks of it potentially. So hopefully that kills a lot of ticks. We were cold in December a lot of the time the Midwest and mid Atlantic was warm. I did see some insects today.

The daffodil stems are just starting to poke up, but I think they will be just fine over the next two months.

Soil temps in many areas were up to mid 40s today. Air temp hit 67 or 68.

Edit: it hit 70 at Windsor Locks. I believe this was a record high not only for this date, but for January overall.


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## Green

Picked up more leaves this evening. Less and less each time. I think I'm pretty much done for about 5-7 weeks, but we'll see. Still a couple more things to do this week.


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## Green

Picked up more leaves. And finally planted the grass from my pots in the ground today. Normally, that would be a no-go in mid January, but this year is different.

It's been a month and a half since I mowed and applied the Winterizing fertilizer. So glad I applied it. No fertilizer since mid October in a year like this would not have been pretty...I think the areas I didn't winterize as part of my test are going to be starving by early Spring.

I'm not seeing any obvious adverse effects from the anti-transpirant application.


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## Green

Got 0.15 inch of rain at night.

Very windy, so more leaves blew everywhere.

Went to grandfather's and charged the tractor battery for 70 min, started it (not easy starting), and ran if for 5 min. Added stabilizer to the gas. Started fixing area along driveway that someone tore up while plowing. Collected the loose sod pieces and brought them to an area in the back that I prepped, as it started snowing. Will fix entirely in April.


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## Green

Pre-M and overseeding plan for Spring 2020:

Seeding:

-Dormant overseed portion of main front near utility boxes using Rowdy TTTF seed at 6 lbs/M rate. Keep area mowed low, and apply PGR prior to germination. Overseed or reseed any other spots that need it.

-Overseed side front from marker to back of garage with Rowdy TTTF at 4 lbs/M in denser areas, and higher rate as needed in thinner areas. Do this immediately following 2 Tenacity apps 2 weeks apart to thin out Fine Fescue from the area. Apply PGR prior to germination.

-Dormant overseed upper back from garage to deck with Bullseye TTTF at 4 lbs/M. Reseed bare spot(s) behind deck with blend of Bullseye and Firecracker SLS. Apply PGR prior to germination on entire upper back.

-Dormant overseed lowest part of side using Rowdy TTTF at whatever rate needed for good coverage.

-Dormant overseed Hard Fescue at end of low-input area under pine tree. Add soil if needed.

-Spot Seed or plug hellstrip area and level bumps (main front near sidewalk needs leveling, too).

-Rest of low input area: seed bare spots with Northern mix. Seed flood-prone area reno with MyHolidayLawn KBG in early May.

Pre/post herbicides:

-Glyphosate 3x on flood-prone area prior to topdress/leveling/digging drainage trench/drill and fill with mason sand mixed with a bit of compost.

-Glyphosate 3x on any particularly bad Poa Triv spots anywhere.

-Tenacity blanket on main front once, followed within 4 weeks by Dimension. Gallery around edges.

-Spot spray Tenacity on any suspected Bentgrass or Poa on side front; Dimension or Prodiamine everywhere except where seeding (or delay it). Gallery on all edges.
--Tenacity on seeded area(s).

Tenacity 3x (rates to be determined) on side slope of side front to reduce Fine Fescue (did this last year, too).

-Tenacity blanket on back and side; follow with Dimension within 4 weeks on non-seeded areas (or repeat Tenacity on seeded areas). Gallery on edges at least, if not entire side.

-Prodiamine or Pendi (depending which I can get) on non-seeded areas in low-input area, (in a split app with Dimension if using Pendi...was reading that that strategy is effective with stacking 2 AIs in the split if certain rates are utilized). Still hoping to find some Prodiamine 0-0-7 as it's supposed to be the best of the DNAs (and Dimension) on Spurge. Gallery on all edges. Spot spray or blanket spray Tenacity on seeded areas.


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## Green

Got 1.6 inches of rain yesterday, and much of the snow coating from earlier in the week has melted. As such, with all the rain and melting snow, the low input area has ponding (soon to be a pond/skating rink mixture most likely).

Still mostly above average in temps...46 yesterday. 44 projected for today, and then slowly decreasing low 40s and high to mid 30s with fluctuations over the next week and into the start of Feb. The last week of Jan. and first week of Feb. are typically the coldest (and snowiest) time of the year and 35 degrees is the average high, but it looks like higher temps will hold through much of that period.

So glad I put down the late-season fertilizer app on 11/30/19...the soil has been unfrozen quite often through the first 1/3 of this Winter, and the grass greened up nicely a bit during some periods over this time. It seems to have fully recovered from the Rust disease as well, once the temps were too low for continued Rust fungal activity. Perhaps my N apps and biofungicide app helped as well.

Had I omitted the late app, my last fert (mid or late Oct. for many lawn areas) would have run out a long time before. I'm still researching timings and fert types and formulating potential alternatives to the late app for future use due to all the recent research on that subject (and observations of other lawns with different fert timings and potentially the results of my Winterizing experiment, too).


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## Chris LI

Definitely a weird year. I think my turf might run out of carb reserves, due to the mild temperatures and no winterizer app. We peaked at 50* today. Time will only tell. Thanks for the update.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Definitely a weird year. I think my turf might run out of carb reserves, due to the mild temperatures and no winterizer app. We peaked at 50* today. Time will only tell. Thanks for the update.


What a great year for the winterizing experiment I set up last Fall. It will really put it to the test with the warmer weather and tendency to run out of resources faster. Some years, with quicker induction and longer-lasting dormancy, it might not require as much reserve.

I fully expect to mow sometime between 24 Feb. and 24 March this year to get rid of dead growth...at the same HOC I last mowed at on 30 Nov.


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## Green

Raked up a few stray leaves. I think it got over 50 today. Uncommon in the middle of Winter.


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## Green

Planted a few grass plugs. Soil temps were around 40 (front) and 33 (back) at 5PM. Grass is now fully dormant; essentially no growth at all. About time.

But the root growth apparently continues...


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## Green

Got 0.9 inch of rain the last two days, most of it today I think. Flooded again.

It's been cloudy a lot, and the grass looks like it's starting to rot or something with all the moisture. Really need some sun to dry it out.

Snow flurries, high gusty wind, and leaves and branches everywhere at the moment.


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## Green

Note to self about Screamin Green slow release percentage:

After reading that up to 35% of prills in SCU may act similarly to fast release N, I calculated that at worst, Screamin Green may act as a ~40% slow release fertilizer instead of a 60% slow release as mentioned on the label. This is important for anyone applying more than 1.0 lb total N at one time. I will calculate the adjusted percentages before each application.

This only applies to SCU, and may not apply to all SCU. It does not apply to PCSCU. This has nothing to do with prills being damaged by mowing...that's a whole other thing that I'm not going to think about.


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## Green

Tentative new high-efficiency fertilizer plan for 2020:

-April: 0-0-7 pre-M; grub prevention
-Late May/early June: organic N at 0.75 lb N rate
-Mid Aug: organic N at 0.50 lb N rate
-Mid/late Sept: Screamin Green (or C-X plus Milo) at 1.25 lb N rate
-Mid/late Oct: Urea/AMS/Methylene Urea/Nitroform at 0.75 lb N rate* (0.25 lb N from ureaform)

*If winterizing experiment pans out well, discontinue final late season winterizing app, and use the October app instead.


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## Powhatan

Did you source the Screamin Green from a local SiteOne? My SiteOne is selling the 50 lb bag for $27.00. I created a homeowner account last year but haven't bought anything yet.


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## Green

Powhatan said:


> Did you source the Screamin Green from a local SiteOne? My SiteOne is selling the 50 lb bag for $27.00. I created a homeowner account last year but haven't bought anything yet.


Damn! That's a lot less $ than up here. I don't get why there should be a discrepancy. I think it's like $10 higher here. Only thing I can think of, is we are further from the company that markets it than you are. Maybe it's transportation cost.

About 5 years ago, I got my original bags for like $25 each, but that was not at SiteOne. It was at a random place, might have well been a flea market (it wasn't, but was just as weird a place to find it...I guess someone was trying to get rid of an extra pallet).

Tell me about this homeowner account...is it a charge account, or something else? My manager did not suggest there was such a thing when I mentioned accounts...he just mentioned charge accounts (which I assume mostly pros use due to volume purchases).

Another interesting tidbit: the amount of biosolid in each bag is just under 50%. You can even tell by eye., before verifying on the label. So it's similar to 40% of a bag of Milorganite per bag of SG. But rumor has it, it's the NJ variety, not the Milwaukee one. They also use dust inhibitors (something I wish Carbon Earth used...I wonder if they are in the newer formulas).

Check out this new Lebanon clone as well for more percentage info: Eco-blend 16-2-3 50% Mesa 40% Biosolids 1% Fe:
https://www.lebanonturf.com/products/2218611
Still doesn't look like as complete a formula, though. But they do itemize the 40% biosolids separately unlike SG (which lumps it with the manure in the analysis). And the Lebanon version uses MESA instead of SCU. And SG has SOP instead of MOP.


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## Green

Today, no wind and it was above freezing too (as has been typical this Winter). So, I took advantage of it and picked up the leaves and branches in the front that came down/blew over from the storm the other day.


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## Powhatan

Green said:


> Tell me about this homeowner account...is it a charge account, or something else? My manager did not suggest there was such a thing when I mentioned accounts...he just mentioned charge accounts (which I assume mostly pros use due to volume purchases).


On the SiteOne request account page the choices are "Contractor" or "Homeowner/Retail Customer". I requested the homeowner, my request had to be reviewed for approval (the request didn't ask for my financials), and about two days later I received an approval email with login instructions. After I login, I see the product prices, and filter select for what's available at my local SiteOne location.

I'm not 100% sure on the remaining purchase procedure since I haven't bought yet. My online account info shows nothing about having store credit so presuming I purchase using my CC: Select what date morning/afternoon pickup timeframe I want, then go pick up item(s) on the requested date at the SiteOne location, pay with my CC.

Several help videos here: https://www.siteone.com/en/help


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## Green

Got 0.52 inch of rain over the past couple of days.


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## Green

Got 0.82 inch of rain last night and today (liquid equivalent from rain and snow/slush).

Tomorrow and the following day are supposed to be quite cold, with highs likely below 30F, windy, and night-time temps likely going into the single digits at least one of those days (that hasn't happened much or at all this season yet).

@Powhatan, thanks for the info. I'll look into it.


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## Green

Just a quick update. Things look good overall. Dormant but good. Soil temps are cold...back is frozen solid, and other areas are mostly 33F. I definitely will not be mowing for the first time within the next week! Most likely the first cleanup raking and mow will be after March 1st rather than before. The grass blades are desiccating out anyway, so no need to mow anytime soon. Cold is good. It helps get rid of some of the upper soil moisture.


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## Green

So, despite the cold soil temps, I've started seeing more insects this past week, as it's been in the mid to high 40s and even into the 50s during the day, which 5-10 degrees above normal. Still pretty weird considering it was really cold a couple of days ago. But the same happened around this time last year.

Today, I decided to dormant seed the near (shaded) end of my low input area. Growing grass there is tough. There was a lot of moss, and the ground was partly frozen. Yet, when I raked (and I didn't rake too intensely) most of the grass just came out along with the moss, so it's bare dirt essentially now...

After raking, I threw out seed by hand. Mostly the Jetty Hard Fescue, which I'm excited to try as it might actually grow under the trees. I added in a little Chantilly CRF in some areas. Hoping the seeds stay put until germination time (at least 4 weeks, probably more like 6-8).


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## Green

Two days ago: got 0.07 inch of rain.


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## Powhatan

Screamin Green price went up $2 a bag to $29, so went ahead and purchased 3 bags for the season from SiteOne. A sales clerk wanted to know if I needed preM to kill the poa trivialias that's sprouting from rhizomes, I said no thanks. If it was only that simple.


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## Green

Powhatan said:


> Screamin Green price went up $2 a bag to $29, so went ahead and purchased 3 bags for the season from SiteOne. A sales clerk wanted to know if I needed preM to kill the poa trivialias that's sprouting from rhizomes, I said no thanks. If it was only that simple.


Still considerably less expensive than here, I'm pretty sure.


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## Green

Today:

Tried to pull out some Triv, but it didn't go too well...the ground is still very cold and it makes what's usually easy a struggle.

Raked about 1/3 of the upper back, from deck edge to back garage wall (about 0.3K). I noticed last Fall it was thinning out, so after raking I dormant seeded 1 lb of Bullseye TTTF seed (3-3.6 lbs of seed per thousand).

Finished pruning a small tree in that area that had been severely damaged 2 Winters ago. Very tiring and awkward angle.

Measured my small folding pruning saw. The actual blade length with the cutting edge part is 8 inches, but the entire blade is longer. I'm not sure the correct way to measure. I need a replacement.

Also took delivery of the 50 lb bag of Pendimethalin I had ordered last week.


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## social port

Hey @Green! I noticed that you have some Pendimethalin. Are you using that this year instead of one of the usual suspects?


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## Chris LI

It's a shame Bullseye isn't available anymore. I guess you're really using it sparingly. Glad to hear you still have some left.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> It's a shame Bullseye isn't available anymore. I guess you're really using it sparingly. Glad to hear you still have some left.


Since the back lawn is only 5 cultivars, I only use one or more of those 5 when overseeding. And I prefer to use the TTTF, of which there are two, due to the shade. The Firecracker LS is already discontinued as straight seed for a while now. They replaced it with SLS, which I assume is a derivative, but I never found any confirming info on that from the AOSCA. I've been using it anyway as a substitute. Bullseye is very hard to get now. For anyone reading this who needs some, there is a chance the guys in TN still have a little when you read this, but they won't for long. I wanted to get more Bullseye into the lawn where it's thinning.

As far as the KBG, Bewitched is available easily. Rugby II wasn't grown last year. There is none currently available. I have a few ounces left, but it failed my germ test last Spring, so it may have been no good even last year. I used it anyway when I was reseeding. The America is available, but it may not have great weed filtering despite being 0/0. I have a bit and use it anyway.


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## Green

social port said:


> Hey @Green! I noticed that you have some Pendimethalin. Are you using that this year instead of one of the usual suspects?


How's it goin'?

I decided to use Pendi in some places this year instead of Dimension due to broadleaf weeds (not going to spray Gallery everywhere again, just the edges).

I also think it was time to switch up the mode of action at least in a few areas. I almost always use Dimension, so who knows what does over time.

By the way, interesting article on why pre-Ms fail: https://oregonstate.edu/dept/nursery-weeds/feature_articles/top_10/Top_10_reasons.html


----------



## social port

Green said:


> social port said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey @Green! I noticed that you have some Pendimethalin. Are you using that this year instead of one of the usual suspects?
> 
> 
> 
> How's it goin'?
> 
> I decided to use Pendi in some places this year instead of Dimension due to broadleaf weeds (not going to spray Gallery everywhere again, just the edges).
> 
> I also think it was time to switch up the mode of action at least in a few areas. I almost always use Dimension, so who knows what does over time.
> 
> By the way, interesting article on why pre-Ms fail: https://oregonstate.edu/dept/nursery-weeds/feature_articles/top_10/Top_10_reasons.html
Click to expand...

Doing great, Green. Getting ready to kick off another lawn season.

I also have a lot of broadleaf weeds coming through. I could have/should have used gallery last fall, but I never got around to it. I'm just going to dust off my bottle of triclopyr to take care of things.


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## Green

Almost 60 for the high today.

Fertilized all daffodils I could find in the front that have been coming up (but not the ones on the right hand side as they get lots of lawn fert already). Used a mix of Baystate, 0-0-50, and 4-4-4.

Took soil temp in the front toward the end of the day after the sun had a chance to warm things up, so it's probably a high. It was right at 40. So, if anything, the soil is a bit cooler than a few weeks ago, but overall about the same. Things are probably the most dormant they're going to get now, this week. No growth occurring.


----------



## uts

Green said:


> social port said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey @Green! I noticed that you have some Pendimethalin. Are you using that this year instead of one of the usual suspects?
> 
> 
> 
> How's it goin'?
> 
> I decided to use Pendi in some places this year instead of Dimension due to broadleaf weeds (not going to spray Gallery everywhere again, just the edges).
> 
> I also think it was time to switch up the mode of action at least in a few areas. I almost always use Dimension, so who knows what does over time.
> 
> By the way, interesting article on why pre-Ms fail: https://oregonstate.edu/dept/nursery-weeds/feature_articles/top_10/Top_10_reasons.html
Click to expand...

As always great resources. I have the same dilemma, so il throw a question, hopefully I'm not high jacking. I have a section which has very decent broad leaf pressure. Last fall I sprayed them down and it left a few bare spots. I am sure anlot more will come up today.

I have 2 options I guess

1. Put something like gallery down in that area along with the prodiamine. Was also thinking can I put down snapshot? That would help with just 1 product for the beds and this area as well?

2. Dormant seed, hope stuff starts growing and put down prodiamine later.

What do you think?


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## Green

@uts: if needed, dormant seed plus Tenacity tank mixed with Gallery right before germination. Second round of Tenacity after mowing if needed. Follow up with longer lasting pre-M a month later if there's crabgrass or Stiltgrass pressure, etc. If not, you could skip it.

This is the approach I use. It maintains a constant barrier as needed, but allows seeding.

Snapshot of course would only be usable on non-seeding areas, because you really need to have Gallery down by the beginning of May at the latest, and the trifluralin is of course a no-go when seeding. Domyown has a generic Snapshot that costs less. I think turf is technically off label use even though the active ingredients separately are not (companies are picky with their product registrations, so you know it's really the same thing).


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## Green

Total rain last night: almost 1.5 inches. Everything is totally saturated now. Grass/soil is starting to get uneven in spots as a result. There's also pooling again in the low input area.

I'd like to do a cleanup mow in the front no later than mid March if the temps cooperate, but if the wet conditions continue, it's going to be impossible to do it by then.


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## Utk03analyst

I've walked into site one to buy cyto-gro the guy at the counter looked up an account and just placed my order on another account and I paid for it at the counter. I later went online and set up an account ordered a fungicide forget which one and my order was ready at the counter and I paid for it when I arrived. The only thing I will say is my first purchase was at a 15% discount to what it would have been if I order it on my account and if you can wait you can usually find better prices online.


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## uts

Green said:


> @uts: if needed, dormant seed plus Tenacity tank mixed with Gallery right before germination. Second round of Tenacity after mowing if needed. Follow up with longer lasting pre-M a month later if there's crabgrass or Stiltgrass pressure, etc. If not, you could skip it.
> 
> This is the approach I use. It maintains a constant barrier as needed, but allows seeding.
> 
> Snapshot of course would only be usable on non-seeding areas, because you really need to have Gallery down by the beginning of May at the latest, and the trifluralin is of course a no-go when seeding. Domyown has a generic Snapshot that costs less. I think turf is technically off label use even though the active ingredients separately are not (companies are picky with their product registrations, so you know it's really the same thing).


Thank you for the reference to the generic link. A few dollars saved I guess. I'm going to order it soon so I can clean my beds and start putting it down. The weeks are flying by.

For the turf I think I might just go with some tenacity and put a generous seed down in a good area. I have some KBG from Hogan from a friend and il see how that germinates and go from there. Good sun and irrigation should help.


----------



## Green

Since it's the time of year when everything is dormant, I'm posting some stuff from when it was in green mode. Never-seen photos from 2019. These were from late September. It was after the lawn recovered from Summer stress and it had also gotten Carbon-X the week before. This was in the front. We really need photos like this right now. :mrgreen:


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> We really need photos like this right now. :mrgreen:


Yes, we do. Nice and green!@Green


----------



## Green

Mowed for the first time this year. It wasn't technically necessary, but it was warm and we're expecting rain tonight. I mowed most of the main front at 3.25 in, and the front hill at 2.6. No more than a half inch of dried stuff was removed. Some leaves were mulched in.

I raked and put down 3/4 lb of Bullseye TTTF seed on the upper back behind the deck and steps, and a bit directly to the right of the basement door in the lower back. Not a good day/time of year to rake that area. Nothing is well rooted yet, and felt like it was pulling up.

Also took down Christmas lights finally, and raked up leaves and sticks from the upper front hill bed, before the plants grow any more and I can't step in the bed.

By the way, cool article from the 1980s on Ryegrass: https://archive.lib.msu.edu/tic/wetrt/article/1984jul34.pdf
Reminds me of roughly where TTTF is at currently.


----------



## Green

Got about 0.06 inch of rain last night.

Took delivery of my shade tolerant TTTF seed from Hogan.

Forsythia are slightly yellow. Grass is starting to green up in a semi-serious way. Days still aren't quite sunny/long enough though, despite the warm temps.


----------



## Green

Dormant seeded with some Rowdy TTTF after raking on the shaded part of the main front. Just eyeballed both the size of the area and the amount of seed in the spreader. Maybe about 2 lbs of seed on, say, 0.25K area, so...maybe 6-8 lbs per thousand. It's probably a bit heavy, but I don't think it'll hurt anything since most of it won't take due to the existing grass in the area. The next 3 nights are all supposed to hit 32 or below, so I'm hoping the dormant seeding freeze/thaw cycles help bury the seed.


----------



## Green

Pruned a few branches on the hickory, and tried to decompact a few low spots that had gotten traffic in Winter 2018-19.


----------



## social port

Green, those photos from last fall look great :thumbup:


----------



## Green

According to weather channel, it hit 71 peak temp today.


----------



## Chris LI

What were you saying about my area lagging with spring temps? :lol: 
We did well, but only hit 62* today.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> What were you saying about my area lagging with spring temps? :lol:
> We did well, but only hit 62* today.


Lol, no! More implying you're not lagging in terms of greenup. Coastal, some days you'll be forecast cooler, others warmer. You are not lagging this year!

In other news, I have no idea what is going on with my roots in the shaded areas. They're gone. Grass could be pulled up like paper mache but I'm not going there.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green, those photos from last fall look great :thumbup:


Those were shot on 35mm film! Brings out the color. That's the secret.


----------



## Green

Pulled up a little Triv here and there on the middle side. Did a few TTTF transplants into bare spots in the low input area.

Yesterday was the very beginning of Spring here as far as I'm concerned. Poa Triv is breaking dormancy ahead of everything else as usual, and there's a good amount again this year.


----------



## Green

Dormant seeded a little bit of Jonathan Green Black Beauty Shady mix (not the one with Triv!) on the bare spots in the low input area that didn't have Triv near them.

Threw down Moss-Out on various places. I was reading that the best time to control moss in the year is before it forms spores, because it won't come back as fast if there are less spores around. It appears to be started to sporulate/flower in some places already.

Fertilized the back daffodils, which are now starting to come up using the combination of Baystate, 4-4-4 organic, and SOP. (The front daffodils are quite high now, and the Crocus flowers have been blooming for a few days now.)

Added between 0.25 and 0.45 lb/M of N from AMS using a hand spreader on the upper (neighbor half) of my extra test plot to see what happens (7x9 foot area and 1.2-2oz of AMS), and took photos of the plots for that thread. Will update it later.


----------



## Green

Got 0.9 inch of rain last night and this morning. Temp is 66 right now, and may have been even higher an hour ago. This is 20 degrees above average. Grass is greening up in a hurry...


----------



## dport

Green said:


> Dormant seeded a little bit of Jonathan Green Black Beauty Shady mix (not the one with Triv!) on the bare spots in the low input area that didn't have Triv near them.
> 
> Threw down Moss-Out on various places. I was reading that the best time ton control moss in the year is before it forms spores, because it won't come back as fast if there are less spores around. It appears to be started to sporulate/flower in some places already.
> 
> Fertilized the back daffodils, which are now starting to come up using the combination of Baystate, 4-4-4 organic, and SOP. (The front daffodils are quite high now, and the Crocus flowers have been blooming for a few days now.)
> 
> Added between 0.25 and 0.45 lb/M of N from AMS using a hand spreader on the upper (neighbor half) of my extra test plot to see what happens (7x9 foot area and 1.2-2oz of AMS), and took photos of the plots for that thread. Will update it later.


Curious how long you will wait to throw down Pre-em after your dormant seeding. I'm a few hundred miles south of you and the triv and other weeds are awful. I have my prodiamine ready to go, but wondering if I should seed some thin areas.


----------



## Green

dport said:


> Curious how long you will wait to throw down Pre-em after your dormant seeding. I'm a few hundred miles south of you and the triv and other weeds are awful. I have my prodiamine ready to go, but wondering if I should seed some thin areas.


I'll just skip the pre-M on small spots as best I can.  I don't like taking chances waiting until the last minute when CG is starting to germinate to apply. The bigger areas being overseeded will get Tenacity soon. 
Sounds like your optimal application time is right now! I'll be applying in the next 2 weeks.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

@social port, check out this thesis!
https://escholarship.org/uc/item/7780p8fn


----------



## Green

To-do list March 2020:

-order tackifier
-order teejet nozzles
-order ester weed killer
-order another set of chapin nozzles
-order hose holders
-buy more moss-out
-source Ky-31 seed
-pick up Lebanon fertilizer and other fertilizer
-Agway
-TSC
-Lowes

-rake
-take soil samples
-put down more seed
-pre-M app - dimension at half rate
-tenacity

-mosquito dunks

-find scrapers

-fertilize/pre-M/seed/repair other yards

-figure out lawnmower - oil leak?
-change oil 
-repair spreader
-snowblower maintenance

-kill triv
-plant trays
-mulch, planting bed maintenance, etc.

-leveling

-soil inspection, jar test, and percolation test

-plumber


----------



## Green

Pulled up a few Chickweed plants with white flowers on the East side in the mulch bed.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> https://escholarship.org/uc/item/7780p8fn


Thanks for the link. That raises some important questions. It is also cool that they inadvertently found that some types of L. perenne handle drought and heat better than TTTF. That seems game-changing to me. I might be interested in trying some in my yard if I knew what to buy.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> https://escholarship.org/uc/item/7780p8fn
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the link. That raises some important questions. It is also cool that they inadvertently found that some types of L. perenne handle drought and heat better than TTTF. That seems game-changing to me. I might be interested in trying some in my yard if I knew what to buy.
Click to expand...

I don't know if those types of PR are grown for seed yet. If they are, some may be Tetraploids, which are not common yet, but there are a few. I guess one of the issues there is that tetraploids tend to be forage types with higher biomass production. That's probably part of the reason the researcher backcrossed the tetraploids to regular TTTF. There are a few turf type tetraploids currently, though (in perennial ryegrass; I don't think there are any in Tall Fescue that are not forage grasses yet). I think the whole tetraploid turf type thing is kind of a big experiment. I don't know if it will be a more commonly offered type in the future. Really depends if they can get the turf quality up, clipping yield low, cold tolerance up, etc.

These turf type Rye-Fescue hybrids sure are taking forever to be bred. They started them like 15 or 20 years ago, I think. And we hardly ever hear anything about them.

I think I shared another link with you to a study showing that TTTF has a lack of genetic diversity overall. Hopefully they're working on increasing it, because if not, there won't be many more advances in TTTF. Maybe crossing with PR is the solution, I don't know. Or, they need to go to other countries and get selections that are different enough from what they currently use. Or meadow fescue crosses. It's not going to be easy.


----------



## Green

Threw down some more Rowdy TTTF seed for insurance in the main front. The seed tends to get displaced and eaten over time.

Mowed the portion of the side front that I want to overseed after raking aggressively. First mow. 2.6 in. Got some dead stuff out and bagged it. Nothing green in the clippings though. That is good.


----------



## Green

Got 0.1 inch of liquid equivalent. Believe it or not, it snowed a little (enough for a coating) last night. First snow in a long time. And then it rained.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> social port said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> https://escholarship.org/uc/item/7780p8fn
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for the link. That raises some important questions. It is also cool that they inadvertently found that some types of L. perenne handle drought and heat better than TTTF. That seems game-changing to me. I might be interested in trying some in my yard if I knew what to buy.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I don't know if those types of PR are grown for seed yet. If they are, some may be Tetraploids, which are not common yet, but there are a few. I guess one of the issues there is that tetraploids tend to be forage types with higher biomass production. That's probably part of the reason the researcher backcrossed the tetraploids to regular TTTF. There are a few turf type tetraploids currently, though (in perennial ryegrass; I don't think there are any in Tall Fescue that are not forage grasses yet). I think the whole tetraploid turf type thing is kind of a big experiment. I don't know if it will be a more commonly offered type in the future. Really depends if they can get the turf quality up, clipping yield low, cold tolerance up, etc.
> 
> These turf type Rye-Fescue hybrids sure are taking forever to be bred. They started them like 15 or 20 years ago, I think. And we hardly ever hear anything about them.
> 
> I think I shared another link with you to a study showing that TTTF has a lack of genetic diversity overall. Hopefully they're working on increasing it, because if not, there won't be many more advances in TTTF. Maybe crossing with PR is the solution, I don't know. Or, they need to go to other countries and get selections that are different enough from what they currently use. Or meadow fescue crosses. It's not going to be easy.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I figured that seed for those PR types wouldn't be available--or at least widely available right now. But when you read about a type of PR (with its nice color, quick establishment, and stripability) that will handle heat and drought better than TTTF, that's a sell in my book. It's very appealing.


----------



## Green

social port said:


> Yeah, I figured that seed for those PR types wouldn't be available--or at least widely available right now. But when you read about a type of PR (with its nice color, quick establishment, and stripability) that will handle heat and drought better than TTTF, that's a sell in my book. It's very appealing.


I agree. Turf type PR is great once it's established. There can be some loss in Summer and Winter (especially if the Summer is dry because it hates dormancy), but it seems minimal honestly. Both our Summers and Winters here, as you know, are often no joke. But in irrigated, fertilized lawns, the current varieties do great in mixed stands, and are still probably the most used grass species in this area, with TTTF maybe rising to second most popular more recently. Just a few more improvements (like the ones we are reading about above in the thesis) and TTPR will be a decent option for home lawns your area, too. I totally agree. I keep remembering that TTPR has been around longer than TTTF. Maybe we'll see a second coming of improvements. I'd love to see the TTTF/TTPR hybrids someday.


----------



## Green

Worked on grandfather's lawn. Fixed the plow damage and added CRF seed and a good amount of starter with meso (also put a little on the corner near the street). On the rest of the front (parallel to house with spreader) and sides, edges around house and back hill minus thin area to be overseeded, applied greens grade Pendimethalin. Also did not apply to front areas that either were seeded or will be in the next few weeks. Mower battery: totally dead, almost no power, could not start after like an hour of charging. Time for a new one. Put down approx 9 lbs of the Pendi on roughly 7K (2.68% AI). 1.25 lb/M. Tough to spread because the lowest setting on the spreader was overkill; similar consistency to Headway...very small particle size, almost powder-like. So just one set of passes and some extras around edges. Blew the hard surfaces off after. Goal is to prevent the early germinating broadleaf stuff. That yard has a Horseweed issue, so...


----------



## Green

Got 0.8 inch of rain last night into today.


----------



## Green

Forsythia just started to bloom today.Very early stages. No need to rush to get pre-M down. I've been doing this long enough to know I have a couple of weeks leeway for optimal timing from this point.
-------------------------------------------

@social port, here's another one of those studies: http://www.pubhort.org/ejhs/2014/file_4341608.pdf
And more info here: https://forages.oregonstate.edu/tallfescuemonograph/Morphology/relationships/hexaploid


----------



## Green

Pulled low input soil core samples. So soggy in almost half the area, despite the drought monitor now indicating abnormal dryness. Had to kneel on a folded trash bag.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> Forsythia just started to bloom today.Very early stages. No need to rush to get pre-M down. I've been doing this long enough to know I have a couple of weeks leeway for optimal timing from this point.
> -------------------------------------------
> 
> @social port, here's another one of those studies: http://www.pubhort.org/ejhs/2014/file_4341608.pdf
> And more info here: https://forages.oregonstate.edu/tallfescuemonograph/Morphology/relationships/hexaploid


Well, sounds like a mixed bag of results to me. I always try to remind myself that replications are essential to producing a body of clear evidence. 
I remember looking into this UC research group last year. I can't remember what exactly came of my effort.


----------



## Green

Got nearly 1.4 inch of liquid (snow plus rain) yestersay.

Scraped gypsy moth eggs off trees (N) into a container of soap today. Every little bit helps in the fight.

I think some of my seed is starting to germinate more recently, though it's possible it germinated very slowly over the last 4 weeks.


----------



## Green

2nd mow on the front today. 2.6 in (and 3.25 on edges). Definitely more than a charity mow (some green stuff cut off at the same height I left off at in the Fall), but probably not strictly necessary. Wanted to get it done on a nice day before more rain comes. Skipped a few areas I'm doing things with. Removed the snow stakes first, finally.

On the main front overseed area, I took soil samples and sprayed full rate T-Nex (8.8mL or 1/3oz) and Tenacity with surfactant (as my pre/post-M) at 4oz/Acre rate. Area is 375 to 400 square feet. Had to rush to do this before germination, which will start happening soon. This way, I won't have to mow it while the dormant seeded grass comes in. Didn't even measure soil temps. Just put it down knowing from experience we're almost at the inflection point. Used the excess (rinsate) on the area near the patio that needs leveling.

Bought some stuff today, including 2 bags of sand to get me started. First time I've ever bought stuff without even entering the store.

Chemlawn came next door and apparently sprayed pre-M/fert, as I didn't see any granules. Hopefully they did not spray onto my overseed. I did put up stakes to delineated the corners.


----------



## Green

Today, I finished taking my soil samples. Just in time, as it's going to rain all weekend. I did not get to rake in the back yet. That'll have to wait a week or so until things dry out after the next rain.


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> Today, I finished taking my soil samples. Just in time, as it's going to rain all weekend. I did not get to rake in the back yet. That'll have to wait a week or so until things dry out after the next rain.


I took my soil samples today boxed them up to be mailed out to waypoint on Monday.


----------



## Green

Threw down some mosquito dunk pieces in the flood prone area before the rain, since I noticed the mosquitoes are getting slightly more active lately. I don't think any are biting just yet. The ground is still soggy, so I had to chuck them rather than walking through mud.


----------



## Green

Yesterday:

Got 0.96 inch of rain in the preceding days.

Sprayed 5oz rate of Tenacity with NIS on two parts of the side front as pre-M and fine fescue reduction: the side slope, and the flat area near the driveway (to be overseeded in a few weeks).


----------



## Chris LI

How is the fine fescue reduction going since last year?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> How is the fine fescue reduction going since last year?


Pretty good on the slope area. That area has also been overseeded multiple times over the last few years, so there's lots of non-FF ready to fill in. It seems greenup is the best time to do this. Fall doesn't work as well. The other adjacent area I'm doing it on is one I want to open up some space for overseeding in a few weeks. I'm keeping it cut short until then.


----------



## Green

Today: Raked a lot of the lower back and upper side to loosen up matted grass.

A number of neighbors (maybe 30-50%) have started mowing over the past week.

Lost an immediate family member the other day (not due to the virus). Trying to stay positive by hopefully still doing his lawn during this period.


----------



## Green

Raked the rest of the lower back, middle side, and dry part of low input area.


----------



## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> Lost an immediate family member the other day (not due to the virus). Trying to stay positive by hopefully still doing his lawn during this period.


Sorry to hear of your loss, Green. Working on the lawn is a good time for reflection and remembering good things.

Stay safe.

--ken


----------



## Chris LI

ken-n-nancy said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Lost an immediate family member the other day (not due to the virus). Trying to stay positive by hopefully still doing his lawn during this period.
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry to hear of your loss, Green. Working on the lawn is a good time for reflection and remembering good things.
> 
> Stay safe.
> 
> --ken
Click to expand...

^+1
It is therapeutic. Taking care of their lawn is another way of taking care of your family and honoring them.


----------



## Green

@ken-n-nancy, @Chris LI, thanks. I ordered a new tractor battery since the old one is dead and won't hold a charge anymore.

Got 0.15 inch of rain yesterday.


----------



## Green

Finished raking the back, and the parts of the low input area that needed it.

I noticed that my neighbor (today) put down the Dimension 0-0-7 0.15% that I got for them last year. I had suggested they use that at 2 lb rate now in place of their Scotts step 1, and then use the step 1 or Halts (Pendi) in 6-8 weeks. I noticed also that a few others in the area have put down pre-Ms.

The pollen is starting to move in the air, mosquitoes and other bugs starting to go for the face, and my grass seed has started germinating in the front. Forsythia are in peak bloom.

Dropped off 6 lbs of starter with Meso for another neighbor doing a small overseed project. Also hooked him up with some near golf quality seed.


----------



## Green

Today: mowed front hill for the 2nd time this year, and the adjacent (flat top) part of the side front (first time), at 2.6 in. Still have not mowed the side slope that is being treated with Tenacity, as I want to do some leveling and need longer grass.

Mowed upper and middle side, lower back, and about 3,200 square feet of the low input area all at 3.25 in setting (also for the first time this year). Gator blade is still on. It's doing well. Grass was not long yet, but with a bunch of days of rain coming, it was best done now, ahead of time.

Put down Dimension 0-0-7 0.15% on the front hill (roughly 25x20 or 500 square feet). Used 2 lbs of it to last 2 months as the first half of a split app.

Put down about 7.5 lbs on the roughly 3,200 square feet of the low input area. Again, 2 lbs/M split app #1. I applied from the edge of the Hard Fescue seeded area to the beginning of the Triv spots, and to last year's reseeded patches in the perpendicular direction. This way, I avoided the area behind the shed where the roots got clipped over the Winter (which I'd like to overseed).

Pulled/dug out some Triv in the lower back, and annua on the upper side.

Threw down most of the rest of the first 1 lb of Jetty Hard Fescue seed on the shaded near end of low input area. Nothing has germinated there yet, as it's always the most lagging area for soil temps in the whole yard due to cool shade. Also, a lot of the seed put down on 2/17 looked to be displaced/gone.

So I then tried out the M-Binder for the first time ever. I just measured out 1/3 cup or so (not sure if that was the correct amount!), threw it into 2/3 gallon of water, shook it up, and then sprayed. Took a bit to figure it out, but I figured out the best way to avoid clogs was not only to remove the nozzle, but also the strainer. That way all the big particles go right through and flow out easily rather than back up in the tube. Hopefully this stuff does the trick and keeps the seed where it is. I got a good coating down, I think...the soil looked damp after. I forgot to let out the pressure in the sprayer, and unscrewed it, and it blasted toward my face a bit, but did not get in my eyes. For some reason, the seller packaged the powder in a leather sack (waste of leather if you ask me), sewn shut the same way the grass seed bags are, with product dust all over the exterior of it. Thankfully I know from Pete's video how to open the bags properly.


----------



## Green

Got 0.3 inch of rain yesterday. The final Oak leaves have been coming down.

Today:

Put up barrier tape around the main front overseed area. The seed continues to germinate here and there.

Raked the garage side to dethatch, and then put down seed. Roughly 1.5-1.75 lb of Rowdy TTTF seed on ~0.25K area.

Sprayed Tenacity at the 2oz rate without surfactant on the main front (perpendicular direction to street), top of side front behind planting bed to trees/marker, and applied on the garage side and hell strip areas at the 4-5 oz rate.

Put down Bullseye TTTF seed on the upper back spots behind deck.

Sprayed tackifier on the garage side, upper back spots, and again on the low input overseed. Really hoping it works. I didn't see as much seed left after the rain, so some soil must have eroded a bit. Hopefully, it just covered the seed rather than displacing it.

My neighbor way down the end who was going to put down seed, did that yesterday. He used the starter with Meso I brought him. And then the lawn service he hired came to apply pre-M/fert (except on the seeded area). Lawn is TTPR/KBG/FF with what looks like some Triv here and there. Neighbor wants to keep it in good shape after buying the house. He bought a 2019/2020 model Honda mower a few weeks ago and used it for the first time this past week.


----------



## Green

Got 0.395 inch of rain. Maybe the tackifier is helping reduce seed erosion. Hard to tell. I guess if you don't use any mulch, you can't expect it to be as effective.


----------



## Green

Lots of wind today.

House across from previously mentioned neighbor put down pre-M.

Soil temp in upper back is mid 40s with air temp in the mid 40s.

Some lawns that have not been mowed yet and are well fertilized are getting a bit long.

Also seeing the first sign of seedheads starting.


----------



## Green

Did my deceased family member's lawn...

Put down approx. 28 lbs (by eye) of Lebanon 0-0-7 0.15% FG Dimension on the back (roughly 4 lbs rate). GDD is 563 and projected to be 600 by the time it gets watered in on Monday. Cutting it close. Threw down some more 2015 vintage VNS CRF seed on the front corners/edges, and topped it off with some (also old) Tenacity. Saw some tiny Spurge or more likely Prostrate Knotweed seedlings coming up, which I'll have to keep after with the Tenacity. I string trimmed before the Tenacity app. Not ideal timing to cut or trim immediately before applying, but sometimes you have to. I used the trimmer to knock down some of the high areas, since I've been unable to get in a first mow yet. I ran out of string partway through, so I grabbed some 0.05 inch line that he had in the house and gave that a shot. It worked pretty well, but I wouldn't be surprised if the trimmer were to run through it quickly.


----------



## Green

Yesterday, Easter:

Mowed all of front, plus the side and low input area up to the start of the test plots at 2.6 in. Mowed driveway edges at 3.25 but got the wheels stuck in the edges and accidentally scalped the edges.

I made a judgement call not to drop a pre-M on the plot area. Thinking: soil already is too damp, 1-2 inches more rain coming and will flood, area is in poor shape and could use spot seeding, etc. Also don't have a whole lot of Dimension left at this point. I'll use Tenacity with surfactant instead, hopefully next week. If still too damp, then the week after. Great thing about Tenacity: it's forgiving as a post-M if you're late.

Also sprayed Gallery at roughly the 0.5 oz/M max label rate on the Hard Fescue overseed area. That is the only pre-M I'll be able to use there this Spring.

Also sprayed at the same rate in the front mulch bed where there were lots of weeds last Summer. I'll have to remember to spray again where the pots, bags, and mulch piles are covering.

Used my excess on the hellstrip areas and low input back border at low rate. Will have to add more soon.

Neighbor L spread about 5 yard of soil or compost in his yard and overseeded. Hopefully we won't get washout from the storm and have all his effort and soil and seed wash into the street. Hopefully he also didn't or won't apply Dimension yet. Finally, I've always wondered, does a heavyish topdressing of soil over low spots of existing lawn allow the new grass seed to grow roots down into the soil properly?

Also got 3 gal of gas in case the power goes out in the storm.


----------



## Green

Yesterday: Got 2.8 inches of rain, a mostly flooded low-input area, and lots of wind today. Remains to be seen if the tackifier held.

Insulation fell out, maybe from wind. Left it out.


----------



## Green

Finished raking the upper back, including a very light raking over the whole area to loosen up matted grass and allow the seed to germinate, but not so much that I would disturb anything beginning to germinate. Then blew the area gently to remove leaves. I then sprayed an app of 4oz rate pre/post Tenacity (2.7 mL), mixed with 0.4 oz of T-Nex, and a spoonful of NIS in 1.5 gal of water. Good timing I think, as soil temp was 56F. Some broadleaf stuff is starting to germinate, too.

Speaking of germination, the Hard Fescue in the end of the low input area appears to be starting to germinate. Or, it could be CRF, since I mixed a little of that in, too.

Another thing I did today, was to mix up some sand, soil, and compost, to start filling in holes created when I pulled Triv in the Fall and late Winter, and start leveling some small uneven hellstrip areas.

Speaking of Triv, I dug up a couple of small patches of grass in the front that were infested with it.


----------



## Green

Picked up 8 nails from lawn and bed edges using the magnet.

Dug up some lilies. Dug some weeds up, including Poa annua and Triv, and a couple of dandelions. Added a little more seed on the garage side and main front overseed area. Watered the latter. Did some hand trimming/edging with shears. Threw some more iron on the moss areas in the back.

Going to stay off the upper back going forward so the seed can start coming up, which it probably will any day now.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member's lawn for first time of the year after changing the tractor battery. So weird going to an empty home. Used a multi HOC approach, including mowing the front mailbox side overseeded area, which is too early to germinate. Did not have to cut the farthest back part, which isn't growing much yet. While string trimming, I launched a small piece of a branch into my right cheek bone. Ouch. Thankful for certified polycarbonate safety glasses. I saw one home in the area watering their front lawn with a sprinkler. It struck me as interesting. They must have either overseeded or put down a product. Either that or they were clueless and thought they had to water even we've been getting enough rain and it's been moderate to cool.

At home, got out the hose and quickly hand watered the main front overseed area at around 7PM. Hoping that cuts down on freeze damage tonight. It's supposed to go down to 30F tonight.

Local lawn co applied fert/pre-M/sprayed weeds on the usual 2 neighbors, plus the back one. I still have to apply pre-M in a few areas tomorrow. On the gdd tracker, we are into the "done" stage now, meaning there is not much time left and crabgrass could even be germinating in sunny areas already.


----------



## Green

Used the Groundskeeper rake to dethatch the area I plan to overseed with TTTF on the side front. The Tenacity has started to whiten the grass, especially the FF, which was the plan. It also seems to be lightening some of the PR. I'm sure a lot of the grass will lighten over time.

About 60-67% who mow regularly seem to have mowed at least once this year now. My neighbor 2 away was one, and also put down his Dimension 0.15% 0-0-7 today. I also noticed that my neighbor who I gave the starter w/Meso to, put down some soil and seed on his side front. I wonder if pre-M had been put on that area. Then again, adding topsoil, ryegrass seed may well grow right through any pre-M barrier. We will see.

Edit: Also put down Bullseye seed on a small lower back dead spot caused by my painting of glyphosate last Fall. I was so careful, too.


----------



## Chris LI

Temps really dropped for us the last few days, and I saw snow reported through Albany and some of New England today. Did you get any?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Temps really dropped for us the last few days, and I saw snow reported through Albany and some of New England today. Did you get any?


Definitely cool again.

No snow accumulation here, but several towns Northwest of here, they got 5.5 inches.

We got almost 0.6 inch of rain.

I put down around 2 lbs of Rowdy TTTF seed on the flat side front area next to the driveway (400 sq ft), but I did the overseed backwards...I still have to spray the Tenacity/PGR and then mow it. I wanted to get it down as it's going to go below freezing again tonight. Sort of a pseudo dormant seed. Hoping I don't disturb the seed when I mow. I stepped on it pretty well. Could always add more.

Added a little more Bullseye seed to areas in the back.


----------



## Chris LI

Timing sounds good for you, as temps should climb this week. :thumbup:


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Timing sounds good for you, as temps should climb this week. :thumbup:


And so far so good...none of my already germinated seed has died yet. It might go as low as 30F again, but more likely 32. This will be the second hard freeze (probably 5-6 hours at 32) this week. So far so good with the seedling grass. The wet ground should help protect it tonight, I would think.


----------



## Green

@Chris LI...I just realized...

That is what the manual reel mower is for! I had visions of your antique unit, and then realized I can use my Fiskars.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> @Chris LI...I just realized...
> 
> That is what the manual reel mower is for! I had visions of your antique unit, and then realized I can use my Fiskars.


 :nod:


----------



## Green

Mowed the side front area with the seed 3x, finishing at about 1.5 in using the Fiskars reel mower (2nd to lowest setting). Good thing I had raked up most of the sticks and nut shells prior to seeding.

Then mowed the front, side, and lower back normally. I mowed the edges at max height because they got scalped the last time and still haven't recovered. Did not scalp many areas this time. Mowed the side front slope at 3.25 because I plan to top dress it to level dips soon. There is also a bit of Triv to kill at the top of that slope.

Pruned the spruces. The buds had already formed this past week, so we'll see how the late pruning turns out. I tried not to take off too much this time. Last year, I killed a few branches by getting too aggressive.


----------



## social port

Green said:


> mowed the edges at max height because they got scalped the last time and still haven't recovered.


It's funny. We are moving in different directions here. 
I also have slopes at the perimeter of my yard. When I mow up to the curb, the grass is always cut slightly higher than the rest of the stand. This year I have been experimenting with a slightly lower HOC against the curb, just to make the height more consistent with the rest of the lawn. It seems to be working well, but then again, I'm cutting at around 4 inches.


----------



## Green

@social port, yeah, I'm still mowing at 2.6 in or so, so it's really easy to scalp the elevated edges. I like to overhang the mower when doing the edges, otherwise the edges get tall and matted. I'm not looking forward to having to increase to 3.75 or 4 in...the season has barely begun for me. The first seedheads are just starting up over the past week, and the leaves are in the process of opening up on some trees. The pollen storms have not started yet. Almost everyday, it's either windy or raining. If it's not raining, it's windy. If it's raining, it might still be windy...making scheduling sprays really tough.


----------



## Green

Finally, the wind decreased this evening. I watered the main front overseed area.

Sprayed Tenacity:

2 oz rate on the rest of the main front. 4 oz rate on the lower back and the side. Used the 5oz rate plus 0.3oz of PGR on the side front overseed area plus a bit further back. Used surfactant on all areas. This was as both pre- and post-M, as well as FF reduction on the overseed area.


----------



## JDgreen18

Hey @Green just fyi Costco has the greenmax on sale right now...10 bucks off.


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Hey @Green just fyi Costco has the greenmax on sale right now...10 bucks off.


Thanks. So, how much at the current sale price?

That stuff is still carrying over from my late app last Fall, because of the methylene urea.


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> JDgreen18 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey @Green just fyi Costco has the greenmax on sale right now...10 bucks off.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. So, how much at the current sale price?
> 
> That stuff is still carrying over from my late app last Fall, because of the methylene urea.
Click to expand...

$39.99


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> JDgreen18 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey @Green just fyi Costco has the greenmax on sale right now...10 bucks off.
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. So, how much at the current sale price?
> 
> That stuff is still carrying over from my late app last Fall, because of the methylene urea.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> $39.99
Click to expand...

Must've increased by $5 since last year...
https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=177473#p177473
That was the price in 2019 with the $10 markdown. I'm in no rush to buy it, so we'll see what happens.


----------



## Green

Got almost 0.3 inch of rain today, and more flooding. Don't know when I'll have access to the trest plots again.

Neighbor diagonally across apparently put down Methylene urea in the past few days (I assume with pre-emergent in it, but who knows).

House next door which uses Chemlawn and a mowing guy, is lagging in waking up. It hasn't been mowed yet, but is not really in need of it yet, either. This was one of those lawns that I believe only received a mid Fall (late October) urea app right before the pause period, and no other Fall fert. Then it was fertilized (with pre-M) a few weeks ago. Still lagging.

Almost all (maybe 75%) have mowed at least once this year now.


----------



## Green

Very windy today. I noticed that the people in the very last house (which haven't up kept the yard so great and usually have leaves blowing out all Winter) put down some seed and hay. I'm not sure what the hay is, but some of it made it a few hundred or so feet onto my lawn today. It has seedheads, veins in the leaves, and the collar area has a pronounced bump on it. I picked up the few pieces that made it down here today and threw them away.

I added seed to the spots in the front (Rowdy), and some in the spots in the low input area (the JG mix). So far so good with my germination rate, especially in the low input area which was seeded the earliest, and also the seed surviving a few frosts.

Speaking of which: I watered the main front overseed area again today in the late afternoon to try to get the sunlight's heat into the ground, as it could be an even harder freeze tonight, getting down to between 32 and 30 for up to 7 hours potentially. I noticed some minor orange tips from the frost after mowing the other day. Nothing too bad. Hopefully everything survives tonight.

I carefully stepped into the Hard Fescue overseed area, and got down low to check for germination. It's starting for sure. But wow. The Hard Fescue seedlings are barely visible even up close. They're markedly smaller than KBG seedlings. I've never seen anything like this. I have a feeling it's going to be a very slow species to establish from seed. They are however, a deep, dark green color.

One of the neighborhood homes had their driveway paved last Summer, and they threw down seed after as a whole section of the yard was dug up and regraded. I don't think they've done much to it as far as care, and it was very sparse and uneven going into Winter. But it's slowly filling in, little by little now. I guess that in a year, it'll be filled in totally without anything else done. Grass is remarkable.


----------



## Green

Mowed the front and low-input area (at least where it was not wet). Trimmed in back for the first time. Then dug up some Triv and onother annua spot (side). Then mixed a gal of glyphosate using 3oz with 2.5 g AMS and a little citric acid, and some NIS. Sprayed a few other Triv spots in various areas.


----------



## Green

Got 0.3 inch of rain today.


----------



## Green

Mowed and raked family member's lawn.

Then at home, spread some of the mulch and mowed the side front overseed area 3x as it got dark (pre-germination mow with the reel at about 1.5 inch).


----------



## DrewSilva

Green said:


> Got 0.3 inch of rain yesterday. The final Oak leaves have been coming down.
> 
> Today:
> 
> Put up barrier tape around the main front overseed area. The seed continues to germinate here and there.
> 
> Raked the garage side to dethatch, and then put down seed. Roughly 1.5-1.75 lb of Rowdy TTTF seed on ~0.25K area.
> 
> Sprayed Tenacity at the 2oz rate without surfactant on the main front (perpendicular direction to street), top of side front behind planting bed to trees/marker, and applied on the garage side and hell strip areas at the 4-5 oz rate.
> 
> Put down Bullseye TTTF seed on the upper back spots behind deck.
> 
> Sprayed tackifier on the garage side, upper back spots, and again on the low input overseed. Really hoping it works. I didn't see as much seed left after the rain, so some soil must have eroded a bit. Hopefully, it just covered the seed rather than displacing it.
> 
> My neighbor way down the end who was going to put down seed, did that yesterday. He used the starter with Meso I brought him. And then the lawn service he hired came to apply pre-M/fert (except on the seeded area). Lawn is TTPR/KBG/FF with what looks like some Triv here and there. Neighbor wants to keep it in good shape after buying the house. He bought a 2019/2020 model Honda mower a few weeks ago and used it for the first time this past week.


What dd you end up using for tackifier and source of supply? Doing some preliminary research for a fall reno on my front that has a big slope.


----------



## g-man

@DrewSilva check the blankets Ryan knorr used in the YT video. They worked great.


----------



## DrewSilva

g-man said:


> @DrewSilva check the blankets Ryan knorr used in the YT video. They worked great.


I had looked at those and saw @GrassDaddy used them as well with not much success. I stumbled across m-binder and thought it was much more cost effective than the blankets.


----------



## Green

DrewSilva said:


> What dd you end up using for tackifier and source of supply? Doing some preliminary research for a fall reno on my front that has a big slope.


Nature's Seed on Amazon. I'm not sure if they're the manufacturer or a dealer.


----------



## Green

Got 0.2 inch of rain yesterday.

Spot sprayed super old Tenacity mix on main front in family member's lawn (random broadleaf weeds, Dandelions, seedling Prostrate Knotweed that got through the pre-M barrier, and random unidentified weedy grass). Most of the stuff (other than dandelions) is along the edges. Planning to keep after it every week. Also threw down a bit more seed on the damaged area (Baron KBG and Wicked PR this time) since nothing has germinated yet.


----------



## Green

Did a lot of spraying.

Glyphosate on more Triv spots. Used Triclopyr Ester for first time ever. 1.5 tbsp in 1.5 gal with surfactant at spot spray rate (1 gal/M). Sprayed clover. Sprayed a few purple and white violets in low input. Sprayed the front walk weeds (I think Chickweed, Speedwell, etc.)

Mixed and sprayed Tenacity and Gallery on the test plot areas. Gallery on most edges. Tenacity and Gallery on back border where there is annua. All Tenacity at 4oz rate and Gallery at 0.5 oz rate. Also had to spray Tenacity on some unidentified broadleaf seedlings at upper back border (hopefully not the Pokeweed).

Sprayed app 2 of Tenacity at 5oz rate on the area I want to reduce FF on the side front driveway slope. I used a bit of the Triclopyr in the mix this time. Reducing FF this way seems to work, but appears to be at least a 2 year process. Spring seems best.

The adjacent overseed area is very whitened/yellowed now from the Teanacity/PGR, where I'm trying to achieve similar.

Mowed the same majority of the low input area as last time. Not supposed to mow after spraying (same day) but sometimes have to break rules.

Transplanted a bit of grass into low input area.

Found a tick crawling on me after coming in. Time to start using repellent regularly.

No more nights below freezing are in the immediate forecast.


----------



## Green

Got 1.5 inches of rain over the previous day.

Added a little more Rowdy seed to main front overseed area and garage side overseed.

Pulled up a couple of small Triv seedlings with brown stem markings near the back patio corner. I don't know where these things come from. The area hasn't gotten seed in years.

On a related note, I noticed some Triv coming up in the main front in an area where I pulled some seedlings a few years ago. Either I missed some (likely), or else it started to come back now, 6-7 years after I renovated that area (also likely). I noticed more Triv in other clumps in the main front. May is when it really starts to take off, giving very little time for killing and reseeding before Summer.

Next steps: continue killing Triv. Plant sod trays. Level a few areas.


----------



## Green

Watered the overseed areas.

The Triv is really taking off. I need to see what soil temp equates with this. I sprayed more of it with glyphosate in the main lawn today. It's everywhere again this year. But the patches are considerably smaller this year in the lawn areas where I did a lot of spraying last year.

The mosquitoes have also started taking off. Time to spray the natural garlic based mosquito/tick repellent/killer and use the dunks more regularly.


----------



## Green

Watered seeded areas.

Mixed and sprayed 2 gallons of mosquito barrier. Threw some mosquito dunks into the standing water.

Then mowed the front, side, and lower back. Not sure if glyphosate can translate in 24 hours, but had to mow. Some minor clumping noticed.


----------



## Green

Watered seeded areas. Not much new germination just yet, but soil temps are at 60 in the late afternoon now.

Also sprayed more Triv spots. It seems like infestation is a yearly thing now.

Nextdoor neighbor's lawn was mowed today for the first time this year. Finally. Yesterday, Neighbor 11 had lawn service come back for fert I guess. He has far too much seed down in bare spots at the moment.


----------



## Green

Fired up the Toro for first time this year and mowed in the low input area. Started on the first pull. Followed up with the other mower on the test plot area set to max HOC, first mow of the year there, after raking up sticks. Still pretty soggy.


----------



## Powhatan

Green said:


> Fired up the Toro for first time this year and mowed in the low input area. Started on the first pull.


My old gas push mower started the season working very well. About 1.5 months later it's getting harder to start, the pull cord feels like it has resistance on the initial pull and the RPMs are slow to spin up when it starts. I did all the standard tune-up maintenance first of the season, so I'm guessing the piston ring is worn. I'm starting to research the battery powered push mowers, but the initial mower with battery and charger high package cost makes me hesitant. Then there's the battery Amp, Volt, Watt, and run-time, SqFt comparison confusion.


----------



## Green

Mowed and trimmed family member's lawn and put down approx 9 lbs of 0-0-7 Dimension on the front/sides and immediate back, omitting areas with seed. Roughly 1.25 lb/M. 12 days since last mow. It was too long. Aiming for 5 days next time.

Rain coming tomorrow with a bit of snow possible tomorrow night!


----------



## Green

@Powhatan, I don't think the Toro is even at the 1 year mark yet. When the older mower had issues starting, it was a piece in the carb that got clogged. I'm not up on those repairs yet, so, had a mechanic go through it thoroughly.


----------



## Green

Threw down some of the Jonathan Green seed mix on bare spots in the low input area ahead of the rain.


----------



## Green

May 8th-9th: got at least 0.4 inch of rain. 
May 9th: dug 2 rocks out that had surfaced in bare spots in low input area.


----------



## Green

Mowed front and side, still at 2.6 in. Seedheads appear to really be starting up in a big way. Mowed the side front slope at 3.25 in again as I plan to level low spots.

Sprayed a few more Triv spots in the main front and lower back with glyphosate.

In the low input Hard Fescue overseed area, I dug out a few rocks, and put down the rest of the 1 lb of seed (maybe 1-2oz worth), and sprayed tackifier. I then did the same with Bullseye seed in the lower back near the basement/wall.


----------



## Green

Had some rain with a bit of hail today. Tomorrow night is going down into the mid to low 30s again.

Edit: no measurable rainfall.


----------



## Green

Might get down to 35F tonight; freezing in Northern parts of the state. This has happened a bunch of times over the last few weeks.

Watered the front (and side once) seeded areas twice. The TTTF seed is taking a long time to start germinating. Just a few here and there coming up in the areas seeded first so far, and what has is super slow to grow. In the same time period, a couple of neighbors, a guy near me and his father-in-law, both planted PR and it's mostly up now and been cut once. But they also used topsoil, which speeds things up, too.

House next to house across from neighbor 11 had a big Maple cut down. Neighbor 11 has a lot of the PR that has germinated in the topsoil he added, despite the pre-M barrier applied in some of those areas.

I syringed out 80mL of Tenacity for my neighbor who I am splitting the bottle with, put it into a clean bottle, poured some NIS into another bottle, grabbed one of the measuring syringes, and wrote up instructions for mixing and use. Also mixed up a half a capful (0.25 oz) of Gallery in a gallon of water for him to put down this week, and left these items by his garage for $30. We also discussed Spring fertilization utilizing Carbon-X. I suggested 2 lb/M now and again in June. He Winterized around late Nov., and applied the 0-0-7 last month.


----------



## Green

Watered again today, including the low input seed and Hard Fescue overseed area today. I'll have to start watering more often there.

Also sprayed a few more Triv areas with glyphosate this evening after the wind decreased. There are some diffuse/mxed areas I cannot spot spray this year, so I'll try my hand at the selective herbicides again this year (but never really had much luck with them in the past). Worst case, I could always renovate areas that are really bad next Spring if that doesn't work.

It looks like Chemlawn came to the neighbor today...yellow sign. Their lawn has only been mowed once so far this year. Needs fert. I guess the single late October urea app that Chemlawn did last year was not enough to carry over into the Spring. Lawns overall seem to need to need more fert this Spring anyway, though...I guess the warm Winter used up carb reserves faster. My neighbor I mentioned yesterday is in need of fert any day now by the color. He even noticed it himself. Mine will need it in a week or two. I want to do it before it loses color.

Trying not to increase mowing height yet...I want to start spraying the selective herbicides for Triv, first, to make sure it gets the "hidden" areas before things grow in too much.

One more night in the mid to upper 30s tonight, and then everything is 50s and maybe some 40s going forward.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member's lawn after putting air in tractor tires. Put psi up to 15. I think it was about 5 beforehand. Mowed the front and side a bit lower this time to try to increase density.

At home, mowed lower back and low input area including test plots but some areas still haven't woken up yet. Used the Toro for the second time this year. Started on first pull once again.

Grass is really looking like it's going to need fertilizer very soon. Same story everywhere. All yards, pretty much looks like this, except those that have already been fertilized in 2020.

Finally gave in and took an allergy pill before mowing today. First time in a long time. It was a good decision. And then a tylenol after.

I then did the second glyphosate app on many of the Triv spots: those in the low input area, those on the side and lower back, and the front ones except those on the driveway side of the main front overseed area, after running out of both solution and time. Also decided to kill all the in between areas on the lower side infested area. So now I'll have one big square area to reseed. Experience says it doesn't pay to be stingy with glyphosate against Triv. I hate all the dead spots, but it's necessary. I hope to get the third app in next week, and then reseed before too much more time goes by.


----------



## Green

First 80 degree day today and 63 dewpoint, but the humidity didn't build yet so it felt nice. Got 0.15 inch of rain last night. Watered the seed in the main front, side front, garage side, upper back, and low input area. I do just enough with the hose to moisten the soil. Seed doesn't really need as much water as people often think.

Talked with neighbor 11 and told how to apply 0.25-0.5 lb N to his newly overseeded 500 sq ft main front area. He said he would like to do it tomorrow. Also gave him a rundown about other things, like watering, and how one component of his 4-species Northern mix (the Triv) might brown out in the Summer and it doesn't mean he's not watering enough.

To do list: 
-spray Triclopyr ester app 2 on clover in areas where it's not desired, and possibly a bit to thin out clover in very dense areas in low input area. Trying to stay away from herbicides there due to the bunnies, etc.
-mix another gallon of glyphosate and continue spot apps on Triv.
-start grass seed trays for extra sod.
-Trim and mow
-Apply Milorganite and SOP
-Level with soil in areas
-Apply Tricure to front hill
-elective app for Triv
-biofungicide app 1
-purchase more mosquito dunks, sand, compost, wet and forget, and mixer for drill
-ET data
-screwdriver tests/dig up any rocks
-sprinkler head, etc.

The forsythia in the area have no more blooms, and the grass is producing more seed and trying to start to harden off for Summer.


----------



## Green

Got 1/3 inch of rain last night.

Watered overseed areas. Germination continues to slowly increase each day. Lots of bees pollinating the short-lived, small, white flowers on the tree next to the garage. Maybe carpenter bees.

Sprayed app 2 of Triclopyr ester this evening. I think 2 apps is going to be enough. 1t really hurt the clover two weeks after app 1. This stuff is so much better than the amine I usually use (more effective). But you can only use it in cool to warm weather, and it smells. Reminds you of how toxic it is everytime you use it. The amine has almost no smell. I used the low rate. Bottle says wait 3 weeks before reseeding. There is definitely Triv in a few of the clover areas. Triclopyr seems to hurt Triv, as well, a little.

And then, I finished app 2 of glyphosate on Triv after mixing another gallon. Some newly noticed spots got their very first spray today, though. 2.7 oz of 41% glyphosate in a gallon of water with 2.5 oz of non-spray grade AMS dissolved, and then a little NIS and citric acid. Works really well.


----------



## Green

Mowed the front, side, lower back, and low input area using both mowers. Still only using the old one on the front for now. Main front and side were slightly long, so side discharged. Will have to do my trimming tomorrow or on Thursday. Also watered the front and side overseed areas once. Watered yesterday, too. Watering every day now once or twice if no rain. But holding out on lawn watering as long as possible. Maybe the shorter HOC will reduce ET this time of year versus last year.


----------



## Green

Watered all the seeded areas well since I wont be able to tomorrow until the evening if that. Also hand watered the edges and hellstrip areas, which are beginning to brown. Soil moisture is going down. Trimmed.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member's lawn. A bit overgrown in the back. 8 days. Peak growth this time of year. Also put down about 10 lbs of Lebanon 25-0-5, 0.067 Acelepryn/0.67 Dimension on most of the front and sides, focusing primarily on the main front. Also put down roughly 6-8 lbs of Grubex on those same areas. Then sprayed some shampoo on dry areas, and Tenacity as pre and post. Roughly 0.3-0.6 lb N, depending on area. Hopefully it wasn't too much, and requires more mowing.

I'll go back and hit the back edges with more Dimension and maybe use some Gallery to help prevent Horseweed, and then another split app using Pendi for the same reason. And keep up with the Tenacity.

At home, I put down roughly 0.375-0.4 lb N everywhere except the overseed areas and the flood prone part of the low input area, which I'll be working on soon. I used Milorganite/Baystate. Used a lot of the old stuff with 4% Fe. Unfortunately, my Earthway spreader's right wheel detached soon after beginning, and I lost some parts. I borrowed my neighbor's spreader to finish up and got it done, thankfully. Also put down the last bit of Tricure granular I had left on the typical hot-spots (side front slope, front hill, and hellstrip/curb areas). Got it down before seeing a ton of drought stress.

My neighbor nextdoor said he was going to apply the Gallery pre-M. It should cut down on Summer weeds. I asked if I could give him a bit of other advice, and he said sure. I said they should stop watering at night, and switch to AM, and raise the mowing height to about 2 inches from 1.5, which he said he already did earlier today when he mowed. Last year, he kept mentioning playing catchup with me, always noticing my HOC was one level higher than his.

My other neighbor put down his Carbon-X today (first time user...he's going to love the color). The amount of prills looked about right for the 0.5 lb N rate I had him target.


----------



## Green

Got 1.1 inch of rain today.


----------



## uts

Green said:


> Got 1.1 inch of rain today.


No measurable rainfall on our side. I need to turn on my irrigation def.


----------



## Green

uts said:


> No measurable rainfall on our side. I need to turn on my irrigation def.


That's not good. I was afraid that would happen here, but it did not.


----------



## Green

This evening: sprayed Velocity application #1 on the main front (minus the overseed area). 4oz/Acre rate. 5.46g in 2.1 gallons of water over approx 2.125K area. Sprayed late, right before it got dark, and overlapped a swath into the border with my neighbor's (there is Triv there that I believe came from my seed years ago and I don't want it spreading back over here in the future). There is dew at night; not sure if that's good or bad for an herbicide that hasn't dried yet. Really hoping this works. It has never really worked for me in the past. Did not use filtered water; maybe next time. Just used the standard Chapin nozzle, as that's all I have right now. I need to get some better ones. Applied parallel to driveway, and there was a little extra at the end. I used it in the perpendicular direction on the middle area that has the worst infestation. The label says wait 10 days to reseed, but I can't. I need to get the seed down soon. I'll risk it. I have never applied this early in the year, or at this high a rate in a single app. Really hope it works. It's also combined with the fertilizer app the other night and the rain that followed; hopefully that will reduce the collateral damage to the good grass species. I also hand-shook the mixture as usual. Really need to buy a drill mixing attachment.

I also watered the overseed areas once today (which I do pretty much every day now; not even worth mentioning anymore). Though, I've pretty much given up on the upper back area, as very little seed has germinated there. Most of it must have rotted. Guess I'll be repeating the overseed in the late Summer.

All the trees have now leafed out. Zoysia has been greening up for a few weeks. Crickets are starting to chirp.


----------



## Green

Sprayed first application of Velocity on the two remaining areas at the 4 oz/acre rate:

-a 1,000 square foot (roughly 25x40 foot) area on the middle side

-a 900 square foot (roughly 30x30 foot) area in the low input area

My strategy has always been to use a combination of pulling/digging out, glyphosate, and selective herbicides. The selective herbicides don't seem to work too well and do tend to cause collateral damage, but are the only thing that can be used on areas where the Triv is blended with the good grass. Roundup gets used on all discrete patches, especially those near areas not yet infested to stop the spread into those areas (set up a perimeter).

Glyphosate seems to be a cure. As long as the seed used the next time doesn't have more in it, 3 apps seems to eliminate it. I have an area I killed about 6-7 years ago just with one app of Roundup/diquat rather than pure glyphosate (before I knew better), and only now has a little bit of Triv returned. It was an easy fix using glyphosate on those patches this year.

Next app: June 14th and 15th.


----------



## Green

Skipped watering the overseed areas yesterday, as it was cloudy and we had gotten a very small amount of rain overnight, so things stayed moist all day.

That made it a good day today to do the first cut since seeding on the main-front and side-front driveway overseed areas. I did not cut any of the new grass yet, but the existing grass was getting long. I used the manual reel mower on the second from the top setting (over 3 inches). Unfortunately, the mower did not cut most of the seedheads. Does this mean it's not adjusted quite as well as it could be, maybe? Or it could just be the design of the mower. It has a metal bar that pushes everything down before it hits the blades; maybe the seedheads don't pop back up properly in front of the blades because they're stiff, and then get missed.

After this, I watered the areas in the afternoon.

This morning, I sprayed my final app of glyphosate on most of the areas (except most of the side areas).

Japanese stiltgrass is everywhere in the road cracks now. At least one of my neighbors is already familiar with it, and I'm trying to tell a few others about it so we can keep it under control. I pull it when I see it.


----------



## Green

This morning, mixed and sprayed app 3 of glyphosate on most areas.

Later, mowed family member lawn. But got thrown off schedule because the people next door were burning fresh greenery and the wind was blowing thick smoke in our direction. Had fo wait it out for 45 min, and then got thrown off schedule. Mowed in the fastest gear the tractor had to compensate for time, after letting air out of the tires to improve the cut and stability. Finished in less than 1 hour, including double mowing the main back area at highest and then next next HOC down. Did not get to trim, or spray the Gallery I had mixed. Hopefully it'll last mixed.

Came home and mowed. It was 6pm by the time I started. Got the height on the Toro messed up and wondered why it was cutting too low. Figured it out and fixed it. Mowed everywhere except the upper back.

Did not get to water seeded areas.

No rest. Feel like crap. Finally going to eat dinner. Need to relax.

Got rid of the test plot stakes before mowing. Experiment was a loss due to Triv infestation. In fact, most of what I mowed in that area today was Triv seedheads that were a foot high.

Ant traps went out yesterday, a bit late.


----------



## Green

Raked out majority of Triv spots in main lawn, and added topsoil to many in the front and side.


----------



## Green

Finished putting down topsoil or compost on spots to seed, and then seeded most of the dead spots in the front, side, and lower back. Covered with peat moss by hand. Watered the spots. Pulling out all the stops (soil, peat moss) since it's so late in the season. These really speed up germination and are worth it if you're late in the Spring. Also helps protect the new grass from the heat and feed it. Last year, the spots I didn't cover took forever, and I didn't use soil on many areas, either.

Trimmed.

Neighbor on non-garage side had irrigation turned on yesterday. Hopefully it doesnt run every day and saturate my overseed near the border like two years ago, which was what thinned the grass in the first place.

Local lawn company applied 2nd app to the normal two yards, and I believe 11th neighbor had his company come the day before (3rd app for him).


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## Green

Got less than 0.15 inch of rain over the past 48 hours.


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## Green

Started watering the seeded areas today (actually started last night).

Dug out 3 big Triv plants I'd been watching, from the planted area next to the shed in the lower back/low input area.

Sprayed final app of Triclopyr ester this evening for clover, including spraying some low input areas to thin it out.

Sprayed a mix of Tenacity, Gallery, and leftover Triclopyr residue on vegetation/mulch behind the back planted area.

Sprayed Certainty application #1 (of 2) at 0.5oz per acre rate (2 small scoops in 1.75 gal of water) on the ~1K of upper side area. It says not to mow for 2 days after. The next couple of weeks will be interesting. Hopefully it won't destroy the lawn totally. Last year, I did the lower rate 3 times last year, instead of the higher rate twice, so we will see. I have the appropriate label.


----------



## Chris LI

How many apps of the Triclopyr ester have you done so far, and what were the intervals? Do you have good control?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> How many apps of the Triclopyr ester have you done so far, and what were the intervals? Do you have good control?


I think 2 apps on any given area pretty much got rid of it. Maybe 14 days apart...I'd have to look back at the notes here. I never had this sort of success with the amine. It would hurt it, but then a lot would come back a few months later.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> Chris LI said:
> 
> 
> 
> How many apps of the Triclopyr ester have you done so far, and what were the intervals? Do you have good control?
> 
> 
> 
> I think 2 apps on any given area pretty much got rid of it. Maybe 14 days apart...I'd have to look back at the notes here. I never had this sort of success with the amine. It would hurt it, but then a lot would come back a few months later.
Click to expand...

Thanks...similar experience here. I was a little late to the party this year and it started to take over before I got to spraying last week. I'm hoping to knock it out for good, with the ester this year.


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## Green

Watered the reseed spots twice.

Watered the main front overseed area for about a half hour using the impact sprinkler, for a half inch or more.

Finally mowed that area before watering, but accidently hit and destroyed a white sprinkler flag I was using as a marker, despite being careful. I think part of it is still on the ground. Last time this happened, I saw sparks. Can't be good for the blade.

Also mowed the side front overseed area for the first time, including part of the garage side. Got a new dust mask.

Also mowed the upper back for the first time of the year. The overseed didn't work so great. Very little germinated there. Guess I'll be repeating in late Summer.

All areas got mowed at the 3.75 inch setting with the old mower. I might take some of the areas down to 3.25 in the future. Not sure. See how it goes.

Last, but not insignificant, I dug up and replaced the driveway/sidewalk sprinkler head and replaced the 4-inch head that was too elevated, with a 6-inch pressure regulated model flush with the sidewalk. It should pop up at least 3 inches above the grass surface when all is said and done. So it should clear 4-inch grass halfway decently. That was the original problem, and was why I originally raised the first head a couple of years ago, but being elevated above the grade of the sidewalk brought a bunch of issues. I removed some rocks at the same time while digging. as well, today.

Neighbor's got mowed today.


----------



## Green

Bunch of hand watering today:

All seed and most new grass areas. Hellstrip and curb areas, the sprinkler repair area, and a dry spot or two forming on the front hill.

Last night got into the 40s, and Northern/higher elevation areas in the state dipped into the high and mid 30s, and some had a bit of frost. I believe it was a record low for this date. I'll take all cool days and nights I can get, as they are helping with the seeding and keeping things from drying out.


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## Green

Mowed, trimmed family member lawn and applied 2 lbs of 2.68% Pendi on the back hill/edges mostly. Sprayed 0.4 oz of Gallery in 1.5 gal of water on the edges. Put down about 12-15 lbs of 6-2-0 2.5% Fe Milo on the back, focusing more on brown and slower growing areas and omitting the very aggressively growing former garden area (which got some Pendi, too). That was about 0.15 lb N/M. Just want to keep it dense over the Summer, but not surge grow. It's already growing too fast despite no fert this year and some large spots starting to brown for some unknown reason. The Tenacity app from the previous time bleached the unknown forage grass, and I'd like to follow up with another app soon. The aggressive weed control is honestly to make my life easier, so I'm not dealing with tons of Horseweed, etc., when I mow. The lawn is keeping pace with others in the area; I can't ask for more. Left a trimmer spool for my uncle. Did some much needed quick pruning of annoying branches, mostly Maple.

At home, I mowed the front and upper side minus the overseed areas at 3.25 in with the old mower. Used the manual mower around the seeded spots. Really need to get Tenacity on those spots asap. Did not get to water them today. Mowed the lower back, lower side, and low input area with the Toro at 2.75 in using side discharge. Will raise it next time. Mowed the area behind the shed at 4 inches. I plan to take plugs from that area to fill in the dead spots where the Triv was, and then overseed the donor area with shade tolerant cultivars in late Summer. This was the area where the KBG roots died back over the Winter.

Put out mosquito dunks in the flood prone area after mowing. Bugs are pretty bad outside lately.

Next time: spray Tenacity, trim, and take care of spots that failed screwdriver test.


----------



## Green

Sprayed Tenacity on the reseeded areas. Pretty sure I'm going to skip a second blanket app on the balance of the lawn to continue the pre-M effect. I'll just pull or spot spray whatever crabgrass comes up.

Watered the seeded areas because it didn't rain. They were dry, since I didn't water yesterday.

Pulled some forage grass in a localized area in the low Input area. Some was Timothy, but some was another type with narrower blades and lighter color that had rhizomes. I guess some will grow back, but I'll keep pulling it to burn out the energy in the roots.

Got 0.8 inch of rain from some downpours associated with nearby thunderstorms this evening. Neighbor across from me put down fert earlier in the day. Wonder how much runoff there was.

Neighbor next door got their Pendi app down within the past couple of days per my guidance for a split app.


----------



## Green

In the middle of the day, a guy I knew from high school was working at the house next door. For some reason, he accidentally parked his truck with the front tire just up on the curb/lawn. I realized after he left that he had driven over my sprinkler head, and it tilted down to the side ever so slightly. So, I got out a small hand shovel, and pried it back to the upright position, filled in with extra soil and packed it tight with my fingers, removed and cleaned under the rubber cap, and then used a garden fork to decompact/aerate where the truck tire had been.

Watered the reseeded areas twice by early afternoon (plus last night's rain). Cleaned up all the sticks and oak tree stuff from the driveway. And string trimmed. It's 87F right now and sunny; warmest day this year so far.

5 days since seeding the Triv spots; no germination just yet, but probably around the corner...

House on the next street over that last year had their driveway done, and reseeded one side after, had fert put down today. Looks like applicator went a little heavier on that thin area. It has been filling in, slowly over time.

My neighbor who used Carbon-X at about the half lb N rate a couple of weeks ago, now has that nice signature ultra dark green color from that product that is a hallmark of AMS mixed with slower release materials.


----------



## Green

New to-do list:

-Fertilize overseed areas in front
-Fertilize last year's reseed areas and any areas developing rust/red thread lightly (foliar app)
-Tenacity
-biofungicide app 1
-Mow
-Pull and transplant grass plugs
-Glyphosate final areas
-Glyphosate area in flood prone area
-8-0-4 on front
-Prune tree
-plant tree?
-Second mosquito barrier app
-Milo on upper back
-shampoo on upper back
-Dimension/Pendi split app 2
-Hydretain on low input area
-shrub fert
-take apart, clean, and grease pump sprayer


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## Green

On and off rain (probably less than 1/3 inch), enough to keep seed moist without help. That reminds me, I just noticed the first bit of germination starting!

Yesterday evening, front soil temps were 70 and up but under 80.


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## Butter

@Green 
When you apply shampoo what rate are you shooting for? How often do you use it? Are you using a specific brand or is it more about a specific ingredient?
Thanks.


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## Green

Butter said:


> @Green
> When you apply shampoo what rate are you shooting for? How often do you use it? Are you using a specific brand or is it more about a specific ingredient?
> Thanks.


Honestly, I don't get to do it that often, but I try to do it when the soil is hydrophobic. Like near the street, if I start watering slowly, and it sort of runs off instead of soaking in. Another case is before Summer stress sets in. You need a really good rain or irrigation soon after applying for it to be effective. It helps more of that water get to the roots and stops runoff.

I just go for the least expensive, ideally clear, shampoo, like V05. I'm looking for lauryl sulfate and/or laureth sulfate surfactants high up in the ingredient list.

I just throw some into a sprayer and apply. I don't measure, but I also don't overdo it by using a whole bottle on a small area.


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## Butter

Thanks. I used to use Dollar General Baby Shampoo a lot until my friends and family gave me so much crap about it!


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## Green

Mowed the three front and side overseed areas at 3.75 in, including first mow on the garage side overseed (a shaded area). Probably just the old grass got cut in all these areas, though. I don't think the new grass has gotten to 3.75 inches yet. Mowed the side front at 3.25 in (edges at 3.75 in setting to prevent scalping). Mowed the upper back at 3.75 in. Mowed the lower back and low input area at 3.25 in, but the low input area with its uneven ground in some areas really needs to be mowed higher as the temps increase. 2 inches in some high spots is just too short, and overall I felt like I was cutting too low. Time to start raising the mowing height again. Took off a good amount, maybe 50 percent (3 inches).

Low 70s today, but windy and horrible allergy weather. Watered reseed spots once and the low input seed areas as well. Took allergy medication for third time this year and still felt it.

Edited on 6/15/21 for spelling.


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## ruxie88

Green said:


> Low 70s today, but windy and horrible allergy weather. Watered reseed spots once and the low input seed areas as well. Took allergy medication for third time this year and still felt it.


Allergies are hitting me hard this year. I've been on medication for 10-days straight. First time I had to do that in several years.


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## Green

ruxie88 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Low 70s today, but windy and horrible allergy weather. Watered reseed spots once and the low input seed areas as well. Took allergy medication for third time this year and still felt it.
> 
> 
> 
> Allergies are hitting me hard this year. I've been on medication for 10-days straight. First time I had to do that in several years.
Click to expand...

I went all last year and maybe the previous year without, but suffered a few times. Looks like I'll need it again tomorrow when I use the tractor mower on the other property.


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## Green

Today:

The sun is getting intense...near the peak for the year. Even at 78F max air temp today, the grass was starting to stress as soil moisture decreases. I watered that portion of the low input area that got cut too short, as it was starting to burn up. The soil is not so great, and is compacted, which doesn't help. Put down an inch overall with the oscillating sprinkler.

Applied first fertilizer app to the front and side overseed areas:
-Side front overseed (roughly 400 square feet): 1/3 lb of Scotts Step 4: 32-0-12 (0.25 lb N)
-Garage side overseed (roughly 0.25K): 1 lb of 5-2-0 Milo with 4% Fe and 40% WSN as starter fert (0.25 lb N)
-Main front overseed: (roughly 375 square feet): just under 1/3 lb of Scotts Step 4 (0.25 lb N)

On most of these, I'll pick up with my regular fertilizer schedule. The main front area is going to need an app or two of Carbon-X due to the poorest soil situation (tree competition, etc.)

I watered each of these areas: the garage side by hand until saturated. The side front area with the sprinkler until I got a good half inch, and the main front area at least 0.25 inch with the sprinkler.

The irrigated areas stayed wet going into the night as I was kind of late watering (afternoon). Not ideal, but the dewpoint was low and temps are actually going into the 50s tonight. Should be ok.

I continue watering the reseed patches and the low input Hard Fescue overseed area at least once most days, if not twice for the front areas. Tomorrow may need 3x.


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## Green

Mowed family member lawn, but did not do the entire main front, as it's going dormant. The front is the most into dormancy, progressively less into the back. The far half of the back still required a good 4 inches to be cut off, though (50%). Also hand watered the main front road corner and edge near sidewalk, and the transplanted area from the Winter damage.

-------------------------

Watered seeded areas twice. 87F today with strong sun. Front hill was drought stressing, so I hand watered the worst spots at 4PM (as well as the hellstrip areas and corners). I'll come back tomorrow morning and wafer fully. Also stained mailbox.


----------



## Green

Watered the front hill and adjacent slope with about 0.5 inch of water, as things were too stressed for comfort.

Finally did the deed. Sprayed glyphosate on the section of the flood prone area that I plan to renovate. Any later in the year, and the Triv might not kill fully, even in shade. I'm committing to the reno. Despite the shade, I'm going to try MyHolidayLawn KBG. It's a slow grower, and hopefully it can tolerate being flooded.

Mowed the main front and side. Holding out at 3.25 inches. Mowed around the seeded areas. Also mowed both overseed areas to promote drying. Bag mowed a couple areas with lots of Triv (or even annua) seedheads just in case. Don't know if they could be viable so fast, but you never know.

Fixed the Scott's "Pro" spreader.

Front, side, and low input area grass is getting rough looking. Some red thread spots here and there, drought stress, and possibly some rust starting. AMS spoonfeeding might be in the near future for that.

Fertilized: 11 lbs of Protene 8-0-4 on the main front, 7 lbs on the side front (minus garage side). (0.375 lb N). And roughly 9 lbs on the opposite side.. (A bit higher rate). Put down approx. 8 lbs of 6-2-0, 2.5 Fe, 1/3 fast release Milorganite on the upper back. Grass is thinned out. Overseed failed. Maybe I did it too early. I'll repeat in August.


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## Green

Couldn't tell if it was really going to rain or not. It went from 70% to 30% back to 80% chance.

I went outside and managed to find the hose end sprayer, backflow preventer, old bottle of Hydretain ES Plus II from a few years ago, and a bottle of lawn shampoo. Measured out about 15oz of the Hydretain and applied to the ~2,000 square feet of the low input area that gets driest. Had issues with both the hose and sprayer (kinking up and the sprayer breaking), and got myself all wet but got it sprayed. Meanwhile, it was starting to rain a bit. Then I did the upper back with a couple of ounces of the shampoo and whatever of the Hydretain was left in the sprayer. Setting 4 seemed to work pretty well, but the thing kept falling apart and spraying out everywhere when I least expected it. The gasket that holds the sprayer nozzle to the bottle shot out at one point, but luckily I found it and screwed everything back together.

It's going to be interesting to see what the Hydretain does this year, if anything. I'm not new to it, but it has never seemed to do much of anything. One year, I swear it made the weeds grow better (think infestation level) and didn't help the grass. But other years, I maybe didn't apply it right. This year, I did everything right...apply to damp soil with a hose end sprayer. Got watered in by light rain within 20 minutes. And then heavy rain less than an hour later. If the product works, I should be seeing results after this app.

Edit: rainfall was 0.95 inch. It came over a fairly short period of a couple of hours.


----------



## Green

Reference photo of the main front about 6 weeks ago before killing Triv and reseeding but after digging some out over the Winter and early Spring (that's what the small holes are from on the left side):










Speaking of Triv, this Purdue article gives an excellent description that I find very accurate to what I've seen on here and in the wild:

http://purdueturftips.blogspot.com/2014/11/weed-of-month-for-november-2014-is.html

Only question is, he talks about stolons germinating. Did he mean seeds?


----------



## Green

Mowed the lower back/lower side, and much of the low-input area. Used the Toro mower at 3.25 inches, which is a slight HOC increase. Unfortunately, the drive wheels seized up a couple of times. Never had that happen before, and the mower is a year old. Wonder what could cause that. I was able to wiggle them free eventually, both times, by trying to roll the mower back and forth, a bit at a time, and it seemed to work ok after.

Pruned the young Hickory in the front this evening, taking off a bunch of the lowest branches, as the leaves were draping on the ground.

There is red thread scattered in the main front. Mostly near the Hickory tree, where there's some mild shade part of the day. I think the Velocity herbicide has something to do with the disease developing. The herbicide acts like a PGR (and not a great one--the grass yellows and looks like bad drought stress instead of getting darker green like with T-Nex). But the slowed growth likely has a lot to do with it. I'll probably throw some extra N at it.


----------



## Green

Mowed the upper back at 3.75 in. Going to leave it there until I overseed in late Summer. The lawn is TTTF/KBG, and the KBG is just not making it through the times of the year that are cool and damp, with shade. The grass is a bit thin. I'll spoonfeed it all Summer to try to keep the annual rust infestation from occurring, but only every 3-4 weeks or so, as I do not want the existing KBG to thicken too much before the overseed. I will overseed with TTTF seed only again (dormant seeding was attempted this Winter, but essentially failed on that particular area).

Mowed the rest of the low input area, using the older mower at the top 3.75 inch setting here, too. Double mowed, first pass side discharge; second pass perpendicular/mulching. A lot of the reason for that double mow was to put down some lines for when I spray in a couple of days.

Watered the middle side. It was getting a little bit crunchy feeling underfoot. Put down a good inch of water. That should help.

There have been a good number of leaves falling off all of the trees the past week or two. Not sure why. At least, enough to notice them. Not really a lot.

Sprayed the second app of glyphosate on the portion of the flood-prone area that is going to be renovated this year. It is browning a bit. Before spraying, I took the HOC down to 2.6 inches there.

Took apart the 3 gallon sprayer and cleaned and regreased it. It was losing pressure. All good now.

Finally, sprayed Velocity app #2 on the main front (minus the overseeded area), being careful to avoid the reseeded areas in progress as well. I used the 3.5oz per acre rate: 4.54g over 2,000 square feet in 2 gallons of water. Again, I primarily went parallel to the driveway. The third of the lawn closest of the street got about 35% less (did not get the full second pass), which is fine, because it had less Triv and stresses more due to the sun/heat form the road. As mentioned previously, this stuff acts as a PGR as well; the reduced mowing is welcome, but the recent red thread disease and the overall drought-stressed look is not.


----------



## Green

35x25 feet -V
47x25 - C 0.382g
low input

Side: 2.27g V
L: 2.0g V


----------



## Green

Mowed the family member lawn, but only had to do the AC side and various parts of the back (more shaded areas, such as the far half, part near the house, etc.) because it's been really dry lately. Cut down some errant woody plants encroaching on the front path. Neighbor pruned our tree, a welcome change. I can get under it with the riding mower now.

At home, mowed the lower back at 3.25 with the Toro, and the front with the old mower: the side front at 3.75, main front at 3.25 to try to keep the Triv exposed to the sun and heat to fry it out, the garage side at 3.75, other adjacent overseed area at 3.25, and borders at 3.75, but did not mow the curb border as it's drying and browning out.

I really need to water in the front, tomorrow. Everything is with manual sprinklers and hoses for now, as the irrigation system needs work and is not being used this month.


----------



## Green

Started watering in the front. First, I hand watered dry spots/areas (and there was a large area to do). Then, I sprayed shampoo on the bad areas (I need a new hose-end sprayer). Then hand watered again. Then started setting up the sprinklers. I got through the areas most in need of it in the front. Will pick where I left off in the front tomorrow. Unfortunately, the grass did not totally dry in some areas despite a bit of wind the whole day; only stopped watering at around 5:30PM. Tomorrow, I won't go as late. My original goal was to get the front completely done today so I put down my first app of the year of biofungicide tomorrow afternoon (or even this afternoon). it might go down to 59 tonight, but hereafter, everything is in the 60s for nighttime temps, so I've to avoid going into evening with wet grass. I put down an inch of water in many places; half inch or 3/4 in some. I wouldn't have been able to do deep watering on the sloped area without the shampoo. It really makes the difference from the water absorbing versus rolling off. But I also wet the ground really slowly, and kept coming back with the hose. Just spraying or turning on a sprinkler all at once even with shampoo wouldn't have allowed all the water to soak in. But with my method, almost all of it did.


----------



## Green

Yesterday and today: more watering. No rain for about a week now. Did front hill yesterday and finished the garage side and main front today. Watered the hard fescue overseed area at near end of low input area to about a half inch. Started watering upper side but only got to put down a half inch. Will do at least another half inch tomorrow to finish it, then move to other areas.

There was a dry spot in the upper back less than 2 feet by 6 inches or so. I dug up the grass, and dug down about foot. I removed about 2 bucketfulls of rocks/large gravel that was used as base material below the soil and made it into the top soil in some areas. I was able to use the gravel by the deck area. I didn't have much extra soil to fill with, so I mixed sand in to take up space. I'll come back and top dress with a loam/compost mix in a week or two to bring it up to grade and add more organic matter. The sifter was invaluable to separate the soil and rocks.


----------



## Green

Continued watering. Did the upper side again with another inch (total over 2 days: 1.5 inches; about the holding capacity of sandy loam). And watered the first third or so of the low input area (~0.5 inch over like 5 hours).

Sprayed Velocity app 2 on the lower side, between 3.7 and 4 oz/A rate there. Also sprayed app 2 on the middle part of the low input area (sunny part of that area). Used the 3.5oz rate rate there. Grass is starting to enter dormancy as the water is depleted and the soil is poor, so I'll need to water tomorrow there. And sprayed app 1 at the 4.5oz rate on the far end, adjacent to that area (what was the test plot area previously for the Winterizing experiment). The soil there seems to be a bit finer and siltier so it isn't quite wilting just yet.

Transplanted some grass plants into former Triv spots in the main front that I had killed but never reseeded.

Finally, I mowed the lower back at 3.75 in with the Craftsman.

Tomorrow, I'll continue spraying and will trim in back, (maybe lightly dethatch the upper side to expose more Triv first) then water the hellstrip areas, side slope and overseed areas on the side front, back, and more of the low input area.


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## Chris LI

Hopefully, it will bounce back with that nice soaking that you gave it. The roots should be trained a bit from the recent dryness to dive deeper for water.


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## Green

Sprayed final Certainty app on upper side after lightly detaching with groundskeeper rake to expose any Triv. Also sprayed app 1 on far part of low input area.

Watered upper back, garage side, both front overseed areas, slope, upper part of lower back, and middle sunny portion of low input, as well as hellstrips.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Hopefully, it will bounce back with that nice soaking that you gave it. The roots should be trained a bit from the recent dryness to dive deeper for water.


My current understanding of how much water the soil can hold may be overly optimistic. I'm going through the ET article that g-man wrote, and asking some probing questions in the thread to get a better understanding of how some grass goes for weeks and continues growing for a while in a drought during times of high ET. Some of those observations don't square with the math. G-man and bernstem are being helpful there. It could be that my 1.5 inch watering recently was a partial waste. We'll see. I'll get it all figured out eventually. I just know that after a 2 inch rain, you can go a bit longer than after a 1 inch rain.


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## Green

@dfw_pilot: https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=238376#p238376

These were some quick shots on Kodak Portra 160NC last September to use up a roll. Still, the color is rendered so nicely. Imagine Velvia 50 plus a polarizer and taking your time.


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## Green

@Aggrorider1

Here is historic data showing average ET and rainfall for my area. I believe the data go back 10 years. (We have trended drier in the Summer the past ten years than previously.):










And this is the actual ET per day to date for 2020, measured by moisture sensors at the same weather station:


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## Green

@Aggrorider1

If you divide the total monthly ET by # of days per month, the averages per day each month are:

Jan: 0.03 in/day
Feb: 0.04 in/day
March: 0.07 in/day
April: 0.12 in/day
May: 0.16 in/day
June: 0.21 in/day
July: 0.21 in/day
Aug: 0.18 in/day
Sept: 0.14 in/day
Oct: 0.08 in/day
Nov: 0.05 in/day
Dec: 0.03 in/day


----------



## Aggrorider1

Appreciate this info. Should be very helpful.


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## dfw_pilot

Green said:


> These were some quick shots on Kodak Portra 160NC last September to use up a roll. Still, the color is rendered so nicely. Imagine Velvia 50 plus a polarizer and taking your time.


I always wanted to try a few rolls of 160 for some portraits but never did so.

Now that the film hobby is so scarce, I miss my Mamiya 7II. Shoulda never sold it.

Cheers!


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## g-man

@Green this is ET0, right?


----------



## Green

dfw_pilot said:


> Now that the film hobby is so scarce, I miss my Mamiya 7II. Shoulda never sold it.


Yeah, used MF gear especially has gone up in value. The problem is, almost none are still made, which doesn't help. I always thought the idea of a MF rangefinder camera was interesting. Even 35mm bodies have gone up in value in many cases. Only the Nikon F6 is still made in small quantities as far as SLRs go.

Film usage has apparently stabilized in the past few years, but it's still a fraction of what the market was at its peak around 2000 right before the digital switchover started gaining critical momentum.

As far as film, there's still a good selection of b&w, and an ok selection of color, as long as you don't need higher ISOs. 800 is pretty much the highest today in color negative (with Kodak) and 100 in slide film (both brands...Kodak reintroduced an Ektachrome in the past couple of years after 5 years of no slide film production).


----------



## Green

g-man said:


> @Green this is ET0, right?


The top graph and the data I posted are averages per month over about ten years. I don't know if you can call the ones in the graph ET0 since they're for the entire month at once (e.g. 6 inches), but I believe the values I posted can be used as ET0, if I understand the concept of ET0 correctly.


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## Green

Still hot and dry. Got a robocall from the water company saying they want people to conserve for the next 2 days due to very high demand. Call came in while I had two sprinklers in the lower back. I shut them off. One dumped a bit too much water, about 0.8 inch, and the other not enough, maybe 0.2 inch. I then hand watered in the front (especially hellstrips and lower edges, and any dry spots). I will continue hand watering tomorrow if we don't get rain.

I mowed the lower side and long areas in the low input area only. And did so at 4 inches. With how dry it is, there's no other option.

And trimmed a little in the back.


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## Green

2 weeks and no rain (maybe 0.01 inch once). Temps have been 80s to 90 every day (mostly high 80s). And the water company has asked people to voluntarily conserve yesterday, today, and tomorrow. So, I've been hand watering only (in the heat of the day...I know, not the best for evaporation), and picking and choosing the areas I want to water. A minute over a 10x10 area gave about 1/3 inch, so that's what I've been going for, and estimating it based on the time. It actually went pretty fast. In about an hour and a half, I knocked out about 1500 square feet. I did the two sides (the lower side hadn't been watered yet this year, but has shade the first half of the day right now). Did the upper flat part of the side front where it was getting brown or wilted, some edges, parts of the main front, parts of the back, and a few little areas in the low-input area including the overseed (which is struggling). I am going to have to give in and resume using some sprinklers tomorrow...as well as continue to hand water. Hand watering is good because all the water gets to the ground, but it has limitations...I'm not being paid to do it for a few hours. If I was getting $100 per hour to do it, that would be different. There is no way you can go 2 weeks this time of year without major dormancy setting in, without watering, if there's no rain...as much as I wish that were possible. Semi-dormant (what I have now in a few areas) is ok. But I don't want it so go totally brown.

Nextdoor, Chemlawn applied granular today. So, I made sure to hit the edges with the water, just in case. I'm not sure exactly what they use, but it is white and soluble. Might be a combined homogeneous Urea/AMS prill.


----------



## Green

Hickory nuts have started to come down here and there the past couple of weeks, but are still tiny. Lots of leaves, too. Same happened last year. Not sure why. Sedges are starting to pop up in the neighborhood as well.

Continued watering--again, by hand. Put down 0.3-0.5 inch of water on the front hill, hellstrip area including bed, side front slope, front hill bed, and portion of main front in front of the Hickory...almost 1,000 square feet total watered by hand today. Also the low input shady overseed area, some spots there that were browning, etc.

Front hill was so dry that spots such as in the middle were all wilted and looking brown. Footprints stayed, etc. It greened up and sprang back a half hour after watering, so I hit it in time. I guess soil moisture was near zero. Not sure if there's any benefit to doing this, other than saving water (which was the aim). Broke the hand watering into 3 sets to allow it to soak in.

One of these days, I will have to mow...can't just keep going forever without cutting, despite how dry it is.

Sprayed app 1 of biofungicide at approx 2oz/M rate on the back, sides, and front. Should help with the disease pressure. If it rains at some point, I'll repeat the app. Sprayed some (from very old concentrate) Tenacity on weedy brush plants in teh back, and some stuff in low input area.


----------



## Green

Finally mowed this evening. I put it off all this past week due to the lack of any rain over the last two weeks. I've had dry spots appear in many places, with 48 hours of voluntary water restrictions, during which I have only hand watered. There is finally rain expected tomorrow. I did not get to trim or apply fertilizer, but but I got everything mowed.

Mowed the low input area at 4 in with the Toro, and then the back, garage side, and front at the top setting with the Craftsman. Main front is messed up (growth regulation, dryness, drought stress, a bit of fungus) from the herbicide and weather. But if it works, it'll be worth it. So not much was cut off there.


----------



## Green

It finally rained. Roughly 0.6 inch. We had gone 16 days with essentially no rain (maybe 0.01 inch once during the period at most), and temps mostly in the high 80s (some low 90s and some low to mid 80s too), with full sun most of the time. After the rain, I sprayed 0.1 lb/M of N from Ammonium Sulfate on the front and side (including the reseeded spots) to help with recovery. I tried to do an extra pass on the really bad areas, like where there's red thread going on. I think the combination of the rain, the fertilizer, lower temps for a few days, and having just mowed, will help with recovery.


----------



## JDgreen18

Green said:


> It finally rained. Roughly 0.6 inch. We had gone 16 days with essentially no rain (maybe 0.01 inch once during the period at most), and temps mostly in the high 80s (some low 90s and some low to mid 80s too), with full sun most of the time. After the rain, I sprayed 0.1 lb/M of N from Ammonium Sulfate on the front and side (including the reseeded spots) to help with recovery. I tried to do an extra pass on the really bad areas, like where there's red thread going on. I think the combination of the rain, the fertilizer, lower temps for a few days, and having just mowed, will help with recovery.


I got about an inch of rain...man we needed it.


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> I got about an inch of rain...man we needed it.


Yeah. It's raining now. Btw, you must have the same water company...they're asking people to watch their water use and if possible (like if you haven't already) cut back on overall use by 10% because some people are having discolored/contaminated water. They're attributing it to more people using water at home due to the virus, and the distribution and treatment not keeping up. The 2 weeks without rain really brought out the problem. A lot of people don't use water as efficiently as they can when irrigating. I just learned myself that in very sandy soil, anything past 0.75 inch of water is probably wasted totally. And even then, that's only if it has totally dried out and wilting. 0.3-0.5 inch is probably a better typical amount. Plus, the infiltration rate might only be 0.2-0.3 inch per hour in some cases when it's very dry. I have only really watered fully once this year so far, and it was in the past week and a half. I'm doing it all manually (a lot of it this past week by hand to save water).


----------



## Green

Tried to apply SOP 0-0-50 before the rain, but it didn't go too well. I only have the Scotts "Pro" spreader in working condition right now. It doesn't spread the sand evenly for one thing (My SOP is sand, basically...probably Potassium Feldspar as it's pink, but I'm no geologist). I I ended up putting down 0.5 lb/M of K on the low input (longways, minus flood prone) area, the side (up and down with less on the upper), and maybe 1 lb/M on the main front up to the car (perpendicular to driveway). Around the time it began to rain, the spreader started making the familiar crunching noise as if it were going to break from the rough (but fine) sand particles again. I had just repaired it two weeks or whatever ago. Stopped, took it apart, freed it up, and gave up until I fix the Earthway (hopefully next week). As my great aunt is famous for saying (like the song Big Girls Don't Cry)...Ay-yi-yi.

I've had it with these spreaders.


----------



## JDgreen18

@Green 
In the back I water a hour a zone 3 days a week 1 hour is about .4-.5 inch its the only way for me not to burn out. The front get lots of shade 25-30 min a zone is good plus I have better coverage in the front as 30 min gives me .4-.5.
There is no way I can hand water my yard is to big. I haven't gotten a call tho from the water company but I don't have a land line anymore.


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> I haven't gotten a call tho from the water company but I don't have a land line anymore.


They said also not to use it even for a shower if it's discolored, until it clears. They recommend running the water if that happens. Why they didn't think to ask people to use it for irrigation, I don't know. It's a waste to run it down the drain. But hopefully that won't happen to many of us.


----------



## Green

Got another 0.6 inch of rain, for 1.23 inches total yesterday and today.


----------



## Green

A while back, I asked about Zoysia in the Northeast without irrigation. How viable? I walked the neighborhood tonight. Remember we had 2 weeks without rain (mostly high 80s and 0.2-0.25 inch of ET per day), and then rain yesterday and today. Some of the Zoysia was wilting (near curbs and stuff) but seemed to bounce back and is doing adequately. Not sure how many properties are irrigated or fertilized. But I bet if they had their practices (mowing, fert, etc) optimized, it would look better. In any case, there's still a good amount of green in it. Most of these lawns seem to perpetually have a lot of brown, probably due to lowish mowing with a rotary and poor soil.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member lawn. It rained for a minute or two right before, moderately, but thankfully dried in 15 min. It was a bit long as expected, but not unmanageable. But it kept threatening to rain the whole time. I got done in time. Did the back, the front slope/side, a little the opposite AC side, and the perimeter of the front along the house and driveway. A lot of the grass is brown. After mowing, I applied about 0.8 lb of the 2.68% Pendi on the areas that previously only had Tenacity (40% of the side front near the street, part of that edge along driveway, adjacent fixed area from Winter plow damage, and front road corner on the opposite side of the driveway. This is the 2-3 month rate over that size area...should protect until seeding time.

At home, my neighbor was edging, so I asked if I could take some of the sod pieces that generated. I selected some clean pieces, but the lawn overall is clean and in good shape (there were a few broadleaf weeds but I've never seen any Triv in that lawn. He's got good grass (Northern mix with contemporary elite varieties) and I trust it, having observed the lawn since it was planted after a reno when he moved in years ago. I did see a rhizomatous forage grass in his hellstrip and it was in some of the sod pieces, so avoided those and will inspect all pieces carefully before use and pull out anything weedy). I'll be using these to repair some of my killed Triv spots, mainly in the low input area.

I managed to get down approx 0.25 lb N from C-X on my two front overseeded areas as it started to rain and thunder. I covered my hand crank spreader with a plastic bag from the basement floor to keep rain out. All of a sudden shortly into the 2nd fill, the spreader jammed. I kept trying to crank it. Wouldn't budge. Took off the bag and shook the fert into my Scott's push spreader. Imagine my surprise...a large, rusty nail jammed into the exit door of the hand spreader. No clue where that came from. So weird. It wasn't in the spreader to begin with. Doubt it was in the bag used as rain cover. And I weighed the fert, so I would've seen it if it was in there you'd think. Gremlins...

It then rained approx. 0.2 inches.

I'm pretty sure I skipped my 2nd split app of crabgrass pre-M everywhere this year (except low input). This was semi-intentional. Immediate neighbors have good control this year (thanks to having one of them do a split app). CG is starting to germinate lately in other yards the past few weeks. But holding strong here. I pulled one plant this evening from the very edge along the driveway. I have Tenacity and Quinclorac, too, if needed, just in case I miss anything with pulling. But nice to be able to give some areas a partial break from pre-M, and promote better rooting instead.


----------



## JDgreen18

Hey @Green did you ever use the ultramate sg humic soluble powder from Andersons? I forgot I bought it a few years ago but haven't used it yet. I'm almost done with my RGS I bought last year and only have one bag of humic DG left. I am going to switch over to this humic and was curious if you were happy with the product. (Did it help wirh the soggy ground issue you had)


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## critterdude311

Green said:


> A while back, I asked about Zoysia in the Northeast without irrigation. How viable? I walked the neighborhood tonight. Remember we had 2 weeks without rain (mostly high 80s and 0.2-0.25 inch of ET per day), and then rain yesterday and today. Some of the Zoysia was wilting (near curbs and stuff) but seemed to bounce back and is doing adequately. Not sure how many properties are irrigated or fertilized. But I bet if they had their practices (mowing, fert, etc) optimized, it would look better. In any case, there's still a good amount of green in it. Most of these lawns seem to perpetually have a lot of brown, probably due to lowish mowing with a rotary and poor soil.


I think you are on to something with the mowing practices on the zoysia. In my neighborhood, i see people with zoysia lawns who let it grow to 3.5 or 4 inches (cutting every 10 to 14 days) and then they come in and hack it down in to the 1.5" to 2" range and it creates a noticeable browning effect. If it's mowed properly I think you will see a lot less of that unless you are in a drought / severe heat stress situation. Meyer should be peaking in the low 90s.


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Hey @Green did you ever use the ultramate sg humic soluble powder from Andersons? I forgot I bought it a few years ago but haven't used it yet. I'm almost done with my RGS I bought last year and only have one bag of humic DG left. I am going to switch over to this humic and was curious if you were happy with the product. (Did it help wirh the soggy ground issue you had)


I think I used it once at some point. I'll get to it eventually. Thanks for the reminder. I saw the box last week, and then forgot about it again, lol.


----------



## Green

critterdude311 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> A while back, I asked about Zoysia in the Northeast without irrigation. How viable? I walked the neighborhood tonight. Remember we had 2 weeks without rain (mostly high 80s and 0.2-0.25 inch of ET per day), and then rain yesterday and today. Some of the Zoysia was wilting (near curbs and stuff) but seemed to bounce back and is doing adequately. Not sure how many properties are irrigated or fertilized. But I bet if they had their practices (mowing, fert, etc) optimized, it would look better. In any case, there's still a good amount of green in it. Most of these lawns seem to perpetually have a lot of brown, probably due to lowish mowing with a rotary and poor soil.
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are on to something with the mowing practices on the zoysia. In my neighborhood, i see people with zoysia lawns who let it grow to 3.5 or 4 inches (cutting every 10 to 14 days) and then they come in and hack it down in to the 1.5" to 2" range and it creates a noticeable browning effect. If it's mowed properly I think you will see a lot less of that unless you are in a drought / severe heat stress situation. Meyer should be peaking in the low 90s.
Click to expand...

Yeah. I will admit most of the Zoysia immediately around here is improperly managed and does not look good (light green from lack of fert and brown undernesth from who knows what, mowing, as you said?). I see some Zoysia/cool season mixes. It's that same awful color crabgrass gets when N deficient. You can see yellow showing through the green.


----------



## critterdude311

Green said:


> critterdude311 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> A while back, I asked about Zoysia in the Northeast without irrigation. How viable? I walked the neighborhood tonight. Remember we had 2 weeks without rain (mostly high 80s and 0.2-0.25 inch of ET per day), and then rain yesterday and today. Some of the Zoysia was wilting (near curbs and stuff) but seemed to bounce back and is doing adequately. Not sure how many properties are irrigated or fertilized. But I bet if they had their practices (mowing, fert, etc) optimized, it would look better. In any case, there's still a good amount of green in it. Most of these lawns seem to perpetually have a lot of brown, probably due to lowish mowing with a rotary and poor soil.
> 
> 
> 
> I think you are on to something with the mowing practices on the zoysia. In my neighborhood, i see people with zoysia lawns who let it grow to 3.5 or 4 inches (cutting every 10 to 14 days) and then they come in and hack it down in to the 1.5" to 2" range and it creates a noticeable browning effect. If it's mowed properly I think you will see a lot less of that unless you are in a drought / severe heat stress situation. Meyer should be peaking in the low 90s.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yeah. I will admit most of the Zoysia immediately around here is improperly managed and does not look good (light green from lack of fert and brown undernesth from who knows what, mowing, as you said?). I see some Zoysia/cool season mixes. It's that same awful color crabgrass gets when N deficient. You can see yellow showing through the green.
Click to expand...

Haha yea, it's funny you mention that, I see the same thing around here. The poorly maintained Zoysia lawns always have a yellowing effect. I think it's a combination of the color just being generally lighter in color to the cool season turf, compounded when the homes which have it are neglected, as in, they do the bare minimum required for lawn maintenance (0 fert, 0 weed treatment, minimal and improper cutting), so it winds up being the only thing which survives in the yard. When they come in and hack it down once every 10 days, it looks like crap because the underlying stems / stolons are the majority of what is left until it regrows. My experience with Meyer and Innovation has been positive so far, but if it's not properly maintained, I can absolutely see where it would look like crap up in the northeast anyway.


----------



## Green

Got 0.25 inch of rain since the last gauge dump the other day.

Dug up some areas in the back near the wall that had Ryegrass mixed in, and set them on top of the soil. I'll transplant them to other areas and then transplant some new plugs in.


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## Green

Yesterday: off and on rain, 0.1 inch by afternoon...and another 0.1 inch later.


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## Green

Mowed everything but the upper/middle side and front driveway slope. Took far third of low input and main front back down to 3.25, and did 3.75 in most places. 4 inches in most of low input to avoid breaking 1/3 rule but would have preferred to go lower seeing how there's rain coming tomorrow. Put down approx 20 lbs of 6-2-0 Milorganite on low input area (0.18 lb N), and put out a lot of mosquito dunks in the area that floods. Outdoor faucets were done today.


----------



## Green

Yesterday:

Fertilized Rhododendron. Got some rain...about 0.17 inch.


----------



## Green

To-do list:

-Buy mulch
-Daffodil bulbs?
-pruning - shrubs
-Buy and apply late Spring/early Summer lawn fert
-Mow, trim, and spray at family member's and sharpen blade
-Trim
-Check for rocks in dry spots in back
-Cut down tall weeds near natural area border in back
-Plant grass plugs
-Mow
-Biofungicide
-Mosquito barrier
-Vines
-Order soil/sand, herbicide, mower air filter, mosquito dunks, sprinkler head, faucet backflow, spreader parts, and hose adapters, etc.
-Info for neighbor
-Spread mulch
-Fertilize azalea 
-Fire up irrigation system zones
-Mix glyphosate
-Selective herbicides
-Change oil in old mower
-Snowblower
-Order seed
-Clean wall
-Amazon: hose guides? Melnor? Coupler?
-Solar lights
-Computer
-Car


----------



## Green

Trimmed. Planted the grass plugs I got from my neighbor earlier in the week in the back/low input area in some of the killed spots. I checked them for Triv and didn't see any. They're pretty clean. A lot of fine fescue. I tried to make it work.


----------



## Green

Sprayed biofungicide on main lawn except side front. 4oz rate in back and about 2oz rate in front.

Pulled up some crabgrass in the main front near neighbor border (remember, I never did pre-M in a bunch of places). Also used some Tenacity in a handheld bottle on what I couldn't pull easily, as well as some rhizomatous weedy grass near the lower driveway edge that I never totally got rid of other years by pulling. And some at the neighbor border.

Finally started up the irrigation system for the year before spraying. Yes, late. I guess it counted as a syringing session. Hand waterd the usual new grass and plug areas, and set zone 5 to water tomorrow morning for 4 x 12 min on each hour, for about 0.37 inch at 50% depletion (no real drought stress noticed).


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## Green

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 4x15 min and 4x20 min respectively, tomorrow morning on the hour. Aim is a half inch. Tightened nut behind handle on front faucet at plumber's advice to eliminate the leak between it and the handle. Problem solved.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member lawn.

Home: mowed lower back with Toro at 3.75 in. mowed portion of low input area that needed it at 4 inches using side discharge.


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## Green

Mowed upper back, hellstrip areas, and main front at 3.75 in as the rain started. Total: roughly 0.15-0.2 in.

I think my neighbor next door may have gone against my advice and fertilized in the last few days. Not only that, but my furthest neighbor, who bought his house recently, appears to have had another fert app by his lawn service in the past couple of days. That brings it to 5 apps so far this year since April, I believe. Even if they are putting down only 0.3 lb N each time (doubtful...I'd guess more like 0.5 lb or even higher based on what I've seen/smelled while walking by), that means his lawn has gotten at least 1.50 and probably more like 2.50 lbs of N so far this Spring...yikes. At least he has good soil, good grass cultivars, a good mower, keeps up with the mowing a few times per week, and has gotten some good advice from his neighbor!


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## Green

Mowed side front, side, and rest of low input area (at about 3 inches in the far end due to how damp it can get...the Triv is still alive).

Fertilized back azalea. Started harvesting the grass seed from the seedheads I let grow. Did the ones from the TTTF (and KBG) near the front door daffodil area. @Powhatan

Ordered seed.


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## Powhatan

Interesting too see if you get germination. My harvested KY-31 germinated but not TTTF. I made two separate test plots.


----------



## Green

Powhatan said:


> Interesting too see if you get germination. My harvested KY-31 germinated but not TTTF. I made two separate test plots.


I'll try it in pots at some point. Some was still a little green/hard to remove from the stalks. But a lot of it came off really easily, so I guess it was ready. I also have some seed from last year, including Poa Triv. I'm really curious if those seeds are viable, especially at low HOCs. That will be an interesting experiment.

Speaking of KY-31, I was finally able to source some clean, Oregon-grown seed. A local dealer got a large shipment recently, and it's 0% weed and 0% other crop. Cost twice what most does ($4.80/lb for the 5-lb minimum before tax and shipping; I assume larger quantities will be less per lb, but that still puts it in the 2x price range of most), but I think it'll be worth it. If you are interested in getting some from them, I'm sure they'd be happy to help an occasional out-of-stater...just let me know. Not sure how long they'll have it in stock. They said they have a few pro landscapers who buy hundreds of pounds at a time.


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## Green

Today: Mowed damp grass with the Toro while it started to sprinkle, and then put the mower the heck away before it got too wet. Hoping the residual heat from running it helps it dry in these situations. Mowed the lower back down to the 3.25 inch setting, and nearest half of the low input area down to 3.75. Going a bit shorter right now as we're getting sufficient rain again and there are more days with wet grass. Lots of disease spots and areas. Not sure if I'm going to use a real fungicide on any of those areas...depends. If this is as bad as gets and the weather cooperates over the next week, I'm ok with how it is right now.

Edit: the rain was roughly 0.75 inch.


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## Green

Started to transplant some of the grass from the back I loosened up last week to the side and front.

Ordered from united Seeds.

Yesterday, checked soil temps. 80F in the front in the late afternoon (cloudy) at 4 inches.

Set zone 5 to water for 10 min x4 on each hour as usual tomorrow morning (about 0.3 inch). I got thrown off because it didn't rain today. Yesterday there was an 80% chance so I thought I wouldn't have to water. I'm a day behind now.


----------



## Green

Got my seed order from Hart.

Started mowing in the front - main and the hill. Rectangular hellstrip area. 3.75 in. Upper side at 3 in.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 20 and 25 min respectively x4 on the hour for tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Mowed rest of front, and side, back, and low input. Trimmed in back. Still using several HOCs from 3-4 in in diff areas for diff purposes. Going to have to mow once more tomorrow in the front.

For some reason, neighbor behind me keeps having fert applied in the wrong seasons. Had his second app today, same day as neighbor across. He will not have any in Fall most likely. Don't get it. Just goes to show that even with a lawn service, if you pay for it at the wrong time of year, they will do it.

Set zone 4 to water for 15 min x4 tomorrow AM in order to get the garage overseed watered and get some water down before the really hot weather next week.


----------



## Green

Watered the side front slope 0.5 inch x2 with 2 Orbit heads, but doubt the whole inch made it into the soil, due to runoff and evap.

Watered the middle part of low input area from like 12:30 to 6 PM with the oscillarpting sprinkler, putting down at least 0.5 inch and causing puddles (bad soil back there...hence the term "flood prone". I should apply that humic/KOH stuff soon.

Mowed family member lawn and trimmed. Holding some green. Also clipped lots of Horseweed in the "hardscaped" areas. So, my pre-M worked (the early Pendi app with followups) because unlike other years, there are very few in the lawn so far. First app was March 18th. I read that for Horseweed, an early app plus followups is key. It also worked against the Prostrate knotweed (I bet the Gallery helped for both, too. And the Tenacity.). Horseweed is awful to mow, so it was totally worth it. (Mower feels like it's going to break, the noise is so bad when you mow them...even with a tractor. Today was a breeze by comparison.)

At home, mowed the front hill and main front at 3.75 inch with the old mower. Finally ready for the heat.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 15 and 20 min x4 and zone 3 for 25 min x4 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

I should not have messed with the irrigation! I heard rain at 6:30, got up and turned it off then the rain stopped. Turned it back on. The end.

Also set up the oscillating sprinkler to water the furthest third of the low input area. Roughly 0.4 inch, between 2 and 4 PM.

Ordered my final seed today (from LI) and should go out Mon.

Note: need to adjust a couple of sprinkler arcs: head in middle of driveway edge in zone 1 goes very slightly too far to the right onto driveway. Head in zone 2 along middle of front walk edge stops in line with the walk but should really arc all the way to the next head near the door for head-to-head coverage.

Set zone 5 to water 12 min x4 (0.4 inch) tomorrow morning.

Started noticing spurge in lawn areas the past week or so, first near edges and now in low input area. But most edges are still free of it, so the Gallery is working.

Tomorrow: continue watering and apply biofungicide.


----------



## Green

Today: watered/syringed some areas including the garage side overseed area.

Sprayed Biofungicide on the back and side front. Higher rates in back due to more disease and less watering.

Continuing watering in low input area. Put down 0.25 inch to 0.6 inch on different areas (shade vs. sun).

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 11 and 14 min x4 tomorrow morning (0.37 inch) between 6 and 9AM. I might add another cycle manually later.


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## Green

95F today, and about the same tomorrow but likely more humid. Forecast not to go below 75F tonight, which is fairly uncommon in this area (we are not Miami, so it really only happens a few times each Summer). Even more surprising since the dewpoint is only 67 at the moment, so the heat must be building up to cause it rather than the humidity.

Did supplemental watering on zones 1 and 2 in the middle of the day and lightly syringed (very light, just misted) the front hill. Adjusted the arcs of the two heads in the main front and will check again in a week. Main front is very green and is growing due to on-point watering over the past week (not allowing high moisture depletion), so I feel comfortable going another day or two without watering.

Hand watered the grass and plants near the mail box. Sprayed biofungicide at 2oz rate on the main front, and parts of the side front and back that got watered, and used up the last bits on the areas with disease in the low input area.

Watered rhododendron Bush approx 1/3 inch.

Set zone 5 to water for 15 min x4 tomorrow morning (about a half inch).


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## Green

Continued hand watering, including garage side and hard fescue overseed areas. Watered Japanese Maple 0.7 inch or so. Middle of side front is way too dry.

Collected seeds from the TTTF and KBG in the back.

Planning to mow tomorrow evening.


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## Green

Watered the middle flat part of the side front (behind mulch bed) with impact to ~0.25 inch.

Mowed lower back, side, main front and hellstrip areas (3.75) and low input (4 in and 2.75 on the area with Triv--little experiment). Hand watered earlier in the day. Hoping the rain materializes tomorrow or the next day.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 9 and 11 min x 4 tomorrow morning. Very dry.

Finally mailed out my soil samples today, 3 months late. I hate to say they've sat a while. I don't care...using them anyway. They've been sealed in bags.


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## Green

Watered hard fescue overseed area and dry spots in back and low input area by hand and used impact sprinkler on middle side for 0.25 inch.

Got a small amount of rain this evening, maybe a tenth. Right after, watered zone 5 for 12 min and made a minor adjustment to the arc of the head at the driveway/sidewalk corner.

Set zone 5 to water for 12 min x2 tomorrow morning.


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## Chris LI

How bad are the heat/drought conditions affecting you? Are you supplemental watering to prevent stress, or combat it? Work/life got in the way last week and I couldn't keep up, so I'm playing catch up.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> How bad are the heat/drought conditions affecting you? Are you supplemental watering to prevent stress, or combat it? Work/life got in the way last week and I couldn't keep up, so I'm playing catch up.


It has been super dry. Under 0.15 inch of rain the past two weeks (13 days technically) until tonight around 9PM. We just picked up almost 0.7 inch, most of it bordering on torrential. Not sure how much soaked into the slopes.

I got the sprinkler system turned on a couple of weeks ago, and have been watering the front fairly aggressively since then, during the previous hot period. Yesterday, the front hill was very heat/drought stressed in the second half of the day. There is brown creeping in everywhere.

Every part of the lawn has been watered at least once this year now.

Today, mowed the upper back (slightly overgrown - 8 days), side front including hellstrip areas (minus middle part that is ultra dry), and lower side. Watered garage side overseed by hand after mowing as it was super dry. Skipped watering the Triv reseed areas today, as it was mostly cloudy, despite being near 90.


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## Green

Mowed most of the rest (near half minus some areas adjoining the rest of the yard) of the low unit area at 4 in.

Mowed the lower back at 3.75 with old mower, then trimmed.

Pulled some crabgrass and spot sprayed Tenacity on those areas and some clover spots and forage grass (app 2) in the front. Spritz bottle.


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## Green

This morning, sprayed Certainty and Velocity for Poa Triv (and annua): 2nd and final app of Certainty on the area adjacent and including the flood-prone area (minus glyphosated area). Used the standard Certainty rate over about 1,200 square feet. Sprayed 4.5oz per acre rate of Velocity on the opposite half of that far end (2nd app), about 875 square feet. And sprayed 3rd app on the middle portion behind that after raking out some dead grass lightly (about 900 square feet and used 3oz/acre--which is likely the final app on that area this year). The Certainty and Velocity likely did overlap where the adjacent areas meet. There is still greenish-brownish Poa Triv in the far area...so it's still alive. Last Summer, a lower rate of Certainty didn't even touch it...just suppressed it. I'm using the higher rate this year, and mowing lower.

The other areas--3rd apps on the lower side and main front--will have to wait until the extreme heat breaks later in the week. Simply too hot to mess with the good areas. It will be longer than 28 days, which the label recommends as the normal max time interval, but the grass has barely just about dully recovered from the last 2 apps, even now. I could do 2 more apps on those areas, if needed though, for 4 total.

Mowed back of family member lawn real quick (1), and watered the plants and grass near the front walk. Then sharpened one of my standard MTD blades (I think the original one) for the craftsman mower. They are so hard to check the balance of, due to the complex shaped bolt hole. Maybe a better balance stand would help...? Just have a generic one.

At home this evening, removed the gator blade which was dulling, and put on the sharpened blade, then mowed the front and upper side. Side discharged the main front due to the height and amount of material to avoid leaving trails of uncut stuff in the wheel path. With the heat, the confetti clippings from the side discharge will reduce to nothing in no time.

Earlier, this morning, I ran zones 1 and 2 and watered each for 30 min (about 0.25 inch) to top off soil moisture before major heat comes (could go up to 99F Monday).

Still pulling up small crabgrass plants in front here and there near the neighbor border due to not using a pre emergent. A few years ago, someone side discharged a bunch of crabgrass seed toward my side. Bet it's from that. Also been pulling spurge, mostly in low input area. Most of it is fairly small still.

Set zones 4 and 5 to water 15 min x4 tomorrow morning (half inch).


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## Green

Ran zones 1 and 2 for 4 min each today to combat heat stress, and did light hand watering/syringing on heat stressed green areas, and heavier watering on adjacent browning areas. Watered main front overseed to about 0.9 inch using impact sprinkler.

Zone 5 head near concrete marker along driveway may need a slightly larger nozzle to combat heat stress better.

Set zone 3 for 75 min (half inch) and zones 1 and 2 to water for 11 and 15 min x 4 (0.37 inch) tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Did not hit 99 after all--forecast changed and it hit 94-95. Dew point rose to the mid/high 60s. So it was not as bad as expected. But still very sunny and hot.

Syringed and watered by hand in front (side front slope into part of adjacent flat area have been burning out the worst and required the most supplemental water) and garage side, and watered 2 parts of low input area: area near and including hard fescue overseed area and middle area treated the other day with Velocity.

Also repaired the end of a hose.

Set zone 5 to water for 12 min x 4 tomorrow morning, and will run an extra manual cycle after that for a few minutes at least.

10:20PM edit: 83F, 69 dewpoint...normally there would be lots of dew by now under such conditions, but there is not. Many areas are totally dry, even those watered today. I think the 6 mph wind (not common at this hour) is helping to keep the grass drier. The back has a bit of dew, and is being blocked moreso from the wind.


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## Green

Changed the nozzle in the second head along driveway in zone 5 (next to concrete marker). Took out a 3.5 dark blue and put in a 4.0 dark blue because the grass nearby was browning and stressed. Removed a few caps and cleaned out the adjustment ports with the hose, as they were clogged with sand again. Ran zone 5 for another 15 min or so. Hand watered.

The zone 1 head that does nearly a 360 arc should probably be increased slightly, due to chronic dryness in that area. Maybe tomorrow.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 10 and 12 min x4 tomorrow morning (0.3 inch).


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## Green

Hand watered a few areas again.

Changed nozzle in zone 1 middle head from 2.5 low angle to 3.5 low angle. I might have to refine the setting at some point. Close for now.

Set zones to water tomorrow morning: zone 4: 15 min x4. Zone 3: 30 min x 3. Zone 5: 15 min x4.


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## Green

Hoping for some rain tonight.

Today, mowed low input (near half) at 4 in, and back, sides (not upper side), main front, front hill/hellstrips at 3.75.


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## Green

Today: Watered zones 1 and 2 for an hour each, with irrigation audit. Results are below. Zone 1 road/driveway corner head got jammed with sand and stopped rotating. Good thing I was running them during the day, or I wouldn't have known.

Also mowed the upper side prior to that.

Watered the near half of the low input area (0.25 to 0.3 inch).

Sprayed biofungicide at the 2oz rate on all main lawn areas except the side front. Did the garage side.

Need to do some nozzle changes:

Zone 2: decrease nozzle on neighbor border of main front closest to house front corner (sprays toward top of slope). Increase nozzle below that (top/middle of the slope area on the side).

Other results: zone 1 continues to get a solid half inch on average per hour. As expected, zone 2 averages closer to 0.3 inch, and requires longer runtimes. Also, it's ok if the shadier areas receive less water.

Set zone 5 to water for 11 min x4 tomorrow morning. 0.3 inch or so.


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## Green

Finally changed the oil in the old mower. It has been well over a year, almost a year and a half (yikes!), and it was very dark, like chocolate sauce. Replaced the old standard oil (Penzoil 10W30) with Mobil 1 extended performance 10W30.

Went to HD and got a few bags of mulch and a bag of soil for the lawn projects.


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## Green

8/3/20:

Got 0.25 inch of rain yesterday.

Mowed family member lawn. It's pretty much dormant now from the heat and lack of rain, but I mowed over almost everything to get it cut down. It's a little longer than 4 inches in many places due to laying over of dormant grass. The next thing I do will probably be to spray for Nutsedge, which is widespread.

Continuing with the mowing before the Hurricane/Tropical storm coming up the East Coast gets here, I mowed all the areas at home that needed it: the main front/front hill/hellstrip areas, sides, back, and near half of low input (far half is still under growth regulation from Triv herbicides). Most areas at 3.75 in, but the lower back at 3.25. Side discharged main front and low input. Goal of cutting shorter is to reduce disease activity ahead of the storm.

Got a little rain this evening.

Some of my grass is going flourescent green. Neighbors, too. I've seen this other years. Maybe the heat?


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## JDgreen18

Green said:


> 8/3/20:
> 
> Got 0.25 inch of rain yesterday.
> 
> Mowed family member lawn. It's pretty much dormant now from the heat and lack of rain, but I mowed over almost everything to get it cut down. It's a little longer than 4 inches in many places due to laying over of dormant grass. The next thing I do will probably to spray for Nutsedge, which is widespread.
> 
> Continuing with the mowing before the Hurricane/Tropical storm coming up the East Coast gets here, I mowed all the areas at home that needed it: the main front/front hill/hellstrip areas, sides, back, and near half of low input (far half is still under growth regulation from Triv herbicides). Most areas at 3.75 in, but the lower back at 3.25. Side discharged main front and low input. Goal of cutting shorter is to reduce disease activity ahead of the storm.
> 
> Got a little rain this evening.
> 
> Some of my grass is going flourescent green. Neighbors, too. I've seen this other years. Maybe the heat?


Hey green the pest and lawn ginga had a video on this...he talked about multiple lawns in the neighborhood having the same issue.


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## Green

Power out since 3:40PM.

Only got 0.15-0.2 inch of rain. Lots of wind and trees and branches down in the neighborhood, including a small tree in the back.

@JDgreen18, thanks.


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## Green

Watered the three front zones for about an hour each. Used the manual controls in the valve box. Zone 1 got a bit of a longer runtime. Power is still out. Using the generator quite a bit. Got gas today...2 cans...8.5 gal.


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## Green

Power is still out. 2 days now. Good news is that tomorrow is supposed to top out under 80F.

Watered a good half of the low input area to 0.3-0.5 inch with the oscillating sprinkler. Just trying to keep it green. Not looking to have to mow anytime soon.


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## Powhatan

Green said:


> Power is still out. 2 days now. Good news is that tomorrow is supposed to top out under 80F.


That sux, at least it won't be too warm. There are some areas around us also still without power. We were lucky and only had a few power blips. I had the home builder put in a generator hook-up panel when the house was built, it's come in very handy. The portable generator I have now supplies enough power for the important stuff.


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## Green

Watered the lower back (zone 3) for 75 min (half inch) and side front zone 5 for 30 min x3, hand watered spots (Spring seeded areas in front/side/back), watered bed near mailbox and hard fescue overseed area with sprinklers. Watered middle part of side front again using impact and hand watering for another 0.3 inch. Need to increase the nozzle in the 12-inch head that covers that slope area. Hand watered garage side and dry spot in upper back near grill.

Power was restored this evening. 4 days. Right before the heat picks up again, thankfully. AC is back on for 4+ hours now. Neighbor's power nextdoor is still out.

Grass is long. I wanted to mow this evening in the main front, but did not have time. Will have to water regardless and then mow later at end of the day.

Set zones 1 and 4 to water for 22 min x4 and zone 2 for 30 min x4 tomorrow morning. Repeat interval of 75 min. 0.75 inch in front and 0.5 in the upper back.


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## Green

Powhatan said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Power is still out. 2 days now. Good news is that tomorrow is supposed to top out under 80F.
> 
> 
> 
> That sux, at least it won't be too warm. There are some areas around us also still without power. We were lucky and only had a few power blips. I had the home builder put in a generator hook-up panel when the house was built, it's come in very handy. The portable generator I have now supplies enough power for the important stuff.
Click to expand...

We had a day or two in the mid and upper 80s, but not back to back. Opening windows at night, it was possible to sleep (with sound from a dozen generators running, though), and get through each day with windows and often shades, shut. By the end of today, it was 83F upstairs. But the heat hadn't picked back up fully yet--today thankfully topped out around 85 for the high.

My neighbor who is still out had trouble with his generator, and is trying to start it now. We thought the engine may have flooded, among other things. He did get it started after an hour or two, but it's still not running right. It originally stopped after running the whole day.


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## Green

This afternoon: Picked up sticks from the storm. Mowed the main front, back, and side with the Toro at 3.75 inches after hand watering the main front overseed area. Both overseeds in the front are threatening to go dormant due to tree roots and no rain in a while. Will finish cleaning up and mowing tomorrow afternoon.

I'm ok with mowing during the hottest part of the day, as long as the sun is mostly gone where I'm mowing. It doesn't seem to be an issue.

Watered front beds by hand.

Set zone 5 to water for 12 min x 4 tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Hand watered Spring overseed areas.

Set zones 1, 2, and 3 to water for 11, 15, and 18 min. X 4 every 45 min. for tomorrow morning (roughly 0.37 inch in front and 0.5 inch in back).


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## Green

Set zone 5 to water for 10 min. X4 tomorrow morning (1/3 inch).

Got a very short downpour this morning.


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## Green

Mowed side front at 3.75 in with the Toro. Also mowed area I skipped accidentally last time at 4 in. Hand watered the garage side/ Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 11 and 15 min x4 tomorrow morning.

It's really dry.


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## Green

Mowed lower back, upper back near shed up to steps, upper side at 3.75 (Toro). Mowed low input at 4 in. Far half is dormant and soil is super dry and cracking. Really need to water. Mowed that area (minus flood prone area) as well despite how dry it was. No grass was cut (very little) in that area, but I mowed to clean up the leaves that came down in the storm. I used side discharge in low input due to the grass length. Also did not mow most of the area behind the shed, which is also dormant, but not as brown due to shade.


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## Green

Changed the nozzle in the zone 5 12-inch head because the slope along the driveway keeps burning out. There was a light blue 4 gpm nozzle there, and I replaced it with a 5 gpm. I would not be surprised if the zone is now maxed out.

Ran that zone for another 17 min while doing the swap.

Pulled spurge, mostly in the low input area.

Watered the far end of the low input area for about 2 hours . Grass is dormant/partly brown and soil is hard and cracking, so I figured I better get some water down. Only put down about 0.2 inch because more would have puddled most likely.

Mowed the main front and rest of the side at 4 inches because it was too long in the front. Need to mow again there in a few days.

Decided not to water tomorrow morning. With temps decreasing into the low 80s starting tomorrow and the higher HOC, I will be decreasing to a half inch twice per week if possible.


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## Green

Mowed the upper back and trimmed. I think the rust disease is beginning. I want to stop it before it gets to the spore stage this year. I bag mowed those areas that were yellowing a bit, and also the garage side, which had it bad last year (and had too many leaves to mulch). I'll wash the mower before the next mow.

Finally fixed the Earthway spreader.

Put down a bag of Scotts Foundation (biochar and a little clay) on the low input area minus the flood prone area. Did the same with 2 lbs/M of 0-0-50 SOP. Also spot sprayed Tenacity at 4oz rate on some crap (e.g. Nimblewill).

Also did the SOP on the side, and finished the app I started about a month ago on the main front when the spreader broke km ast time. Still need to do the side front.

Watered the hard fescue area to 0.5 inch. Needs some fert.

Collected seeds from the grass near the shed, which I'll try to grow. Mostly FF. Spotted a couple of the false green kyllinga plants coming back. Didn't see them last year after spraying the previous year. They look like FF except for the distinctive sedge-like seedhead, and presumably a triangular stem. So, they blend in until they go to seed.


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## Green

Finally, a little rain today. Got about 0.16 inch. I hand watered the garage side and middle of the sude front, which both needed it. But disease is starting to set in everywhere...including rust...I think I know what the early stage looks like, now.


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## Green

Got a little rain yesterday night, but not enough. Maybe 0.05 inch.

Watered the main front area that was overseeded a few months ago, as it was stressing badly. Probably overwatered, putting down an inch in about an hour with an Orbit rotary.

Mowed the rest of the main front, hellstrip areas, and lower two-thirds of the front hill at 3.75 (Toro). A bit overgrown. Blade also needs sharpening.

Sprayed Triclopyr ester on clover and violets in the upper back. This is going to prevent overseeding for at least a few weeks, but had to be done first. It was too hot to spray over the past few weeks. Hoping the weather cooperates over the coming weeks for a late overseed.

Put down 2 lbs per thousand of 0-0-50 SOP on the side front and hellstrip areas.

Set zone 5 to water for 15 min x4 on the hour tomorrow morning (a half inch). Grass is badly in need of it.


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## Green

5000th post on this site...and many of those have been right in this journal thread, which I think is a great way to keep track.

Yestersay morning, got a little bit of unexpected rain, but nothing significant.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 15 and 20 min x4 this morning.


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## Green

Today: Mowed with the newer mower: side front and upper back (3.75). Lower back, side, low input: 4 inches. Side discharge in low input, and skipping the dormant far end entirely.

Hand watered lightly: hellstrip and edge areas near sidewalk and road.

Transplanted sod from lower back to bare spots in the middle side. Will start reseeding tomorrow.

Dug rocks out from an area in the lower back and flat part of side front that was overseeded this Spring. Side front is very drought stressed.

Set zones to water tomorrow morning: zone 3: 38 min x2. Zones 4 and 5: 15 min x4.


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## Green

Watered near half (non-dormant part) of low input area with the oscillating sprinkler. Put down 0.3 inch to 1 inch, depending on the area and how long it ran before I was able to shut it.

Zone 1 driveway corner sprinkler is jammed, so I watered that area just over 0.3 inch with an impact in about 20 min. this afternoon. The in-ground head was probably shooting into the street.

Got one of the small (12-15 inch diameter in this case) spots I killed in Spring reseeded in the lower back today. Seed was a mix of Bullseye and Firecracker SLS. I've been trying to plant plugs at the same time. It really speeds up grow-in. More spots to do tomorrow.


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## Chris LI

Are you seeing recovery from heat/drought stress? Temperatures are expected to bump up a little for us this weekend, but I think we'll be OK.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Are you seeing recovery from heat/drought stress? Temperatures are expected to bump up a little for us this weekend, but I think we'll be OK.


Yes, actually I have been over the past few weeks despite lots of high 80s/low 90s. I will try to get some much needed photos this weekend. I think the days are just enough shorter and the sun is not quite as high, so even higher temps aren't as stressful right now compared to 6 weeks ago.

Believe it or not, there is still some Triv that is partially green in the essentially non irrigated, almost dormant, partly shaded area in the low input area. I need to do something about it...the prescribed herbicide program (Sulfosulfuron - 2 apps at a 3 week interval) that was supposed to kill it hasn't totally. It has been 4 weeks since the second app. I'll have to do a third, lower rate app to try to finish it off. Can't believe I'm about to do that! On the positive side, there are no sedges whatsoever in that area...the herbicide has kept them out.

I used the same program on my upper side area, almost full sun in Summer, and it worked much better. I have dead spots and lost some of the ryegrass, but even those are recovering a bit, and will be easy to reseed in a few weeks. By that time, the dead spots will close up a bit and be smaller.

Still no real rain in sight and we are in moderate drought...everything is irrigated now, as needed, to keep it going. Trying to take the chance to get a lot of seeding done now, before we get inundated with rain, which typically follows drought, and prevents seeding.

Trees and scrub brush are now showing drought stress. Some trees even started to turn (like Fall color) over a week ago. Way too early. My neighbor's large (6 foot high) warm-season grass plants with fine blades are starting to show drought stress, too. The storm didn't help the trees of course. The trees in irrigated areas are doing ok, though.


----------



## Green

Watered the far dormant portion of the low input area with about 0.15 inch of water to keep it going, reduce the crunch factor, and keep the Triv remnants green in the drought so I can spray it again.

Hand watered in the front, etc., as needed.

Watered between Spruce and Rhododendron.

Seeded another area or two in the back.

Set zone 5 to water for 15 min x6 tomorrow morning. It was drought stressed pretty badly today in the sun and 90 degree temps. We are in another stretch of days of near and equal to 90 degree temps, with sun.


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## Green

Sprayed the area in and around the flood prone area for Triv, 3rd application of Certainty, at 0.25 to 0.3 oz per acre, using a stronger dilution than recommended - a gallon and a half of water on 1,000 square feet. Hopefully this extra app will knock a lot of the rest of it back. To recap, I did 3 apps total: the first two at 0.5 oz per acre separated by 3 weeks, and then this one a little over 4 weeks later. The area gets shade, so I guess that's how it has survived so long. I'll have to wait 2 weeks before overseeding this area.

Watered the right-hand side Spruce with a sprinkler. Watered the back bed as well. (Over)watered the middle dormant part of the low input area (almost 1 inch). And watered the main front overseed area at 0.10 inch of water.

Changed some nozzles in zone 2:
-Upper head on the side: removed a 2.5LA and put in a 3.5LA. Will need to raise that head up or something eventually as well.

-Took a 2.0 LA out of the head upstream of the one mentioned above (closest to front house corner). Put in a standard 2.0, because it was overwatering. Problem now, is that the head wants to generate a lot of mist with the slightest wind, so I'm going to have to install a pressure regulator under it once Hunter makes their new PR-075 accessory available. I haven't seen it in stores yet. The regular light blue 2.0 nozzle does throw further, though. So it should distribute the water over a larger area. We'll see how it goes when I do the next audit. Also, I used a LA in the first place because I was concerned about the property edge being watered adequately after the standard nozzle didn't do the trick. Not sure if the standard nozzle will be able to keep it from browning out in hot weather. But maybe once I can get the pressure regulator, it will work well.

Mowed the main front at 4 inches. Too high...need to mow again in a couple of days after the heat breaks.

I'm seeing traces of more disease starting up...need to get biofungicide down in the next 48 hours. The higher HOC is not helping, either. Mowing in the evening did help dry it after the the light afternoon watering/sprinkler tests, though.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for only 0.3 inch tomorrow morning to try to keep fungus down...9 and 12 min x4 every half hour around 7:30 AM. That way, it doesn't stay wet long.


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## Green

Mowed the back and lower side: 4 in except the upper back and garage side (3.75). Trimmed. Pruned near garage side. Spot sprayed Tenacity, including the recently seeded spots in the back. Cleaned the Toro with the hose attachment, and then checked and cleaned the air filter for the first time since getting the mower over a year and a half ago. Not too dirty, actually.


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## Green

Planted a few of the smaller spots in the lower/middle side with the main front mixture. Tomorrow I'll add the Tenacity and plant more spots. Today was the last 90 degree day. Temps are dropping now.


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## Green

Mowed the main front and front hill (3.75), and low input non-dormant areas at 4 in. Added mosquito dunks. Put down 3.75 lbs of 6-2-0 Milorganite on the lower back (0.25 N). Hand watered a few stressed areas and seeded areas.


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## Green

Reseeded the final small area on the lower side. Still have the large area left to do.

Got strong storms starting around 4PM. Power tried to go out. As of 5:30PM, there was 1.2 in of rain so far. At least there was rain. Thankfully no tornadoes here, but other places in the state were hit. Rain total was 1.4 in.


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## Green

Mowed the lower back and upper side (4 in). Upper side (KBG/PRG) is filling in well now that I'm cutting high...interesting. Mowed upper back (3.75 in) and lower/middle side (old mower).

Put down 2 lbs/M of 0-0-50 SOP on the back. First time ever. Sprayed very low rate of N (under 0.05 lb/M) from AMS on upper back after mowing (and a tiny bit on the garage side). Fairly humid and no wind, so it'll absorb nicely foliarly tonight, then get watered into soil from rain.

Mixed and sprayed final app of glyphosate on the part of the flood prone area to be renovated.


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## Green

Picked up an additional 0.3 inch of rain this morning.


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## Green

Picked up an additional 0.05-0.1 inch last night at 10PM during a downpour.

Sprayed Tenacity on the other reseeded area in the lower side. Interesting, after the heavy rain, the seed and peat moss are still there, but some of the seed is now on top of the peat moss, rather than under it.

Sprayed app 2 of Triclopyr Ester on violets, clover, etc. in the back. Really want to overseed to get more shade tolerant grass in the lawn (TTTF), but will have to wait 1 weeks in the areas I blanket sprayed (patches of clover behind the deck). KBG chronically thins out in shade starting in the Fall.


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## Green

Grass grew really fast in some areas, like the main front. It was 5 days, and I had to increase the HOC to 4 in again due to the recent rain causing it to be able to grow more. Also mowed the side front and the side and lower back. Side front didn't grow much (front hill did), but there were dried leaves to mulch up. That area is so stressed and dried out still, that I didn't want to take anything off in most areas. It looks better now. Giving it a chance to recover from Summer heat and short-term drought.

Some areas, like the middle portion of the main front and upper third of the front hill, are not growing well. I will likely start hitting these areas with humic soon, and may topdress that upper hill area with some new compost soil one of these days.

Sprayed Biofungicide on the volunteer pumpkin plant, which has had Powdery Mildew for a few weeks (and sprayed adjacent plants). (Got a pumpkin last week). Sprayed Mosquito Barrier in the flood prone area. Will do the rest of the yard later in the week, after mowing everywhere. I had misplaced the wand for my 1 gal sprayer, so took the one from my spare sprayer in the attic.

Last night, ordered more Serenade, a bag of Sul-Po-Mag, and a foaming herbicide application kit to kill invasive vines with.


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## gm560

@Green how is the Triv handling the third round of Certainty? How about the surrounding desirable turf?


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## Green

gm560 said:


> @Green how is the Triv handling the third round of Certainty? How about the surrounding desirable turf?


Here are three photos...a wide view, medium view, and closeup. You can pick out what's what of the green stuff. Hint: all of the light green in the closeup is the Triv. It's shriveled, but still alive. I'm not sure how much of the brown is dead Triv, versus dormant grass. And you can see the Triv is still hanging on after 3 apps. If left like this, it could easily make a comeback. I'm not sure yet what I'm going to do next. I guess it's still possible more could go brown over the next week or so as the herbicide works. It's only been 9 days since the third app. I'm hoping I don't end up having to do a 4th, because it'll cut into the overseeding window for Perennial Ryegrass (which is what I'd use since it'll be so late). On second thought, I think most of the brown is dead Triv...the grass has been coming out of dormancy over the last week.


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## gm560

Man. That's a lot of triv that made it out alive. Thanks for the update.


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## Green

Today, I really started working on the flood-prone area renovation. I was hoping to do more tomorrow, but it's supposed to rain so it'll have to wait until Thursday.

Today, I dug a trench leading from an area that ponds, to the natural area. I sloped it down slightly, from about 9 inches deep at the beginning to about 14 inches at the end. It's maybe a yard to 2 yards long.










After digging, I put in a couple of layers of small rocks:










I then put in a couple of 50-lb bags of medium grade white sand:










Finally, I put back the existing soil, mixed with a little fine-grained brown sand to make it more sandy (not shown).

--------------------------------------------------

Here is the plan for Thursday:

1. Final spray with a quick burndown agent that will also kill the moss (I've already done like 4 glyphosate apps this year, starting in the Spring and the most recent less than a week ago). Let dry.

2. Rake up sticks and rocks from the surface. Dig out any rocks near the surface in the reno area. I may break up the surface soil with the rake.

3. Topdress with a sand/compost/loam mix and do any final grading and filling of low spots. I'll try to grade it a bit toward the trench. Apply Milorganite as starter fert. This is not "sand capping". I don't have the resources to do that or maintain it. I figure a topdressing of sandy loam is the next best thing, and lower maintenance. I can always add more next year. The existing soil is like a sand/silt/clay/muck mix, and holds water really well...too well at the surface. The goal is to firm up the surface a little bit. I think digging out a bunch of rocks will help the drainage, too.

4. Spread KBG seed, topdress with either peat moss or whatever.

5. Spray Tenacity. Let dry.

6. Spray Ultramate SG.

7. Set up irrigation and start watering. It won't take much water to germinate this damp area...that's for sure.


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## Green

gm560 said:


> Man. That's a lot of triv that made it out alive. Thanks for the update.


Yeah. I'm thinking at the two-week mark (in a few days), I may do one more app. The label recommended two. An article I read recommended a third if needed. I've never seen anyone recommend 4. I'll try it with distilled water for good luck the next time.


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## Green

Been raining today. Got 0.5 inches in the first half. Really hoping the flood-prone area dries out in time to work on it tomorrow. We'll soon see if the drainage ditch helps or not.

Let's take a look at the low-input area.

First shot shows the portion that was used as the failed Nitrogen Winterization testing area. See the brown? Most of that is Triv that I toasted using a combination of Velocity and letting the grass stress and dry out in the heat. That's how infested it had gotten. Really hoping it's truly dead, now. Planning to overseed with Ryegrass sometime later this month, but there's still some Nimblewill to kill first:










Moving back a bit, this is the adjacent area, which also had some Triv. I used a similar approach on it. I'm hoping to overseed it in the next two weeks, mostly with Tall Fescue, and do a little leveling:










Continuing to move toward the main lawn, these are some areas where I killed Triv with Roundup in the Spring. Looking to fix them using plugs, not seed:










And here is the good part of the low input area that was treated normally, adjacent to the main lawn (no big Triv issues in this part this year):










Next steps are to spray/keep spraying Tenacity on the bad areas (blanket spray on the areas to be overseeded), to kill Nimblewill and get a pre-M barrier going to resist Poa annua. The rest of the low-input area will get a standard pre-M now that we're getting into good germination temps and actually getting rain again. The Hard Fescue overseed area all the way at the end (not shown in the last photo) won't get anything because the roots need to develop better.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> First shot shows the portion that was used as the failed Nitrogen Winterization testing area. ...


Well, that photo tells a convincing story of not trying that experiment again...


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## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> First shot shows the portion that was used as the failed Nitrogen Winterization testing area. ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well, that photo tells a convincing story of not trying that experiment again...
Click to expand...

Why...Just joking? 

For anyone reading fast and browsing photos too quickly, I need to state that we are so far removed from when that experiment was done, now, and there is no link whatsoever between the experiment and current situation in the photo (taken yesterday).

Then again, Poa Triv was a good part of why the experiment failed, but living Poa Triv, not dead Poa Triv. And of course the Nitrogen did not cause the Triv infestation.

Once I get it overseeded, it could be fair game again, though.


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## Green

Mowed main front/front hill/hellstrip areas, upper side, back, and low input area at 4 in because the rain caused too much growth. At the same time, the rust disease is really setting in, and some of it is in the spore form. I really need to get fertilizer and biofungicide down over ths next couple of days. The front is really bad, or at least will be soon.

Also need to blanket spray most of the low input area with Tenacity because no only is there Nimblewil, but I'm late with Fall pre-M as well. Tenacity will cover both pre and post until I can get the actual pre-M down.

We also did the first weekly glyphosate spray of three on a small section of neighbor 11's hellstrip to kill Zoysia.

Glyphosate pdf: http://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/GWC/GWC-2.pdf

Research whether time of day matters next.


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## Green

Put down about 8 lbs of Baystate fertilizer on family member's 1K front lawn in zone 7a. It was not fertilized at all last year. Mostly weeds and weedy grass, but we'll see if we can get the good stuff growing a little thicker and better with some minimal inputs a couple of times a year at most. It's going to be dry for the next week or so, so synthetics were a no-go this year. The biosolids should mostly just sit there at the surface until there is rain to carry the nutrients into the soil. And even then, this is not a lawn that has a lot of microbial activity most likely, so it will take a heck of a long time for it all to get broken down and utilized...at least the rest of this year, probably. Maybe longer.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> Put down about 8 lbs of Baystate fertilizer on family member's 1K front lawn in zone 7a. It was not fertilized at all last year. Mostly weeds and weedy grass, but we'll see if we can get the good stuff growing a little thicker and better with some minimal inputs a couple of times a year at most. It's going to be dry for the next week or so, so synthetics were a no-go this year. The biosolids should mostly just sit there at the surface until there is rain to carry the nutrients into the soil. And even then, this is not a lawn that has a lot of microbial activity most likely, so it will take a heck of a long time for it all to get broken down and utilized...at least the rest of this year, probably. Maybe longer.


Some fertilizer will definitely help, and I think biosolids (Bay State Fertilizer or Milorganite) are great for lawns, particularly rarely fertilized ones!

8 pounds of BSF on 1ksqft isn't a whole lot of fertilizer though. At 4% N, that's only 0.32#N / ksqft. That will help, but it will be far from a huge boost. Then again, if the lawn hasn't seen any fertilizer in over a year, any fertilizer at all will be a welcome surprise!

Keep up the good work!


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## Green

@ken-n-nancy, it could be close to 0.5 on N. And that would be sufficient given we don't have a ton of grass there right now. I'm going by the BSF average analysis, not the marked one. In any case, it's 0.3-0.5 lb N. I'm leaning toward doing the same in the Spring, if the situation with the virus allows a visit at that time. That would be at least 0.7 lb N in total. We'll see. Last year, we didn't get to apply any, due to other circumstances. The year before, I applied 0.8-1.0 lb. Slow and steady...


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## Green

Sprayed final glyphosate app on lower side (mostly a few weeds, like oxalis. No grass made it through the previous apps between Spring and now, so the Triv is 100% dead). Used the final ounces on the flood-prone area. Sprayed 50/50 AMS/Miracle Grow mix on front hill, hellstrip area, all the way to concrete marker. Also main front overseeded area from Spring, all the way to the driveway. These areas are showing the biggest hints of rust disease. Set zone 5 to water for a total of 48 min (0.4 inch) tomorrow morning.

Recent photos of various main lawn areas (HOC=4 in) from this past week:

Main front is filling in after Spring Triv kill and reseed and recovering from Summer stress:










Upper side is recovering and gaps from dead Triv due to Certainty Herbicide are filling in slowly:










Back:










Speaking of the back, remember this area from last year that I dug up, re-graded, plugged, and then seeded lightly?










It's all filled in now. But it still needs leveling:










On the side, I transplanted a few sod chunks (look for them) and seeded other spots. These spots were also where Triv was killed in the Spring:










The sod chunks came from the back lawn because there was Ryegrass in them. Had to get it out:










And those donor spots are now reseeded (with some small plugs, too). Detail of germination:


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## Green

Watered parts of the main front with the impact sprinkler, including the area overseeded in the Spring. Basically where I sprayed yesterday. Will hand water as needed tomorrow.

Got the rocks up in the flood prone area. Sprayed Groundclear (ammonium nonanoate) as the final kill for the moss, etc. Then put down 350 lbs of sand and a couple bags of Miracle Grow Garden soil mixed in...as topdress for the seed and to hopefully firm up the surface when it floods. Tomorrow will be the seed, finally. I'm like a month late with this project. Not sure how it'll go considering it's KBG in the shade.


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## Green

@ken-n-nancy,

Were you comfortable seeding on 8/26 ?
I ask because you guys tend to be at least 2 weeks ahead of us in terms of cooling temps.

I'm putting seed down on my mini reno tomorrow, 9/7, so my timing is similar to yours with respect the local climate. Avg. first frost is mid to late Oct. here.

I feel like I'm so late! Like a month late. The area is shaded, so it's not going to be easy for KBG, and due to these factors, I'm not sure your seed down date and conditions (partial to full sun?) are apples to apples vis a vis mine. Really hoping this late reno works out.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> @ken-n-nancy,
> Were you comfortable seeding on 8/26 ?
> I ask because you guys tend to be at least 2 weeks ahead of us in terms of cooling temps.
> 
> I'm putting seed down on my mini reno tomorrow, 9/7, so my timing is similar to yours with respect the local climate. Avg. first frost is mid to late Oct. here.
> 
> I feel like I'm so late! Like a month late. The area is shaded, so it's not going to be easy for KBG, and due to these factors, I'm not sure your seed down date and conditions (partial to full sun?) are apples to apples vis a vis mine. Really hoping this late reno works out.


Comfortable, yes. However, I would have liked to be on August 15th instead for seed-down in NH with KBG-only.

The area we have under renovation this year gets good sun from about 10:30am onwards, so I think it should be okay. Our front lawn renovation from 2018 sees a similar amount of sun and grew enough for us to mow it a few times before winter. We had some sparse areas that didn't fill in until May and June. I don't think the sparseness was due to temperature, though, but was probably due to poor soil contact.

Our renovation of our side lawn in 2015 was quite shady, with tree filtered sun being the only sun it gets - ever. That said, it does get filtered sun for much of the day. However, our seed down date for that renovation was too late - the grass never got tall enough to mow before winter. The grass all survived the winter and eventually did well in the spring, but Bewitched is real slow to get going in the spring! Our seed down date was September 9th for that renovation.

I'm pretty confident you'll be okay with today as a seed down date given your extra two weeks there, but you may not get to mow it more than once before winter! Keep us all posted!


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## Green

@ken-n-nancy, thanks. Unfortunately I got delayed one more today. Tomorrow is going to be the day. I would not have been able to set up the irrigation needed today, anyway. And still might have to just hand water for a few days as I might not have time to set something up right away. But moisture is not the issue. If anything, the area is too moist. If we get a thunderstorm and more than 0.3 inch of rain, pooling occurs and washout becomes possible. Therefore, the challenge is to get roots to develop before any thunderstorms. I do have tackifier and plan to make use of it, but it's not a cure for washout by any means.


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## Green

Today, I ended up going to the family member lawn and raking up all the branches that came down during the storm weeks ago, because my dad was available to go and help. Originally my uncle was going to borrow some sort of rake for the tractor and he was going to help, but that fell through, so we did it by hand, which arguably worked better. I then mowed, and it was quite overgrown considering so many weeks had gone by since the last mowing.

At home, mowed the main front and upper side at 4 in real quick as it got dark. Earlier, watered the middle side to 0.3 in with the impact, and hand watered the hellstrip areas, mailbox planting bed, lower driveway edges, upper front hill, and any other spots that were browning or stressed looking. Also tested zone 1 and unjammed the head at the driveway corner to make sure it works tomorrow morning.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 15 and 20 min x4 tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Finally got the seed down on the renovation area this evening. I put down about 0.25 lb of MyHolidayLawn KBG using the Scotts mini push spreader (excellent tool for putting down KBG seed...thats mostly what I use it for), gently raked the seed into the soil surface by gliding the back of a metal spring tine rake over the area in different short patterns, and then went for a walk around the seed bed to get it pressed in and pick up any junk on the surface. Area is a half circle and about 0.15K in size. So 1.5-1.75 lb/M of seed, which is in the middle to higher end of the recommended range for this cultivar. Then brought the hose to the area and hand watered it. Tomorrow will be tackifier (plenty of it) and Tenacity (high rate, no surfactant). I'm not using peat moss for this one. After those dry, I'll put down the Ultramate SG.


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## Green

Mowed the back at 4 in, and then the low input area mostly at 4 in. Started to clump, so got the side discharge going partway through. Also started getting dark.

Set zone 5 to water for 11 min x4 tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Day 2 on the renovation:

Put down the following:
-0.49 mL of Tenacity (6oz per acre), no surfactant
-0.5 lb of Baystate fert
-6.5 g of Andersons Ultramate SG

All of these are considered high rates. The Tenacity should cover for a full 6 weeks. At that time, I hope to be putting down a starter fertilizer with Tupersan (something I've never used before and which is on the way out actually, but the goal is to avoid whitening the new grass with a second Tenacity hit). The Ultramate is supposed to help the new grass germinate since it's a bio stimulant. It also has KOH, much like AIR-8, so I'm hoping it helps aerate the soil and improve the drainage so the area doesn't retain water for weeks on end in the Fall.

I also applied a 0.5 lb of M-Binder Tackifier, and lightly hand watered everything in. Actually, I think the Ultramate was after the watering.

Then threw a few mosquito dunks onto the Reno area as final step.

----------------------------------------------------------

As far as non-Reno stuff today:

Hand trimmed and mowed front hill/hellstrips at 4 in real quick, and middle and lower side at 3.75 with old mower.

Tenacity: applied 14mL with NIS (4oz per acre) to rest of low input area except Reno, Spring Hard Fescue overseed area, and one other area. Roughly 5.25K area. The Tenacity will act as a pre-M, post M, and root-absorbed kill. This will prevent annual bluegrass, kill broadleaf weeds, forage or weedy grasses, and Nimblewill. Any bad grasses that get whitened will get another app, especially the Nimblewill.

And the roughly 1.25K area where I skipped Tenacity, got a final app of Certainty instead. I used 0.33 oz per acre again this time: 0.25g with NIS, using distilled water this time. This is the area immediately adjoining the Reno. I kept the Certainty at least a foot away from it. This will make 4 applications in one season/year now, which is one more than I've ever seen recommended. It has been just over 2 weeks since the previous app. We will see what happens. (The Triv is shriveled and suppressed now after the three apps, but is still there.) In two weeks, I'll overseed the area anyway, so no concerns about a bit more damage to the good grass. Hopefully at that point (2 weeks is the minimum waiting time to seed after Certainty) the Tenacity will finish off more of the stressed Triv. That is the plan.


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## Green

Day 3 of the renovation:

We got about 0.1 inch of rain this morning, and it was humid (72 dewpoint), so no need to water. However, with the possibility of T-storms forecasted, I didn't want to risk washout of the seed, so I covered it with tarps. The tarps might also have the side effect of warming the soil and promoting germination. Just need to remove them before the seedbed gets too hot tomorrow morning.










Also was able to put down about 30 lbs of Baystate fert on the low input area before the afternoon/evening rain. Went heavier than average on the hard fescue overseed area new grass, and conversely lighter than average on the areas still to be overseeded next week. N range was about 0.15-0.5 lb/M depending on area and goal. Most areas got 0.25-0.33 lb N. Considering I have lots of Fine Fescue in this area, this is an ideal medium range app.

No more 80s are forecast for the immediate period, and there are one or two days of high 40s at night predicted.


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## Green

Renovation day 4:

Got 0.4 inch of rain yesterday...perfect amount.

And the tarp thing on the reno worked...only one small area near the edge (just to the lefthand side of the white rock in the foreground, under that first tarp) washed out. Today, I swept the water off, and removed the tarps. Tomorrow, I have to clean them...fun. Some pooling near the reno area, as expected.

Needless to say, I did not have to water the reno area today. It stayed moist until sunset. The soil was also nice and lukewarm due to the tarps, but not baking by any means. I may have just sped up the germination a bit while I'm at it...we'll see in a few days.

----------------------------------------------------------
I also prepped and seeded the 14x13 foot area at the bottom of the side yard this evening. Raked up the dead grass. While I was at it, I did my best to improve the leveling of the area. I did not add any soil, just scraped and raked around what was there with a groundskeeper rake and then the back of a standard (48" ?) aluminum tine landscape rake. I then seeded with about 1.25 lbs of my front lawn mix (80-10-10 TTTF/Apple SGL TTPR/Bewitched KBG) using the Scotts mini push spreader. I added some Rowdy TTTF seed to the furthest/shadiest portions. Gently raked the seed in. And watered it down. Tomorrow, I'll touch-up seed (including mowing and overseeding the existing grass to the side of it).

I'm noticing the rust disease getting more widespread in various places. I'm not quite keeping pace with it so far. Just trying to keep it from getting much worse, like other years. My understanding is the grass is stressed after Summer, and that makes it susceptible.


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## Green

9/12/20:

Reno day 5. Not much happening. Just waiting for germination to start.

----------------------------------------------------------

On the small renovation area on the lower side, I planted some fine fescue plugs in the shadiest spots. This lawn area is under a tree, so making fine fescue is a good thing. TTTF alone, let alone a Northern mix like the one I seeded with, just won't cut it. But adding a small percentage of fine fescue will make a big difference in performance.


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## Green

Reno day 6. Watered it once. Still waiting for the first few seeds to germinate. Not expecting it anytime soon.
--------------------------------------------------------

Most of the main front was overgrown (6 days) so mowed it carefully at 4 in. The areas that weren't overgrown had a major increase in rust. So, I mowed those areas (as well as the garage side) with the old mower and bagged and removed the clippings. Lawn is still orange in those areas, but not as bad after mowing. Cleaned my shoes, too.

Also mowed the hard fescue overseed area with the old mower to get the grass, weeds, and pine needles taken care of. Lots of challenges in the area, like roots, rocks, and tendency to grow moss.

Put down 3 lbs (0.25-0.33 lb N) of Carbon-X on the main front (original formula- the one with RGS/humic/kelp, MOP, and the homogeneous unstabilized urea/AMS prill). Went a bit heavier on the area with rust (which spans the middle section to the road and even toward the Eastern property border).

Also mowed the side front, other side, and back at 4 in, but finally took the lower back down to 3.75 again. Started trimming.

The things that really seem to slow the rust disease down and stimulate growth are: water, sunlight, fertilizer, and mowing. Fungicides of course, too, but I'm trying to not have to go the chemical route just for rust.

Ran zones 1 and 2 for 30 and 40 min to water in the fertilizer.


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## Green

This evening is reno day 7. Earlier today, I didn't see germination, though. Probably a few more days.
----------------------------------------------------------

Very windy today, so the seeded areas dried out often, where they often stay moist half the day.

Hand watered the rust area in the main front. It's getting worse everywhere, slowly. Time to fertilize more areas and more aggressively.

Set zone 5 to water for 11 min x4 tomorrow morning (0.37 in).
----------------------------------------------------------

Mowed family member lawn.


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## Green

Reno day 8. No germination yet.
----------------------------------------------------------

Rust slowly spreading everywhere. Continuing to fertilize, mow, water, one area at a time.

Mowed the low input area at 4 inches. Trimmed in back.

Started mowing upper back corner near house lower for overseeding soon, and mostly bagged it due to the rust.

Seeded another small area in the lower side/back, actually the one I dug up the other day. Used a small handful of Bullseye and Firecracker SLS TTTF, and a pinch of Fiesta 4 TTPR.

Sprayed 4oz rate Tenacity (no surfactant) on that area and the large lower side Reno area. Then dumped in a little NIS and hit the area in the main front where the (I believe) whitened Bentgrass is. And sprayed the remnants on the back low input border vegetation.

Put down 2.5 lbs of Carbon-X (0.5 lb N) on the upper back and garage side. Will water it in tomorrow morning...set zone 4 to water for 13 min x2 tomorrow morning.

Helped neighbor with 2nd glyphosate spray on the Zoysia. As expected, it had started to green up again since the first app. My other neighbor who has dealt with it stopped by, and suggested he rake it out a bit before the final app to expose the stolons. It has been over a week and a half since the first app.


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## Green

mowww said:


> Ordered some Tupersan for spring overseed...
> 
> @Green I think it is among the slowest to establish KBG varieties so on an initial seed it could be oddly spotty. With an overseed I am less worried about patches of this or that growing at varying speeds. Going with Tupersan in spring and more seed after an aggressive verticut. I am excited to see your Reno progress. I seeded a few areas 10 days ago and have some germination.


That sounds right...still no hint of germination here. The literature from the company scientists showed no real difference between a 1.0 and 2.0 lb/M seeding, so I used something between that range.

I also loaded the MHL reno area with M-Binder tackifier. Hopefully it doesn't mess with the MHL germ. Someone on Amazon claims the tack killed their seed. I had super slow germ in the Spring on the hard fescue area last time I used the tack...but maybe that was due to spraying Gallery at seeding time. That Hard Fescue is still working on establishing now due to poor conditions. Another area where I used the tack on a TTTF overseed this Spring was fine.

@mowww, let me know if you have guidance or references on Tupersan rates versus concentration versus protection duration. I've never used it before but have a bag of fert with it ($$) mostly for the Spring, but I also plan to use it this Fall as my starter fert app before my 6oz/A Tenacity app is set to wear off in, say, 5 weeks. (I bought it to try as I did not want to risk another Tenacity app on this grass once it does come in, but the reno area is a verifiable Poa hotbed.) Then again, does Tupersan even do anything against Poa??

Also, if you think there is good reason to do so, I will consider buying some powder concentrate to keep (not sure if it keeps for many years or not but that would be the intention) before it's no longer available.


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## Green

Reno day 9 (earlier today when I checked, it was technically 7.5 days since planting, and no germination yet).
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Applied fertilizer to more areas: 
lower back: 2 lbs of Carbon-X (0.5 lb N)
side front (not counting garage side): 2 lbs of Green Max (0.33 lb N if I subtracted the area right)

Applied shampoo to the upper front hill which has been suffering, and then watered in that area by hand. The rust is getting worse there.

Set zone 3 to water for 12 min x4
and zone 5 for 11 min x4 
tomorrow morning.

Neighbor I'm helping with Zoysia had fert applied today. Other homes had it last week. End (driveway) neighbor's lawn is coming out of dormancy.


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## kay7711226

Lot going on, I read through when you started the Reno, good luck. few questions,

1. For the North side, what seeds are you using and do you happen to have a price list? From what I read is it Harts? checked their website but did find a price list.

2. How bad is the fungus on your side? Past week or so it's hitting my area bad, lots of leave rust and some other fungus I can not tell. Do you generally try to overseed affected areas or let it fill back in?

3. I'm also helping my neighbor across the street do his lawn....Its in really bad shape, pretty much nothing done to it. During spring I dropped some Scotts triple action, Had him hold off until Fall to do any seeding. ~3 weeks ago had him do 2 rounds of Spectracide Herbicide. Monday did the prep for seed down, mow low, dethatch, sprayed tenacity, seed down(Newsome Trio Mix - TTTF 80%, PRG 10%, KBG 10%, and I also added some more PRG from Agway) watering daily 3-4 times a day(8, 11, 2 sometimes 5) I had him picked up some Lesco starter fert 14-20-4. Do you think I should apply now or hold off until I see germ? Want to maximize germ and best chance to survive the winter, if you can think of anything else that will help from your experience let me know. We are expecting soil test report in a week or so, but I'm using my report as a guidance until the report gets here.


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## Green

Reno day 10. No germ yet after 8.5 days.
---------------------------------------------------------

Lots of stuff this afternoon, most of it relating to the rust battle:

Mowed back and side at 3.75 in. Most of main front at 4 in.

Applied 2.5 lbs of Carbon-X to the side minus lower end Reno area (0.5 lb N). Watered it in with a bit of water.

Bag mowed bad rust areas at 3.75 inch in main front and upper back. Took area to be overseeded in upper back down in height. Applied 2.5 lbs of granular Trinexapac ethyl. Not sure how that will work, but it was easy to do.

Sprayed Serenade biofungicide everywhere on main lawn except that area mentioned above. Used super high rate: 5 oz per M, and went heavy on the bad rust patches.


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## Green

kay7711226 said:


> 1. For the North side, what seeds are you using and do you happen to have a price list? From what I read is it Harts? checked their website but did find a price list.


I have different areas that are North facing. The most shady is the back, which is TTTF and KBG mix. The KBG does not do well under the damp, shady conditions of late Fall to early Spring. It kind of rots away when it's too damp and shaded. Some of my KBG in that mix did came from Hart Seed. Each type of seed in the mix pretty much is from a different supplier. I also get Ryegrass seed from them sometimes.

As far as a price list, last time I ordered and asked Bill Hart about an updated price list, it sounded like there was one for 2020, but I couldn't find it. You might call and ask him about that if you need the updated list. Here's the 2019 list: https://hartseed.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/Harts-Pro-Lawn-Seed-List-Web-18.12.13.pdf



kay7711226 said:


> 2. How bad is the fungus on your side? Past week or so it's hitting my area bad, lots of leave rust and some other fungus I can not tell. Do you generally try to overseed affected areas or let it fill back in?


The rust is getting bad right now. If I don't do anything, it'll get really bad. We don't want that. So I'm mowing and tossing out the clippings in the really bad areas, I fertilized, and I sprayed biofungicide. The mowing removes some of the active rust. The fertilizer helps the grass withstand the disease, and the biofungicide will hopefully help prevent the new spores (which go all over the place when mowing) from starting new disease.

I overseed when I need to. I did some in the Spring in some shady areas already. I'm about to do some in the back where the KBG has trouble making it through the Fall and Winter due to shade. In that case, I'm using the TTTF seed because it holds up much better to shade. I tried to do it earlier in the year with dormant seeding, but it didn't work for some reason. Maybe the seed rotted.



kay7711226 said:


> 3. I'm also helping my neighbor across the street do his lawn....Its in really bad shape, pretty much nothing done to it. During spring I dropped some Scotts triple action, Had him hold off until Fall to do any seeding. ~3 weeks ago had him do 2 rounds of Spectracide Herbicide. Monday did the prep for seed down, mow low, dethatch, sprayed tenacity, seed down(Newsome Trio Mix - TTTF 80%, PRG 10%, KBG 10%, and I also added some more PRG from Agway) watering daily 3-4 times a day(8, 11, 2 sometimes 5) I had him picked up some Lesco starter fert 14-20-4. Do you think I should apply now or hold off until I see germ? Want to maximize germ and best chance to survive the winter, if you can think of anything else that will help from your experience let me know. We are expecting soil test report in a week or so, but I'm using my report as a guidance until the report gets here.


I like the 80-10-10. That's the seed ratio I mostly use in the front currently. Adding more PR seed to the mix is probably a good idea this time of year. The Agway PR is good stuff; I have it in a lot of lawn areas mixed in. I think I might buy a bag for some more overseeding in the next week.

As far as the fertilizer, I'd hold off on any fertilizer until he mows 1-2 times, especially if it's an overseed. Even then, only 0.25-0.5 lb N at a time, and then again 2 weeks later, is the best bet. I feel like the only reason to put down starter fert at seeding time is if you're pressed for time, or you're using the one with Tenacity. You can also use Milorganite if you want to put it down at the same time as seed, because it lasts longer. Otherwise, after mowing is probably best.

Other tips: don't let it get above 3 inches, and mow it back to 2-2.5 inches. Try to have him keep at that height through early Spring.


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## Green

Reno day 10 (8.5 days past seeding):

We have the beginning of germination. It's really hard to see as of today, and only a percentage of the seed is coming up so far. Some of it appears whitened from the Tenacity. Not worried.

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Continued watering seeded areas. Reno area only needs one light sprinkling per day to stay moist. I can handle that by hand. My lower side area has not germinated yet, and the wind constantly dries out the seed. I did not use peat on either area this time, in order to reduce labor and retention of moisture which could rot the new grass since it's very shady at times.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Neighbor on side had sprinklers blown out for the year this AM.

Back neighbor finally mowed today for the first time in ages. The Nutsedge was over a foot high. The tree that came down in the storm was removed a couple of weeks ago. Thankfully he does not discharge his weed clippings (complete with sedge, Crabgrass, Nimblewill, and Triv seed) onto my side. They go the other way. Some people have common sense and consideration. That yard is mostly Poa Triv, Yellow Nutsedge, Nimblewill, and some Tall Fescue these days.


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## Green

Just noticing: I've seen some really decent looking Fine Fescue lawns and Tall/Fine Fescue lawns in commercial lots.

I'm waiting until Tall Fescue improves to the point where it spreads and recuperates halfway as well as some of the more bunchy KBG cultivars out there. And also waiting for rhizomatous Tall Fescue that is even finer-bladed than the current spreading varieties (say, under 1/4 inch). When that day comes, I would totally experiment with planting a TTTF/FF lawn if irrigation was an issue or water conservation a priority. I would probably go with Hard Fescue, and maybe a low rate of what's called Slender Creeping Red Fescue (a more drought/heat tolerant CRF species that doesn't spread as fast either, so it wouldn't take over everything over time). I think a full Fescue lawn with TTTF/Hard Fescue/Slender CRF at 75/20/5 percent would be interesting to try. A true low-input lawn that could tolerate sun and shade, look halfway decent (dark green), stand up to some use/traffic and recover from small spots, and not need tons of fertilizer. Now that would be neat.


----------



## kay7711226

Great tips, appreciated. 
I'm also suffering from the same shady(fall/spring) in the backyard north facing. The SS6000 shady mix with 25% Mazama and 75% fescue was great spring into early summer, however once summer heat came in the fescue wasn't having it. The back lawn was less than 60% filled in and thinking might have contributed to the heat stress. Overseeding with the same seeds this fall(4lbs left over) and introducing some PRG and different varieties of KBG from scotts I had laying around. Hopefully with the topsoil leveling and fall blitz I can get it up to 80-90% filled in by next summer and see how it deals with the heat then. If not I maybe have to switch to your TTTF strategy. I will swing by Benedicts Home/Garden today see if they still got special on the Agway PRG fall mix, think I got a 3-4lbs bag for $11. I'm also trying the mow and collect clippings to control the rust and dollar spots, it seems to have slowed since applying Prop&Azoxy, may also do a follow up soon.


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## Green

Reno day 10. Germination continues slowly. Been watering both mini reno areas by hand.

----------------------------------------------------------

Watered the main front area where the rust is. hand watered near the lower corner and driveway edge of the main front where the sprinkler is jammed up.
Set zone 5 to water for 15 min x4 tomorrow morning.

Neighbor nextdoor put down the Scotts step 4 the other day per my guidance to do it in Sept.

Not much happening today.


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## Green

Reno day 11. A bit more germination, but nothing you can really see or photograph yet. 
----------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday and today, a few seeds have started germinating in the lower side renovation area as well. But it's super slow, probably because I didn't use peat and it keeps drying out from the wind. I must water that area 5+ times a day. And it's often dry each time.

Replaced the sprinkler head at the driveway corner in zone 1. The filter was not dirty, so I guess the reason the head often chronically got stuck out of arc for over a year is because it was just jammed from sand where it pops up, I guess. Hopefully this won't happen to the replacement. The soil is very sandy there. I installed a used head of the same type and age. I didn't change the nozzle yet though. The replacement has a 0.75 black nozzle, but the original had a 1.5 dark blue.

Then mowed the main front and upper side at 4 inches, minus the bad rust areas in the main front, which I'll bag mow later on as I've been doing.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 12 and 15 min x4 tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Reno day 12 (10.5 days after seed down):

A little more green appearing.

Tonight is the last night of a 3-day cool-down with highs in the 60s and lows around 40 or possibly even lower. Lots of wind as well.


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## Green

Reno day 13: 
More of the same: a tiny bit of green showing here and there.
----------------------------------------------------------

Tenacity is doing its job in the low input area, but will need a second app this week, and also application where it hasn't been applied yet.

Dethatched the upper back corner to the middle part near the deck with the groundskeeper rake, scalped, and then overseeded with 1.5 lbs of Bullseye TTTF seed (3-4 lb/M). A bit late, but should work ok.


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## Green

Reno day 13: 
It continues...
----------------------------------------------------------

Mowed the back, garage side (bag mowed due to rust), upper side (3.75 in) and much of low input area (4 in, side discharge). Mowed front third of main front and bagged clippings due to rust).

Continued hand watering. And syringed, especially front hill.

Put down Milorganite: 1 lb of 5-4-0 on hard fescue area, 5 lbs of the same on upper back/garage side (hope it keeps the squirrels from digging in the overseed), and 4 lbs of 6-2-0 on lower back. Still active rust in many areas.


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## uts

Green said:


> Reno day 13:
> More of the same: a tiny bit of green showing here and there.
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Tenacity is doing its job in the low input area, but will need a second app this week, and also application where it hasn't been applied yet.
> 
> Dethatched the upper back corner to the middle part near the deck with the groundskeeper rake, scalped, and then overseeded with 1.5 lbs of Bullseye TTTF seed (3-4 lb/M). A bit late, but should work ok.


Hopefully with the weather being warmish germination should increase. Best of luck!


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## Green

uts said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Reno day 13:
> More of the same: a tiny bit of green showing here and there.
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Tenacity is doing its job in the low input area, but will need a second app this week, and also application where it hasn't been applied yet.
> 
> Dethatched the upper back corner to the middle part near the deck with the groundskeeper rake, scalped, and then overseeded with 1.5 lbs of Bullseye TTTF seed (3-4 lb/M). A bit late, but should work ok.
> 
> 
> 
> Hopefully with the weather being warmish germination should increase. Best of luck!
Click to expand...

Still more seeding to do, but yeah.


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## uts

I wanted your opinion on PRG. I was looking at mountain view seeds PRG (maybe Stellar 3GL) for this spring when I plan to do a very heavy leveling with topsoil. These are going to be 4-6" of leveling at least in a lot of areas.

My plan was to do the leveling, drop PRG in may/june (hopefully) and have a full established lawn soon. I know my irrigation will help with this. I wanted to do a sand leveling in the fall but also want to move to a full *** reno. The PRG should give me good and fast repairing ability and I could possibly do 2 topdressings in one year ? Maybe KBG the year after or so.


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## Green

Reno day 14: 
More and more seeds are coming up, but not everywhere yet. 
----------------------------------------------------------

Applied about 1/3 lb N to the garage side with Green Max. Very dry, and in poor shape from shade and a little rust.

Did irrigation audits in back:

Zone 4: 60 min. Average is 0.4 inch which is fine for the back this time of year. The back garage corner head could probably still use a decrease. And maybe an SR nozzle in the one closest to the front corner, possibly with a 6 inch head instead of the 4 inch.

Zone 3: 75 min. About 0.4 inch average. Probably should decrease the middle nozzle a bit more.

Watered the hard fescue area and put down too much, about a full inch.

Sharpened Toro mower blade. It was tight again, as it was put on with an impact wrench last time, but it came off this time after some persistence, and nothing broke. Really need to get a heavy duty socket to fit the breaker bar, so I don't have to use the ratcheting wrench again next time and risk damaging it.

Mowed the side front (dried out again and didn't grow much, but also looking halfway decent from the fert). And the rest of the main front. 4 inches. I can't go lower in the front or low input area yet due to the drought.

Mowed the rest of the low input area at 3.75 with the other mower. Took middle area to be seeded down to 2.75 in.

Helped neighbor with 3rd and final Zoysia spray. He raked and watered a little beforehand.

Set Zone 5 to water for 22 min x4 every 90 min tomorrow morning to reinvigorate the dried out grass/soil and get more of last weeks' fertilizer into it.


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## Green

@uts, are you asking for cultivar advice? 
The good news is there are lots of great cultivars, including but not limited to anything by Mountainview like Stellar 3GL (I've been using Apple SGL for a year). The Agway seed cultivars (ASP1001 GL, etc.), and many other brands are all pretty good and about equal.

The bad news is that along with KBG, they all tend to be prone to Rust. I have KBG everywhere, and I have rust everywhere.

The PR is also badly affected. And they're of course prone to Red thread.

Ryegrass definitely has its strengths in mixes and it sounds like you're discovering what those are.


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## uts

I was kind of looking for advise on both things, the plan to level the lawn and what to use and how ambitious to be .. lol

the reason for rye was the fast germination and establishment plus much lower cost per bag (I was getting a 50lb bag of Stellar for $90). This would have covered my entire front area easily.


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## Green

uts said:


> I was kind of looking for advise on both things, the plan to level the lawn and what to use and how ambitious to be .. lol
> 
> the reason for rye was the fast germination and establishment plus much lower cost per bag (I was getting a 50lb bag of Stellar for $90). This would have covered my entire front area easily.


I think you should look at mixing your own soil for the leveling. You won't get it exact, but I think mixing compost and sand is better than just sand. That's what I've been doing. I've been told that by doing this, I'm still missing the clay and silt components of my native soil for the most part. But it gets it into the ballpark.


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## Green

From this week's drought monitor regarding the Northeast:

_* In areas where pastures are stressed by drought and hard freezes occurred, significant re-growth of grass may not occur this autumn even if widespread precipitation returns. On September 20, the U.S. Department of Agriculture rated 100% of Rhode Island's pastures in very poor to poor condition. Pastures were rated 90% very poor to poor in Connecticut and Massachusetts. On the same date, USDA topsoil moisture was rated 100% very short to short in Maine and New Hampshire. Streamflow in many areas of the Northeast is very low for this time of year. Some of the areas hardest hit by drought are reporting wells going dry and new wells needing to be dug.*_


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## Green

Reno day 15: Maybe just about getting to the point where it's worth taking a photo in the next couple of days to update.
------------------------------------------------------

Continued the irrigation audits today.

Ran Zone 1 for 60 min. Findings: the average is about 0.4-0.5 inch, which is perfect. However, the newest head near the road next to the neighbor boundary could use a slight increase in nozzle size to boost watering in that area. I think it put down like a quarter inch, which isn't quite enough even for an area that often sees some shade. Indeed, the area has gotten quite dried out and stressed this Summer and required regular supplemental watering. I don't want to increase too much, though...soggy ground, dead roots, disease, and moss were the result one September when the neighbor overwatered the area because their sprinklers were miscalibrated and on every day. It might be worth trying a black SR nozzle instead of a blue nozzle...we'll have to see. I also removed the black 0.75 SR nozzle from the head I replaced the other day near the road/driveway corner, and put in a dark blue 1.5, which is the default for that area. For some reason, the nozzles sit tight in that particular sprinkler head and weren't easy to get out like usual. I guess manufacturing variance. I recalibrated the arcs on a few heads, but there was some wind at times, so we'll see later if I got it perfect or not.

Ran Zone 2 for 80 min. Findings: Average is again 0.4-0.5 inch. The head near the Juniper definitely needs another nozzle increase, for sure. I backed out the screw a bit today, and will have to remember that for when I swap the nozzle. Coverage was not even enough or reaching far enough before doing so. Speaking of which, the head near the front door definitely also needs have its screw backed out a bit. I hesitate to say put a smaller nozzle in, though, despite 0.75-0.9 inch of water in the vicinity, because it's always a sunny area that dries fast and browned in the past when I had a smaller nozzle in the head there. Maybe just adjusting the screw will fix the localized overwatering. I can always retest just that area in a week or so after making these changes. The two heads on the side are outputting comfortably over 0.5 inch, and up to 0.75 inch, but that's fine because the slope tends to get a lot of sun and dry out faster than other places.

The idea of adjustments is not just to try to get the water levels close in all areas...that is a fine starting point. But after that, you find that some areas need more or less water due shade, soil type, location, etc., and you take these factors into account, too. For example, a persistent dry spot not due to buried debris is an area that requires a bit more water and a larger nozzle than you'd expect if you were just trying to make everything equal throughout the zone/area.

Started watering the low input area but didn't get too far. Will finish up tomorrow.

Sprayed Serenade biofungicide at about 3oz rate on all main lawn areas.

Blanket sprayed 10mL of Tenacity (app #2 on most areas) with NIS on the bulk of the low input area (around the 3oz/Acre rate).


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## Green

Reno day 16: 2 weeks post seed down. KBG in the shade is slowww. The only thing slower was Hard Fescue this past Spring.
------------------------------------------------------

Finished watering low input area where it was needed. 0.3 inch with oscillating sprinkler.

Sprayed the upper back overseed area: tank mix of Tenacity, Propiconazole (3 oz of the old Bayer fungus control), and NIS (for the Tenacity). Prior, I also sprayed 0.5 oz of powdered Ultramate SG.

I also dug up part of that overseed area to remove rocks that were right under the surface and caused browning over the Summer. I'll try to fix the grading tomorrow and more seed.

Dethatched and overseeded the middle 12x25 foot area in the low input area that had been treated with Velocity earlier in the Spring and then allowed to dry out during the Summer. Used 2 lbs of TTTF blend (cultivars: Tribute II and Sitka), and 0.2 lb of Wicked TTPR seed. Then applied 1.65 lbs of granular Trinexapac ethyl.


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## kay7711226

Green said:


> From this week's drought monitor regarding the Northeast:
> 
> _* In areas where pastures are stressed by drought and hard freezes occurred, significant re-growth of grass may not occur this autumn even if widespread precipitation returns. On September 20, the U.S. Department of Agriculture rated 100% of Rhode Island's pastures in very poor to poor condition. Pastures were rated 90% very poor to poor in Connecticut and Massachusetts. On the same date, USDA topsoil moisture was rated 100% very short to short in Maine and New Hampshire. Streamflow in many areas of the Northeast is very low for this time of year. Some of the areas hardest hit by drought are reporting wells going dry and new wells needing to be dug.*_


Hopefully you are not in the stage 2 area, the cooler weather and shorter days is making it a bit easier to keep up with. 
https://portal.ct.gov/Water/Drought/Drought-Home


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## Green

kay7711226 said:


> Hopefully you are not in the stage 2 area, the cooler weather and shorter days is making it a bit easier to keep up with.
> https://portal.ct.gov/Water/Drought/Drought-Home


I think we're in the moderate drought category here and stage 1. No restrictions that I know of yet. But that's bad enough, especially when nearby it's much worse.


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## Green

Reno day 17: OMG, this is so slow.
------------------------------------------------------

Mowed family member lawn. Partly dormant again due to drought, so it wasn't unmanagable despite being 2 weeks. I then fertilized: tested out a 45-lb bag of Ecoscraps 4-2-0 by Scotts. Seems just like Milo/Baystate. Also put down 10 lbs of Expert Gardener 29-0-4 (a urea-based fert). This combo was similar to applying an 8-1-1 or 7-1-2 fert at the rates I used. Started to rain lightly while I was applying, but eventually stopped. Didn't get to blow the excess fert off the hardscape due to this.


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## Green

Reno day 18: is this some sort of joke? Maybe I should've seeded slightly heavier. The coverage is terrible. Too late now. On the positive side, some of the blades are starting to tiller. And it's still faster than the Hard Fescue was. (I've only mowed that like, I don't know, 7 or so times since seeding in the Spring, and even then mostly to remove weeds and debris.)
------------------------------------------------------

Finally was able to take the front down again to 3.75 in due to cooler weather. I had left it at 4 in the past couple of weeks due to drought conditions, but soaking rain is expected soon.

Today, mowed the front, side, and back at 3.75 inches and then the normal two-thirds of the low input area at 4 inches. Still had to side discharge in some areas due to clippings. 5 days, so I'd have to mow at 4 to mulch most likely. Also had to discharge some leaves off of an area and then mulch them in elsewhere. @ken-n-nancy: another good use for the discharge if you're willing to keep the mower oriented in the same direction opover and over to kove leaves around. Another use today: blowing the clippings off the driveway.

Left the low input area at 4 in for now because it's largely non irrigated (though I did water a couple of days ago). Also, the higher grass is helping to crowd out the weeds better, and is holding up better to the Tenacity onslaught. Remember, a lot of the grass is Fine Fescue, and I don't want it being killed by the Tenacity.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> @ken-n-nancy: another good use for the discharge if you're willing to keep the mower oriented in the same direction over and over to move leaves around. Another use today: blowing the clippings off the driveway.


Thanks for the good tips. Back before getting in to the "lawn hobbyist" thing, I used to mow primarily with side discharge for the better part of two decades. I usually used to mow "reducing perimeters" with the side discharge discharging inwards to cut and recut the clippings again and again and again to effectively mulch them up that way.

In the fall, I'd use that approach in reverse, discharging to the outside, to have the cut-up leaves all end up around the perimeter of the lawn in the woods...


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## M32075

Green said:


> Reno day 17: OMG, this is so slow.
> ------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Mowed family member lawn. Partly dormant again due to drought, so it wasn't unmanagable despite being 2 weeks. I then fertilized: tested out a 45-lb bag of Ecoscraps 4-2-0 by Scotts. Seems just like Milo/Baystate. Also put down 10 lbs of Expert Gardener 29-0-4 (a urea-based fert). This combo was similar to applying an 8-1-1 or 7-1-2 fert at the rates I used. Started to rain lightly while I was applying, but eventually stopped. Didn't get to blow the excess fert off the hardscape due to this.


Let us know how you like the ecoscraps compared to Milo


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## Green

Reno day 19 (17.5 days post seed down): So, the coverage is not great, but there is still more seed coming up, and some of what has already come up is tillering despite only being less than a half inch or so high. And this is KBG and it's a small area, so it's ok if the coverage is not great...it will spread far and wide eventually. This is exactly the reason why I decided to focus on a small area this Fall, and then do the rest of the approx. 1,000 square feet in the Spring.

Hopefully the coming rain deluge (1-2+ inches; heavy rain) doesn't mess it all up. At the very least, the ton of leaves that will come down will have an impact.

First photos since germination (sorry for the quality; the humidity fogged up the lens):









Tillering visible:









-----------------------------------------------------------


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## Green

Non-reno stuff:

-Soil temps were at 70F today, so I should still be able to eke out some final seeding in a few places this week, especially with perennial Ryegrass.

-Leaves have started changing color in some places, and more are coming down as time goes on.

Today, I dethatched, mowed and overseeded a small section near the border/Juniper. I used TTTF seed: Rowdy, Bullseye, and some old Titanium 2LS from 4 years ago (which is almost used up, but I should test one of these days). Threw down the seed by hand. Then applied granular Trinexapac Ethyl (to slightly damp grass, this time). It then started drizzling, and has basically been like that all afternoon.

I covered the dug up/fixed/leveled/reseeded area behind the deck in the upper back with a tarp because it's a slope, and we're going to get heavy rain tonight.

My neighbor who I've been helping, reseeded the Zoysia hellstrip today, as well as overseeding his side yard along the driveway. I made sure he used a mix with a lot of Perennial Ryegrass in it.


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## uts

Great to know you are doing this because I will drop PRG blend in a day or two in my backyard. Hopefully it goes okay.


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## Green

uts said:


> Great to know you are doing this because I will drop PRG blend in a day or two in my backyard. Hopefully it goes okay.


Still at at it, including an overseed on a large area. Looking to finish totally by Oct. 2nd.


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## Green

Day 20. Got 1.9 inches of rain yesterday. It's hard to tell so far, but I think the reno mostly made it through (uncovered, no tarps this time). Last night was torrential rain. Some of the sand may have shifted, and the area is still partly underwater now, so I won't need to water it tomorrow. Once the water goes away, I'll know more.
------------------------------------------------------

Germination is coming along nicely in the lower side mini reno. After the rain, a ton of grass popped up. It's probably halfway germinated now.

This evening, I seeded a small area at the top of the side front driveway slope today using the mix I made a couple of years ago for that area, and covered with peat moss.

Tomorrow, I will apply starter with Meso/Tenacity where it's needed, and try to seed the rest of the areas I need to as well as possibly mowing or trimming some areas, but really want to apply fertilizer if possible. I held off doing it the past few days due to the heavy rain that we were forecasted to get.


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## Green

@ken-n-nancy, hold onto those nozzles...I was actually surprised to receive them this time as well. I've never seen them in that set before (or any for that matter), and was starting to wonder if they even existed, but was hoping to get my hands on some eventually, because sometimes the top on/off can jam with sand, so these are an alternative. Don't for a second think these are a regular, readily available part...they're not (or at least haven't been). In fact, they're undocumented, even in the older literature. In the past, I got some for my Prosprays, too, just in case...


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> @ken-n-nancy, hold onto those nozzles...


Thanks for the tip!


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## Green

Day 21 on the Reno. Almost 3 weeks post seed down, and about a week and a half since germination began. All indications are that germination is still occurring. KBG can continue germinating for 4 weeks. The standing water is now gone. That's good. Some of the soil and sand seems to have shifted from the heavy rain, but the seed itself seems to be holding as it germinates.
------------------------------------------

Finished reseeding the last few spots from the Spring in the front, finally. Took forever to mix 1 wheelbarrow full compost and sand, because the compost was full of junk (mostly wood). 1 wheelbarrow full doesht go far, but it got the job mostly done, filling in the low spots where I had previously removed grass and soil, or buried rocks.

I then had to pick which to do: mow or fertilize. Both needed doing but there wasn't time for both. I picked fertilize because of the rust disease. Couldn't do it the other day due to impending heavy rain, so did it today. About a half pound of N on essentially all non-seeded areas, with Carbon-X (small areas reseeded a few weeks ago got fertilized, too). Didn't fertilize the hellstrip areas. I basically treat this stuff as if it were 46-0-0 urea. It's close enough, anyway. And spreads better due to being heavier. The 17% slow release from organic N makes the product a little less hot, but the ammonium sulfate kind of compensates for that. I really need to wear a mask the next time. The fert dust was bad.

Earlier today, I put 2/3 lb of starter w/meso (half rate) on the 12x24 foot overseed in the middle portion of the low input area.

The Triv is coming back in the main front. I think I'm going to use Tenacity on that lawn, see what goes white, and then hit those spots a few more times over the next month to try to thin it out so the good grass can fill in. This might slow it down from spreading and not damage too much else if done right. Experience says October is the best month for this strategy. September is too early as it's still dormant. November treatments one year resulted in a bunch of dead spots the following Spring. So, let's try October.


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## Green

Something interesting regarding sod strength:

Last week, I dug up some rocks in a North-facing area. The area gets good sun from about late May until about mid August, but in mid Fall and up to mid Spring, there's a good amount of shade.

The lawn is TTTF/KBG, and heavy on the KBG, because the original seeding rate was something like 75/25. It's also a bit sloped, and retains moisture during the cool and shady parts of the year. Often in the Winter, snow gets piled on the area. KBG doesn't like these conditions.

The cultivars are noted as having average sod strength/aggressiveness.

When I dug it up, not surprisingly, most of the sod broke apart in a few places. It was not very strong. KBG is such a battle in such areas. It just doesn't do well under those conditions. Of course, it should get a little better with the rocks now removed. No doubt, they probably played a role too.


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## Green

Reno day 22. Didn't get to check it.
-------------------------------

Got 0.05 inch of rain today. Not even enough to water in the fertilizer, so ran all the zones long enough to put down an additional 0.1-0.2 inch of water, even though the soil is still wet from rain. No more watering for a good week now.

I guess I'll just let it ride in the low input area. Whenever we get more rain, fine. No way am I going to water there. So, some of the N will get lost back into the air. Not ideal, but sometimes it happens.

While watering, I swapped some nozzles and made some coverage adjustments. Zone 1: removed a 1.5 light blue nozzle from the newest head along the road near neighbor's border and put in a 2.0 light blue. Zone 2: removed a 2.0 light blue and put the 1.5 light blue in the head near the door. Also backed the screw out a bit to concentrate the stream at further distances and reduce overwatering at near. Also in this zone, removed a 4.0 dark blue from the head near the Juniper and put in a 5.0 light blue. Finally in zone 4, removed a 2.0LA nozzle from the head near back garage corner and put in a 1.5SR. That head is not in the best place. Not sure what might be done about it. Really need to take measurements at some point.


----------



## Green

Reno day 23. Two weeks since seed down. KBG could still keep germinating for another 2 weeks. Good amount of Fall leaves falling early this year due to drought, but not too many on the Reno areas yet. Really need to do my final overseed on the adjacent area tomorrow, before the leaves get too crazy.
-------------------------------

Seed is starting to germinate in the first low input area overseed.

Started mowing this afternoon, in the front and sides mostly. Some mowing in the low input area, too. Ideally, I will re-mow tomorrow at 3.75, as well as do the back, low input area, etc.

Applied Tenacity to the small main front overseed area.

Got a new white lawn mowing mask today.


----------



## Green

Reno day 24
--------------

Continued mowing and trimming. Back and rest of side at 3.75 in. Rest of low input area at 4 in. Trimmed some of the new grass spots in the back and side by hand.

Spot seeded a few very small spots (less than a foot in size) on the upper side with Champion GQ PR.

Still active rust disease distributed throughout the entire yard with spores that go all over when mowing, but the grass is tolerating it and it's not getting worse. Good amount of grass blades in various stages of infection, as well as brown blades that were already affected.


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## kay7711226

Notice you are still doing seeds, on my neighbors lawn, I have more for the Agway PRG and was thinking keep some for next spring for bare spots, or can I chance it now and drop more seeds before first frost?


----------



## ken-n-nancy

kay7711226 said:


> Notice you are still doing seeds, on my neighbors lawn, I have more for the Agway PRG and was thinking keep some for next spring for bare spots, or can I chance it now and drop more seeds before first frost?


@kay7711226, although every day matters now, in CT if you get PRG down soon, it should germinate and survive the winter.

Due to septic tank replacement, I've successfully had PRG germinate and sruvive the winter when seeded on 11 October, which is 2.5 weeks _*after*_ average first frost in my area.


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## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> kay7711226 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Notice you are still doing seeds, on my neighbors lawn, I have more for the Agway PRG and was thinking keep some for next spring for bare spots, or can I chance it now and drop more seeds before first frost?
> 
> 
> 
> @kay7711226, although every day matters now, in CT if you get PRG down soon, it should germinate and survive the winter.
Click to expand...

And I did just that today...overseeded about 1,000 square feet of low input area in under an hour and a half from start to finish.

You're good in Fairfield county/zone 7a...you're arguably transition zone there. I'm inland, so it's cooling more rapidly here. It'll be more successful where you are. This time of year, PR germinates in about a week.

I'm using the same seed, btw.


----------



## Green

Day 25 on the KBG Reno. Pouting strongly; very minimal growth or increases in density in the past few days. I definitely do not have full coverage and will need to add more seed to a few areas in the Spring.
---------------------------------

Purchased some Tri-Rye seed from Agway, and then overseeded at least 1,000 square feet of the low input area (the portion used for last year's winterizing test--which failed due to both standing water and Poa Trivialis infestation). Hoping the overseed helps reduce the spread of the Triv. Ryegrass should give it some good competition.

The seed had a bit more other crop than I'd like to see (more than the batch they had earlier in the year), but it's unlikely to be Triv since there is no KBG in the blend. The cultivars are Allied Seed ASP0218, ASP0113, and ASP0117. I've been using their Ryegrass for almost 10 years now, and am excited to see how these new varieties perform compared to older ones I've used in the past like ASP6001. They claim an improvement in rust and very high density.

Mowed it twice, dethatched with the groundskeeper rake, mowed again, and then spread seed at a heavy overseeding rate...around 5 lbs per thousand.

Also seeded the bare spots from the Spring Triv kill real quick before it got totally dark. I will add plugs to them soon.

Also seeded slightly into the area I plan to renovate in the Spring, to avoid bare spots and mud over late Fall, Winter, and Spring.

I have a smaller area near there that's an issue, too, but I feel it's too late to really do much more seeding unless I can do it tomorrow. If not, I'll try to push Nitrogen a bit and get the existing grass a bit denser. Problem is, I need to topdress first regardless of whether or not I seed.


----------



## kay7711226

Green said:


> ken-n-nancy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> kay7711226 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Notice you are still doing seeds, on my neighbors lawn, I have more for the Agway PRG and was thinking keep some for next spring for bare spots, or can I chance it now and drop more seeds before first frost?
> 
> 
> 
> @kay7711226, although every day matters now, in CT if you get PRG down soon, it should germinate and survive the winter.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> And I did just that today...overseeded about 1,000 square feet of low input area in under an hour and a half from start to finish.
> 
> You're good in Fairfield county/zone 7a...you're arguably transition zone there. I'm inland, so it's cooling more rapidly here. It'll be more successful where you are. This time of year, PR germinates in about a week.
> 
> I'm using the same seed, btw.
Click to expand...

Awesome, I will go for it today, keep you'll posted on the progress


----------



## Green

Today:

Reno Day 26: Barely worth mentioning.
--------------------------------

Sprayed Tenacity at 1.75-2oz rate with NIS over ~5,000 square feet of low input area (minus reno, recent overseed, shaded/Hard Fescue areas, etc.). Doubled up on the PRG overseed area and adjacent Triv/annua/maybe Supina infested area. Goal is to really do the Nimblewill in before it can go dormant. Will be sticking to spot sprays for the rest of the month, as it's getting late to be blanket spraying with less than 2 months of active grass growth likely remaining.

Applied 2 lbs of granular Trinexapac Ethyl on yesterday's overseed while still damp from light rain, as the sun came out. We'll see if that strategy works better than the dry grass apps and the app during a sprinkle on other areas.

Sprayed Tenacity with NIS at 2oz rate on main front, going a bit lighter on the shaded area near border/overseed from the Spring. Hit suspected Triv spots with extra after. Goal is to get any Triv/annua, Bentgrass, etc. and broadleaf stuff like clover whitened and then follow up with spot sprays of Tenacity for the grasses and Triclopyr for the clover.

Trimmed.

Mowed the upper side and side front at 4 inches. Good amount of leaves coming down already.

Really want to mow the upper back overseed this week, but I know it's not ready yet as the new grass doesn't have root development yet, so it'll get damaged. It's not getting much sun, so it's slow.

Added peat moss to the front seeded spots to help germination.

Got unmeasurable rain a few times; enough to help keep seed moist until the wind picked up.


----------



## Green

10/7/2020:

Reno day 27: 25.5 days after seed down. Still super slow and lots of leaves. Looking forward to tomorrow's sun and wind to help it dry, and maybe in a few days I can use the blower a bit.

Aiming for a mow of the upper back overseed this weekend. Noticed lots of fuzzy balls...must be some sort of fungus from the biosolids and damp conditions.

Got a strong storm/downpour this evening with a wind gust that looked to about 50mph. Got 0.1 inch of rain.

Soil temps down to about 62F now.


----------



## Green

Today:

Reno day 28. No updates. Hanging in there.

Mowed almost everywhere, except for seeded areas and garage side. Mulched a bunch of leaves. Bag mowed again on the bad rust area in the main front. Took the back and lower/middle side down in height by using the old mower at highest setting. I was able to mow the main front and low input area at 4 in without having to side discharge...4 days since low-input area was mowed.

Next tasks to do:
-kill vines
-mow upper back overseed
-Gallery
-Propiconazole on main front overseed area
-spray fert, soap, etc.
-transplant grass plugs


----------



## Green

Reno day 29. Three, nearly four weeks since seed down. I carefully stepped onto the area for the first time since then today to blow the leaves off. The coverage is poor at the edges, but I'll take what I have for now. Hoping to mow within a week on the areas that have coverage. We'll see.

Speaking of mowing: mowed the upper back overseed except for the dug up area, for the first time. Used the manual reel mower. Did not water again today, as it was still damp and wanted the clippings to dry out. Will resume tomorrow and follow up with the first fert app Sunday hopefully. I mowed this overseed much earlier than normal. Not a lot of the new grass blades got cut yet, but they probably got matted down. Warm temps and sunlight will help.

Spot sprayed Tenacity with NIS at normal rate on as many of the Nimblewill spots I could find in the low input area. It's been brown and partly dead for over a week, but with some pale green showing when you look closely. I really hope this last app takes care of it. Running out of time as it hates cool weather.

Sprayed regular Miracle grow on the bad rust areas in the front, including the upper front hill. Rate: no more than 0.1 lb. Probably less.


----------



## Green

Renovation day 30. Still in pout stage. Most blades are no more than an inch high or so, but some have definitely tillered into two. Not going to be mowing it anytime soon, I guess.

Washed car, finally. Didn't wet the grass. Hit 74 today. Sunny. Really needed a day like this.

Did wet the grass to test the new hose end sprayer though. But wind dried it after the watering/syringing. Applied a little shampoo to the typical areas in the front. Initially it leaked, but I messed with the washer, and it seemed ok after. Grass was very drought stressed near the front hill/side slope. The water helped.

Later, after the wind died down, mowed the front and upper side, bringing it down to 3.75 in again, as we are supposed to get some rain. Mulched leaves. Did some side discharging.

String trimmed existing grass on main front overseed to give the seed a chance.

Finally changed the air filter on the Toro prior to mowing.

Why am I still the only one in the neighborhood with rust in any significant amount?

Next tasks to do:
-kill vines
-fertilizer
-pre emergent
-Gallery
-Propiconazole on main front overseed area
-transplant grass plugs


----------



## Green

Reno day 31. Did not water it because there is a lot of rain in the forecast for tomorrow.

Fertilized. Put down 0.3-0.5 lb of N from Carbon-X everywhere except large seeded areas. Did not apply to upper back. Did apply to the lower side reno.

Put down about 6 lbs of Fall pre-M on the non seeded parts of the low input area. About 3600 square feet. Used Hi Yield pre-M with Team herbicide: 1.33% Benefin and 0.67% Trifluralin. I like to change up what I use every so often. Team is supposed to also be really good against POA.

Earthway spreader broke in the middle of fertilizing, so the application in the low input area may not be even. I might have an area that got over fertilized, as it all started coming out all at once and I couldn't stop it. Grabbed the Scotts spreader for the pre-M app.

I might try to seed one more area still later this week...
--------------------

Mowed family member lawn. Greened up from the fert 2 weeks ago. Also put down KY-31 seed on some bare areas. Covered with peat moss real quick. Let the rain water it.
---------------------

Picked the 2nd and 3rd pumpkins at night!


----------



## Green

Going to stop counting reno days every day now that it's been a full month.

Got a little rain already this morning. More to come tonight.

Sprayed a little bit of Gallery around edges of mulch beds/grass for any late-germinating Chickweed, etc. Some has apparently already germinated in the last couple of weeks.

I guess I'm done with seed until Spring...it's getting too cold.


----------



## uts

Green said:


> I guess I'm done with seed until Spring...it's getting too cold.


It's gotten cold but there are a few warmish days in the forecast. The PRG that I put down a few days back, I can see it germinating.

I actually added some TTTF seed in the few big bare spots I have just because of the amount of rain we are getting. I dont see any 30s temperature for 2 weeks at least. I feel this is a milder fall.


----------



## Green

uts said:


> It's gotten cold but there are a few warmish days in the forecast. The PRG that I put down a few days back, I can see it germinating.


The PR seed I put down 6 days ago is not germinating yet. Soil temps were 62F a few days ago. I guess it will start in a day or two.

I'm not doing more seed unless I really have to. There's one area I didn't get to that I wanted to. It needs more soil/sand to level it, and I don't have enough right now anyway. I might just topdress it a bit, fertilize, and leave it until Spring. Or add a little seed for the heck of it when I do. Not sure.


----------



## Green

Today:

Got 2.1 inches of rain. Major ponding in low input area. Thankfully I had a buffer zone between the Reno and the PR overseed, so the seed should not carry over into the reno.


----------



## CTTurfDad

Green said:


> Why am I still the only one in the neighborhood with rust in any significant amount?


Hey Green! Are you still seeing this? My rust issue this year seems to be worse and longer lingering than last year. I remember you having this issue last year too, if I recall correctly.


----------



## Green

CTTurfDad said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why am I still the only one in the neighborhood with rust in any significant amount?
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Green! Are you still seeing this? My rust issue this year seems to be worse and longer lingering than last year. I remember you having this issue last year too, if I recall correctly.
Click to expand...

Yes. And they say once you have it, it tends to come back every year. I think the problem--why it got out of control back in September--is because I never applied any fertilizer in August, and I applied less this Spring than I normally do. Knowing I have rust that starts in August every year, an August app of organic fertilizer is going to be a requirement every year going forward.

I also stopped using PGR in the Fall a few years ago because of the rust. If I use it, I only use it in Spring now.

I need to get the mowing height down a bit...but I'm not sure how much that'll help. Mowing more often will stimulate more growth initially though, which could help.

The grass is coping with it ok, but it's still there. It's under control.


----------



## Green

Today, I started pulling up Poa Trivialis in the main front, and then used the groundskeeper rake to de-thatch to get more of it out in a larger area (between the driveway and small Hickory) that had a good amount of it. I did pull a good amount out (and some good grass along with it, as is unavoidable). I'm not sure how much this weeding session will help, as the stuff can easily regrow from little bits of stem in the soil, and it's impossible not to leave some behind. Having it whitened from the Tenacity was a major help, though. Having just had rain also helped with the de-thatching. I replanted some of the good grass in the bare spots that resulted, to help the lawn recover.

I don't think spraying repeated apps of Tenacity to suppress it is going to be a viable strategy right now...I don't want to kill the good grass, and that's what would probably happen. The dethatching and pulling of clumps by hand is actually less invasive and faster than Tenacity. But Tenacity serves a purpose...whitening the Triv. At the 2oz/Acre rate I used, it has very little effect on the good grass, but the Triv whitens partially.

Reminder: bag mow the area next time to get any stuff I left behind when raking.


----------



## kay7711226

Green said:


> Today, I started pulling up Poa Trivialis in the main front, and then used the groundskeeper rake to de-thatch to get more of it out in a larger area (between the driveway and small Hickory) that had a good amount of it. I did pull a good amount out (and some good grass along with it, as is unavoidable). I'm not sure how much this weeding session will help, as the stuff can easily regrow from little bits of stem in the soil, and it's impossible not to leave some behind. Having it whitened from the Tenacity was a major help, though. Having just had rain also helped with the de-thatching. I replanted some of the good grass in the bare spots that resulted, to help the lawn recover.
> 
> I don't think spraying repeated apps of Tenacity to suppress it is going to be a viable strategy right now...I don't want to kill the good grass, and that's what would probably happen. The dethatching and pulling of clumps by hand is actually less invasive and faster than Tenacity. But Tenacity serves a purpose...whitening the Triv. At the 2oz/Acre rate I used, it has very little effect on the good grass, but the Triv whitens partially.
> 
> Reminder: bag mow the area next time to get any stuff I left behind when raking.


Same strategy here, hand pulling, easily identifiable by the POA seed heads. Not going the tenacity path however, What's your preventative approach going forward? I won't be overseeding from here on into next season.


----------



## Green

kay7711226 said:


> Same strategy here, hand pulling, easily identifiable by the POA seed heads. Not going the tenacity path however, What's your preventative approach going forward? I won't be overseeding from here on into next season.


Not sure why Triv would still have seedheads this time of year...if it has seedheads now, it's probably Poa annua or Perennial Poa annua (Poa annua var reptans...which has stolons). Thankfully those two are easier to control long-term, and pre-emergents have good results on them, as does Tenacity in repeated applications (sometimes).

Strategy? Whatever I can do. It's not easy.

As far as Triv, the Tenacity, even at low rate, whitens it, which helps to find it. You can't really kill it with Tenacity...if you did enough apps to do that, you'd probably kill the good grass, too. I did that one Fall. I had a lot of collateral damage in the spray spots...so much that I had to reseed them in the Spring.

If I see any clumps in April and May, I'll hit them with glyphosate as usual that time of year. Anything real small, I might try to manually remove. Every Spring the last few years, I create dead spots and then reseed them. It's crazy.

And of course avoid overwatering.


----------



## Green

On family member property, put down 2 bags of mulch, string trimmed, watered the corner KY-31 overseed area with a gallon of water using my sprayer to re-moisten the seed, and sprayed Tenacity on that and other areas near edge. Also mowed the opposite side shorter and used the tractor again to help push the seed into the soil.
-------------------------------

At home, mowed the lower back, upper side, main front, most of front hill, and portion of side front near garage at 3.75 inches with the Toro in the dark. Then put down fertilizer (Green Max) on the upper back and adjacent patio borders at a low rate (0.33 lb N), going a little lower (0.2 lb soluble N or so) on the overseed area and the fine fescue borders.


----------



## Green

Got about 1.65 inches of rain yesterday (on top of the 2+ inches from just 4 days ago which the ground is still saturated from). The low input KBG reno and part of the PRG overseed area all flooded together. The water is still pooling now, but has slowly been drying up/absorbing. I think my trench under the reno area has really helped it to drain faster. Let's hope the PR seed already started to germinate, and that it did not move into the KBG reno area. I won't be able to walk out there to check it for several days at least due to soggy ground. I would think the drought is now substantially improved with about 3.75 inches of rain in just over half a week. My soil can't take anymore water for a while; these all-at-once rain events between dry periods are not ideal.

Pulled up some more Poa Triv in the front, and planted some of the good grass back into the spots.

The rust is mostly under control for now. Still there, but I keep mowing it off before it gets real bad.

Potential first frost tonight...covered some sensitive plants. And did not mow.


----------



## Green

Got first light frost this AM.

Today, mowed grass and leaves at 4 in, mostly on the side front and near half of low-input area (side discharging mostly), including mulching/clearing pine needles from the hard fescue overseed area from the Spring. Standing water near reno area almost gone, but still a mess (waterlogged ground, wet/matted new grass with leaves).


----------



## Green

Pulled more Poa Triv in the main front. Every little bit you remove or kill helps...keeps it from taking over. It's just that every time you pull it, there's collateral damage. That and you can never get all of it or anything close to that in a whole lawn. But I keep seeing more and more whitish patches appearing from the Tenacity, so I can't help but pull as much out as I can.

Very damp and cloudy day...still no need to water any new grass/seed areas.

Mowed the lower side overseed with the manual reel mower for the first time even though it's way early as far as development is concerned. Hoping to thicken it up. Cut at 1 inch, but didn't cut much...the mower matted a lot of it down and I had to blow it after. But every cut should help at this point now.

Also mowed the main front overseed (triangle near Juniper) with the reel for the first time to knock down the existing grass and give any seedlings a chance. Last week, I used the string trimmer for that, but decided not to chance it again at this point. I keep debating whether I'm going to apply proactive Propiconazole on the area or not. There is definitely germination, but I'm not sure how much germinated in the portions with thick existing grass (mostly *Triv*/KBG/Rye mix...which is why I overseeded it with TTTF....to get more good shade-tolerant grass in there to compete with the Triv).

Cannot help also noticing that over time, the proportion of Fine Fescue (likely Creeping Red) and also mystery fine-bladed bluegrass species (don't ask) are increasing in the main front. More and more patches are becoming apparent. I'll let the fine fescue keep spreading over time, since it seems to do pretty well...and it's not Triv (don't know if I can say the same about the mystery bluegrass). Lawns evolve over time. I don't want to fight it unless there's a good reason (e.g. Triv).

Reno area and adjacent low input area are still too waterlogged to do anything with. The reno is a mess of matted seedlings and leaves. Really hoping to be able to use the blower on it in the next couple of days so it doesn't get too messed up. On the positive side, the trench seems to be clearing the standing the water much sooner than it used to. The adjacent area pooled for a few days longer than the reno area. In the Spring, I will make another one in the adjacent area before renovating it as well.

I noticed yesterday that the Ryegrass has started germinating in the low input area.

Mowed the main front with the old mower at 3.75 in.


----------



## Green

Tons of leaves were on the flood-prone area KBG renovation. It was finally dry enough to get onto it and blow them off. The grass seed and a lot of the sand shifted into the center, so there's not much grass coming up on the outside edges of the area. Rather than think of this as a Fall reno, I'm now thinking of it as a Spring reno that I started in the Fall. I doubt it's going to get mowed this year, but we'll see. Next Spring, I can add more sand at the edges, maybe transplant grass from the thick areas at the center to the bare areas at the edges, add more seed if needed, etc.

The far end low-input Ryegrass overseed looks like it's coming in pretty well, but I won't be able to mow it just yet since it's still pretty new and the soil is really wet.

I did, however, mow the upper back overseed area for the second time. And I used the rotary mower on it this time due to the wet, matted grass and the leaves. HOC is somewhere around 2-2.5 inches, and I think it's doing great. After mowing, I fertilized the entire upper back with the application I missed a few weeks ago, using 1 lb of Green Max for about 0.25 lb N.

Also mowed the lower back and the side.

And mowed the side front (Toro) twice to mulch leaves in. Then applied about 2 lbs of Green Max to that area and hellstrip areas.

The rust is getting worse again. And now the adjacent yards clearly have it as well. Can't win...but my strategy to try to improve it is to mow more often and reduce the HOC this week while it's warm. 70 today but cloudy again; warmer tomorrow.


----------



## Green

@Babameca, any suggestions for a good (easy-to-use is key) car wax that I can probably get at Advance Auto or Napa? I'd like to wax in the next couple of days so ordering is out of the question. I have always used Turtle Wax in the past...if there is something that is both better (or at least as long-lasting) but easier to apply, that would be great. I guess I'm looking at liquids because of this requirement...


----------



## Babameca

@Green Cheap and mighty with great reviews:
https://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/hybrid-solutions-ceramic-spray-coating/6000201125184


----------



## Green

Today, I blew the leaves that came down again off the side front and onto the main front. I then watered about a half inch and did an irrigation audit in that area. Results below.

Temp hit about 77 today. Was able to take advantage of it.

Trimmed in back, and hacked into the sidewalk border grass lower. Not sure how that'll work, but wanted to get the brown from Summer out. Guess I'll have to fertilize to help it recover from the scalping.

Also watered the upper back, but only for a half hour/0.25 inch of water.

Washed the car.

Changed the center nozzle in zone 3, but I think that head needs to be moved next year to get better coverage. Removed a 2 gpm dark blue, and installed a green 1.85 gpm 30-foot nozzle that looks to be somewhat of a low angle design. Also should install a 6-inch pressure regulated head when it gets moved.

Finally, mowed and mulched leaves on the main front, and took it down to 3.25 in with the Toro, and double mowed portions with leaves. The color is terrible on the rust area still, and was exacerbated after mowing. Lots of brown from both active rust and previously damaged grass blades.

Zone 5 audit results after 60 min: not enough water on the upper front hill or the area closest to garage. I'll plan to make the following nozzle changes to start with: increase nozzle near garage. Decrease 12-inch head nozzle. Decrease two nozzles at bottom of front hill near sidewalk. Maybe install PCS at the head for rectangular hellstrip area (U-8Q). Might need to increase runtime for a half inch beyond 60 min to compensate after these swaps.


----------



## Green

Wet, cloudy day, so no mowing or anything. But ideal for watering.

I made the nozzle changes in zone 5: Changed a dark blue 1.0 near driveway and a light green 30Q near neighbor border for two 0.75 black nozzles in the front hill heads near the sidewalk. Changed the 12-inch head from a 5.0 back to a 4.0 dark blue. And changed the head closest to garage from a 3.0 light blue to a 3.5 light blue. That head is no longer feels smooth when rotating, probably getting jammed from sand and only a matter of time until it stops working. @ken-n-nancy, believe it or not, some of the no-tab nozzles were so stuck that water pressure did not get them out. And sometimes the tabs on the ones with tabs do break off. While making these changes, the area got watered again for probably a half hour, like it or not.

Also applied about 0.2 lb N from Green Max on the rust area in the main front and a little bit on the overseed area near the juniper as well. Then watered the rust area to about 0.25 inch.

Neighbor's yard got mowed today.

Also thinking about options for the rear garage corner sprinkler head in zone 4. The head that is there ends up spraying about half of its water into the natural area in the middle of its arc, which is a waste. Maybe a good solution would be to exchange it for a PRS-40 (or PRS-30) spray head, fitted with a strip MPR (or a strip spray nozzle) next year. I'm tired of wasting the water in the middle of the arc just to water the two parts on either side. These spray body options might be better ones than moving the head...a move would not really accomplish the goal.

Historical sprinkler blown out (irrigation winterization) dates:
Oct. 30th, 2020 (planned)
Oct. 28th, 2019
Nov. 8th, 2018
Nov. 7th, 2017
Nov. 16th, 2016
Nov. 17th, 2015


----------



## Green

Babameca said:


> @Green Cheap and mighty with great reviews:
> https://www.walmart.ca/en/ip/hybrid-solutions-ceramic-spray-coating/6000201125184


Thanks. That sounds really easy. I'll give it a go.

What surfaces can't it be used on?

Can you go through how you apply it and what you use?


----------



## Babameca

@Green As I probably did not mention, I am 'hardcore' hobbyist. So, I use more 'professional' products. Read the label. I would simply do a complete wash. Not even need of a full dry down. Spray on, spread with first microfiber cloth, followed by a second one to remove any haze. No pressure applied. It way easier than wax or sealant, but lasts way longer and beats water like crazy. I would avoid glass. Not sure about mat plastic, but should do IME.
And little goes a LONG way! 2-3 sprays per panel is all you need. Don't overdo.


----------



## Green

Babameca said:


> @Green As I probably did not mention, I am 'hardcore' hobbyist. So, I use more 'professional' products. Read the label. I would simply do a complete wash. Not even need of a full dry down. Spray on, spread with first microfiber cloth, followed by a second one to remove any haze. No pressure applied. It way easier than wax or sealant, but lasts way longer and beats water like crazy. I would avoid glass. Not sure about mat plastic, but should do IME.
> And little goes a LONG way! 2-3 sprays per panel is all you need. Don't overdo.


Thanks. They say to avoid soft plastic in the listing. I guess that includes the rubber type material around windows. I wonder if it can go on the metal of wheels, and if it'll benefit the plastic covers of the lights.

Reminds me, I really should get something to get rid of the haze on the headlight.

It's hard to believe something so easy to use could compete with regular wax, but I guess that's technology. I'll let you know how it works; you seem familiar with the overall product class even if you don't use it personally.


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## Green

Blew and then mowed leaves and grass. A ton of leaves came down in the past few days. The Toro did a good rough mulch at the 4 inch setting with one pass. Not clean, but ok for now. The leaves fit under it better and also didn't get blown out the right front like with the MTD @ken-n-nancy (though the gator blade will help with that a bit once I get it installed).

Mowed the side front and near half of the low input area this way.

Mowed the low input overseed areas for the first time, using the old mower at 3.75 in. Did the middle area 2x and the far area (PR overseed) 3x, finishing with the bag on. I don't think any new grass got cut yet...too short still. But it held up to the abuse I gave it pretty well.

My buddy got his fertilizer down. I had him get Scotts 32-0-4 and apply 2 lbs of it per thousand as it hasn't been fertilized since he moved in during the Summer. Just a little something to keep it going until I can look at the lawn and advise what to do in the Spring.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> Blew and then mowed leaves and grass. A ton of leaves came down in the past few days. The Toro did a good rough mulch at the 4 inch setting with one pass. Not clean, but ok for now. The leaves fit under it better and also didn't get blown out the right front like with the MTD @ken-n-nancy (though the gator blade will help with that a bit once I get it installed).


Green, thanks for the note on the mulching with the Toro. This most recent time when I mulch-mowed with the Cub Cadet, there was pretty solid coverage of the lawn with leaves, and they were damp, having not quite dried out from rain in the morning. Something about that combination pretty much eliminated the leaf-push to the front right. I took some photos but haven't had a chance to post them in the Cub Cadet thread yet. Maybe I'll get the time in the next few days...

In any case, thanks for the tip on the gator blade part number; I haven't ordered on yet, but it's on my "wish list" so to speak.


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## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> In any case, thanks for the tip on the gator blade part number; I haven't ordered on yet, but it's on my "wish list" so to speak.


Sounds like me...the year I ordered it, it was too late for leaf mulching that year. But did it ever handle the rapid Spring growth...another strength of it. I really need to sharpen and install it tomorrow...the regular blade is doing poorly right now. Just not performing well enough for the conditions.

btw, did the mention work properly and give you a notification? I added it in my edit, not the original post.


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## Green

Mowed family member lawn. A little bit long as it was 2 weeks (it's been so damp here lately...so many days with drizzle you'd think it was Britain or the PNW). It was of course slightly wet during the mow, but I made the best of it. I stayed off the overseeded areas entirely.

@Powhatan - The KY-31 seedlings are definitely up. Unfortunately the main area is a corner area near the road, and someone drove over my barricade stakes probably while backing out of the driveway. I had a feeling this would happen, so I brought an extra stake and the hammer with me today so I could fix it. Sure enough, I needed them...

But it's been 2 weeks and it germinated. It does seem a little more aggressive with germination than TTTF. It's at about the same point as the Perennial Ryegrass, maybe a little behind (which I planted on 10/5 at home) for comparison. I don't know when it germinated, as today was the first time I checked it. Sounds like a success...just hoping it (and all the grass I've recently planted this past month) survives now...supposed to go down to 25F Friday night.


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## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> ken-n-nancy said:
> 
> 
> 
> In any case, thanks for the tip on the gator blade part number; I haven't ordered on yet, but it's on my "wish list" so to speak.
> 
> 
> 
> btw, did the mention work properly and give you a notification? I added it in my edit, not the original post.
Click to expand...

I don't think so, in that none of my notifications say "You were mentioned by Green..." for this posting.

However, I still noticed the above (obviously, as I'm replying) but that was because my current style of reading TLF is to read threads in which I've posted. I don't have enough spare time right now to go looking for "new threads" that I might want to read, so I only read threads in which I've posted something. I do that by making use of the "Your posts" item in the hamburger menu.


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## Green

To-do and notes:

**shut water faucets before freeze Friday night and contact irrigation guy about blowing out system*

-clean mowers - including bag, and Earthway spreader
-Vines
-Mow/leaves
-reel mow lower side reno and final fert
-Buy supplies - fert, gloves, AMS, herbicide, car wax, shop towels, microfiber cloths
-Pre-M/fert on low input reno
*-Final fertilizer (new Winterizing method)*
-Wash car, etc.


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## Green

Blew leaves off Reno areas. Reel mowed lower side Reno at 1 inch for second time but didn't take much off.

Cleaned old mower. Then sharpened the gator blade and put it on the mower. That thing is great. Only had time for one pass mowing, but got a lot of leaves roughly mulched in the front. Mowed at the 3.75 inch setting there as well as on the other main lawn areas (back, side). Cut down the dead pumpkin plant prior and did a rough mow in that area then blew it. Hadn't mowed under it in months.

Blew the residual leaves off the upper back.

Tomorrow: my final fertilizer app. Normally early December, but trying a new strategy this year based upon the newer research.

Neighbor next door was fertilized today by "Chemlawn". They used what looks like a semi homogeneous urea/AMS particle. It's water soluble, and white, but not perfectly circular. Not clear if any if it is methylene urea or not, but I'm guessing not since it's essentially white and not at all blue. Also appears to be a little MOP in their blend. App rate appears to be 0.75 lb N or so based on prill distribution. We will see how that single app stacks up against the results of the custom blend I'm applying tomorrow. Of course, I also did the Fall blitz and they did not. @bernstem. I also blew the excess back onto the neighbor's lawn as the applicator didn't or didnt do it well enough.

My observations the past few years show that winterizing now actually works really well in my area even though growth will continue for another month or so most years. Ryan Knorr has a recent video in which Turf expert Ryan and he talk about Winterizing. Turf Ryan talks about the new research, and they agree now is a potentially good time in their area due to better uptake than late Nov./early Dec.


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## Green

Got 0.36 inch of rain last night/this morning. More to come...

Ok, here it is...

I winterized the grass today. I'm using a new (to me) method that I consider experimental. Went all-in.

Normally, I would not be winterizing so early. But I'm optimistic based on the newer research as well as my own observations of other lawns that got Winterized in late October the past few years. Plus, I put a lot of time into coming up with my own blend.

In a nutshell, most lawns that were fertilized in the final week or two of October had excellent Winter color as well as decent Spring green-up. In some years, my Thanksgiving/early December Winterizing application produced visually better results, other years about equal, and in some years worse.

All I did was tweak the fast/slow release ratio and move the app up about one to 1.3 months earlier, which is also consistent with the newer research.

My blend went down at 0.75 lb N, and contains:
-0.25 lb N from Scotts Green Max 27-0-2
-0.25 lb N from Lebanon 27-0-5
-0.25 lb N from Nitroform 39-0-0

For those that like the breakdown: About 0.28 lb of fast release N from Ammonium Sulfate and standard Urea was applied, and 0.47 lb slow release N from the Methylene Ureas/Urea Formaldehyde. Some of that is similar to fast release and becomes available within 2-4 weeks. Other fractions are longer duration release such as up to 2-4 months. And at least 0.10 lb of the 0.75 lb total N is even longer term...6 months or more. As microbial action decreases with lowering temperature, Nitrogen release rate will decrease accordingly. I did a lot of research on methylene ureas last Winter.

As I said above, I went all-in and took the risk. I applied my blend everywhere except for the 1,000 square foot flood-prone area (which is flooded), and a 500 square foot test area in the main front (31 feet along the front walk by 16.7 feet along the driveway).

My better spreader broke last week, so I had to use the Scotts Pro, which kept wanting to break down as well...the agitator kept popping up and I had to keep stopping and pushing it down. So I wasn't able to apply perfectly in 2 passes, but rather mostly in one pass. Just stating this because some areas got a slightly lighter or heavier dose as a result. The side front from the concrete marker to garage got a slightly heavier dose, for example.

The particles were all about the same SGN, and were a fine fairway grade to greens grade, so they blended really well and homogeneously.

It was very wet out. I had to apply on top of the leaves that fell overnight, as well.


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## Green

Got an inch of rain so far today. Will update the total tomorrow.


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## Green

Yesterday: The rain from Thursday continued, and then turned into the first snow of the season. It didn't pile up on the ground, but it coated some areas, and we probably had a good inch come down. I had to clean it off the car. Eventually it stopped, and it got cold. Daytime high was only in the 30s, and it hit about 26 last night with a 15 hour hard freeze. There was a freeze warning that specifically mentioned irrigation systems. The night before, I drained the supply from the faucet and shut all outdoor water off. Thankfully my irrigation guy came during the day and blew out the system.

The liquid total was 1.9 inches when all was said and done.

A ton of leaves came down. Even some Maples with mostly green leaves down the street are losing leaves now after that freeze.

Zoysia appears to have stopped growing and has little green left now.


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## bernstem

Snow already! We might freeze tonight, then back to 60-70 degree highs with 40-50 degree lows. Perfect cool season weather here other than the short days. I'll be applying your blend to half my back lawn with the other half stabilized Nitrogen (Xgrn 8-1-8). It will be interesting to see how they compare.


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## Green

bernstem said:


> Snow already! We might freeze tonight, then back to 60-70 degree highs with 40-50 degree lows. Perfect cool season weather here other than the short days. I'll be applying your blend to half my back lawn with the other half stabilized Nitrogen (Xgrn 8-1-8). It will be interesting to see how they compare.


Awesome! I'll be following. Same formula and components that I used? Let me know if you have trouble sourcing any of them.

Yup, snow here too the other day. Not unheard of, but quite rare.


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## Green

Today, I started mulching leaves in the front (there are tons). I got the side front done, but the rain started earlier than expected as I was beginning the main front. So I had to stop, and put away the electrical equipment and mowers while it was raining.

Spray painted near sprinkler heads to mark them. Noticed a Poa Triv patch on the garage side, and marked it as well. I didn't get all of it last time I killed and reseeded spots in that area, apparently.

Then I took advantage of the rain by applying shampoo to the upper front hill and edges, etc. This is supposed to be the last rain for a while, and I needed those areas to get fully hydrated.

Rain total tonight: another 0.45 inch. Thankfully no more rain in the immediate forecast. Although still in a mild drought, we are saturated for the time being.


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## bernstem

Green said:


> bernstem said:
> 
> 
> 
> Snow already! We might freeze tonight, then back to 60-70 degree highs with 40-50 degree lows. Perfect cool season weather here other than the short days. I'll be applying your blend to half my back lawn with the other half stabilized Nitrogen (Xgrn 8-1-8). It will be interesting to see how they compare.
> 
> 
> 
> Awesome! I'll be following. Same formula and components that I used? Let me know if you have trouble sourcing any of them.
> 
> Yup, snow here too the other day. Not unheard of, but quite rare.
Click to expand...

Yes, I am using the same mix. I figured it would be more useful to you if I did. Amazon made getting everything easy.


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## Green

Lots of wind today. Early leaf season for sure. More than half appear to be down now.

Neighbor 11 got fertilizer today. Looks like the same blend "chemlawn" used next door. No rain in the forecast though, so a lot will be lost to volatilization and possibly his mower.


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## Green

Started to mow today. Have a lot of leaves to take care of. Mulch mowed the lower back, upper back/overseed twice, and started bag mowing in the front to get some leaves out and also due to the rust area (which is brown now after the cold snap. It really looks like it's the low Potassium level causing all this.) Still mowing at 3.75 inches with the old mower at the moment, and 4 inches with the Toro on the low input area. It's finally drying out after the rain.

Neighbors had their fertilizer application by local company. I think it's mis-timed for the area, especially since there's no rain in the forecast. But it's also late...we're in the slowdown/pause period now and inputs should probably be decreasing rather than large drops in November.

Tomorrow I'll blow and mulch mow more areas.

Let's see if I can get this grass to recover from the rust/brown. We've had the rain. I winterized. Warm temps starting today (60s). Only one more ingredient for success left...

Planning to mow like a crazy man this week...

Let's see if I can turn this thing around.


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## Green

@ken-n-nancy, I used the gator blade again today. Great performance with the leaves. Seriously, the regular blade does not even compare. And it should work even better for you; I don't even have a Honda engine on that mower...

By the way, I had a couple of questions for you in other threads over the last few weeks, but hadn't seen the replies. Did you reply to either or both and I missed it? One was about how to balance the square star cutout blade using your method, in your mower thread. The other is a question about irrigation on a well. Thanks.


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## Green

Continued mowing again today and mulched lots of leaves.

Mostly using the old mower at 3.75 in with the gator blade, which is an absolute machine! Just totally decimates the leaves. Did the side and main front. Then mulch mowed the near third of the low input area with the Toro at 4 in.

Neighbor's lawn was mowed today by their mowing guy; my neighbor just did it a few days ago so the guy had barely any leaves to take care of and was in and out like lightening.

Other neighbor who has the same irrigation company was finally blown out today. It's a wonder nothing got damaged during that 15 hour freeze. Or did it?

Blew the leaf cover off the flood prone Reno area which was completely covered for a week. Finally mostly dried out. Clearly, it's going to be a reseed in the Spring, as enough seed and sand shifted so there is only grass in the middle. Thankfully I bought extra seed for this reason. The cultivar is discontinued.

Also blew off the lower side Reno, which is a northern mix and in situated in much better conditions (less shade, not prone to flooding) and is actually coming along slowly but steadily.


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## Green

Another warm day...high 60s. More mowing...

Mowed and mulched leaves on the side front at 3.75 in.

Did the upper back, taking it down to its Winter HOC, which is just under 3 inches (3.25 inch setting on the old mower). The overseed looks pretty good.

Then finished mowing the low input area, including the two overseeds, and re-mowed the part I did yesterday, bringing it all down to 3.75 in with the Toro. The entire yard is now down to 3.75 in. and the upper back is cut at the 3.25 in setting.

Total area mowed was at least 8,000 square feet. I'll take a break tomorrow to recuperate and then start bringing more areas down to 3.25 in on Sunday or Monday.


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## Green

75F today. And higher in more inland areas. Not unheard of, but not common.

Reel mowed the lower side mini Reno at 1 inch again. Still very thin. Then watered a bunch of new grass spots including that area.

After that, went to mow family member lawn. Took the main front and AC side down to the second highest setting, and mowed the back at the typical 4 inch setting. Then watered the seeded areas. The KY-31 seedlings seem to be holding on even with the cold snap and hard freeze and snow last week. A little discoloration in some cases, but that's about it.

Neighbor across blew out his irrigation today. I think there are still a bunch of people who haven't done it yet.

Neighbor 11 mowed his new Rygrass in the hellstrip that was planted to replace the Zoysia that I helped him kill. It looks good. @Chris LI. There was a small area of Zoysia and we advised him to get rid of it after he moved in.


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## Green

Rinsed out the Scott's spreader and the mower bag and let them dry since it was hot and sunny again. Supposedly hit 79F today. One more day left: 75 forecasted for tomorrow.

Visited a friend with a new house and lawn and offered advice on the lawn. It basically looks nutrient deficient but otherwise good overall (just really thinned out and not much color, like it hadn't been fertilized in a few years). It's also clearly mostly older grass varieties (lots of coarse Tall Fescue and very fine-bladed/bunchy KBG). Also definite remnants of old crabgrass. He's got the mowing down, is learning to fertilize, and plans to do a soil test in Spring, as well as putting down more fertilizer, a pre-emergent, Grubex, and Lime as needed according to the test results.


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## Green

Blew leaves off the lower side Reno, and lightly watered. 78F again today.

Also blew off the flood prone Reno area. The grass that survived the flooding and germinated is weak from being so damp. Looking forward to reseeding the area in the Spring and getting what is already there to spread...it's hanging on, and should survive the Winter ok despite not being cut before Winter.
---------------------------

Finished mowing family member lawn--mowed the side and back slopes, including the first mow of a lot of the new grass I overseeded with a month ago. Also mowed the far part of the back and mulched leaves. Took several of these areas down in height to the second from the highest setting. Then, watered the overseeded areas lightly, and sprayed shampoo on the problem area in the main front and watered that in. Also sprayed (first time trying it) Bonide Weed Beater Ultra primarily on the back. Maybe went a bit low on the rate, 3-3.7 oz over 3,000-4,500 square feet. Guess I can spray another app next week if needed. Surfactant was just the shampoo, but I think the stuff had it's own surfactant, too.


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## Green

I'm sorry to hear about Alex Trebek. Apparently he would have fit in here. Who knows, maybe he read the site or even posted here.

https://patch.com/california/studiocity/he-fixes-his-studio-city-sprinklers-himself-who-is-alex-trebek


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## Green

Took a look at a church lawn that was fertilized on 10/20. We'll see how it holds up, but I think the mid to late October time frame will probably work great as a winterizer.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> I'm sorry to hear about Alex Trebek. Apparently he would have fit in here. Who knows, maybe he read the site or even posted here.
> 
> https://patch.com/california/studiocity/he-fixes-his-studio-city-sprinklers-himself-who-is-alex-trebek


Me too! Alex is a part of our family, as we have dinner every night with him, since I was a kid (teenager). He will be sorely missed!

On a separate note, were the warmer temperatures able to reach enough north for you to enjoy/your lawn to benefit from? We're seeing an extended season, so far. We'll see what happens after the rain tomorrow and Thursday. The last I recall hearing is that the temps should continue to be above normal in our area for most of November.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> On a separate note, were the warmer temperatures able to reach enough north for you to enjoy/your lawn to benefit from? We're seeing an extended season, so far. We'll see what happens after the rain tomorrow and Thursday. The last I recall hearing is that the temps should continue to be above normal in our area for most of November.


Yes. About a week of 68 to 78 (today was 76, and was the final super warm day). It's going to gradually cool down again over the next week...50s by this Friday and some 40s early to mid next week.

It really helped with the late seeding progression.

4-inch soil temps were 50-55 about an hour ago around 7:30PM. Not complaining.

The area that had the worst rust this year is now mostly brown. I'm hoping it recovers, but we will see. I mowed it a bit lower than the rest of the main front today and got a lot of the brown cut out. I think it's Potassium deficient to some extent and that was the real issue. I don't know if any of the rust is still active. It might not be, now that we had a hard freeze.


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## Green

Mowed everything except most of the side front:
Took the main front down to 3.25 (Toro). Same on lower back and overseeded parts of low input. Side at 3.75 with old mower and bagged and relocated most of the leaves (a maple dropped most of its leaves today). Upper back at 3.25 and bagged including overseed. Rest of low input at 3.75 with old mower (down half a notch from last time). Mulched a ton of leaves. Old mower didn't start and it was dark. It was the spark plug. Cleaned it and it worked great.


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## Green

Finished (for now) mowing and blowing leaves. That tree near the lower side finally lost almost all its leaves this morning. Blew off both Reno areas, and mowed the side front and side, taking them down a notch to 3.25 with the Toro. Blew leaves off the upper back and garage side. Blew and then bag mowed (again) the PRG overseed area at the far end of low input and took it down a half setting more to 3.25 with the old mower.

Then sprayed about 0.05 lb N from AMS (2oz in one gallon) on that ~0.5K brown area in the main front near the street where the rust weakened the grass and caused massive shedding. I can see little bits of green poking through. It started raining lightly within the hour. Repainted marks where my sprinkler heads are.

Upper front hill has recovered due to the shampoo app and rain.

Dewpoint is 64, which is not common this time of year.


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## Green

Got 0.65 inch of rain, and the flooding is back. More leaves came down. We are getting near the end of it, but won't be totally done for a while. Took delivery of my faucet parts, and they are definitely the correct ones.

Upper back, low input fescue overseed area, and middle/lower side look the healthiest and greenest. Side front is the next best. Then lower back and upper side, then main front, and then low input. Need to check my fert notes to figure out why. Edit: the best areas were fertilized during peak leaf drop in the second or third week of October. I think we may be onto something with timing.


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## Green

Got 0.17 inch of rain yesterday.

I wasn't really planning to mow today but it ended up being the ideal day and there were tons of leaves in the front again, so I found time. I also decided to reduce the height today on the main front, down to the 3.25 inch setting with the old mower, which cuts at about 3.0 in or slightly below that. There was a good inch or so to cut off, but going slow, the gator blade handled it while mulching in the dusting of a few leaves as well. Now hopefully the grass doesn't hate me and go brown tonight since we are having a hard freeze down to 27F or so. Didn't really want to cut so far into it before a freeze, but really had no choice as today was the best day. I know some transition zone people, like GCI, always try to avoid mowing a few days before a freeze for this reason. Unfortunately we don't have that luxury here this time of year, and it still needs to get mowed. I saw tons of people mowing today as well.

Still growing strongly in the front, which gets sun. Even the side front, which I bag mowed at the 3.75 inch setting, had some grass get cut off. Previous mow in the front was with the Toro at the 3.25 inch setting 3 days ago and some still got cut off despite the slightly higher setting today. On another warm day, I'll mow the rest of the areas.

After mowing, I mixed enough 24-8-16 miracle grow for 1,000 square feet into 1.5 gal of water and sprayed the brown area(s) that were damaged by rust over the past few months. Hopefully the Potassium will foliarly absorb or in any case will get to the roots and help the grass out since soil levels are low. The urea will foliarly absorb for certain. Rate was 0.075-0.012 lb N (yes, the numbers are backwards on purpose), with the highest amount on the main front brown area and lowest amounts on hellstrip areas. Total with the two apps this past week comes to about 0.1 lb N on that area.

Then sprayed the residual mixed with some shampoo on the upper back and side from garage to end of stairs. Idea is to help get rain to soak in and loosen soil before the ground starts freezing. The surface is also crusting, which is not good. Often, the grass and soil gets messed up by freeze thaw, rain flowing along it, and animals digging. Maybe hydrating it will prevent this.

Neighbor l put down his winterizer fertilizer today.

Turned off the water faucets to prevent freeze damage.


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## Green

Mowed the lower back and upper side at 3.25 with Toro to get rid of leaves. Did not cut off much. Blew parts of upper back and garage side off. Blew off reno areas. Picked up garbage that blew in. Raining now.

Front went slightly off color from the cold last night, but it's still growing. Probably one more true weekly mow left and then of course a few more after that to mulch leaves and catch whatever grew slowly.


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## Green

Got over 0.25 inch of rain last night. Picked up sticks. Soil temp: 49-50F in the front at 4:30PM (4 inches).

Considering doing a manual Spring dethatch and overseed in that corner area in the main front that had rust bad and is now brown. The grass there appears to be primarily some crappy fine-medium-bladed KBG cultivar. Adding more TTTF would improve the disease resistance.


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## Green

Soil temp dropped a full 10 degrees since 3 days ago! Readings were taken at about the same time of day. Not sure if it'll rebound a bit, or stay around 40F after this. Some areas are below 40 (far ends of low input area). Upper back is at 40, and not really growing now (always the first place to stop as it's heavily shaded this time of year). Lower back and side are slightly above 40, and the front is in the low 40s. I probably should stop mulching leaves in the lower back now, and collect them...we'll see though...I want to do what's easiest at this point, and mulching is easier.

Quick calculation:

For my first FAS app using the Miracle Gro formula that I have, I will have roughly 0.50 oz of AMS go down per thousand square feet if I target 0.05 lb N (3.333oz of product per thousand). Since FS gets added in at about 1 : 0.85, I would need to add about 0.6 oz of FS per thousand. Using Miracle Gro because it also has foliar urea and Potassium Phosphate, and I need a bit more K (but not so much as to cause snow mold to go crazy). I'll use regular AMS for the second app the week after.


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## Green

Blew off Reno areas and bag mowed leaves at 3.75 inch in lower back but still cut off a bit at that setting so it grew a bit. Then mulch mowed the side at the same setting. Gutters were cleaned out today prior. Neighbor had what appears to be a final mow yesterday. Soil temps up a few degrees in lower back to about 45. High was 59 today, warmest day all week. This evening, made some adjustments to the Scott's Pro spreader which acted up when I applied my fertilizer almost a month ago. Got a new white mask for mowing.


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## Green

Mowed and did a combination of bagging and mulching leaves in the front at the 3.75 inch setting with gator blade. Did not cut much off. Double mowed some areas. Mostly North-South direction. Also mowed the rust damaged area in the front driveway corner at 3.25. Mowed hellstrip areas, which I hadn't done last time. Mowed the lower back North-South (no leaves there today) at the 3.25 inch setting to shorten it a bit. not sure if I'm going below 3 inches on the back this year for the final cut. I think neighbor D did his final mow today. Others mowed as well, but most likely aren't done yet due to leaves.


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## Green

Did the final mow for the year on the upper back at the 3.25 inch setting after blowing the leaves off. This area is the greenest of anywhere, partly due to the new grass I overseeded with, and partly due to the use of Propiconazole while there was rust. Growth has pretty much stopped here, so very little was cut off despite the previous mow being 12 days ago. Found a nail on the deck.

Mowed and mulched the final large batch of leaves at 3.75 inch with the gator blade in the low input area. 12 days since the last mow, and it was not overgrown, so it's really slow now. Had to collect the leaves in the far overseed portion, and double mow some other areas to get the leaves taken care of. Overseed areas were mowed at the 3.25 inch setting, and this was probably the final mow on the far area. Picked up and brought in the rocks I had out there near the Reno area.

I'm done mowing for the year on at least 4,000 square feet now.

Noticed a patch of Triv in the lower back near the beginning of the upper back, to the right of the drainage area when facing South. And another bit I missed when I sprayed this year next to the bare spot a few feet up toward the walkway. Making a note of these now.

Neighbor 11's lawn looks the best out of anyone's right now. The new grass near the mailbox is coming in well, and so is what his neighbor planted, and mine in my low-input overseeds. It should all or mostly survive the Winter.

Tonight is only going down to 50F. Wednesday, I'll finish up with most of the mowing for the foreseeable future, and hopefully spray my FAS.


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## Green

Got over 1.1 inch of rain this morning. It's extremely windy, which should help to dry up some of the standing water...before the next rain event in a few days.


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## Green

Raked parts of the front, especially where I had rust, to prepare it for better mowing results tomorrow. Received my Pre-emergent and organics for next Spring, including a bag of Dimension for a friend is a new homeowner. Neighbor l apparently removed his barrier fence this past week. He and my neighbor next door helped to get the adjacent yard (the one that never gets cleaned and leaves blow out all Winter) cleaned of leaves...I thought that was great.


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## Green

Mowed the front...first bagging with the old mower to pick up leaves. 3.75 inch, and got minimal clippings since the time I last mowed (4 days ago). Then mulch mowed at 2.75 in with the Toro to reduce the height (most of the main front), same height with the old mower on the overseeded spots and the brown area, and 3.25 inch with the Toro on the side front. The front will grow slightly more still this year. I didn't get to do the back/low input areas because it started to drizzle. I did spray my final low rate N/1st FAS app on the front though, going heavier on browner areas with the hope there is still enough time for partial recovery. 0.5oz FAS rate, but also with urea, totaling 0.05 lb N (and double to triple that on the rust-damaged area). Used NIS. I'm done spraying N now, except for one more FAS app using the bare minimum N the next time. There was also Potassium in the mixture, which I hope helps the cold tolerance since my soil is low in it. Note: I'm not going for the Guinness book snow mold record; just a little Potassium, nothing excessive.

Regarding the double mow, bagging first: I think the microbes are still active enough to handle a bit of grass clippings in the front, but I didn't feel like the amount of oak leaves present were a realistic thing to ask of them at this point. And I'm someone who has done the "mulch mow all season" thing before, and ended up with buried grass and had to rake it in the Winter. Didn't want a replay of that this year, so I've been careful to not get too heavy-handed with the mulch mowing as it cools down.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> Regarding the double mow, bagging first: I think the microbes are still active enough to handle a bit of grass clippings in the front, but I didn't feel like the amount of oak leaves present were a realistic thing to ask of them at this point. And I'm someone who has done the "mulch mow all season" thing before, and ended up with buried grass and had to rake it in the Winter. Didn't want a replay of that this year, so I've been careful to not get too heavy-handed with the mulch mowing as it cools down.


^+1
I've also learned from experience. Don't let the quest for OM and soil improvement get in the way of sound science. During the leaf season, I have the opportunity to mulch 2+ times per week to feed the microbes on a regular basis, before the soil temps drop. I can turn the leaves to dust with my setup, and they would be digested within a week or so (especially if we had a little rain to enhance decomposition). However, there have been years where the temps would suddenly drop leaving finely chopped leaves (mostly Red oak) that would not break down until the following season. Not only would it be unsightly, but more importantly, it would reduce turf density, and essentially smother some of the blades reducing what little photosynthesis was left for the season. The overly thick layer probably helped inhibit weed seed germination (I have read studies), but I think was detrimental overall.

This year, I decided on a slightly different approach. I always bag some leaves for the vegetable garden, but changed the timing. Usually, I mulch most of the earlier part of the leaf season and occasionally bag for the clean look, or if the leaf cover was light. This season I mulched entirely up to yesterday, to get as much leaf mulch into the lawn before the soil temps drop. Then I pulled the trigger on ONLY bagging for the remainder of the season, so I have enough leaves for the vegetable garden. Some years, I have mulched too much into the lawn and didn't have enough for the garden. The cool backyard can't take mulching as long, so the area near the garden has gotten side discharged leaves directed into the garden. The NE corner of the house that is almost always shaded still had embedded leaf litter from last week, so I fluffed it up with the blower and sucked it up with the bag yesterday.

Sorry for the long post, but I thought you might be interested in the methodology.


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## Green

Got 0.7 inch of rain this morning. Lots of flooding now. At least my spray app got watered in.


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## Green

@Chris LI, well put. Now if you can help me understand how you make leaves disappear using side discharge, I'd appreciate it. Or maybe the secret is the Snapper mower?


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## Chris LI

It's a combination of equipment and technique. After a few perimeter passes, I use the Zamboni pattern of overlapping rectangles (with curved corners) to shift the piles away from the street. When it gets as closer to the garden, I look at where its building up, so I can redistribute the leaf mulch. Depending on what I see, I might reverse the pattern and work back towards the street, or I might go straight down the middle of the furrow and work my way out of the center blowing the leaf mulch outwards. I may do a few back and forth passes in the thicker areas after that, to continue redistributing the material. I usually finish making perpendicular back and forth passes (towards/away from street) working my way from the edge of the property towards the driveway. If I need more passes after that, I continue in that orientation until I work my way back towards the property line. The combination of the Zamboni pattern and finishing with cross hatching back and forth passes works well to evenly distribute the material. I think that is the key. Once you get a buildup in one area, you need to keep working it to spread it out, otherwise you can wind up with overly dense areas which don't break down as well. Also, you want the nutritional value spread as evenly as possible. 
In irregular areas, I work with the shape/terrain to do a similar thing.

IMHO, the Snapper is superior due to its deck design, but any mower with side discharge capability and a Gator blade can get the job done. The Gator will keep the material under the deck longer, so it's more finely chopped before it exits the deck. I visualize where I want the leaves to go and adjust to mowing/mulching conditions (moisture, wind, etc.). This technique works well, but it's not done with only a couple of passes, when the leaves are heavy. I gauge how many passes will be needed based upon density of the leaves. With several passes in multiple directions, they are pulverized to pea size and smaller. For the most part, I run the mower at the slowest travel speed, and highest engine speed. Time and patience go a long way. I 
try to get the most out of each pass, and don't mind if a couple of leaves are missed. 
I know they will get picked up in future passes. 
Essentially, I strategize it to get the maximum production with minimal time, like a landscaping business would do. However, I do spend a little more time to get the best finished product in reasonable time. If I were running it as a business (whether collecting or not collecting any material), I would run a faster travel speed to get it done faster with a little less quality.

One other thing to note, the leaves travel further away from the mower on the first/second chopping, when the size is larger. After that, the smaller particles travel shorter distances when they are chopped multiple times. Keep this in mind when trying to redistribute the leaf mulch evenly, and when you near the perimeter of the area you are working, especially near hard surfaces and in windy conditions.

I get instant gratification when I turn them into dust. A long time ago, I used to dread leaf season, when I would get every leaf out of the yard (including the beds), every week, bagging everything (all for the vegetable garden and compost pile; nothing to the curb). Now I embrace leaf season. I saw the light and mulch most of them (saving some for the vegetable garden).


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## Green

@Chris LI, thank you very much for the detail. I couldn't ask for it to be anymore thorough. I'm going to need to look up the Zamboni pattern. Despite having been to a good amount of hockey games in the past 10 years, a combination of not being able to follow the pattern of the Zamboni well, and not always paying attention to how it drove, means I need to review it.

What I've been doing is to try to distribute the leaves with a handheld blower first and then mulch mow. But if you think your method could do that without the blower being used a lot in many cases, it could save time (and battery power if using the battery one).

Another thing is, it seems the current Snapper mowers still have a throttle control, whereas no one else does. Is that correct? Also, you keep raving about being able to suck up nut shells. That's useful. But at the same time, Allyn Hane did a video in the past testing the idea of whether mowing after fertilizing sucks up fertilizer. His Toro sucked up a bit of it. I hesitate to think that long-duration polymer coated fertilizer and the Snapper high vac mode aren't compatible...

Some neighbors here use a blower/vac built on a lawnmower body. I'm not sure if Snapper made it, or MTD for Craftsman, or someone else. It looks like a mower but sounds a bit like a blower and is not used for mowing, just picking up leaves.


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## Chris LI

You're welcome...great discussion here. I'll jump in on your questions/comments:

The Zamboni pattern I am referring to uses a single machine. If you see them at an NHL intermission or a higher end rink, they will use two machines to get it done in half the time, so the ice can set quickly. I made a crude color coded drawing using Crayolas. I used ROY G. BIV (Yup, found 'em all in the box, Lol), to make it easier to distinguish where the two perimeter passes (red) transition to the overlapping rounded rectangles. It's OK if you laugh at my artwork, I'm utilitarian, and have a good sense of humor. I'll attach it at the end.

I blow the collection of leaves off the curb line and about 3'-4' into the lawn past the sidewalk, to reduce chances of blowback. This tends to leave a pretty good furrow, which gets worked across the lawn using the pattern. When I blow the beds out, it balances the load even more. I don't tend to spend time evenly distributing them with the blower, but that's just my preference. If I see a nice even coating of leaves delivered by Mother Nature, I will use that opportunity to mulch instead of side discharging them, to keep them in the same location.

Most non-commercial 21" mowers don't tend to have a throttle control, as you mentioned. That's one more feature I love about the Hi-Vac. I hate starting engines at full throttle, especially with cold oil. Funny you mention fertilizer pickup with mowing. The throttle control fits right into that discussion. There have been times (rarely) where I didn't need a lot of suction, so I would run the throttle on the lowest setting and bump up the travel speed to compensate for the snail like pace. This was when I only had some stray leaves that I wanted to bag (for a clean look) without picking up previously mulched leaves. This technique also reduces fertilizer pickup.

On the subject of fertilizer pickup, I used to make heavy apps of fertilizer with some slow release N (usually PSCU or SCU) in early fall a few weeks before I would switch over to bag mowing leaves. Then I would do a final fertilizer app after my final bag mowing of leaves at the end of the season. I would avoid applying fertilizer during fall bagging season. Now I love using 100% WSN (urea and AS) for that exact reason; no worries of fertilizer pick up. This is another reason why I started incorporating liquids in my program. In the spring, I avoid bagging a couple of weeks after a fertilizer app for the the same reason. Another option I have used is to use a blade with no lift (Ninja) to avoid pickup, in case I needed to bag. If I ran that blade on lowest throttle, I think fertilizer pickup would be negligible.

Those leaf mulching machines you mention are pretty cool. I used to window shop them at Sears before I bought the Snapper (and the Sears near me closed). They were essentially a lawn vacuum/leaf shredder. They had a good size hose (~4" or so) that could detach to vacuum out the beds and hard to reach places. They're not cheap; probably $700-$900, and only good for a short portion of the season, so my backpack blower/Snapper combo works well for me.


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## Green

Soil temps rebounded to around 50F today as an average during the peak of the afternoon before sunset, and about 45 in tye upper back, where I fixed a lot of squirrel damage in the overseed. End of next week, I'm going to put down a hommade repellent so they stay out of it, and to prevent voles this Winter.


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## Green

Temps are pretty average now...in the 40s mostly with some 50s here and there for highs. All Zoysia grass in the neighborhood is now fully dormant and brown. Got 4 extra gallons of gas in case the power goes out during the storm the beginning of the week.


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## Green

@Chris LI, thanks for the color-coded drawing. I assume it starts in the middle/top portion where the line starts. I'll have to keep going over it to try to follow it exactly, but the colors definitely help! So does the write-up. I'll study it and then ask more questions.

As far as 21 and 22-inch push mowers go, I'm not that happy with the three I've used so far, but all have a few good points, but none are perfect. (2 Craftsman/MTDs and one Toro). Someday I'll get something higher-end/better, but I'm not totally sure what that will be...but brands like Snapper, Massport, Husqvarna, and the professional 21" Toros we've talked about before all have strengths. Anyway, it'll probably be like 7-10 years before I buy something real good.

I noticed that Snapper now looks to be selling some lower-end (up to $650) MTD-designed models under their brand name (including at Walmart). I bet this has something to do with Briggs and Stratton.


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## Chris LI

You're welcome. I know it looks like a 3 year old drew it, Lol, but since the lines cross I figured it would be easier to decipher. I know my eyes would go wonky trying to make heads or tails of it. One thing to note; that is the exact pattern we drove the Zamboni (actually an Olympia, with old Zamboni as backup) at the rink I worked at ages ago. I would back out the doors (at the top) and start the 1st perimeter pass across the doors. You can start at any part of the perimeter and work clockwise.

As far as the MTD built Snappers, I don't have any experience with them, but have seen comments online that they are not as robust. I think they are mainly there to get the Snapper name out there at a lower price point, and try to keep up with the Jonses with features. The Hi-Vac and Ninja models are higher end old-school, less moving parts, more robust, etc. (especially the Commercial versions). Before I bought the Snapper, I was very torn, because I wanted a mower with BBC (blade brake clutch) since I was bagging most of my leaves at that time. I almost bought a Toro Super Recycler with BBC, but always wanted the Snapper Hi-Vac, so ultimately it did not deter me from buying it. I would suggest that Toro model as an alternative, if the Snapper is not for you.


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## Green

Today, I did my final trim and final scheduled mow, mowing the areas I didn't get to last time. But something tells me I will likely be mowing once more between now and Christmas; it looks like it'll still be warm enough for a slow burn the next couple of weeks...at least in the front.

This was probably the last mow on the lower back, though...not much was cut off and it's been 8 days. Any further minor growth won't need to be mowed again most likely as it's very shaded back there now. So I'm likely done with the upper back, far half of low input area, garage side, and lower back now...about 6,000 square feet.

I mowed the lower back, side, and side front (including hellstrip areas) at 3.25 inches with the old mower, and the near half of the low input area (very damp) with the Toro at 3.25 inches. I mowed the main front curb strip at 3.75 with the old mower. The only areas where a significant amount was cut off were the side and the side front. Not many leaves, so I mulched in the few that were there. Hand trimmed a lot of areas with grass shears.

Cleaned out some mulch areas. Took in 3 of the 4 hoses for the year. Washed out the spreader.

Blew leaves off the upper back and garage side.

The front rust-damaged area looks like it's recovering with some warm temps, the fertilizer, rain, and frequent mowing. (There has not been active disease there for several weeks to one month.)

I noticed a little active rust on tall untrimmed grass near the AC compressor. So there is a bit left still.


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## Green

Got 2.8 inches of rain yesterday.

Soil temps were 48-54F from upper back to main front in full sun today.


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## Green

Worked on family member lawn. Mowed the front, sides, and started mowing the back, all at the top (~4-inch) setting. 3.5 weeks since the previous mow, and it wasn't overgrown, due to slowing from the impending Winter dormancy. Color is holding. Started trimming. Including hand trimming the corner KY-31 overseed to help it harden off. Started blowing leaves. Some matted areas in the back due to wet leaves, but should recover. Planning to finish tomorrow before the rain.


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## Green

Today:

Mowed this morning. Not a lot of leaves lately, just a few here and there, so in the front, I felt it was no problem to mulch them in. I started by mowing the lower back at the 3.25-inch setting with the old mower/gator blade combo. I was fairly sure the previous mow was going to be the last one for this year, but it turned out it was ready for one more mow today. I also went slightly into the upper back, near the shed, where some sun still hits and it looked like it grew. Clippings in the bag after mowing were pretty short, probably a third of an inch on average. Last mow had been 5 days ago. I really feel this will be the final mow for the year on the back.

Mulch mowed the main front and side front (except the middle portion) at the 3.25 inch setting with the old mower/gator blade for a 3-inch cut on average in most places. I bag mowed the portion of the main front in front of the small Hickory tree, and before that, I raked out the driveway/road corner area that is recovering from the rust disease. Still a good amount of brown there, but it's better than it was a few weeks ago. I also skipped mowing on any areas that didn't need it. Clippings were longer here than in the back, but still not overly long...probably 5/8 of an inch or so.
----------------------------------------------

Then I went to finish up the family member lawn. Radar led me to believe it had drizzled or rained lightly there between 8 and 10 AM, so I let it dry out, and then went over. I finished blowing the matted leaves that were stuck to the grass. I had trouble starting the riding mower. Not sure what the problem is. It cranked but didn't turn over, even though I had just used it yesterday. After a few times, a puff of smoke came out. Then it cranked and buzzed on subsequent attempts. I plan to check the spark plug next time. But since I wasn't sure where it was and didn't have anything to remove or let alone clean it with, I charged the battery for 10 minutes to see if I could provide a little extra power to overcome whatever issue was preventing it from starting. It worked, and once I started it and used it, I had no issue restarting it again a few times. But a huge puff of black smoke came out when it turned over the first time. This starting problem has been getting worse the past couple of months. Note to self: don't try to connect the charging leads to the battery terminals with the charger already plugged into the AC! Bad idea.

Once I got it started, I re-mowed much of the front at the second-setting down (I had mowed it yesterday at the top setting).

Then, I went back and used the blower to spread the leaves around the back for mulch mowing. I wasn't sure how well all those leaves would mulch, and it took another hour or so to spread them around and prep it for mulching. After that, it was just a matter of driving the tractor around enough to mulch them, and having fun going through deep leaves and doing irregular patterns. Once that was done, I lowered the deck to the next setting, and mowed the area down to shorten it. I stayed off the very far back, which was a bit soggy, etc., but didn't need mowing. When I was done, the leaves (mostly Maple, with some Oak) were mulched pretty well. It was basically a whole season worth of leaves, because I had last mowed 3 weeks ago and most hadn't dropped yet, but by today they all had dropped. It was more than I expected, but thankfully still manageable by dedicating an entire afternoon and with some perseverance.

Photo from after distributing the leaves and before mulch mowing:








(It doesn't really show how many there were in this photo, because it's taken from up high, but that was thick leaf cover.)

And as it started getting dark when I finished mulch mowing:








(Terrible image quality in the dim light with my phone. And I'm pretty sure I won worst striping ever with my irregular, zigzagging mulching passes. Sometimes you just have to get it done and it doesn't matter how it looks.)


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## Chris LI

:thumbup:


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> :thumbup:


I know it looks like it could be a bunch of Zamboni patterns, but in reality it was just a bunch of zig-zags and uneven circles around the perimeter, and then a random zamboni pattern as the final cut, but hopefully not leaving anything uncut. Basically, I hit the areas with leaf clumps more often. You know how it is when it's getting dark.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> Chris LI said:
> 
> 
> 
> :thumbup:
> 
> 
> 
> I know it looks like it could be a bunch of Zamboni patterns, but in reality it was just a bunch of zig-zags and uneven circles around the perimeter, and then a random zamboni pattern as the final cut, but hopefully not leaving anything uncut. Basically, I hit the areas with leaf clumps more often. You know how it is when it's getting dark.
Click to expand...

It looks great! You got everything mulched so you can't see it in the photos. That's what matters. As you get more practice, you will find yourself improvising to adjust the pattern to the conditions that you are seeing.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> It looks great! You got everything mulched so you can't see it in the photos. That's what matters. As you get more practice, you will find yourself improvising to adjust the pattern to the conditions that you are seeing.


I love mowing before rain comes. It held off all day yesterday until it got dark.

-----------------------------------

Today, we got a storm with 2 inches of rain, some snow/slush, and now wind the past few hours. Needless to say, no more mowing for a good week based upon how wet it is and how cold it's going to be most of next week. I still have some areas at home that didn't receive a cut this week, so I'll hit them the end of next week.

Family member lawn is now done for the year, except for some grass trimming and maybe raking of a few pine cones later this month. I think the single app of post-emergent I used about a month ago did some good on that lawn. I forget the equivalent trade name, but I had Bonide Weed Beater Ultra based on Ryan Knorrs's recommendation, and it was a mix of Carfentrazone-ethyl, Dicamba, MCPA ester, and Mecoprop-P. I had never used that mix before, or Carfentrazone, but a single app chlorosed some of the broadleaf weeds and was fairly easy on the grass. I kept it well away from the trees to avoid drift. I think the cold will zap the weeds further, too. Interestingly, I saw a few dandelion flowers yesterday, right down low near the grass surface. Those things never quit.

I believe I saw some confused Forsythia bushes this past week as well, blooming yellow. Time for pre-emergent?


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## uts

Funny you mentioned confused forsythia bushes, one of my hydrangeas on the sunny side started opening a leaf bud last week, then it realized how stupid it got when it dipped in the low 30s and a few frosts.. lol


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## Green

Today, nothing strictly with the yard other than picking up a few sticks and fixing some squirrel holes. Also started up the snow blower. Worked fine even though there is a bit of old stabilized gas still left in it from like last Feb. Along put air in the tires, as well as the Scotts spreader tires. Very chilly with the wind today.


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## Green

uts said:


> Funny you mentioned confused forsythia bushes, one of my hydrangeas on the sunny side started opening a leaf bud last week, then it realized how stupid it got when it dipped in the low 30s and a few frosts.. lol


It's so weird. I wish I'd been able to get close to those Forsythia to verify it was yellow and not green leaves, but from a distance, I swear it was yellow flowers.


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## Green

High was 38F today according to weather channel data. The wind was low, so I sprayed biofungicide on the main lawn areas. It's been so wet that any disease could worsen going into Winter. When I walked on the upper back, I could feel that the grass/ground was very cold. There was no frost at that time, so I hope walking it doesn't damage the lawn. Normally I wouldn't walk back there when it's 38 degrees, but I wanted to get the stuff applied because there was little wind, and tomorrow is going to be colder than today, as well as windier. We also aren't supposed to get rain for 5 days or so, which is ideal when applying the product. Soil temp back there was 35F. Anyone think walking the lawn at that temp could damage it? The grass felt a bit stiff underfoot, and was cold to the touch. But again, there was no frost at that time. Hopefully it will be ok. It's always the coldest area. All other areas felt soft underfoot. Not sure what the threshold point is for damage..whether there has to be frost, or how cold it has to be.


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## Green

At family member lawn: started up the tractor to test it, but it popped (sounded like a 0.22 rifle). (No, I didn't jump, actually...but the cloud of black particulate smoke made me move pretty fast). Finally got it started after a few tries and more smoke, and ran it for 5 minutes or so. I need to figure out what's wrong with it.

There was snow on the ground in most places, so all I could really do was stuff like trim near the back door and ac unit, cover it, fix the gutter tube, remove the stakes, and bring the hose in.

Oh, there was a guy in an F150 with a lot of fertilizer bags in his bed. Which one of you guys was that, lol?


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## Green

Mowed today, applied final fertilizer per winterizer experiment, and blew leaves on areas I didn't mow (garage side, upper back, behind shed, and far half of low input area). Washed out both mowers. Ran the gas out.

The final mow of the season is now done. I'm done until March.

Bag mowed the lower back (yes, one more time) and the side at about 3 inches. Some mulch mowing on the sunnier part of the side. Side front and hellstrip at the same height. Front hill and main front reduced to about 2.65 inch. All bagged. And most of the near 3500 or so square feet low input area got mulch mowed at about 3 in (skipped the shaded areas: behind shed (blew that off) and hard fescue area). Might have chewed up an irrigation flag with the mower.

Put down my standard winterizing app from past years (0.50 lb N from Scott's 27-0-2) on three areas: the 31 x 16.7 foot test area in the main front (1 lb of fert over just over 0.5K area), as well as the lower side Reno (which got double winterizer apps now) and area in the lower back that got damaged from the pumpkin plant (and I don't think was winterized yet). I didn't fully measure the fert on those last two, but they got a combined total of 1/3 lb of product.

Also applied 1 lb of N from the small bit of 46-0-0 I had left on a test area in the side front at the corner of the driveway and garage side walkway. This experiment area is also getting double winterizer apps, and at full rate. Used about 1/3 lb of product on 0.125 K area.

Used the hand crank spreader for all of these apps, and then blew off the driveway and walkways. Repainted my marks with turf marking paint.

Took in the last hose in the front and again shut the water off.


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## Green

Got at least 0.1 inch of rain yesterday.

60F today.

Finally waxed the car and put up Christmas lights. Sprayed vole repellent on upper back, garage side, and 3 sides of shed. Mixed 5 oz of Victor Castor oil repellent, a few drops of peppermint oil, and about 1.5 oz of Dawn Ultra Platinum (I think it was too much soap for a gallon as it foamed and overflowed and made a mess. Then sprayed 2 more gallons of water over that 1,250 square feet. It will rain/snow tomorrow to water it in. First time trying this. Hoping to prevent vole damage in late Winter and maybe repel mice, too. If it reduces squirrel holes as well, great.

Soil temp in front was 41F at 9PM.

Dug up a small patch of grass in the back to remove some Perennial Ryegrass from the TTTF/KBG mix. Transplanted the grass into holes in the main front.

Next door neighbor applied winterizing fertilizer today: about 0.65 lb N and 0.25 K from Scotts step 4.


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## Green

Yesterday: a bit more rain, and snow that didn't stick. In a couple of days: first big snow of the year.


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## Green

Put up marker stakes along the driveway, road, and sidewalks tonight. It's still late Fall, but it feels like Winter now. Looks like mostly 30s for highs the next two weeks, which is typical for January. It could go into the single digits by the end of the week.

The spray application to the upper back does not seem to have deterred the squirrels from digging. But I know what will...the upcoming heavy snow.


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## Green

Got like 10 inches of snow last night. I wonder if it'll stock around until Christmas. A few days until Winter officially starts. Roughly 90 days until the first mow of 2021. I've got my gypsum ready to apply near the road in late Feb/early March.


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## Green

Went down to at least 10F last night. Weather looks good for the next few days, but Winter-like. Done shoveling snow now for a bit.


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## Green

Had a rain/wind storm last night. Ended up getting 2.504 inches of rain. In addition, there was about another 0.5 inch locked in snow that melted. So, the usual flooding occurred. Thankfully someone cleared the storm drains yestersay. Near 60 degrees for the past 24 hours due to a strong South wind.

Soil temps this evening were mostly 40-50F. Grass looks the same as it did before the snow, but matted now. Still no visible diffs in the winterizing experiment areas.


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## Green

Got near 50F this afternoon and was sunny, so things started to dry out nicely at the surface in the front. I picked up some sticks and leaves, did some light raking, and shoveled some more of the snow off the edge near the street to help it melt faster where it was piled.

The daffodils hear the door (right hand side) are just starting to come up. This is wicked early. I noticed while I was pulling up grass that encroached on the area. They're covered by mulch and some leaves, and hopefully they will slow down as it gets colder and the ground freezes, so they don't get hurt by the cold.

I transplanted some of the KBG from that area into bare spots in the main front.

I'm not seeing tons of Poa Triv. Usually by this time of the year, I see a good amount of it. And there is always more in the Spring than what you see in Fall and Winter. But at least that's a good sign that there isn't tons of it visible now. I apparently made a significant dent in it the past couple of years.


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## Green

Got 0.2 inch of rain last night, with more likely tonight, so call it a quarter inch or so. The grass is watered more than well enough right now (still some standing water/ice in the low input area).

I wonder when the ground will freeze. Probably late Jan., just like last year...


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## Green

Got about an inch of snow by yesterday morning. Pretty much melted now, but the moisture helps the grass. It's going to be dry for the next week, so it was welcome. Swept up a few leaves the other day so they don't end up in the lawn. Grass is no longer growing at all from what I can tell, and is holding up well.

Edit 1/5/21: The middle overseed portion of the low input area is no longer darker green than the surrounding grass, viewed from a distance. This means that the methylene urea applied via starter with meso (half rate) on 10/1/20 has now run out. 3 months is about right, so it makes sense.

I'm now seeing widespread Poa Triv reappearing in the main lawn of my neighbor I helped with the Zoysia hellstrip last year.


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## Green

Yesterday, I did a little raking of a matted area in the front near the road where there had been snow piled up. I also got rid of some leaves in the driveway and parts of the lawn, and picked up sticks. Color is going even more now in all areas except for the upper back overseed, which has maintained more green (likely due to new grass holding color better). Soil temps are also declining: in the front, they are in the low to mid 30s, and in the back, low 30s (e.g. 32F). And this was in the middle of the day, so it's peak soil temp. The ground is in the process of freezing. Finally, I've noticed once again while walking the neighborhood that Perennial Ryegrass is holding its color the best, something I noticed last year as well. It's an interesting thing, since Ryegrass usually has the worst Winter tolerance. I guess just like in Summer, it stays green as long as possible, and then rapidly goes downhill if the threshold is exceeded.

The rest of next week is supposed to continue the slightly above average temperatures we've had for weeks (around 40F for the high). And then after that it looks like it's going to be consistently average for Winter in this area (highs in the mid 30s).

Roughly 65 days remain until the first mow of 2021.


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## Green

This week is still above average; in fact we are in a stretch of the highest temps in a while...highs solidly up into the 40s. I was able to clean up the few leaves, sticks, and pieces of bark in the main lawn today, including the upper back which I was able to get onto for the first time in a month, and blew off. Finished raking in the front where snow had been piled.

The grass is very dormant everywhere (not a lot of color generally), and the ground is obviously somewhat frozen in the back.

Roughly 2 months until I mow again.

65% of the snow comes after Jan. 15th in my area, with the Jan. 20th-Feb. 20th period the busiest for big snowstorms. Last average date of measurable snow in my area is around March 22nd, but I've usually mowed once before that.

Late Jan. to early or mid Feb. is historically the coldest time of year here, so the cold will be coming soon.


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## Green

Got over 1.1 inches of rain last night and this afternoon.

Highs are still around 40F for a few days. This has been a good long streak of slightly above average temps for about a month now.


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## Green

Raked up/blew the few leaves that were on the main lawn areas. Warmest day for the next couple of weeks most likely. Got over 40F, but trending colder going forward. About 50 days until first mow in the front.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> Finally, I've noticed once again while walking the neighborhood that Perennial Ryegrass is holding its color the best, something I noticed last year as well. It's an interesting thing, since Ryegrass usually has the worst Winter tolerance. I guess just like in Summer, it stays green as long as possible, and then rapidly goes downhill if the threshold is exceeded.


Funny you mention this. I noticed this after introducing PRG into my lawn a couple of years ago, when trying to deal with establishment issues in high traffic areas. I stayed away from it because I didn't want it to compete with my kbg, and for the Winter kill/Summer burnout tendencies.

Since we finally hit real Winter temperatures this past few days, I'll have to take another look.


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## Green

1/25: checked soil temps in front. Most areas were too hard. Hellstrip areas were as low as 32F. The warmest area was the side of the front hill and was in the upper 30s. Picked up a few leaves/sticks. Added N2 to car tires, bringing cold psi up from 32 to approx. 34. Neighbor who battles Zoysia had a tree removed. Frozen ground should reduce lawn damage.

Got snow starting today. Just a little bit.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Funny you mention this. I noticed this after introducing PRG into my lawn a couple of years ago, when trying to deal with establishment issues in high traffic areas. I stayed away from it because I didn't want it to compete with my kbg, and for the Winter kill/Summer burnout tendencies.
> 
> Since we finally hit real Winter temperatures this past few days, I'll have to take another look.


Things held steady for a few more days after that posting, then cooled down over the next couple of weeks. We peaked a few nights ago with two days back to back with a low of 8F. Then yesterday, that big snowstorm hit. We had about a foot by 4 or 5 PM, and well over that now. Probably will be around 18 inches tomorrow.

Edit: I think we had 18+ inches when it finished. Powdery easily but compacted and kind of wet/heavy.


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## Green

Got 7 more inches of snow yesterday.

2/9: Got another ~3 in of snow.

Over 2 feet in the past week.


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## Green

Got 3/4 to 7/8 inch of rain last night with the Nationwide Winter storm (on top of existing snow). Thankfully icing of surfaces was limited to the first few hours while it drizzled, and then it warmed up to above freezing, so no power outages. Got gas yesterday just in case.

------------------

Today, checked out family member lawn for first time this year. Lots of plow damage 2-3 feet into the lawn along the edges near the driveway. Not sure if any of the new grass planted last year is still there now. I'm hoping most of the damage will end up being just the topgrowth and a layer of soil sheared off, but I won't know the full extent for a few weeks, so I can't begin to formulate a remediation plan yet. I saw a lot of bare soil and bare spots with some divots removed, so we'll see once the snowy season is over.

Also messed with the riding mower while there...checked oil, removed the spark plug, cleaned, and reinstalled it. Started up and ran the engine for a few min. Still got a puff of smoke upon startup, but it did start up. Added the rest of the gas and some extra stabilizer. Spent about 10 min on it.


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## Green

Some wet snow and/or rain yesterday and today.

As of the past day or two, we are clearly in the final phase of Winter. This is when the sun gets a little stronger, days a little longer (sunset around 5:30PM, finally), and things begin to get more wet and damp. Temps also happened to rise starting today, coinciding with the seasonal changes. This year, there's a lot of snow to melt.

This phase usually matches up well with the calendar, as do seasons in general. Where I live, solar and astronomical seasons seem to be very correlated; e.g. late Winter starts around Feb. 20th, and Spring starts in the third week of March. Meteorological seasons are a bit off from the other two, and not as reliable an indicator of seasons here.

So, while people in Tenessee or NC are seeing the beginning of their meteorological Spring right about now, I'm exactly a month behind them.


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## joemarshallxx

So I have one sole tree in my front yard, and the dry spot (15' x 15' area) is all on a slope, a pretty good steep slope as well. I tried verticutting and seeding last year, but whenever it would rain or I when I would water it, the seed would wash away (I put pete moss on top after I seeded). Should I have gone with hay? This year I plan on doing one of those grass matts to help prevent them from being washed away. Is this the right move? Finally, there are some weed (clovers and other weeds) in the bare spot. Should I kill those off before putting the matt down? Should i also put new soil down as well? Thanks!


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## Green

joemarshallxx said:


> So I have one sole tree in my front yard, and the dry spot (15' x 15' area) is all on a slope, a pretty good steep slope as well. I tried verticutting and seeding last year, but whenever it would rain or I when I would water it, the seed would wash away (I put pete moss on top after I seeded). Should I have gone with hay? This year I plan on doing one of those grass matts to help prevent them from being washed away. Is this the right move? Finally, there are some weed (clovers and other weeds) in the bare spot. Should I kill those off before putting the matt down? Should i also put new soil down as well? Thanks!


Did you mean to post this in the tree discussion area? If so, you can still copy it, and delete before you make another reply on the site, then repost.


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## Green

Got about 5/8 inch of rain over the weekend. Snow is melting; grass is essentially fully visible on the front hill now, always the earliest place to dry out or melt. Most other areas are still covered for now. I saw some snow mold in the immediate neighborhood; a few sporadic patches of both gray and pink in neighbors yards where snow has already melted. Mowing height seems to make no difference; grass ranges from about 1.5-3 inches in the area. If I had to guess, I'd say the first (mostly unnecessary) mow of the year will be delayed a week, so not until around probably around March 22nd (after Spring has began officially) before any mowing starts this year.

It appears we are on the verge of greenup starting very slowly in the next week, at least once snow melts fully...I see initial precursor signs beginning. Typically, Perennial Ryegrass is first, followed by some types of fine fescue, and most types of Kentucky Bluegrass and Tall Fescue seem to be the latest to green up, always lagging considerably (taking into April).

A neighbor with an older, irrigated lawn (25+ years old; sodded originally), mostly a Ryegrass/KBG mix, is almost bulletproof...the Ryegrass that survived all these years (mostly fine-bladed varieties) must be very cold tolerant, and isn't phased by the single digit temps we get for several nights each Winter. It probably makes up almost 50% of the lawn mixture regardless of having endured Winter and Summer stresses repeatedly. Natural selection. He did lose a good portion of his hellstrip this past Summer, though (insects?).


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## Green

A couple of days ago:
Checked soil temps. Front: around 40F at 4 inches and 45F at 2 in. (Neighbor front: 50F.) Back: frozen solid.

Today: all snow in the front finally melted. Still some left in places in the back. Grass a bit of a mess due to matting. Front hill and hellstrip areas dried out enough to rake; still too damp everywhere else. Squirrels started digging up upper back. Need to find a repellent. (I hear hot pepper works.) Main front mulch bed got raked put and some pruning was done.


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## Green

Update:

Got about 0.95 inch of rain yesterday. Essentially every last bit of snow melted in the process. A couple of days before, I started raking, as the front and upper side were drying out enough to begin. Planning to finish up this weekend in the front if if it dries out enough, and will then take stock of how things look. Today was the last cold day in the forecast (just in time for Spring), topping out around 40F. Soil temps in the front (at about 4 inches) were around 40 or slightly above in some areas today as well.


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## Green

Just a little bit of snow is still visible in a yard down the street in a shaded area where it was piled. Soil temperatures are on the way up. I was able to finish raking the majority of the front today. The more shaded area from the utility boxes over is still too damp and cold...maybe in a couple more days. The upper back is still frozen solid.

I was also able to photograph the experiment areas for the winterizing experiment after they got raked, and will post them in an update soon. A friend stopped over for lawn advice and goods I had purchased, before I raked. I asked him to evaluate the areas. He saw no or minimal difference, like me, and it was hard to say one area looked better than the other. But everything is just barely starting to come out of dormancy...it's still pretty brown. More pruning, etc. was done today, also. Lights came down.

Started seed tests.


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## Green

Yesterday: continued raking, including front hill bed. The Crocus flowers started blooming even while covered up, so I had to carefully clear all the leaves and sticks out to reveal them.

Today:

Sprayed Triclopyr ester on front walk chickweed, spiked with NIS and also some blue Nitrogen solution that was sitting in my sprayer all Winter. Hoping to kill it before it produces seed.

Finished raking the front entirely.

Took the mower out and did the first mow of the year on the side front/hellstrip areas! Got quite a bit of clippings, but almost 100% of them were dried grass. (Not much green material in the bag, thankfully.) Mowed at 2.6 inches (and 3.2 on the edges). Got a few twigs in there as well.

Applied gypsum to the edges (mostly near the road).

Then, the mower quit on me. Cleaned spark plug. Still no go. Swapped it out with an almost new one. Finally started up after some hesitation and a little blue smoke.

Then mowed low (1.6 in) and raked out the corner of the main front near the road/driveway. Put in stakes and measured. Put down 1.25 lbs of seed (6 lbs/M). This was the worst of the rust area last Fall. (I assume the seed is No-Net TTTF blend as marked. It could've been mismarked by the company I guess, but it's clearly some type of TTTF seed anyway.) Problem is, there's a fair bit of thatch and the seed is kind of hung up in it. (The groundskeeper rake didn't finish the job as it was so tenacious.) I might go in with an actual dethatching rake in a few days and cut some slices in, gently. I think it can be done after the fact without disturbing the seed, even if it's not in the ideal order.


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## Green

Today, I worked on the dethatching of the already-seeded area, and hopefully improved the chance of the seed rooting into the soil. Also raked a couple more areas--the rest of the side, a portion of the low input area, and the back down to the end of the patio. Also threw a little fertilizer (SOP and Milorganite) onto the back daffodils that were coming up.


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## Green

Got 0.6 inch of rain last night. I saw one Forsythia bush in bloom, several miles South of here. Several neighbors have put down pre-emergent this past week, and I've seen lawn fertilizing company trucks out. Haven't seen any mowing guys out yet; probably next week.


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## Green

Mowed the main front at 2.6 in for the first time this year. Really only brown clippings were collected in the bag, as expected. Figured I'd get it done before the rain storm tomorrow.

Also sprayed first app of glyphosate on several Poa Triv spots (in the front, mostly) since the wind was low.

GDD tracker is now in the green optimal range for crabgrass pre-emergent application, but I won't be doing it on most areas this year as it's not necessary due to low crabgrass pressure. So, the grass will get a break and the roots will be able to grow uninhibited. Squirrels are still digging up the upper back.


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## Powhatan

Green said:


> Also sprayed first app of glyphosate on several Poa Triv spots (in the front, mostly) since the wind was low.


I'm still finding poa triv clumps randomly over the yard even after spraying and hand pulling several times. Not as much as when I first started removing it a couple years ago. Every time I see it now I hand pull as much as I can. It's just a continual battle now to try to keep the population low.


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## Green

Got almost 1 inch of rain last night.

Today, I evaluated the areas for the Winterizing experiment. I should be able to post this update and the photos by tomorrow night.


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## Green

Powhatan said:


> I'm still finding poa triv clumps randomly over the yard even after spraying and hand pulling several times. Not as much as when I first started removing it a couple years ago. Every time I see it now I hand pull as much as I can. It's just a continual battle now to try to keep the population low.


Yeah. I will see soon how much there is this year!


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## Green

Today:

Sprayed Tenacity on the main front road/driveway corner overseed area. Put down peat moss. Watered once by hand. Applied about 0.2 lb of granular Trinexapac-ethyl to the damp grass AFTER applying the light coat of peat below the canopy.

Forsythia are just now beginning to bloom a little in the area.

----------------------

Worked on family member lawn for 1.5 hours (first time of 2021):

Raked matted grass in front, raked up turf chunks from snow plow. Evaluated plow damage (thankfully not as bad as I thought based on a month ago). Picked up pavement chunks strewn everywhere (don't think it was from the plow...looked like someone dumped it...pain in the neck but had to get it picked up so I can mow in a week or two). Applied first app of pre-M to the front, side, part of AC side, and the hill in the back and around the immediate back of the house. Pendimethalin to help with broadleaf weeds as well as CG. Put down roughly 1.35 lb/M of 2.68% AI granular Pendi. I'm a little bit late with it. Should've gone down a week ago. Skipped it on the real badly damaged areas that I plan to seed.


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## Green

Got 0.4-0.5 inch of rain last night. Going down near or below freezing the next 2-3 nights, so I covered the daffodils that started blooming.


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## Green

Easter. Looks like last night was the last night of 3 in a row to go below freezing. Had to cover the daffodils.

Started hickory pruning.

It's warm and windy enough now that I had to water the overseed 3x today.


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## Green

Past week has been as follows:
-Forsythia are in full bloom mostly now.
-Soil temps: low to mid 50s at 4 inches in the front. Still 40 or not much higher in the back. Not much happening...greenup is super slow and deliberate this year.

Today: Noticed the first signs of TTTF seed germination in the main front driveway.road corner overseed.

Next door lawn had fertilizer/pre-M applied.


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## Green

Family member lawn:

Wed 4/7: Gave lawn tractor to mechanic. Would not start.

Fri 4/9: Put down rest of first split app of pre-M. Dimension 0.15% 0-0-7. 2 lbs/M. Applied to rest of back except shaded far and right-hand portions that haven't rooted in yet post-Winter. Rest of AC side. Parallel to house direction.

Sat 4/10: Leveled and plugged/reseeded damaged driveway edge areas and watered them. Seed used: Rushmore Chewings Fescue, Gladiator Hard Fescue, Baron KBG. Top dressed with heavy layer of old (2015 dated; failed recent test) VNS CRF. Topdreseed with peat moss. Only seeded side front edges. Plugged both sides and area along side walk. First time trying Proplugger. Very useful tool. Trimmed.

Tues 4/13: Got tractor back. $80. Had additional trouble. No start post repair. Called mech to troubleshoot and he stopped by. Likely due to batt terminal lead corrosion. Need to clean. Sprayed more Tehacity on main front edge and front road corner (after string trimming unidentified creeping weedy forage grass--trying to knock it down by trimming and spraying immediately after). Watered seed and plug areas.


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## Green

Put down approx 12 lbs of 0-0-50 SOP on entire low input area.

Took second set of measurements for winterizing experiment.

Mowed front at 2.6 in. Second mow/first true mow (in the dark). Several other neighbors did the same earlier today. Marked some more Triv spots.


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## Green

Rain. At least 0.3 inch by midday and counting...


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## Chris LI

You've been busy! Do you have any photos?


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> You've been busy! Do you have any photos?


Just photos for the winterizing experiment so far. I'll be updating that next week sometime.

I'm seeing Poa Trivialis again this year, and starting to spray the spots. Problem is, some are pretty big and a fine bladed type that hides, and they get worse over the years. And unless you spray well beyond the area, you never get it all. Even then, it occasionally comes back in the same spots 1-5 years later. It's easy to find the spots on a cloudy day.

I'm going mostly without pre-emergents this year. Giving the roots and environment a break.


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## Green

Got 1.97 inches of rain by last night (total). Take that, abnormal dryness!


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## Green

Continued watering overseed. Lots of grass up now, but it's in the stall phase.

Sprayed a bunch of Triv spots (like 30 or more) mostly in the main front and side slope of the side front, but a couple patches in the back as well. I really hate doing this and wish there was a viable selective herbicide.


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## Green

Late afternoon:

Raked the lower back. For whatever reason, the ground and matted grass seemed kind of hard at the surface, so it didn't really stand up well when I raked. The rake kind of just scratched and glided over the surface. Not sure what causes that soil texture, or what I can do about it. It almost sounded like you could get a reverberation of the rake noise off the surface like you would knocking on a hollow door.

Mowed the side for the first time this year (at ~2.4 inches). Mowed the middle portion of the low input area which was ready as well. Broke the 1/3 rule. Also, the yard is bumpy in that area. And the Poa Triv is very obvious. I'm hoping to get it under control.

Pulled up what I believe is chickweed in the front mulch. Need to re-spray the sidewalk one of these days before the crack weeds go to seed.

Also very soon, I need to start sod trays (for real this year), finish pruning, kill a bit of moss, and finish early Spring seeding. Those are all on the list for the end of this week. Looks like I'm missing the mulch sale at Home Depot.

Neighbor's lawn was mowed yesterday for the first time this year.

Thankfully a little (but not too much this time) rain is on the way tomorrow.

A good friend of mine is slowly learning the basics of lawn care from me. So far this year, he has applied his first split app of Dimension to make a dent in the crabgrass factory he was given, patch seeded a small area a week ago and had germination start today, and purchased and started using a manual reel mower to supplement his new lawn tractor purchased last Summer. He's going to maintain a diverse, eco-friendly lawn a la @Powhatan (probably even more diverse...I think he's decided he's keeping the dandelions). The lawn seems to be a Tall/Fine Fescue, Kentucky Bluegrass, and other plant mix primarily.


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## Green

Got 0.15 inch of rain as a thunderstorm passed nearby late in the afternoon. Immediately prior to that, I spread about 3.5 lbs of 0-0-50 SOP on the side front and hellstrip areas (parallel to driveway). I also cleaned up/scratched up part of the lower side reseed from last year where it was too thin, and the adjacent area between it and the neighbor's tree, and threw down some Rowdy TTTF and Gladiator Hard Fescue. I need to add a little bit of soil next time due to the tree roots.

Pulled out a few unknown small Poa plants from the area. They had the brown stem coloration that Triv can exhbit, as well as long ligules, but were already developing seedheads (while the blades were still no more than a quarter inch long). Triv or annua? Head-scratcher.

Speaking of seedheads, I did see the first definite signs of seedhead formation on the desirable grass beginning.

Marked a few Triv spots for future spraying.

My neighbor next door mowed for the first time this year.

Due to the impending potential for temps to drop to 32 or 31F tonight, I set up a sprinkler and timer to water for 1 minute every hour during the night. This way, I won't lose my new grass seedlings to the cold. (That's a Hunter PRS30 shrub mount with a Rainbird 18-foot spray nozzle attached, set to cover a right angle.) I also painstakingly covered the daffodils in the front. The wind should also help.


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## Green

Temps stayed cold. Today's high was in the upper 40s and very windy, and it's going down to 33 tonight. I set up the sprinkler again to protect the overseed tonight, and covered some back daffodils just in case, some of which still have a couple of unopened buds. Soil temp was low to mid 50s in the front.


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## Green

De-thatched the front hill today, using the groundskeeper rake. I had never de-thatched this area before, but kind of planned to do it this Spring due to seeing an accumulation of material last Fall and having some Summer (and of course Fall) performance issues. Did it in two directions. Almost all of what came up was brown grass blade material. Surprising how much there was that wasn't breaking down. I don't believe much of any true thatch (e.g. dead rhizomes) came out...it was all relatively light material from the grass blades and a few above-ground dried stems possibly.

Essentially nothing alive/green was removed, which is why I love using this rake so much. That and the fact that it doesn't take a lot of pressure and doesn't wear you out too bad (as long as you don't rake continuously). You also have a lot more control and it's more environmentally friendly than renting a machine (and costs nothing). Gave it a quick second raking with a metal spring rake after. Hopefully this will help with the Summer performance. I may repeat in late Summer/early Fall since this was a relatively light de-thatching. The lawn is a bit more brown-looking in the area now, but should recover over the next couple of weeks. I plan to bag mow it tomorrow to pick up any remaining material.

Adjusted the sprinkler for the overseed area and changed the schedule to like 6 min 3x per day (10, 2, 6).

Received a bottle of Prodiamine 65WDG I ordered from LCN's company the other day. I'll probably use this on whatever areas I pre-M this year (not a whole lot of areas). Tenacity will be the first app, which will go down in the next week as post-M/temporary pre-M/marking indicator for weedy grass. And then any areas that need more duration will get a longer-acting pre-M such as this Prodiamine.


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## Green

Garage side got cleaned up. Acorns galore. Mowed lower back for first time this year (3.25 in). Just took a little off (and not everywhere did something get cut off), but will probably decrease the HOC the next time. In keeping with not mowing too much off, I mowed most of the front at the same setting. I did mow the area between marker and back of the garage at 2.6, as well as the front hill (which got bagged, and as expected, 3/4 of the clippings (after yesterday's dethatch) were brown stuff). Mowed the main front at 3.25 in. Applied 0-0-50 SOP on the rest of the lawn: Back, side, main front (minus the overseed area). Applied parallel to driveway. About 2 lbs/M of product went down. A few more straggler Oak leaves from 2020 that are still dropping got mulched in today. There are still a few more left on the trees, as well. Also trimmed by hand in the front. Marked some more Triv spots on the side and in the front for next week, and pulled up a patch of Poa annua on the upper edge of the side (where I saw some last year as well).


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## Green

Got 0.4 inch of rain last night.

Today:

Finally mixed and sprayed Cayenne pepper and peppermint oil on the upper back lawn to hopefully stop the squirrel dig-up project and let the grass root in. Note: remove the filters from your sprayer; and it may still clog up every so often. Thankful that N95 masks are available again...that pepper solution can get nasty (used lab grade goggles as well). While I was out there, I also sprayed the second app of Triclopyr Ester on the front walk chickweed. Used the residual on some clover. And then got out the glyphosate and sprayed more Triv spots (front, side, and low input area portion near the back).

Temps are only going down into the upper 30s for a couple more nights.


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## Green

Got a few more things done:

Mowed the main front, lower back (2nd time so far), and far end of low input area (1st time). HOC: 2.6 in.

Pulled up a good number of small Poa annua plants in last year's lower side reseed area (that answers the question of whether it was Poa annua; the tipoff was the seed heads). Note to self: apply a pre-M to this area in late Summer, and Tenacity in the next week or so.

Applied moss out to that area and the small area behind deck corner.

Put down Miracle Gro soil (compost) to amend the portion that was seeded last week under the tree and keep it moist. Lots of plastic crap in the soil that had to be picked out, and also what appeared to be a shoelace. (Shoelaces don't compost very well, apparently.) Hopefully no weed seeds.

Raked the upper back.

Trimmed.

Pruned Spruces.

Sprayed glyphosate on more Triv spots in the main front and side.


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## Green

Put out mosquito dunks in the flood prone area ahead of the next batch of rain. Local lawn company #1 applied pre-M today for neighbors A and B. (B finally reseeded the dead hellstrip areas--one from last Summer; the other from many years ago. They obviously did not pre-M those areas). Gave neighbor 11 the shade mix for his shady area that was mostly moss. His applicator company still has not come yet to do pre-M. Crabgrass could start germination in about a week given historical trends and current temps. Seed mix had the following: 50% Gladiator Hard Fescue, 30% Rushmore Chewings Fescue, 10% Common Creeping Red Fescue (not a big fan but that was the only type available), 8% Perennial Ryegrass (3 Allied Seed cultivars), and 2% Mercury Kentucky Bluegrass (a derivative of P-105; has some shade tolerance). His lawn is mostly PR, KBG, Triv, and FF.


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## Green

Only got 0.10 inch of rain maximum yesterday (probably less). But that's ok. It'll allow me to do some things in and near the flood-prone area over the next few days now that it's dry enough.

Today, I hand watered the two overseed areas, as well as the lower side mini-reno areas from last year, which were in need of water. That area is still very sparse, and I want to start fertilizing it regularly soon to get it to fill in.

High wind brought down my overseed barrier, so I fixed that.

The gdd tracker just crossed into the yellow early crabgrass germination period the past couple of days, so my Tenacity needs to get applied in the next days. (Not using a conventional crabgrass pre-M on most areas this year.) Hopefully we'll have some days free of wind.

Planning to post a backlog (past two updates) on my winterizing experiment thread in the coming days, but time is short, so we'll see.


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## Green

Got a little bit more rain overnight.

Mowed the low-input area (non-flooding parts) mostly at the 3.25 inch setting. Mowed the uneven behind shed area at the top setting (3.75). I plan to move some plugs around in that area soon since the grass is thin.

Sprayed a single, well-defined Poa Triv plant in the lower back a few feet from the patio.

Only watered the lower side overseed today. Let the front one dry out, as I plant to mow it for the first time tomorrow.


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## Green

Yikes...

Attempted to prune the roots on some small trees (unfortunately, buds just broke open the other day, so technically late). I thought I could transplant this April, but now I'm reading that you have to prune 6 months ahead of time and then wait.

First (reel) mow on the main front overseed. Did not water it again. I think mostly old grass was cut.

Mowed the front and side at 3.2 inches (2.6 on some parts of main front).

Sprayed a few more Triv oddities in the main front, and marked others for future reference.

Neighbor 11's fert company finally came in the past couple of days to pre-M/fert his lawn. Just in time because crabgrass is apparently starting to germinate (according to soil temps, gdd tracker, and Forsythia which are losing their yellow). He doesn't really need the fert at this point, but that's how those companies generally roll. They would be smart to use like a 15-0-7 or some such thing.


----------



## Green

Got 1.09 inch of rain yesterday/last night.

Drew a circle around the young Hickory (I think it's 9 years old now) and then sprayed glyphosate to kill the grass in order to make a mulch circle. Accidentally got a small amount of spray (gly + AMS + NIS) on the base of the tree (on the bark about 3-4 inches up off the ground, wetting a spot a little bigger than the cover to a gallon jug). Rinsed it off within 10 min., but I've been panicking ever since. Hopefully it doesn't kill or damage the tree or compromise its health in any way. I was reading that young trees have been injured by the chemical in some cases. The leaves have not opened up yet; it looks like the buds are just starting to undo themselves and I wanted to get this done before the leaves started coming out. Probably should have been a little more careful and used a guard of some sort (though it's also possible that the root system can absorb it from the ground, and apparently it can stay in the tree tissue for a year or more, with dosing injury being a cumulative thing). On the positive side, we got a good amount of rain yesterday/last night already, plus more to come, so the tree should not need to soak up everything after the spray...it's already hydrated.

Marked some Triv spots in the front (for experimenting) using the marking paint while I had it out.

Mowed the lower back/adjacent portion of the side at 2.6 and raised to 3.2 in partway through. Mowed a small bit of the upper back at the same time near the shed. Mowed the low input area (nearer portions that aren't wet) at the 2.75 and 2.25 inch settings with the Toro (but it's still too long for now). Plan is to mow again in a couple of days.

Sprayed a few Triv patches in the low input area and back.


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## uts

Green said:


> Got 1.09 inch of rain yesterday/last night.
> 
> Drew a circle around the young Hickory (I think it's 9 years old now) and then sprayed glyphosate to kill the grass in order to make a mulch circle. Accidentally got a small amount of spray (gly + AMS + NIS) on the base of the tree (on the bark about 3-4 inches up off the ground, wetting a spot a little bigger than the cover to a gallon jug). Rinsed it off within 10 min., but I've been panicking ever since. Hopefully it doesn't kill or damage the tree or compromise its health in any way. I was reading that young trees have been injured by the chemical in some cases.


I have a red maple that looks fairly young in the middle of my reno which I did last year. I sprayed its base and everywhere around it. Might have even gotten some on the trunk as well with volitalization because it was in the summer. It looks great this year and didnt drip any leaves last year either.


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## Green

uts said:


> I have a red maple that looks fairly young in the middle of my reno which I did last year. I sprayed its base and everywhere around it. Might have even gotten some on the trunk as well with volitalization because it was in the summer. It looks great this year and didnt drip any leaves last year either.


That's great to hear! I felt like the risk of hitting it with a mower or trimmer was too much...that's why I wanted to do the mulch. Everything is about how much risk you're willing to accept...


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## Green

Got another 0.10 inch or so of rain yesterday.

Today, I moved some plugs using the Proplugger, in the back (where Triv was killed last year) and adjacent area behind the shed (where I'm trying to propagate fine fescue because that's all that will grow in the shade). Moved about 15 or so plugs. Only took about 20 min. It's a great tool. If you're moving a lot of plugs, you might want to wear boots instead of sneakers, because jumping on the plugger repeatedly in old sneakers probably is not great for the feet (kind of hurt after).

Trimmed in back. Watered the lower side overseed. Some seedlings are coming up.

Mowed: Upper back for first time this year (2.6/3.2 in). Lower back/lower-middle side (2.6). Note: I'm been using push lawn mowers for about 10 years now (since soon after college). You'd think I'd have figured out sooner not to push uphill with outsretched arms like a zombie. (The lower the HOC, the harder it seems to be to push a mower.) Now I know why I keep getting pain behind my shoulders, in my lower back, feet, and neck. Unless someone has far better strength and endurance than average and can do that easily, I think it's anatomically better to move the arms and mower forward like a positive bench-pressing repetition, and then walk forward, and then repeat. You don't think about it usually, because you just want to get it done. I'll keep experimenting (and I can't wait to use the other mower which is self propelled once I'm mowing slightly higher). Ah, biomechanics...

Also mowed the side front/hellstrip areas and upper side (3.2 in), garage side (2.6 in), and main front (mostly 2.6 with 3.2 toward the East).

Both neighbors were mowed today (one was quite overgrown because they were on vacation for about 2 weeks...should have seen the clippings in the wheelbarrow after he mowed).


----------



## Green

Opened up the irrigation for the year after it stared to rain lightly. There are a few issues that need to be taken care of to get everything working right.


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## Green

Mowed family member lawn (~2hrs of work total). Had to fix the battery leads/terminals first...disconnect, clean, reconnect. Started right up after, but did backfire. Thankfully someone else had mowed it recently at least once over the last week or two, otherwise it would have been way overgrown. There were some clippings left to take care of and mulch in first. After doing so, I mowed everywhere, mostly using the second setting down. After, I trimmed, blew, and then put down Dimension on the shady L-shaped back portion (eyeballed the amount, but probably 4 lbs/M or so) as it started to rain again. I then used the garden weasel in a dead patch back there and seeded with the Chewings and Creeping Red Fescue. Did the same to the portion in the corner of the main front, and seeded with KY-31, but did not get to put down any peat moss or Tenacity yet...later in the week.

Didn't get to do anything at home. Most of the leaves finally came out on the trees, but not all, and Zoysia is starting to green up around here.


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## Green

Yesterday, 5/10/21:

Last night, got 0.7 inch of rain.

Sprayed 2nd app of glyphosate on Triv spots. But there is a lot more outside the spots, so...

I did it. I sprayed Certainty (Sulfosulfuron) on about 0.7M of the main front in a double anti parallel set of roughly L-shaped areas:

....................[................................].... 
....................[................................].... 
....................[................................].... <
.....................[..............]]...............].. < overseed
.............................]]]]]]]]]]]]].
..........................]]]]]]]]]]]]]].
....................O......]]]]]]]]]]]].. <tree
]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]..
]]]]]]]].........................................
]]]]]]]...........................................
]]]]]]..............................................
]]]]]]..............................................
]]]]]]...............................................

Key: ]] denotes sprayed areas. Some other patches also treated. Used turf paint to draw out area. Kept spray away from tree root area, and leaves are still in early phase process of unfolding.

Used 1.5 gal. of dehumidifier water mixed with roughly 0.24g of herbicide, any remaining residue of Triclopyr ester from the sprayer, and approx 1.5oz of NIS. Also sprayed periphery of all gly spots, except those in the back and low input area. This may be my only app, depending on how the lawn reacts. (Because Tall Fescue does not like Certainty, but I can always overseed in Aug if needed.)
Also sprayed Poa annua patch at top of side hill (which got Tenacity last week).


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## Green

Mowed today. Since the grass was a bit long, I temporarily upped the HOC in some areas. Main front (except areas sprayed yestersay): 3.2 in. Side front: same. Garage side and upper back: 2.6 in. Lower back: 2.25 inch setting (but grass is longer than that after being cut). Side: 3.2. Low input near 2/3: 3.25 (behind shed: 3.75).

Lower side corner overseed is progressing well.


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## Green

Mowed the lower side overseed with the reel mower. Really need to fertilize it and do a Tenacity spray due to the Poa annua. Still watering the front overseed every couple of days lightly. Raked out the back walkway grass to get the dead stuff from Winter out. The daffodils back there are starting to end the flowering period.


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## Green

Today: mowed. Most of main front and upper side also: 2.6 in. Side front from garage to marker: same. Rest of side front: 2.6. Low input: 2.25 setting on near part and 3.2 on far (damp part--Triv infested; broke 1/3 rule and side discharged).

Pulled Poa (mostly annua) on flood prone area (maybe 10 plants, not too bad).

Sprayed lower side mini Reno with Tenacity due to Poa annua. Eyeballed the rate (really not critical for the first app as long as you don't go too high). Tank mixed with 1-2% (again eyeballed) N, low rate of NIS, and whatever Sulfosulfuron residue was in the sprayer.

Did not get to mow back or trim.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> Low input: 2.25 setting on near part and 3.2 on far (damp part--Triv infested; broke 1/3 rule and side discharged).


I'm curious on your methodology with the different HOCs on these two locations. Can you elaborate?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Low input: 2.25 setting on near part and 3.2 on far (damp part--Triv infested; broke 1/3 rule and side discharged).
> 
> 
> 
> I'm curious on your methodology with the different HOCs on these two locations. Can you elaborate?
Click to expand...

Honestly, it's just "how much can I get away with cutting off and still have it look good and be healthy?" (and not violate the 1/2 or 1/3 rule). It was pretty overgrown due to not being able to cut that far area for a long time (this was like the second or third mow on that area this year as it was so damp and even wet the past week or two), and the soil was saturated in that area, too, so there was more rolling resistance as well (which would've been even worse--leaving bad ruts--at a lower HOC). No worries...the neighbor who borders that area has zero lawn care inclination, and mows once every 3 or so weeks May through October at about 2 inches, and that's it. So that far end is truly low input, and I have zero competition from the neighbor, so don't really care if I can't keep up there. I would like to get it a bit shorter next week if I can, though, so it can dry out a bit better.


----------



## Green

Sprayed the front this evening (entire side front up to garage (1.5M), and the portions of main front not treated for Triv the other day (1.3M). Also omitted the overseed area):

-0.3oz/M of Trinexapac ethyl PGR mixed with 2oz/M of Serenade Biofungicide. No surfactant added. (Went lighter on areas that need faster growth to keep up.) First app for the year. Tried the new drill mixer. Really cool is that the drill and sprayer use the same battery.

-Mixed up Certainty/Sulfosulfuron (0.16g/1 scoop) in 1 gallon of water (but I think I forgot NIS) and sprayed Triv patch at neighboring border of side front.

-Painted lines on lower side for upcoming Triv treatment.

Used extra PGR mix on edges, side border, and low input area border.


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## Green

Yesterday 5/16/21: Got 0.10 inch of rain.

Put down first N fertilizer of the year on the front: 
Side front up to garage: 0.50 lb N from Protene 8-0-4
Main front up to overseed area: 0.50 lb N from Protene 8-0-4

Started trimming (by hand) lower side overseed area this past week.


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## Green

Today: First real use of sprinkler system. Watered side front for 75 min and troubleshooted (troubleshot?) the head that wouldn't pop up. I was thinking it was a pressure issue. It seems to be. I tested it by turning off another head in the zone, and it popped up soon after, which confirmed it. (Makes sense, because the head is at or near the end of the run and is up higher than most of the others, so if there is pressure drop, it should affect that one.) To fix it, I started decreasing the nozzles in that zone. I got 3 done...the first three (starting from nearest the garage and going away from it). Those three were changed as follows: first head: 3.5 dk blue -> 3.0 dk blue. Second head (near marker): 4 dk blue -> 3.5 dk blue. Third head (12"): 4 dk blue -> 3.5 dk blue. That's a good start; the entire zone at least seems ok no, no pressure drops or heads not coming up now.

Hand watered the overseed areas. (Need to water the new plugs from the other week, tomorrow.)

Later, we had thunderstorms and got approx. 0.02 inch of rain that seemed almost like melting ice as it came down (not much; glad I watered).


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## kay7711226

Green said:


> Sprayed the front this evening (entire side front up to garage (1.5M), and the portions of main front not treated for Triv the other day (1.3M). Also omitted the overseed area):
> 
> -0.3oz/M of Trinexapac ethyl PGR mixed with 2oz/M of Serenade Biofungicide. No surfactant added. (Went lighter on areas that need faster growth to keep up.) First app for the year. Tried the new drill mixer. Really cool is that the drill and sprayer use the same battery.
> 
> -Mixed up Certainty/Sulfosulfuron (0.16g/1 scoop) in 1 gallon of water (but I think I forgot NIS) and sprayed Triv patch at neighboring border of side front.
> 
> -Painted lines on lower side for upcoming Triv treatment.
> 
> Used extra PGR mix on edges, side border, and low input area border.


Was curious on how to go about using PGR on my overseeded area in the lawn, was thinking it will slow the "spreading rate" in time for the summer heat but guess not a concern?


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## Green

kay7711226 said:


> Was curious on how to go about using PGR on my overseeded area in the lawn, was thinking it will slow the "spreading rate" in time for the summer heat but guess not a concern?


It's not usually an issue. The thing to keep in mind is that if the new grass is growing slowly, you need to back off from your normal rate accordingly. Also, I wouldn't apply it until you've mowed it a couple of times at least. I have not yet applied it to my overseed as it's growing too slow (but am hoping to at some point). I did, however, apply it to the existing grass before seeding (in March) and used the granular version for that.


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## Green

Watered the main front zone 1 for 60 min.

Mowed the lower back at the 2.25 inch setting with the Toro (though the effective HOC is higher that that). Also mowed the middle and lower side (upped the height one notch on the lower side which is partly shaded and was a bit long because I hadn't mowed in a while). Used the manual reel on the second and third height setting on the mini reno and adjacent overseed areas.

Sprayed Certainty app #1 (Sulfosulfuron) on the ~0.875M area at the very far end of the low input area. This is the area that I tried to use the previous year for my winterizing experiment but it got too wet. The area is now pretty infested with Triv. I overseeded it last Fall, and am hoping that this will kill a lot of the Triv, as I can't do a reno on the area because it's just not conducive for a bunch of reasons. And it's everywhere, so there is no option to spot spray Roundup or something like that. Also sprayed the small blocked out area on the upper side and an area at the boundary of the low input area with my back neighbor. (I have persmission to spray a few feet into several neighbor's yards now, which is awesome because there is Triv on one border and annua along another.) Still have to spray the areas blocked out in the middle/lower side that got mowed today...they'll have to wait 2 days.

Then sprayed glyphosate on my Triv kill spots throughout the yard. This was app 3 on most of the spots, but was app 2 and even app 1 on several. I would like to start reseeding by the end of the week in some of the areas.

It's the peak of tree pollen season now, with stuff coming down constantly, including the maple tree seeds. Real messy outside.

A few days ago, I noticed 2-tiller crabgrass had started to come up in the cracks in the street.

Set zone 2 to water for 80 min tomorrow morning.

Neighbor was mowed today.


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## kay7711226

Green said:


> kay7711226 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Was curious on how to go about using PGR on my overseeded area in the lawn, was thinking it will slow the "spreading rate" in time for the summer heat but guess not a concern?
> 
> 
> 
> It's not usually an issue. The thing to keep in mind is that if the new grass is growing slowly, you need to back off from your normal rate accordingly. Also, I wouldn't apply it until you've mowed it a couple of times at least. I have not yet applied it to my overseed as it's growing too slow (but am hoping to at some point). I did, however, apply it to the existing grass before seeding (in March) and used the granular version for that.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I took those points into consideration today, will monitor for the next 2 weeks.


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## Green

Today: Watered upper back in the middle of the afternoon because the grass was curling up and soil was getting dry. 40 min.

Put out ant traps.


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## Green

Mowed lower back, side, and low input area minus flood prone area (3.25 in). Mowed side front including garage side (3.2). Trimmed, blew. Put down fertilizer on 2/3 of 0.182K lower side mini Reno from last year: 0.4 lb of 8-1-8 XGRN (a bit under 0.25 lb N rate).

It's getting dry. Areas that don't have good coverage produced some dust while mowing. No rain in the forecast.

Set zone 5 to water for 46 min tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Watered lower side mini Reno with about 0.15 in of water to water in fertilizer.

------------------

Mowed family member lawn this evening (1.5 hours total). Almost 2 weeks, and it was very high...maybe even 12 inches in some spots. Increased cutting height to max (about 4 in) and mostly cut in clockwise direction. Seed is coming up in the back, and somewhat in the front as well, though it's very dry in the full sun. Watered those areas after, and sprayed Tenacity on some weedy grass. Did not have time to do anything else. Note: next time bring more gas and clean mower before using. Also water scalped spot. Apply pre-M.

------------------

Before it got dark, mowed the upper back and main front at home, starting at 8PM and finishing at 8:30. HOC: 3.2 in.

Set zone 1 for 60 min, zone 2 for 80 min, and zone 4 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning. Speaking of which, neighbor nextdoor had their system turned on today; guy said it was set to M W F 20-30 min, sometime between 6-8. Almost certainly a slight deficit.


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## Green

88 today, but mostly cloudy. Watered the near end of the low input area for about 4 hours today with the oscillating sprinkler (0.6 inch).

Sprayed Certainty (Sulfosulfuron) app #1 on the blocked out areas in the mid and lower side. In the front, which was done maybe a week ago, the Poa Triv is starting to yellow, and the grass overall where I sprayed got slightly lighter in color (chlorosis). I hope it's working...seems to be.

Set zone 3 to water for 75 min and zone 5 for 46 min tomorrow morning. Since some of the lower back grass is new from last year, I want to make sure it doesn't dry out too much. Normally I'd probably let it go for a few more days.


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## Green

Today, continued watering low input area. 0.55 inch. Mid to upper 80s and sunny. Front grass was heat stressed, so syringed a lot of it around 2PM while watering the overseed area (which is starting to show growth, and could possibly use a PGR app after the next mow). Humidity was moderate but wind was fairly high so syringing really helped and I felt ok doing it without inducing disease.


----------



## Green

Reel mowed the 0.2K main front overseed area twice (second time on 3rd lowest setting). Took soil samples from the area. Then applied fertilizer to it and the area beyond it: 0.5 lb/M of N from Protene 8-0-4, 0.25 lb N from 8-1-8 XGRN, and 0.5 lb of K from 0-0-50 micro grade SOP. Then hand watered the area. Total: 0.75 lb/M of N and 1.0 lb/M of K20. First fert of the year on the area.

Picked up sticks. Swept up tree pollen. Probably a good 5-10 lbs worth.

Wiped glyphosate on Poa Triv under the trees at the border in the side front across from the concrete marker, where I missed a spot when spraying several weeks ago.


----------



## Green

Mowed: low input area (3.25 and side discharged a lot of it). Also mowed lower back, side, and front at the same height. Lots of tree pollen got mulched up in the side front. Mowed (and bagged) the lower side mini reno and adjacent overseed area at 2 in/3.2 in to pick up the Maple seeds and Poa annua seeds. Then watered both that area and the main front overseed area. Edged (sidewalk and main front side of driveway).

Set zone 5 to water for 20 min x3 every 75 min tomorrow morning. Grass started losing quality, as expected, due to how dry it's been. Moisture should definitely be below 50% now based on how many days we've gone and rough estimate of ET per day. I wanted to let the grass stress a bit but not go dormant. Low input area far half soil is cracking at the surface. HOC is increased accordingly, but if it starts getting wet again next week, may reduce it.

Need to spray trees for what I believe is gypsy moth caterpillars. Started noticing the chewing sounds and some poop a few nights ago. Did not see any eggs this year, but may not have been able to see every branch.

Noticing spurge starting to germinate in front mulch bed border. Need to get my pre-emergent down (Gallery). May still also use Tenacity/Prodiamine mix on some areas as well. That combo will knock out any seedling crabgrass if a high enough Tenacity rate is used, and of course will prevent more from germinating. I have not used any pre-M or post-M yet this year (trying to go without as much as possible to give the grass and soil a break from it).


----------



## Green

Hand watered the new grass areas. Syringed the main front at 2PM despite mid 60s dew point, because it was mid 80s, sunny, and windy. Cleaned up driveway and sidewalk. Put down fertilizer on rest of lawn areas: sides, back, and 5.5K of low input area. Used 0.50 lb N from Protene 8-0-4, and applied to the lower side new grass areas on top of the other day's application. Finished the first bag and used most of the second (15 lbs are left in that one).


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## Green

5/27/21:

Mowed family member lawn and did some other things (1 hour to mow, 1-1.5 hours for the rest). Trimmed. Put down KY-31 seed on corner. Sprayed with Tenacity. Covered with peat moss. Put down Scotts Green Max fertilizer on the thin areas where the plow damaged the lawn in the Winter. Lots of pollen. (Next time: bring a pruner, the plugger, and apply pre-M/more fert.)


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## Green

Today: Mowed front and upper back after trimming in the back, at 3.2 in and mulched up more pollen stuff. Wanted to do other areas but didn't have time before it started raining.

Also mowed new grass in flood prone area (from last year's reno) for the first time, but there wasn't much there to mow (because it's shaded and the Reno mostly failed because it was done too late last Fall...it will be overseeded soon in any case). Prior to that, did the first glyphosate spray on rest of the adjacent area in preparation for the rest of the future reno area. I don't care if I have to seed mid June; I'd actually rather do that than wait until late July or early August, due to the shade on part of the area. Got most of the area done about 3.5 hours before rain began, but did a small section about a half hour before. Rain started light, so should be ok. Didn't have time to rinse the measuring cap, so I just left it in the area to have the rain rinse it. Put out mosquito dunks beforehand.

For anyone who uses the cheap Chapin $10-20 sprayers for Roundup, you may be interested in knowing there are flat fan tips available for them. I got the kit, and used the blue tip today (medium spray) which worked great for this use.

Neighbor nextdoor had "Chemlawn" fertilize.


----------



## Green

Cold today. High of around 50 if you believe it, and rain. Got 1.85 inches since last night.


----------



## Green

Got 1.01 inch more rain yesterday.

Sprayed Certainty 2nd app this evening on main front in same areas and same rate as previous app, plus a couple of areas missed last time with large Triv clumps. It's forming seedheads at lawn height now in those previously missed areas, just like Kentucky Bluegrass. I guess maybe the Trinexapac ethyl could have something to do with this. I will likely cut the seedheads out manually just in case they're already viable. Doubt it, but better to be safe.

Then attempted to spray Bt for gypsy moth caterpillars with the Hozon, which took a lot of trial and error. Not fun at all.

Dew formed over an hour ago. Dew point is 48 and temp is 51 according to weather.com app.


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## Green

6/1/21:

Mowed. Garage side at 3.2. Other side, lower back, and near 2/3 of low input at 3.25 with some side discharging in the latter. Didn't cut a lot off in many of those areas. Still mowing the uneven shady area behind shed at 4 in. Painted/Repainted weed control marks in those areas. 2 neighbors were fertilized today. Nextdoor said they did 2nd crabgrass app a few days ago.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member lawn and fertilized (2 hrs). Not looking too good; lots of brown. But also wasn't too much to cut off this time, unlike last time. Applied split app 2 of pre-M, except on seeded areas. Used a mix of 0-0-7 0.15 MOP Dimension and 30-0-7 0.10 Duration 120 Dimension (approx 0.25 lb/M of both N and K. Hoping the low rate fert helps improve the lawn quality without causing too much growth).

-----------------------------

At home, trimmed. Fertilized two small areas and one larger area: main front overseed and adjacent border: 0.5 lb of 0-0-50 SOP (approx 0.5 lb K20). And last year's main front overseed area: 1.25 lb of 8-1-8 XGRN (approx 0.25 lb of N and K). Finally, the entire upper back and a bit of the garage side: 3 lbs of the 8-1-8 for ~0.25 lb of N and K, but concentrating on the worst looking areas more.

Neighbor nextdoor was mowed today.


----------



## Green

We got maybe 0.1-0.2 inch of rain last night/this morning. I won't count the total until the front is gone and there's no more rain to fall.

Sprayed Triclopyr ester app 1 on clover (and a few escapee violets in the upper back). Will use Triclopyr amine for the second app, assuming it will be hot out at that point. Had a few days in the 60s and 70s recently, so took advantage and used the ester (which seems a lot more effective).

Painted Roundup on weedy grass in the back walkway using q-tip. Thanks to @HoosierLawnGnome for the idea. I almost didn't notice this stuff, as it was blending in with the Tall Fescue pretty well. Not sure what type of grass it is (no clasping auricles, and appears to have rhizomes), but something tells me this will take a series of apps to kill/suppress. Thankfully, it's not in a large area. I found it in a third clump later in the day; will hit that one the next time.

Many of you know I'm going mostly without Pre-emergent this Spring, to give the roots a rest and the environment a rest from the chems, and maybe reduce potential development of resistance as well. I typically use granular Dimension every Spring/Summer. Sometimes in a split app, sometimes all at once in April.

That said, I planned to do an app on some higher-pressure areas, but to switch up the AI to Prodiamine. So, today I used Prodiamine 65 WDG (purchased from Yard Mastery) for the first time ever. Since I was 2 months late, I had to mix in a post-emergent with it, and used my fallback broad-spectrum HPPD inhibitor of choice, Tenacity, as a tank mix at approx. the 2oz/A rate plus NIS. It should kill any tiny seedling Crabgrass that may be emerging (I did not see any, but you never know what's hiding, and I used to get some crabgrass there years ago.) Much of the area treated--essentially the sunnier/farther slice of the near half of the low-input area--does have partial shade, and usually does not start getting much weedy grass germination until June, anyway.

So, I mixed up enough Tenacity to cover 4,000 square feet at the 4oz/A rate in a gallon of water (since I like to keep some mixed solution on hand at all times), and then poured approx 0.375 of that gallon into my Prodiamine mix and mixed again with NIS. Used a total of 3.5 gallons of water (essentially full Chapin backpack sprayer) over approx 3,000 square feet area. I was hesitant to use the battery sprayer with the WDG due to potential accumulation and clogging and normally wouldn't. But I had to cover a fairly large area quickly, and the manual pump sprayer would have taken way too long, so I did use the battery sprayer this time. It was difficult to get all the yellow liquid out after use. I'm also not a fan of Prodiamine, because of the staining tendency.

I used 4.25 g of the 65 WDG per 1,000 square feet (12.75g total), because according to the labels I read, that should provide approx 2.5 months coverage, which is what I was aiming for. This is essentially the second half of a split-app, but without ever doing the first half. Sprayed a few feet into my neighbor's yard for insurance, which he gave me permission to do.

Also sprayed Tenacity app #2 at approx the 2oz/Acre rate on the sunny portion of the lower side mini reno (for Poa annua control). Added a small amount of fertilizer to the mix because I had it lying around. Kept the rest of the solution in the spray tank.


----------



## Powhatan

Green said:


> Many of you know I'm going mostly without Pre-emergent this Spring, to give the roots a rest and the environment a rest from the chems, and maybe reduce potential development of resistance as well. I typically use granular Dimension every Spring/Summer. Sometimes in a split app, sometimes all at once in April.


I also planned not to do preM this year for same reasons as you, but when I pulled some poa triv that had seed heads I figured it would be prudent to put down the preM to at least prevent "some" new triv. Did a 4 month granular prodiamine app in Apr. I plan to try a fall overseed with mesotrione, then follow-up with another 4 month granular prodiamine app to cover me into late winter.


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## Green

The famous evaporating rain struck. As of yesterday, today was supposed to be partly rainy, with an 80% chance, and about a half to 3/4 inch predicted. As the day went on, it became clear that it wasn't going to rain. There was still a 60-70% chance of a thunderstorm tonight as of this afternoon. The thunderstorm ended up hitting South of here, and now there is less than a 30% chance of any rain (15% as of 7PM). So, we won't get rain. This is what happens here in the Summer. And it's not even Summer yet. I don't get how an 80% chance is not an almost sure thing. I could see 70% being a little iffy since it's barely over a 2/3 chance, but not 80%, which is 4/5.


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## JDgreen18

I got nothing as well...needed to water in some fungicide I applied too...


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## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> I got nothing as well...needed to water in some fungicide I applied too...


Yeah, looks like Bridgeport/Milford/West Haven/New Haven to old Saybrook got some, but not so much North of that. Not even a drop here. The only good thing is that it won't be wet all night. My Prodiamine isn't getting watered in, either...


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## Green

Thought it was going to rain, so I did a few things before that:

Mowed the far end of the low input area at 3,2 in and bagged for a change. Also scalped the future Reno area at the same time. Then sprayed the 2nd app of glyphosate there. Finally, put down leftover 0.067% Acelepryn 0-0-7 from a few years ago on the area. Only had a little more than 1.5 lb and stretched it to cover most of the 0.84K.

Photos:

Painted glyphosate on the third bunch of weedy grass near the back walk.

Put down a little less than one fill of the hand spreader (one scoop) of 8-1-8 fertilizer on the Hard Fescue overseed area from last year. Really trying to get it established, and it has taken forever due to the shade and tree roots.

Set zone 5 to water for 44 min tomorrow morning.

Neighbor is setting theirs to 2x per week for now per my advice (at 45 min). They were contemplating 4x per week, but talked them out of it. Mowed yesterday. Other neighbor's new irrigation guy tried to get them to do 4x per week as well...I don't get why. (Both will be mowed by the same LCO for the next month or so.) And thankfully they stopped watering in the evening.


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## Green

Powhatan said:


> I also planned not to do preM this year for same reasons as you, but when I pulled some poa triv that had seed heads I figured it would be prudent to put down the preM to at least prevent "some" new triv. Did a 4 month granular prodiamine app in Apr. I plan to try a fall overseed with mesotrione, then follow-up with another 4 month granular prodiamine app to cover me into late winter.


A question I have is, how soon can Triv seeds be viable after they're mowed off? I don't know the answer to this, so I'm not sure if a pre-M would help you or not. I'm also not sure if Triv seed is susceptible to Mesotrione during germination like annual bluegrass seed (supposedly) is.

I have a few Triv patches with lots of seedheads; I plan to cut the seeds out manually before I mow next time, just in case.


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## Green

May to June temp averages degrees C for PGR GDD:

16: 17
17: 16
18: 17
19: 20.5
20: 17.5
21: 16.5
22: 21
23: 25
24: 16
25: 17
26: 21.5
27: 22.5
28: 14.5
29: 10.5
30: 10.5
31: 14
1: 15
2: 17.5
3: 18
4: 21

GDD 348.5


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## Green

Watered the near end of low input area (shaded area) for 45 min with water turned on a bit more than 90 degrees to get 0.4 inch and water in the pre-M and fert. Pulled a few weeds in the area.

Tested zones 5 and 1 (and syringed).

Sprayed mix of Serenade Biofungicide (2 oz rate) and PGR (just under 0.3 oz rate) on side front up to garage. No added surfactant. GDD was approx 357. Will target 250-300 next time, since it looks to be starting to enter rebound slightly. 2.25 gallons and a fast walk resulted in a bit of excess after 2 passes. Used the extra on borders along mulch beds and on the entire garage side (light coverage).

Lots of mushrooms coming up in the lawn the past few days.

Left-hand neighbor's lawn had a lot of small, browning spots. I went and took a close look, and it's minor red thread disease. Surprising, since it hasn't been super rainy and cloudy the past few weeks.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 50 and 65 min tomorrow morning (around 0.4 inch of water).


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## kay7711226

Green said:


> JDgreen18 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I got nothing as well...needed to water in some fungicide I applied too...
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, looks like Bridgeport/Milford/West Haven/New Haven to old Saybrook got some, but not so much North of that. Not even a drop here. The only good thing is that it won't be wet all night. My Prodiamine isn't getting watered in, either...
Click to expand...

DITTO......was able to total 0.1". Lined up my applications to get watered in very disappointed with Gil Simmons and his crew!!


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## Green

kay7711226 said:


> DITTO......was able to total 0.1". Lined up my applications to get watered in very disappointed with Gil Simmons and his crew!!


He and the weather channel both made it sound like rain was a sure thing. Also the National Weather Service. They got punk'd, big-time. But the joke's on us. I thought the revised new US climate/weather prediction model would have helped...are they even using it yet?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/weather/2021/03/22/american-model-gfs-upgrade-noaa/
https://www.aerisweather.com/blog/2021/04/18/will-a-new-gfs-weather-model-upgrade-close-the-gap-with-the-european-model/
https://weatherboy.com/american-gfs-forecast-model-upgraded-today/

Or else it was just the infamous evaporating rain striking again. I think it's a CT thing...surely that does not happen in Jersey. They almost never have drought when we do. That, and when it rains, it's often on Tuesdays or Wednesdays...j/k. But it seems like it.


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## Green

Hand watered sunny part of lower side overseed and adjacent area planted last Fall.

Sprayed bioinsecticide on all the front and side trees as high as I could reach. Last time was practice. (Lots of Caterpillar droppings in driveway, but I don't recognize the species as the droppings are mostly light brown. Gypsy moth droppings are usually black, and I'm not seeing many of that color. Initially I thought it was gypsy moth; that's why I sprayed.)

Mowed main front (3.2 in) but forgot a small area. Will get it tomorrow. Mulched up pollen stuff from Hickory tree at neighbor corner, which is behind the ones one on the opposite side of the driveway in timing. Removed the barrier from the main front overseed before mowing, and mowed it at the same time. First mow with the gas mower all year since it was overseeded in March. Looks like it's a bit too dense now. Oh well.

Sprayed mix of PGR (0.3 oz rate) and Serenade (2 oz rate) on non-Sulfosulfuron-treated portions (1.75K) of main front. No surfactant added. Roughly 8PM.


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## Green

To-do list:

-Mailbox part 6/7/21
-finish mowing 6/8/21
-Soil samples
-continue sulfosulfuron apps
-gutters 6/11/21
-Fertilizer
-Gallery
-Sprinkler troubleshoot and test
-hydretain
-fix spots
-trays
-mosquito barrier 1st application 6/12/21


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## Green

Hand watered the hellstrip areas and edges plus side slope of the side front.

Early evening, got a 2 min rain shower, which helped keep the pollen down; immediately after the grass dried a few minutes later, mowed the side front (3.2) after picking up twigs.

Set zone 5 to water for 22 min x2 tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Mowed back (upper at 3.2), sides, and near 2/3 of low input at 3.25 in, using side discharge on the Toro as it was a bit on the long side and I had to mow quickly. Mowed the lower side mini reno at 2.5 in. So far, it rained lightly for a while this evening; maybe a tenth of an inch so far but hoping for some more.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 40 and 52 min x2 tomorrow morning (~0.65 inch). Not taking any chances with another day (that'll be 5 in a row) in the high 80s to low 90s and little rain in the past week.

Edit: got between 0.15 and 0.2 inch of rain in total, I believe.


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## Green

Idle thoughts...

If I were doing a new KBG planting or Reno, I think one way I might go would be this blend: Midnight/Mazama/Bewitched/Prosperity. Caffeinatedlawncare is doing a Reno like this minus the last one, right now. Looking forward to watching it.


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## Green

Another hot/fairly humid/mostly sunny day with essentially no rain. In late afternoon/early evening, finished mowing the last few small portions of the low input area, hand watered hellstrip areas/planted area. Tuen set up two oscillating sprinklers and watered most of the pre-M'd portion of the low input area (0.25-0.45 inch). Might add a little more water to one area tomorrow.

Prior to watering, took soil samples in that area. There was still some moisture remaining in the 3.75 inch and lower depth. I might utilize the soil probe to check moisture over the next week.

Made a late decision to set zone 4 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Sprayed the second application of Sulfosulfuron (Certainty) on the 875K far low input corner, as well as the marked areas on the side, and the spot on the side front border. Watered the far end of the middle portion of the low input area (adjacent to sprayed area) with another 0.25 inch of water this evening just to be sure. The area can only take about 1/3 inch at a time otherwise it puddles. Felt ok watering in evening as it was dry today. Still not super excited about it. Sprayed road weeds with vinegar. Used soil probe to check moisture. Side front was driest, while lower back still had some moisture left. Zone 2 was too damp near border; need to reevaluate that area over time. Mowed last year's shaded flood prone area Reno at 3.7 in. Will remow in a few days, and then prep for overseeding soon.

Set zone 5 to water for 25 x2 min tomorrow morning (around 0.4 inch).


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## Green

@mowww, really hope what I got last year was actually MHL. It hit about 7 inches unmowed for a month or so (which probably wouldn't be unheard of for most KBG in such a shady area). It's also showing a high degree of basal tillering (branching out from a height right near the ground, maybe a cm or two above). I selected this variety specifically because the area is often too wet to mow for long periods.


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## mowww

@Green sounds about right if it had adequate nutrition. The edges along my neighbor's bare lot have not been mowed this year and got to ~9-10" tall in total so far; however some of the northern mix in that are got to 1' by the time the MHL was maybe 5". I've got everything pretty regulated right now and it is hard to determine what is what variety-wise.


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## Green

Mowed family member lawn and trimmed (2 hrs). 9 days since last time. Getting a little more brown after all the days the past two weeks that were around 90, and little rain. Did not have to in fact mow the whole main front area due to drought stress, just a few patches/sections needed it. Got gas 2 times ago. Need more next time. Was a bit hard starting. Someone had apparently taken a vehicle for a loop over the border in the back, so that section was matted and took longer to cut. Someone also mowed a path from the other yard to the driveway...weird.


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## Green

mowww said:


> @Green sounds about right if it had adequate nutrition. The edges along my neighbor's bare lot have not been mowed this year and got to ~9-10" tall in total so far; however some of the northern mix in that are got to 1' by the time the MHL was maybe 5". I've got everything pretty regulated right now and it is hard to determine what is what variety-wise.


Thanks. Looks good. I wonder if we'll ever know why it was phased out before or shortly after the patent was finalized, or if it'll come back in the future. I guess like NoNet TTTF (which is composed of "Flame" (which was sold alone at one point) and "Sunlight", and possibly one or two others), it's a blend rather than a single cultivar, from what I've read. I'm already seeing different blade widths, so it could be due to the blend. Hopefully it does ok in the shaded, damp environment that floods. In your case, I guess you won't get the main benefit since it's in a blend with other non-similar cultivars in most places (or did you seed it alone in some areas?).


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## Green

Got a trace amount of rain last early this morning.

Went to pick up supplies (fert, etc.). Peat moss is currently out of stock almost everywhere in the area, but I found some at one area store. Sounds like it won't be back in stock for a few weeks in most places.

Sprayed 1st app of Mosquito Barrier. This stuff has been great the past few years. It's a really strong garlic concentrate. Any mosquitos you hit with it tend to die, but the real feature is that it repels more for weeks after. I use it because I don't want to handle airborne chemicals, and many insecticides are not allowed in my state unless you're a pro, anyway. Bifenthrin and Permethrin are a few of the only ones that are legal to sell and use, and Bifenthrin is non-selective, which is not what I want either. Results with Mosquito Barrier have been pretty good, but I spray almost everything in the yard (including sweeping the lawn areas) except the natural areas and high surfaces. I used 3 gallons today. I'm so sick of extra chemicals...I use lawn chemicals, and that's enough.

Also sprayed 1st app of Triclopyr ester on a couple of clover patches in the front I missed the last time. It was only in the 70s today. I sprayed at night. Tomorrow will be under 80. No more ester for me until Fall after this. It will be amine plus AMS for the second app.

Finally, sprayed low rate Tenacity (app 3?) on the sunny 2/3 of the lower side mini reno. And sprayed my back neighbor border, into his yard about 10 feet (with permission)...part of which might technically be my yard, but I digress.

Lot of busy work. Lawn (especially front) is not looking spectacular at the moment, due to herbicide damage (including some possible PGR bronzing), a bit of disease, and a hint of heat stress.


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## Dude

Pretty interested in the mosquito barrier. Are you applying ~every 4 weeks?

Have you noticed a difference in other pest pressure/ticks or mostly just mosquitos?


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## Green

Dude said:


> Pretty interested in the mosquito barrier. Are you applying ~every 4 weeks?
> 
> Have you noticed a difference in other pest pressure/ticks or mostly just mosquitos?


Last year, the combination of this plus the mosquito dunks in areas that collect water made a huge difference. They say it repels ticks. I've seen a few ticks this year on plants and even my clothing, so there are tons out there. Hopefully it will repel them and the gnats that go for the eyes later in the year. They claim all of the above. Also later in the year, there are larger, more aggressive mosquito species (not sure which ones carry disease). I want to be consistent this year. I'm almost out of my first 32oz bottle purchased a couple of years ago, so I need to order more. You don't smell it anymore after a few days or so.


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## uts

Green said:


> Bifenthrin and Permethrin are a few of the only ones that are legal to sell and use, and Bifenthrin is non-selective, which is not what I want either.


Both of the above cant be sold in CT to consumers(in a concentrate at least). I have seen bifenthrin in the 1.3G Ortho bottles. I had to go with cyzmic cs because of this.


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## Green

uts said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Bifenthrin and Permethrin are a few of the only ones that are legal to sell and use, and Bifenthrin is non-selective, which is not what I want either.
> 
> 
> 
> Both of the above cant be sold in CT to consumers(in a concentrate at least). I have seen bifenthrin in the 1.3G Ortho bottles. I had to go with cyzmic cs because of this.
Click to expand...

Must be rtu that they suggest, then. I know they were suggesting people could put permethrin insecticide on clothing to prevent ticks, but that didn't sound like the best idea. And of course bifenthrin granular products are everywhere. CT is pretty tough on insecticides, but I'd rather have them be tough on that than, say, fert or pre like some states.


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## Green

Mowed almost everywhere today. Almost all areas at the standard 3.25/3.2 HOC, using side discharge as needed (in low input area primarily...the non-dwarf cultivars grow faster than the semi dwarfs, compacts, etc. Kind of annoying, but that's ok). There are also a couple of very uneven areas I have to mow at 4 in. Did not get to mow all of the main front, but double mowed the overseed area down to 2.6 in. Also mowed the low input far corner (treated with Certainty) the same. It's holding up pretty well, and might be able to handle a third app at some point. I did re-mow the flood prone Reno area, and then pulled some Triv plants and other weeds there (including a Nutsedge seedling, I think). Did some trimming before it got too dark.

Put down fertilizer on side front. 8.75 lbs of 6-2-0, 4Fe Milorganite (0.25 lb N). That old formula was great to spread, very uniform and small granules. The current stuff isn't the same.

By the way, the Certainty (Sulfosulfuron) is really toasting the Triv nicely in the front. Lawn looks semi dormant in those areas, and getting a bit crunchy as expected (same as last year on the side), but it's working. Best I can hope for is a lot of dead Triv this Summer, and not much dead Fescue. We'll see. I'm going to keep mowing those areas fairly short so the heat penetrates.

Found two residual Timothy plants in the main front near utilities. Every once in a while, I still find a plant or two, but only a few per year now. Still some pollen stuff all over from the tree near there.

Normally they say not to mow the day after spraying weeds, but I found this study: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://turf.purdue.edu/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/11_AGRY_Patton_ground20ivy.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiO-v-ippXxAhXrQ98KHbWBCcQ4ChAWMAR6BAgDEAI&usg=AOvVaw2Lpxuws4_WjhrqDMmG5vB0


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## Green

GDD count:

June 6: 25
June 7: 25
June 8: 26.5
June 9: 27
June 10: 21
June 11: 17.5
June 12: 17
June 13: 19
June 14: 18.5
June 15: 22
June 16: 17
June 17: 16.5
June 18: 18.5
June 19: 25
June 20: 23
June 21: 23.5
June 22: 20.5
June 23: 17


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## Green

Got 0.5 inch of rain today. This evening, applied 0.17 lb N (10.5 lbs of fert taken out of the bag) to the main front from biosolid fertilizer (Ecoscraps 4-2-0). I was originally targeting 0.25 lb N and messed up, but that's ok. I'll likely go back with some XGRN in couple more weeks to make up the difference.


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## Green

Spot sprayed 3rd (selective/strategic this time) app of Certainty (Sulfosulfuron) on the worst Poa Triv spots, and blanket sprayed the 2nd app on the low input hack neighbor border area. Inspected the results in the far low input corner area; the herbicide is killing a lot of the "regular" Triv, but once again is not really doing anything to the fine bladed type. I'll have to follow up the two apps in that area with another herbicide later on to try to get that stuff.

Mowed rest of main front and mowed the side and lower back as well at 3.2 in. Had to side discharge as it was so thick and the blade is getting a little dull which probably doesn't help. Lower back is fully awake now and at its peak. Upper back is getting there. Front is past its peak.


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## Green

Started trimming. Applied first app of PGR to lower back, mixed with biofungicide this evening. Used 0.25 oz of PGR and 2.5 oz of Serenade (0.22oz/M and 2.2 oz/M).

Both neighbors were mowed today.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.

Yestersay, I saw the very first Hickory nut that fell (very small). And leaves have started to drop here and there. It's only been a bit over a month since they came out.


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## Green

Mowed lower side overseed at 3.2 in, and then watered it with 0.25 inch of water. Trimmed and blew.

---------------------

Mowed family member lawn (2+1 hrs). Bought 4 gal. New gas. Pulled some weeds, cut down some odd brush. Skipped mowing on the most dormant areas in the main front and AC side. Did not trim, but put down a 45-lb bag of 4-2-0 Scotts Ecoscraps fertilizer (same as Milorganite) everywhere, concentrating especially on the areas where recently seeded grass survived. Roughly 0.15 lb of N (range: 0.12-0.2 lb). Then, sprayed a full gallon of Gallery pre-emergent herbicide (0.5oz/M high rate) on all edges. Blew the fert and clippings off the hardscape. A few leaves have came down there, too.


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## Green

Put down 0.25 lb of N on the side and lower back from Milorganite 6-2-0 classic fertilizer (now discontinued in favor of the current 6-4-0 version). Opened up a new bag and took out 10.75 lbs (so about 40 lbs left). 6.5 lbs on the side (including lower side mini reno from last year) and 4.25 lbs on the lower back. Got some rain after 8PM; we'll see if it amounts to much.

Update: Got 0.3 inch of rain.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 21 and 28 min x2 tomorrow morning (approx 0.35 inch).


----------



## Green

Did irrigation audit and watered zone 3 for 68 min. Should equate to about 0.45 inch. We will see when it finishes.

Results: Not quite. A few areas did get 0.45-0.5 inch toward the middle, but many got less. Going to need some adjustments. Note: retest zone 2 for overlap total. Looks like the head near the neighbor boundary/tree needs a nozzle increase with the latest adjustments of head arcs.

Sprayed Serenade biofungicide on lower back, side, and main front at 3oz rate.


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## Green

Yesterday: Mowed (3.25) side front, upper back, upper side, part of main front, and low input area at 3.75 (side discharging). Due to high 80s low 90s and the highest sun angle of the entire year, I let it go 8 days on the low input area. It did grow, though! Good opportunity to raise the HOC after. Today was under 70 and a few days of 70s/50s are forecast, so it will recover a bit before the next batch of heat.

Today: 0.2 inch of rain. Started watering zone 4 this evening. 30 min done so far. Set it for 2 more cycles overnight. Total: 90 min.

Edit: Garage neighbor was mowed (#2) on 6/23.
Neighbor 11 was fertilized on 6/21.


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## Green

To-do list:

-Shrubs/tree care/pruning/weeding
-Soil sampling finished 7/17/21
-Potassium 7/17/21
-Biofungicide (ongoing)
-PGR (ongoing, but fewer areas and lower rates as time goes on)
-More Triv kill
-Mosquito app 2
-Order supplies
-Gallery
-Fill in low areas
-Dig out rocks
-Measure sprinkler head postions done 6/28
-Test spray nozzles out
-Tenacity(ongoing)
-Check for ants (ongoing)
-Triclopyr amine


----------



## Green

Observations:

Saw a firefly or two the other night.

Red thread is increasing in our area.

I'm getting broadleaf weeds popping up along disturbed edges and in mulch areas; should've done the Gallery app a few weeks ago. Also have a few crabgrass plants popping up in the disturbed edges.


----------



## Green

6/24/21:

Mowed a lot of the main front (3.2) but also lightly dethatched the Triv-infested areas with the groundskeeper rake and bag mowed them at 2.6 in to make sure the sun stresses it out and also to make it more receptive to herbicide contact.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member lawn (1.5+0.5 +1 hrs). It's going more dormant, slowly. I mowed even less of the front than last week (very little of the main front today). Back is starting to show dormancy, too (less growth, bit of brown mixed in). String trimmed (thankfully not a whole lot to do this time due to the Summer stress). Hand trimmed a few key areas to preserve the green (string trimming shreds the grass and makes it look bad and more susceptible to browning in heat). Hand watered (1 gallon or so via container) all hostas except one closest to door, and also a couple of the patches of grass I planted earlier in the year along the driveway; it's mostly filled in now between seeding, plugs, leveling, fertilizer, mowing to help it thicken up, a little watering, some weedy grass, and lots of time. Trimmed all the crap vegetation down in the back hardscape area as well. The new grass (fine fescue mix) planted in the back where there's shade is doing great. Ive been running over it with the mower for a few weeks now (carefully, since it's around 600-800 lbs). While mowing the back, I noticed the wheels picking up some moisture from both the ground and presumably from cut vegetation; a good sign that not all the moisture is deplete yet. Today was under 80; tomorrow mid 80s, and then 3 days of 90s after that (all likely without any rain) coming.

---------------------------------
Set zone 5 to water for 24 min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Mowed rest of main front, side front, sides, and back at 3.25. Mulch mowed low input (except 2 ends) at 4 in due to impending heat. It's starting to show initial signs of dormancy (reduced growth, some browning).

Put down 5 lbs of 8-1-8 XGRN fertilizer on entire main front (0.16 lb of N and K).

I'm now in the predicament where there is fairly high wind all day and evening (over 6-7 mph at all times) for a few days, but I'm due to spray certain things (like PGR and an herbicide). Not sure what's going to happen with that.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 60 and 80 min respectively tomorrow morning. Heat is coming.


----------



## Green

Finished mowing the last few spots, such as the lower side mini Reno (3.2) and flood prone mini Reno (3.65).

Tested sprinkler zones 1 and 2. It's important to test when it's hot out. Especially if you have sandy soil that can jam up the heads.

Blanket sprayed Velocity Herbicide on the main front (minus 40x13 ft / 500 sq ft area closest to road that is not infested). Used 3.9g over 2,000 square feet with 2.4 gal of distilled water. I used the drill mixer and took my time mixing. I also added 0.0126 lb of N from Ammonium Sulfate (0.006 lb/M), and a tiny splash of non-ionic surfactant (not enough to foam up the mixture). This is my first time trying it with the additives. Applied parallel to driveway after practicing on hardscape and taping up my nozzle with teflon tape to stop a leak. Used the extra on the worst spots. It was 86F today with low 90s forecast for the next 3 days, but it was the best timing compromise to apply it today as far as rain, wind, temp in the future, PGR rebound, etc.


----------



## Green

I let the front hill go a little too long without water. Patches started going not only dark, but brownish in the heat today (it was 94F). That means water immediately. If I didn't, it would start going dormant and the soil would get hydrophobic, so I got out the hose to hand water. Around 4:30PM, connected the nozzle, turned it on. Walked toward it. Pop! Sounded like a gunshot. I swore out loud. My neighbor asked me what that was. Thankfully I was about 8 feet away from that hose. It had a heavy nozzle on it. I should have known this might happen because it's a crap hose, had a bubble forming in it, and it had broken a few times before (but never popped like that). I removed the coupler, cut off the broken part, and reinstalled it. Turned it on. It broke again. That hose is now trash. I'll use it for tree staking, or something. It lasted maybe 3 years. Went to get another hose. Found an older but better quality one. Appeared well used. Tested it out. It had a hole. Cut and fixed that hose.

Finally got to hand water. Did the spots on the front hill, and the grass and bed by the mailbox, as well as the main front overseed and rest of the area near the road.

Also hand watered spots in the lower back, low input behind shed, and gave the lower side mini Reno from last year 0.1 inch for good measure.

Also sprayed next app of low rate Tenacity on the mini Reno. And sprayed full rate (4-6oz/A) on the low input far neighbor border where there is some sort of weedy warm season grass (probably Nimblewill) encroaching, as well as some broadleaf weeds. There also will be sedges there in another week or two; maybe this app will help with that (the Sulfosulfuron Certainly should have...no pun intended!)

Measured distances between sprinkler heads in lower back. Need to draw it up to figure out how to modify.

Watered low input area to approx 0.5 inch from just beyond near end of future Reno area to near end in late afternoon/evening with the Dramm oscillating sprinkler. Ended at 7:30PM as the last sunlight faded from the lawn in the area.

Set zones 3 and 5 to water for 30 min x3 and 28x3 min tomorrow morning. I think the amount for an inch might be 170 min in zone 3 based on the latest audit.


----------



## Green

Tested zone 5, running it for an additional 15 min or so in the afternoon. Modified arc and stream in the sidewalk/driveway corner head. Changed the nozzle in the head upstream of it from a dark blue 1.5 gpm to a dark blue 1.0 gpm and removed and cleaned under the cover. Checked the head opposite it; it had a 1.38 gpm red 25T nozzle. I'll do an audit and then judge whether it needs to be decreased or not. (The two lower sidewalk heads appeared to have 0.75 gpm black nozzles.)

Watered the far end of low input area (where I had treated with Certainty previously) with 0.25 inch of water for an hour and a half in early evening using an oscillating sprinkler to keep the soil from drying out. I also didn't want it going any further into dormancy. It's mowed relatively low (sub 3 inches) and is partly brown from the herbicide. For whatever reason, the soil there holds water very well. It might be partly clay (or silt). And it can only take up to 0.3 inch of water in about 2 hours without flooding or at least getting squishy. And then it has to sit a day or two (this time of year; longer in cooler times) before it can accept more water. But if you let it get too dry, it cracks and water can run off if applied too quickly.

Sprayed Serenade biofungicide on side front (not garage side) (3oz rate), lower back and lower side (lower rate; minimal water) this evening. For some reason neighbor is watering right now. (Other neighbor was mowed today while it was in the 90s.)

Set zone 4 to water for 30 min x2. And zones 1 and 2 to water for 60 and 80 min respectively, tomorrow morning. A couple of dry spots have started to appear in zone 4. I marked one and will have to dig out rocks and replace soil one of these days.


----------



## Green

Today, took soil samples from the flood-prone area.

It got to 96F, but a good portion of the low input area needed mowing, so I mowed at 4 inches only on those areas after the area started to go into shade in the early evening (it was still over 90 at the time). I took off a enough that it was definitely worth mowing, and didn't overly stress it.

Sprayed Tenacity on the back border and into bare areas of neighbor's yard (with permission). The spray dried almost on contact.

Sprayed dish soap on the moss behind deck. First time trying this.

Pulled a piece of crabgrass from the Triv-treatment area in the main front. I should do a Quinclorac app in the area soon as pre/post, to hold me over until seeding time when i will reseed/overseed.

There is still living Poa Triv in the middle (shady part) of the main front. Ughhh. I will dethatch it again in a week or so.

I put mosquito dunks out in the flood prone area.

Got a small amount of rain and some mildly severe weather in the evening. There could be more rain tonight, and rain is likely at various points tomorrow.

Tomorrow if the rain holds off a while, I hope to:
-finish soil sampling
-mow a small area or two
-spray PGR
-put down fert
-spray gallery
-spray hydretain
-spray ultramate


----------



## Green

Started raining last night. As of this afternoon, we had accumulated maybe a third of an inch so far...

Sprayed hydretain in low input area except for the far third or so. I used a little more than recommended due to not being certain of the hose end sprayer calibration/settings. I rarely use hose end sprayers. I applied it during the rain. Also went very light on the back border as I don't want to encourage the Poa Triv. Ideally I'd have applied it 2-4 weeks ago prior to a lot of drought/heat stress.

Also sprayed Gallery pre-emergent herbicide on the edges of the yard and front shrub bed portions. Judging by experience, I'm late, but mid May was too early. I think early to mid June would be ideal. Spurge, Purslane, etc. are germinating strongly, as is crabgrass because I didn't use Dimension this year (mostly in bare spots/edged areas). Used 1.5 scoops in 1.75 gallons or so.

Finally sprayed Ultramate SG on the flood-prone area and into adjacent areas, etc. Hoping it helps the drainage. I wasn't sure how much to use, so I added 3 scoops from the Miracle Grow spoon to a gallon of water. I should calculate the correct rate for next time.


----------



## Green

After a couple of weeks of little rain, it's been all-day on/off hard rain since yesterday. Apparently it's a Winter storm type pattern, and it can linger in an area. When I saw the rain gauge today, there was about two and a half inches in it, with more to come.


----------



## Green

Looks like we added another inch of rain today. I'll have a total tomorrow.


----------



## Green

Got almost 3.5 inches of rain in total before it stopped sometime last night.

Everything is pretty damp still, but the ground was fairly dry before the rain and the rain was fairly slow over a few days, so a lot of the rain did soak in. Regardless, I had to mow today. Did the near 2/3 of the low input area at 3.75 in with the side discharge. Also did the side front, sides (upper part of side), and near portion of main front at 3.7.

Used side discharge as needed and double mowed some areas. The middle portion of the side front is semi-dormant as usually happens this time of year. It really didn't grow, but I mowed it to remove the bit that did. The fine fescue mixed in that area is pretty brown now. The near section is the next most dormant. Same deal, but not as bad. This happens every year.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member lawn. But hardly anything in the front needed mowing; just some KY-31, really. Lot of dormancy. And in the back a few areas, especially where there's clover. I didn't mow most of the back hill because I sprayed what I believe is weedy Paspalum there. I used Bioadvanced Fenoxaprop-p-ethyl 0.41%: 1.25oz in 0.7 gallon of water with a little NIS. (This is half the blanket spray rate because I was basically spot spraying. It's always good practice to mix spot spray rates at 50%-20% of the full rate so the correct amount of carrier volume gets used...got this tip from Greendoc. I probably ended up spraying at double the low blanket spray mix rate by the time I was finished). We will see if this stuff kills the Paspalum. Also sprayed some other odd grasses, such as the unknown weedy grasses and some crabgrass at the front road edge. First time trying Fenoxaprop.


----------



## Green

90 again today and tomorrow.

Got about 1 inch rain with a thunderstorm this evening. I got soaked getting out of the car and setting up the rain gauge. No need for irrigation. This is great. I just need to find time to mow. Haven't gotten to the upper back in a long time...it's going to need the 4" HOC this time so I don't remove too much. And PGR...everything is way past and in rebound now (but it helps grow out any disease, which is good).


----------



## Green

Mowed during icky 90 degree/humid weather around 5PM. Upper back (finally): 4 in. Main front, front hill, garage side/part of adjacent area: 3.7. Side and lower back: 3.75. Behind shed: 4.0. No rain, but I hear thunder every once in a while even now in the distance. Blades are getting dull. Lots of brown in the main front from drought stress, disease, and herbicide stress.

Also did touch-up spruce trimming.

Tomorrow lawn goals before rain:
-Triclopyr
-PGR
-Finish mowing/trimming
-Finish sampling
-Fertilizer?
-Get gas


----------



## Green

Sprayed PGR on front hill, garage side, front portion of main front past tree (where the last 2 overseeds were done), a bit of the side front, the garage side, lower back, and upper back (1st app). Rate was around 0.2. Added NIS to help absorption prior to rain. Used extra on edges.

Used residual Fenoxaprop-p-ethyl on back border in case anything is emerging. Maybe I should've sprayed it on the Triv instead; label says it controls it. Nice to know it's another tool for that.

2 usual neighbors were fertilized today.

We're supposed to get up to a few inches more rain the next few days. Ground is still saturated. I won't be able to mow some areas for a while after. Or apply fert. And there is going to be a lot to mow in a few days.

Got 8 gallons of gas just in case.


----------



## Green

Got 3 1/3 inches of rain last night and yesterday.

Put down approx 5.3 lbs of 6-2-0, 2.5Fe Milorganite on the upper back and garage side. This was part of my scheduled "late Spring/early Summer" fertilizer in the upper back, while it was an extra 0.25 lb of N on the garage side, which is shaded and I'm trying front-loading it as is not as receptive to growth and fertilization in Fall due to the sun angle in the area. The end of Summer is pretty much now in that area, is what I've concluded by watching it over the years. It's about dense now as it's going to get all year. Mid July is the best time to seed that area, too. Upper back isn't quite as bad, but it, too, has a shorter season.

Also applied roughly 1/3 lb of 8-1-8 to the shaded Hard Fescue area in the low input area, which I'm still trying to thicken up. It's taking years. Applied exactly 1/3 lb to the lower side mini Reno and overseed area. Roughly 0.14 lb of N and K.


----------



## Green

7/11/21:

Mowed family member lawn. Mowed almost everywhere this time, except a couple of still fully dormant and/or heavily trampled areas. There was some unevenness and matting also in the front by the road. Not sure if someone drove over it after the rain, or if the rain alone did that. Raked/blew a few matted areas. The fenoxaprop hasn't shown any sign of effects yet.

----------------------

At home, mowed the upper back, part of garage side, and adjacent section of side front (up to marker) at 3.75 in the dark at 9PM. Grass was starting to become moist from dew.


----------



## M32075

Big backyard party this Saturday any suggestions on what to spray for mosquito control that I can pick up at a big box store.


----------



## STUDENToftheGAME

Black flag fog did the job for me. Kept mosquitoes away for a week or so.


----------



## Green

Yesterday, re-mowed the upper back.

Today: mowed the lower side and lower back (not mini reno area).

Also: started my "Fall" seeding by seeding 4 of the Triv kill spots in the lower back, and covered with peat moss. Where necessary, I leveled and put down moss-out in those spots. Seed mix was my usual mix for the back minus the Rugby II, which I haven't seen available for several years now. I used approx. 80/20 TTTF/KBG. About 3/4 of the TTTF seed was Bullseye, 1/4 Firecracker SLS, and roughly equal amounts of America and sod certified Bewitched KBG. Will follow up with some plugs in the next day or so, and in about a week, some fungicide in those spots as a preventative.


----------



## Green

M32075 said:


> Big backyard party this Saturday any suggestions on what to spray for mosquito control that I can pick up at a big box store.


You'll probably need to go chemical. I would look at domyown and see what products are allowed in your area, and read the reviews. Then see what you can get at local stores.


----------



## M32075

Green said:


> M32075 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Big backyard party this Saturday any suggestions on what to spray for mosquito control that I can pick up at a big box store.
> 
> 
> 
> You'll probably need to go chemical. I would look at domyown and see what products are allowed in your area, and read the reviews. Then see what you can get at local stores.
Click to expand...

Thanks


----------



## gm560

M32075 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> M32075 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Big backyard party this Saturday any suggestions on what to spray for mosquito control that I can pick up at a big box store.
> 
> 
> 
> You'll probably need to go chemical. I would look at domyown and see what products are allowed in your area, and read the reviews. Then see what you can get at local stores.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Thanks
Click to expand...

This product is the same AI as Demand CS. In a pinch that's what I would go for.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Cutter-32-fl-oz-Concentrate-Backyard-Bug-Control-Spray-HG-61067-6/100211822#product-overview

Do a perimeter spray (non flowering or edible trees and shrubs) today or tomorrow and you should have great control by Saturday.

For an extra control you could grab this and spray it outside an hour or so before your guests arrive:

https://www.homedepot.com/p/AMDRO-14-oz-Quick-Kill-Mosquito-Fogger-100537437/304755281


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## M32075

I found in the garage a few bottles of spectracide triazicide concentrate I bought last year on sale I'll use that with my hose end sprayer. Probably do it early Friday morning at sunrise. Thanks for your help always appreciated


----------



## Green

Last couple of days: got a small amount of rain and mist in several increments (no more than 0.2 inch total). Was pretty damp.

Tonight, mowed the upper side and front at 3.75 in. And mowed the low input area (everywhere) at 4 inches with side discharge. It was about 8 inches high, with some higher spots, so I violated the 1/2 rule. It had been about 2 weeks since the last mow (less on some areas at 10 days; way more than 14 days on the soggiest portion). Hopefully the clippings being discharged back out and sitting on top of the grass don't contribute to disease development overnight.

Mowed lower side mini Reno/overseed area at 3.7 in.

Neighbor was mowed today.


----------



## Green

Grass looks a lot better now that it's cut higher for the Summer. The color is better, and a lot of the brown is hidden.

Pulled up some yellow Nutsedge and Poa Triv plants in the flood-prone area. Fallowing is going well in the future reno area...stuff is coming up...weeds, sedges, and some tree seedlings mostly.


----------



## kay7711226

Green said:


> To-do list:
> 
> -Shrubs/tree care/pruning/weeding
> -Soil sampling
> -Potassium
> -Biofungicide
> -PGR
> -More Triv kill
> -Mosquito app 2
> -Order supplies
> -Gallery
> -Fill in low areas
> -Dig out rocks
> -Measure sprinkler head postions done 6/28
> -Test spray nozzles out
> -Tenacity
> -Check for ants
> -Triclopyr amine


Have you done PGR and Tenacity in a combined spray application? Need to do both on neighbor#2.


----------



## uts

kay7711226 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> To-do list:
> 
> -Shrubs/tree care/pruning/weeding
> -Soil sampling
> -Potassium
> -Biofungicide
> -PGR
> -More Triv kill
> -Mosquito app 2
> -Order supplies
> -Gallery
> -Fill in low areas
> -Dig out rocks
> -Measure sprinkler head postions done 6/28
> -Test spray nozzles out
> -Tenacity
> -Check for ants
> -Triclopyr amine
> 
> 
> 
> Have you done PGR and Tenacity in a combined spray application? Need to do both on neighbor#2.
Click to expand...

Didnt do exactly this but for my backyard overseed, I sprayed PGR, waited for 2 days and then did tenacity with triclopyr to get rid of bentgrass. To be honest I wouldn't do that because the PGR slowed the growth. Since tenacity relies on growth and chlorophyll production it decreased its efficiacy in my opinion.

If I were to do this again for an overseed, I would spray tenacity, spray again at 10 days, wait for a week do PGR and after 3 or 4 days mow low/detach and overseed.

Again it totally depends what your scenario is.


----------



## kay7711226

uts said:


> kay7711226 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> To-do list:
> 
> -Shrubs/tree care/pruning/weeding
> -Soil sampling
> -Potassium
> -Biofungicide
> -PGR
> -More Triv kill
> -Mosquito app 2
> -Order supplies
> -Gallery
> -Fill in low areas
> -Dig out rocks
> -Measure sprinkler head postions done 6/28
> -Test spray nozzles out
> -Tenacity
> -Check for ants
> -Triclopyr amine
> 
> 
> 
> Have you done PGR and Tenacity in a combined spray application? Need to do both on neighbor#2.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Didnt do exactly this but for my backyard overseed, I sprayed PGR, waited for 2 days and then did tenacity with triclopyr to get rid of bentgrass. To be honest I wouldn't do that because the PGR slowed the growth. Since tenacity relies on growth and chlorophyll production it decreased its efficiacy in my opinion.
> 
> If I were to do this again for an overseed, I would spray tenacity, spray again at 10 days, wait for a week do PGR and after 3 or 4 days mow low/detach and overseed.
> 
> Again it totally depends what your scenario is.
Click to expand...

Targeting crabgrass and excessive growth(extend time between mowing)


----------



## uts

I would do quinclorac rather than tenacity or atleast add that to tenacity. Much better kill with it.

Do PGR a few days after.


----------



## Green

@kay7711226, I have on occasion combined the PGR and Tenacity at the same time. That was before an overseed. No issues.


----------



## Green

Re-mowed most of low input area to try to get rid of some of the clippings from the last time. It didn't get all of them, but got some. Avoided the most drought/heat stressed/areas going dormant. Took the far end down to 3.75 in. Mowed the flood prone area seeded last Fall at 3.7 in, and pulled up some more Triv there.

Rained briefly right after, but nothing significant. Good for the grass seed.

Overall, heat/drought stress and disease stress are increasing everywhere. The soil isn't holding moisture as well as last month, even from one day to the next. Time for a surfactant...


----------



## Green

Summer chlorosis has been starting up the past few weeks, which is typical this time of year. Dry spots are also becoming more evident as they start to thin out and brown. I'm not sure if I'll be able to address all the areas. That would be a lot of digging. One in particular is pretty big, and I'm pretty sure it's due to buried patio stone.

Today, it was sunny and around 90 again initially, so too hot to do anything except hand water dry spots. But after, it clouded up and kept threatening to rain. We didn't have much, so I was able to get a lot done:

Took rest of soil samples in the front.

Trimmed in back and side.

Mowed back, sides, and front at 3.75 in. Put down SOP: 0.85 lb K on main front (but more on neighbor side than driveway side), approx 0.6-0.75 lb K on side front, and 1 full lb of K on the garage side, back, and and entire low input area. Put out mosquito dunks and pulled Nutsedge in the flood prone area.

Between humidity, dull blades, overgrown grass last week, etc., the turf canopy is not very clean.


----------



## Green

Got 0.15-0.2 inch of rain last night/today, but mostly dry today. Enough to start watering in the SOP from yesterday, but not much more than that.

Hand trimmed some grass in the back, including along the deck. And then raked out the decomposing clippings that were starting to build up in the area to get some airflow and help prevent root rot. I pulled out a Poa annua var. reptans plant or two from right next to the sprinkler head.

Pulled some sidewalk weeds...spurge.

Set zones 4 and 5 to water for 45x2 and 25x2 min tomorrow morning.


----------



## Chris LI

Green said:


> Overall, heat/drought stress and disease stress are increasing everywhere. The soil isn't holding moisture as well as last month, even from one day to the next. Time for a surfactant...


What are you planning on using? Hydretain seems to help some, from my experience last year. We'll see about this year, with using it with the Rgs/Air-8 combo.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Overall, heat/drought stress and disease stress are increasing everywhere. The soil isn't holding moisture as well as last month, even from one day to the next. Time for a surfactant...
> 
> 
> 
> What are you planning on using? Hydretain seems to help some, from my experience last year. We'll see about this year, with using it with the Rgs/Air-8 combo.
Click to expand...

I have some liquid SLS on order; planning to make the BLSC with humic acid, and maybe throw the kelp in, too if I can find it. In the meantime, if I need something sooner, I'll use the shampoo. I now know the ideal dilutions of everything. Previously, I just guessed. This is to get the water penetration. just watered a little while ago, and it didn't look like there was a ton of runoff on the side front area. I haven't used anything there yet this year.

Will probably also apply the Hydretain to the areas in question, but not at the same time...it's easy to screw up. Really have to water a bit, spray it, and then water deeply immediately. And not mix with anything else.


----------



## Green

Watered zone 5 (key word for search: water) and did irrigation audit, as well as adjusting some head arcs and throws. No real wind, so I think it's good now. Audit results using the ten yellow mini gauges mostly along the middle:

Watering duration: 30 min
Range: 0.10 inch to 0.30 inch
-middle of front hill (3 gauges): 0.2 inch
-Side slope: 0.3 inch
-Behind mulch bed: 0.1 inch
-nearest garage: 0.15 inch
-in between: 0.1 inch

If I had to guess based upon past audits, the furthest are getting ~0.05 inch per 30 min.

Comments: Fairly happy with the distribution; for the most part, the sunnier and more sloped areas are getting the higher amounts. Don't think I need to do any further nozzle changes.

So, the average was 0.2 inch. I'm sure the further areas (not tested this time) are getting less for the most part, but that should be ok as they're in shade part of the time.

I think this is about as good as it's going to get.

Finalizing:

0.2 inch/30 min = 0.4 inch per hour. 
-> 75 min per 0.5 inch.
Round up to 80 min.

Final results - zone 5 - watering times to use:
160 min for 1 inch 
80 minutes for 1/2 inch 
40 min per quarter inch
16 min for 0.1 inch
60 min for 0.375 inch

Still have to figure out the hellstrip areas another time.


----------



## Chris LI

Thanks for the reminder on the shampoo, I still have some kicking around in the garage that I can use up.


----------



## Green

Got a little rain, just enough to water seed.

Pulled some weeds, mostly Spurge and crabgrass. So, the Gallery app was definitely late in the front this year. I think the Tenacity/Prodiamine that went down first in the low-input area, will allow that area to do better. Getting ready to do a single app of Quinclorac soon.

Marked the area next to patio that has buried stones.

Mixed 0.6 gallon of Triclopyr amine at 1/4 full rate for spot sprays and then sprayed clover. I couldn't find a lot of it, so I guess the first ester app got rid of a lot (but it'll probably be back in the Fall). Put it in the gallery bottle.

Set zones 1, 2, and 3 to water for 20x3, 26x3, and 50x3 minutes tomorrow morning. This should be roughly 0.5, 0.5, and 0.75 inch.

Put mini gauges out in zone 2 and 3 overlap areas.

I have germination starting in the 4 reseeded Triv/glyphosate spots from this Spring. Just under 6 days, and I didn't even water it the first couple of days. It's really fast this time of year. Planning to do more soon.


----------



## Green

Results of the zone 2 and 3 overlap irrigation audit: got 0.55 to at least 1.5 inch (to the top of the NRG gauge) with the 5 gauges set up from the patio to the middle side. Middle upper portion probably had the highest; might have to think about changing the nozzle in the lower side head.


----------



## Green

GDD count for PGR:

Jul 9: 24.5
Jul 10: 23.5
Jul 11: 21.5
Jul 12: 21
Jul 13: 20.5
Jul 14: 24.5
Jul 15: 25.5
Jul 16: 26.5
Jul 17: 27
Jul 18: 25.5
Jul 19: 21.5
--240.5--
Target: 274 (0.2oz/M)
Jul 20: 23.5
Jul 21: 22
Jul 22: 21.5
Jul 23: 21
Jul 24: 21.5
Jul 25: 22.5
Jul 26 (day only): 16
Total: 388 gdd at reapplication


----------



## Green

Yesterday: mowed back and upper side at 3.75, and low input at 4.0 with side discharge. Really need to sharpen blades.

Today: Sprayed Quinclorac (first time ever spraying it not mixed with anything else) mostly on the area along side neighbor border but also at the low input neighbor border where I had been been spraying Tenacity, and some of the driveway/sidewalk edges. Instead of using MSO, I used NIS. Will see how it goes, but I'm going more for the pre-emergent properties than anything. I noticed it has a bit of a noxious/irritating smell to it. In most places, I'll just keep hand pulling any crabgrass.


----------



## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> Today: Sprayed Quinclorac (first time ever spraying it not mixed with anything else) ... Instead of using MSO, I used NIS. Will see how it goes...


Curious to see what your experience ends up being with it. I've always used it with NIS (because that's what I've had on hand, rather than MSO) and had what I considered to be good results with crabgrass and clover.


----------



## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Today: Sprayed Quinclorac (first time ever spraying it not mixed with anything else) ... Instead of using MSO, I used NIS. Will see how it goes...
> 
> 
> 
> Curious to see what your experience ends up being with it. I've always used it with NIS (because that's what I've had on hand, rather than MSO) and had what I considered to be good results with crabgrass and clover.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I read one of your posts saying that yesterday. We will see.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member lawn (2 + 0.5 + 1 hrs there). Way overgrown after a week and a half; easily over 8 inches in some areas. Had to triple mow the back, in fact. There is a damaged or dead spot about 3x6 feet in the front from something being on the lawn for a couple of days. Raked to unmat the area. A lot of it is brown like dormant color, while some is yellow due to lack of light; not sure if it all will come back. Gave it a little water anyway. Also watered the corner area nearby as it looks like some of the seed might have started to germinate. If so, that's crazy...I put it down almost 2 months ago.

Sharpened my Toro blade and my gator blade for the old mower while I was at it...home lawn is badly in need of a mow.

To-do tomorrow and weekend:
Wash hat. Hardware store.
Install blades, Mow, PGR, biofungicide. More seeding and plugs. Roundup on Triv. Post question about Sulfentrazone versus glyphosate.

Order:
Teejet nozzles, Chapin accessories, Toro gator blade.


----------



## Green

Reinstalled the Toro blade. Trimmed. Mowed the back (3.75) including the part next to patio skipped last time. Side (3.75 and lower part overgrown). Mowed front and increased to 4 inches. Mower is working much better after sharpening.


----------



## Green

Worked on family member lawn (3 hrs). Trimmed. Went back over some areas with the riding mower to get rid of the worst areas with clumps from Thursday's overgrown mow.

Then sprayed 2 gal of Quinclorac plus MSO on areas with crabgrass, side front, front edges, and Yellow Nutsedge. Some of the edge areas never got a pre-emergent other than some Tenacity (due to having to fix them and let them grow in after snow plow damage from this past Winter), so I am taking advantage of the 6-week pre emergent function of Quinclorac to take us through the rest of the crab germ season. I think that's an underappreciated feature of Quinclorac. Actually, I was pleased with how little crabgrass there was in those areas. But if I didn't spray it right now, it would grow like gangbusters over the coming week. Only place I didn't spray that still needs it was that corner area...need to figure out how soon is safe if the seed is coming up.

Then sprayed Sulfentrazone on the Nutsedge areas (my first time ever trying this AI). I made sure not to add surfactant as per the instructions, beyond the tiny bit of residual MSO left in the tank after finishing the Quinclorac. Used 2.6 oz of Ortho Nutsedge killer (the hose end sprayer bottle was a pain to break open the other night for tank spraying, lol!). Rate was based on calculations from the Dismiss label. Applied to an approx eyeballed 1,000 square feet.

After that, sprayed glyphosate on the hardscape (with gloves, N95 mask, and safety glasses on!), which is a mess of weeds. Prior to spraying, I trimmed the weeds to hopefully help absorption. The Horsetail in particular, may be glyphosate resistant. If so, I will have to follow up another time with 2,4-D. Not to be confused with Horseweed/Mare's Tail, which there is also a bunch of...but that should die from the Roundup. If not, a shot of Tenacity should push it over the edge.

Since I wasn't sure if the RTU 2% Bayer Isopropylamine salt of glyphosate with red tracker dye they had was still good (looking up the EPA number put it in the early to mid 2000s, so 12-15 years old at least, which is definitely pushing it from what I've read), I added a little of my 41% concentrate to it (along with the usual AMS and NIS) before topping it off with distilled water to bring the total to a gallon. I sprayed in the dark, which was a pain. Used a LOT of it...a gallon of mix on an area that's maybe 15x30 feet. Used the mower headlights and a headlamp. Toward the end, my filter clogged and I had to go into the mix and remove it. Thankfully I had a brand new pair of nitrile exam gloves on, which I then threw away after.

That's a wrap, as they say. (No, not a rap.) Makes me think of something Allyn Hane once said on camera: that although it may at times seem like he's spraying a lot of chemicals, and that he did his fair share when he worked in the industry (and customers he inherited from Kanye West, who preceded him) as well, he is not the lawn care chemical nut and is actually pretty environmentally conscious. Well, I feel like a lawn care chemical nut, but not by choice either, right about now...so I can identify with that comment.


----------



## Green

Yesterday: sprayed Mosquito Barrier app 2 in low input and back mostly. Need to do front still. Tons of mosquitoes.

Today: Sprayed glyphosate on some Triv in main front shaded areas that I missed in Spring. Sprayer still clogged...very annoying. Opened new bottle of concentrate (my second ever).

Set zones 4 and 5 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Watered the center sunnier/drier part of low input area using my new PGP Ultra shrub model. I prefer it to the I-20 shrub model I had been using because it doesn't have the check valve, it has an indentation for easier nozzle removal (so you don't mess up the nozzle when removing it), and I don't need the shutoff of the I-20. With a 3.5 gpm nozzle and the water turned on 30% of the way, it only takes about an hour to get 0.4-0.5 down per section. Watered at 2 positions this afternoon. The Hydretain is helping for sure; instead of an abrupt wilt and the browning, the beginning of dormancy is delayed. I think the surfactants in it have also helped with the water absorption. I didn't get any puddling after watering this time.

Pulled a few Triv plants in the flood prone area.

I then sprayed PGR/Serenade Biofungicide/Nu-Film 17 on all main lawn areas* (except on the middle of the side front and I believe also the garage side where the PGR was omitted). Rates were around 0.15oz/4oz/0.5 tsp per thousand, and I used distilled water as I've been doing this whole year. I went heavier on areas that were likely to grow more. First time ever with this exact mix.

PGR was applied at approx 388 GDD today (17 days), whereas 274 was the target. Didn't really notice much or any rebound beginning in most areas. I also applied it to the side for the first time this year today. No rhyme or reason beyond consistency. This was also the first app in a while on the entire main front; previously, herbicides were acting as a PGR in part of the area.

*main lawn: everything except low input area.

Pulled a few weeds in the main front...including 3 or so (~3-tiller) crabgrass plants more toward the driveway side, and mostly in this year's overseed area...so the thick grass on that side is doing well at slowing down the crab development. The ones on the opposite side where I sprayed herbicides including glyphosate, which thinned the lawn, have more tillers, presumably because of faster growth due to less competition from good grass.

Set zones 1, 2, and 3 to water for 60, 70, and 100 min (roughly 0.5 inch) tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Skipped watering the 4 spot-seed repair areas today due to a touch of rain yesterday night, and allowed them to dry a bit today at the surface. If it doesn't rain early tomorrow, I'll water lightly.

Mowed everywhere. Front at 4 in. Low input area (1 week since last mow): same but with side discharge. 3.75 in everywhere else (back, side). Pulled crabgrass as I mowed. Less than 10 plants pulled in 14,000 square feet. 5 main tillers on some with each of those branched further themselves. Also pulled Spurge, Poa Triv, and some other plants. Grass a little on the long side in most areas...been a while. Probably cut off 60% length in some areas (low input area).

Good amount of disease discoloration throughout. Time to start going below 4 inches again...it wants to go shorter. I will only have been at 4 in for about 2 weeks this year in the front. Low input area is a different story...been at that level for a while on most of it.

It also wants fertilizer...already! Shocking, as it's still July/early August. I think the rust disease is just starting up...I'm seeing that overall discoloration I saw in other years right before it starts. Here we go again...


----------



## Green

Treated the yellow Nutsedge plants in the flood-prone area. For the ones in the to-be reno area, I mixed some Sulfentrazone out of the bottle (Ortho) and NIS, and used a paper towel to wipe the herbicide on the plants. Hopefully this works. For the ones in last year's reno area, I spritzed them with Tenacity plus NIS.

Put the gator blade back on the old mower, and cleaned underneath (some mold, actually). Then mowed the flood-prone mini reno area from last year at the highest setting. Put down Moss-out on the area, and then mosquito dunks.

Sprayed Ultramate on the flood-prone area. 1oz per thousand.

Put down Scotts Foundation soil improver on the majority of the low input area (except areas that retain water).

Put down 0.50 lb of N (the beginning of Fall N, believe it or not) on the back. Used Protene 8-0-4.

Spot-treated the 4 back reseed spots with Thiophanate-Methyl granular fungicide from Scotts by hand as a preventative.

Noticed that the rust disease is definitely beginning in the first few areas, in the back. Haven't decided what I want to do about it yet. Don't know that the fertilizer is really going to do much of anything for it; it never seems to.


----------



## Dude

My god you've been busy.

Good to know that you're starting the N. I've been thinking about it this past week but have been hesitant to start. Unusual weather this year for us.


----------



## Green

Dude said:


> My god you've been busy.
> 
> Good to know that you're starting the N. I've been thinking about it this past week but have been hesitant to start. Unusual weather this year for us.


Yeah. I don't know...I looked at the back the other day, and was thinking, man, that wants N (already!) and K. And I just put K down like a week and a half ago. Don't get me wrong...that app definitely helped; it looks a bit better now. But feels like I'm playing catchup.


----------



## JDgreen18

Hey Green I used https://keeganmaterials.com/
They have a sand silt and clay mix soil that is easy to work with. As far as weeds for the most part I got soil as part of a reno process so I always fallowed the soil before planting.
I can tell you this my neighbor got some from the same place had it spread did not gly before or after spreading the dirt. He planted grass in the spring well needless to say all he has is weeds mostly crabgrass.
I think weeds in the soil aren't as important as to how we handle it and what cultural practices we follow. My neighbor asked me why doesn't my lawn look like yours...I try to help but he doesn't listen..oh well


----------



## Green

@JDgreen18, @uts

Thanks.


----------



## Green

Got a little under 0.25 inch of rain last night, which was enough to waterin products, but not enough for irrigation, so I watered the rest of the low input area (near third or so) with another 0.3 inch or so, using the Hunter sprinkler head.

Transplanted a TTTF plug into the corner behind the deck, and removed moss.

Set zone 4 to water for 36 min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## M32075

Green said:


> Reinstalled the Toro blade. Trimmed. Mowed the back (3.75) including the part next to patio skipped last time. Side (3.75 and lower part overgrown). Mowed front and increased to 4 inches. Mower is working much better after sharpening.


How do you sharpen your blade. By hand with a file or a grinder?


----------



## Green

M32075 said:


> How do you sharpen your blade. By hand with a file or a grinder?


By hand. 2 files. One larger, one small one for tight corners.


----------



## Green

Mowed side (3.75) and front (4.0 in) except for the middle of the side front.

Side front is drying out noticeably. Some stress spots evident today. It was also dry to the touch 15 min ago, whereas the main front already had dew.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

8/2/21: Mowed and trimmed family member lawn, finally...over a week and a half, so overgrown. Mowed front perpendicular to house, and back counterclockwise. Had to go back over the back and main front a second time. Also threw down more seed on that front corner (KY-31 seed + SoilMost + Soilmost Seed Coat + Peat Moss + Hydretain + Quinclorac w/NIS). Watered it in (and the below fert). Put down a low rate of 29-0-0 Ace/Scotts fert w/Methylene urea on several areas...the damaged area in the main front, as well as on both sides (AC side was treated heavily for Sedge...see results below). Not sure, but this could have been the last time I mow this lawn, ever. Probably once more still, though. Brought 2 gallons or so of gas. 2 hours to mow. 4.5 hours of work total...well into the night, lol. Did a bunch of other things not worth documenting. The Sulfentrazone toasted a lot of the Sedge (Yellow Nutsedge and a few USPs...unidentified Sedge plants that are circular/rosette in shape and which are perennial)...without toasting too much of the grass. It was nice not to have to mow a ton of tall Nutsedge for once.

--------------------

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 75 and 85 min tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Family member lawn again (unplanned...callback, lol). Sprayed Bioadvanced Fenoxaprop-p-ethyl plus NIS and a little Tenacity on any Paspalum (Dallisgrass?) that I could find, and anything else that looked like a warm season grass for that matter. Used the full 10oz/M "big-boy" rate this time, lol. Hopefully it doesn't destroy the lawn.

Sprayed Tenacity on the seed area; not sure if I still had Quinclorac in that thing. Sprayed a few other spots as well.

Then, sprayed 2 gallons of ancient mix that I had in the basement for a few years (Who knows what it was...lol, just kidding...it was Green Light Crabgrass killer (quinclorac plus 2,4-D). Mostly spot sprayed broadleaf weeds. Hopefully it still has some potency left. At least I finally got to use it up.

Trimmed.

Mixed sand and compost real quick, and filled in a depression (partly) in the front.

Watered the seed with a watering can real quick.
-------------------------------------------
Home: hand watered lower side mini reno from last year with 0.2 inch of water. Unfortunately, there is considerable Poa Triv coming back in one corner of the area, which I'll need to do something about soon.


----------



## Green

Today, started mowing. The rust is at the spore stage in some areas now, mostly in the front and low input area, and more widespread than I would have expected for the very beginning of August. I'm going to up my mowing frequency if possible, not allow the lawn to stress too much, and order some Propiconazole to have it on standby. I'll make a decision this weekend on what to do, but this time I'm not inclined to mess around, and will probably put down a curative rate on all main lawn areas sooner rather than later (within a week), before it gets bad. And then hopefully cultural practices, fertilization, and biofungicide can be used to prevent a recurrence. I usually don't treat like this, but last Fall was terrible and I don't want a replay (with literally browned grass even after I got rid of much of the orange stuff).

Mowed the front and low input area at 4 in. Side discharged as needed in low input.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

ken-n-nancy said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Today: Sprayed Quinclorac (first time ever spraying it not mixed with anything else) ... Instead of using MSO, I used NIS. Will see how it goes...
> 
> 
> 
> Curious to see what your experience ends up being with it. I've always used it with NIS (because that's what I've had on hand, rather than MSO) and had what I considered to be good results with crabgrass and clover.
Click to expand...

Looks like it worked. I haven't seen any more crabgrass in that area since applying it 2 weeks ago. (I pulled a lot of it before spraying, but surely missed some.) To me, the 6-week pre-M feature is the most useful part, like Tenacity. And it turns out Quinclorac can even be applied at seeding time for Tall Fescue seed.


----------



## Green

Got a trace amount of rain last night/this AM; still damp. Cloudy. Started watering low input area. Put down about an inch in 2 hours on the first section using the oscillating sprinkler. Need to finish mowing later...

Trimmed, blew, and mowed in the back (4 in now...increasing HOC again for a bit). Also mowed the side, at 4 in and 3.75 toward the lower half.

The Nutsedge treatment in the to-be Reno area with Sulfentrazone plus NIS wiped on worked great...they're brown now. Bad news: more have popped up, so I'll need to do it again.

Set zone 4 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Watered lower side and more of low input with 0.2 inch. Sprinkler spike broke off in the ground when the water was turned off, and is nowhere to be found. Unfortunately, zinc is not magnetic.

Set zone 5 to water for 20 min x3 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

GDD count for PGR:

July 27: 24
July 28: 22.5
July 29: 20.5
July 30: 23
July 31: 17
Aug 1: 18
Aug 2: 21
Aug 3: 18.5
Aug 4: 18.5
Aug 5: 20.5
Aug 6: 23.5
---227 so far---
2-4 days until reapplication

Earliest end of Target: 267


----------



## Green

Was going to mow family member lawn, but lawn tractor did not work. Got a mechanic on the phone; not much I can do until he looks at it, but judging by the apparent gas in the oil reservoir and white smoke while trying to run, and then stalling out, he knew what was going on. Even before this, the engine wouldn't crank, so I charged the battery (it's just over a year old, so not sure why).

While I was at it, I watered the areas I needed to, including: an area I spread more soil on, after it mixing it. Mixed 50 lbs of sand and one bag of Scotts Miracle Gro raised bed soil (note, never buy again...full of weeds...such as tree nuts that sprouted). Sprayed Tenacity on that area after to prevent weeds. Added soap inside.

----------------
Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 75 and 85 min tomorrow morning. Control dial seems to have loosened overnight.


----------



## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> ken-n-nancy said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Today: Sprayed Quinclorac (first time ever spraying it not mixed with anything else) ... Instead of using MSO, I used NIS. Will see how it goes...
> 
> 
> 
> Curious to see what your experience ends up being with it. I've always used it with NIS (because that's what I've had on hand, rather than MSO) and had what I considered to be good results with crabgrass and clover.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Looks like it worked. I haven't seen any more crabgrass in that area since applying it 2 weeks ago.
Click to expand...

Glad to hear that the quinclorac with NIS instead of MSO worked just fine for you!


----------



## Green

Mowed front, sides, and back at 4 in. Got drizzle.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning.

I believe the neighbor was mowed today.


----------



## Green

Mowed low input area (4 in).

Sprayed mix of Serenade Biofungicide (4oz), PGR (0.1oz), and Nu-Film 17 on main lawn areas.

Set zone 4 to water for 30 min x3 and zone 3 for 50 min x3 tomorrow morning.


----------



## doverosx

I'll be watching to see how Serenade goes .


----------



## Green

Watered the further half (minus the Reno areas) of the low input area with about 0.3 inch.

Hand watered in the front (mostly the side front middle slope (0.3 in), upper front hill, hellstrip areas (0.25 in), bed areas, and area in main front near utilities) (maybe 0.1 inch). Too hot to do a whole lot (90F; mid 70s dewpoint). Next two days forecast to be 94 and 95.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 60 and 75 min (about 0.5 in) tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

doverosx said:


> I'll be watching to see how Serenade goes .


I have Propiconazole on order. The Serenade won't stop the rust. But it can keep Dollar Spot and Brown Patch from getting bad (and mostly has).


----------



## M32075

Green said:


> doverosx said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be watching to see how Serenade goes .
> 
> 
> 
> I have Propiconazole on order. The Serenade won't stop the rust. But it can keep Dollar Spot and Brown Patch from getting bad (and mostly has).
Click to expand...

I used serenade and corn meal a few years back with no luck glad to see it's helping you out.


----------



## Green

M32075 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> doverosx said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be watching to see how Serenade goes .
> 
> 
> 
> I have Propiconazole on order. The Serenade won't stop the rust. But it can keep Dollar Spot and Brown Patch from getting bad (and mostly has).
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I used serenade and corn meal a few years back with no luck glad to see it's helping you out.
Click to expand...

It works for certain things if you start using it before it gets funky, but it really has to be applied at least once a month. And I go nuts trying to do it when there's no rain for a few days. This last time I had to water the next morning and wasn't sure if the sticker/extender I used (a real hassle to use, but helpful in Summer) had time to cure before that.


----------



## Green

Continued watering low input area. Including hand watering of flood-prone area (0.25 inch - first time ever. That was about all it could take at one time). Second day of three in the low 90s with 70s dewpoints.

Set zone 5 to water for 28 min x4 (around 0.7 inch) tomorrow morning. It was at its limit today...very dried out. I've been trying to start the watering later now, because sunrise is later than it was back in mid June.

I am now watering somewhere every day due to the heat. As expected, the increased watering frequency is helping to keep the speed of spread of the rust disease from increasing.

I'm due for fertilizer any day now, everywhere except for the back, which was already partly fertilized (and is now looking better due to that and the water) not too long ago.


----------



## Green

Continued watering low input area. 94F with humidity again today.

Pulled up a few crabgrass plants from the main front (Spring overseed area). 9-20 tillers. Shallow roots. The no pre-emergent year is going well, overall. Minimal crabgrass pressure so far.

It has been on the drier side in terms of lack of rain...dry enough with the temps lately that poorly managed Zoysia is browning out.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 46 and 60 min tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Got 0.4 inch of rain this morning, so with recent irrigation, that adds up to almost an inch in some areas. I did not think it was going to rain.

Got another 0.1 inch downpour late this afternoon. Total today is 0.5 inch. That is great.


----------



## Green

Mowed main lawn areas at 4 in, except most of last year's lower side mini Reno and this year's adjacent overseed from the Spring. Bag mowed the worst rust areas with the old mower prior. Pulled a few weeds including some crabgrass (possibly Large Crabgrass, which I don't often see so it kind of threw me off) in the upper back.


----------



## kay7711226

Green said:


> doverosx said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be watching to see how Serenade goes .
> 
> 
> 
> I have Propiconazole on order. The Serenade won't stop the rust. But it can keep Dollar Spot and Brown Patch from getting bad (and mostly has).
Click to expand...

Where did you get Serenade? Need something to rotate besides Propi for my DS and BP, it's really bad this year for me!


----------



## Green

kay7711226 said:


> Where did you get Serenade? Need something to rotate besides Propi for my DS and BP, it's really bad this year for me!


I got it from Seven Springs Farm.
https://www.7springsfarm.com/products/serenade-aso-2-5-gallon

It's really a preventative, and best started in June or even earlier. It has kept me from getting bad DS and BP. I haven't used anything else yet this year.

Looking back, I applied it 5 times so far: May 15th, June 6th, June 20th, July 26th, and Aug 10th. I haven't used it on the low input area so far and usually do not. There may be more disease there, but I usually don't look as carefully.


----------



## jskierko

Green said:


> kay7711226 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Where did you get Serenade? Need something to rotate besides Propi for my DS and BP, it's really bad this year for me!
> 
> 
> 
> It's really a preventative, and best started in June or even earlier. It has kept me from getting bad DS and BP. I haven't used anything else yet this year.
Click to expand...

I agree with Green. However, you will find very mixed feelings on this board in terms of its usefulness. I used Serenade all of last season with good success. Haven't used it this season and I seem to have a few more problem spots. Could be a result of environmental factors out of my control, but I think serenade is a worthy add to the arsenal.


----------



## kay7711226

Thanks, I will keep it in mind come next season when I need to rotate from Propi.


----------



## Green

Yesterday: family member lawn (3 hrs there): riding mower repair (shutoff), changed oil and filter. Mowed back real quick. Seeded the front bare spot where I previously added soil. Used Boreal CRF, Gladiator Hard Fescue, Rushmore Chewings, and Baron KBG. Applied both types of soil moist. Covered with peat moss and topped with the granular mulch. Did not initiate watering. Slightly watered the previously seeded area. Didn't see anything coming up yet, but it had been in the 90s, sunny, with no rain for a while over the past week.

At home: Set zone 5 to water for 22 min x3 this morning (today-see date above).

--------------

Today at home: mowed low input area at 4 in. Side discharged a lot of it. More dried leaves come down little by little as time goes on.

Then applied 1.5 lb/M of Sul-Po-Mag to the entire low input area.


----------



## Chris LI

I'm seeing some leaf shedding, too. How is turf growth? It's pretty strong here, for this time of year, with the moderate temps we've had.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> I'm seeing some leaf shedding, too. How is turf growth? It's pretty strong here, for this time of year, with the moderate temps we've had.


It looks really good at 4 inches right now. Growing fairly fast, even with the PGR. Unfortunately, I'm going to have to start lowering it again at some point. And the rust is slowly spreading. Trying not to use the Propiconazole, but I have a couple of standard XR Teejet nozzles (red and yellow) coming specifically for it, that apply smaller droplets than the default Chapin nozzle (all I've ever used so far). Figured less of it would get to the soil and kill the good fungi that way. Also with the 4-inch height.

Did I mention something related to shedding?

My SLS ordered over a month ago is finally en route.


----------



## doverosx

For some reason I'm getting a bunch of "bunching" fescue. It seems to be native to the area and it is popping up in areas that are somewhat surprising. Are you seeing any fescues or other wild grasses popping up? Get this though....my poa is CHOKED out, it's all gone except for one spot but that spot is heavily suppressed. I'm going to be a broken record here, but "This year is a strange one."


----------



## Chris LI

Which # XR teejets did you go with? I noticed the Chapin tip had a fairly coarse spray, too, and was thinking of upgrading for foliar apps.

You mentioned dried leaves coming down, so that was my reference, since I noticed some dropping. Maybe 'shedding' was a little too strong of a term.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Which # XR teejets did you go with? I noticed the Chapin tip had a fairly coarse spray, too, and was thinking of upgrading for foliar apps.
> 
> You mentioned dried leaves coming down, so that was my reference, since I noticed some dropping. Maybe 'shedding' was a little too strong of a term.


Just checked the order details. Still waiting for them to come.

XR11004-VP and XR11002-VP, since Ware said he liked XRs for foliar apps in his thread on these. I got the all-plastic ones due to price and since they're similar to what I've been using and seem easy to clean out. And I ordered a few 50-mesh stainles-steel screens with plastic border to go under the nozzle. Who knew you were supposed to have a screen under the nozzle.

I get what you mean now. For some reason I thought you were talking about lawn shedding.

Finally got the SLS today.


----------



## Green

doverosx said:


> For some reason I'm getting a bunch of "bunching" fescue. It seems to be native to the area and it is popping up in areas that are somewhat surprising. Are you seeing any fescues or other wild grasses popping up? Get this though....my poa is CHOKED out, it's all gone except for one spot but that spot is heavily suppressed. I'm going to be a broken record here, but "This year is a strange one."


Nothing crazy here!


----------



## Green

Got 1.33 inch of rain last night/this morning.


----------



## JDgreen18

Hey Green when you spray the ultramate do you mix up a batch of 12% solution then just use it as needed from there? Or do you mix what you need each time. I bought a few bags of this a couple of years ago and never used it.


----------



## Chris LI

Since you went with the yellow and red XRs, I figured I would go with the blue in stainless (XR11003 - VS), so we can compare. I was having trouble deciding and I think the spray droplet size might be a little finer for the pressure range I will probably be using (looking at the chart). It was also the cheapest tip on Amazon. I didn't get any screens, so we'll see if it clogs.


----------



## Green

JDgreen18 said:


> Hey Green when you spray the ultramate do you mix up a batch of 12% solution then just use it as needed from there? Or do you mix what you need each time. I bought a few bags of this a couple of years ago and never used it.


I just partly filled the 3-gal sprayer and then threw the powder in the sprayer (with the screen for the tube that sucks everything out removed) and shook it up in a circular motion. That's it. The first time, I guessed the amount. The last time, I weighed it out.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Since you went with the yellow and red XRs, I figured I would go with the blue in stainless (XR11003 - VS), so we can compare. I was having trouble deciding and I think the spray droplet size might be a little finer for the pressure range I will probably be using (looking at the chart). It was also the cheapest tip on Amazon. I didn't get any screens, so we'll see if it clogs.


That's a good idea. We'll see how it goes.


----------



## Green

Mowed family member lawn (2 hrs). Mowed everywhere. Didn't get to trim. Mowed main front parallel to house, far part of back in same direction, and most of the rest of the back counterclockwise. Brought roughly 1 gal of gas. Need more next time.

------------

Got 4 more gal of gas ahead of the storm.


----------



## Green

Today: sprayed an app of Sulfosulfuron on the left 1/3 of last year's lower side mini Reno, and a couple of areas in the low input area adjacent to the to-be Reno area, due to Triv. Will follow up in a week or two with Tenacity so I can seed. Also noticed some more Triv next to the reseeded spot near the front of shed/walkway. Noticed a patch of Bentgrass in the middle side near the lower back border.

Trimmed and blew clippings near the back walkway and where the gutter drains.

Mowed almost all lawn areas. 4 inches and side discharge, except the far end of the low input area, which I took down to 3.25 in because it might stay too damp to mow again for 2 weeks.

Got more gas to make sure there is enough for the coming Hurricane Henri, which is likely to make landfall as a Category 1 at the CT coast on Sunday. At least 3-5 in of rain expected; wind speeds depend on the track. Cleaned up a few things, took a few things inside, and pulled more weeds and a whole bunch of plant waste. Put the rain gauge out, and braced it with 2 bricks.

Neighbor next door was fertilized with "Chemlawn" in the last couple of days, and neighbor 11 sometime in the past week.


----------



## Green

The Hurricane changed from a category 1 to a tropical storm sometime between 6 and 7AM today, about 150 miles East of Long Branch, NJ, and then the eye made landfall at about 12:30PM just over our state border in the Southwestern corner of RI. It then moved faster than forecasted over the land. Since then, we have picked up around 2 inches of rain.

Thankfully wind gusts were not severe in our immediate area (no more than about 40 mph, and likely less), and were mostly confined to the morning period. As of now, most of the wind threat is over for CT. Additionally, power has stayed on here so far, and thankfully only a fraction of the outages predicted last night occurred in the state due to the Eastward change in track.

RI has gotten hit harder. It was originally predicted to make landfall as a category 1 in central LI/CT, but moved further east late last night and early this morning. This track is not common this time of year (landfall in CT/RI/NY) and is more typical later in the hurricane season (but even then isn't very common, as they usually ride the Eastern Seaboard/coast).

More rain is expected, and I'll have a total late tomorrow night or on Tuesday. Had the 60,000 plus power outages predicted earlier today occurred (originally over 700,000 to 1 million outages were projected in the state before the storm track changed), it would have been brutal with Wed., Thurs., and Fri. predicted to be 90F, and power likely to be out for at least a week in many areas. Last August, we had a power outage of 4.5 days, and that was bad enough.


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## Green

PGR was applied on Aug 10th. GDD count:

Aug. 11: 27
Aug. 12: 28.5
Aug. 13: 27.5
Aug. 14: 25
Aug. 15: 22
Aug. 16: 23
Aug. 17: 22.5
Aug. 18: 23
Aug. 19: 27
Aug. 20: 25
Aug. 21: 25
Aug. 22: 22.5
Aug. 23: 22.5
Aug. 24 (day): 11
Total: 331.5 (target: 260)
Link to reapplication chart: https://thelawnforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=398788#p398788

Plan to apply Propiconazole curative rate (for rust) plus 0.05 rate PGR plus Serenade or Companion plus Nufilm 17 tank mix on Tuesday. Not going to mess around this year. I have never applied a curative fungicide everywhere before, and only rarely have applied one to a given lawn section.


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## Green

Rain is up to 2.5 inches so far. Final total coming tomorrow.


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## Green

Final rain total from the tropical storm: almost 3.5 inches.

Neighbor was mowed today.

Sprayed the fungicide (primarily for rust). Tested the sprayer nozzles first, but still picked the wrong one. The yellow was too slow. It also clogged a few times (I didn't use a screen).

Applied mix to main lawn areas and part of low input behind that area and behind shed.

Mix: 
-2 oz rate of Propiconazole 14.3 (curative)
-0.05 oz rate of PGR
-2 oz rate of Companion Biofungicide (includes trace NPK)
-0.5 tsp rate of Nu-film 17
-1 gal. distilled water per thousand in most places

No PGR on some areas that struggle to grow this time of year (upper front hill, garage side, walkways, lower side mini Reno, borders, etc.; limited amount on others. Sprayed grass trays as well.

PPE: Long pants and shirt, hat, safety glasses, N95 mask, new premium dishwashing gloves, new Tigley boot-style overshoes (these are great).

It was my first time using Propiconazole 14.3, and first time using Companion. The Companion contains a small amount of foliar fertilizer (2-3-2; not sure how to calculate how much was applied, though), a nice bonus. And apparently it contains molasses. Didn't expect that! But the color and smell gave it away (even though all inactive ingredients are "confidential").

Next time, I would use the red XR Teejet nozzle (and a screen) instead of the yellow. This was a very slow, tedious project, and the slow nozzle made it worse.

Prior, I sprayed glyphosate on a few more Triv spots.


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## Green

A few days in a row near/over 90 this week. 2nd of 4 today. Due to all the rain plus the PGR wearing off, the grass is getting pretty long. I have a neighbor who has mowed 3x in the past week or so. I am not doing that with the push mower, no way. Especially since I'm supposed to be resting. My method: keep HOC at 4 in a little longer to reduce mowing frequency, and let it go a bit. I'm not watering yet since that 3.5-inch dump of rain Sunday and Monday. Surprisingly, the water in the low input area has mostly dried up already. But the mosquitoes are in hyper mode. The area to-be-renovated (now late) is growing all sorts of plants and grass now...major fallowing. Planning to spray it out soon so I can do seed prep in the near future.

Today: seeded a few of the Spring glyphosate spots (sides and border of low input area). The hot weather should help germination. Pulled a few weeds. Watered the new grass spots, painted glyphosate on more of the weedy grass in the back walkway using a q-tip.

Put down the 1.5 lb/M app of Sul-Po-Mag product on the side front thinking I was going to water tomorrow morning (but then decided not to water since it's too soon after all the storm rain).

Pruned a few branches that were in the way today or yesterday.


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## Chris LI

I received my blue teejet today. I have a lot on my plate, but will try to test it out over the next few days.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> I received my blue teejet today. I have a lot on my plate, but will try to test it out over the next few days.


Where does the blue fit as far as flow rate? Because the yellow was excruciatingly slow (and gave the Chapin battery powered sprayer some difficulties).


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> Chris LI said:
> 
> 
> 
> I received my blue teejet today. I have a lot on my plate, but will try to test it out over the next few days.
> 
> 
> 
> Where does the blue fit as far as flow rate? Because the yellow was excruciatingly slow (and gave the Chapin battery powered sprayer some difficulties).
Click to expand...

0.30 GPM @ 40 psi; right in the middle from the yellow (0.20 GPM @ 40 psi) and red (0.40 GPM @ 40 psi). That coincides with the numbering system from TeeJet, with the yellow ending in 02, blue ending in 03 and red ending in 04. At a walking speed of 2 mph, they should put out gallons per 1000 square feet @ 0.68, 1.0 and 1.4 respectively. At 3 mph, 0.45, 0.68, and 0.91 gal per 1000.

I was thinking either blue or red would work for us. Since you had the red, I figured that I would try the blue. Theoretically, you should be putting down twice the amount with the red compared to the yellow, so it will be interesting to see your results. I didn't see if they factored in viscosity of the fluid, so hopefully your next mix will be of a similar viscosity. See screenshot from TeeJet Discussion below:


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## Green

@Chris LI, thanks.

So, the blue is in between. My quick test showed that the red was putting out larger droplets than I wanted, and I was trying to keep the fungicide spray foliar so as not to mess with the soil biology too much (not sure if this works). Also, testing on a 12x10 section of hardscape (0.12M) showed that the red put out 1/8th gal. (1 gal. per thousand). The yellow seemed to put out half of that or slightly less, so I went with it. I like to do 2 spray repeats generally. But once I started applying to larger areas, it became clear it was going much slower. I walked more than 4 repeats of a 2.5K area with 2.5 gallons as it got dark, and finally gave up and used 4x less water on the final area as it was dark (not just getting dark, but dark...nocturnal animals were coming out and I could hear them).

The pump also went on and off a few times per second with the yellow...short staccato pulses, which I didn't like, either. Once the warranty is definitely over I might adjust the pressure on this thing, btw.

The next mix will be similar, but slightly thicker but also less sticky.

I'm not sure yet how much the red tip differs from the default Chapin (also red...wonder why). Or maybe they're not similar. We'll see in a couple of weeks.

Worst case, I'll have to get a blue if I don't like either the red or yellow and want something in between. Or maybe dark red, who knows.


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## Chris LI

Green said:


> I'm not sure yet how much the red tip differs from the default Chapin (also red...wonder why). Or maybe they're not similar. We'll see in a couple of weeks.
> 
> Worst case, I'll have to get a blue if I don't like either the red or yellow and want something in between.


I'm on the same page with you. I wanted a finer spray, which should be the blue, but I wasn't sure it would put out enough gpm, so I didn't have to walk too much. I also wasn't sure if I could build enough psi to make a finer mist with the red tip, so it wouldn't be too coarse of a spray, for a good foliar app. I'm also curious as to how the mist coarseness of the red tip compares to the stock (red) Chapin tip. The Chapin tip seems to work well for soil apps, but I don't think it's fine enough to get the most out of a foliar app.


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## Green

@Chris LI, You brought up a good point about the liquid's viscosity. I bet that's why the actual mix came out much slower than my test using water.

As for clogging, it happened again today when I sprayed the rinsate on the low input area...the Teejet red nozzle this time, clogged. I still didn't try the strainer. Apparently these two Teejet XRs are more prone to clogging than the default Chapin nozzle...maybe because these are lower flow-rate nozzles.

The droplets from the red XR seem a little coarse for a strictly-foliar app. (And the battery sprayer puts out a ton of PSI...arguably, too much.)


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## Green

Today: 92F. Day 3 of 4. Finally watered...lightly hand watered the upper front hill. Also did the hellstrip areas and bed, part up near the garage, some edges, and lightly syringed a good portion of the front as well while I was at it. Watered most of the seeded areas 2x today.

Set zones 4 and 5 to water for 20x4 and 30x4 min. tomorrow morning. That will yield a good soaking for the side front and a light watering for the upper back, which is beginning to stress, as well as the single seeded area on the garage side being kept moist.


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## M32075

Crazy weather I got close to 5 inches of rain from Henri suddenly I come home from work and dealing with heat stress on the front lawn go figure


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## Green

M32075 said:


> Crazy weather I got close to 5 inches of rain from Henri suddenly I come home from work and dealing with heat stress on the front lawn go figure


Yeah. Same here, but 3.5 inches of rain. I'm currently playing the "how long can I get away with not watering much when every day is around 90F" game right now. I finally had to start watering. I'm also not mowing until the heat is over.

It was terrible out there this evening...not only sticky, but the mosquitoes were horrible. Exactly like Florida weather/bugs.


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## Chris LI

Thanks for the update on the red tip clogging. I just ordered the strainer. A few things came up today, so my lawn activities took a backseat.


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## Green

Final day of the 4 days around 90, so I started mowing this evening in between the threat of storms. Side discharged at 4 inches in most of low input (except the same far end mowed at 3.25 again to promote drying). Cleaned the mowers. Mowed far flood prone mini area with old mower. Then mowed main front, most of side, and lower back--again side discharging at 4 in as the grass was long. Probably slightly broke 1/3 rule.

Rust transmission looks like it's starting to halt since the curative fungicide app went down, as expected, but beyond this, I'm really glad that I applied it (despite how labor intensive it was and how it might impact soil biology), because there seems to be some dollar spot as well as other stuff appearing now, too. Prime disease weather. August is almost always the worst month when everything catches up.

Pulled a few weeds, mostly Spurge.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 80 and 90 min (broken up into 2) tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Got under 0.1 inch of rain last night.

Finished mowing (same height and method as yesterday)--upper back and side front. Pulled some more weeds. Mowed lower side mini reno at 3.2 in; mowed roundup area down low. Hadn't mowed this area forever. Really needs fertilizer. Sprayed Tenacity without surfactant on seeded spots, then watered all except garage side spot. Sprayed Tenacity on large weeds at upper back natural area boundary. And then on the back neighbor border.

One of the roundup spots in the front from the Spring has something interesting going on...several TTTF plants are now growing in the area. No seed has been put down. It was either an incomplete kill, or the rhizomatous TTTF is working. I don't think it was the former, because it was completely bare for months and had been treated 2x-3x with roundup in the Spring.


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## Green

Family member lawn: 3 hrs; brought at least 1 gal gas. Trimmed. Mowed (perpendicular to house). Seed is starting to germinate. Also used groundskeeper rake to quickly dethatch the damaged area in back, and overseeded with CRF and Rushmore Chewings; topped with a little peat moss. Did similar on some parts of side front, but with KY-31/CRF.
--------------

Noticed the first hint of Fall color on trees starting on trees while driving.


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## Green

Sprayed Glyphosate on the to-be flood-prone reno area. Reminding myself to get a photo of it tomorrow...

Sprayed Certainty (Sulfosulfuron) at the 0.5 oz per acre rate on the far end of the low-input area. I had done several apps in late Spring/early Summer, but decided to do one more. The goal is to prevent any Sedges that may have germinated since the last app wore off, and to knock down the Poa Trivialis, which is starting to make a comeback. A bonus is that this app will also act as a PGR for the grass; I won't be able to mow for a while once the area floods, which it likely will due to impending rain. Hopefully we don't get 4-6 inches, which I heard mentioned by a weather man. The grass will turn ugly for a while, but it will at least be regulated. I'll follow up on the other side of the rainstorm (in a week or two) with Quinclorac and Tenacity for the Crabgrass that has started making its presence known over the past month.

Also used the residual from the above spray app, mixed with a little Tenacity, on the lower side mini reno to stop the Triv and Poa annua from making a big comeback. Also sprayed Bentgrass patch in the middle side.

Also started putting down GrubGone G at the 2 lb/M rate. Applied to the turfed parts of the low-input area (11 lbs over 5.5K) and the upper back (2 lbs over 1K). This is a new grub control product that is a curative but also has preventative effects. I'm using it for the preventative effects. I'll have more to say about it soon; I got it so I could rotate to a different AI and not have to use Chlorantraniliprole again this Spring (which I had used for like 5 years in a row). Last year, I didn't apply anything (took a break from grub prevention), and didn't want to push my luck again for a second year.

Not sure how much I can get done tomorrow, but would like to mow a few areas at least, trim in back, finish putting down Grub prevention, Sul-Po-Mag, and Protene on at least the lower side (an area less prone to runoff), and maybe do some transplants. Also, flood prone area needs another mow if possible, then iron (to kill moss), Ultramate (to help drainage?), and mosquito dunks. Wed or Thurs if there's a break in rain, I'd like to apply SLS on a few areas.

Grass seed started to germinate in the reseeded spots.


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## Green

Tried to do as much as possible with 3-5+ inches of rain expected the next 2 days from the remnants of the Hurricane that hit Louisiana.

Trimmed in back.

Mowed back, most of sides, main front, and most of side front at 4 in.

Put down 1.5 lbs per thousand of Sul-Po-Mag on back, side, and main front.

Put down 2 lbs/M of GrubGone on lower back, side, and front.

Attempted to put down 1-1.5 lbs of leftover Protene 8-0-4 fert on lower and middle side, but filled spreader while it was open. You can guess what happened. Swapped that out for 5 lbs of 8-1-8 XGRN for the same area, to total 0.5 lb N. That area shouldn't have bad runoff. I'll wait to apply N to other areas due to the rain.

Put down a liberal amount of granular moss-out on flood-prone area after mowing grass in last year's failed mini Reno area down to 2.6 in. Sprayed Ultramate on the entire future Reno area (1,000 sq ft) to help water infiltration. Used approx 1 oz (roughly 1.5 of the large scoops with green spoon from Miracle Gro) with 1.5 gallons of water. Finally, put out mosquito dunks on the area. By this time, it was dark.

I think I'm all set. So glad I applied fungicide recently to all main lawn areas and some of low input area...this weather is prime for disease, and it would be worse for sure if I hadn't used it. Some of the mix is even still on the grass blades, thanks to the sticker/extender I used.


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## Green

Just light to moderate rain so far. So far, maybe a half inch of rain as of 1:30PM. They're predicting 3.5-5 more by tomorrow at around 8AM.

Rain let up for a bit. Took advantage of it. Since I have my SLS now, I mixed 1/3 oz into the residual Ultramate solution from last night and topped off to 1.25 gal. (The recommended BL solution rate for the liquid for those who have been around a while.) Sprayed the major/usual problem areas in the side front, totaling around 1K area.

This will help get more of the rain into the soil, especially on the slopes, rather than running off. Been wanting to do this application for quite a while (since early July). The Chapin red nozzle is great for these types of apps.

6:45PM edit: Rain total is 0.8 inches so far. The heavy stuff is coming tonight and there are all sorts of warnings. 3-4.75 more inches of rain are predicted tonight.


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## Green

As of 1:40AM: Got ANOTHER 4.3 inches of rain.


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## M32075

My total was 5.2 Draining the pool before work. Central NJ got crushed with rain


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## Green

Final check of the rain gauge just now said 0.25 inch, but I think it was closer to 0.3 due to evaporation.

That makes the final rain total 5.4 in, or very, very close to it.


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## Green

M32075 said:


> My total was 5.2 Draining the pool before work. Central NJ got crushed with rain


Not to mention tornado damage.


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## Green

Ground is still too damp outside to mow. I had washout of peat moss and some seed in 1 or 2 of the small spots, but others are fine. Can fix it tomorrow. It looks like a lot of the standing water in the flood-prone area is gone...can probably chalk that up to the Ultramate applications, including the recent one the night before the rainstorm. The wind helped dry it up, too. I'm really surprised it absorbed as well as it did already. Next step will be to cut down the weeds by hand this weekend, and then spray a final glyphosate app. Possibly dig the 2nd drainage trench first, though...which will be kind of a big job.


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## Green

Sprayed Mosquito Barrier at 3oz in 1 gallon in and around the flood prone area so I can work on the Reno prep in the coming days. (Starting the 2nd bottle).

Mowed a bunch of areas at 4 in after picking up sticks and nuts in the front. Side, front, and near two-thirds of low input (side discharge...quite long...maybe 7 inches in areas).

Pulled up the weedy grass plants (that were previously glyphosated by hand) near the back walkway. They were mostly dead and pulled up easily.


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## Green

Finally broke down and ordered some Air-8. The reviews all this time have been decent, and it's now available in 1 gallon, which is a smaller size, so it became feasible. The few dollars off for the holiday pushed me over the edge. I'll use it on the flood prone area exclusively, where the results with the Ultramate have been pretty good. If this is as good as that, cool. I'll get at least 10 applications out of the gallon, even if I use it on some adjacent areas. Anything that will improve the results of my late Reno in any way will be appreciated.


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## Green

According to the small lawn irrigation gauges, we got 0.3 inch of rain last night. That was enough to push everything over to saturation...

The flood-prone area now has standing water (which is going to delay reno prep even more...July really would have been the optimal time for this reno). So, I threw some mosquito dunks into the water. The mosquitoes are relentless now. Go out with long sleeves and pants, repellent, etc., and your face gets bitten.

Mowed the back. Side discharged at 4 inches. I'm locked into this now. There is no other choice...the upper back near the garage was the worst...the soil (which has a ton of compost in it) is like mud underfoot. Anymore rain, and the lawn is going to melt, I swear.

That 0.3 inch of rain pushed everything over the edge.


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## Green

The flood-prone area was still too wet to do anything with. I wanted to rake and spray glyphosate. Tomorrow is supposed to be windy, and then more rain tomorrow night...ughhh.

I wanted to start seeding other areas, but didn't get to it. Maybe tomorrow...hopefully. But I have another property to mow first.

Instead, I transplanted some turf into bare spots where I had killed Triv in the Spring (mostly middle side, but one in the front, too). It takes a while to do, but the gratification is essentially instantaneous. The side is almost done, now.

Pulled a couple of small Triv plants in the lower side mini reno that was planted a year ago. This stuff is tenacious; the seeds keep germinating along with the good grass. If you can get it before it gets big, that's the way to go.

Then, mulch mowed the middle and upper side and the main front at 4 in, as well as the front hill and hellstrip areas.

Pulled a few weeds, primarily Spurge in the front walkway.

Neighbor was mowed today. Local company fertilized.


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## Green

Morning: Sprayed glyphosate on flood prone area. The water finally absorbed. Just some mud. Very windy, so had to use yellow Chapin 0.56 gpm coarse spray tip. The previous app didn't really work; I think I know why. Before spraying, raked up plant debris.
--------------
Late afternoon: Mowed family member lawn. Bit damp still. Lawn tractor was tough to start. Charged it and got lucky. Then it quit and I couldn't get it started again with a second charge. I think it's a faulty battery even though it's pretty new. Neighbor is going to take a look at it. Mowed clockwise. Trimmed. The grass seed is coming up, particularly the KY-31. Put down fertilizer everywhere: ~4.2 lbs on front areas, and ~6 lbs in back. Expert Gardener 29-0-4 (Pennington). 0.25 lb/M of N. Brought 1.6 gal of gas.
------------
Evening: Finished mowing at 4 in: garage side and adjacent area. Then low input (side discharge). Then put down 13 lbs of 0-0-50 SOP on whole low input area (1.0 lb of K2O equiv.) In the dark, sprayed an app of Ultramate on flood prone area, focusing on last year's Reno and adjacent area (same area sprayed with glyphosate this morning).


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## Green

Got 0.25 inch of rain yesterday. Thankfully, it wasn't more. It could have been up to an inch.


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## Green

Side front slope area under tree near driveway was drought stressed, so sprayed SLS plus residual Ultramate and hand watered in increments.

Mowed and dethatched ~5.5x35 foot (0.192K) area at main front border, then sprayed 0.2 oz of PGR in 0.6 gallon of water over the area. Plan to reseed/overseed (includes part of neighbor's).

Mowed front and started side (4 in).

Old mower failed to start at one point. Cleaned spark plug. Didn't help, but much later it started. Might buy new plug, but it could be something internal. Removed engine cover and did quick wipe down of dust.

Ran snowblower.

Set zone 5 to water for 17 min x 4 tomorrow morning (~0.4 in), but some portions still have plenty of soil moisture from fairly recent rain. This time of year is always tough to balance everything in a given zone, unless you want to do a lot of hand watering/setting up of small sprinklers. Haven't had to do any watering for over 2 weeks.


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## Green

Raked last year's flood-prone mini reno, added 2 bags of play sand, and overseeded with a little more of the KBG seed.

Started raking adjacent area. Decided to leave a buffer strip in between the two areas for now for drainage. It can eventually be seeded at some point in the future. I won't have time to dig drainage before seeding, and will seed the area where the trench is to go, and dig it after the grass comes in...or even next Spring.

Mosquitoes are horrible. Sprayed tons of deet repellent all over pants and shirt multiple times, but they just kept coming and biting. All different types. Must be fairly resistant. Might try Picardin in the future, instead.


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## Chris LI

We have both Sawyer Picaridin and Permethrin repellents thst we got from ****'s Sporting Goods. They both work well.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> We have both Sawyer Picaridin and Permethrin repellents thst we got from d---'s Sporting Goods. They both work well.


Thanks. I believe the latter is an actual insecticide, and I'm not crazy about coating clothes with it.


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## Green

Finished mowing the side and did lower (and upper up to steps) back at 4 in w/side discharge. The rest of upper back was too damp. In fact the portion near the garage has mud clumps...not sure if those are just due to all the rain, or maybe are invasive jumping worm castings (I've seen a few jumping worms in the past year). Thankfully today, all of the frogs seemed to make it out of the mower path (unlike yesterday). I saw one. Need all these guys to eat mosquitoes, ticks, moths, etc.

Mowed overseed area on main front border down low and bagged. Seeded, and threw down peat moss. Used the following seed on my side of the border: Main front mix from last year plus the rest of the expired Titanium 2LS that probably won't germinate, and a little Rowdy TTTF on the most shady part. Neighbor side: Barenbrug TTTF (Barvado, Bearcat, Bar 3FA BTR9, 0.28% Ryegrass, and a little weed/other crop), Rushmore Chewings, and Boreal CRF to approximate their mix as best as possible. Will let their KBG spread back into the area over time. At least the Fescues aren't likely to have Poa T in them. Hand watered.

Hand watered flood prone overseed area.

Left neighbor was mowed today, as expected.

Put down 1.5 lb/M of 0-0-50 SOP (parallel to driveway) on main front. May have gone lower on overseed area.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 17 and 16 min respectively (x4) tomorrow morning. (Zone 1 areas are drying more due to pavement.)

Tomorrow: Tenacity on seeded areas.


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## Green

Family member lawn (one of my final sessions): removed riding mower battery (relative tested it and found a bad cell). Then hand watered all front new grass areas, which were threatening to die from the heat. If I can just keep it going a bit longer...
-------------------

Home: Sprayed mix of PGR at 0.1 oz rate, Companion Biofungicide at 2 oz rate, and Nu-Film 17 at 0.5 tsp rate on main front. Sprayed Tenacity at approx 4oz rate w/out surfactant on the recently seeded main front border area. Put down 1.5 lb/M of 0-0-50 SOP product on lower back, side, and side front. 0.75 lb of K.

Upper back soil is still waterlogged and puffy. Never seen this before. Feels like walking on mud. More rain is on the way in 24 hours or so.

Left neighbor watered this AM.

Set zone 5 to water for 16 min x2 (0.2 inch or so) tomorrow morning. Supposed to rain tomorrow night so don't want to overwater right before.


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## Green

Humid today. And windy. The grass stayed somewhat moist. I ended up mowing the rest (front, upper side: 4 in. Upper back and low input: same with a lot of discharging). Lower side mini Reno: 3.2. Far end of low input: 3.75.

Neighbor's sprinklers got stuck on for about 5 hrs. after being mowed. Only wet a relatively small portion of my side, but will likely redo the biofungicide on the border in a few days just in case.

Sprayed Companion biofungicide (2oz rate), PGR (0.05-0.12 oz rate), Nu-Film 17 (0.5 tsp rate) on the rest of the main lawn areas.

Sprayed Tenacity at approx 4 oz rate on flood prone overseed area (no surfactant).

Put down 1.75 lb of 0-0-50 SOP product on upper back.


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## Green

The rain held off today (we got 0.3 in by early this AM). We were lucky.

I was able to go and mow the family member lawn. First, I had to install the replacement battery in the lawn tractor, and it worked great after. This was my final time mowing there, as the property is going to be sold. I mowed the main front and most of back twice, perpendicular (taking the HOC down a notch in the back on the second pass). Did the two sides carefully; cutting over the new grass with the riding mower on the second setting down, but not sure if it actually got cut. I trimmed before mowing. That's a wrap. @gregonfire: like you, saying bye to a house and property. But it'll be nice to no longer have to do two. I accomplished something.


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## Green

Started raking out main front spots to be reseeded, using groundskeeper rake. Dead grass and moss to rake out. More to do tomorrow. Then: loosen soil with garden weasel and reseed. Allowed flood prone area to dry out and plan to continue reno prep tomorrow. Neighbor was aerated today. No rain.

Goals for tomorrow: Flood prone area reno prep and seeding. Spray Tenacity/Quinclorac mix on adjacent area. Spray Tenacity on lower side mini reno from last year and low input border. Trim in back. Spray PGR around front spots to-be seeded. Spray RU on lower side mini-mini reno area. Spray Miracle Gro on sod transplant areas. Seed sod tray(s). Take photos. Dump debris in back.


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## Green

To-do list:

-PGR GDD calc.
-Mail soil samples done 10/1/21
-Grass seed germination test
-Trimming in front
-Pull up/spray/kill weeds in sidewalks
-Mosquito barrier Spray
-Edging/trimming/bed defining/mulch
-Pick up nuts from lawn
-Dig and replace spots in back and low input
-Tree and/or shrub pruning
-Hort soap app on Holly?
-Tree transplant???
-Irrigation work??
-Patio side dig up and remove rocks and replace grass?
-Spray AIR8 first app before next rain
-Apply fertilizer before rain (in progress)
-Apply low-input pre-M before next rain
-Apply Gallery on edges to prevent broadleaf weeds this Winter
-Spray Tenacity on low-input
-Leveling areas
-Install rain sensor
-Triclopyr spray
-Broadleaf weed spray


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## Green

No time today. Got a trace amount of rain during a fast moderate downpour in mid to late afternoon. 0.05 inch or less. Thankful that seed got watered.

Pulled up some Triv at the edge of one of the Spring kill spots in the main front. I'm very impressed by how much my TTTF is filling in some of those spots (not many of the spots, but where it's happening, it's impressive). They were killed in May. I never expected TTTF to fill in several inches from the edge of a glyphosate spot in about 4 months and put up new plants in the center of an 8- or- 10-inch-diameter spot. In one of these spots, the TTTF is doing at least as good a job as the KBG at filling in, if not better. Generally, TTTF tries to fill in from the edge, and doesn't do so well in covering ground quickly. But these are actual daughter plants a distance away. Very impressive. Unfortunately, I couldn't tell you what cultivar it is...I've used Bullseye, Firecracker S/LS, Titanium 2LS, Summer, and Flame/No-Net. Three of these 5 are supposed to exhibit some of this behavior, though. I will say I don't think it's the Summer, because the blade width is not really fine. Bullseye was top of the heap for a long time, but was never advertised as spreading, so I can probably rule it out as well. Now, this last one is a little more shaky logic, but I'll also say I haven't seen this behavior in my back lawn, which is Bullseye/Firecracker. And Titanium is similar to Firecracker. So, maybe I should put my money on the Flame/No-Net...I'm not sure.

Hand watered that stubborn under tree area on slope of side front near driveway. Started germination test of old Wicked TTPR weed from 2016. Hand-sharpened my 2 standard blades for the old mower.


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## Chris LI

If you want to try to take out some Triv, try a strong dose of Triclopyr as an experiment. I went after some clover this summer and Triv got wiped out as collateral damage. The reseeding interval is too long at this point, but if you have some C, C, or O to take out next spring in an area that has Triv, it would be interesting to see what happens.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> If you want to try to take out some Triv, try a strong dose of Triclopyr as an experiment. I went after some clover this summer and Triv got wiped out as collateral damage. The reseeding interval is too long at this point, but if you have some C, C, or O to take out next spring in an area that has Triv, it would be interesting to see what happens.


I do remember a similar effect last year from clover spraying. It can't hurt to do in Spring if there is a need to spray anyway.


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## Green

Whew! I finally got the Reno area finished with raking, and then seeded, then threw down peat moss by hand (about an hour and a half process), and hand watered it as it got dark. Finally seed down. 2 months later than my target, and technically too late for a KBG reno. Last day or two of Summer, right? Just did a real rough rake, and didn't spray again or worry about slight ground unevenness. I put down granular moss-out before the seed to kill the remaining moss. Seed was MyHolidayLawn KBG blend. Didn't even weigh it out precisely...grabbed what I believe was 3 lbs by eye out of a 5 lb bag, and put it down on just under 1 K area (but around 30% of the seed was 6 years old and probably will not germinate, so true rate was closer to 2 lbs per thousand). Too dark for a photo showing the final result. Just have a little bit left of the area to seed tomorrow.

I now have shoes dedicated to that area. They are caked with the seed and I don't need it transferred elsewhere.

Set zone 5 to water for 15 min x4 tomorrow morning.

Grass is getting pretty long. Needs a mow.

Noticed germination started today in the main front border overseed.


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## Green

Final day at family member house/lawn. All done! I no longer have two lawns to maintain! Did a quick trim (back, mostly) and blow in the back under the steps and some quick watering and tidying up right before the buyer and agent came! Very satisfying. Also sharpened my other 2 blades while I was there! It'll be interesting to see if/when I'm in the area or passing by over the coming months how that recent KY-31 overseed hangs on. People have been driving over it, etc., but I think it'll hold up.


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## M32075

Green said:


> Final day at family member house/lawn. All done! I no longer have two lawns to maintain! Did a quick trim (back, mostly) and blow in the back under the steps and some quick watering and tidying up right before the buyer and agent came! Very satisfying. Also sharpened my other 2 blades while I was there! It'll be interesting to see if/when I'm in the area or passing by over the coming months how that recent KY-31 overseed hangs on. People have been driving over it, etc., but I think it'll hold up.


Great time to sell a house the market has been crazy hot


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## Green

Mowed almost everywhere today. It had been about 1 week, so it was really overgrown. Slightly broke the 1/2 rule on many areas. Side discharge was mandatory. I believe only one frog was killed by the mower, one too many. Mowed at 4 inches again, except for far end of low-input area: 3.7. Installed the blades on both mowers prior to mowing. Unfortunately, there were so many nuts on the side front that the Toro's blade likely started to lose it's edge with just this mowing. Lawn is crazy dark...likely from the recent spray apps (Companion biofungicide 2-3-2, PGR, etc.), as well as the Potassium and Magnesium apps over the last month. It looks like the Propiconazole is starting to lose its protection...rust and other disease is threatening to make a comeback. At the same time, the low-input area, where I did not treat (especially the far end right near my reno) is getting pretty rusty. It's beyond time for some Milorganite or XGRN.


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## Chris LI

Wow, that IS some topgrowth! Do you think the pgr had any effect at all on growth? It sounds like it helped with color. Any photos?


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## kay7711226

Seems my PGR is not slowing down top growth as expected with the cooler weather, still having to cut 3 days to avoid bagging.....


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## Green

@Chris LI 
@kay7711226

Ideally I would be mowing every 4 days now, with the PGR. I think we are just in the time of year when you get a growth flush if the conditions are right. There has been enough rain for it to happen. Plus, it's not like we are totally devoid of Nitrogen, even if you haven't applied anything significant in a while. I feel like the recent non-Nitrogen nutrient boosts increased growth potential, too. They certainly helped the color.

I haven't had time for photos. I've taken some here or there and not had time to post, but nothing from this week yet.

I have to wonder if mulching the clippings recycles some of the Propiconazole back into the roots. Hopefully it does.


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## kay7711226

Is it same for north facing? I'm already losing daylight and moss growth with the constant rain, however still holding color but top growth not as extensive as the rest of the lawn.


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## Green

kay7711226 said:


> Is it same for north facing? I'm already losing daylight and moss growth with the constant rain, however still holding color but top growth not as extensive as the rest of the lawn.


Yeah, pretty much the same thing. That's where the TTTF/KBG mix is. That stuff has gotten really dark this past week, and is still growing at quite a pace. A lot like mid Spring, but much thicker and darker and no stalkiness or pollen. Arguably, this is the best it has looked all year.


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## Green

Got around 0.1 inch of rain yesterday.

Reno main area: 11x40= 440 
Approx 500 sq ft
Tenacity: 0.34 tsp
1.68 mL

No germination yet, except for overseed area.

Sprayed 5oz rate of Tenacity and max rate of Air8 on it (first time trying Air8).

Got out a new N95 mask for these spray apps.

Mowed lower side mini Reno from last year at 3.7 in.

Marked some Triv spots in the lower side and border of low input with back. Not sure if they can be treated with Sulfosulfuron successfully this time of year, but I might try it.

Put down 6-2-0, 2.5 Fe Milorganite fertilizer on low input (minus Reno areas), back, and side. 0.25 N. 4 lbs/M. Did not get to do front yet.

Drizzle, damp, cloudy, and rain all day. Heavier rain forecast to come tonight and tomorrow.


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## Green

Got some heavy rain late last night. Total was 1.06 inch. Some of the peat moss washed out and collected at the periphery of the reno area. I tried to grab as much as I could and chuck it back into the areas it came from, as some of it had seed with it. It seems like less than half of the seed probably moved...a lot of it stayed put and is now embedded in the top layer of soil from the heavy rain, so I guess the peat moss did its job.

The problem now is that the seed is no longer covered everywhere. My experience is that this tends to slow germination and growth down. I don't think I'm going to add more peat moss, though, as that would require walking all over everything, which is impossible now. Also, part of the area has standing water now. Hopefully that will absorb over the next day so. I'm not sure if it will do anything bad to the seed to be submerged at this point...I doubt it, as it hasn't started to germinate yet.

There is some water in the overseed area, which has started germinating already, but that should go down fairly fast since I dug a drainage trench for that area last year. I'm hoping the Air8 also helps the water absorb faster. The Ultramate did seem to have an effect last time, and they're similar products in many ways (both have Potassium Humates; both have KOH).

Put down preventative rate of Scotts Thiophanate Methyl fungicide on main front border overseed, which is coming in fairly well.

Goals for the weekend:

-Spray glyphosate final app on area in lower side done Sat.
-Spray Half rate Quinclorac and Tenacity mix plus NIS on low input area far end and put up application sign done Sat.
-Trimming
-Transplants
-Seeding
-Trays
-Dig out rocks in marked areas
-Pick up nuts
-Mow at least main front and upper side
-Spray fertilizer on previously transplanted areas done Sat.
-Spray Sulfosulfuron on Triv areas located the other day done Sat.
-Package soil samples
-Orders


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## Green

Continued hand watering many of the new grass areas, and germination areas (but not the reno). The reno area is still very damp, and the ground adjacent (where I sprayed today) is squishy. On the positive side, the standing water appears to be gone, so maybe the Air8 helped with that.

Didn't get to do a whole lot today, but I did a bunch of spray apps this evening:

-Glyphosate final app on area in lower side (before reseeding hopefully tomorrow)

-Mix of Tenacity and Quinclorac at about half rate each on the far end of low input area. I went heavier on any crabgrass I found, and on the low area that had a lot of clover. (I can seed TTTF/PR anytime after this app. with no negative effects.) Sprayed up to the line created by the Mulberry tree. Total area: approx. 1,000 square feet.

-Sulfosulfuron (Certainty) spot sprays on any Triv I found in that same area, as well as some parts of the low-input/reno border, a few spots at the low input/back border, a spot I found in the lower back, and some spots in the lower and middle side. Also sprayed lightly on the lower side mini reno, which will hopefully prevent Triv/annua germination (except for the shaded FF portion). Getting late in the year, but worth a shot. We'll see how the grass in the low-input area reacts to Quinclorac / Tenacity / Sulfosulfuron all at once. Maybe it'll fry the Triv. I also plan to do a follow-up Tenacity spray when I do the entire low-input area in the near future (which will be on conjunction with Fall granular pre-M, since that granular app will be late, and the Tenacity will bridge the gap).

-Miracle Grow fertilizer spray on the recently transplanted grass, as well as many of the new grass spots. I used 0.58 oz of 24-8-16 and approx. 0.14 oz of 10-52-10 Miracle Grow in about a half gallon of water. Did not spray the spot on the garage side, the one at the back/middle side border, or the one at the back/low input border, but will get those the next time.


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## Green

Raked up Hickory Nuts (time consuming) and mowed the front and side at 4 in, making use of side discharge. Mowed the sod transplant areas on the side for the first time. Upper back ground is still a total soggy mess underfoot...not sure how I'll be able to mow.

Still did not get to do the rest of the main lawn spot reseeding projects, let alone the low-input area spots.

I might have seen one single grass seed germinate in the reno area. Not sure if it was the seed I put down, or some annua/Triv, but I saw one seedling. It had been 7 days, so it's possible.

GDD calc:

Sept 16: 21.5
Sept 17: 21.5
Sept 18: 23.5
Sept 19: 18.5
Sept 20: 17.5
Sept 21: 17
Sept 22: 22
Sept 23: 24
Sept 24: 19
Sept 25: 17.5
Sept 26: 16.5
---total so far: 218.5---
Sept 27:
Goal: 255-260


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## Green

No germination apparent yet in the reno area.

Trimmed and blew in the lower back area. It had been a long time since the last trimming. Mowed the back (still soggy near garage) and the low-input area. Kinda long, as it had been 6 days. Still at 4 inches in most places. Mowed the far end of low input (that was treated a few days ago) down to 3.25 in. The area looks horrible, but that's fine, as the neighbor's lawn adjacent to it looks horrible, too (and they hardly ever mow). One or two frog casualties today; sometimes they just sit there embedded under the grass and you don't know they're there until it's too late. But several others moved out of the way.

As it got dark, I seeded some of the spots in the front. Mostly used my normal front lawn mixes, but used Rowdy TTTF seed in the more shaded areas.

Rain expected for tomorrow. Not sure how much, or if it would be the right amount to water in a product. Kinda wish I had time to do more seeding, as well as a fertilizer and pre-M app, as it's not clear if there's going to be any more rain over the next 10 days after tomorrow.


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## Green

Got about 0.16 inch of rain today.


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## Green

Dug up the areas that had PR in the lower back as best I could and used them as sod transplants for the main front. Reseeded those donor areas and watered them. Also prepped and seeded more of the spots in the main front. Did not water anything yet there. Tomorrow: watering, peat moss, Tenacity, and more spots to seed. Also fixed an area near the sidewalk. A chunk of turf/soil about 6 inches wide and irregular in shape was missing and it wasn't like that yesterday. It was a head-scratcher. At first, I thought maybe an animal dug it up. But since it was missing, and there was no way an animal would cart off (or eat) a chunk of sod and soil, I figured it had to be something else. Just doesn't happen. First, thought maybe trash people dragged a large item along the sidewalk and snagged it. Then figured it out: Neighbor's LCO must've snagged the edge with one of the zero-turn rider's blades while passing by from where he parked because it was too narrow to fit and he went up on the edge at an angle. The mower must have dragged the sod underneath after loosening it, with the scalp wheels overlapping the edge (there was a faint tire track showing the path), and then when he started up the blades, it sucked up the sod and bagged it. In order to fix it, I dug out some other sod from a couple of edges to transplant, and watered it and marked it. Will add a little soil on top tomorrow. Looked like someone took a bite out of the edge.

In other news, the KBG reno is starting to germinate, but it's not even above the soil level yet...I had to dig into the surface to see it.


----------



## M32075

Green said:


> Continued hand watering many of the new grass areas, and germination areas (but not the reno). The reno area is still very damp, and the ground adjacent (where I sprayed today) is squishy. On the positive side, the standing water appears to be gone, so maybe the Air8 helped with that.
> 
> Didn't get to do a whole lot today, but I did a bunch of spray apps this evening:
> 
> -Glyphosate final app on area in lower side (before reseeding hopefully tomorrow)
> 
> -Mix of Tenacity and Quinclorac at about half rate each on the far end of low input area. I went heavier on any crabgrass I found, and on the low area that had a lot of clover. (I can seed TTTF/PR anytime after this app. with no negative effects.) Sprayed up to the line created by the Mulberry tree. Total area: approx. 1,000 square feet.
> 
> -Sulfosulfuron (Certainty) spot sprays on any Triv I found in that same area, as well as some parts of the low-input/reno border, a few spots at the low input/back border, a spot I found in the lower back, and some spots in the lower and middle side. Also sprayed lightly on the lower side mini reno, which will hopefully prevent Triv/annua germination (except for the shaded FF portion). Getting late in the year, but worth a shot. We'll see how the grass in the low-input area reacts to Quinclorac / Tenacity / Sulfosulfuron all at once. Maybe it'll fry the Triv. I also plan to do a follow-up Tenacity spray when I do the entire low-input area in the near future (which will be on conjunction with Fall granular pre-M, since that granular app will be late, and the Tenacity will bridge the gap).
> 
> -Miracle Grow fertilizer spray on the recently transplanted grass, as well as many of the new grass spots. I used 0.58 oz of 24-8-16 and approx. 0.14 oz of 10-52-10 Miracle Grow in about a half gallon of water. Did not spray the spot on the garage side, the one at the back/middle side border, or the one at the back/low input border, but will get those the next time.


Interesting that you used miracle grow on the transplanted grass. I used Feature first time this spring wasn't to impressed was thinking of adding adding a few tablespoons of miracle grow to it that's collecting dust in my garage good or bad idea?


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## Green

M32075 said:


> Interesting that you used miracle grow on the transplanted grass. I used Feature first time this spring wasn't to impressed was thinking of adding adding a few tablespoons of miracle grow to it that's collecting dust in my garage good or bad idea?


It seems to have worked really well. I've used Miracle Gro on grass a few times over the years, probably about 5 times in the past year alone. I like how it dissolves, and the results are good. Really easy to use.


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## kay7711226

Green said:


> kay7711226 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is it same for north facing? I'm already losing daylight and moss growth with the constant rain, however still holding color but top growth not as extensive as the rest of the lawn.
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, pretty much the same thing. That's where the TTTF/KBG mix is. That stuff has gotten really dark this past week, and is still growing at quite a pace. A lot like mid Spring, but much thicker and darker and no stalkiness or pollen. Arguably, this is the best it has looked all year.
Click to expand...

Same here, north facing is out doing the rest of the lawn, full, thick, deep green back there. Soil temp is 3-4deg lower guess that explains it together with the Fert blitz.


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## Green

kay7711226 said:


> Same here, north facing is out doing the rest of the lawn, full, thick, deep green back there. Soil temp is 3-4deg lower guess that explains it together with the Fert blitz.


I think that makes sense.


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## Green

Mowed side front (except upper portion of front hill that was really dried out and wilted). 4 inches. Then re-mowed near portion from marker to side walkway at 3.75.

Prior, took delivery of the Garden Weasel medium size Nut gatherer. This helped a lot for picking up intact Hickory nuts, but not for the shells or for acorns. You'd need the small size for acorns. Shells, I picked up some by hand.

Mowed side at 4 in. Mowed low input down to 3.75 (except behind shed which is uneven, and far end, which was mowed at 3.25 inches again). Did not mow the adjacent uneven area yet to be leveled and overseeded.

Side discharged as needed.

Mowed the lower side down to 3.7. Pulled up some Poa Triv from there, but it appears to be a losing battle, as tons has germinated over the past year. Time for Tenacity this weekend, and then pull more next week.

Set zone 5 to water for 24 min x2 tomorrow morning.

Tomorrow: finish mowing, trim, seeding, and Tenacity and peat moss on seeded areas. Biofungicide/PGR.
Also this weekend: Fertilize, Pre-M/Tenacity,


----------



## Green

Finally mowed main front (4 in side discharge) and lower back (mulch).

Hand watered side front slope and main front neighbor border front corner a bit due to wilting. Sprayed Tenacity on all seeded spots, and covered the rest with peat moss. Picked up a few more nuts.

Tomorrow: finish seeding and most transplanting, mowing, trim, spray biofungicide/PGR, Tenacity, apply fert, and pre-M. Clean up patio and rest of driveway.

Rust disease is threatening to come back in the main lawn. You can see an occasional spore here or there, and some generalized yellowing as well (early disease stage). And it never went away in most of the low input area, because I never treated it there. But it isn't terrible, even there right now.

Chemlawn sprayed neighbor today.

My 9/25/21 half-rate mix of both Tenacity (~2oz/A) and Quinclorac (half normal rate) plus NIS worked...the crabgrass is totally dead now...all brown, no green left! That was a rapid kill, but I wonder if the cooler weather played a role, too. It took less than 1 week. I did spot spray heavier on the crabgrass, though. Oxalis is dying, too. Clover doesn't seem to be that affected yet.

Poa Trivialis is making a comeback in the lawn...a few areas in the main front that are obvious. A couple in the back. Will likely try Tenacity on them and then see what whitens. I pulled a plant out today, but that doesn't help much...it's a drop in a bucket. Marked a few areas in the low-input area the other day.


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## uts

The crabgrass dying fast is the quinclorac doing. I've always had excellent control with it. I use triclopyr so much more than other stuff that I compare everything to it and this seems to be miles ahead. I cam get a repeat app usually before I see triclopyr doing anything.. lol


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## Green

uts said:


> The crabgrass dying fast is the quinclorac doing. I've always had excellent control with it. I use triclopyr so much more than other stuff that I compare everything to it and this seems to be miles ahead. I cam get a repeat app usually before I see triclopyr doing anything.. lol


And this was with NIS, not MSO. But who knows, maybe tank mixing with Tenacity increased speed of control. Then again, I never saw Quinclorac work this fast when I used it this Summer during peak season...even with MSO. Usually it would discolor the CG after a week, and then take a second app after a another week or so (either more Quinclorac or Tenacity instead) to fully kill it.


----------



## Green

Today: Finished mowing (upper back at 4 in. - mulched). Letting it dry out, but was still soggy in the area near the garage.

Picked up a few more nuts with the new toy on the side front.

Put down Fall pre-emergent on the entire low-input area except for the reno area and other areas to be seeded. So, about 5,000 square feet. I used the same pre-emergent as last year: a generic version of the combo product, Team: Benefin 1.33% / Trifluralin 0.67%, by Hi-Yield ("Crabgrass Control"). I used approx. 1.68 lbs of product per thousand. Since the pre-M is late, this will be followed up with a 2.5 oz/A Tenacity spray later in the week.

Started spot spraying Tenacity on the main front, etc. Did the two bentgrass areas (one on the side, and one in the main front), and started to spray some Triv spots in the main front, but ran out. Will do more later in the week.

Put down fertilizer everywhere. Front: 0.5 lb of N from 8-1-8 XGRN. Side: same, but 0.25 lb N and K. Back: 0.50 lb of N from 24-0-4 Carbon-X. Low-input: 0.50 lb of N from Carbon-X. I'm done with any major Potassium apps now. Normally I wouldn't apply it this far into Fall even on the front, but the grass has really responded well to it over the last few months, with more density, darker color, and less disease, as well as stable growth evident. So, while I didn't do a lot of N this year on the front, the Potassium has really helped a lot, and it needed just a little more.

It started to drizzle at one point very lightly for a few minutes, making the fertilizer spreading a bit harder.

This was the first significant Nitrogen for the front since Spring. On the late side (Sept. is optimal for the first Fall app in my area, but this is a somewhat warm October, and I never got to it in Sept.) The main front hadn't had any appreciable fertilizer since May! And even then, it was only 0.5 lbs. So, it was cruising on N from then, N tied up in organic matter, and what was left of any Nitroform from last October, as well as the trace amount of N in the Companion apps. It really doesn't look too bad, but it's time push it now and counterbalance the recent Potassium with more N. The side front hadn't gotten any real N since June.

Sprayed (and finished up, I think) my glyphosate mix on a clump or two of Poa Triv in the low-input area--in the area to be leveled/overseeded later this week. Since it's late in the season, I will be using a Rye/Fescue mix for seeding in that area.

Speaking of seeding, I got another significant area seeded today: the area I killed a while back in the lower side, immediately above last year's mini reno, which was killed to prevent the spread of Poa Triv back into the existing lawn area. I quickly raked up the dead grass with the groundskeeper rake, then loosened up the soil using the garden weasel cultivator. After that, I mixed some topsoil up (using my current standard mix: Miracle Gro veg/herb "garden soil" compost, mixed with Quikrete fine grade kiln-dried sand, eyeballing the proportions and leveling it as best I could as it got dark). Then, transplanted the last of my sod tray into the lowest part of the area, and seeded the rest slightly densely with my current standard main front seed mix, 80% TTTF/10% TTPR/10% Bewitched KBG. Finally, topped with peat moss and hand watered it.

Rain is expected tonight and tomorrow. 1/2 to 1 inch is forecast. We need it, but my upper back lawn is still soggy. This will just make it worse.

Reno area is still germinating. Nothing spectacular yet. A small, green blade every so often. Two weeks since seed down.

It was dark, so as usual, no photos...yet. Next week.

I'm overdue for PGR/Biofungicide, and will apply it later in the week. It got too late today, even though it would have been ideal with the still wind.

Next: Finish seeding, Tenacity, Triclopyr ester spot spray in back, Biofungicide/PGR, trim, plant seed tray for transplant into shady area, spray gallery, tree transplant ? , Milorganite/Mg apps, go after large weeds, dig out rocks...

Zoysia in the neighborhood is still green, but appears to be starting to lose some color. It went into the upper 40s at least one night in the past couple of week so far. Most trees in the yard and neighboring yards haven't turned colors noticeably yet, but will start soon, as I saw the first hint of deep green color loss about 6 weeks ago. Not too many leaves have fallen yet...thankfully. Just a few the last few weeks. Still time to spray without dealing with tons of leaves on the grass.


----------



## Green

Rain so far is about an inch. It came down hard last night. Reno area is probably under water again.

Ordered some Rugby II KBG from the guys in TN that everyone loves to buy from on here. My previous purchase of this seed was in like 2013, so my remaining bit is no good and doesn't germinate. Unfortunately it wasn't grown at all during the past 2-3 years (I believe 2018 was the last time, and I missed out on that crop), but was finally grown and harvested again this year, so I haven't had any to use when reseeding spots in the back for several years now. That is good news that Rugby is back, since America and Bullseye are being discontinued (or more likely, already are). I will research/consider freezing some of my remaining seed to make it last longer. The discussion was interesting; I asked about the difference between sod quality seed and their 0/0 seed. The answer was that all of their 0/0 seed (they are very picky about what they accept) is, in essence, equal to gold tag seed and the implication was, from the same lots or harvests. But they don't feel the need to pay for the official certification, which costs a lot when added up over many seed types. They have their own testing done to verify the quality, and the implication was that their tests are equivalent to the best. The only time they sell gold tag is if a company sends it to them as their product, and they haven't normally had customers (including sod farms) demand the certification. That was very informative. Just keep in mind that not all retailers necessarily follow the same process. Btw, KBG in small quantities has been up around $9-10+ the past year or so for various reasons, like less acreage planted, adverse weather conditions, etc. I remember when it was $5-6, 9 years ago.

The AIR-8 bottles are terrible...I spilled some in the basement shaking the container, thinking I was going to use it. It went all over my hands (which started burning slightly from the KOH, so I had to go wash it off after a couple of minutes even though I was trying to clean it up off the floor). Concentrated dish soap and water to the rescue...I got most of it off the concrete. It appears it can eat through concrete a bit, so be careful.

Sprayed SLS on the typical problem areas in the side front. Grass is looking bad in those areas; looks like the rust is coming back (but no spores quite yet, just generalized blade yellowing/bronzing/complete loss of color). I may well have to treat that area synthetically again this week.

Checked my Wicked PR seed test last night; several seeds germinated. So, it's still good...sort of...a few out of maybe 150-200 seeds. I'll just throw it down densely when I seed this week. I only have a little left, anyway.


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## Green

Rain total from Sunday and Monday: 1.5 inches. Parts of the reno/overseed are under water. And I'm sure the upper back soil is even more waterlogged now. It was cloudy and damp all day today. Tomorrow I plan to do my spray applications, and if necessary will mow some areas prior. I also need to finish seeding if the conditions are cooperative. Anything I can't seed tomorrow will be seeded in a sod tray and put in a sunny place, and then transplanted in a few weeks.

Furthest neighbor had their huge old oak tree taken down.


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## Green

Today, just had time to mow some areas...

First, I mulched in a bunch of leaves I had collected last Winter. I had been meaning to do so for a while but never got around to it. Leaves would come down or blow in during the Winter, and on warm days, I would rake or blow and collect them, as well as picking up a few here and there that would land at the edge of the driveway, before they blew onto the lawn. By March, I had quite a few. So, I mulched them into the middle of the main front before mowing today.

After that, I took the height down to 3.75 in on the main front, front hill, and lower back. I still mowed the side and the hellstrip areas at 4 in, since PGR rebound produced a decent amount of growth in some areas, coupled with the recent rain.

Prior to mowing, I raked up nut shells from the main front border corner. I also started trimming by hand today in the front. I'll have to do more with a string trimmer tomorrow, as well as doing my spray apps, and if I can, I really want to finish seeding, as it's late (but this is a warm October, thankfully).

Took a quick look at the reno area. Most of the standing water is gone, but the soil is still highly waterlogged, which is fine. There are more green things visible now. More in some areas than others, so maybe some of the seed did shift from the first rain event. It looks like the rest of the peat moss washed out and collected at one side from the latest rain. Hopefully more germination is still occurring, otherwise it will be a thick stand in some areas for a while.


----------



## Green

Sprayed mix of PGR (0.05oz rate), Sonata biofungicide (3oz rate), and Nu-film 17 (0.5 tsp rate) on main front. Mowed rest of side front and took it down to 3.7 in. That was enough for today...much more tomorrow. Took delivery of Rugby II KBG seed to keep on hand for back lawn repairs.


----------



## Green

Did some research and confirmed via the seed registration/plant variety protection document for Firecracker SLS that it came from the same germplasm as Firecracker LS. Been wondering since it replaced it a few years ago. Then again, lots of other TTTF cultivars came from similar sources, too.

https://apps.ams.usda.gov/CMS//AdobeImages/201500359.pdf


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## Green

75F today (above normal)

Mowed the upper back at 4 in (mulch) and the upper side (took it down to 3.75; started mulching, then switched to side discharge when I noticed incomplete mulching).

Before mowing, blew small leaves off the upper side. Several large (6+ in) earthworms came out of the saturated soil due to the blower (I don't think these were the invasive jumping worms, but am not certain). So, the muddy, lumpy soil is indeed due in part to worms.

Then, finished spraying. Sprayed almost 14K of lawn!

Applied PGR (0.05oz rate) / Sonata biofungicide (3oz rate) / Nu-Film 17 (0.5 tsp rate) to the back and side. Sprayed same mix minus the PGR on the side front (and walkway grass in back and side).

Then, sprayed Tenacity (2.5oz rate*) / Sonata / NIS on the low-input area (minus the flood-prone area reno and overseed, of course). *Went heavier on the far end; not exactly a uniform application. Might apply a bit more over the coming week to the rest; not sure. Also sprayed into back neighbor's yard around 6 feet in, as usual for buffer (which I have permission to do long-term).

Will be interesting to see if the Sonata controls the (currently minor) Rust disease, now that the Propiconazole has worn off. I'm hoping it will be effective. Serenade never was effective on rust, but Sonata is labeled specifically for Rust and Powdery Mildew and nothing else, so it's supposedly exactly what I need right now for Fall. We'll see how it goes. Parts of the low-input area have minor rust. So does part of the garage side area near driveway. Tried going heavier on that area.

Also sprayed Tenacity on the lower side mini reno seeded area (no germination just yet).

Found some more Poa Triv (upper back) and marked it.

Planning to mow low input area tomorrow, less than one full day after spraying. And then finish seeding, finally. Still have time for PR, as long as the warm weather keeps up for while.


----------



## Green

Mowed the main front and front hill and hellstrip areas at 3.75 in. Mowed the lower side at 4 in. Mowed the low input area at 4 in (side discharge after blowing leaves), and the far end at 3.25. Also mowed main front neighbor border overseed area for the first time. Used the old gas mower because it was too damp to use the reel mower. It worked fine. That's all around 10,000 square feet. After that, carted/carried supplies to low input area and started mixing up topsoil to level out the low area near the far end. Used a bag and a half each of garden soil and fine sand, but will have to go back out there with several more bags in a couple of days to get it level...and then seed, finally.

Reno is stalling out (not even all germinated yet, apparently), and it appears that some seed may have washed out from the far end during those 2 heavy rain events, as the coverage there is very thin and it's thicker at the near end/middle. 20 DAS. 10 DAG (initial). Seedling height: ~1cm. Overall density: extremely low (too low to see in photos). I did blow a few leaves off of the edges of the area today, best I could do without stepping over the edge.

Picked the pumpkin that was to the left of the shed right near the Hosta.


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## Green

Yesterday's rain ended up being a trace amount, so I thoroughly watered all seeded areas. Yesterday, I hand trimmed some of the older hew grass patches for the first time with shears (and continued today and tomorrow) to get a good, clean, fairly low cut on them.

Neighbor was mowed today, and then watered this evening.

Finished mixing and putting down topsoil on the low input area far end/middle problem area this evening. Seeded by hand using a fairly heavy rate of fairly fresh (2019 crop, I believe) Sitka TTTF (an older, less refined variety but which is sturdier and more brown patch and drought tolerant than newer ones, more like KY-31, but looks better) and older, outdated Wicked Perennial Ryegrass seed with a low germination rate. Topped with peat moss, walked the seed in, and watered fairly heavily. The area is much more level now. It took about 4 bags each of sand and Miracle Gro soil, and it's still not real level, but much better.


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## Green

Mixed a gallon of full strength Sulfosulfuron (Certainty) and spot sprayed any areas with Poa Triv I could find. Several were a second app, while others were not. With the warm weather, I figured why not. If it keeps it from spreading, great. Areas sprayed were in everywhere except side front and upper side. I sprayed the entire area of last year's lower side mini reno, too. Some areas were at the borders of reseeded areas.

Speaking of seeding, I got a few more areas done (front--main front is done now). Almost done now. I investigated the area where multiple TTTF plants had cropped up since the Spring kill, looking for rhizomes. I might have found one or two from the TTTF, but nothing totally definitive this time, unlike other times. I found one KBG rhizome. If it didn't spread into the area, I suppose it could have been due to seed from the previous year or something...I didn't use a pre-M this Spring.


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## Green

Yesterday: a little hand-dethatching on the upper front hill and triangular hellstrip area.

Today: mowed front and side at 3.75. Also mowed (first real mow and first reel mow) the main front border overseed area with the Fiskars. Double cut. Mowed lower side (3.7).

Finished my seeding projects for the most part. Everything now was primarily Perennial Rye and/or heavy rates, though I did use my front mixes, as well as some Fescue, Northern mix seed, etc. I want to also see if coated seed keeps better, so I tried some of that which is old. Most of my previously seeded areas are coming in well with the warm days. Any remaining areas will likely get plugs, though I might reseed one or two more really small spots. Mixed and spread some more soil for seeding/leveling.

Set zone 5 to water for 24 min x2 tomorrow morning.

Tomorrow: 
-Sulfosulfuron spot spray (final)
-Tenacity on seeded areas
-Finish seeding
-Peat moss as needed
-Finish mowing and trim
-Fertilizer app (in progress)
-Gallery app
-Air8 on front hill dethatch area
-foliar fert on new grass.
-dig up rocks
-Markers in front
-Propiconazole spot sprays for rust


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## gm560

Green said:


> Mixed a gallon of full strength Sulfosulfuron (Certainty) and spot sprayed any areas with Poa Triv I could find.


What kind of damage do you see to the desirable turf when you do this?


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## Green

gm560 said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Mixed a gallon of full strength Sulfosulfuron (Certainty) and spot sprayed any areas with Poa Triv I could find.
> 
> 
> 
> What kind of damage do you see to the desirable turf when you do this?
Click to expand...

Interesting and timely question. This time of year, I'm actually seeing rust disease on many of the areas where I sprayed a week or two ago. Makes sense, because the ability of the plants to take up nutrients is diminished after being sprayed. I'm also getting yellowing. I plan to give these areas (and a few others that just have rust but weren't treated) a hit of Propiconazole as soon as possible to limit the disease spread, as well as keeping up with the Sonata applications. I've never tried Fall apps of Sulfosulfuron before, so we'll see how it goes. Since it has been in the 70s, I figured why not. I even experimented today by spraying into an area where i put down seed yesterday.

As far as Spring apps go, I usually get thinning, yellowing, and growth regulation. Often, the areas recover over time without needing an overseed.


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## Green

Finished mowing. Back and low input (side discharge) at 4.0 in.

Applied Sulfosulfuron (Certainty) to a few more spots in the low input area.

Sprayed Air8 in upper front hill and adjacent slope, and watered in. First time for that area. Used 2oz in a gallon or so of water.

Put down 0.5 lb of N from 24-0-4 Carbon-X fertilizer on the back and side. Hope to do the other areas tomorrow. Also applied 0.25 lb N from Milorganite (various leftover formulas) on the front.

Rust disease is increasing again, slowly. Plan is to try to keep up with fertilizing and mowing, and Sonata apps, and apply Propiconazole to spots that are really bad. Bag mow those areas if large.


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## Green

Did some bag mowing: low input near end to remove pine needles and leaves. Rust area at lower back/low input border to collect diseases clippings.

Sprayed Propiconazole on many of the disease spots to keep it from spreading. Also proactively sprayed several high pressure areas at half rate (including some of the seedling areas).

Sprayed Tenacity on rest of seeded areas. Sprayed Gallery at full rate on areas that customarily get Winter weeds, including front walk.

Trimmed in back.

Blew leaves off Reno area almost without stepping into it.

Picked up sticks. Mowed side front (including garage side) at 3.75 and mulched leaves in.

Put down fertilizer on front (minus hellstrip areas). Carbon-X. A bit higher than 0.5 N total rate. Possibly 0.75. May have some areas with too much fert, as spreader is breaking, and leaked. I can't spread evenly with it anymore, and have to fill with a bucket due to the leak. Only a matter of time before a big mishap. Also applied to low input area.

No more seeding; will resume in March or April. Though I might try to seed a pot or two with PR for transplant this year (not trays) still.

Waiting for rain now.


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## Green

Got at least 0.15 inch of rain last night, but probably closer to 0.2, so enough to get most of the fertilizer into the soil.

Tested main front and side zones. Highest head (along front walk) in zone 2 would not activate. Suspected and confirmed a pressure issue. Shut off side heads (lowest ones on the zone), and it popped up. Replaced the existing 3.5 dark blue nozzle in lowest of the two side heads with a 3.0 dark blue. Upper head on that side has a 3.5LA and is kind of low in the ground, but the main problem appears fixed for now. Also replaced the covers on the two side heads, which were wearing out and allowing soil and grass roots in. Will need to audit these zones next Spring.

Reminder: check your heads every so often.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for a total of 1 hour each (in 2 increments) tomorrow morning (about a half inch). Zone 2 already ran for 15-20 min today.


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## Green

Got a trace amount of rain today (maybe 0.03 inch or so). Just enough to water the seeded areas. Starting to get a few germinations in some of the latest-seeded areas. Also noticed a larger-than-normal (~3/4-inch tall), slightly-tillered seedling in the reno area. Figured it couldn't be anything good. Pulled it up. It was a Poa Triv, confirmed by the ligule and string test. It had a spot of rust disease on it, too. I should probably treat the reno area with something soon to prevent a rust outbreak. I also think it can probably handle a tiny bit of fert, as some of the blades are starting to come out of the pout phase.

High temps were in the 50s today. Haven't seen that in a while. Frost projected for next weekend.

Set zone 5 to water for 21 min x3 tomorrow morning (around 0.39 inch).


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## Green

Started mowing: Did lower back, side, and part of main front at 3.75 in, with side discharge as needed. Leaves are really starting to get noticeable when mowing now. 70s today and tomorrow! New grass is coming along well where it has already germinated. Lawn getting a bit rusty/fungusy, so antsy to get biofungicide applied. Looks like the Propi plus bag mow on the bad spots stopped the infection from proceeding already. Reno area is ok; starting to come out of pout, slowly. Still looks like dirt with a little green tinge from a distance, though. Will have to get photos soon. At least the leaves are holding off from coming down too rapidly.


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## Green

Finished mowing front (including border overseed area) after raking and sweeping nuts and branches (3.75/3.7). Mowed lower side - 3.2 and pulled some Triv at border with low input. Tested zone 5. Hand-applied fertilizer (Carbon-X) to hellstrip areas and upper front hill and side front bad spots (eyeballed amount). Nextdoor neighbor had seed put down (looks like PR/KBG mix) in the last couple of days apparently...the company always leaves small piles in front of the yards in the street for me to sweep up and throw back into their lawn. So sloppy.

Set zone 5 to water for 20 min x4 tomorrow morning (around a half inch).


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## Green

Mowed near two-thirds of low-input area at 4 inches, only using side discharge to move leaves and then mulching most of it. Between the lack of rain, Tenacity, and bit of disease such as rust, the grass is growing pretty slowly. Most likely, the previous fert app hasn't yet been entirely watered in to get down deep into the soil. With a large amount of rain expected for Monday at this point and limited time this weekend, there is no point in watering between now and then. But, I guess I'm going to have to go easy on the next fert drop because there's likely a backlog of N in the top half inch or so of soil, and once it gets watered in, will produce a flush of growth I'm guessing. Plus, the salt content in those upper soil layers might get too high from the AMS building up if I use just as much as usual this weekend. A lot of the grass (mostly fine fescue) in the shadier area has been browning for a month or two. The fertilizer apps have apparently not been sufficient to get it to perk up yet, but I may go slightly heavier on that area if we are truly getting getting an inch plus of rain in a few days. Lower calcium levels this past year might be playing a role, but the same happened last year from what I remember. I'm being careful to mow high and try not to mulch leaves into the ground in that area.

Also re-mowed the main front to mulch up the few leaves and get the grass lower. 3.7 in with old mower (which is maybe actually 3.6 in reality).


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## Green

Sprayed Miracle Gro in main front, garage side, and lower back on a few new grass areas and rusty areas. Sprayed old mixed Triclopyr ester from this Summer on some clover (including in main front) and broadleaf weeds like violet. Looking forward to any collateral damage to Triv.

Sprayed mix of PGR (0.02 oz rate) / Sonata Biofungicide (4 oz rate) / Nu-Film (0.5 tsp rate) on main front (minus the border overseed area). Trace amount of rain this AM and again now.

Tomorrow:
-Photos
-Trimming (front and back)
-Pick up nuts/shells, sticks, etc.
-Measure and document area next to patio
-Mow side front, side, and back
-Finish mowing low input
-Final blitz fertilizer app in back and second to last in front; final app on low input area
-Dig up and replace areas in upper back and low input area
-Blow leaves off Reno area
-Apply first app of fert and pre-M to reno
-Spray 1/2 rate of AIR8 on reno
-Plant PR pot(s)
-Transplants
-Tree


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## Green

New plan:

No fertilizer, except maybe on Reno area (because 3-5 in of rain now expected, which is too much)

Mow, spray rest of main lawn; clean off Reno area and spray AIR8 + Miracle Gro.

-----------------

Mowed back and side at 3.7 with some side discharging, plus double mowed main front overseed area down to 3.2 in. Blew leaves off Reno area. Sprayed PGR (<0.25 tsp) / Sonata biofungicide (4 oz) / Nu-Film (0.5 tsp) on each of those areas. Used extra on parts of low input. Supposedly the Nu-film needs some light to cure, which it did not get. I never found out whether this is actually necessary, but I can reapply the Sonata again in a week or so, regardless.

Didn't get to mow or spray the side front or apply anything to the Reno area, but if weather holds, maybe tomorrow evening.


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## Green

Rain total was 2.86 in as of 1:30PM or so. Still more rain to come, though. Flooded out!

I think I might to pre-germinate some PR seed over the next couple of days. Don't think I have cheesecloth, though. Not sure how I'd do it.


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## Green

Cecked the rain gauge today to see how much additional rain we received. It said 0.76 in, but the wind probably evaporated more than 0.05 inch, so it had to be at least 0.8 inch, if not 0.9 or even 1.0. I guess I'll say 0.8. So, that means we got at least 3.66-3.7 inches of rain from the entire storm, counting yesterday's and today's totals.


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## Green

Mowed the entire front at 3.7 in. Bagged the side front because it was long, damp, no fungicide app yet, etc. Mulch mowed the main front. Raked up sticks and some nuts and leaves prior.


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## Green

Mowed the upper hack (bagged), side (bagged), and lower back (discharge) at 3.7. And near 2/3 of low input at 3.75 (discharge and mulch). Behind shed at 4 in. Did not get to do far end. Seed is germinating everywhere. Hopefully will survive.

Some rust in many places; good reason to bag mow. But it's controlled this year, not out of hand like last year.

Put down final blitz N on lower back: 0.25 lb of total N from Carbon-X. Might want to overlap when applying to side next week as it came up a bit short.

Put down my still experimental early "Winterizing" app from last year, on 2 areas that get cold the soonest: upper back and far half or so of low input area (3,000 square ft, not Reno area, etc.)...borders: applied up to base of behind-shed slope and open/overseeded area near back neighbor boundary. Altered the blend this time by doubling the amount of GreenMax. 2 lbs of GreenMax, 1 lb of Lebanon, and 0.65 lb of Nitroform per thousand square feet this time. All 3 mix very nicely in a bucket as they are about the same size. Around 1 full lb of N.

Put down first fertilizer on the Reno and adjacent overseed area, plus the buffer zone between them, totaling 1K area. Used 3 lbs of Jonathan Green starter fert with Tupersan pre-emergent herbicide. 10-15-10. 0.3 lb N and K; 0.45 lb of P. Probably the only fert it'll get until Spring, unfortunately. Area is deficient in both P and K per soil test.

Finally, sprayed the AIR-8 app on the area as well, at full rate, 9 oz in 1.5 gal of water.

Used the residual AIR8 on the upper front hill.

1 inch of rain is expected tomorrow. Still no time for photos.


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## Green

Got 1.2 inches of rain yesterday and last night. Today was the last day in the 60s (65) for a while. Still 62 at this hour.

Happy Halloween!


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## Green

Mulch mowed. Main front (oversees areas at 3.2), side (lower side at 3.2), and lower back at 3.25 inches with the Toro. Side front and garage side at 3.6 with the old mower. Forgot to mow the rectangular hellstrip area.

Default neighbor was mowed today.

Then applied my final blitz fertilizer app to the side front as it got dark (but not the garage side beyond the beginning of the walkway). Used about 1.75 lbs of Carbon-X, which equates to around 0.28 lb of actual fast release N (because Carbon-X is a 20% fast release fert). Scotts spreader worked ok at setting 3. Normally, blitz apps wouldn't go this late (early Nov.) here, but the weather has cooperated. First frost is typically mid Oct., but we still haven't had one yet (likely tonight...but if not, then the following morning for sure). Still hit about 60F today (and grass was growing strong even in the back until about a week ago), but rest of the week supposed to be 50s daytime and 30s at night.

Set zone 5 to water for 20 min x2 tomorrow morning...strictly to water in the fertilizer.

Will repeat the same thing for the rest of the front and the side tomorrow night.

Grass is overall good except for some minor rust. Nothing like last year, due to early use of fungicides this year.

Done with PGR. Will let grass grow out naturally over the next few weeks. Any rebound will help push out rust disease, ideally. Will consider bagging again on next week's mow, if necessary.


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## Green

Last night: put down final blitz fertilizer app. ~0.25 lb of actual fast release N from Carbon-X on the main from. And then started to apply to the side, but ran out in the middle of it. Goal was 0.50 lb of actual fast release N there. I grabbed the Scotts Greenmax and added another pound or so of fert to finish up, especially the outer half of the side. Also applied 0.75-1.0 full pound of N on the lower side (mini reno from last year). The side has the worst rust, etc.

Watered the main front and upper-middle side this morning to water it in: 30 min on zone 1, and 40 min on zone 2. Then just now manually watered the middle to lower side with 0.3-0.45 inch of water with the impact sprinkler.

Shut off the back faucet for the 2nd night in a row, and ran all sprinkler zones quickly to check each head. Then turned off the water inside, and drained and opened the faucets on the system.


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## M32075

Interesting you did carbon x so late in the season I was thinking about putting down some Scotts turf builder I had laying around last week chickened out now I'm regretting it.


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## Green

M32075 said:


> Interesting you did carbon x so late in the season I was thinking about putting down some Scotts turf builder I had laying around last week chickened out now I'm regretting it.


Yeah, I used it like regular urea/AMS, just taking the fast release portion into account. I wasn't interested in getting anything out of the organic portion this Fall. That will do something for the soil mid Spring into Summer, and will keep me from needing to apply much of anything for quite a while next Spring. No brainer.

You should still put it down, in zone 7A. You could probably have 2 more weeks if you want. This is a warm Fall.


----------



## M32075

My next question is I suffered with major snow mold last spring light raking and a shot of fertilizer fixed it . If I put the Scott's down now then again as my winterizer and I get snow mold again is another shot of early spring fertilizer necessary or enough nitrogen stored to repair snow mold.


----------



## Green

M32075 said:


> My next question is I suffered with major snow mold last spring light raking and a shot of fertilizer fixed it . If I put the Scott's down now then again as my winterizer and I get snow mold again is another shot of early spring fertilizer necessary or enough nitrogen stored to repair snow mold.


No, you shouldn't need more in the early Spring. Just do the raking, and then let things warm up and it'll recover just fine.

I'm doing a final winterizer app on most areas this year, too, unlike last year. I always use GreenMax for that one. I think it's still the better method to do the late app if you can do it. But you really only need 0.7 lb of N, max, not 1.0 like they used to say. Also, better to be a tiny bit early in my experience. I used to wait too long (well into Dec.). I might still publish results of my experiment from last year on this site before 2022. But it's a lot to compile. The takeaway was that I think I got slightly better results from the final winterizer app versus the early app/experimental method I tried. It was no more than a 20% performance boost or so, but that makes the difference sometimes. This year, I think it'll be no later than the first week of Dec. here, but possibly earlier. I had a neighbor that did it in Nov. last year, and had amazing results. It was someone who knows how to garden but doesn't really care about the lawn a lot, and only fertilizes once or twice a year. He threw it down because he had it. It was the greenest lawn in the neighborhood in the Winter and early Spring, no joke. Part of my experiments involve looking at what others do and their results. We'll see how it goes this year.


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## Green

Today: blew the leaves around that were stuck to the ground on the Reno area (from the rain). I'm using them as a blanket to help protect the baby grass from the cold, so I'm not re,loving them yet, but they had to get unstuck first. Also pulled another Poa Triv seedling from the area. The rain and wet ground has done a number on the seedlings...they are very stunted and sparse and kind of embedded in the wet soil.

Pulled a few bigger Poa Triv plants from other lawn areas, including the main front border overseed area, which is looking pretty good now overall. (Some of the front and back late reseeded spots are still thin.) Spritzed Tenacity on a few of those border Triv spots. My herbicide spot apps seem to be working well to slow the Triv down considerably this Fall.


----------



## Green

Had sprinkler system blown out (irrigation winterized) today. So did another neighbor. I saw a third neighbor doing his himself last week, while some others have had theirs done over the past few weeks. Tech said he's more than half done at this point. Complimented the grass. I had drained everything the other night and covered the backflow preventer with a garbage bag.

Also turned off and opened the front faucet and checked the hose connection. I should check the backflow covers one of these days.

Dates from this and previous years:

Nov. 5th, 2021 (on the warmer side this Fall)
Oct. 30th, 2020 (abnormally cold)
Oct. 28th, 2019
Nov. 8th, 2018
Nov. 7th, 2017
Nov. 16th, 2016
Nov. 17th, 2015

Average date of winterization: Nov. 7th.


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## Green

Spritzed a bunch or Dandelions and some other broadleaf weeds, mostly in the lower back, using 2,4-D/3-way. Had no idea there were so many. Probably 15 or so, but the grass was keeping them hidden and in check; many never even flowered this year. Also spritzed a few of the Triv patches with Tenacity.

To-do list:

-Check soil temps
-Change mower blade
-Blow leaves
-Mulch leaves in
-Spray FAS
-Bag mow and reduce HOC 
-Trim and weed
-Spray Triclopyr on clover and violets
-Spot spray Propiconazole on small rust patches
-Spray biofungicide

-Photos
-Mark sprinklers

-Transplant grass
-Dig up rocks and level
-Tree
-Mulch
-Clean up patio area


----------



## Green

Mowed the front at 3.6 in (not including garage side) mostly to mulch leaves. Double mowed side front, bagging the second time as there were a lot of leaves. Plan is to do a low rate N, P, K and Iron spray app on those areas tomorrow, and resume the leaf cleanup, etc. I don't have any AMS left, apparently, so can't do a true FAS app right now. Fixed side front slope edge driveway vehicle tire damage. Temps will be slightly warmer tonight than the past few nights: 34F low rather than 29/30, etc.


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## Green

Peak leaf drop now. Can't keep up.

There were tons of leaves on the flood prone reno area, the far end, etc. Blew them off and picked them up with the mower, and then scattered them on the near half of the low-input area for mulching. Just got done.

Right now, the plan looks like: finish the low-input area, and then wash the mower, change the blade, and work on the main lawn areas. I need to mow the grass shorter, bag everything from the main lawn areas due to rust disease, and then start spraying (Triclopyr and then disease sprays including maybe Propiconazole on a few bad spots). First order of business is to paint marks where the sprinkler heads are, so they won't be damaged accidentally. I will have more time tomorrow.


----------



## Green

Slight plan change today. Changed old mower's blade for the gator, and then started to mow front (did side front and near driveway half of main front). Much more mowing to come tomorrow, and then rain expected Thurs. night/Fri. So, looks like I won't get to spray for a while due to wind, rain, etc. Did the next best thing though...bagging all clippings to remove rust disease. Lowered HOC setting to 3 inches or so.

Before mowing, marked edge sprinkler heads with paint.

--------------

Planning to finish mowing front (edges, hellstrip areas, and other half of main front), then do back and sides, all bagged. Then near half of low input (mulch). Then blow leaves in Reno area, mow far half, and apply iron for moss wherever there isn't baby grass, and then spray tank mix of Miracle Gro and AIR-8.

Thursday: trim, hand trim (including reseed spots).


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## Powhatan

Green said:


> Changed old mower's blade for the gator, and then started to mow front ...


Gator better than the Toro Atomic for mulching leaves?


----------



## Green

Powhatan said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Changed old mower's blade for the gator, and then started to mow front ...
> 
> 
> 
> Gator better than the Toro Atomic for mulching leaves?
Click to expand...

Oh yeah. Waaaay ahead of it. You should have seen what I did in just an hour this evening.

To me, the Toro is a hybrid between a high lift and a mulching blade.


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## Green

Lots of leaves.

Finally mowed upper back. Bag mowed at 3.6 in.

Mulched/ side discharged leaves in the front at the same HOC setting. Not done yet. Resume tomorrow.


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## Green

Today:

First thing was applying fertilizer to my coastal CT family member lawn (Zone 7a). I used 0.50 lb/M of N from Scotts 32-0-12 "step 4" (1.75 lbs over a bit more than 1K area). This wasn't a true winterizer app, as it's probably 3.5+ weeks too soon for that in the area; more of a one-off final blitz app, but it will serve essentially the same purpose as a winterizing app, experience tells me, as it's close enough in time. I hadn't fertilized that lawn in a long time. Normally, we'd want to do this by early Nov., but the area is about a week behind average (warmer) this year (more like 2 weeks where I live). Remarkably, there was will a tree (not sure if it was Oak or Maple) with all green leaves.

At home: worked on mowing/leaf cleanup. Gave the lower back its first mow in quite a while, lowering to around 3 inches. Same with the side, except that I had to increase the HOC to the next level for much of the middle and lower side, as it was too long to mow down to 3 in. (Last mow on that area had been Nov. 1, ten days ago, and there were some warm days during that time, so it grew a fair amount.) Also finished mowing the front at the same HOC as the lower back. All this was bagged due to rust disease. I also re-mowed much of the front (done yesterday) to mulch in leaves, forgetting only to mow the triangular hellstrip area. Those areas are being mowed at 3.6 in. Also did the garage side at that HOC. Finally, tackled the low input area. Blew leaves out of the reno/flood-prone area, then picked them up with the mower. Continued scattering much of them elsewhere in low input for mulching. Mowed much of the rest of the far end down to 2.6 in in case I can't mow it again this year due to soggy ground. Did intermediate area at 3 in, including mowing the TTTF overseed area for the first time. Then did the rest of the low input area at 3.75 in with the Toro, except for the uneven shaded part behind the shed, which I continued mowing at 4 in. Plan for Spring is to level and overseed that area.

Finally, I mixed AIR-8 at near max rate (~8 oz), and added in roughly 0.17 lb/M of N from 24-8-16 Miracle Gro, and sprayed the mix on the entire flood prone area, including reno, overseed, and buffer zone. I swear AIR-8 (and Ultramate, too, which I use instead sometimes) really helps with drainage if applied before rain. Reno is not developing well; baby grass is stunted due to too much moisture. It's going to be a continued battle to overseed and push for fill-in this Spring, while combating excessive moisture, flooding/ponding, and moss.


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## Green

Ended up getting a total of 1.1 in of rain late last night and this morning. The usual areas are now flooded and there was also wind, so a whole more leaves came down. Some trees even lost almost everything. We'll see how long the flood prone area water takes to dry out and absorb this time. But more rain could be on the way tomorrow.


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## Green

Checked soil temps in the main lawn, finally. Back is around 50F give or take mid day (4 in), and front is 50F and higher. I guess these are highs for the day.

Just had a strong thunderstorm come through around 4PM. Had a nearby lightening strike, hail, wind, etc. Thankfully no tornado here, but some power outages. My neighbor finished mowing right before it began. NWS never issued an actual warning, just a watch. The storm dumped more rain, so more flooding now. It might rain more over the next couple of hours.

Got another 0.3 inch of rain from the storm.


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## Green

Did a real quick leaf mulching on the front hill, hellstrip areas, and part of the side front near the border. Sprayed my excess watered down AIR-8/fertilizer mix on the upper side front. Mixed Triclopyr ester (a little weak) plus NIS and sprayed mostly near border of side front. Left it in the sprayer for now. Picked up sticks from the storm.


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## Green

Today, mulched leaves in the main front after blowing off the driveway, part of side front, and road. Utilized side discharge in the process.


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## kay7711226

Green said:


> Checked soil temps in the main lawn, finally. Back is around 50F give or take mid day (4 in), and front is 50F and higher. I guess these are highs for the day.
> 
> Just had a strong thunderstorm come through around 4PM. Had a nearby lightening strike, hail, wind, etc. Thankfully no tornado here, but some power outages. My neighbor finished mowing right before it began. NWS never issued an actual warning, just a watch. The storm dumped more rain, so more flooding now. It might rain more over the next couple of hours.
> 
> Got another 0.3 inch of rain from the storm.


Crazy right, only woke up to the news without any expectations!


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## Green

Today, finished mulching leaves in main front, then bag mowed the front at 3 in setting. Collected the rest of the leaves and grass clippings with disease lesions. Got about 1/3-1/2 inch of growth since last mow a week ago.


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## Green

Warm days: today was 66F, and nights have only gone into the upper 40s the last few nights, but colder air is coming in as I type.

Bag mowed back and most of sides at 3 in setting. Mulch mowed lower/middle side after removing leaves at max HOC (and relocating to low input area for future mulch mowing), as there was substantially less disease there. Got clippings similar to the front from the lower back and side. Took upper back down to the 3 in setting for the first time (final HOC on the area, so got a lot of clippings (with rust disease on some). Removed a good amount of rust diseased blades. Grass is probably still growing even here for now.

Blew leaves off various areas, including flood prone area, then picked up using mower. Relocated some for mulching. Bag mowed adjacent far end at 3 in HOC (higher than previous mow) this week, and still got some clippings (ground was also quite soggy still).

Started mulch mowing low input area near far end (max HOC with old mower).

Mixed up AIR-8 at 5oz per thousand rate plus 4oz of standard Miracle Gro (one yogurt cup full - around 0.07-0.125 lb of N per M), but sprayer is losing seal...need to regrease. So calibration was off, and it mostly got applied to the reno area and buffer zone (therefore, near full rate). Started to rain.


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## Jeff_MI84

@Green are you taking the HOC down lower or leaving it as is?


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## Green

Jeff_MI84 said:


> @Green are you taking the HOC down lower or leaving it as is?


Probably going to do my final mow at 2.75 in at least some areas, and leave it where it is in others (the back TTTF tends to scalp easily, as do very uneven areas). I think that's what I did last year. I'll have to look back to see what I did where.


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## Jeff_MI84

Oh okay.


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## Green

Got at least 0.1 inch of rain last night, and a bunch more leaves came down. Tonight: going into the upper 20s. Shut off the front water just in case.


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## Green

Wow, still on the front page after 3 days as the season slows...

Yesterday: Mowed the majority of the low input area and mulched a large amount of leaves in. Down to 3.6 inches now. Definitely took something off, but didn't measure as I didn't bag. Raked a few remaining leaves.

Today: Got at least 0.1 inch of rain last night. I like the light rains. A little flooding...and of course some areas are very soggy.


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## Green

Mulched leaves in main front real quick.


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## Green

Got a trim and mow in on the lower back. Bag mowed at ~3in, including the upper back up to the steps, and the border where the natural area meets grass. Once again, I got clippings (0.25-0.5 inch). One week since the prior mow.

At family member coastal CT lawn: checked soil temps. Roughly 40F, maybe 42. Neighboring lawn has a lot of Zoysia. Still a hint of green left in the Zoysia blades.


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## Green

Got around 0.1 inch of rain today plus some snow flurries at one point. First of the season.

Picked up a bag of Scotts GreenMax fertilizer (my favorite formula to use as a final Winterizer fert).


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## Green

Cold like Winter today...high was around 40, but in the very late afternoon, it was 34-35F.

Neighbor in back mowed and mulched leaves today. Very surprised. Usually quits before October. Had not done anything in weeks.

Overall, lawns are not holding color well this Fall. At the moment, mine is one of the best. Last year, it was pretty bad. Only thing that changed was more Potassium (even into the Fall) this year.

Neighbor 11 lawn was fertilized on 11/22. We'll see how it looks in March versus other timings. Experiments continue...


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## Green

Warm enough to get out and work on leaves. Used the mower to bag up leaves from the side front and upper back, and relocated them to the side where I mulched them in, and the low input area. Got a few clippings despite not lowering the deck to the previous mow height for a true mow.

Grass especially in back where it's more shaded is losing color and stiffness. Also has a good amount of brown from disease damage. (Amount of active disease may be decreasing as it gets colder.)

Trying to figure out if there's enough rain coming late week for a final winterizing N app.


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## Green

Mulched leaves in lower back. Not many, so they often flew everywhere out from the mower. Then dropped deck and bag mowed grass and remaining leaves. Did the same with upper back, except bagged most of the leaves (except near shed and house where I mulched) and ended up triple mowing the area due to deck height error.

Mower engine started to smoke. Checked and cleaned air filter, checked oil level, and added a bit of seafoam to the gas tank. It turned out that mulched leaves had gotten into the engine area and were burning up; blew it out well and problem was solved.

Started the side. Did other (garage) side with bag mowing at top height. Bag mowed side front. Started to mulch leaves in main front. Plan to finish mowing tomorrow; hoping for dry ground.

HOC: ~3 in setting. Grass clippings were cut off in all areas. Nothing crazy long, but had slight growth even in back. Clippings mostly 1/8 to 1 inch, but a few longer and shorter ones.

Dandelions are damaged but still green.

Got a small bag of Anuvia fertilizer (from domyown since no one local seems to sell it) to finally try out for next year. Very interested to see how it works.


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## Green

Trace amount of rain overnight. And again this afternoon, but I got to mow as it was just a bit damp. Wind increased toward the end of mowing...

Finished mowing and leaf cleanup for the week. Front and rest of the side. Mowed at ~3in setting again, and bagged the grass and leaves as I've been doing the last few weeks. Got clippings, but not a ton (just like the other areas yesterday). I think this may have been the last true mow for the year. (Will likely do one more over the next week or so to get the grass just under 3 inches in some areas.)

Also mowed most of the near part of the low input area, mulching leaves in the process (3.6 in). In addition, mowed the uneven area behind the shed for the first time in a long time (at 4 in with the Toro because the ground is so uneven). Mulched the leaves there as well.

Hand trimmed near hellstrip areas and utilities in the front.

Tonight, got some wind gusts (with some rain) which brought down more leaves and some sticks (mostly in the back), so it's no longer clean like it was earlier today.


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## Green

Yesterday: checked soil temps. 40F on average. Not lower, but some places higher.

Today: blew leaves off back lawn and adjacent hardscape and bed areas into natural area and also low input area and then mulched them in. Picked up sticks.


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## Green

Sprayed final app of biofungicide (Sonata - 4oz rate) w/ Nu-Film (0.5 tsp rate) on upper and lower back at 3PM, so it had a chance to dry properly. Gave the P95 mask a try. Seemed to work pretty well despite the valve. Didn't really smell a lot of the spray.

Then later, blew leaves from the side front plus bed edges, to the main front.

Then mulched leaves on the main front and the adjacent side.

Brought in one of the front hoses. Only one each left in both front and back now.


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## Green

Got 0.2 inch of rain last night. Surprised it was at the higher end of the predicted range. If I had had time to do the fertilizer, it might have worked out. Then again, there is a lot of wind today, so whatever didn't get watered in would volatilize with the damp ground. More rain is predicated tonight, but only 0.01-0.1 inch is likely. We'll see. In any case, there will likely be another rain chance later in the week, and the soil is still above 40F, so there is still time.


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## Green

Snow melted. It was still a little damp, but managed to mow the lower back and the side in order to get the leaves picked up. Got a little bit of clippings from the lower back, but even less from the side. Growth is pretty much over, so that was my sign to put down my final N fertilizer.

Put down final winterizer fertilizer app on the lower back, side, front, (and low input from back neighbor ornamental grass opening to shed to lower back border to near end, which I know is around 3K).

I actually wanted to do this app a little earlier in the year, 1-2 weeks ago, because I have anecdotal evidence that slightly earlier might actually be more effective (plus all the research from turf programs). But I didn't think there was going to be enough rain last week. Didn't want a lot of the N volatilizing away...it's pretty damp and will be windy the next couple of days.

0.2-0.35 inch of rain is expected on the weekend, perfect for watering in.

I used 0.67 lb of N from my standard formula I've been using for years now: Scotts 27-0-2 GreenMax. 0.2 lb of the N will be immediately available from AMS. The rest is urea and methylene urea, and provides a graduated slower release N between now and when the ground freezes in Jan, with a little residual left for Spring greenup. The fast release urea needs to be converted to ammonium via hydrolysis, which takes 1-2 weeks in this weather. The shorter chain, high-activity methylene urea fractions work over the following few weeks. And the longer medium-term and long-term (moderate activity) fractions break down over the next few months, into March, whenever temps rise high enough for bursts of microbial activity during Winter thaws. It's the most effective Winterizer formula I've ever used for my area, which is why I stick with it now (including subjectively better results those with 46-0-0 fast release, time after time). The graduated, temperature dependent release and conservative application rate also ensure that I don't overload my soil with N, or have a lot that gets wasted and runs off, so it's also better environmentally than throwing a full lb of fast release out in cold temps.

Went slightly heavier on the damaged lower side. I removed 8 lbs of fert from my new bag. Had trouble with the Scotts spreader, as usual. Can't wait until I have a better one!

I will likely post last year's experimental data sometime this Winter. It takes a while to sort through.


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## Green

Got a tenth of inch of rain so far as of early afternoon. After a lull, we are supposed to get another batch. High is near 60 today...unseasonably warm.

Total rainfall as of tonight: 0.2 in. Just barely enough to properly water in the low SGN Scotts fert. Still 56F at 12AM. Rain is done; very windy now.


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## Green

Mowed and bagged leaves in the front. Very few clippings; grass is done growing. Same setting; ~3in. I'd still like to shorten it down one more notch for Winter.

Decided to rake some of it after mowing to try to unmat it. I also changed the blade in the old mower today before mowing, to a sharp blade. Hoping these things as well as the final mow help retain some color. For some reason, there are a bunch of brown or partly brown blades. I have only mowed on warm days with high nighttime temps following, for the last month. I also applied at least 3 lb/M of actual Potassium this year, and more than that in Nitrogen, so I'm not sure why it's struggling again this year to retain color as it gets cold. It's better than last year, but still not great.

There are a couple of other lawns nearby holding color better, that I believe used less fertilizer (or certainly not more). And the area on the upper front hill that I did an extra app on this year (and sprayed a lot last Fall with N) is holding better than the rest of the front. Still not sure why this is...I thought I had adequate fertility this year generally. Maybe not. Maybe another half pound of N would have improved it.

Or maybe my grass cultivars just aren't great at keeping color in the cold. I don't have a lot of Ryegrass anymore; that seems to hold color well in Winter. I still have the opportunity hit it with Ferrous ammonium sulfate after the final mow. Maybe that will help with color retention.

It could also be because I mow high most of the year. Not sure.


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## Green

Got a trace amount of rain last night. 60F today. Almost 20 degrees higher than average.

Mowed again. Shortened the front hill, flat part of side front up to marker, and main front down to 2.7 in HOC, and re-mowed the edges, hellstrip areas (3.7), and side (3 in). Perpenducular to driveway this time. Got virtually no clippings from the side. Grass does look slightly greener after cutting off some brown. Will see if it holds, given the sharp blade this time (and warm temps tonight).

Just have the low input area left to shorten.

Hand trimmed the border behind deck, near grill, and near stone wall for the final time this year as well.

Took in the other back hose.


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## Green

Got about 0.25 inch of rain yesterday. Currently this weekend, highs are in the 30s (with wind chill today).

Two days ago, met another TLF local member and obtained a very useful piece of equipment for next year and beyond. Realized I was experiencing some symptoms at the same time, and was able to seek prompt treatment that evening, thankfully.


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## Green

Blew leaves off of upper back (enough to be annoying), and lower back and side (just a few). Upper back ground felt frozen underfoot. Temp dropped to 36F toward the end and lawn just started getting slightly stiff as I was finishing up, so I got the heck off it.


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## Green

Got about 0.10 inch of rain last night, maybe a bit less.

Today: last time mowing this afternoon. Not because anything grew recently, but because I hadn't gotten to the low-input area in a while! hadn't mowed the area since Dec 2nd, and even then I never shortened it for Winter. Don't think it really grew at all in 3-4 weeks. Normally I don't mow beyond Fall, lol...it's the second day of Winter today, but was 48F, so took advantage.

Mowed the near half or so of the low input area: 
-Area behind shed: 3.75 and side discharge into the lawn with the Toro.
-Then some blowing (careful of the wind!)
-Then down to 3.25 and mowed most of the remaining part of that half of the lawn, mulching in lots of leaves at the same time.
-Took out the old mower and mowed the part near back neighbor border which had new grass and was soft.
-Rest of the lawn area didn't look good enough, so went back over most of a second time, but with this mower, cutting it slightly lower (3 in) for Winter. Finally, it looked clean.

Also washed out 3 spreaders today and let them air dry in the wind: The new (monster) spreader, the Scotts mini (which was caked with soil and grass seed from the Fall), and the spreader my grandpa used to own (since his property had a lot of weeds, I didn't want to take a chance).


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## Green

Grass is now dormant, and looks it. Hopefully I can get a photo soon. It's Winter, and beginning to feel like it. 3 months of cold, here we come.

Cleaned nuts out of car engine area and charged battery for first time.


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## Green

Had some snow coating and then light rain last night (white Christmas). Now back to green...

Need to clean out equipment this week.


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## Green

Picked up some sticks in front, put down mulch around Hickory for first time, and started putting away supplies in shed.

Contemplating one more final mow in the front this week before cleaning and running out the mowers, if weather cooperates. Not sure that anything will be cut, however. Or if it'll even be dry/warm enough to do it. Never mowed that late.


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## Green

Got 0.2 inch of rain over the last couple of days.

Well, I was right. There was still one more mow left in the front. I've never mowed this late in the year. It was very damp; any more damp and it would have been wet. But I was able to do it. Was it really necessary? No. But I got it trimmed up, sucked up some leaves, and got exercise.

Mowed the front (except side front driveway slope). 2.6 in again; mowed the main front, middle of side front, and front hill parallel to driveway. Close portion of side front in the perpendicular direction mostly. Skipped the driveway slope of the side front, to prevent mower wheel indentations and minimize erosion of the soil.

Got 1/4 to 1/3 of a bag full of clippings just from the front (which had been mowed last on 12/16, 2 weeks ago). Lawn isn't the greenest in the area right now, but is holding up well going into Winter.

Photo of clippings from the front (South-facing area):









Mowed the garage side at max height and other side at the lower height (hadn't mowed lower than 3 in previously there, but even so, not a lot got cut off, as it hasn't gotten a lot of sun the past couple of weeks). Now that we're past the shortest day of the year, I felt ok about reducing the leaf surface area.

Mowed hellstrip areas and edges at max height.

Also hand trimmed across front.

Last mow, last day of the year! Done mowing until late March or even early April, most likely.

Happy New Year!


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## Green

Sprayed home-made vole / rodent repellent on the upper back, garage side, and about 1/4 of the lower back and part of the other side. Used the excess water in the front mulch.

Ingredients: a gallon of warm water, ~5oz of castor oil, a pinch of cayenne pepper, a teaspoon or so of peppermint oil, and an ounce of cheap blue dish soap. It didn't clog the sprayer too badly this time, and didn't foam too badly (last year, I used 1.5oz of Dawn Ultra which was way too much soap). This year's soap had some urea in it, so I guess it was a foliar fertilizer of sorts, too.

I still had garlic water from the mosquito repellent spray this Summer in the sprayer, lol! Dumped that out and any bacteria that was in it before mixing up the new stuff.

Almost no rain so far today, but it was in the low 50s again...about 15 degrees above average.


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## mowww

@Green did I just see a photo on your journal? Love it, keep 'em coming if it isn't too much trouble. I hope the vole repellent works out for you.


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## Green

mowww said:


> @Green did I just see a photo on your journal? Love it, keep 'em coming if it isn't too much trouble. I hope the vole repellent works out for you.


Thanks. I'll try. Had to show the clippings. The repellent worked last year.
----------
1/3: charged car battery

To-do list:
-spray rtu rodent repellent
-Blow clippings away from curbs
-blow/remove leaves as needed from lawn; beds
-dehumidifer clean
-sprayers clean
-remove Toro mower blade
-clean out garage and relocate supplies
-remove flags and inset markers for Winter
-put up driveway stakes for Winter
-clean out stuff on patio
-bring in hose


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## Green

Got 0.35 inch of rain, mostly last night.

Today: Fixed green hose. Rinsed 2 spreaders and 2 mowers; added oil and ran mowers dry for end of season. Shut water off again just now. 20s for high tomorrow...

I heard a lawn tractor somewhere nearby today. Not just idle, but moving. Someone did a January mow, apparently. It was soggy as heck out.


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## Green

Got more rain. Not sure how much. Guessing 0.1 inch.

Sprayed rtu rodent repellent. Started removing garage supplies. Started putting in stakes near road. In the low to mid 40s today. Cooldown and then real Winter coming, plus snow tomorrow night. Highs in the 30s rest of the week and then teens, 20s, 30s next week for highs.


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## Green

Cleaned up a few leaves and sticks in the front and driveway area. Charged car battery. Got gas for snowblower, 3 gallons. Took in last hose in front. Put up stakes. Still have stuff to do in a couple of weeks if it warms up.


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## Green

Got 7-9 inches of snow last night.


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## Green

Charged car; picked up a few leaves in driveway. Added stabilizer to gas can.


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## Green

Yesterday: Got rain. Probably no more than 0.25 inch.

Today: snow starting to melt in places. Charged car.


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## Green

Had a couple of cold days so far, including a day recently with high around 16 and low in the single digits, with more to come, though today hit 45 with little wind, which was warm for this time.

As more snow melted, I realized that the "free sod cutters" had come in the past week. I ended up carefully ripping out an 18-inch wide, rolled up, frozen chunk of the lawn that had been cut and mostly freed from the root system, by hand today, and relocated it for safe keeping, so it wouldn't get broken up further. It was too frozen to unroll. I also attempted to fix a few adjacent areas, but those will likely get snagged by the plow again at some point, now that they're raised up. I didn't want to stretch too much or tamp too hard on the frozen turf.

At least "free aerator" activity is decreasing a bit.

Charged car (+1r).


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## Green

Going into the single digits again the next two nights. Put N into car tires ([email protected]). Picked up some leaves and sticks from driveway and sidewalk areas. High today: low 40s.


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## Green

Last night: got 2 inches or so of snow, and then rain. Total liquid: 7/8 inch. All of the new snow melted, but still a coating of old snow in many places.

Today: shoveled a bit of residual snow and swept water away from driveway low spots. Collected a bit more turf cut by the plow, and picked up a few sticks.


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## Green

Today:

Charged car. Got it washed (express). Waxed it with the liquid ceramic stuff, finally. 44F high today. Almost 10 above average.


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## Green

Noticed some more damage...this time squirrels going ridiculously nuts...could not believe the pile of soil and ripped up turf. Normally they just dig a small hole. Last week, I noticed the torn up turf, and nut shells. Today, it was literally a pile of soil, so they returned and dug more in the same spot. The area is about 6x6 inches, maybe bigger. That was weird.

Got snow last night (not much), but it's very cold now so everything is iced over again. Car doors were a bit frozen, but got in. Didn't dare mess with the wipers or windows, which are frozen...the one day I left the wipers down. Back lawn has been covered in snow straight through since the last few snowfalls, all this time so far.


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## Green

Got a coating of snow yesterday evening/night, which ,mostly melted since it hit 40F today.

Tried my best to evaluate/fix the dug spot and plow damage (more of it keeps becoming evident as snow melts, but thankfully it's mostly in a relatively small area for now). Picked up leaves and sticks from near the edges. Flattened out the cut sod pieces now that they thawed. Charged and test drive car.


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## Green

Snow flurries today. Got 4 gallons of gas. Did not add stabilizer. Charged car prior. Started generator. Picked up leaves from lawn edges/driveway/road gutter.

Major storm coming, bringing around a foot or so of snow tonight and tomorrow, with 40 mph wind gusts possible, then dropping to single digits Saturday and Sunday night.

Most front and side yard snow is melted, but there are still small piles, etc. Back has remained mostly covered with a coating this whole time.


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## Green

Last week: got about 10 in of snow. 2/2/22: charged car battery.


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## Green

1.1 inches of rain and still going. Might change to freezing rain or sleet this evening. Going to be cold this weekend, again. Snow is melting. Back still has snow in some areas. Front has less. There is standing water in some places, which will ice over at night.


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## Green

Additional rain from the previous and most recent rains: at least another 3/8 inch. ice cover and standing water continue to be an issue in certain back areas.

In a warm period for a few days. 40s. Might hit 50 or higher tomorrow.

Swept up a few leaves/sticks form the lawn edges/driveway/sidewalk/road area. Got a better look at the plow damage areas as snow continues to melt. Turf is pushed/rolled up a bit about 4-6 into the lawn, and will need to be pulled/placed back flat at some point. Not sure this stretch of warm weather is the time to do it as it might not be warm enough to make it flexible. We'll see if I can manipulate it yet.


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## Green

Took a look at the plow damage. Most of what happened was this:

The turf stayed attached to the soil (likely due to having good roots and cold soil temps), but the plow managed to push the soil underneath, causing high spots and mounds in a few places. Similar to what I've seen described by people dealing with moles, but larger in area.

It looks like the solution to redistribute the soil and eliminate the high spots will be to dig it up in the warmer weather, and level it, and put the sod back. I'm not sure if there's any other alternative. I've never had this happen before. Any other ideas?


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## bernstem

You should be fine with leveling, re-laying what is now essentially sod, and rolling. I don't have that issue here in St. Louis, but when I lived in Michigan and Iowa it happened often enough.


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## Green

bernstem said:


> You should be fine with leveling, re-laying what is now essentially sod, and rolling. I don't have that issue here in St. Louis, but when I lived in Michigan and Iowa it happened often enough.


Sounds like what I was thinking, more or less. Any ideas on how to dig the sod up in the easiest and cleanest way? I know there are tons of different types of shovels and spades, and I have a few different types already. It will probably be mid March before I can even think about starting. The soil is too hard right now, and we want the threat of plowable snow to be minimal by that time as well.

I have a flat landscape spade (short handle, though), short handle spade with standard shovel at the end, and a long handle half moon edger as well as a traditional long handle shovel (heart shaped/curved). But maybe there is something better? Something flat but with a long handle, maybe?


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## Green

Dormant overseeded family member zone 7a back yard. Covered shoes with 2 layers of plastic bags due to dog poop. Put down by hand at least 2 lbs of seed on what might be 0.7K area. A lot of it was bare soil, but there's some existing grass in the middle mostly. Used 0/0 clean KY-31 seed mostly, plus CRF seed for a durable, low maintenance and shade-tolerant ground cover, plus a little bit of Allied / ASP (Agway) PR blend for quick germination insurance. We'll see what happens in a few months.


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## bernstem

Green said:


> bernstem said:
> 
> 
> 
> You should be fine with leveling, re-laying what is now essentially sod, and rolling. I don't have that issue here in St. Louis, but when I lived in Michigan and Iowa it happened often enough.
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds like what I was thinking, more or less. Any ideas on how to dig the sod up in the easiest and cleanest way? I know there are tons of different types of shovels and spades, and I have a few different types already. It will probably be mid March before I can even think about starting. The soil is too hard right now, and we want the threat of plowable snow to be minimal by that time as well.
> 
> I have a flat landscape spade (short handle, though), short handle spade with standard shovel at the end, and a long handle half moon edger as well as a traditional long handle shovel (heart shaped/curved). But maybe there is something better? Something flat but with a long handle, maybe?
Click to expand...

I was always able to just flatten out the wadded-up sod by hand. If you need a shovel, I would use a flat shovel of some kind, though I expect anything will work.


----------



## Green

bernstem said:


> I was always able to just flatten out the wadded-up sod by hand. If you need a shovel, I would use a flat shovel of some kind, though I expect anything will work.


I think I'm going to have to dig it up. Like I said, it's still rooted solidly in the top few inches of soil. But it moved about 6 inches, and the underlying soil below the top couple of inches moved a couple of feet laterally. It's kind a weird, freak thing. There also some mounds (at least one) in addition to overall grade being messed up locally over the larger area.

In other words, it got somewhat rolled into a mound, but is still rooted for the most part. And with extra soil oushed underneath it.

The portion that was partially unrooted I already ripped out and removed a few weeks ago, for replanting as the very last step. That was the portion right near the road edge. I wanted to store it somewhere safe for the rest of the Winter so it wouldn't get damaged in the future.

I think this all happened because the plow driver pushed too far into the yard...about 6+ feet. There really was no reason to do so. It was likely someone new, and/or unfamiliar with the area. I think the normal driver(s) was/were out due to being sick, because it was a different truck. I had stakes up showing where the edge was, roughly. Also, normally when they do have to push snow into the yard (if there's a lot of it), they pull up on the plow as they push it so it doesn't hit the surface.


----------



## bernstem

That sucks, but a bit of work and it should be fine. There may be some areas that don't make it, but they should be fixable with plugging. I have an area in the new reno under my oak tree that the squirells destroyed this past week. It will probably get some crack grass or plugs.


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## Green

@bernstem, we'll see next month. The crazy driver came back, but didn't touch the area this time. Praying for no further damage. Also, we'll see in April or May if the sprinkler head on the other side was hit or not. It scraped the soil an inch away from it. That was a new one the last couple of years. As far as plugs go, I'm not a fan of lawn-to-lawn transplants in the front due to Poa Triv. Even just digging up sod and replanting it in the same spot can help the Triv spread. Thankfully that area seems pretty clean so far, though.


----------



## Green

Got about two inches of fresh snow last night. Mostly all of the previous stuff was melted for a few days at least.


----------



## Green

Got approx 0.5 inch of rain last night.


----------



## Green

Got 0.8 inch of rain yesterday. Picked up a few sticks. Went into the mid 60s for a while today. Car washed. Charged 2 days ago.


----------



## Green

Yesterday and the previous night: got a decent amount of snow (actually mostly sleet). Ground is covered again.


----------



## situman

Its like a daily weather report lol.


----------



## Green

Got trace amounts of rain a few times since last update. Today: sprayed rodent repellent from front door to ac and along garage side. Charged car. Added 0.5-0.67 of the gas, and attempted dormant seeding of the small areas in the front hill area along driveway where squirrels dug a while back. Picked a handful of road salt crystals off the main front edge. Used a lot of seed as it's old. Flame TTTF (2016 crop) and Champion GQ PR.


----------



## Green

Rain total: 0.25 inch from last night and the previous day combined.

Soil temps: low 40s in front; 30s in back (ground is still frozen in back). Next door neighbor's front yard was a few degrees higher (slightly more sun) as usual this time of year. Air temp: 40. Put down rodent repellent granular near daffodils in main front.


----------



## Green

Got a few inches of snow today. Not going to stay long, as it will be back in the 40s and 50s starting tomorrow.


----------



## Green

Dormant seeded a little Bullseye TTTF into one of the front spots near the driveway for insurance, some side front spots including squirrel area mentioned previously, garage side spots, and upper back garage corner. Finally got Christmas light strings down. Picked up a few sticks, bark pieces, etc.


----------



## Green

Yesterday: Got an inch or so of snow and ice after some rain. Total liquid equivalent precip was almost 0.4 in. Temps dropped during the day; today will only hit the mid 30s for the high, and the wind chill will make it feel like 18F at times.


----------



## Green

Got trace amounts of rain the last two nights, but nothing measurable. More rain expected tonight and tomorrow, so I put down my white landscape fabric to cover the bare area near the road caused by the plow. Used 2 layers of Dalen grass seed fabric cut to fit and metal staples. Goal is to prevent erosion and nutrient runoff now that soil in the front is no longer frozen, and let everyone know the area is being worked on.

Poured the rest of the gas into my car.

Got to about 72-74F today...unseasonably warm.


----------



## Green

Haven't mowed yet, and haven't seen anyone do so or seen any fert trucks out just yet...probably by next week a few mowing and fertilizer people will be on the roads.

Lawn is still brown, but greening up a little at a time. Crocus flowers are up now. Some lawns are about half greened up now around town.


----------



## Green

Yesterday: First day of Spring. Got a between 0.05 and 0.1 inch of rain the night before. Good because 0.5 inch or so was predicted at one point but we really didn't need it. Grass continues to green up slowly.


----------



## Green

Front soil temps were in the low 50s and upper back near garage/deck was around 40F today.


----------



## Green

Yesterday: started raking lightly in main front and hellstrip areas. Removed a 1-inch+ rock from the lawn.

Today: took front soil samples from driveway/hellstrip areas, and then applied gypsum to those edges and a couple feet in, to counteract road salt (including under the fabric in the damaged area). Also applied to front hellstrip plant bed as usual. Removed a few little pavement pieces from the plow. There is one small brown spot near the curb where a good clump of salt crystals must have landed at some point.

Neighbor (right hand side) started raking today too. Complimented/reminded him that this was a great time to do so, before the lawn company puts down pre-M. Asked me if I managed to kill all the Triv last year. Explained that it's a continual battle and I expect to see more next month. Got permission to do small spot treatments and reseed or sod a bit over the border again this year if needed. Makes it easier to control this way, as I can get a whole patch killed this way, rather than leaving part of it over the border, or can kill a very small spot located a couple inches over the border. So it doesn't spread back again. Said I'm pretty sure it came from my side originally, anyway. (Got unlucky with some VNS KBG seed a decade ago before knowing better, apparently).


----------



## Green

Today: checked the rain gauge. 1.5 inches came last night and from the 24 hrs prior to that.

I worked on the uneven ground in the main front near the road caused by the snow plow. Using a 5 gallon bucket filled with rocks (~80-100 lbs) as a roller on my hands and knees, as well as using my feet on the soft ground, I did my best to work out the bumps. Problem is, you end up compacting the high spots, and even then, the ground isn't as flat as it used to be. But at least I won't need to dig anything up and level.


----------



## Green

Got at least 0.1 inch of rain the other day. Then the mini gauge froze last night.

Saw some Forsythia in bloom several towns over yesterday. Today was cold. Went out for a walk with a full Winter coat, heavy gloves, etc. around 5:45 this evening. My soil thermometer said the air temp was 23F. Soil in in the front hill was low 40s. Weather channel said dew point was -3. Windy, blustery...still windy now, and is around 20F (and feels like 9) according to the weather channel.

Had snow squalls last night, like a mini blizzard. The snow last night actually stuck. Had more snow in the form of flurries today too. I guess this weather is coming off the great lake region. Supposed to go down to 18 tonight.

Probably won't mow anything yet, until Sunday at the very earliest.


----------



## Green

Saw more Forsythia in bloom today. Grasses in various areas are in differing stages of greenup. Low 40s today. Looks like it's not going to be this cool again in the forecast. Checked tire pressure. 36.5. Picked up most of the little bit of fertilizer I need for the year. 2x SOP ($48 each) and 1x urea ($42). No pre-M as I'm not planning to use it on most areas this year.

Stopped in Agway, and this store at least is phasing out the Agway brand, including grass seed, as they had issues with supply from the Southern States Cooperative parent company that owns the brand.

Neighbor across who uses the same irrigation company had their sprinklers turned on as they needed them marked for aeration.


----------



## Green

A few Forsythia are starting to bloom in my neighborhood as of today. Daffodils are starting to bloom in some cases.

Several lawns have had pre-M applied in the last few days by lawn companies around here.

Raked the front hill and hellstrip areas. Used the manual reel mower on the hellstrip areas and a green stripe at the top side of the front hill (likely caused by my spreader failing back in the Fall last time I fertilized (causing uneven distribution).

I continue marking Triv spots as I find them.

It's raining now, and is windy.


----------



## M32075

Why no Pre M this year?


----------



## Green

M32075 said:


> Why no Pre M this year?


I don't feel I need it in many areas after years of use. Did the same last year, and it went well. I'll take the better rooting and environmental profile in exchange. Plus, it's harder / more expensive to get certain supplies this year (fertilizer, pre-M).


----------



## Green

Yesterday: got 1.2 inches of rain. Grass is greening up, but Tall Fescue is usually slow.

Today: re-overseeded coastal family member zone 7 back lawn. Looked like whatever seed was left from the previous dormant seeding was just starting to pop open, but there wasn't much left because of either washout or the lawn people doing Spring cleanup and blowing the seed away in the process a couple weeks ago. Added the rest of my Creeping Red Fescue, predominantly in the shaded areas, some more KY-31, and ASP PR. Also added the rest of my 2015 Chantilly CRF (a couple pounds), which likely won't germinate.

Local high school athletic field was mostly greened up, probably due to the short cut and mostly PR grass (plus KBG, Poa annua, and weeds). Didn't look like they mowed yet this year, though. Grass had a slight yellow tinge (not dead material brown; possibly a nutrient deficiency?)

More Forsythia blooming each day.


----------



## Green

Got at least 0.1 inch of rain yesterday, maybe more because I checked late and some evaporation was likely.

Went to friend's. Helped him collect soil samples as he's busy due to the baby. Soil looks good. Gave him the 3 small bags of fertilizer I bought last year: Scotts starter and step 4, and expert gardener 30-0-4 (and got reimbursed 40 of 120). Gave him 6.5 oz of starter with Meso, and 2 Nitrate/Nitrite test strips. Started going over the Spring plan for his yard. Need to remind him to get a fert sign when I email.

Neighbor continued aerating today after the rain.


----------



## Green

Yesterday


----------



## Green

Today: Did more raking in the front. Took down some of the snow stakes.

Then, started mowing for the first time this year after changing the blade on the old mower. 2.65 in setting (standard blade) -- same height I left off at in the Winter. Mowed the front hill, hellstrip areas, side front slope up to marker, and the half of the main front near the driveway (except the edge). Got about the same amount of clippings this time as I did from my final mow of 2021 on Dec. 31st. Mix of green and brown.


----------



## Green

Raining off and on today. Maybe a half inch plus so far.

For the first time ever, I'm definitely seeing fertilizer stripes as the grass wakes up. I guess this is due to the poor condition of my old spreader I used back in the Fall. It was dumping more to one side and wouldn't close completely between passes. I think it may be totally shot beyond repair. We'll see. Not having a reliable, fully working spreader last Fall was a problem. Thankfully I have a couple of "new" (second hand) spreaders to work with this year.

The stripes are in the same direction as the driveway. I might do a light granular app in the perpendicular direction this month if it doesn't even out on its own soon.

Speaking of fert: neighbor got fertilized (and pre-M I assume) by "Chemlawn" today. Looks like some granular was used, but it's almost fully dissolved from the rain, so it was hard to tell.


----------



## Green

Got 2.65-2.75 inches of rain yesterday!

Today: Finally fixed the plow damaged areas in the front near the road. One large area and one small one. Sod was stored near the house in a mulch bed since Jan, so it accumulated leaves and other debris. Removed the landscape fabric. Took a while to clean the sod and ground areas of debris, level, and replace the sod; maybe an hour. Ended up banging some areas inward toward the transplanted area with a rubber mallet to try to get things more level around the area. It's not too bad now, but might need a little soil at some point. Also transplanted some extra from the road edge into main front lawn bare spots. Marked all transplant areas and the squirrel areas at the edge of the front hill.

Neighbor 11 mowed; yard looks real neat now. Almost no one has mowed just yet.


----------



## Green

2 days ago: got at least 0.1 inch of rain.

Still a bit soft outside. Finished raking the main front.

Areas that got the early versus late Winterizing app look about the same. Can't really say one is better.


----------



## Green

This morning: got a trace amount of rain.

Today: continued raking (side front). Neighbor next door mowed for first time.


----------



## Green

Today: mowed rest of main front (2.7 except edges) and bagged. Mowed rest of hilly part of side front (to marker) and bagged. Mowed hellstrip areas and edges at 3.15 in and bagged. Mowed front hill and slope for second time and mulched at 2.7.

Mowed most of the side at 3.15 in for first time (didn't get to rake it yet but it needed a first mow). Tried mowing the lower back while I was at it, but got no clippings, so stopped.

Ground is soggy. Mosquitoes are starting to bite a bit. Threw down mosquito dunks in flood prone area. That area especially (and the low input area generally to some extent) is a mess...soggy, Poa, etc.

Added some more seed to the front patches, but it's old seed--2017 test date and older, so may not work. Summer, Flame, (and Champion GQ that is definitely no good). Can always add a little new seed.

Next door neighbor put down pre-M (Scotts step 1) in the past day or two; I'm getting him started on a Tenacity program on a small area where there's Poa annua (mainly so it doesn't spread to mine nearby). Ethofumesate is restricted use here, so Meso is all we have for Poa annua.

Talked with my friend. He did the first pre-M split app on 4/5/22 (2 lb/M of Dimension 0-0-7 0.15 almost everywhere), and 0.83 lb/M of 30-0-4 fertilizer product on the area he seeded last year (0.25 lb N), and a 1/3 rate of starter w/Meso on the area to be seeded.


----------



## Green

Got 0.2-0.25 inch of rain yesterday.

Finished raking the front today (flat side front between marker and tree. Got a bunch of nuts pieces.


----------



## Green

Got 0.2-0.25 inch of rain last night.

Raked most of the side. Marked more Triv spots to kill there, but a lot of it is interwoven, too.

Added a bit more seed to some of the front spots (fresh No-Net seed). Also seeded a large dead/thin spot in the lower side (Rowdy TTTF and Rushmore Chewings since it's under a tree). Will need to kill some Triv in that spot before seed germinates.

Supposed to hit 32-34 tonight for the low.


----------



## Green

Removed rest of snow stakes finally.

Lightly dethatched the slow to green area / fertilizer skip area from Fall using groundskeeper rake, and bag mowed it at 2.7 in after. Mowed the edges I couldn't get to before due to stakes near road. Mowed side front all at 2.7 in this time (a bit too low on the slope, and mower has trouble mulching even with sharp blade). Mowed flat part from market to side walkway for first time of the year; bagged this area. Mowed hellstrip areas at 3.15 in.

Mowed side and lower back with Toro at 2.75 in. First time for lower/middle side. Mowed about 1/4 of low input area at this setting and next lower setting for first time.

Did first fertilizer on front. 1 lb of Potassium from 0-0-50 SOP on front (tried grandfather's old spreader on side front and it stuck open due to not being washed and too small a particle, so didn't go down super evenly.

Tried the Andersons SR2000 for first time ever, on the main front, at G-F setting. Better, but need to get used to it and noticed the last bit doesn't come out easily due to how the agitator works. So not super even either. Learning curve to get through with this.

Then put down about 0.17 lb of N from Ace 29-0-4 fert on main front, focusing on thinner/lighter green/lagging areas. Also applied a bit to the top plateau area of the side front slope.

Added peat moss to the small areas I seeded yesterday.

Shrubs trimmed.


----------



## Green

Got 1.5 inches of rain last night. Significant but not torrential.

Added seed to spots in front. No-Net TTTF. Noticed it has 0.2% other crop. Hopefully just Ryegrass.

Quickly raked and threw down seed on garage side (Rowdy TTTF).


----------



## Green

Lightly dethatched the lower margin of the side front slope using the groundskeeper rake, because there was some brown showing.


----------



## Green

4/21/22: Checked coastal family member throw-down overseed in back dog area. Only 15-20% of the seed is up so far. Cut down oniion/garlic weeds with string trimmer so it doesn't have to be mowed for a while.

4/19: Local lawn company applied pre-M to neighbor 10.

4/22: Mowed the front hill real quick at 2.7 in. Mowed hellstrip areas and edge at 3.15, and main front driveway / sidewalk edges at the same. Neighbor 11 pre-M and fert was applied (4/19).

GDD tracker indicates 696 "late" category for pre-M as of today, meaning pre-M apps should be done and watered in as soon as possible for best effect in order to beat crabgrass germination. No crabgrass germination is indicated yet on their map for the state. Primo/proxy map indicates "done category" last few days. I noticed what appears to be the very early stages of seed stalk formation in a couple of areas, but grass is not even fully awake just yet. I plan to do my first PGR app in the front as soon as possible. I'm also due for my Tenacity app where I will be using a pre-M in about a month. Tenacity allows me to reseed any areas that are damaged or need to be killed off prior to that. I will not be using a pre-M in many areas this year, once again. But I will be using it in some areas. Poa annua has had seedheads for weeks, or course.


----------



## Green

Mowed front except flat parts of side slope and past marker, using both mowers at 2.7 in settings and higher setting on edges to prevent scalping. Lightly dethatched the front hill and hellstrip areas with groundskeeper rake before mowing, and then bag mowed those areas. Tried not to tear it up too much. Just a bit of dead grass came out, and a few green blades. Nowhere near the amount that came out last year at this time. Progress. No more thatch problem this year.


----------



## Green

Today: started raking lower back. Mowed more of low input area at 2,7 in. Put down Scotts moss killer granular on flood prone area and some other low input areas. Mixed a gallon of glyphosate, and then sprayed a few small Triv patches in the main front and side before it got dark. Used up most of my miracle gro/AIR-8 mix from last Fall that was still in my 3 gallon sprayer. Used it on some of last year's front reseed patches.

Next steps:
Trimming in front
Peat moss on seed*
Continue soil sampling
Continue SOP application
Tree pruning 
Tree transplants
Start trays
Spray PGR, Tenacity, and Triclopyr
Cut down brush in back

*glyphosate first


----------



## Green

Spot sprayed Triv (and a Poa annua plant between the lower back and side) during very light but sustained rain (almost a mist) with saturated foliage. Used a bit of extra volume. We'll see if it works. The sprayed areas turned off-color instantly. Good amount of annual Ryegrass from reseeding previously, but I don't really care as it's not invasive and never seems to cause issues, so I leave it be unless it really bothers me.


----------



## Green

Got no more than 0.1 inch of rain the other day.

Neighbor next door was mowed today. First time this year.


----------



## Green

Dug out "small" trees for transplanting. Shovel handle snapped in the process. Wrapped roots in tarp. Trying to keep them watered until planting.


----------



## Green

Drought stress is setting in. Even starting to brown a bit in the sunlight.

Today: mowed front. Skipped areas where seed is down. Skipped hellstrip areas due to drought stress. Mowed side. HOC: 2.75-3.2 in.

Noticed tonight that seed stalks are just starting up for real.

Last few days: local lawn company fertilized and/or pre-M'ed previously self-aerated neighbor lawn. End neighbor D mowed (first time).

Today: put down light app of fertilizer / Dimension on coastal family member front lawn. Approx. 2 lbs of 30-0-0 on 1K area; used Scotts Wizz on settings 4-5. 9% fast release urea; 21% Duration 120 day Coated urea; 0.18 lb of fast release N applied. Back overseed is coming along. Around 1/3 of the seed has germinated.

Test-applied a very low rate of 29-0-4 Ace fert to the area next to patio adjacent to side hill to test the battery hand spreader.

Heard a few Spring peepers around a pond in the next Southern town. Late frogs.


----------



## Green

Got at least 0.37 inch of rain last night and today. This is a full dump for my soil type, but just barely. It was really drying out and starting to drought stress in the front, so it was much needed. I was going to need to water soon if it didn't rain. I will be good for another few days now. Hopefully more rain later in the week to take us through to the next week.


----------



## Green

Started planting the tree at the far end of the low input area. Did not get to do anything else. Rain forecast for tomorrow. There is a lot to be done over the next couple of weeks still.


----------



## Green

2 days ago: got less than 0.1 inch of rain.

Today: mowed front at 2.75, side and lower back at 3.25. Sprayed Tenacity on last year's main front border overseed after mowing (yes, you're supposed to wait a day or two ideally before spraying). Also sprayed far grass end (~1,000 square feet) of low input area, leaving a few feet of border unsprayed near the transplanted tree.

Sprayed PGR on front (minus the newest reseed areas that have to regrow and fill in to catch up). 0.3 oz per thousand rate. Side front up to line created by side walkway.

Sprayed Triclopyr ester at label mix rate on weeds in the upper back near natural area border, before the grass grows in. Also sprayed the front walkway weeds. Left the mix in the sprayer.

Noticed TTTF germination near the road in the plow damaged repair area a few days ago.


----------



## Green

Finished mowing (low-input at 3.25 with discharge due to damp grass from light rain earlier). Put down 11 lbs of 0-0-50 SOP there (minus flood prone area). Put down low rate of blended lawn fertilizer on the two areas overseeded last year, plus main front border overseed. 1/8th to 1/5th lb N from Ace 29-0--4 with the Wizz. Eyeballed.

Then sprayed glyphosate on a bunch of things. Triv in main front, side, back, and low input (including flood prone ongoing Reno area). Poa annua in side, lower back, and tons of it in the flood prone area and lower side ongoing reno/overseed areas. Was able to do a second app on a few patches. Sprayed during light rain as it worked well last time. In fact, this time, some browning was evident in several minutes, no joke. Less rain than last time.

Next tasks to do:
-Tree pruning
-shrubs
-Fill in hole
-Fix tree
-Trimming
-Start grass trays 
-Finish soil sampling
-Finish raking
-Finish Tenacity 
-Add peat moss
-mower blade sharpening 
-jumping worm treatments
-daffodil transplants
-mulch


----------



## Dude

Interested in the decision to glyphosate the poa annua.

Where you knocking it out before it went to seed? (Asking because most of mine has.)

Or would it not die out in the summer and/or you don't want to look at it until then?


----------



## Green

Dude said:


> Interested in the decision to glyphosate the poa annua.
> 
> Where you knocking it out before it went to seed? (Asking because most of mine has.)
> 
> Or would it not die out in the summer and/or you don't want to look at it until then?


Trying to get it before more seed forms. This stuff is always going to seed and makes tons. I think I accidentally killed a Bewitched KBG plant today, thinking it was Poa annua. Even after 10 years, it happens once in a while!


----------



## Dude

Green said:


> Dude said:
> 
> 
> 
> Interested in the decision to glyphosate the poa annua.
> 
> Where you knocking it out before it went to seed? (Asking because most of mine has.)
> 
> Or would it not die out in the summer and/or you don't want to look at it until then?
> 
> 
> 
> Trying to get it before more seed forms. This stuff is always going to seed and makes tons. I think I accidentally killed a Bewitched KBG plant today, thinking it was Poa annua. Even after 10 years, it happens once in a while!
Click to expand...

Makes sense. Thanks for the info.


----------



## Green

Got 0.4 inch of rain yesterday and the night/evening before.


----------



## Green

Connected hoses today, and watered overseeded areas and spots. Resumed watering the transplanted tree with the watering can last night. Currently giving it 2 cans full, and ground is still soft, but will have to get a hose out there soon.


----------



## Green

Mowed the side and back at 3.15 in with side discharge, and mowed the low input (almost all of it is awake and growing now) at 3.25 in. Watered the tree twice with a can full each time. Hand watered front/garage side/lower side overseed areas and spots with the hose. Watered the hellstrip areas and road edges/corners lightly as well. Neighbor was mowed today.


----------



## Green

Today: Opened sprinkler system / irrigation and ran each zone for several min. Made sure all heads were operating. The zone 1 head along the middle of the driveway edge was stuck in one position and was fixed by manual rotation several times. Continued hand trimming. Mowed side front at 3.1 in and didn't remove too much (less than 1/3 - ideal). Took a few soil cores to judge moisture (dwindling - cores ranged from fairly dry to slightly moist at 3-5 in depth. Put down first Spring fertilizer on side front. Slightly lighter on garage side overseed portion. And heavier on areas that need filling in. Used old stock of Milorganite Classic 6-2-0 professional 50-lb (white bag) fertilizer. 2 perpendicular application patterns. Scott's Pro spreader, setting #3. 11 lbs applied to 1.75K area (0.375 lb of N and 0.125 lb of P per thousand).

Set zone 5 to water for 3 x 30 min. tomorrow morning. First major irrigation of the year. Noticed a neighbor utilizing his system tonight as well; appears to have added a head in his center dry spot, finally.


----------



## Green

Mowed main front (3.15). Put down 0.375 lb N from 6-2-0 2.5Fe Milorganite on the area (same as the other area last night). Threw down some extra Firecracker SLS seed in bare spots from last year's seeding.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 2x 30 min and 2x 40 min respectively tomorrow morning (first watering on main front this year). I let the soil dry out as much as I could without causing issues before watering the first time.


----------



## Green

Ended up mowing the lower back and lower/mid side again (very slowly) 3.1. Also mowed most of upper back (first time this year). Same height setting. Then mowed a lot of the low input (3.25).

Sprayed glyphosate on a few Triv patches in the main front. There are others that are too interwoven to deal with right now.


----------



## Green

Trimmed back, finished mowing. Mowed upper side. Mowed side front (3.1). Filled in hole in side bed, added mulch.


----------



## Green

Mowed main front (3.1, side discharge), a bit longer than ideal. Mowed rest of low input, including Reno area (still in progress; needs an overseed) at 2.2 bagged to try to collect weed seeds. Sprayed Triclopyr ester on area behind shed. Far low input neighbor mowed for the first time in past few days.


----------



## Green

Fertilizer day.

Put down a 40-lb bag (my last one) of Baystate fertilizer on 5.5K of the low-input area except reno area. (roughly 0.36 lb of N and P). Used it on the area because the P level is just a touch lower than optimal, and this stuff has the highest P:N ratio of anything this side of starter fertilizer.

Put down 9.5 lbs of 6-2-0 2.5Fe Milorganite on the side. And 3 lbs of 0-0-50 SOP. The Andersons SR2000 spreader is tough to use on a small hill for repeated passes in different directions due to its size and weight. I also found that I have to add a little of extra product because the agitator doesn't get it all out. Then the challenge is what to do with the extra. Other than those issues, it's a great spreader, but there is still a place for the smaller, lighter units in certain areas.

Finally, sprayed Tenacity at 4oz/A rate with some NIS on the entire low input area, and the lower side, and the front town sidewalk edges where weeds are coming in. Sprayed into both neighboring yards; kept it a few feet from the tree. Went 1.5x rate on the bare spots from last season's Triv kill.

Also put down Castaway 3-0-1 crushed Tea Seed meal fertilizer on the back and garage side at approx. 6 lb rate for invasive Jumping Worm control. First time trying it. 0.18 lb of N and 0.06 lb of K. Note: if anyone decides to use this stuff, wear a mask and safety glasses if you're handling it/measuring it out. I did not, and noticed the dust irritated my nose and eyes a bit. The way it works is by irritating and being abrasive to earthworms, I believe. Perhaps also when they consume organic matter coated with it. But it's also an irritant to people's mucous membranes, apparently. Soil temp was 60-65F in the upper back tonight.


----------



## Green

Got 0.3 inch of rain last night.

Did a few more glyphosate spots for Triv in the main front. Looks like there are some that will need hand coating to avoid killing intermixed grass.

Tomorrow:
-clean mowers
-sharpen 
-buy tree supplies 
-trim
-hand weeding beds
-mow
-finish tree
-hand coat glyphosate on triv
-spray front
-start trays
-more glyphosate and Tenacity spot sprays


----------



## BBLOCK

pics?


----------



## Green

Mowed front, side, lower back (3.1), and area behind shed (3.6) during light rain, so utilized discharge starting at the side. Total mess...wet clippings caked to shoes, etc. Now hopefully we can get some actual rain accumulation and not just wet grass.

Trace amount of rain (<0.05 in) tonight. Supposed to hit 90F tomorrow. Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.

GDD count:
5/6: 14
5/7: 11
5/8: 11.5
5/9: 13.5
5/10: 15
5/11: 17
5/12: 20
5/13: 21
5/14: 21
5/15: 21.5
5/16: 20.5
5/17: 18.5
5/18: 15
5/19: 13.5
5/20: 16.5

Total: 249.5


----------



## Green

Hit 90F today for the first time this year, but wasn't too bad.

Sprayed Biofungicide today on main lawn areas at 4oz rate with Nu-Film 17, and added in PGR at 0.3oz rate in front (including garage side and seeded main front utility area this time). 3.75 gal of liquid was a bit too much for 2 passes on the main front, so I will try 1.3 gallons per thousand next time. Used extra on borders, including in both back areas. Omitted the main front plow fix area in progress. Noticed spots of disease in front for first time this year--mainly red thread and/or Pink Patch.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 30 min x2 and 40 min x2 respectively (~0.5 inch), and zone 4 for 40 min (approx 1/3 inch) tomorrow morning (holding off a bit so the spray solution can cure fully in the morning if it didn't yet).

Neighbor nextdoor was fertilized on the 18th (spray).

Next:
-back fert
-glyphosate
-data
-Sprinkler testing
-seed trays
-peat moss
-glyphosate
-ants
-trees
-blades
-soil testing
-poa annua
-Gallery
-Tenacity
-soil samples


----------



## Green

Today:

Finally took the blade off of the Toro and sharpened/rebalanced it after washing off the bottom of the mower. I also scraped the grass buildup off the bottom. After doing all of this, the cutting performance was much improved...good as new. I should get a new Toro bolt, and find the correct socket however. It appears to be a metric socket slightly smaller than 9/16ths. I've stripped my bolt slightly by using the 9/16ths socket for 2 years now. Also need to change oil.

Set neighbor up with a source for coated CRF seed for a shady area, and he seeded yesterday. We'll see how it works. Hopefully any residual pre-M is totally broken up by loosening soil.

After the mower maintenance, I mowed the side (minus the previous mini reno area from almost 2 years ago) and the lower back at 3.25 in. I then applied 7 lbs of Milorganite 6-2-0 2.5% Fe Classic Pro fertilizer to the lower back using the Andersons spreader. Setting "I" resulted in over 4 sets of passes needed. 0.37 lb of N.

Set zone 3 to water for 85 min tomorrow morning. First time watering this zone this year. Will see how the output is tomorrow. 1.40 cu ft / min. 0.45 in lower half. 0.3 in upper half (center). 10.5 gal/min.


----------



## Green

Mowed the front and messed up. Noticed the rear wheels were set one notch lower and must've been like that for a while. Only scalped one bit in the triangle hellstrip border. Changed it back to 3.25 in setting before doing most of main front. Skipped the areas I threw seed on a while back. I'll have to come back tomorrow with the less invasive mower that doesnt suck seed and tear up soil.

Grass is looking rough in front. It's drying down and tired from a bit of hot weather and seed production. Disease spots scattered here and there. Everyone else appears more or less in a similar situation. No one around here is overwatering right now...everyone is dry for the most part.

Mowed most of low input at top 3.75 in setting. Went way too long since previous mow and it was high. Broke 1/2 rule. It's also drying out.

Got new gas and added stabilizer.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning. Will check hellstrip sprinkler output tomorrow.


----------



## Green

Finished mowing after trimming in back. Did upper back (3.1), and rest of low input (3.6/3.75/4.0). Put down 5 lbs of same Milorganite I've been using on upper back. Mulch mowed Reno area as well at 2.25 in. Lots of Poa (both of the bad types) in the far half of the low input area. Blew mower off after. Need to stay on and up my pre/post-M game. Saw a fox and a deer.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 30 min x2 and 40 min x2 respectively tomorrow morning because it's not clear how much rain is coming, and things are drying out a bit.


----------



## Green

Put down fertilizer (~ 1/2 lb of Ace 29-0-4) on the flood prone Reno areas with Scotts Wizz handheld. Spot sprayed glyphosate on more bad Poa I missed the previous time in the same area (and a bit of Nutsedge...hopefully it will kill this, too). Did more trimming (hand). Put out new ant traps. Mowed rest of main front (3.1). Mowed the middle side at 3.1. Mowed the lower side finally (3.65 where necessary, and 3.1 bagged to try to get Poa annua seeds up). Finally, put down 30 lbs of Encap Lime on low input 5.5K. Heavier on near end, lighter near flood prone area, and even heavier on border area that I reclaimed about 5-6 years ago.


----------



## Green

Got 0.4 inch of rain so far (mostly last night). Not raining now.

Edit: 7PM total: 0.6 inch,

I'm not sure yet, but it looks like 0.75 lb of N (from mostly natural slow release sources--my standard Spring approach) may not be enough for Spring. I've only put down 0.375 so far generally this Spring though, so I could still be pleasantly surprised after I add the other 0.375 lb. I used to use 1.0 lb in Spring, but started backing off a year or two ago as it seemed like too much as I fertilize heavily in Fall. I might need to go back to that amount. We'll see.


----------



## Green

Mowed lower back at 3.25. Just removed a little. Removed seedheads from some of the Poa Triv areas in the front. Started cleaning up old mower (needed a cleaning). 90s next two days. Will wait until after to mow anywhere else.


----------



## Green

Only hit mid to upper 80s today, but supposed to hit 90 tomorrow. Not going to water until after the heat and humidity goes back down. Tonight may not get below 70. Supposed to have some days with highs in the 70s starting mid week.

Talked with neighbors about lawn. Neighbor 11 shade seeding was successful, but he will add more sun and shade seed as needed. He is also going to raise mowing height from 2.5 to 3.0 at least on the side which is uneven before it burns out totally (it scalps to 1 inch where the tree was, and he has reseeded it every year due to burning out).

Neighbor nextdoor (who often waters in evening and is currently on B setting with Super recycler) front lawn is decimated...large brown patches. More brown then green, I think. This is from bad red thread /pink patch disease that has been worsening over the past few weeks. I think the mowing stress combined with it just forced it into dormancy, at least for now.

Neighbor across sealed driveway this past week for 1et time ever.

Tenacity share / Zoysia battle neighbor did Scotts step 1 pendimethalin with fert in mid April or so. He will repeat again in about 1-2 weeks. Mentioned that the TTTF samples I once gave him are doing well and showed me one by the driveway edge. Said he may use the Gallery packet I gave him in 2020 this year (0.25oz from my records; need to tell him it's good for 500-750 square feet).


----------



## Green

Yesterday: did a 2nd (even lower rate) granular fertilizer app to flood prone Reno turf grow-in areas. This time, used 1/4 to 1/3 lb of the 29-0-4. Around 0.15 lb N rate. I should probably get a better scale for small amounts.

Been getting a little rain.


----------



## Green

Mowed garage side at 3.65, upper back at 3.15, and low input at 4.0. Bagged area in middle with worst Poa Triv seedheads at 3.65. Grass a bit too long. Trace amount of rain so far.


----------



## Green

Got 0.1 inch of rain this morning.

Mowed side front (3.1) and got half of main front done (3.65). It's a bit too long. Used side discharge because it started to rain slightly.

Then put down 4 lbs. of 8-1-8 XGRN fertilizer on the side front (0.187 lb N and K), mostly parallel to driveway with a bit extra on the front hill in both directions with what was left after the first pass.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning. Put out a mini gauge in each hellstrip area. Result: 1 inch (rectangle area) and 0.7 inch (triangle).


----------



## Chris LI

I'm getting caught up on journals...man, you did a lot so far this year. How's it looking?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> I'm getting caught up on journals...man, you did a lot so far this year. How's it looking?


Thanks, I've been trying to keep up. I haven't had much time this year to take lawn photos, and when I have, I haven't gotten to post them yet. I will eventually get some photos into at least one or two previous posts, and hope to take some more soon. Mostly just been logging what I do for my own records.

The lower back looks pretty good. All other areas have some form of issue. Right now, the biggest cosmetic issue is red thread in the front. Poa Triv in the main front, some partly dormant old school fine Fescues in the side front, jumping worm damage in the upper back, and a very slow grow-in on the Reno area from last year with Poa annua here and there. At least the KBG I planted is starting to spread, but it doesn't look anything like a lawn yet.


----------



## Green

Started up zone 1 to check the heads. None were stuck, but one needed a slight arc adjustment as it was watering the road a bit. That one (driveway/road corner head) as well as the middle road head adjacent also got new covers today as the access holes in both were worn and no longer sealing. Ended up running the zone for 15 min.*

Pulled a few Poa annua plants in flood prone Reno area.

Finished mowing: rest of main front at 3.65 (bagging where there lots of Triv seedheads but discharging elsewhere), side (same HOC), and lower back (3.25 mulched).

Watered low input behind shed (1 inch) and open/sunny area between boundaries (1/2 inch). First time watering any of low input this year.

Took soil samples on side. Used soil core probe to check for moisture. Zone 1 is slightly drier.*

*Set zone 1 only to water for another 30 min tomorrow morning.

Note: church was fertilized on 5/12 and lawn looks pretty good. Not sure, but don't think there's watering being done at all. Could be wrong of course. It's mowed at over 3.5 in, which makes sense if it's unirrigated.


----------



## Green

Finally got the transplanted tree soil fixed up...removed the temporary sod, banged off as much soil as I could, and mixed more soil up to bring the level to where it should be. It looks like the tree is not planted too high after all. (Most of the root flare area on the trunk is barely above soil level.) Then added a thin layer of mulch, and watered with 3 watering can fulls. Hopefully the tree will regenerate its roots properly and not become compromised; a lot of root pruning was done (even the largest roots had to be significantly cut this Spring).


----------



## Green

Set Zone 2 to water for 50 min and Zone 4 for 40 min tomorrow morning as it's drying out and will be windy tomorrow. There should be rain tomorrow night.


----------



## Green

It started to rain when I was about to begin mowing. I let the light rain end, and then side discharged with damp grass on the far end of the low input area at 3.6 in. Reminder: clean out mower tomorrow. Supposed to rain more tonight sometime. Tomorrow, I'll try to finish mowing after it stops raining. I also put down another half pound of the 29-0-4 fertilizer on the flood prone reno area. Animals dug into the mulch and soil I put around the tree the other day, so now I have a soil/mulch mixture at the surface instead of a layer of mulch on top of soil, which is a no-no...ughhh....neighbor was mowed yesterday.


----------



## Green

Got 0.4 in. of rain last night.

Mowed upper/middle side, lower back (3.25) and rest of low input (3.75). Behind shed 4 in as usual due to unevenness. All discharged.


----------



## Green

Got another 1.55 inches of rain last night.


----------



## Green

Pruned spruces (finally). Sharpened and balanced gator blade.


----------



## Green

Mowed front at 3.6, mostly discharged. Extra long...

Sprayed second PGR app on front. Unfortunately I got busy, never calculated the GDD, and 3 weeks went by realizing it, so it started to go into rebound over the last few days. No big deal...give it a mow, and do a second app and all good.

Side front: 0.375 oz
Main front: 0.6 oz

Aiming for 0.25 oz rate, but went lighter and/or omitted some of the usual areas that aren't growing as well this time of year (like the side front slope, middle of main front, garage side shaded area, new grass patches, and area of main front corner near house corner where there is a soil issue).

Mowed far end of low-input and adjacent Reno area in case of more rain coming.


----------



## Green

Mowed upper back, garage side, lower side (3.6), lower back, and other side (3.25). Gutters cleaned; 3 neighbors fertilized (incl. back) by lawn co.

Trace amount of rain last night.


----------



## Green

Watered tree with 2 canfulls. Neighbor applied step 2 after watering.


----------



## Green

Yesterday: water:

Watered zone 5 for 30 min x2.

Watered mid-nearest third of low-input area (not very end shady area) with oscillating sprinklers (1/3 inch).

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 70 and 75 min respectively this morning (already tested all front zones and ran zone 2 for 15 min day before yesterday).

Neighbor 11 was fertilized yesterday. He raised his mowing height at my prompting this past week or two. Probably hasn't watered yet. A bit of brown, but it's hanging on so far.


----------



## Green

Mowed most of low input at 4 in discharge, but accidentally chopped up a fert stake because it was dark out. Not sure where it went; will look tomorrow.

Trace amount of rain last night.


----------



## Green

Still behind. This is where the PGR in the front is really helpful.

Found most of the chopped up stake from yesterday. Removed the remaining rock and grass piles from far end of low input area. Watered tree with 2 canfulls, and finished mowing low input area (including Reno area).

Washed both mowers out.

Picked up sticks and mowed side front (3.6).

Because it was dark out, I chopped up an irrigation flag by accident. My streak continues...I need to stop mowing in the dark. Found it.

Set zone 5 to water for 45 min tomorrow morning.

Neighbor was mowed today.


----------



## ken-n-nancy

Green said:


> Because it was dark out, I chopped up an irrigation flag by accident. My streak continues...I need to stop mowing in the dark. Found it.


Do you have any lighting in your yard, or are you really mowing in the dark, dark? I generally only need to resort to mowing in the dark in late fall when the days are short and the grass is still growing some. When I do so, I have found that a headlamp works pretty well.


----------



## Chris LI

ken-n-nancy said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> Because it was dark out, I chopped up an irrigation flag by accident. My streak continues...I need to stop mowing in the dark. Found it.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you have any lighting in your yard, or are you really mowing in the dark, dark? I generally only need to resort to mowing in the dark in late fall when the days are short and the grass is still growing some. When I do so, I have found that a headlamp works pretty well.
Click to expand...

I felt badly when I saw this, too, but didn't know what to say. Sometimes, we get stuck having to work in the dark. Bringing up a headlamp is a great idea, and got me thinking about a similar solution that I mainly use during leaf mulching season. I borrow my son's bicycle headlight. It has a simple universal mounting with an elastic rubberized band that I strap to the cross-bar support on the mower. It works great. Evening commuter traffic zipping down my street slows down as they pass by, presumably to rubber neck towards the light to figure out what some idiot is doing on the lawn after dark. :lol:


----------



## Green

@Chris LI 
@ken-n-nancy

I actually grabbed the headlamp tonight (as well as my glasses), as I had to do some fertilizing after dark. Lots of insects zipping around. Definitely can see a bit better with that combination, though. Probably should have done something similar the last few nights, and probably should get a new headlamp as well.

The mower headlamp attachment is a cool, idea; would love to see a photo of it someday, and maybe get the brand name, too.


----------



## Green

Today:

Mowed upper back and garage side (3.6 mulch), lower back and all of side (3.25 discharge on most and mulch on lower side), and main front (3.6 mulch near half and discharge further half which was longer). Lower back was good, not at all overgrown, but not too soon either. Probably took off 25% to 33% there (8 days since last mow this time).

Then started applying my 2nd round of Spring Nitrogen fertilizer. Put down around 0.1875 lb of N from 8-1-8 XGRN on the front. Also put down 26 lbs of 8-0-4 Nutrite O'Natural on 5.5K low input (0.375 lb N; unintentionally biased more toward nearer halves of the area in both axes, but only applied East-West passes. Good enough. Applied another app (3/4 lb--around 0.3 lb N) of 29-0-4 to Reno area. 4th app so far. Applied 6 lb/M of 3-0-1 Tea Seed Meal to upper back/garage side for jumping worm app #2. Didn't get to fertilize side and lower back, or to trim.

Sprayed dilute solution of Triclopyr ester at heavy rate on some clover in side front and middle side, since temps and humidity were moderate today and rain is expected tonight (it drizzled several times this evening). One thing I was able to do was to spray a patch where I'm working on killing Poa Triv, but got incomplete kill of the good grasses after glyphosate app 1. Hoping the Triclopyr will finish off any residual Triv without doing another gly app (which I normally would do). Will switch to amine next time for clover, violet, etc., unless there is another conducive app window. Will continue using ester at low rate as a tank partner with Tenacity, however.

Almost Summer officially. Thankfully the Northeast hasn't seen high temps like many other US areas have, so far (Europe being an extreme case...well over 100F there).


----------



## Chris LI

Cycle Torch is the bike headlight. I bought it a few years ago, but it's still in production. I bought just the headlight at the time, but now it comes with the taillight for one penny more.

Cycle Torch Ultra Bright USB Rechargeable Bike Light Set, Perfect Commuter Safety Front and Back Bicycle Light LED Combo, Tail Light Included, Compatible with Mountain, Road, Kids & City Bicycles https://a.co/d/0iFDTRC


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Cycle Torch is the bike headlight. I bought it a few years ago, but it's still in production. I bought just the headlight at the time, but now it comes with the taillight for one penny more.
> 
> Cycle Torch Ultra Bright USB Rechargeable Bike Light Set, Perfect Commuter Safety Front and Back Bicycle Light LED Combo, Tail Light Included, Compatible with Mountain, Road, Kids & City Bicycles https://a.co/d/0iFDTRC


Not bad! Thanks.


----------



## Green

Got 0.75 inch of rain last night/today. 0.46 in by the middle of the day, and the rest this afternoon.

Spot sprayed a few dandelions, etc., using 2,4-D amine 3-AI mixture in a handheld spritz bottle I keep for this use, but hardly ever use (I use very little general broadleaf herbicide...I might bring the bottle out once or twice a year and use a tiny bit of it). Last time was late Fall last year. I almost never use it in a handheld sprayer. Usually just a spritz here or there, where I don't want to dig up the grass to go after a dandelion, etc. Took advantage of the humidity after the rain.

To-do list:

Run snowblower and generator
Mower maintenance 
Clean and lube sprayer mech
Friend's soil test
Calculate GDD
Trim
Triclopyr in upper back, main front, and Reno weeds
Tree
Pruning 
Weeds in back wooded areas
Continue fertilizing (N and K; selective urea app?)
Tenacity on side border
Gallery on front edges
Iron for moss on Reno area
Continue Triv kill and removal
Pre-M on low input area
Mosquito barrier
Hydretain 
PGR and biofungicide
Far low input area - Tenacity app 3?
Invasive vines
Seed testing

Irrigation:
Pressure checks
Hose repair
Diagram
MP rotator installation 
Rain sensor
Spray testing
Check for leaks


----------



## Green

Mowed main front at 3.25 in (extra mow); took off very little but it cleaned up. Avoided the area to be sprayed for clover...

Sprayed Triclopyr ester (some still in 3 gal sprayer) on main front clover, and upper back clover/violets, etc. Felt bad because one of the bunnies was there before that. It left when I went near it. Decided to wash off the herbicide tomorrow morning, because they like to eat the grass/broadleaf plants. This will also prevent potential turf burn, hopefully.

Set zone 4 to water for 5 minutes tomorrow morning around 9AM. Should give the spray enough time to dry.

Tomorrow: trim, spraying, and fix tree. Buy oil for mower.


----------



## Green

Cleaned pump mechanism of 3 gallon sprayer and re-greased because it stopped holding pressure.

Sprayed Tenacity at roughly 4 oz per acre rate on border part (overseeded last year) of main front, mixed with low amount of Triclopyr ester. Used excess on back neighbor border.

Cut Triv seedhrars off with shears (tedious).

Sprayed first application of Velocity on main front and a spot on the side for Triv control. Used 5 grams of Velocity (3.5-4oz per acre rate), 0.6oz AMS, and 2.5 gallons of distilled water, plus low amount of Southern Ag NIS (not measured, but less than an ounce for sure). Went very light feathered into Tenacity treated area so I don't fry it. Tried to go heavier on areas more infested with Triv. 2 sets of passes, 2nd one faster walk pace.

Near half of main front looking rough due to fungus, so Velocity will likely dig it up more. I saw both active red thread and pink patch today.

89-92F temps next 2 days.


----------



## Green

Sprayed an app of Certainty (Sulfosulfuron) on the middle side (0.375K area) because of Poa Triv which was rampant in the area in the early Spring (and a bit of annua, too). That grass is fading now, but the goal is to help push it out more aggressively and allow the better grasses to transition in. The area is in partial shade and is otherwise a mix of KBG, PR, TTTF, and FF. It's actually doing very well, so I hate to have to ding it up in the short term for longer term benefits. The FF (which is necessary due to the shade) hates this herbicide the most. TTTF is also very sensitive, but it can mostly handle one app without too much issue from my experience, and will eventually rebound. Perennial Ryegrass is a bit more tolerant, and KBG (in general) tolerates the herbicide the best (but still goes chlorotic from it if two apps are used). I'm not sure I want to risk a second app in the Summer heat, so I may just leave it at one, or I may try a lower rate or a different herbicide the second time. Sometimes one app isn't enough, but two can cause some damage to good grass sometimes.

0.95-0.1 g Certainty 
0.375K area
(0.42oz per acre rate)
0.75 gal distilled water
Roughly a half ounce of NIS

Watered the tree.

-------------------------
Tomorrow:

Buy oil, get gas, and change oil and blade
Tree
Trimming
Mowing
Fertilizer: N, K, Iron
Gallery
PGR/Bio
Pre-emergent
Tenacity
Glyphosate
Air-8


----------



## Green

GDD count:

June 12th: 17
June 13th: 19
June 14th: 18.5
June 15th: 22
June 16th: 17
June 17th: 16.5
June 18th: 18.5
June 19th: 25
June 20th: 23
June 21st: 23.5
June 22nd: 20.5
June 23rd: 17
June 24th: 17
June 25th:; 19
June 26th: 23.5
Total: 297 (goal: 260)


----------



## Green

Yesterday:

Temps didnt get as high as forecast due to intermittent clouds and a breeze. 92 was forecast, and it got to 88.

Got gas (but didn't add stabilizer yet added week of July 1st). Changed oil in old mower, and swapped the standard blade for the recently sharpened gator. Noticed mower is harder to push through grass with gator due to drag on the blade from high (really not that high) grass.

Mowed side front with that mower. It's looking pretty dry and a bit fungusy and didn't grow as much this week*.

Sprayed PGR / Companion 2-0-1 (4oz rate) / Nufilm 17 on the above area. *Reduced PGR quantity to 0.25 oz due to the above. As usual, went lighter on the side slope and upper front hill due to lower growth potential from heat stress.

Mowed the lower back and the side with the Toro at 3.25 in. Those areas are just beginning to look dry and heat stressed from two days on the upper 80s, etc.. Minimal disease spots so far. A bit of clipping material was left behind this time.

Mowed low input except for far end. 4 in, discharge. The clover really seems to improve the drought tolerance a bit.

Put down 6.5 lbs of 2.68% Pendimethalin granular pre-emergent (generic version of Scotts Halts) on 5K of low input area (2 month rate).

Put down unmeasured low to medium rate of granular Scotts Moss control (Iron) plus Calcium on shaded Reno area.

Put down 8-1-8 XGRN fertilizer at 0.1875 N and K rate on lower back and middle and lower side. Still need to do upper side (0.5K) next week. This is the next installment of my "Spring" / early Summer fertilizer.

Sprayed Gallery pre-emergent on front edges, side border, a bit on side house border, and on back neighbor border area. Medium to high rate. Probably a couple of weeks on the late side.

I was trying to get as much as possible done before the rain. A quarter to half inch is expected tomorrow, and that will be it for the week. I wanted to get these products watered in.


----------



## Green

So much for planning on the rain watering in the products. Only got 0.1 inch of rain today. As of last night, a quarter to a half inch was still projected. I'm going to have to water tomorrow. I guess every little bit of rain helps, but I thought it was going to be a sure thing. Going to set zone 3 to water for 60 min, zone 5 for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning, and will water low-input area an additional 0.25-0.4 inch using oscillating sprinkler.


----------



## Green

Watered about two-thirds of the low-input area this afternoon/evening with the oscillating sprinkler (0.35-0.45 inch, which adds up to about a half inch with the rain the other day. Will finish tomorrow.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 60 and 70 min respectively tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Finished watering low-input area.


----------



## Green

This morning: set zones 4 and 5 to water for 20 min x2.

Mowed upper back after trimming.

Watered tree.


----------



## Green

Mowed lower back, side (3.25) and about half of low input (4.0) before rain started.

Picked up a trace amount of rain last night during a thunderstorm, and light downpour again just now. Total rain: 0.1 inch.

Set zone 1 to water for 60 min, zone 2 for 70 min, and zone 4 for 30 min tomorrow morning.

Rain total for June was 3 inches.

Sulfosulfuron (Certainty) is causing minor to moderate yellowing of the treated area (middle side) over the past few days. Hoping it kills the Triv in the process...there are no guarantees, but it's pretty good stuff. I like the fact that it's not a hot herbicide...rather than causing rapid burning like, say Sulfentrazone, the color fades slowly starting after one application, so it's easy to strike the right balance and avoid killing the lawn with Sulfosulfuron...it's a very intuitive-to-use herbicide (with some caution and experimentation needed). It also induced minor to moderate PGR effects on the area, which will be relatively short-lived most likely. I didn't have to take off as much during today's mow.

The Velocity I blanket sprayed on the main front is causing substantial PGR effects (equal to T-Nex), and minor yellowing, both expected. For reference, June 11th was my last T-Nex app, with Velocity on June 24th, and no hint of rebound to speak of at this point. It's still under good regulation at the moment, but from the Velocity. I'll probably do T-Nex again within a week to keep it that way, and continue alternating between the two every couple of weeks.


----------



## Green

Yesterday:

Started to notice very visible crabgrass in various yards and commercial properties in the central/Southern parts of the state. Haven't found any in the lawn yet, despite no pre-M for crabgrass this year.

Had to do an emergency spot watering, due to browning in the heat, of an area in the side front by the driveway down toward the end (where squirrels dug in the Winter and I added seed this Spring). Grabbed a full watering can and gave it some water.

Saw coastal zone 7a family member lawn, and front is hanging on. Some browning, some crabgrass only at edges, lots of clover (a positive...helps drought tolerance in low input situation versus grass alone, plus provides flowers for pollinators, etc.) Back seeding mostly hanging on. Just one area near driveway (and where dog goes a lot) looks totally dead. Hopefully we get more rain every so often so it hangs on through the Summer.

-----------

This morning: set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2.


----------



## Green

Mowed main front (3.6 mulch). Lots of brown disease spots...ughh. I've hardly done any preventatives so far.

Put down 7.25 lbs of Protene 8-0-4 fertilizer on the lower back and lower/middle side (0.375 lb of N). Went both directions. I think total N for Spring/early Summer is going to end up at or around 0.875 lb on most areas of the main lawn. I used to use 1.0 lb, but that seemed to be too much. I since reduced to 0.75, which seemed too low after doing it for a year or two. 0.50 was way too low. So, 0.875 is the new target, and seems about right now that it's about to be hit with this latest app. Amazing how much difference these 0.125 or 0.25 lb increments in total N can make in performance in the Spring.

Watered tree.

Set zone 3 to water for 170 min. tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Mowed side front (3.6) and hand trimmed. Then put down 8 lbs of Protene 8-0-4 fertilizer there (0.375 lb of N). Used setting just past 3 on Scott's Pro spreader and made 2 sets of perpendicular passes for even coverage. Ran out right at the end.

Finished mowing low input (4.X inches, discharge*). I originally mowed Saturday, but had to stop due to a brief rain shower. I finished tonight. Unfortunately, it was quite long (~8-10 inches) since so much time went by. Probably broke the 0.6 rule to some extent.

I decided to try something I'd been curious about for a while but was afraid to try, until I saw LCN mention doing it with his Toro SR. I increased the height setting one extra position* past the highest level (4 in) on the Recycler. It seemed to work. But then it started getting tougher to push partway through. Looking at the mower, one of the front height adjusters had disappeared! I was like, oh, $hit. I thought for sure it had sheared off somehow. Got a light (as it was now dark) and spent a couple min looking for it in the grass. Didn't see it. Thought I was going to have to figure out how to get a part and repair it. Then I noticed the wheel was out of position, too far forward. Ok...what the...? I felt underneath it, and noticed the adjuster was still there, but underneath. So, everything just got rotated a quarter turn or so. Easy fix! Moral: if you try this secret extra height trick on a regular 22" Recycler, only do it on the back wheels, not the front ones! And go slow while mowing like I did so you don't break anything! Hopefully the drive belt didn't get extra wear from this situation.

Enjoyed watching hundreds of fireflies afterward.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning to water in the fertilizer and replenish moisture. Will have to give the front hellstrip bed some water with the hose or watering can tomorrow, as it's not covered by the zone and the plants aren't looking so great. Lack of rain also shows any issues with sprinkler coverage, such as the garage side that is starting to brown and far neighbor road border that is quite brown and hydrophobic, too. Reminder: Check zone 2 coverage as well.


----------



## Green

Finished mowing low input (4+ in), mowed lower back and upper side (3.25) all discharge. And flood prone Reno area (3.6).

Watered garage side and tested two right corner rotator nozzles, Hunter and Rainbird. Hunter put out ~0.4 in and Rain bird 0.2 in in 45 min or so. Hunter is probably the one I'll install.

Watered near end portion of low input with oscillating sprinkler (0.6 in).

Fertilizer:

Put down 1.25 lbs of 8-1-8 XGRN (0.187 lb N and K) and 2.25 lbs of Protene 8-0-4 (0.375 lb N) on upper side. Total K: 0.375. Total N: 0.56 lb.

Put down 12 lbs of Protene 8-0-4 on the main front (0.375 N).

Watered transplanted tree and front hellstrip bed (first major watering; should have done it last week, as plants are getting dried-out-looking.

Noticed some powdery mildew and rust in flood prone Reno area.

Neighbor was mowed yesterday.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 1.5 hrs. each, tomorrow morning (around 0.75 inch).


----------



## Green

Checked sprinkler zone 1 and 2 heads. Mostly ok, but the mid-driveway head was stuck again, so not sure if it watered properly this morning. Also made a couple of minor arc adjustments, as things shift over time.

Just shut off the water now: Continued watering in low input area. FInished up to shed East-West (1.5 inch, oscillating sprinkler) and did the area that I leveled and overseeded last Fall (0.6 in) using my grandmother's old Craftsman rotating sprinkler (precurser to MP rotators?). Lost a valve out in the grass for a couple of hours in my haste, but thankfully found it eventually.

Tomorrow: continue watering, trimming, mowing, spraying. Nozzle testing. Sedge. Tree.


----------



## Green

GDD count:

June 26th: 24
June 27th: 21
June 28th: 19.5
June 29th: 20
June 30th: 21
July 1st: 23.5
July 2nd: 26
July 3rd: 23
July 4th: 21
July 5th: 22.5
July 6th: 25
July 7th: 22
July 8th: 22
July 9th: 23
Total: 313
Goal: 260-280


----------



## Green

Watered middle side-front (0.5 in small oscillating sprinkler), driveway side of main front (0.4 in using Orbit gear drive rotary), mid-back-low-input, and near-back-neighbor-border-low-input (~half inch using Hunter PGP Ultra with 3.5gpm dark blue nozzle).

Sprayed biofungicide:

Side front: 7oz Companion 2-0-1, 0.2 oz PGR, >1 tsp Nufilm 17

Main front: leftover bit plus: 9oz Serenade and 0.3 oz PGR; >1 tsp Nufilm 17

Side and lower back: leftover plus ~4 oz Companion 2-0-1.

Used typical application patterns/strategies. Sprayed main front curb repair area for first time (minimal PGR). Extra applied to typical areas.

Watered tree.

Spot sprayed weedy grasses and Nutsedge (mostly Poa Triv) in flood prone Reno area with glyphosate.

Front hill patches turning dark due to drought stress. Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.

Next two days and beyond:

-Reno fert?
-Watering
-trim
-mow
-spray (upper: sonata, nufilm. Reno: sonata)
-pruning
-branches
-tree 
-pressure and leak check, head shutoff ?
-sedge
-test zones in front
-Tenacity on back path
-weeds in sidewalk
-solarization 
-seed trays
-nozzle tests
-order sprayer ends, bug spray, fert, hose repairs, and new hose?
-Potassium fert


----------



## Green

Yesterday:

Hand watered hellstrip bed and bit of main front road/neighbor border corner grass that's been browning out for past couple of weeks.

Mowed low-input (4 in discharge). Was within 1/3 rule.

Mowed upper back and edges along patio (3.6 mulch) and trimmed walkway and drainage mound area. Getting a bit dry in spots.

-----------

Set zone 4 to water for 25 min x2 this morning.


----------



## Green

Hand watered struggling areas, including by the sidewalk, which looked almost black today (there was a less pronounced warning yesterday, but I ignored it since I had watered that morning). Watered hellstrip bed again, too.

Put down fertilizer on flood prone 1K Reno area: 0.33 lb of 29-0-4 and 1.0 lb of 0-0-50 SOP. Then set up the oscillating sprinkler. It's watering now. Super dry, and some rust and powdery mildew disease, too. Left two of the catch gauges out there; note: mark obstacle tomorrow.

Pulled a few small crabgrass plants from the area just beyond the Reno area. I expect Nutsedge to start soon, too.

Thankfully it's windy and not humid today.

A little later, I mowed the lower back and side (3.25 mulch), and the front and garage side (3.6 mulch after washing mower). Most of the watered spots were pretty much fully dry by tonight.

Set zone 5 to water for 26 min x2 tomorrow morning.

Going to hold off at least another day on zone 3, which was watered just under a week ago.


----------



## Green

Tested all sprinkler zones today. With no significant rain for 3 weeks and Summer heat, it's imperative that they work right. Ran zone 4 for around 17 min at 5PM or so, due to extensive testing. Opened up the package for my Hunter pressure gauge with pitot tube and used it for the first time to measure output dynamic pressures at the heads. It's a bit tricky to use while the heads rotate, and I got pretty wet. But pressure appears to be around 40 psi, which is optimal. I'll do further testing upon installation of the new head. Plumber tested the static pressure this morning, which was low to mid 90s psi. If my measurements are accurate, going up the hill must result in significant pressure loss.

Watered area next to patio with rotating sprinkler. Put down too much water...an inch or more.

Checked brown spots in lower back by pushing irrigation foam into soil. No rocks felt. Not sure why I have small localized dry spots developing. If they worsen, will do a root-feeding insect test.

Also watered behind shed with small oscillating sprinkler. 0.6 in.

Got a few minutes of "rain" drops this evening. Not even a trace amount.

Set zones 1 and 2 to both water for 1.5 hours each, and zone 3 for 2 hours tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

To-do list:

-Trimming 
-bed and shrub irrigation
-tree
-find prs 40
-nozzle test with prs 40
-head install
-solarization 
-soil and mulch bags
-weed ID
-ET data
-journal data
-photos
-wetting agent
-drainage project


----------



## Green

Today: Watered hellstrip bed. Watered tree. Started eliminating weeds and crabgrass in road gutter.

Set zone 5 to water for 26 min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Hand watered various areas. Watered tree with watering can, then set up irrigation on the area (including several positions in the Reno area. Put down 0.4 in on the existing lawn area. Also watered the main front road neighbor corner using the rotating sprinkler. Accidently put down about 1.2 inches of water, but I'd rather have too much than too little.

Front hill is drought stressing badly again just one day after being watered. Set zone 5 to water for 26 min x3 tomorrow morning, and will try to stretch it out until Tuesday (3 days) using hand watering on Sunday or Monday to fill in (and hoping for a little rain, too). We are now in abnormally dry (first level) on the drought monitor (but with the next level, moderate drought, just a town or two over), and stage 2 drought in the state system. Water company asking for 10% conservation. Will not wash my car at home as I'd been considering...will take it to the car wash where water is presumably (hopefully) somewhat recycled.


----------



## Green

2 weeks without rain: last real rain was 0.1 inch on 7/2.
3.5 weeks without significant rain: last significant rain was 0.75 inch on June 21st/22nd.

Mowed most of low input (4.0 discharge, very little growth). And mowed main front (3.6). Trimmed plow repair area by hand.

Watered near end of low input, and did not mow it yet. Only put down 0.2 inch.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 1.5 hours each tomorrow morning.

Also set up and tested 2 hose-end sprinklers on side front neighbor border and connected to Orbit timer to water for 1 hour tomorrow morning.

Today was cloudy and only topped out at 78F, which was nice, but dewpoint was 64...not much lower than the temp, a bit sticky at times.

Back has some brown spots forming. Need to check the soil for debris (upper back) and insects (lower back; no debris felt).


----------



## Green

Yesterday evening: watered middle of low input, but sprinkler only put down 0.1 inch after 3.5 hours for some reason.

Today: finally got rain. Still raining. Looked like about an inch as of 5:30 PM. Still raining now. It was over 3.5 weeks without real rain. A lot of lawns are brown. And 90s all this week starting tomorrow, so the rain was needed badly.

Rain total tonight: 1.2 in.

Never got to finish mowing; it'll have to be done tomorrow evening, right before the following 95F day.


----------



## Chris LI

Glad you got some rain before the oven gets turned on. Hopefully, that will carry you through the heatwave.


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Glad you got some rain before the oven gets turned on. Hopefully, that will carry you through the heatwave.


Thanks. I think it will, for the most part, at least for the first few days (the side front will undoubtedly need supplemental water first, by Thurs. morning at the latest, maybe earlier, and other areas will follow suit one by one over the following days).
--------------------
I like calculating these things.

Forecast:
71 low tonight (Mon to Tues)
Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday:
91/71, 
95/73, 
92/69, 
94/70, 
95/72, 
92/70

(And then a bunch days in a row with high of around 88F following that)

That's 6 days. Let's say ET will be 0.285 inch per day in the worst larger areas (not talking about edges). We got 1.2 inches of rain.
0.285 x 6 = 1.71. 
1.2 - 1.71 = -0.51.
So, I'd have to supply over a half inch of water during the week to break even if there's no further rain during the coming 6 days. That will result in further browning. Realistically, I'll need at least another extra half inch beyond that as a buffer...if the roots can access that entire 1.2 inches from yesterday's / last night's rain. They may not be able to access anything beyond the first 0.75 inch. 1.2-0.75 = 0.45 inch additional. So, I may need to add up to one inch over the next 6 days, biased more toward the end of the period. I don't need to cause things like oxygen deprivation in soil spaces, or "wet-wilt" by watering too much.

Originally, had it not rained, I would have watered the side front this morning. That will be delayed until Thursday, I believe, due to the rain. I may skip mowing most of that area, all together, tomorrow. I think the PGR is still active.

Not sure what I'm going to do in the non-irrigated low input area, as watering in the evening is a bad idea this week. I might water during the day on a cloudy day if there is one, even if it's hot. Goal is to not have hoses stay out too long and cause grass damage.

I'm thankful we can use a bit of water at this point. There are voluntary conservation measures in place currently.


----------



## g-man

Green said:


> That's 6 days. Let's say ET will be 0.285 inch per day in the worst larger areas (not talking about edges). We got 1.2 inches of rain.
> 0.285 x 6 = 1.71.
> 1.2 - 1.71 = -0.51.


This calculation is not correct. The soil can only hold on to X amount of water per in of depth. Even on the high side of clay soils, I think you will struggle to get to 1in of water in 6in of root depth. In other words, 1.2in of rain does not equal 1.2in in your root zone.


----------



## Green

g-man said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's 6 days. Let's say ET will be 0.285 inch per day in the worst larger areas (not talking about edges). We got 1.2 inches of rain.
> 0.285 x 6 = 1.71.
> 1.2 - 1.71 = -0.51.
> 
> 
> 
> This calculation is not correct. The soil can only hold on to X amount of water per in of depth. Even on the high side of clay soils, I think you will struggle to get to 1in of water in 6in of root depth. In other words, 1.2in of rain does not equal 1.2in in your root zone.
Click to expand...

Right. (Technically the calculation is correct, but it's not applicable to my soil in reality).

That's why I added the subsequent information and calculations:


Green said:


> Realistically, I'll need at least another extra half inch beyond that as a buffer...if the roots can access that entire 1.2 inches from yesterday's / last night's rain. They may not be able to access anything beyond the first 0.75 inch. 1.2-0.75 = 0.45 inch additional. So, I may need to add up to one inch over the next 6 days, biased more toward the end of the period.


My conclusion later in that post was that I'm going to need to ideally need to add about one inch of additional irrigation this week. I'm not basing that on what my loamy/somewhat sandy can technically hold, though, and not going through those calculations; but basing it on personal experience of wilting points. That's what the numbers in the above quote are based on.

In some of my areas, the soil is such that only 0.4 inch or so may be plant available of the 1.2 total. I may need to supplement with more than 1 inch in those areas.

In other areas, it's closer to 0.75 inch from the recent rain that the roots can likely access (partially shaded by house during late afternoon, TTTF with deeper than 6-inch roots, and higher soil exchange capacity and organic matter percentage). In normal Summer weather, that area can go about 9 days between waterings or rain.

Hope that clears it up.


----------



## Green

Only 89F yesterday. Last night: finished mowing. Did lower back and lower side (3.25), middle and upper side (3.75), rest of low input (4.X), side front (3.6), and upper back (3.6), all discharged. Skipped some areas that were too stressed.


----------



## Green

Did a bit of hand trimming in the back. Rust is starting now near the walkway (on those areas that don't get trimmed often). Collected those few blades by hand and threw them in the trash, but there is still some rust down lower. I am not using PGR in back this year (which would give Rust the chance for a quicker foothold due to slower growth), but still have only had to mow it once per week in the upper back (thankfully, because the jumping worms made the slope steeper and I'm having a foot issue, so it's tough on the slope). Plan is to keep adding fertilizer there in ~0.25 lb increments monthly as I have been since April, as well as making sure to keep things trimmed and irrigated as much as possible to keep rust pressure low as long as possible culturally.

Worked on some of the road weeds in the front. Still no crabgrass to be found in the South-facing front lawn areas, and I did not pre-M it this year.

As expected (see previous posts), side front needs supplemental irrigation tomorrow. Set zone 5 to water for 26 min x2 tomorrow morning. There's also the chance of a storm in the afternoon.

Watered tree. 1 can full. Soil was still slightly damp to touch, but not taking any chances in this heat. High was 95F today. Supposedly still around 83 now at 9PM.


----------



## Green

Sprayed Hydretain on dry parts of low input about 45 min ago. There was a 97% chance of a thunderstorm hitting us between 3:00 and 3:15, but it went a few miles North and we got nothing. So, I set up the oscillating sprinkler on full blast a few minutes ago to at least get it somewhat watered in. Will need to move it a few times this afternoon/evening to water everywhere I put down the Hydretain. I don't think I've ever applied it this late in the Summer. Sprayed a bit on problem areas in back, but didn't get to water them in.

Ended up mowing after the heat broke from the "cold front" (still 83F right now at almost 8PM). It had been 5 days and the main front was long (PGR rebound? I haven't calculated GDD yet, but it's been only 12 days and I used a low rate last time, so anything is possible I guess). Mowed main front (and upper side again) at 3.6 with discharge.

Hand watered lower front hill around 5PM (as well as driveway slope) as the sprinklers didn't put out enough water up this morning when set for 52 min. The lower portion only had 0.15 inch, while the middle had 0.3. I lowered the nozzles in the two lower heads last year by 0.25 gpm, but may have to put them back to where they were again. Watered hellstrip bed. Watered tree with 2/3 can full.

Finished watering the low input area at 8PM. Put down 0.3-0.4 inch in most places; nothing lower than 0.25. Sprayed and watered from the area I leveled and overseeded last Fall, to the near end. Pulled a Nutsedge seedling that was almost a foot tall from far end just outside the Reno border. Came right up with roots and no breakage evident; must have been a true seedling and not from tubers. That's how most of mine seem, and they're just a single plant here or there and not in groups, so I guess I can just keep controlling them this way.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 1.5 hours each, zone 3 for 60 min, and zone 4 for 45 min tomorrow morning.


----------



## ionicatoms

Green said:


> There was a 97% chance of a thunderstorm hitting us between 3:00 and 3:15, but it went a few miles North and we got nothing.


LOL this is so relatable.


----------



## Green

ionicatoms said:


> Green said:
> 
> 
> 
> There was a 97% chance of a thunderstorm hitting us between 3:00 and 3:15, but it went a few miles North and we got nothing.
> 
> 
> 
> LOL this is so relatable.
Click to expand...

Totally! Happens to us all. But at least you guys probably get multiple chances for afternoon thunderstorms a week this time of year (though maybe not quite like South Florida). By the way, earlier today before the "cold front" came through, it truly felt like Florida outside.

Up here, we hadn't gotten rain in over 3 weeks until the other day. Thankfully we did get it. But this whole week is low to mid 90s with no rain, lol. And Sunday night, the forecast is showing 77 as the low...which is extremely rare here...usually if will go down to at least the low 70s, even during the middle of Summer. Cool season grass becomes prone to disease with higher humidity, mid-day rain, or evening watering (like I'm doing at this moment).


----------



## Green

Still classified by National drought monitor as "abnormally dry" but wouldn't be surprised if it gets to the 2nd level (moderate drought) in the near future (because of this heat, and because the county East of us has been in that level for a couple of weeks now).

Definitely have some disease spots here and there, still. Although red thread is now decreasing, Brown Patch is ramping up.

Today, I set up the old Craftsman rotating sprinkler that used to be my grandmother's, behind the shed around 4PM, and watered for around 40 min (0.4 inch). Tomorrow I will probably do another area or two.

Watered the tree with a full can this evening. It needs it every day in this heat. It's around a 70-100 ft walk from the house, and the watering can does the trick without the nuisance of a hose.

Set zone 5 to water for 40 min x2 tomorrow morning, but will hand water the lower front hill later in the day as well due to output of the sprinklers being insufficient there. Upper front hill is hanging on much better this year than the past several...as are the hellstrip areas (haven't had to hand water them much this Summer so far; the irrigation is doing the trick after dialing it in last year). Two or three years ago, I had to hand water them fairly often due to insufficient irrigation, and a couple of years before that, I had no irrigation in them whatsoever, and had to drag a hose out every other day to water them in the heat (and then a lot of it would run off into the road, and the areas would look a bit brown still). Definitely an improvement, bit by bit.

Sprayed some road weeds (mostly crabgrass) with my usual pavement contact herbicide of choice for midsummer--5% acetic acid. (Then you let the sun bake them, and follow up again in a week or so if needed.)


----------



## Green

Did a lot of hand watering in various areas, including neighbor main front and side border, lower front hill, side front, etc. Watered in a few areas using rotating sprinkler, including lower side. Still tending to put down too much water. I verified that it waters faster on lower settings, due to more water on a smaller area (it rotates slower and throws the water less distance as a result). Watered tree again. Goal is no watering tomorrow (high humidity and 92-95 high temp is likely).

Pulled a little more crabgrass and a few Nutsedge from in and near the border of the MHL reno area.


----------



## Green

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning. Watered tree.


----------



## Green

PGR is starting to rebound. Been too hot out to do anything.

There was a decent possibility of rain today (at one point 80% chance), but other than a very brief sprinkle, got nothing.

Gave neighbor C 1.5oz of Quinclorac for his Crabgrass issue.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 60 min each tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Mowed front (3.6). Main front mostly overgrown due to rebound. Upper front hill now browning more than lower, due to lack of rain.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning.

Neighbor was mowed today.

To-do list:
-shoes*
-mowing
-marking
-Triv apps
-tea seed meal
-zone 5 nozzles
-sedge
-PGR and biofungicide
-Tenacity (back walk)
-tree
-seed trays
-Zone 4 sprinkler head
-further nozzle tests 
-SOP
-order liquid fert and extra sprayer elbows


----------



## Green

Mowed flood prone Reno area (3.6). Lots of weeds (mostly the dwarf st. John's wort), and grass in the most shaded area is struggling. Moss also keeps coming back. Definitely a long term work in progress.

Painted marks.

Mowed lower back and side. Some areas were a bit long. 3.25 discharge.

Watered tree.

Set zone 3 to water for 85 min x2 to tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Watered tree.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Mowed low input (4.X discharge). Last mow there was 13 days ago. The Hydretain I sprayed about a week ago seems to be doing its thing, but it's definitely time to water again after all of the hot days. Mowed upper back (parts of which have gone dormant), and put down 6.5 lbs of 3-0-1 Tea Seed Meal fertilizer (0.18 lb of N) there and on much of the garage side. I've been doing this monthly since May due to jumping worms.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 45 min x2 and zone 4 for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Put down some fertilizer on low input:
1 lb of 0-0-50 SOP (0.5 lb K2O) and 3 lbs of Protene 8-0-4 (0.25 lb N) on flood prone area. Then watered it with 0.1 to 0.3 inch of water.

On rest of low input area, put down 11 lbs of SOP over 5.5K and 18 lbs of Carbon-Pro G (Lesco biochar product) on 4.5K. First time using it; hated it. Did not want to come out of the spreader. Not going to buy it again.

Hand watered in upper back, especially where I forgot to move the grill before the irrigation cycle.

Watered tree.


----------



## Green

Continued watering low-input area with oscillating sprinkler (~0.5 to 1 inch per area).


----------



## Green

Finally got some rain. Got about 0.75 inch of unexpected rain in a relatively short period last night. It's about time. Last rain before this was 2 weeks ago (other than a sprinkle or two at one point).

Mowed front with Toro, but had to change the HOC accordingly. I went down to 3.25 on the side front, and skipped most of the side slope all together to let it recover from heat stress. Discharged. Mowed the main front at a slightly higher setting: 3.75 back wheels, due to PGR rebound. Mulched.


----------



## Green

Red thread disease is no longer active, and the damage appears pretty much grown out (maybe lagging a little on low input area fine fescue).

Got a trace downpour this afternoon.

Started to mow a little while ago despite rain threat. Got the lower part of the lower back and side done, about 500 square feet. 3.25. Had to stop when rain started.

Then it started to rain again, with some heavy rain. Picked up almost another 0.25 inch.
----------------

Fertilizer plan for second half of Summer:

1 lb Potassium on low input (already done this past week)

0.5 lb Potassium on main lawn (early Aug)
0.5 lb of N and K on main lawn (Protene 19-0-19) (except upper back) (early to mid Aug)

1 lb Potassium everywhere (late Aug or early Sept)
Note: SOP, Sul-Po-Mag

0.5 lb of N on main lawn (Anuvia fert) (mid Sept)
0.5 lb of N on main lawn (Screamin Green) (late Sept)
-or possibly opposite order; need to do more research on the Anuvia

0.32 lb of N on low input from Screamin Green w/Prodiamine (late Aug)
0.68 lb of N on low input from regular Screamin Green (late Sept)

Note: Need Fall pre-M on side and lower back as well.


----------



## Green

Side front:
Minus slope and middle:
0.13oz or 4 ml PGR
4oz bio comp

Main front front: 16x42=0.672K. 0.08oz pgr =2.3ml
2oz bio

Rest=1.83K v
3.66g velocity 
0.44 oz AMS 
1.83 gallons water
Nis


----------



## Green

Today, finished mowing lower back (including in front of shed) and side (3.25 discharge). Sprayed Companion 2-0-1 Biofungicide on side front and front portion (non-Triv infested area) of main front. Also added in PGR on that area, and all of side front except middle portion (threatening to go dormant), much of dormant garage side, etc. Used variable application rate method. The section on the main front got 2.3mL of PGR, and the side front portions got 4mL. Biofungicide was dosed at approx 3oz per thousand. Nitrogen applied foliarly with this was around 1/200th of 1 lb.


----------



## Green

Today:

Watered in zone 5 for 10 min, and changed the front hill driveway/sidewalk corner head's nozzle from 0.75 gpm black to 1.0 gpm dark blue due to the heat stress issues of the last few weeks. The arc seemed slightly off, too (too far onto the driveway), so fixed that at the same time. Left the nozzle opposite it the same, as there was more shade and less pavement there.

Sprayed Velocity herbicide app #2 at 4oz per acre rate on the 1.83K of the main front that may have Triv, plus the areas marked out on the middle side (second app for the small area, and first app for the large area that previously had Sulfosulfuron). I used approx 2.5 gallons of distilled water, 4.5g of Velocity, 0.5 oz of AMS, and ~0.5oz of NIS. Area was just over 2,000 square feet totaled up. Left a bit of extra in the sprayer. My application area also avoided much of the exposed roots and some of the dripline of the small Hickory tree, just in case.

This is also a PGR and acts as a fungicide for dollar spot as well, both desirable effects. The PGR effect from it does not produce crazy surge rebound like t-nex. Unfortunately, it's discontinued and I have a limited amount. This, and it's a very hit or miss herbicide as far as effectiveness on Triv, noted in scientific literature as well. Hoping for the best this year.

Not sure if there's going to be a 3rd app. It's already late in the season, and Triv is going dormant...I can't really see it anymore anywhere, but i know it's there intermixed.

Temps are in the low 90s during the day. I do have some slight clipping clumps in the main front from the previous mow. Probably should have mowed slightly higher, or discharged.

Set zone 5 to water for an additional 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Very slight bit of rust disease the last few weeks in the upper back. I sprayed my first app of Sonata biofungicide there and on adjacent areas to try to stop it. 3oz rate, with 0.5 tsp rate of Nufilm. Pulled a Nutsedge seedling in the upper back. Hand trimmed some of the back walk grass.

Mowed upper and middle side (middle was sprayed with Velocity yesterday) at 3.25 discharge. Mowed near 2/3 of low input area at 4 and 4.X discharge*.

Before mowing, sprayed remaining Velocity on marked areas in low input. *skipped mowing on these 2 areas.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 30 min x2 each tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Sprayed Velocity herbicide (only app so far there) at 4oz per acre rate on far end of low-input area. Used 1.2 gallons of distilled water, 0.2oz AMS, 1.78g of Velocity (this time dissolved the AMS first), and 1.65 oz of NIS. Roughly 875 to 1,200 square feet area. Made sure not to spray into tree mulch area. I noticed yesterday that there is still some Poa Triv in the area with a little bit of green on it, despite the heat. Hopefully this app will knock it back without causing too many other problems. Plan is to follow up with an app of Tenacity plus Methylated seed oil as an experiment, and possibly Sulfentrazone following that. I want to try 3 consecutive different modes of action this time, and am trying different timings.

Also sprayed Velocity on the two areas near the back walkway. Left a bit in the sprayer.

Dwarf St. John's Wort weeds in the adjacent reno area are browning out. No herbicide has been used. I think the heat is getting them.

Watered tree.


----------



## Green

Went outside to start mowing, and no sooner heard thunder. Went back in to check the weather radar. Looked like I had 20 min, so I mowed the side front at 3.6 in (which was super dry because I skipped a watering). Started to rain right after finishing. Got about 0.2 inch of rain. Decided to water toward the end of it since it was already wet (it was about 8:30 by that time, and was getting dark since it was now around 8:30). Watered zone 5 for 30 min (another 0.18 inch or so). Total was about 0.38 inch with the rain and irrigation. Will resume watering again the day after tomorrow, unless it rains again.


----------



## Green

Got another 0.3 inch of rain this afternoon.

After that, mowed the main front at highest setting so far this year, 3.75 discharge.

Pulled some large Spurge, etc, in front bed and walkway.


----------



## Green

Mowed lower back. Started at 3.25 in for a few passes but too much was coming off, so went up to 3.75 (highest so far this year). Just over one week since the last mow there; growing a bit faster this week for sure.

Also mowed the lower and upper side at the same level; middle didn't need it due to regulation from Velocity.

Mowed far end of low input at 4 in. Noted more random crabgrass there and a couple more random Nutsedge in adjacent Reno area.

All discharged.

Grass is growing a little faster, but looks more flimsy at the same time. Not sure if this a reaction to the heat we had or what.

Also noticed first crabgrass (in the front) of the year, at border with main front / side.

Put down 1.75 lbs of 0-0-50 SOP (0.5 lb of K2O) on side front. Mostly parallel to driveway.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning. Starting at 5AM instead of 4:30 now because it's dark a little later in the morning now.

Edit 8/11/22: Watered tree today.


----------



## Green

Mowed upper back (3.6 discharge). Put down fertilizer on main front, side, and lower back. Used Protene 19-0-19 at 0.50 lb of N and K. First time trying this version. Good experience. Small (greens grade) prill, similar to many Scotts fertilizers. Easy to apply accurately.

Also pulled some weeds (Pokeweed, Oxalis, Virginia copper leaf, Spurge) in upper back before mowing, and got 2 gal of new gas for mowing. Added stabilizer.

Set zones 1, 2, and 3 to water for 30 min x2 each tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Mowed the low input area (near 3/4) at 4.X discharge. It has been around 2 weeks since the last mow, so some random grass blades were maybe 10 inches long, so broke the HOC rules of thumb for sure, but not terribly, since a lot of the grass didn't grow as much. But it was in the high 70s and ideal for mowing. It's still holding up well. Pulled some weeds at the same time. Went nice and slow with the mower. The Hydretain is definitely helping retain moisture as it hasn't rained in 5 days now and I haven't watered the area lately.

Also mowed the front hill and hellstrip areas at 3.6 mulch very slowly. Upper part (and to a lesser degree the rest of the side front) is still pretty dormant and didn't need mowing. Repainted my marks before mowing.
----------

To-do list:
Mosquito spray
Biofungicide and pre-M sprays 
Tenacity on Reno area
Sprinkler head plus pressure
Tree

Quick list:
Hand watering
Pruning
Trimming/seeds
Sedge wipe
Grass wipe
Road weeds
Driveway spray
Reno weeds
Reno spot spray?
Patio
Seed testing
Soil send out
Organize equipment 
Weeds in front spots
Orders


----------



## Green

Set zone 5 to water for a much needed 30 min x3 tomorrow morning. I delayed a day or two and it's pretty stressed but will bounce back as no one has walked on or mowed the stressed areas. Doing my part to conserve water.


----------



## Green

Watered tree. Pulled some weeds in and near reno area.


----------



## Green

Mowed lower back, lower and upper side at 3.75 discharge. Middle still regulated from Velocity and didn't need mowing yet. Mowed flood prone Reno area higher (3.75 mulch) after pulling some more weeds. Started trimming at back walkway and behind deck by hand.

Put down 0.5 lb/M of Potassium from 0-0-50 SOP on upper back and garage side, and 3 lb/M of of biochar from the Lesco product on the same area. Used the Scotts Wizz for both apps. Biochar is one of the materials that may help irritate jumping worms. Used around 4.25 lbs of it.

Set zone 4 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning. Sections are dormant/brown.


----------



## Green

Sprayed Prodiamine 65 wdg as Fall pre-M (pre emergent) on upper side (~0.5K area) and part of lower back and middle side adjacent to patio (0.45K area). Used 5.3g of Prodiamine. Was aiming for ~0.625 oz of AI per acre, which is a 3.5-4 month rate. Mostly trying to prevent Poa annua, but sprayed slightly into mulch bed to help against chickweed, etc., as well. Sprayed from house front border to patio lower border. Tried to skip spots where I might need to seed. First time using a Fall pre-M on this area, but the amount of Poa annua has slowly increased the last few years, so it was time to break the cycle. Usually, I'm reseeding Triv spots instead, but have fewer this year in that area, so I could pre-M instead.

Mowed main front (3.75 discharge). Only took off a small amount.

Neighbor was mowed.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 45 min x2 each tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Got 0.15 inch of rain late this afternoon.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Watered tree. Pulled up some weeds (mostly in front walk, but a couple of spurge and one crabgrass in back patio too).


----------



## Green

Started preparing upper back from deck to garage side for overseeding. Mowed low and collected after pulling up weeds (mostly violets). Lawn is not terrible in these areas, but definitely needs a little seed, especially in specific spots.

Next steps are:
-Do a jar compatibility test tonight with Anuew and Propiconazole 14.3 (if that goes well, I may try adding a few more items to the mix as well).

-Rake tomorrow, then mow one more time.
-Spray PGR and let dry
-Spot seed, and then broadcast seed
-Cover with peat moss and water


----------



## Green

Sprayed Anuew on area in upper back and adjacent side to be overseeded. Aimed for 0.3oz rate over estimated 0.85 K area.

Mowed near half or so of low input area at 4.X discharge.

Neighbor 11 was fertilized on 8/18.


----------



## Green

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Had a storm that yielded 0.4 inch of much needed rain yesterday afternoon and evening.

Previous rain was on the 18th, and was only 0.15 inch. I did not water the low input area in between, but it got through due to reduced mowing with strategic timing, higher HOC, sufficient-but-minimal fertility with slow release N, and of course the Hydretain (the secret ingredient that makes a real difference). Also almost no foot traffic.


----------



## Green

Today: quick mow in front at 3.75 discharge. Skipped areas that didn't need it due to drought stress. Main front (8 days) tended to be long where it did grow; I cut off about 55 percent. Also mowed lower part of front hill and hellstrip areas. Where the trees are taking water, the grass is hardly growing due to drought stress and has a grown tinge. Haven't had to mow most of the side front in maybe a couple of weeks. No argument from me; less to mow is a positive. Some animal also put an egg into the ground a couple of weeks ago. I doubt it's alive, but nothing has eaten it yet, either.

Most of the state, including our area, is now in D2, extreme drought. It only took about a week to go from D1 to D2.


----------



## Green

Yesterday: got 0.1 inch of rain.

Set zone 5 to water for 24 min x2 this morning.


----------



## Green

Mowed side (except middle) and lower back at 3.75 discharge.


----------



## Green

Put down 0.5 lb/M of potassium from 0-0-50 SOP on main front and side with Scotts Wizz. I think all areas are done now, except the upper back which I'm going to overseed.

Watered tree.

Found and removed one Crabgrass plant in the front, right next to the sidewalk. This was the first one in the front this year. Not bad for late August and not having used a pre-M. A small piece of Fescue came out with it, and I noticed a rhizome on it where it broke off. Good to see these in the wild every so often.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.

Started orange label seed germination tests last night and blue label ones tonight.


----------



## Green

Began raking out the upper back areas to be overseeded this evening, using the groundskeeper rake. As expected, a lot of dead grass is coming out. While raking, I started seeing worms, mostly "jumping worms" almost immediately, so I got a container of hot water and soap and started throwing them in as they popped up. Some of the worms detatched their lower halves, splitting in two. This is a defense mechanism, and then you use two pieces to find before they wiggle away quickly. I collected at least 10 worms from behind the deck area so far.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 Min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Tomorrow should be a big lawn day. I've been under the weather the past week, but am starting to feel better enough to do what I've been wanting to.

It looks like it's going to rain soon...just got a sprinkle now. Edit: rain passed over. 70% chance, but it was just a couple minutes of rain.


----------



## Green

The heat broke...low 80s now.

Didn't get to work on the overseed project yet, but got a lot of mowing done. It was very long, especially in the main front. I cut that and the upper side at 4.0 in with side discharging, the highest yet this year. It's just so dry. Speaking of which, the side front, which I mowed at 3.75 mulched, is getting a bit crispy despite watering. I'm not willing to water so much to keep it out of dormancy at this point. In fact, I skipped the upper front hill again, and only this week mowed the non-hill parts for the first time in a while.

Also mowed the low input area, raising to that extra 4.X setting again, and skipping some areas that were going dormant.

I had 8+ inch grass to mow today, overall.

Neighbor was mowed today.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x3 tomorrow morning (start times on 75 min intervals, inclusive of watering durations).


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## Green

Watered 2 spots in the middle side and 2 more across the main front. It was drying out near the road, and where it's most sunny this time of year, but a lot of other areas still had sufficient moisture by feel. Overwatered one of those areas near past year's Spring overseed, with over an inch. Watered near part of low input at 0.4 in.

Finished prepping upper back and garage side overseed area: manual dethatching, mowed low, and then put down seed. The area may be smaller than I eyeballed, so my seed rate could be up to 1.5x the 6 lb target; I used 4.5 lbs of seed, and in the bare areas, it almost looked like a new lawn seeding density. Oh well, it'll be ok. Seed was Bullseye TTTF. I'm not planning to top dress with peat moss this time, except maybe in the bare areas. The last two times I tried to overseed this area, it didn't work well; I never really got germination. Now I know it was due to jumping worms, likely eating the seed. Hopefully better results this time, and the higher seeding rate might compensate for such issues.

After seeding, turned on the sprinkler zone for 7 min and shut off and marked 3 heads that aren't needed. I might make other adjustments tomorrow. Tomorrow I'd like to spray Propiconazole and Tenacity on the area.

Set zone 4 to water for 3 min x4 during the day for the seed.


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## kay7711226

Glad your feeling better and ready to get the fall preseason started.


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## Green

kay7711226 said:


> Glad your feeling better and ready to get the fall preseason started.


Thanks! Slightly better. Still sick, but I'll take the improvement. Hoping it turns the corner tomorrow...almost 2 weeks now. Not COVID, btw.

Plus the allergies on top of it. Doing what I can lawn-wise. This is the first time in a couple of years I've taken allergy medicine (I'm not a fan of it).


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## Green

Trimmed in back. Mowed parts of lower back that needed it. (It's so dry that stuff is going a bit dormant.) Also mowed the part of upper back from deck. 4 in discharged.

Put down 1 lb/M of Potassium from 0-0-50 SOP fertilizer on the lower back with the Wizz. Finally gave in and put out 4 mini rain gauges and programmed a watering session.

Adjusted the last sprinkler head in zone 4 (closest to driveway) temporarily due to the overseed. Opened the screw almost an extra half turn. (The seed on the garage side wasn't getting water with the default setting). I want to replace one of the heads with an MP rotator but haven't gotten to it yet.

Watered tree.

Set zone 3 to water for 40 min x2 and zone 5 for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning.


----------



## Green

Germination test results: 5/6 day update

MHL orange label 2019 has a few seeds starting to open and several with early root emergence.

America KBG 2018 blue: early germ

Baron KBG 2018 orange: early germ

Mercury KBG 2018 blue: good early germ

Quartz KBG 2019 blue: some early signs of germination

JG black beauty 2018 orange has a decent amount of root emergence but likely is biased toward the Ryegrass component.

Apple SGL PR 2018 orange has excellent germ

Fiesta 4 2018 blue: most rapid, complete germ and most robust rooting

Karma PR 2018 blue: similar to Fiesta

Firecracker 2018 orange: good early germ

Sitka TF 2019 blue: widespread germ, excellent roots, most robust plants emerging of any here

Scotts coated TF orange 2016- nothing yet, might be too old.

Summer TF 2018 orange: good early germ

Tribute II TF 2019 blue: excellent germ and roots

Jetty hard fescue orange has a lot of roots and some green shoots germinating.

Side PR/KBG mix blue (Fiesta, etc.): some germ (mostly PR) with excellent roots.

Side front 80/10/10 TF/PR/KBG mix blue: some germ, looks reduced; likely biased toward PR and TF.


----------



## Green

Mowed main front and upper side at 3.75 discharged.

Mowed most of flood prone/reno area at 3.75 mulched. Super dusty from being dry.

Low-input area: Put down 8 lbs of Screamin' Green 16-2-3 fertilizer with 0.37% Prodiamine pre-emergent on about 4,000 square feet. 3 month rate. Roughly 1/3 lb of N (first N since late Spring). Previous pre-M was about 9-10 weeks ago. Skipped Reno area and adjacent area, a bit behind shed, very near end, dry areas that might need overseed near back neighbors, and random bare spots so I can seed.

Put down 1.68 lb/M of granular pre-M (Benefin/Trifluralin) on rest of lower back and side below patio. Might need to follow up with another pre-M app this Fall. Skipped areas that might need seed, sprinkler work, or digging and rehab.

Pulled a bunch of Pokeweed. Probably shouldn't have handled it (read about it...kind of scary), so washed my hands and got gloves.

Finished up upper back overseed. Adjusted sprinklers: head behind deck: closed screw 3/4 turn. Grill head: closed it by about 1 turn. Schedule was 8:30, 11:30, 2:30, 5:30, but changed it for tomorrow due to recent applications:

Put down on the area:
-Peat moss on bare spots only (there are 3 small spots basketball and smaller); did not bother with KBG seed, just the Bullseye TTTF.
-0.5 lb/M of K from 0-0-50 SOP fertilizer (upper back); another 0.5 will go down at first mow
-very low rate of SLS to help water penetration and hasten seed germination (whole upper back and garage side)
-Tenacity at 4oz rate without surfactant
-Propiconazole 14.3 fungicide at 1 oz rate (upper back and garage side) to prevent disease and improve germination

Also set zones 1 and 2 to water for 40 min each tomorrow morning.


----------



## Chris LI

Lots of progress in a short amount of time! Do you have them set up in test plots, or spot seeded areas you are tracking?

I'm quite familiar with blue tag and gold tag certified seed, but orange tag, I haven't heard of. After looking it up, it appears to be breeder's seed. I also found it listed as Maryland Highway Dept. tagged seed (Newsome). Can you elaborate?


----------



## Green

Chris LI said:


> Lots of progress in a short amount of time! Do you have them set up in test plots, or spot seeded areas you are tracking?


So, basically, I wanted to start this project in mid August, but have been sick (getting over it, I think) the last two weeks, and didn't do much for a week or so. So, it all happened later than I wanted. The bare spots (spots I glyphosated back in Spring) were going to get my normal seed mix for the area (the TTTF plus KBG). But when I seeded, it looked like there was enough seed after spreading the TTTF, so I didn't go back and add anything more to it. I figure it'll be interesting to see how the spots look as 100% Bullseye TTTF before the KBG starts to creep back in from adjacent areas.



Chris LI said:


> I'm quite familiar with blue tag and gold tag certified seed, but orange tag, I haven't heard of. After looking it up, it appears to be breeder's seed. I also found it listed as Maryland Highway Dept. tagged seed (Newsome). Can you elaborate?


Lol! I knew someone was going to ask about that. In actuality, the blue and orange labels are simply my own labels that I had put on my seed to label the closed bags! I was listing the color because the blue label tests were started a day later! I don't have breeder seed.

That said, I have seen "white tag" seed for sale (not to be confused with plain white tags printed by seed companies)...it's labeled as experimental seed.


----------



## Green

Started raining late yesterday, then stopped. Had about 0.1 inch last night. It then started raining again late this afternoon. Tonight's total as of several hours ago (including that bit from yesterday) was 0.64 inch. But it's still reining, and is supposed to continue. I removed the irrigation gauge and replaced it with the full sized rain gauge, so we'll see how much additinal rain there is. I watered the upper back/garage overseed once today for the standard 3 minutes around 2:30 PM because it was just too dry and hadn't rained yet. (I had shut off the timer last night since rain was expected today.)

Seed test update: the 2016 (could even be 2015 crop) Scotts coated TTTF seed is dead. No germination. 8 days. All other TTTF has germinated as of several days ago. Threw the test away before it molded too much. I was wondering if coated seed lasts longer; apparently not or not to any extent. I only have about a handful left, so not a big deal.


----------



## Green

As of tonight: almost 4.2 inches of rain! I think it's done now. Drought category should improve within a week after this. This brings the total to at least 4.8 inches.

Not really seeing any major TTTF seed germination action yet, but a lot of the seed has popped open and the roots are coming out.


----------



## Green

With almost 10x the amount of rain required to water in Prodiamine, I'm considering topping it off with a little extra in a few weeks. That and really scratching up the soil well where I'm dropping seed, as the pre-M likely moved into those spots to some degree. There are some good articles online about pre-emergent and excessive rain. It gets pretty complicated, with active ingredient, OM, soil texture, pH, etc., all impacting it. Prodiamine and Pendimethalin have pretty good binding affinity; better than dithiopyr. But Trifuralin is even less likely to move off target.

Sulfentrazone, a post-M that is very soil active, has the lowest binding affinity, and is very likely to move off target with excessive rain, possibly contaminating ground water or gardens or ponds. Good thing I didn't use it yet. I'm going to use it at half rate (1.3oz per thousand of Ortho brand) mixed with 3oz/A Tenacity and Methylated seed oil to try to suppress Triv, wait 2 weeks, and then more Tenacity plus MSO at 4oz rate, along with Ryegrass spot seeding and/or overseeding if needed. That should hurt the Triv. Next year, I'll consider Anuew, which I recently purchased.

Night update: went out with the flashlight again and this time, saw some germination in the upper back and garage side overseed. Water was off today due to yesterday's rain, and clouds with low temps today. Set the timer to start watering again just before 10AM tomorrow.


----------



## Green

Everything is long. Needs mowing. Still very damp. The rain really woke it up. All of it soaked in...no standing water. Germination is proceeding slowly on the overseed. Altering the watering schedule back to the default again.

Neighbor was aerated yesterday. Couldn't ask for a better time to do so. Cores look like over an inch in some cases.


----------



## Green

Looked at coastal CT (Zone 7a) family member yard. Very rough...mostly brown, some losses (including almost all of the seed I threw down earlier in the year most likely), and lots of leaves have come down. @Powhatan 
Threw down a few more handfuls of Agway tri rye seed in the back near the deck and driveway for grins. Still way too early to put down fertilizer there considering how brown it is. I wonder if some of the grass I planted a few months ago will come back, or if it's all dead. All the new grass is brown and matted.


----------



## Green

Mowed near 2/3 of low input; 4.X discharged. A few more leaves starting to come down. Grass way overgrown, maybe 8-10 inches; probably broke 60% rule, but grass looks good overall.

Even more germination on upper back and adjacent side overseed.

Germination tests (13/14 day update):

KBG: 
America 2018: very good 80%
Mercury 2018: good 60-70%
MHL 2019: good 45-60% (threw away test due to mold on stacked seed)
Quartz 2019: excellent 90%
Baron: fair 40-50% (threw away test)

Mixes:
JG: good 70-75% (threw away test)
Side front: fair to good 50%
Side: fair to good 65% but needs more PR seed

TTTF:
All excellent 85-95%
Note: Firecracker seedlings least robust; Sitka most robust, but differences are not dramatic

TTPR:
Same as TTTF


----------



## Green

Yesterday: Mowed the rest (remaining low input, reno area, main front, back, sides) at 4.X and side front at 4.0, all discharged and overgrown), despite being damp to wet from rain, etc.

Put down 0.75 lb of 29-0-4 Expert Gardener fertilizer product on LF Reno areas.

Started Flame 2016 and Scotts EZ 2018 germination tests a few hours ago.


----------



## Green

Got 0.1 inch of rain last night.

Sprayed Sonata biofungicide at 4oz rate plus Nufilm plus PGR at 0.1 oz rate plus residual Propiconazole on main front and most of front hill; rest of side front got residual PGR with the fungicide mix only; side and lower back as well as upper back near shed got the same without PGR. Walkway grass not sprayed. Omitted the spreader sticker on 2 areas I need to spray with herbicide: bentgrass in front hill, and an area where I found Poa triv recovering in the main front. The spray didn't get to dry due to dew, unfortunately.

Mowed a strip below my upper back overseed, which is progressing well enough. Water was off today due to moisture. Just a little bit of seed may have moved from the heavy rain last week, but nothing major.

Then, mixed tenacity at 4 oz rate plus AIR8 at 6oz rate (first app of the year); no surfactant and sprayed flood prone/KBG reno area from last year (which is still a work in progress and has more area left to be finished, but it's too late to seed any more KBG this year).Will hit with half rate followup in 2 weeks.

Also applied 4 lbs of Protene 19-0-19 180 SGN fertilizer to side front (minus overseed) using Scotts Wizz. 4 lbs fit into it, but it struggled a bit to get it out. 0.5 lb/M of both N and K.

Finally, raked dead grass out of spots in lower/middle side and lower back, and reseeded; topped with peat moss. Most of these spots were Poa kill spots from Spring; a couple were killed from Summer (need to check soil for debris). Hopefully I raked enough to break any pre-M barrier.

More spot reseeding to come later this week. Sept 15th is pretty much the do-by date for Fescue for decent results.

Found 2015 VNS CRF seed I didn't know I still had from a project lawn. Starting a test on it (failed a test 1.5 years ago so not expecting much). Threw out Mercury (60-65% germ, MHL (similar), Quartz, side, and Jetty (70-75%) tests due to mold.


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## Green

Got 0.25 inch of rain yesterday over about 15 hours with some lightening.

Overseed weeds (and extisng grass) have started to whiten the last couple of days from Tenacity

Set watering to resume this morning: 3 min each at 9, 1, and 5PM.

Set zone 5 to water for 20 min to top off the rain.


----------



## Green

2 week mark with the overseed. Everything is pretty much germinated. Reset watering for 3x per day: 9:30, 1PM, and 4:45. 4 min each time.


----------



## Green

Mowed main front and front hill (4 in, discharged).

Germination test update:
Flame and VNS CRF: none yet
Scotts: some just starting.

Tribute TTTF has pulled ahead with the fastest grow-in and best color. Firecracker is the weakest of the TTTFs so far.

Throwing away Fiesta, America, and Firecracker tests due to mold.


----------



## Green

Raked all the bare spots in the main front (from glyphosate) with the groundskeeper rake to remove the dead grass, and seeded my 80% TTTF mixture, topped with peat moss, and watered. Also dethatched a few other problem spots but did not seed most of those as it wasn't needed. I did a throw and go overseed near the utilities with some Rowdy TTTF seed, though, to thicken the shaded area that struggles. Didn't add peat moss yet; might not bother after seeing how well the back overseed went without it.

Edit: Tomorrow will be in the 70s and might not be sunny all day, so I shut off the water tonight so I can attempt to mow the overseed tomorrow.


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## Chris LI

Lots of spot seeding :thumbup: I need to do the same. I've been shopping for a Groundskeeper II, but am on hold with price/availability. I'll probably stick with my metal leaf rake for the meantime. The Snapper Thatcherizer did a pretty good job, anyway.


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Lots of spot seeding :thumbup: I need to do the same. I've been shopping for a Groundskeeper II, but am on hold with price/availability. I'll probably stick with my metal leaf rake for the meantime. The Snapper Thatcherizer did a pretty good job, anyway.


Home Depot online.


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## Green

Note: Sept. 17th. (Somehow the date stamp says the 18th.) 

Mowed upper back overseed for the first time. Just over 2 weeks since seed down. Don't think I've ever mowed an overseed so soon. A Reno would have waited a bit longer...the existing grass helped protect the new grass from wear while mowing in this case. Used the lighter gas push mower, set with the rear wheels at the 2.2 inch setting and the front wheels at the 2.6 setting for better maneuvering leverage and less dig-in. The Bullseye TTTF seed came in pretty fast. Overseeding when grass was still slightly dormant worked great combined with Anuew PGR and Propiconazole growth regulators (not mixed at same time due to incompatability) to give hew seed an advantage.

Also mowed the adjacent grass (collars outside the overseed) at 3.6 in.

Mowed the rest of the side front (including hellstrip areas again) at 4.0 in mulched, and upper side discharged (overgrown). No time for any more today.

Turned watering back on for tomorrow on upper back overseed: 4 min at 10, 1PM, 4.

Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning. Some drought stress; also not yet recovered from Summer stress. Most other areas are mostly recovered now.

Got gas. Didn't add stabilizer yet.

Talked with friend. Said he thinks he lost a bit of grass this Summer, and overseeded/seeded a few areas, including in the middle of the back. He had some crabgrass because he never got his second Spring Pre-M app down. We discussed N rates for Fall. He'll aim for 1.6 lb of N, and a bit of K.


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## Green

Mowed rest of side, lower back (4 in discharged), near shed (4.X). Put down 0.50 lb of N from 16-2-3 Screamin' Green fertilizer on side and main front.

Set zones 1 and 2 to each water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning. Let it go to the max...drying out a bit near the road.


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## Green

Mowed a lot of the overgrown low input area but didn't get to finish due to a thunderstorm.

Last couple of days were in the low 80s with dewpoint in the 60s. After this, there are no more 80s in the two week forecast, and even some some 60s. Fall is really coming. I'm not exactly thrilled. Better finish seeding before soil temps drop. Also, I don't think there were any 90s in September this year.

Ended up with almost 0.2 inch of rain.

Tested zone 1 sprinklers. Driveway/road corner head is going slightly too far to the left arc, past the driveway edge.

Reduced upper back overseed watering to twice per day for 6 min each, 8AM and 3PM starting tomorrow.


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## Green

Just finished mowing in the low input before it started raining again. 4.X discharged, grass up to 10 inches in some spots because I hadn't mowed it in 10 days. Cut off almost 60% of the height. So it's growing up to 1/3 inch or so per day. Hoping to step up the frequency soon, but still have other things that need doing.

Neighbor was mowed today.

Got a trace amount of rain this evening.

Turned off the water on the upper back overseed for tomorrow so I can mow it again.


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## Green

Yesterday:

Seeded a number of spots in the low input area, using various seed (very little actual sed was used, but I used some ASP Tri-Rye, some Barenbrug TTTF (with Ryegrass as most of the other crop), and most of my leftover Scotts seed/mulch mixture. Also tried the sod quality Jackpot KBG mixed with the Rye on the spot closest to the main lawn, so we'll see if it lives up to the hype as far as quick germination. Used some of the Rushmore Chewings Fescue on a shady spot. I didn't cover any spots there or in the main lawn with peat moss at this point due to time, but I did garden weasel many of the spots after raking with the groundskeeper, and tamped them tight with a garden rake or my hand after seeding, so the seed is absolutely not going anywhere.

In the main lawn, I seeded a couple of spots in the lower back (TTTF/KBG), and a couple in the upper side (Ryegrass/KBG, adding a bit more Fiesta 4 to the spots because the mix was too KBG-heavy and will never grow in).

I gave the upper back overseed its second mow at around 2.4 inches, and mowed the adjacent collars at the high setting again. Put down first fertilizer there and on entire upper back and garage corner/part of side): 1 lb/M of 0-0-50 SOP product, and 3 lb/M of 3-0-1 Tea Seed Meal.

Mowed upper side before seeding. 4.X discharged.

Mowed rectangular portion of flood prone MHL KBG Reno area. 3.75 discharged.

Put down 1 lb/M of K2O from 0-0-50 SOP fertilizer on the entire low input area, going a bit heavier on the near end with the extra. Also put down 0.50 lb of N on the ~1,000 square foot far end of the low input area (adjacent to the Reno area) using 3 lbs of 16-2-3 Screamin' Green (first N on that area in a few months).

Put down 0.50 lb of N (applied perpendicular to house only) from 16-0-2 (actually 16-1-2) Anuvia fertilizer on the lower back. First time trying it. Going to see how it stacks up against Screamin' Green.

Put mosquito dunks out in the flood prone area since rain is expected.

Sprayed 9oz per thousand of 0-0-5 AIR 8 (I keep wanting to write 0-0-8, but it's not) on the flood prone area. Plus Prodiamine residue (some still in the sprayer), and sprayed some rinsate solution heavy on the area next to the patio near the stone work.


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## Green

Germination test update:

As of 2 days ago:

Flame TTTF showed only one seed germinating out of a few hundred.
(Today: same; really need to use this stuff up this week)

old VNS CRF: nothing, as expected.

Scotts seed: a bit more germination, but hard to tell what it is other than Ryegrass, as there is a lot of mulch.


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## Green

Got 2/3 inch of rain early this morning over several hours. This evening, I noticed dead and dying worms (mostly "jumping worms") in the area I treated last night. Looks like it was effective. I saw 10 or so, but I bet there were 50+ in the entire area.

Water ponded in the flood prone area, so glad I put down the AIR-8 and mosquito dunks last night. Didn't get to dig my simple drainage trench yet; now I have to wait for it to dry out. Hopefully I get the opportunity.


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## Green

Cold today. 50s and windy. Quickly mowed rest of upper back and started edges of lower back after trimming this evening; main front (4.X). Blew leaves off of upper back and garage side overseed areas. Hand watered grass seed spots in main lawn.

Reset overseed watering for once per day at 12 min starting tomorrow. Water had been off the last few days due to rain. Still pretty moist; don't want to overwater, so will keep checking it.


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## Green

Had time this afternoon to finish mowing at 4.X but that was it. Mowed the side front, side, lower back, and low input area.

Saw some Zoysia today in my area, walked over it a bit, and was fairly impressed with it. Too bad it's going to start going brown very soon and then will stay that way well into April...about 6 months of the year. It felt much more durable than cool season grass.


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## Green

Last night: got 0.1 to 0.15 inch of rain. Did not water the overseed areas today. Made a last minute decision to keep it off again tomorrow so I can mow, maybe fertilize, etc.

Tonight: seeded the two bare spots in the side front. One of them had a good amount of grass in it, mostly TTTF, that never got fully killed, starting to come back. I did one app of glyphosate in May or June on the spot, and a Triclopyr app later on. No Triv survived this time...none came back whatsoever since then.

I've also occasionally seen Fescue survive 2-3 glyphosate apps to a small degree in other spots. Pretty cool. Basically one or two plants in the spot survive multiple apps sometimes. I've seen this repeatedly, last year and this year.

I seeded the spots with the following:
-Jackpot KBG
-My side front mix (low germination; getting old)
-My main front mix
-Flame TTTF (ultra low germination of a fraction of a percent but threw it down heavy)
-very old Champion GQ PR that is no good (just to get rid of it)


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## Green

Today: sharpened / balanced my oldest blade for the old mower and put it on (took off the gator g3, which was dulling and isn't the greatest for fine textured new grass anyway). Mowed the upper back overseed area for the 3rd time (mulched). I also mowed a bit of the garage side portion of the overseed at 3.7 in (first time) just to knock down the existing grass that was getting a bit too long. Measured the back portion of the area (up to garage corner). As expected, it's slightly smaller than 0.5K. It's 0.35K. Then, put down roughly 3/16ths of a pound of 46-0-0 urea fertilizer on that part of the area using the Scotts Wizz after opening the bag (0.25 lb of N; first major N fertilizer on the area since overseeding (it's almost a month since the seed was put down). Set the zone for the overseed areas to water for 25 min tomorrow morning. It had been off the last few days, but the new grass is fine, and it's getting cooler outside. I will reduce watering to 25 min. every other day starting immediately.

Also mowed the side front at 4 in (discharged). Then put down 0.50 lb of N there (except for the portion where the overseed begins, which is roughly 0.10K) from Anuvia fertilizer (which is mostly ammonium sulfate), using the Scotts Wizz. Set zone 5 to water for 30 min x2 tomorrow morning. I'm a bit late on both the fertilizing and watering; it started to drought stress in a couple of areas today, but I didn't get to it until today.


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## Green

Sharpened my new medium high lift Oregon blade for the Toro and mowed the main front and upper side at 4 in discharged, but apparently didn't sharpen it enough to get all the protective paint off and get a good sharp edge, because the cut quality wasn't too great after. It didn't look any better than with the dull blade I took off. It's also not quite optimally balanced, as the mower was vibrating a bit too much. I'll have to take it off again tomorrow and do a touch up before finishing mowing.


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## Green

Yesterday: 

Mowed rest of upper back, lower back, rest of side, and entire low input area including flood prone KBG mono area (4.X discharged) with the dull blade. Also bag mowed a few main front square feet due to rust disease creeping in. Later than last year, but it's happening again.

Sprayed PGR (0.875 oz rate), Sonata Biofungicide (4oz rate), and Nu-Film (0.5 tsp rate) on front, but it was late and damp with rain coming which will dilute it, so will probably do more biofungicide next week. Kind of uneven, too.

Put down 0.50 lb of N from 46-0-0 urea fertilizer on flood prone KBG area. Put out mosquito dunks. Sprayed max rate of AIR-8 on the area (and on corner of main front near house corner/upper side, and upper front hill and adjacent side slope).

Put down 9 lbs (0.33 lb N) of 16-1-2 Screamin' Green fertilizer on rest of low input area (not far end).

Put down 3 lb rate of 3-0-1 Tea Seed Meal fertilizer on upper back and garage side, and 6 lbs on the lower back.


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## Green

Only got around 0.1 inch of rain from the hurricane remnants so far this morning (after seeing the damage on TV, I'm very happy I do not live in the affected area, due to historical circumstances; everything happens for a reason. 

Anyway, I ended up having to supplement with water where I fertilized. I am still watering the low input area tight now at 8PM, putting down 0.1 inch additional water where I fertilized. A little extra rain tomorrow would be nice too.

Also watered the overseed tonight; the side portion by hand and the upper back part for 12 min. Shut off the head on the garage side and marked it with a flag.

On the positive side, the very low amount of rain meant my fungicide app in the front didn't get washed off after application as I feared would happen.

Also watered the transplanted tree today for the first time in a while. 1 can full.


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## Green

My current "Fall" Nitrogen program (non-blitz method):

-Start of "Fall": Aug. 9-17th - once temps start to decrease to 60F or a bit lower at night and grass starts to respond with recovery growth from Summer stress: 0.50 lb of N (70% slow release from organics and methylene urea). Current choice: Protene 19-0-19

-"Early Fall": about a month later - Mid September once grass is fully recovered and growing vigorously: 0.50 lb of N (50% urea/AMS and 30-60% slow release from sulfur coated urea and/or organics). Screamin' Green or Anuvia.

-About two or three weeks later: 0.50 lb of N (same as previous)

-"Real Fall" (into October now; roughly another two weeks): 0.333-0.50 lb of N from 46-0-0 urea

-Optional if needed 1-2 weeks later: 0.25-0.50 lb of N from urea and/or AMS. Growth starting to slow as Halloween approaches and November begins.

-Pause for 3-5 weeks

-3-5 weeks later as growth is stopping and soil temps are around 40F during the day: Final Winterizing app. Urea/AMS mixture at reduced application rate (0.25-0.50 lb fast release N again), plus a touch of high-activity methylene urea to help sustain greening early next Spring).

The final Winterizer app is arguable. But I use reduced rates. I also have an alternate method I've experimented with instead of final Winterizer, but don't like it as much due to less control.

Low input area only gets the 2nd, 3rd, possibly 4th, and Winterizer apps due to fine fescue needing less N. Target is 2.75-3 lbs per year here, and 3-3.5 lbs on the main lawn.

This year, I am behind with Fall N, mostly due to the drought between July and September (still technically in drought, but not really feeling the effects anymore). I'm currently into my "Real Fall" weather now, but am doing my second app of Screamin' Green or Anuvia. I'm also experimenting with timings and Screamin' Green (60% SCU/biosolids/chicken manure slow release and mostly urea for the fast release 40%) versus Anuvia (30% slow release from Ammoniacal processed N and mostly AMS supposedly stabilized by organic matter for the 70% fast release portion, giving that 70% AMS fraction a two-week release curve according to literature).

Technically, one could could apply a full pound of N at a time from a fast/slow blend enhanced-efficiency fertilizer like SG. I have done this before in other years. However, I generally don't like the results of applying more than 0.50 lb of N at once as much versus splitting it up into two apps, whether the N is all fast or a mix of fast and slow release, but will reconsider as technology advances over time. Too much surge growth from applying a full lb of N, generally. As of now, the only things I get thrilled with applying a full lb of N at once from, are certain organics as well as lower activity methylene ureas (longer Carbon chain stuff).

Runoff and water quality are factors in my decision to use less total N, smaller apps, less immediately soluble N, and less frequent applications. So are things like mowing frequency, soil ecological balance, etc.


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## Green

Today: put down some N fertilizer (second 0.50 lb N Fall app) and pre-emergent:

Lower back: 0.50 lb of N from Anuvia fertilizer
Lower side: 0.50 lb of N of from Screamin' Green. 
-These two areas are adjacent, and I will be comparing the results and differences.

Upper side (0.4K area): 0.50 lb of N from Anuvia.

Main front: 0.50 lb of N from Anuvia (going slightly heavier on worse areas and slightly lighter on dark green areas that got more N the last time)

3 lbs (2.3-2.6 month rate) of 2.68% Pendimethalin granular pre-emergent herbicide on 2K area far end of low input area (flood prone area and adjacent area, from tree to end). Decided it's too late to do any more seeding out there. Skipped seeded spot and tree area. Went heavier in flood prone area.


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## Green

Yesterday: started getting rain. Cold, windy. 50s. November weather.

Before going to bed, grabbed the Scotts Wizz. Put down roughly 0.25 lb of N using 2oz of 46-0-0 urea fertilizer on the non-overseed part of the upper back (beginning of stairs to end of walkway including the walkway grass) during the rain. This way, I'm at least getting a little something down on the area before soil temps tank so it doesn't lack N going into the cooler weather. The area hadn't gotten any real Fall N prior to this.

Maybe a third inch of rain so far as of midnight.


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## uts

@Green have you checked your local soil temps? Mine have already dipped as low as 51 and are ranging around 55F (i have decent shade and in those areas temp is even lower). I started checking because my growth has been much less than expected. I switched to AMS for my last app just for this reason and got a great response compared to urea which kind of makes sense.

I know we have 2 good days of 70 weather but immediately getting 50s weather afterwards. I dunno how much urea metabolization you will get at those soil temps. I also went through Matt Martin's Nitrogen videos and fall applied AMS is much more stable than urea (straight urea) so AMS seems more comforting.


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## Green

uts said:


> @Green have you checked your local soil temps? Mine have already dipped as low as 51 and are ranging around 55F (i have decent shade and in those areas temp is even lower). I started checking because my growth has been much less than expected. I switched to AMS for my last app just for this reason and got a great response compared to urea which kind of makes sense.
> 
> I know we have 2 good days of 70 weather but immediately getting 50s weather afterwards. I dunno how much urea metabolization you will get at those soil temps. I also went through Matt Martin's Nitrogen videos and fall applied AMS is much more stable than urea (straight urea) so AMS seems more comforting.


You know, I actually haven't gotten around to checking soil temps in a long time. But I wouldn't be surprised if the upper layers were around 55 like yours are. I'll start checking. Grass is growing fairly fast though. Still on a low rate of PGR in the front, in fact.

So, I'm testing my habitual blended fertilizer (mostly urea with some AMS) against another product (essentially 100% AMS), and the second apps went down the other day. See previous posts for product details. If there is a difference over the next few weeks, it could be due to colder than average weather favoring AMS.

That said, urea has been fine down to 55 or so for me. It just works slower, which is fine by me. Once we get past mid October, that's when I start to have concerns about urea not working as well. The weather channel is predicting that October may be slightly to moderately warmer than average, which I'm not sure will happen if we keep having lower than average temps, but it also tells me the likelihood of a colder than average October is very low. What might make that happen? Night time low temps are not really much lower than average, despite what seems to be happening and forecasted for daytime highs.

Last Fall, I was using Carbon-X, which of course is 50/50 urea and AMS.

I do have concerns about Scotts Green Max (30% AMS) as my final app, but I found another Scotts product that is 50% AMS, so I will test the two against each other for my final application (which I may also try to move up in time slightly so there is less late season N loss). A couple of years ago, a neighbor who is an old school gardening hobbiest but isn't into lawns threw down some 75% or so urea and 25% AMS Scotts stuff in early or mid November before the grass stopped growing completely but was slowing down. That lawn stayed the greenest in CT until April, I swear. And there was no damage from applying during the pause. Now I know why, as I've learned more since then thanks to everyone on here. The urea probably took 2+ weeks to hydrolyze because of how cold it was. Enough of it was probably converted to usable N by the time the grass stopped its topgrowth a month later to be of use for greening and storage, and was ready to go. (If you apply it after visible growth totally stops and mowing is no longer needed, you're probably too late...more old turf dogma...not to mention wasteful excess with high 1-lb N rates since most of it leaches anyway).

One thing I see almost no use for right now is irrigation. I did water in my fert in the low input area a few days ago with 0.10 inch of irrigation using my oscillating sprinkler, but that was because we only got 0.10 inch of rain after I applied it and it was very windy, so the urea could have been lost to air if I hadn't.


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## Green

Rain total: 1.4 inches. It's wet out there now. Two days of 70s, then back to 50s and 60s.

Re-sharpened the mower blade, and mowed the main front at 4.X in. Bag mowed the worst rust areas at 3.7.

Neighbors were mowed.


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## Green

Mowed side front, side, and lower back at 4 in, mostly discharged; blade and plate may not be seated as well as they could be. I might need to reseat them.

Also played with the manual aerator for the first time, on the upper front hill, which badly needs aerating.

The rust disease is now at the point that I would say needs a curative fungicide in the next week or so, as it always gets worse and worse through the Fall without treatment. This would be about a month later than last year, which seems like an improvement, but it's still happening. The spores are starting to disperse. Best to catch it before it spreads a lot.


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## Green

Got a trace amount of rain last night.

Mowed near 2/3 of low input area at 4.X discharged.

Checked soil temps. 55-60F.


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## 7824

Green said:


> You know, I actually haven't gotten around to checking soil temps in a long time. But I wouldn't be surprised if the upper layers were around 55 like yours are. I'll start checking. Grass is growing fairly fast though. Still on a low rate of PGR in the front, in fact.
> 
> So, I'm testing my habitual blended fertilizer (mostly urea with some AMS) against another product (essentially 100% AMS), and the second apps went down the other day. See previous posts for product details. If there is a difference over the next few weeks, it could be due to colder than average weather favoring AMS.
> 
> That said, urea has been fine down to 55 or so for me. It just works slower, which is fine by me. Once we get past mid October, that's when I start to have concerns about urea not working as well. The weather channel is predicting that October may be slightly to moderately warmer than average, which I'm not sure will happen if we keep having lower than average temps, but it also tells me the likelihood of a colder than average October is very low. What might make that happen? Night time low temps are not really much lower than average, despite what seems to be happening and forecasted for daytime highs.
> 
> Last Fall, I was using Carbon-X, which of course is 50/50 urea and AMS.
> 
> I do have concerns about Scotts Green Max (30% AMS) as my final app, but I found another Scotts product that is 50% AMS, so I will test the two against each other for my final application (which I may also try to move up in time slightly so there is less late season N loss). A couple of years ago, a neighbor who is an old school gardening hobbiest but isn't into lawns threw down some 75% or so urea and 25% AMS Scotts stuff in early or mid November before the grass stopped growing completely but was slowing down. That lawn stayed the greenest in CT until April, I swear. And there was no damage from applying during the pause. Now I know why, as I've learned more since then thanks to everyone on here. The urea probably took 2+ weeks to hydrolyze because of how cold it was. Enough of it was probably converted to usable N by the time the grass stopped its topgrowth a month later to be of use for greening and storage, and was ready to go. (If you apply it after visible growth totally stops and mowing is no longer needed, you're probably too late...more old turf dogma...not to mention wasteful excess with high 1-lb N rates since most of it leaches anyway).
> 
> One thing I see almost no use for right now is irrigation. I did water in my fert in the low input area a few days ago with 0.10 inch of irrigation using my oscillating sprinkler, but that was because we only got 0.10 inch of rain after I applied it and it was very windy, so the urea could have been lost to air if I hadn't.


Great info about the urea and cold temps, thank you!


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## Green

Mowed far end of low input area at 4 in.


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## Green

Mowed main front at 4 in, and bagged worst rust areas (mostly middle) at 3.7.


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## Green

Yesterday, 10/12:
Mowed, put down fertilizer, and sprayed some soil amendments:

Mowed side front at 4 in (didn't irrigate since last rain, so it started drought stressing badly as expected and didn't grow a ton). Bag mowed the overgrown portion due to the overseed on the garage side, to get rid of rust blades.

Mowed the upper back. Did the overseed at 2.65 this time, and mulched. Took off a little more than I'd like, but most of that was existing grass, not new grass. Mowed the side part for first time since seeding, and bagged (same height).

Mowed the lower back, side, and rest of upper back (near walkway) at 4 in. Mowed rest of low input at 4 in.

Mowed and bagged the flood prone area at 3.65 in, including leaves and some grass infected with rust.

Fertilizer:

Side front:
0.50 lb N from Screamin' Green
AIR-8 on upper front hill
SLS plus residual AIR-8: front hill, slope, hellstrip areas

Entire upper back and garage side portion of overseed:
0.25 lb N from 46-0-0 urea
3 lb rate of 3-0-1 tea seed meal
Scotts moss out granular on a couple of areas behind deck

Flood prone area:
0.33 lb N from 46-0-0 urea
AIR-8

Far end of low input (1K):
0.50 lb N from Screamin' Green

Balance of low input (4.5K):
0.33 lb N from Sceamin' Green


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## Green

Yesterday 10/13/22:

Put down 0.5-0.66 lb of N fertilizer and a bit of K on zone 7a family member lawn, which has now rebounded from Summer dormancy. Roughly 2/3 from 46-0-0 and the rest from Scotts 32-0-12.


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## Green

Got 1.7 inches of rain yesterday afternoon/last night. So glad I was able to finish the mowing and fertilizing the other day.

Leaves are well into turning Fall colors, and have been coming down in noticeable numbers for over a week now.


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## Chris LI

Has your lawn kicked into overdrive? I love this time of year. Not too many leaves yet and color and density are peaking for the fall (for my area, at least).


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## Green

Chris LI said:


> Has your lawn kicked into overdrive? I love this time of year. Not too many leaves yet and color and density are peaking for the fall (for my area, at least).


It's interesting. A few days after rain comes, it does seem to grow like gangbusters. But overall, not too bad most of the time. I should be mowing about every 4 days though, ideally, since September started. So far, 1.5 lbs of N since August (3x 0.50 lb N apps) in most main lawn areas. I'm trying to figure out if I can see a real difference between the two fertilizers, but so far I'm not seeing enough difference to really note...even though one is essentially all AMS and the other has very little AMS. The one that is predominantly AMS is only about 1/3 slow release N; the other is 60%. But the growth rate doesn't seem higher with the one composed of more AMS, at least not yet.

I can't really say the color is much better with the AMS-based fert (Anuvia) versus the default Screamin' Green (mostly urea), or even versus an adjacent area that only had 0.25-0.50 lb N from urea (and organic Tea Seed Meal before that).

I don't know. I will admit my fertilizer timing has gotten pretty good, though. Maybe timing is evening the playing field somewhat. Maybe the fact that I only do 0.50 lb N apps maximum, too. The results seem really good when not exceeding 0.50 at a time, whether fast release, controlled release, etc. More N at a time seems to produce results that aren't as good. Again, maybe timing and uptake are factors involved. I've tended to let the lawn dry out as much as possible before fertilizing, too, and I think this is improving uptake possibly. Maybe other years I was overwatering, and losing some N in the process. It seems like the areas I've watered less over the last few months are producing better results with less N, on a predictable gradient. I should pull samples and test for N levels this Fall to compare. I have the test strips to do it.


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## Chris LI

I also like the 0.5 lbs N per app. I was forced to go with higher rates with that jumbo prilled urea to avoid spotty coverage. Growth was a little excessive with the 0.75 and 1.0 lbs N of all fast release, but coming out of the summer, it needed N so I wasn't too concerned, because the temperatures dropped, and irrigation wasn't an issue.


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## uts

I went through a few papers and matt Martin's video about nitrogen and really like the fact that fall applied AMS is very very stable. Not prone to leeching or volitalization. It def produces a better color response as well for me. In my mind my main fert after Aug from now on will be 6 apps of AMS 0.5lbs of N/10-12 days till the end of October.

I will utilize coated urea as a spring applied one application.


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## Green

uts said:


> I went through a few papers and matt Martin's video about nitrogen and really like the fact that fall applied AMS is very very stable. Not prone to leeching or volitalization. It def produces a better color response as well for me. In my mind my main fert after Aug from now on will be 6 apps of AMS 0.5lbs of N/10-12 days till the end of October.
> 
> I will utilize coated urea as a spring applied one application.


We should put article titles/links in our journals so others can read them, too. I think I'm going to start doing that. I'd be interested in seeing a few of the ones you mentioned above, too.

Makes sense. From what you've documented about shade, your soil temps seem to drop a bit lower than average earlier in most areas. Urea seems fine down to 55F soil temp or so, and slower from 55 to 40. Whether it's too slow or not is for the individual to decide. There is also the potential volatilization issue with urea, too.

One thing I've been reading about is "stabilized" urea. It seems to be a loose term often used to describe urea that has not only a denitrification inhibitor (which slows volatilization significantly) but _also_ a urease inhibitor (which of course slows the conversion by urease enzyme (found both in certain soil bacteria and also free in the soil). Such as Uflexx (or Umaxx, which contains more). The urease inhibitor portion supposedly slows and/or delays the conversion by blocking (degrading, I believe) that enzyme. According to Matt's video it delays it for a period of roughly 2 weeks; according to other sources, it slows it from the get-go, which makes more sense. The thing I'm not certain of, is whether a urease inhibitor would further hurt urea's performance in cool weather or not. Still trying to figure that part out. Some sources recommend using an inhibitor in cool weather. But I want to see more of the biochem before I believe it, either way.

In my case, there seems to be little difference in urea versus AMS during September, and even into October. After mid October or so, I'd expect urea to be much slower. Historically, I haven't done much with Nitrogen in later October; I just started extending my apps by two weeks or so as of last year. I found I was ending too early before. Average first frost (mid Oct.) has been a poor estimator of when to stop for me, but I followed that method for at least 6-7 years. I'm confident that extending apps until Halloween or so is better, because there is less of a "pause" period that way (~3-5 weeks versus ~5-7 when ending earlier, and the grass previously showed low N symptoms during late Fall).


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## wiltonlawn

Where are you getting your AMS around here?


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## Green

wiltonlawn said:


> Where are you getting your AMS around here?


I'm not! I bought a bag of Anuvia fert from domyown (15 out of 16% AMS), ordered a bag of AMS from Walmart online back when it was available, used Carbon-X last year (50% AMS) and most recently bought a bag of Scotts fert with 50% AMS in it. AMS is really hard to get locally in any quantity, as you know.

I try not to use too much because it lowers soil pH due to the high sulfur content.


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## Green

Mowed most of main front at 4 in, but avoided the bad rust area in center. It was cut lower last time, buying a few days. Mowed upper side. Saw the spores blowing out of the mower.

Trimmed in back and blew clippings, then mowed that area near walkway at 4 in.

Sprayed Propiconazole for Rust on main front, side, and lower back (going slightly into low input area by several feet where rust was noticeably present). The rust is not real bad, but I want to get rid of it and let the grass grow out to keep it from spreading more. 2oz per thousand square feet. Used the red Teejet nozzle for the first time and found I need about 1.5x the liquid for the area. However, the tube must have gotten some crud in it, so on the third app, it was super slow. The Chapin 20V is just finicky like that. If you're a perfectionist when it comes to spraying, it's probably not the best choice. For me, someone who dislikes spraying and tries to do it less often, it works ok. I'm just glad to get my application down with some semblance of evenness. Sprayed over the few remaining leaves on the main front and lower side. Again, good enough. Not perfection.

Finished the Propiconazole 14.3 I opened last year, and opened the second bottle. A bottle doesn't go very far at 2oz per thousand.

Blew leaves off upper back and garage side overseed areas.


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## Green

Around a tenth of an inch of rain so far as of this morning. The Propiconazole most likely never got to dry, since I sprayed around 6PM and it stayed wet all night, but it should have had plenty of time (around 12 hours) to absorb. I have a feeling drying isn't really necessary...it's a systemic fungicide. The rest got watered in by the rain.


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## Green

Rain total yesterday was 0.10 inch or a little under.

Supposed to go down to 34-35F and get a frost tonight (second time this year). Watered the new grass areas as well as some plants a little while ago to reduce potential freeze damage. Took in a pot.

Seeing Poa Triv spots in the main front. Planning to hit them with an app or maybe two of Tenacity (and maybe mix a bit of Sulfentrazone and Anuew in for good experiment, and use MSO instead of NIS) soon to slow it down, but not get so heavy handed I create dead spots, which I did another year in mid/late Fall by doing 3-4 apps. I think because the grass is using Nitrogen so fast this time of year, it's easy to overdo the herbicide.


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## Green

Mowed side front up to walkway and near third or so of low input area at 4 in after washing newer mower off. Both perpendicular. Neither area has bad rust disease, so I can get away with using the mower again without cleaning it.

Two more nights of mid 30s, tonight and tomorrow night. Sprayed some plants with water again.

Neighbors were mowed.

I keep finding bits of Poa Triv here and there. I mark some of it. Others I try to pull out some or all of what I see. I found some at the top of the side front slope and pulled a bunch of tillers to slow it down. Found a few in low input and marked them for pulling or digging. Marked several in main front for spraying this week. Saw some adjacent to kill and reseed patches where I didn't spray wide enough, such as the spot near the garage side.

Lots of leaves on the ground in some places, now. A lot have turned colors, too.

Yesterday, I confirmed that my controlled release Nitrogen is working correctly, more or less. I found an SCU particle in the lower side, apparently from my Oct 3rd application. I crushed it to see if there was still any N left inside it. There was some.

Set zone 5 to water for 24 min x2 tomorrow morning. Edit: set incorrectly. Did not run.

Upcoming tasks and projects:
Get gas
Continue mowing
Trimming
Herbicide sprays and weed pulling and digging out
Glyphosate on several Triv spots
Digging out rocks
Sprinkler replacement
Tree
Flood prone area drainage dig
Upper back / overseed fertilizer, 50% AMS
33% AMS
Plugs
Mouse spray


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## Green

More leaves came down due to wind the last couple of days.

Mowed the next (middle, as well as going back over some of yesterday's) section of low input. Double mowed with side discharge because the high lift blade I have on the Toro is bad at mulching. Will have to sharpen and swap blades again soon due to leaf season.

Wet down some plants and brought in a pot for third night in a row. Last two nights were 34 and 38; tonight could hit 35-36 again, but last night never got that low.


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## Green

10/22/22:

Redid the spray head sprinkler install from yesterday, because after I filled the soil back in last night, I found I had a leak in the connection; the whole area filled with water. Let it dry overnight and redid it all, twice, using teflon tape this time. So far, so good. This is the head near the back garage corner on the side. I took out a rotor and installed a Pro-Spray with check valve and an MP rotator nozzle (left corner nozzle, I believe).

Bag mowed and blew thick leaf cover in the flood prone area. Then mowed adjacent far end of low input at 4 in with side discharging.

Blew leaves off upper back and garage side. Cleaned the older mower, then mowed the upper back. Raised it to 3.2 in this time on the overseed.

Ended up having 4 nights in a row get down into the 30s. Grass slowed down, but will likely pick up a bit a bit as temps warm.

Yesterday, talked with my friend briefly about his fertilizer plan. He had previously used 0.8 lb of N and 0.3 lb of K from 32-0-12 toward the end of September, and will plan to apply another 0.5 lb of N from 29-0-4 next week. His first Fall fertilizing a lawn, since he didn't do any apps last Fall.


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## Green

Put down fertilizer as rain started:

46-0-0 urea as follows:

Side front: none
Main front: 0.30 lb of N (perpendicular to road)
Side: 0.333 lb of N
Lower back: 0.25 lb of N
Upper back and garage side overseed and rest of upper back: 0.20 lb of N
Low input: 0.25 lb of N or a bit under

Used the Scotts Wizz with a bag over it.

Fertilizer test results: I'm not seeing much difference between the various fertilizer comparisons from last month. The lower side, which only got Screamin' Green, and the lower back, which only got Anuvia, are pretty similar. The relative timings don't seem to matter much either, as long as both are done by early October. Conclusion: the Anuvia behaves smliar to SG when both are used in early Fall in two 0.50 lb N split apps several weeks apart...even though SG is listed as having 60% slow release N and little AMS, whole Anuvia is mostly AMS and listed as only having about half the slow release content. These two fertilizers behaved as essentially interchangeable in my lawn at those rates in the early Fall, except for the fact that AMS reduces pH, so I don't like to go too crazy with it. As such, I'll probably continue with split apps of each in the future to get a diversity in nutrient characteristics...and maybe try another similar 16-X-X product alongside them next year as well. I'm thinking specifically of the Lowes 16-0-10, which seems competitive with both. @CaffeinatedLawnCare . (That one should probably go down a week earlier since it has no AMS and more Potassium.)

Poa Triv is definitely making a comeback, now. The goal is not to eliminate it, but slow it down and suppress it mostly via yearly spot renovations and also occasional selective herbicide apps/programs. That strategy has been working well.


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## Green

Got 1.2 inches of rain yesterday and this morning. Drought staus has gone down to D0 for certain for about a week now.

Sprayed AIR-8 on upper front hill, hellstrip areas, and lower side.

Fixed vehicle tire damage to driveway edge.

Neighbor 2 was mowed.

Made appointment for sprinkler winterization.

Almost 70F, with dewpoint of 65 and 90% humidity! But cloudy and foggy.


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## Green

Only got an additional trace of rain (or moisture in some form that condensed to be measurable, given the relatively high humidity) this morning. So, hand watered the areas that were sprayed with AIR-8 yesterday. Accidentally left the bottle outside last night and found it today.


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## Green

Tons of leaves blew down on the side front, garage side, upper back, flood prone area, etc.

Mowed a bit. Used side discharge with the high lift blade at 4 in to knock down and blast a bunch of those leaves into pieces in the side front. Just a rough mow to uncover the grass again as it was totally covered. Bunch of sticks embedded too. Probably wore down the edge on the new blade. Also mowed the upper side, which had no leaves.

Good stretch of spraying weather coming up...a lot less wind. Good thing, because I need to spray more areas.


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## Green

Didn't think it was going to get so cold last night. It got to at least 32F for a few hours. I didn't do anything yesterday to prepare. Today, I did, since it might get as cold again. Covered the backflow preventer, watered some pots and new grass spots, took in the one pot, shut off the back faucet, etc.


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## Green

Grass growth has slowed over the past week or two.

Got really cold last night. I think it counted as a hard freeze. It was 32 or below for 5 or more hours.

Mowed. Started mowing in the front today. A ton of leaves. Still side discharging at 4 in mostly.

My neighbor next door mowed with the lawn tractor to pick of leaves the other day. Usually the mowing guy keeps it in check but this time of year it needs additional help, and he usually does it a couple of times.

New neighbors moved in over the last day or two.

Got gas. No stabilizer yet.
-----------------

One notable thing: I made it through the entire year so far without using any bug repellent. I could have used it a few times. But the drought really suppressed the insects and ticks in the middle of the Summer for a while.

Spring Nitrogen plan for most main lawn areas next year (slight modifications since this year):

-April: 0.25 to 0.333 lb of N (33 to 50% slow release, mostly urea); after first few mows

-Mid May to late June: 0.75 lb of N from natural sources and ammonium sulfate

Changes since this past year:
-Add small amount of N earlier due to results of test area
-decrease mid/late Spring N by 0.125 lb
Net increase of only 0 to 0.125 lb of Spring N
-N fertilizer slightly more spread out over time

I don't buy the idea that a small amount of early Spring N applied after the first few mows will use up all of the previously stored carbohydrates and cause a chain reaction of runaway flush growth that results in quick decline as soon as Summer stress hits...especially when a PGR is used. Last year, the areas I did this on that were lagging a bit had subjectively better performance for the entire Spring with no noted decrease in the Summer.


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## Green

Mowed front at 4 in again. Same high lift blade and side discharge but really need to swap for the mulching blade. Blew and bag mowed leaves in flood prone area at 3.7. Blew garage side and upper back. Lots of leaves this past week.

Happy Halloween


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## Green

Got up to 0.2 inch of rain last night.

Blew leaves off of side front and driveway, and onto main front so I could fertilize.

Put down 0.25 lb of N from 46-0-0 urea fertilizer on side front. Final regular application and area. Used the Wizz again. That thing is great. I rarely use a push spreader these days.

Set zone 5 to water for 40 min x2 tomorrow morning.


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## Green

Sharpened 2 mower blades: the Toro mulching blade and the Gator G3 blade for the older mower. Neighbors were mowed.


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## Green

Mowed far end of low input area at 4 in (12 days since last mow). Put Toro atomic blade on mower. Double mowed side front at 3.75 in perpendicular (3 days since last mow/leaf mulching). Mowed upper back and garage side (2.7/3.7) - 12 days. Accidentally chewed up a marking flag and wire with the newly sharpened Toro blade. Mulched leaves in both areas. Blew leaves to finish.

Sprayed Propiconazole 14.3 on both areas:
Side front: 3.5 oz (curative and prevention for rust)
Upper back: 1.5 oz (second app this Fall; rust prevention; curative on area near lower back).

Sprayed rodent repellent.


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## michigreender

Great journal. Taking notes 

Does the mower blade difference matter? Or, why and how does it make a difference? I typically mow at 3-3.5, no side discharge. But I recently got a side discharge to minimize under-clumps when grass is too long or wet. Would changing my blade type have different results? 

Thanks!


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## Green

michigreender said:


> Great journal. Taking notes
> 
> Does the mower blade difference matter? Or, why and how does it make a difference? I typically mow at 3-3.5, no side discharge. But I recently got a side discharge to minimize under-clumps when grass is too long or wet. Would changing my blade type have different results?
> 
> Thanks!


Definitely. I find the Toro atomic blade (default blade) works adequately for both mulching and discharging, but not super great for mulching on higher HOC settings (it's a cross between a medium lift and a mulching blade). The high lift blade does a terrible job of mulching...you have to go over and over and over and over the area (with discharge on mostly), and even then...still not as good. The gator blade is the best mulcher I've used so far. Good for discharging, too. I haven't bagged with the Toro, but the high lift would probably do great for that. Most of my mowing is mulching or discharging, but I bag once in a while. I use the discharge especially, a lot.


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## Green

Blew some leaves around and mowed the lower back and lower/middle side at 4 in mulched (looks like the last mow was 13 days ago...yikes). Didn't seem to break the 1/3 rule, though. Cold temps last week really slowed things down, but didn't get any real freeze damage (probably because I didn't mow for a while during that period). Rough mow; the Toro atomic blade didn't mulch real well at 4 in, but at least the leaves are cut up and won't blow around much if it gets windy. Have almost a week in the 70s. Right in the middle of it now.


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## Green

Duplicate post. Will use for something else.


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## Green

Mid 70s today, and 60s dewpoints. Still above 70 right now at 7:30PM, and only supposed to go down to 62 tonight and tomorrow night. Much higher than average. Last bit of early Fall in mid Fall before high temps decrease to the 50s again mid next week. There are even 20s in the two-week forecast. Yikes.

Tons of leaves. Coming down at a furious pace, and more than half, maybe even two thirds, are down already, and it's not even the second week of November. Crazy.

Mowed main front and mulched leaves. Double mowed perpendicularly, first 4 in, then 3.75. Got it fairly clean. Also mowed upper side at 4 in, as well as near 3rd of low Input, where leaves were mulched.

Good amount of Poa Triv in main front once again. Looks like I may need to kill two large (6x6 foot) spots next Spring, in addition to many smaller ones. Not cool.

Tested sprinkler zones 1 and 2. Driveway/front walk head rotation in zone 1 was stuck. In zone 2, the highest head--the mid front walkway head--didn't pop up due to low pressure. Shut off adjacent head, and it popped up. Turned that back on, shut the zone. Turned it back on. All of them popped up. Since they have check valves, that might explain why they all activated the second time. Hopefully they all work ok tomorrow morning.

Put / swapped a few plugs into a mostly dead-looking spot from the Summer on the bottom upper side neighbor corner border. It's either dead or so dormant that it didn't come back this year. There are still roots, and a tiny bit of green in one area. (The adjacent area finally came back essentially 100% over the last few weeks.)

Watered tree with one can full. Noted a couple of damaged spots to the bark, one relatively near the base. Hopefully they repair. Leaves are down.

Set zones 1 and 2 to water for 45 min x2 each, tomorrow morning. Reset clock for time change.


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## Green

Mowed and bagged leaves on flood prone area and adjacent far end (which has rust moderately). Mowed middle of low input* (4 in). Started taking areas down to 3.75 and 3.25 in: Near end of low input* 3.75, lower back (same). Side front (3.25). Blew leaves off upper back and garage side. Blew leaves in the side. Grass definitely still growing, but not super fast. More than 75% of leaves appear down now, all over essentially one week.

Turned 4 sprinkler heads in zone 4 back on tonight, and checked pressure on the new MP rotator head. It was around 45 psi, which is right about ideal for these heads (they're spec'd for 40).

Set zone 3 to water for 30 min x2, zone 4 for 18 min x2, and zone 5 for 34 min x2 tomorrow morning.

Edit: As of 12:30AM, it's 66F, 61 dewpoint, and 84% humidity. Some of the late Summer insects, including crickets (and others that make louder scratching sounds from trees) have reactivated the last few nights. It's only supposed to drop to 63F tonight. And then one more day in the mid 70s. These night conditions are almost unheard of for November (no tropical storms, just a Bermuda high), and are more typical of August or September, but is an enjoyable break from a fairly cold Fall. Let alone 70s being uncommon for daytime temps (averages are in the 50s right now).


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## Green

11/7/22:

Today hit 75F. Last warm day, then more normal. Probably won't see any more mid 70s until April or even May...5-6 months. It was fun while it lasted.

Had the sprinkler system blown out (keyword addition for future search: irrigation winterized). Nov. 7th is the average date, so right on schedule. Marked head locations with paint.

Then washed out mower bag and a few spreaders.

Mowed and mulched leaves: side (3.75*). Put gator blade on old mower and mowed main front diagonally before it got dark (side front last night was also diagonal, which is tough due to the slope). Attempted to use highest setting, but front wheel adjustment slipped down one several times. That's a new issue. Double mowed a portion. The height reduction resulted in some loss of color, but not terrible. Blew leaves and clippings off paved areas multiple times while mowing. There is a phenomenal amount of Triv this year. Next Spring is going to be a major spot renovation year for all those areas, some of which are fairly large.

With the recent watering, warm temps, mowing, and the fertilizer within the past couple of weeks, it should stimulate a bit more growth and recovery over the coming weeks before it shuts down. I think I'm going to have to stop mulch mowing soon, at least partially. Then again, it looks like after late this week, I won't be mowing again for at least two weeks due to freezing night temps...it may even become December before it warms up again.


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## Green

Started digging drainage trench (the second one this time) in flood prone area. Very hard work and slow going due to rocks, buried large debris that are 50-100 lbs, etc. And apparently I have "black layer", too. Wonderful...

Neighbor next door mowed/cleaned up leaves with lawn tractor and blower today. This is good. Other side neighbor was done yesterday. New neighbors still have quite a bit of leaves, but have worked on them a couple of times since moving in (end neighbor who is adjacent went over and helped them for a couple of hours once, bringing both of his blowers).


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## Green

Today:

Mowed low input 3.25*, lower back* / adjacent side*, main front, side front / hellstrip areas (3 in, 2-3x mulch and bag; front hill double mowed at 90 degrees, some areas triple mowed), upper side (added some of the leaves and clippings from previous area and mulched in, double mowing again), garage side (3.3; blew leaves first), lower upper back (3.25 mulched) and upper back overseed (3/2.6; final mow; blew leaves first, and mulched in a few). Everything except 1K flood prone area (which was done and got its final mow last time, but blew leaves there). Side discharged many areas.

Last mow for a while due to cold temps next 2 weeks into Thanksgiving timeframe. Main lawn areas except for garage side and upper back and parts of low input area will need another mow or two eventually, but I can't think that far out. The forecast is for highs in the 40s, with 30s and mostly 20s at night for the foreseeable future after the weekend (with tomorrow / Friday night's low only going down to 64 as the hurricane remnants come through). I'm not going to mow during that cold period.

The mowing and rain with mild temps (60s to 70) the next two days should stimulate one last major burst of topgrowth and recovery before it cools down.

New neighbors had sprinklers blown out today by my technician (who the previous owner also used).

90+ % of leaves that are going to come down are probably down. Mulched a good amount today. Still more left to come down, though. This is super early. I feel 90% done with mowing and fertilizing, too.

When it warms up, I'll mow again. And after that, once I see rain in the forecast, I'll look at dropping my last fertilizer app.


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## Green

Got 1.6 in of rain yesterday and last night. 70F today. Will be mostly in the 40s/20s next 2 weeks. Rest of the leaves in front pretty much came down as the wind from the hurricane remnants came through. 95% of leaves are down. Will need to do a leaf cleanup at some point in the next few days. Zero need for any further irrigation this year.

Trimmed in back and blew clippings (walkway, drain area, etc.). Trimmed near utilities.

Used edging tool to push back damaged side-front driveway edge again. Looks better now.

Took in 2 hoses, one from back and one from front while it was still warm out. Back hoses welded together. Tried a hair dryer. No go. Got some CLR and worked it into the threads for 5 min with q-tips. Then, a pipe wrench with a paper towel in it on the hex female fitting, locked down, and a channel lock pliers on the round Male fitting with a nitrile glove inside. Pushed them in the correct directions and the hoses disconnected. Apparently the metal color fitting on one hose (zinc? Aluminum?) welded to the brass fitting of the other hose over the last few weeks as the weather got cooler. Left one hose in each location. Capped the front one to keep debris out. Need to remember to shut off the water tomorrow due to cold air coming.

Back neighbor did final mow today. What a mess. Hadn't mowed in like 6+ weeks. Lawn tractor could be heard almost stalling due to too much grass many times.


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## Green

Highs are in the mid to low 40s for the next week and a half, possibly even under 40 one or two days. 10 degrees below average. This is December weather a month early. Hopefully we'll see a bit of a warmup at the end of this month.

Today, I went after invasive vines. I used my foaming herbicide kit purchased from Greenshoots last year (first time trying it out). I'm not sure if it'll work given how cold it is. I put 70mL of 8% Triclopyr Amine into the bottle and added almost 10mL of their surfactant with blue dye, and filled to 140mL, shaking the bottle frequently. I walked through the natural area, cutting vines near the ground and applying the herbicide. I wanted to do this yesterday when it was warm, but didn't get to it. The owners of the company said that Triclopyr Ester would not work with the system, and to only use the amine formula. Ideally, I'd have done this a month ago. At the very least, cutting the vines will slow them down.

Plan is to do the final major leaf cleanup in the front tomorrow (with the blower, since I'm not mowing currently). And to put down final winterizer fertilizer on certain areas: the back, garage side, near end of low input, the area behind the shed through to most of the KBG reno area, and the very lowest part of the side. I'd also like to spray FAS on the front.


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## Green

Did final major leaf cleanup in front, garage side, and upper back using blower, and even a rake, broom, and tarp.

Did not get to spray FAS. No time. Did not get to fix tree or dig.

Soil temps: mostly around 50, including lower back which was 49-50. Colder areas (see next section below) were as expected 45 to 50.

Put down final winterizer fertilizer application on those areas using 0.50 lb of N from 27-0-2 Green Max: garage side (0.25K), upper back (1K), lower back (1.16K), flood prone area (very light on the innermost area), area behind shed and additional 1K of low-input behind that to square off with flood-prone area (about 2K in all), very lowest part of the side (0.10K). and shaded near end of low input (0.25K or so). Applied to lower back even though it's technically not ready (soil temp is 50, but it will likely get cold fast this week due to being on North side, and I've often wished I'd done it a week earlier; plus no more rain in the forecast after tomorrow).

Used Green Max, which is mostly urea (and only 30% AMS--which is immediately available after getting watered in) because I'm a bit on the early side and plus still had it from last year. The urea will take a while to hydrolyze in these cold temps...maybe 2-3 weeks...not sure exactly, but will take some time and give more of a trickle feed, which is what I want.

The Wizz handheld spreader lost voltage and slowed down (and even stopped once) a couple of times, maybe due to cold temps. (I just changed the batteries for the first time several weeks ago, so they should not be low yet.) Grabbed the Scotts mini push spreader to continue, but had the usual trouble with the agitator detaching.

Got the fert down, anyway. This is the earliest I've ever started winterizing. Maybe technically too early in the lower back, but again, it should be fine as air temps will go into the 20s at night in a day or two and it's on the North side. Better a bit early than too late.

~4.5K of area fertilized in all. About 30% of the total. The rest of the yard, which has solid 50+ soil temps right now, will get Scotts Pro 26-0-3 with 50% AMS at a later date.

Propiconazole halted rust disease progression nicely. Not seeing anymore powdery brown stuff flying everywhere in treated areas (main lawn), and grass looks green from a distance unlike last year. (Or the year before when it thinned out.)

Lots and lots of Triv in the main front. A few large areas; many medium and small ones too. Going all out next Spring with a program of apps of glyphosate, Anuew, Certainty, Velocity, Tenacity, Sulfentrazone, Triclopyr, and MSO surfactant.

Jackpot KBG seeded late is not really developing faster than expected. May cover some areas with fabric to insulate.

Neighbors were mowed / leaves cleaned up today, too.

Oil man walked and dragged hose on upper back and garage side overseed this AM when there was probably still frost. Hopefully no dead spots will appear. Maybe the fert and rain tonight will help.

First snow of the season started around 8PM and quickly changed to freezing rain and rain.

Front hill and parts of main front look a bit Nitrogen deficient. We'll see. Also noticed that where there is no Triv, the Perennial Ryegrass and to some extent KBG dominating over the Tall Fescue as it gets colder. Ryegrass seems to come into prime time in mid Fall...and hold its color for a long time. With it taking center stage, the front lawn looks fairly fine-bladed right now. In the late Spring and Summer when the TTTF and KBG dominate, the lawn has a different look.


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## Green

Got 0.6 inch of rain last night. Flood prone area is flooded again, so I won't be able to work on it for a couple of days. Hope the soil doesn't get so frozen that I can't continue digging.

For the final winterizer fertilizer on the side front next week, I'm going to use a slightly higher N rate: 2/3 lb, because it looks a bit deficient. Next Spring, I'm going to manually rake out any dead grass again, manually aerate the upper front hill again, and start Tenacity applications for weedy grasses (Bentgrass, and maybe others) on the front hill.

Neighbor's lawn looks good (a few do). I wonder if he used some of the Carbon-X. Kind of has that AMS look, but it could also have been a urea fertilizer. Neighbor 11 lawn is another. His shade fence line overseed from May looks good; he supposedly used my seed for some of it. Some Triv in the area that he didn't remove, but it'll work. Speaking of Triv, it looks like the drought may have killed some of his Triv. I don't think he watered much this Summer (lawn went dormant), and he ended up having to reseed some areas after. There appears to be less Triv now, so maybe that was actually the main casualty of the drought (it was in partial to full sun). The real test will be next Spring. But even if some of the Triv did get killed, it only takes a small amount to survive to allow for a comeback at a later point in time, as it spreads so readily. Neighbor 10 adjacent to him, who is into yard stuff, lawn is suffering. Looks N deficient (he uses the fertilizing company), and he's mowing very low. It's light green and a bit thin looking...not typical for him. I know he has collected and removed the grass clippings all these years. Maybe it's starting to catch up..?


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## Green

I'm not seeing any low temps above freezing in the two week forecast, let alone above the potential frost point of 37-38. I'd prefer to mow when the chance of damage is lower. But holding off for 3 weeks probably isn't the greatest idea, either. The longer I wait, the less chance of higher temps, and the grass will get a bit longer, which requires cutting more off, which increases the chance of browning even more. The average temp is supposed to be 50 during the day and 37 at night. Instead, we are getting more like 42 day and 28 night now.

Glad I dropped my final (mostly) urea-based fert on the shaded back lawn the other day before it started to get this cold. Soil temp is/was still 50 in the lower back as of then, but not for long. Any lower, and urea hydrolysis--which relies on soil bacteria, as it's an organic molecule--will be extremely slow (maybe taking 3+ weeks for most of it to become available...just a guess based on graphs I've seen). The fertilizer had 0.15 lb of N from AMS that will be readily available now, as well. I could have gone 50% AMS instead (0.25 lb N from AMS), but didn't want to trigger any growth.


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## Green

Soil temps relatively close to edges around 4:30PM:
Upper back: 40
Lower back: 42-43
Front: 43-50
Air temp around 38

Hopefully there will be enough rain next week to finish fertilizer, as conditions are going to be about right. Definitely was the right decision to do the back, etc. the other day.


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## Jeff_MI84

@Green how much rain are you hoping for in order for your last application?


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## Green

Jeff_MI84 said:


> @Green how much rain are you hoping for in order for your last application?


A quarter inch would be good.


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## Green

High temp was 35F today, and going down to 19 tonight. And fairly windy. This is normal for late January, the coldest part of the year, not mid to late November.

To-do list:
Clean mowers
Mower blade
Clean spreader(s)
Oil change?
Car
Tree
Lights
Digging project
Final Trimming in front and prune
Final mow
Final Fertilizer
FAS
snowblower and generator test
Mouse repellent in shed
Rodent spray
Vole repellent
Patio
Garage
Buy fert for Spring
Order pre-M


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## wiltonlawn

Green said:


> I'm not seeing any low temps above freezing in the two week forecast, let alone above the potential frost point of 37-38. I'd prefer to mow when the chance of damage is lower. But holding off for 3 weeks probably isn't the greatest idea, either. The longer I wait, the less chance of higher temps, and the grass will get a bit longer, which requires cutting more off, which increases the chance of browning even more. The average temp is supposed to be 50 during the day and 37 at night. Instead, we are getting more like 42 day and 28 night now.


Looks like Thansgiving around here is the best day to cut which might be tricky while hosting! Do you have any hard-and-fast rules for when absolutely not to cut?


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## Green

wiltonlawn said:


> Looks like Thansgiving around here is the best day to cut which might be tricky while hosting! Do you have any hard-and-fast rules for when absolutely not to cut?


I know! I've been thinking the exact same thing for the last few days. And it might be the last good opportunity. It also might be the last good opportunity for applying the final fertilizer...as long as it rains 0.25 inch or more starting the next day.

I used to mow regardless of night temps, a couple of years ago. My only rules were no lingering frost and air temps of 38 or higher while mowing. But I've come around more recently and gotten more conservative because it really seems to help to not do it before freezing temps. The higher the night temps following, the better it probably is. And a nice sharp blade, too.

Lawn was still green as of yesterday, so I think the strategy is working. I'd hate to have it all go brown by mowing before another freeze. My string trimmed areas all went partly brown from freeze damage, as expected, despite it not freezing that night (since the cut quality is terrible with a trimmer, it makes freeze damage much more likely).

Somehow, I'm determined to get everything done. But we can only mow so early on Thanksgiving due to the lingering frost/cold in the morning. It should really be above 38-40 air temp to mow. And the problem with the day before (Wed.) is that it's going into the 20s again that night. And then Friday is supposed to be wet. Plus, having two nights above freezing after mowing definitely sounds better than just one, so Thursday would really be ideal for mowing, as you mentioned above.

I'm going to keep reevaluating this forecast as it gets closer and continues to be revised.


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## Jeff_MI84

@Green i too have been watching daytime/ overnight and soil temperatures. I’d love nothing more than to fertilize one last time, especially the reno.


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## wiltonlawn

Now forecasting low of high 51 low 30 on wednesday. Might go for it


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## Green

Jeff_MI84 said:


> @Green i too have been watching daytime/ overnight and soil temperatures. I’d love nothing more than to fertilize one last time, especially the reno.


All I really care about is the average. If you take the soil temp on a cool day in the middle of the day, or in the early evening in the hours soon after sunset on an average temp day, it should give a decent average. Mine were still above 40 where I've yet to fertilize as of the other day (and were still as high as 50 in some areas). Remember 4 inch temps don't change quickly from one day to the next. Last time I checked them, the 2 inches versus 4 inches made no real difference, either...they were the same at that point in time. Peak temp highs can be useful too, but aren't the full story of course. 



wiltonlawn said:


> Now forecasting low of high 51 low 30 on wednesday. Might go for it


For mowing? I'm looking for higher night temps the day of mowing, especially if it's my final mow. We'll see. 51/28 for my area Wed., so a bit colder than yours.


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## Green

Looks like Saturday is going to be ideal for final mowing and fertilizer here. Warm temps that night, and a good amount of rain the next day.

This video from GCI is very close to my current philosophy on final mowing: 




---------------------------------

Another interesting piece of news: My tweaked Fall fertilizer program, which is only 4 applications, is working very, very well. I'm getting blitz-quality results with fewer applications this year. I'm going to share some knowledge of what is working now, refined over 10 years! Here are the current Fall program details (note this is for fully irrigated, high-income areas, and my low input area does not receive the full late Summer application listed first below):

-Going into Fall, I've already applied a late Summer fertilizer application in early to mid August at 0.50 lb N and K rate. I used Protene 19-0-19 this time with phenomenal results. This stuff has a 2-4 month release (for both the N and the K!). It kept the grass looking good. Prevented a lot of late Summer decline.

-At the very beginning of Fall (mid to late Sept): 
I apply another 0.50 lb rate N fertilizer, using something that has a slow or controlled release component of 30 to 60%, but that is not quite as slow as the Protene. Currently, my top choices are Screamin' Green or Anuvia, but anything similar will work, if it has a 4-8 week release duration. Soil temps are likely in the high 60s to low 70s at this point. Latest research indicates this may be the most important app of the entire year, and that it should not be overdone to produce too lush a turf. In Tennessee or NC, where the months are offset by almost plus one from mine, sometime in October would be ideal.

-Several weeks later, during the first part of October: 
I repeat the previous app again, 0.50 lb N, same type of fert. Peak daily soil temps should be in the mid 60s. This app holds everything together and serves as a bridge between early and mid Fall.

-Several weeks later, my final mid Fall app:
Around Halloween in my area. I try not to string this out into early Nov. This app uses 46-0-0 urea. The rate is between 0.25 and 0.50 lb of N, and the exact rate in that range is subject to adjustment at the time of application due to factors like cumulative N, grass condition, weather, etc. This can also be considered part 1 of the Winterizer ("initial winterizer app"), which is something I just learned, but that is what it's doing. I aim to apply it 4 or so weeks before I expect growth to stop. Soil temps should be solidly in the 50s. Tree leaves are in Fall color, and dropping. This app ensures enough N gets to grass roots before late Fall, but while soil temps are still fairly ideal for topgrowth and repair. Remember: soil-applied granular urea is an organic compound, and its N is not immediately available to roots**. It requires soil bacteria (microbes) to process it and convert it into plant available N, and this process takes longer the colder the soil is / the later in the season it is. Below 50F, it's very slow, and the urea is stable once watered in assuming there is not excessive rainfall or overwatering occurring. **Currently accepted science of N uptake by roots in plants, but there may be more to the story, as newer research suggests.

Then a pause of 3 to 5 weeks until growth slows/stops.

-And the final app (or part 2 of the Winterizer, or "final winterizer"): 
For me, this occurs sometime between mid Nov., and early Dec. The trick here is to wait for growth to stop or at least be at a crawl, but (and this is the new part for me) to also make sure soil temps are still as high as possible (40-50F). The other key element is use of either ammonium sulfate, or a mix of that and urea of at least 30/50. I also like to have methylene urea (MU) in the blend for this app. (This is a very stable form of urea, a true slow release N source that primarily activates in the very late Winter when soil temps are on the climb toward Spring and reach approx 50F again, but some of it may also be available at the very end of the Fall, too). Mistakes I made in the past were: waiting too long until soil was too cold to apply this app, using only urea for it, and using too high an N rate*, all wasteful and not environmentally sound so late in the season. My N rate is once again 0.50 lb, but can be adjusted up to 0.67 lb N if needed. 1/4 to 1/3 of the total N is from "high-activity methylene urea" (e.g. methylene diurea and dimethylene triurea). Scotts 27-0-2 Green Max (30% AMS, 40% U, 30% MU) and 26-0-3 PRO (50% AMS, 25% U, 25% MU) are my products of choice here. Note: If you're using 100% fast release AMS/UREA, 0.25-0.333 lb. N should be sufficient, but I get better results from an AMS/Urea and MU blend in my area. This app helps rejuvenate late Fall color and like the previous app, helps promote Spring Greenup. *Studies show that only around 0.2 to 0.3 lb of N is uptaken by turfgrass so late in the season if a full 1.0 N rate is applied. The rest likely leaches. Don't knowingly be wasteful if you're going to apply a final winterizer; please keep the soluble N rate low!


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## wiltonlawn

Green said:


> Looks like Saturday is going to be ideal for final mowing and fertilizer here. Warm temps that night, and a good amount of rain the next day.
> 
> This video from GCI is very close to my current philosophy on final mowing:


I decided to do more leaves and wait till Saturday as well. Thanks for the posting that video. Happy Thanksgiving!


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## Green

Washed out Toro mower, took the default blade off. Sure enough, it was getting dull again from all the leaves and some sticks despite being last sharpened 3 weeks ago (with no mowing over the last two weeks). Sharpened it, put it back on. Took out the air filter, cleaned it and put it back. Ready for the final mow.

Trace amount of rain this morning.

Zone 7a CT family member front lawn looked fine yesterday. Recovered from Summer. The fertilizer last month obviously helped a lot. Back is a different story. None of the new grass from seed this past Spring appears to have survived the drought. Neighbor's Zoysia is still green, believe it or not. Just the very tips are kinda starting to brown a tiny bit. Around here in 6b, it's all dormant.


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## wiltonlawn

Green said:


> Zone 7a CT family member front lawn looked fine yesterday. Recovered from Summer. The fertilizer last month obviously helped a lot. Back is a different story. None of the new grass from seed this past Spring appears to have survived the drought. Neighbor's Zoysia is still green, believe it or not. Just the very tips are kinda starting to brown a tiny bit. Around here in 6b, it's all dormant.


May I ask where in 7a. Thinking about a test plot of zoyosia here at the 7a/6b border.


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## Green

Today: 11/26/22: Mowed. Final mow of 2022 unless the weather drastically warms up (not expected). A lot of it was double mowed. Got new gas. Changed old mower air filter. Got help on the first pass, as it was too much for one person. Barely finished by 8:30PM or so. Lawn was starting to frost up a bit by that time, which was unexpected (air temp was around 40F) and disconcerting (I had barely started fertilizing by that point and was concerned about damage occurring). But after I finished, the weather man said we had radiational cooling due to the clear sky, so it makes sense. I worked from the coldest area forward and tried not to linger too long where the water vapor that was on the grass was icing up the soonest underfoot. Kept feeling and looking at the grass to judge how much ice was forming. I think I got off it time, as it was not stiff/fully frozen. But having just been mowed, who knows. The extreme far end of the low input area, portion adjacent to the lower back, and parts of lower back near shed seemed to frost-up the soonest, with the main front lagging behind that, most of the side lagging, and the side front being the least frozen.

Mowed with a combination of mulching and discharging: first pass: main front, side, lower back, and low input up to tree/far end (3.25 in*). Second pass: perpendicular. All of those areas plus side front (including almost half of garage side; front hill double mowed) and 1K far end of low input at 2.9 in. Also behind shed at 4 in due to uneven ground. Did the uneven part of low input only with the Toro at 3.25. Hellstrip areas at 3.6 in. There were enough leaves but not tons. A good amount of grass got cut off, but I don't feel like the 1/3 rule was necessarily broken even after the second cut.

I've almost never had to mow past the first week of Dec., and this November is colder than average (28 at night instead of 35), with a cooler December predicted, too, so I'm 80% sure this was the final mow. Neighbor D mowed today, too.

Put down my final Winterizer fertilizer application on the rest of the lawn: Rest of low input including far end (around 5K), side, and main front**: 0.50 lb of N rate. Side front: 0.67 lb of N rate. Fertilizer: Scotts Pro 26-0-3 - greens grade SGN - (48% AMS, 34.7% urea, 17.3% Methylene urea, and 0% Fe). **I was antsy to get off the lawn due to frost, so ended up dumping my entire second set of passes in the main front on the Eastern half due to mis-calibration and rushing. Scotts Pro spreader kept acting up as usual. I might go back and add a bit more fert to the other side next week to even it out better. Also, lots of rain predicted over the coming week. Could be over an inch tomorrow and again Wed. Hopefully not that much!

Shut water faucets again. Fixed gutter downspout that came apart earlier. Noticed a screw came out of utility box; put it on garage shelf next to sprinkler tools. Then the garage system got damaged.

Not sure what soil temps are. Will check soon. Probably low to mid 40s. Color is no longer deep saturated green, but still a weaker shade of green.


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## Green

wiltonlawn said:


> May I ask where in 7a. Thinking about a test plot of zoyosia here at the 7a/6b border.


New Haven county - Milford border. Less than a mile from the water.


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## Green

Yesterday: got 0.4 in of rain. Fertilizer is watered in. The AMS should be going to work immediately.

Checked soil temps today. They ranged from 41 to 50, with the usual progression by area.

Saw a Bobcat in the yard last night. Only a few feet away. Hopefully eating mice.

Found one "jumping worm" in the upper back not too far from the grill. Wasn't moving a lot, but still surprised some of them lasted this long. I guess next year I'll have to treat later into the Fall. And this has been a colder than average past month or so, especially night time temps...lots of nights in upper to even mid the 20s so far. 10/12 was the last time I put down Tea Seed Meal. Should probably apply it until Halloween next year. By the way, that stuff has yielded a really nice level of green color this Fall. Almost like you'd expect from using iron. That was a surprise. And with the grass cut relatively short (2-2.5 inch actual HOC), it has also been easier to see worms. The new grass is also still very young and thin, which also helps, but with good care should have no trouble making it through the Winter. E.g. not piling snow on it from the deck.

Shut water faucet.


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## Green

Checked calibration of the thermometer I use for soil. It appears to be within 1 degree of the thermostat, so probably within 2 degrees or so of accurate. Close enough.

Put down a bit of extra fertilizer mostly in the Western half of the main front to compensate for the uneven app the other day. Also added a smaller amount on the front part near the road, the hellstrip areas, and the front hill for the same reason. Peak soil temps are still near/at 50F in the front, so the N should have have some uptake, however minimal it may be. Applied only a small amount: 0.75 to 0.85 lb of product in total to all areas, using the same Scotts Pro 26-0-3 fertilizer product (50% AMS) using the Wizz. Final N rate after adding more is around 0.62 lb of N in the main front (0.50 lb soluble). And 0.7 lb N in side front (0.58 lb soluble). This is higher than what I was aiming for originally when I planned to do my final winterizizer / boost app.

Blew some leaves in the back and side front.

More rain expected tomorrow. Could be a lot. And some wind. Today would have been perfect for spraying FAS...no wind, then rain the next day. But it wasn't to be.

Frost started to form around 7PM again (35-36 air temp, clouds present, no wind).


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## Green

Got 1.05 inch of rain today. There is standing water now.


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## Green

Got another 0.47 inch of rain today.
(Around 2 inches in the past week and more to come next week. There should be no more D0 drought after this...) Any more rain, and most my soil N reserve is going to be gone. At least the grass won't dessicate. But the water may freeze on top of the soil at night.


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## Green

Today: front bed partially raked out.

Yesterday: soil temps were around 40F.

Tomorrow:
-trim and blow
-pick up sticks
-clean mowers
-final mow
-tree
-patio cleanup
-moss-ex
-digging?

Huge amount of Poa Triv already; this is going to be a bad year for it. Even a couple of large areas (4+ feet) to kill in the Spring. I doubt that these large patches were there hiding this whole time (I would've noticed) or that they spread from small spots in several months time (impossible...it's not Bermuda we're talking about)...more likely explanation is that a bunch of suppressed small spots in the same area merged together into one after coming out of Summer dormancy, and tons of rain coupled with fertilizer allowed it to flourish starting in October.


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## Green

Today, 12/6/22: Did my final mow of 2022 (for real this time). This is typical timing for me (early Dec.) Really cleaned everything up and eliminated excess length that could be an issue over Winter (got the grass down just under 3 inches, finally). Mowed the front, side, lower back, and most of low input. Some areas double mowed. Mulched in the leaves that were there. I'm done mowing until the 3rd week of March or so, which is when I usually do my cleanup mow to start the year. Minimal growth since the previous mow on 11/27; nothing that really needed mowing. This was more a final cleanup than a routine mow. Optimal color is long gone, but it has normal late Fall color (green and brown blended). The TTTF and FF do not hold color well late in the Fall and through the Winter. Tonight's low temp is going to be 51, and tomorrow's will be 42F or so. Can't argue with those temps for the final mow. Temps like this have been virtually non-existant, with almost every night the past month being below freezing, making it tough to find the opportunity for a final mow (or two). Done!

Blew off the upper back, garage side, and flood prone area. Bailed about 40 gallons of water out of the trench I'm in the process of digging.

Pulled a Poa annua plant (no seedheads this time of year!) in the lower side.

Reminder: shut water faucet.


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## Green

Got 1 inch of rain last night and this morning. That's nearly 3 inches in the past 9 days! This is crazy. Everything is saturated and/or pooling. Hand trimmed front borders this evening. Drought be darned.


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## Jeff_MI84

@Green hopefully the wintery mix hitting parts of the Midwest this weekend don’t come out your way.


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## Green

Jeff_MI84 said:


> @Green hopefully the wintery mix hitting parts of the Midwest this weekend don’t come out your way.


As of now, they're predicting snow on the weekend.


----------



## Green

Shut water off. Grass looks pretty good after the final mow. All of the leaves that are going to come down at this point pretty much have now, so very little in the way of leaf cleanup will be needed the rest of the year. If I see a few, I just walk around and pick them up by hand (same with sticks). Trees are bare except for the few that they will retain for the next few months. Might use the blower a few more times this Fall and Winter.

Only changes I'd make for next year if possible are lowering the lawn height from 3.75 to 3.25 in a month earlier (in early Oct instead of early Nov), and treating for the jumping worms a month longer (into early Nov). I think sharpening before the last few mows and waiting for warm weather when mowing made a visual difference. I will also probably give the lower back an additional 0.50 of N next year, half in Spring and half in Fall. It looks slightly deficient. Maybe the high OM from the compost in that area has something to do with it.

List 2:
Pull weeds in road and shed area
Car wash and wax, tires
Wash equipment
Marks 12/17
Snow stakes


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## Green

Today: coated car (yesterday: wash). Cleaned driveway. Put up snow stakes.


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## Green

Last night: Got 2.5-3 inches of snow. First significant snow. Highs around 40 and lows in mid to low 20s now, which is typical. Grass dormant, but still about as green as could be expected with such cool temps. Will try to post photos from the past year. Sunset is now at earliest point of the year (4:22PM). Back lawn is shaded probably all day now.


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## Green

Yesterday and the night before: got another 1 inch of rain. All the snow melted pretty quickly. Cumulative total for the past 3 weeks: 4+ inches of liquid. The ground can't take much more of this. At least it wasn't snow. But might get a small amount on the tail end in the next couple of hours.


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## Green

Just now, at 4PM, I put on boots thinking I would be able to do some work in the back. I took literally 2 steps onto the back lawn without checking it first. "Crunch crunch". It was still frozen, despite it being late in the day and the air temp being at least 38. Got off it immediately. The front had thawed totally earlier, so I figured the back would be ok. Nope. I should have felt it first. Also, if it looks frozen, it probably is frozen.

Ran the snowblower and generator. Got 4 gallons of gas (3).


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## Green

Put up Eastern side Christmas light set (yellow, blue mark, on/off upper). Brushed grass with broom to warm up before walking on. Fiddled with pathway lights.

If the grass is just starting to freeze up a little and you have a very small area you need to walk onto, you might be able to melt it and delay further freezing a bit by sweeping across the area a bunch of times with something, like a broom. A softer bristle would probably do less damage.


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## Green

Last night and today: got almost 2.1 inches of rain, with fairly high wind gusts around 40mph at times. (We have gotten over 6 inches of rain total in the last 4 weeks, so D0 abnormal dryness should be over by next week). The rain ponded in the low input area, and will freeze tonight and stay frozen on top of the lawn for a few days, which I'm not thrilled about. Tonight is supposed to go down to 10F, and tomorrow's high is only supposed to be 18. Lows for the next week will be in the tens and 20s. Road salt went down a couple of hours ago. Winter is here. Looking forward to the forecasted early January thaw next week for some post storm yard cleanup.


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## Green

Ground surface is fairly frozen. Was able to find an unfrozen area in the front near driveway, and the soil temp was 31F at 4 in. Air temp was 27.

To-do list for the next week:
Equipment cleaning
Vole repellent
Mouse repellent
Deer repellent on shrubs (and back)
Trimming
Picking up sticks, leaves
Shed

Supply list to buy:
Dimension, other pre-M
Nutrients Plus
Protene
Anuvia
Grass seed
TSM fert


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## Green

Still have ice in the flood prone area and the back neighbor border since Christmas Eve day. Hopefully will start melting soon. 

If the ground thaws out enough Friday in the front, I will strongly consider using the mower to pick up (not mulch) the leaves the came down in the previous storm. Hopefully the weather and schedules will cooperate.


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## Jeff_MI84

@Green crazy weather out your way. Virtually all of my Christmas snow is gone now.


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## Green

Jeff_MI84 said:


> @Green crazy weather out your way. Virtually all of my Christmas snow is gone now.


Looks like the ground is not going to thaw out by tomorrow, unfortunately...it's still around 32F in the front where I could get the thermometer in, but it would only go in some spots. And the grass is all needled up still. But hopefully the rain this weekend will help thaw it out just enough so I can do a few things next week. And they still have us in a bit of D0 drought. I guess because the rain isn't penetrating the soil well due to being frozen. It's been in the 40s to 50 for several days now, but not a lot of sun. Pretty much November/December weather but with frozen soil.

@Jeff_MI84 
How did you add in your zone and lawn size under your name?


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## Jeff_MI84

@Green it took me a minute to remember how. I added all that on after the website change. Click on your avatar/ profile picture then account settings. Scroll down to lawn details. This took me a lot of trial and error, comparing to other profiles.


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## Green

Upper 50s today. Hoping the ground thaws a bit so I can do a stick/leaf cleanup this weekend (want to use the mower for this in the front) and apply vole repellent to the back as well (won't work if ground is frozen).


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## Green

Got over 0.4 inch of rain 2 days ago. More to come tomorrow.

Ok. I think I've officially gone into lawn nut territory. I used the mower today. On January 2nd. Never mowed in January before now.

I bag mowed the main front, primarily to collect leaves. I did get some grass clippings, ranging from 0.1 to 1.0 inch length, some brown, some green. Maybe 1/4 to 1/3 of the bag filled with grass and leaves from 2500 square feet area. Photo to come. HOC setting was similar to where I left off on my "final" mow on 12/6. That mow was at the 2.75 inch setting with the Toro, going parallel to the house. Tonight's mow was parallel to driveway with the old mower at the 3 inch setting. Charity mow? I guess. Maybe. Kinda. Not so sure. But I have now officially mowed in every month of the year at some point. I think it was last year that I mowed on New Year's Eve, which was the previous record. This year beats it by 2 days. I stayed away from the edges. Soil temp in the mowed area was about 40F, so it did indeed thaw out as I was hoping; it was 31F a couple of weeks ago after that cold snap. I didn't dare try any other areas and know enough not to; the main front is probably the warmest section at this time of year. Will it all go brown due to this? Hope not. Will be an experiment. Was originally supposed to go down to 35-36 tonight as of this afternoon, but now (as of 11PM) it's 35 and they're forecasting 32-33 in a few hours for the low, and then 47, 40, 35, 30, 28 the next 5 nights. Then 20, 24, 26 the next 3 after those. Last night went down to 35; probably should have done this yesterday instead.

Update: ended up going down to roughly 35F for about an hour or two at most, but there is definitely frost around. Grass was cut about 6 hours before minimum temperature was reached, and 3-5 hours before onset of frost.

I briefly walked on the upper back this evening after mowing to dump my clippings in the natural area in back of the lawn, and then checked the soil temp. It was still near 32F back there, though I was able to get the thermometer in no problem this time. No overtly crunchy grass, but saw some dew looking like it wanted to freeze due to the low soil temp, and it felt cold to the touch (air temp was still over 40). So I decided to minimize walking on it; vole repellent application and leaf blowing will have to wait a bit longer and hopefully it will thaw a bit more and there will be a break in the upcoming rain the next few days that is conducive to this while temps are still considerably above average (it has hit high 50s at least so far over the last week).

I have at least 2 months before I can do another charity mow (the earliest if weather permits this year). But this was therapeutic. Would have preferred to have done it earlier in the day, and that was the plan, but I was up all night due to technical issues last night with a project that was due today (it all got deleted and I had to redo it, which was very stressful).

Thinking...Was this my last mow or my first mow? Let's call it both.

Happy New Year!


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## Butter

Happy New Year green!
I can’t think of a better way to celebrate the new year than getting in a mow!


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## Green

Today: had drizzle. Rain so far before that just under a half inch. Got oil.

Back soil finally thawed out as I was hoping for. Applied home-made vole repellent on upper back, garage side, around patio and shed, 20-25% of lower back near those areas, and a bit of the upper side (near bed). This stuff has prevented vole activity successfully the past two years. I used a gallon of warm water, 0.75oz of generic blue dish soap with urea in it (should have used almost half the amount due to too much suds), about a teaspoon of peppermint oil, 5oz of castor oil, and a pinch of cayenne pepper powder, mixed into a sprayer that had been used for garlic earlier in the year (never got cleaned out and was closed up since Summer, so gave it a good rinse with hot water first to get any bacteria chunks out). If I had applied the concoction just a couple of weeks ago, it probably would have washed away from all the rain. Our weather is crazy. But the ground can't be frozen, or it won't work either. Soil temp was thankfully around 40F back there tonight. Last year I also didn't apply until January. It really seems to work.

Looked at a bunch of area lawns today. All the same green/brown color. I suspect all the rain is responsible. Soil is waterlogged, reducing air in the soil, probably preventing real good color retention. Maybe I'll do a survey on this topic eventually. But I noticed mine was greener before all the excessive rain. Everyone's is about the same color now.


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## Green

Got more rain through yesterday. Grand total: approx 0.95 inch.

That's 1.35 inches this past week, and 6 inches or more between Thanksgiving and Christmas. Still flooded in flood-prone area. Trying to figure out my strategy.

USDM still has central CT in DO, possibly including my area. Crazy after all this latest rain that it has been this way or worse for like 6 months now.

Outside of rain, we continue to enjoy another week of December-like weather with 30s and 40s, or even the occasional 50, for highs. This may be partially courtesy of the onshore flow hitting the West Coast and bringing substantial precipitation there.


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## Green

Not much to do now than log the weather and hope for the best. Got the first snow in a while, a dusting. Unfortunately, the town put down salt for it. More rain is supposed to come later in the week, so hopefully they won't keep putting more down at that point, as it's not good for plants and vehicles.

At this point, with the elevated temps, we're still getting a lot of precipitation, just not snow. An inch to inch and a half of rain per week. I'm hoping that this is substituting for snow, and we aren't still due for large amounts of snow after the warm streak ends. (We normally get an average of at least 35 in of snow per year.)


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